NationStates Jolt Archive

Muslims maintain that Islam is a religion of peace, and they'll prove it to us by blowing up a car in a crowded market.




....anybody else see something that doesnt quite make sense?

Muslims maintain that Islam is a religion of peace, and they'll prove it to us by blowing up a car in a crowded market.




....anybody else see something that doesnt quite make sense?

Generalizing muslim behaviour?

Muslims maintain that Islam is a religion of peace, and they'll prove it to us by blowing up a car in a crowded market.
That's your problem right there.

Anti-Abortion Christians maintain they are saving lives.


The prove it by bombing abortion clinics.

And so on, and so forth to infinity.

Got any other nice generalizations we can shoot down now?

generalization, much?

Fighting for peace is like fucking for virgnity.
Same idea, different circumstance.

Saying all Muslims are blowing up cars, or even that they are all for peace is like saying all Christians are fundimentalists. Not true.

Most of the time I would agree with the people who say the OP is generalizing, but I think they're referring to something more specific. Some of the Muslims who are currently objecting to the pope's remarks that Islam is only about mandates to kill stuff, are the ones who are busy blowing up and killing stuff. Now it seems to me that if you are objecting to someone claiming you're a violent religion, expressing that objection violently is perhaps a bit problematic.

There is such a thing as a self-fulfilling prophecy. And I believe if people continue to act like Islam is one big terrorist organization, you will only increase the power the right-wing Islamic nutjobs have by giving legitimacy to their cause. Resulting of course, in more terrorism.

Well how else are you going to get new virgins?

There is such a thing as a self-fulfilling prophecy. And I believe if people continue to act like Islam is one big terrorist organization, you will only increase the power the right-wing Islamic nutjobs have by giving legitimacy to their cause. Resulting of course, in more terrorism.

I agree, if you expect someone to be evil and violent, treat someone like they are evil and violent, chances are, they'll start acting evil and violent

Goddamn you! Just for this you have shamed yourself for the next 5,000 posts.

Anti-Abortion Christians maintain they are saving lives.


The prove it by bombing abortion clinics.

And so on, and so forth to infinity.

Got any other nice generalizations we can shoot down now?

valid point.

however,and i am the first to defend the vast,vast majority of peacable muslims,your argument fails on 1 basic point.(i may be wrong)

i have lots of muslim friends,nicest people i have ever met...i also have tons of friends of the catholic persuasion(i was an alter boy)

the radical element of christians you analogise with muslims is a bit...shall we say...flawed.

the christians have 1 or 2 freaks like phelps being fucking fools.

if you look at isreal and iraq..seems they have an endless supply of jihadists willing to kill innocent people to further their cause.

your point would be more valid if christian zealots blew up innocents every day of the year,not the stray mcveigh or some other idiot runnning around in th woods after he blew up an abortion clinic.

you can draw the parallel..and your correct that religion seems to bring out the worse in some people.

but to compare the jihadists to a handfull of christian zealots is intellectually dishonest.

they commit unspeakable horror on a daily basis..whilst the fundies you point to are aberrations.

want to compare body counts?

i am not saying 1 is better then the other..i actually agree with you..but to compare the 2 is bullshit!

i think education and tolerance will be the only thing that saves islam from the dustbin of history...but unfortunately...they seem to have an endless supply of people willing to kill children in the name of god...daily!

to compare the 2 is dishonest...call a horse a horse if you must..but to compare the 2 is bullshit.

valid point.

however,and i am the first to defend the vast,vast majority of peacable muslims,your argument fails on 1 basic point.(i may be wrong)

i have lots of muslim friends,nicest people i have ever met...i also have tons of friends of the catholic persuasion(i was an alter boy)

the radical element of christians you analogise with muslims is a bit...shall we say...flawed.

the christians have 1 or 2 freaks like phelps being fucking fools.

if you look at isreal and iraq..seems they have an endless supply of jihadists willing to kill innocent people to further their cause.

your point would be more valid if christian zealots blew up innocents every day of the year,not the stray mcveigh or some other idiot runnning around in th woods after he blew up an abortion clinic.

you can draw the parallel..and your correct that religion seems to bring out the worse in some people.

but to compare the jihadists to a handfull of christian zealots is intellectually dishonest.

they commit unspeakable horror on a daily basis..whilst the fundies you point to are aberrations.

want to compare body counts?

i am not saying 1 is better then the other..i actually agree with you..but to compare the 2 is bullshit!

i think education and tolerance will be the only thing that saves islam from the dustbin of history...but unfortunately...they seem to have an endless supply of people willing to kill children in the name of god...daily!

to compare the 2 is dishonest...call a horse a horse if you must..but to compare the 2 is bullshit.
*sighs* That thing wizzing by your head was the point.

It's as irresponcible to say Islam isn't a religion of peace due to the actions of a few as it is to say that Christianity isn't a religion of peace due to the actions of a few. My comparrison was ment to be false to show how silly the orginal point was in the first place.

*sighs* That thing wizzing by your head was the point.

It's as irresponcible to say Islam isn't a religion of peace due to the actions of a few as it is to say that Christianity isn't a religion of peace due to the actions of a few. My comparrison was ment to be false to show how silly the orginal point was in the first place.

In Secret aj man's defense... I think SAM understood perfectly what you are saying. SAM is just saying that there are more than just a few radical muslims.

(Don't shoot me down, I'm just stating the obvious.)

*sighs* That thing wizzing by your head was the point.

It's as irresponcible to say Islam isn't a religion of peace due to the actions of a few as it is to say that Christianity isn't a religion of peace due to the actions of a few. My comparrison was ment to be false to show how silly the orginal point was in the first place.

and to use your sarcasm...my point apparently flew right by you as well.

think about your statement...you say the actions of a few...well i beg to differ,as i see innocents blown up daily by muslim fundies..and by daily...i mean every fucking day some kid/american soldier/someones mom/some innocent jew or someone at the wrong place in fun land gets killed by the actions of the few.

please show me how the christians fundies are doing this kind of mass slaughter?
of innocent people.

now you got me aggravated,cause i despise all religous zealots...but to compare 1 to the other is bullshit,and you know it,and if you dont..open your eyes.

do you really think i would impugn or judge a vast majority of the world by the actions os a miniscule amount of nuts...never.

but to compare 1 against the other is ludicrous..but you seem to want to equate one with the other,and your wrong...period.

sorry if it interferes with your hating bush goggles your wearing,but you best wake up.

i have so many muslim friends that are disgusted with the actions of not the few...but a sizeable percentage,it is laughable for you to compare the 2.

my issue with you is..that you seem to compare some irrevalent zealot with someone onethats commits acts of vile destruction on a daily basis..
and is applauded or hailed as a martyr.
it is called complicity..and the majority of christians would not quitely justify the killing of innocents as correct,or justifiable.

whilst the muslims i know.dont either..the simple fact is...alot of the uneducated muslims think it is justifiable,ergo the steady stream of suicide bombers that think killing innocents is ok if they do it for the cause.

like i said..education and tolerance is the key...but unfortunately...education and tolerance is sadly lacking in the countries we are speaking of.

to compare the 2 is intellectually dishonest....christians do not root for the death of innocents,nor think that bombing a train or killing 3000 people is ok,for god,maybe ...dare we say it..we have advanced enough to understand it is wrong.

seeing the body count in the middle east tells me they have not.

i understand the need to apologise for the atrocities commited everyday,i would probably be a suicide bomber givin the conditions they live in..but it still aint right.

if i mis read your post...disregard my diatribe..

and to use your sarcasm...my point apparently flew right by you as well.

think about your statement...you say the actions of a few...well i beg to differ,as i see innocents blown up daily by muslim fundies..and by daily...i mean every fucking day some kid/american soldier/someones mom/some innocent jew or someone at the wrong place in fun land gets killed by the actions of the few.

There are 1 billion Muslims in the world. The ones blowing people up are a "few" out of that total, even if you're utterly paranoid and believe there are 10 million terrorists, that is 1%. Few.

please show me how the christians fundies are doing this kind of mass slaughter?
of innocent people.

Irrelevant to his point, and shows that your main point is showing that Islam is evil because Christian fundamentalists can just infiltrate the US government instead of having to resort to this kind of warfare.

Muslims maintain that Islam is a religion of peace, and they'll prove it to us by blowing up a car in a crowded market.




....anybody else see something that doesnt quite make sense?Yes. Your post.

Islam is peace. It's a non-violent reglion at heart. That's why the pope has been threatened with a horrible death for saying it is violent.

Stands to reason.

There are 1 billion Muslims in the world. The ones blowing people up are a "few" out of that total, even if you're utterly paranoid and believe there are 10 million terrorists, that is 1%. Few.



Irrelevant to his point, and shows that your main point is showing that Islam is evil because Christian fundamentalists can just infiltrate the US government instead of having to resort to this kind of warfare.

Yes... but isn't Christianity the biggest religion in the world? Thus, I've foiled you again!

And what you're saying is that Christians have started the war in Iraq and yady yady because they can kill Muslims? Rethink that or explain, please, because that doesn't make sense!

Islam is peace. It's a non-violent reglion at heart. That's why the pope has been threatened with a horrible death for saying it is violent.

Stands to reason.

That what makes this whole thing laughable! "How dare you say we're not a religion of peace, just for that we'll kill you and a nun!"

There are 1 billion Muslims in the world. The ones blowing people up are a "few" out of that total, even if you're utterly paranoid and believe there are 10 million terrorists, that is 1%. Few.



Irrelevant to his point, and shows that your main point is showing that Islam is evil because Christian fundamentalists can just infiltrate the US government instead of having to resort to this kind of warfare.

well given the overwhelming power we have over most countries..especill in the middle east,following your logic and apparently theirs...could we not be not nice and obliterate them?
i have a sneaking suspicion,if they had our power they would not hesitate to annihalate us...you know,,the religion of peace...lol

but we dont do the same to them as they would do to us?

go figure..now who is more peacefull...however i just realised i was sucked into an argument that cant be won.

go give osama a hug...i am sure he will hug you back,as your from the west..lol...come give me a hug and i will get you a beer...you decide.

if your from the middle east...time to teach your friends about tolerance..something they seem to be sorely lacking in.

i know..kill the pope cause he says we are violent...lol

well given the overwhelming power we have over most countries..especill in the middle east,following your logic and apparently theirs...could we not be not nice and obliterate them?
i have a sneaking suspicion,if they had our power they would not hesitate to annihalate us...you know,,the religion of peace...lol

but we dont do the same to them as they would do to us?

go figure..now who is more peacefull...however i just realised i was sucked into an argument that cant be won.

go give osama a hug...i am sure he will hug you back,as your from the west..lol...come give me a hug and i will get you a beer...you decide.

if your from the middle east...time to teach your friends about tolerance..something they seem to be sorely lacking in.

i know..kill the pope cause he says we are violent...lol

One only has to look at how Muhammed (their prophet) spread the religion to see that it's not a religion of peace. Even he spread the religion through the sword.

One only has to look at how Muhammed (their prophet) spread the religion to see that it's not a religion of peace. Even he spread the religion through the sword.

I couldn't tell you a line out of the Qur'an, but I know that Christianity was, too, spread through violence. The truth is that all religions were made by humans, and as far as my knowledge leads me, all major religions have made war (Buddhism might be exempt from that statement, I am not sure!). As our society matures, we lose that insensibility and move towards peace. These poor countries just happen to be muslim, but any poor country, without decent education systems, are expected to behave in such a manner.

(I know nothing about the history of the middle east, or religion, which is why I'm not giving references, but in the pursuit of an answer, I believe the above is correct.)

I couldn't tell you a line out of the Qur'an, but I know that Christianity was, too, spread through violence. The truth is that all religions were made by humans, and as far as my knowledge leads me, all major religions have made war (Buddhism might be exempt from that statement, I am not sure!). As our society matures, we lose that insensibility and move towards peace. These poor countries just happen to be muslim, but any poor country, without decent education systems, are expected to behave in such a manner.

(I know nothing about the history of the middle east, or religion, which is why I'm not giving references, but in the pursuit of an answer, I believe the above is correct.)

Actually, Christianity was spread through teaching and preaching, espically in privacy due to the Roman Empire ban on Christianity. The Crusade wasn't about expanding Christianity, it was about protecting the Holy Land from the Muslium.

One only has to look at how Muhammed (their prophet) spread the religion to see that it's not a religion of peace. Even he spread the religion through the sword.

i actually give up...thetre are self hating people in the west...that despite the facts in front of them...will never acknowledge that we are trying to do right,and they want us dead...ergo...go give osama a hug.

give me a hug,you get a beer...hug osama...you get beheaded...but for some reason i cant fathom,people apologise for this abberation of a religion(why i hate religion by the way)but go right ahead....till you aint got a head.

religion of peace my ass..if it was...they would take back their religion and not kill kids...but that is reallly complicated..or are they complicit?

i know i took back my religion...as i dont follow it...as i was molested by a priest and learned then and there...religion is for the weak minded...but i am kinda spiritual...but following a dogma..no thanks.

That what makes this whole thing laughable! "How dare you say we're not a religion of peace, just for that we'll kill you and a nun!"


Damn healthcare nuns. Always giving healthcare to the poor. If that's not violence I don't know what is.

Good job we have Imams to remind us that shooting old ladies in the back = peace.

well given the overwhelming power we have over most countries..especill in the middle east,following your logic and apparently theirs...could we not be not nice and obliterate them?

What? You're not making sense and I'm fairly certain the logic you are using is entirely your own.


i have a sneaking suspicion,if they had our power they would not hesitate to annihalate us...you know,,the religion of peace...lol


By "they" you mean the afoermentioned 1 billion Muslims?

Your sneaking suspicion means Islam is not a religion of peace?

This is an argument?

but we dont do the same to them as they would do to us?

It would not be politically correct. I myself have a sneaking suspicion that there are a great many people in the West who would love to just nuke the entire Middle East.


go give osama a hug...i am sure he will hug you back,as your from the west..lol...come give me a hug and i will get you a beer...you decide.

*sigh* Yeah, I must want to hug Osama bin Laden. That sure does follow from anything I've ever said.

if your from the middle east...time to teach your friends about tolerance..something they seem to be sorely lacking in.

i know..kill the pope cause he says we are violent...lol

Wow, someone killed the Pope!

And I'm from the Middle East!

Dude, you shouldn't type drunk. And you always seem to be drunk. Maybe it's just best if you shut the fuck up if you think this is all so funny as to warrant inane "lol" every five seconds.

This thread is beginning to make no sense whatsoever. But it's interesting that you say the crusades weren't about spreading the religion.... I knew it was about the holy lands (cruel enough... because I'm sure Jesus didn't say anything about any holy land), but I thought I read in my preliminary reading that is was coupled with a misson to spread... I am motivated to read on...

http://d.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/uc/20060919/lbs060919.gif

This thread is beginning to make no sense whatsoever. But it's interesting that you say the crusades weren't about spreading the religion.... I knew it was about the holy lands (cruel enough... because I'm sure Jesus didn't say anything about any holy land), but I thought I read in my preliminary reading that is was coupled with a misson to spread... I am motivated to read on...

I don't know what you were taught, but I was taught that the Crusade was about protecting the Holy Land from the Musliums.

Actually, Christianity was spread through teaching and preaching, espically in privacy due to the Roman Empire ban on Christianity. The Crusade wasn't about expanding Christianity, it was about protecting the Holy Land from the Muslium.

Christianity before Constantine was puny. Christianity became what it is because Constantine and further Roman emperors spread it with sword and law, and European missionaries carried the tradition to the rest of the world.

Well, natually Islam = Peace.

That's why the battle of tours was simply a misunderstanding. The poor muslims were just lost.

Im a Christian who approves of exploding cars for peaceful purposes. Namely my entertainment, the greatest goal of Humanity.

Christianity before Constantine was puny. Christianity became what it is because Constantine and further Roman emperors spread it with sword and law, and European missionaries carried the tradition to the rest of the world.

Here's another thing that I don't understand, whenever we critize the actions of muslium, people always has to bring up the Crusade, why should it matter? I mean just because one group did it, doesn't mean that it's ok for the next group to do it. No matter who did it or who didn't do it in the past, doesn't justify it being done now!

Im a Christian who approves of exploding cars for peaceful purposes. Namely my entertainment, the greatest goal of Humanity.

Remember, christ would want you to shoot muslim nuns: if muslims allowed nuns.

Islam = peace.

I don't know what you were taught, but I was taught that the Crusade was about protecting the Holy Land from the Musliums.
Protecting? How do you protect a place from the people who are living there?

The crusades were all about taking the "holy land" away from the muslims who controlled the region and asserting Christian dominance over them.

Christianity before Constantine was puny. Christianity became what it is because Constantine and further Roman emperors spread it with sword and law, and European missionaries carried the tradition to the rest of the world.

I thought it was a certain King that made Christianity popular.

well given the overwhelming power we have over most countries..especill in the middle east,following your logic and apparently theirs...could we not be not nice and obliterate them?
i have a sneaking suspicion,if they had our power they would not hesitate to annihalate us...you know,,the religion of peace...lol

but we dont do the same to them as they would do to us?

go figure..now who is more peacefull...however i just realised i was sucked into an argument that cant be won.

go give osama a hug...i am sure he will hug you back,as your from the west..lol...come give me a hug and i will get you a beer...you decide.

if your from the middle east...time to teach your friends about tolerance..something they seem to be sorely lacking in.

i know..kill the pope cause he says we are violent...lol

If most Muslims had the power we do, they wouldn't be as obsessed with killing. The third world gets more pissed and violent than the first, it's what poverty does.

Here's another thing that I don't understand, whenever we critize the actions of muslium, people always has to bring up the Crusade, why should it matter? I mean just because one group did it, doesn't mean that it's ok for the next group to do it. No matter who did it or who didn't do it in the past, doesn't justify it being done now!

Point is, it's not about Islam, it's about situations. Islam is not an inherently violent religion, it's a religion that happens to be more popular today in violent parts of the world.

If most Muslims had the power we do, they wouldn't be as obsessed with killing. The third world gets more pissed and violent than the first, it's what poverty does.

Oh that is bull, that is complete bull. Poverty breed violence, yea. Then what about the thousands and millions of people who are poor but don't commit violence acts, how about them? What breeds violence is people who are not willing to look at their own situation, and instead decides to blame someone else instead of looking at their own backyard.

I thought it was a certain King that made Christianity popular.

Um...a.k.a. Emperor Constantine? Or are you making some random reference?

Protecting? How do you protect a place from the people who are living there?

The crusades were all about taking the "holy land" away from the muslims who controlled the region and asserting Christian dominance over them.

Yes. Damn those Romans for taking Judea. Scum!

Anyway I'm off to piss on koran. I'm janjweed so it's okay..

Oh that is bull, that is complete bull. Poverty breed violence, yea. Then what about the thousands and millions of people who are poor but don't commit violence acts, how about them? What breeds violence is people who are not willing to look at their own situation, and instead decides to blame someone else instead of looking at their own backyard.

Name me a third world country not plagued by corruption, gangs, callous violent crime, etc. Islamofascism just has more worldwide contacts than most gangs, but it's the same principle.

Point is, it's not about Islam, it's about situations. Islam is not an inherently violent religion, it's a religion that happens to be more popular today in violent parts of the world.

Let's compare the two religion

Jesus taught about love thy neighbor, peace, and love thy enemy.

Muhammed taught that A. Christians and Jews are second class citizens and thus must pay taxes to live in their land.

B. That there are two types of Jihad, one inward and one outward, guess which one Musliums like to use.

C. I'm not sure if Muhammed did teach this, but through his action, he did spread the religion Islam through the sword. Jesus spread it by preaching, teaching and dying.

Name me a third world country not plagued by corruption, gangs, callous violent crime, etc. Islamofascism just has more worldwide contacts than most gangs, but it's the same principle.

Chile?

Um...a.k.a. Emperor Constantine? Or are you making some random reference?

Lol... I don't even know what I'm talking about any more. Scrap everything! I'm hitting the books.

What? You're not making sense and I'm fairly certain the logic you are using is entirely your own.



By "they" you mean the afoermentioned 1 billion Muslims?

Your sneaking suspicion means Islam is not a religion of peace?

This is an argument?



It would not be politically correct. I myself have a sneaking suspicion that there are a great many people in the West who would love to just nuke the entire Middle East.




*sigh* Yeah, I must want to hug Osama bin Laden. That sure does follow from anything I've ever said.



Wow, someone killed the Pope!

And I'm from the Middle East!

Dude, you shouldn't type drunk. And you always seem to be drunk. Maybe it's just best if you shut the fuck up if you think this is all so funny as to warrant inane "lol" every five seconds.


ok,
well i will forgive the insult and address your points...what were they again?

if your from the middle east...do you concur with the death to the pope crap?

if so,i have nothing to say to you,and your "putting me in my place is a joke"

i will add a lol just to piss you off.

your logic is so feeble i wont argue with you.

but calling me drunk is a good cover...that should help you NOT address the points i made.

as i have said ad nauseam..i have zero/ziltch issues with muslims...i have issues with their so called ignorance of the fact that people commit atrocities in their name,and here nary a peep.
actually i saw people dance in the streets of palistine when the trade centers fell,rejoicing at the deaths of thousands...i cant get my head around that..maybe you can justify it in your sick little world...but that was innocent people to me.

be as snide and deriding of me as you can possibly be...but you know what...your a twit at best,an apologist at worst.

you are the type that give liberals a bad name....no matter what...tow the party line,no matter how stupid.

honestly...justify the murder of children,and dont say in war...justify why intentionally so called freedom fighters detonate bombs in markets...

your the most despicable of all..you could make a difference and you dont.

you just whine.

Yes. Damn those Romans for taking Judea. Scum!

Anyway I'm off to piss on koran. I'm janjweed so it's okay..:rolleyes: Janjaweed are Muslim.... and the Romans invaded Judea before the Muslim religion was founded...

:rolleyes: Janjaweed are Muslim.... and the Romans invaded Judea before the Muslim religion was founded...

There is a little portion of your brain that is used for critical thinking. It's not the same bit that has the self-righteous knee jerk response.

Oh yeah, the pope must die for insulting islam.

Islam = peace.

Let's compare the two religion

Jesus taught about love thy neighbor, peace, and love thy enemy.

Muhammed taught that A. Christians and Jews are second class citizens and thus must pay taxes to live in their land.

B. That there are two types of Jihad, one inward and one outward, guess which one Musliums like to use.

C. I'm not sure if Muhammed did teach this, but through his action, he did spread the religion Islam through the sword. Jesus spread it by preaching, teaching and dying.

Jesus teaches love people. Great. The problem is that a religion's founder has little to no effect on any believers besides religious scholars. People think their religion is what they're taught it is, not what their text says it is.

A. Later developments. Compared to what Christians used to do to jews, I think we can safely say this was normal medieval behavior.
B. Guess which one is more important? Lesser jihad (i.e. outward) isn't even necessarily warfare, it's any sort of external religious struggle. Muslims like it for the same reason medieval christians liked burning witches: people focus on the aspects of their religion that fit their circumstances.
C. Jesus didn't spread the faith. Constantine spread the faith.

Edit: If you want to go with incredibly oversimplified statements about the founders, Mohammad taught fasting, prayer, charity, pligrimage, and faith

Chile?

Pinochet?

And I seriously doubt that drug lords, gang wars, etc., are nonexistent in Chile.

There is a little portion of your brain that is used for critical thinking. It's not the same bit that has the self-righteous knee jerk response.

Oh yeah, the pope must die for insulting islam.

Islam = peace. In your case it seems to be a very little portion...

Oh that is bull, that is complete bull. Poverty breed violence, yea. Then what about the thousands and millions of people who are poor but don't commit violence acts, how about them? What breeds violence is people who are not willing to look at their own situation, and instead decides to blame someone else instead of looking at their own backyard.Yea well, religion isn't exactly the epitome of rationality to begin with, so what the fuck did you really expect?

VR's point is valid enough. Injustice - real, percieved or displaced - breeds violence when people have no alternative means to address it.

The fancy pants president of Iran has complete support amongst everything but the elite. Why? Because even though the people who believe in him are the people he's screwing over the hardest, they lack the opportunity to figure it out. They just know they're screwed, so whatever explanation they're presented with by their regimes media, is the explanation they'll believe.

It's true for most of the region. Unfortunately it's also very true that we are to blame for a great many of the problems that plague the region, and that we do absolutely nothing to change it. You can hardly blame immigrants here for being pissed off by it. After all, we'd obliterate the fucking planet before we'd put up with the kind of shit we continually pull on the various ME nations. It's part of our culture. Something we're proud of. And we call others evil barbarian hordes if they share those same values.

How good are you at swollowing hypocricy? Does it go down well when it destroys things you care about? What about when it destroys people you care about?

About the constant crusade comments. No, the crusades aren't relevant to us in this day & age, but we're percieved as crusaders still to a great many people in the ME. Have you noticed how hard it is for orthodox NSGers to believe that atheists aren't depraved monsters & that it's even possible to live without god? Do you really think people from cultures soaked in orthodox Islam can believe that we aren't motivated by Christianity as a matter of course?
Do you think that Christian powers creating a non-Muslim country as a refuge for a non-Muslim peoples right around the historical battleground for our religions, isn't seen as the new crusades?

Don't get me wrong. I have 0 respect, sympathy or tolerance for any of the fuckers who believe they're fighting a holy war, but I utterly fail to comprehend how the hell my fellow westerners can avoid understanding why it's happening.

This argument typically boils down to, Muslims are bad. No, most Muslims are great only a few are bad and hey look some Christians are bad too so there. Id be VERY curious to see what the actual statistical breakdown of % of Muslims that do violence in the name of thier religion or support the use of violence from others of the same religion for the cause and compare the %s with Christians. Id suspect that although both numbers of violence supporters would be small in both groups id be willing to bet the Muslims would still support violence 20fold over the Christians. Im just guessing at this number however and a definitive answer to this would be most enlightening.

Islam is a religion of peace, at least it claims to be.
Some people calling themselves Muslim are violent.


What makes more sense next?

A: Islam is not a religion of peace.
or
B: Those violent people calling themselves Muslims are failing miserably at being Muslim.

In looking over this thread, I see a lot of people saying things like "even if it's 10 million terrorists, that's still a small percentage of Islam."

Now, that is, strictly, true. But I think it masks a rather different truth.

The majority of muslims are SE Asian; the most populous muslim nation is Indonesia. And in those areas, while they do have the occasional terrorist incident (such as the Bali bombing), the general populace seriously condemns and opposes such radicalism. Frankly, I've felt safer and more welcome in some areas of Malaysia than in some European cities.

Unfortunately, I simply can't say the same for the majority of the Middle East.

Don't get me wrong; places like the UAE and Turkey are every bit as civilized and advanced as anywhere else. But they are not the majority, and frankly, though that majority aren't terrorists themselves, they are strongly supportive of the terrorists goals AND METHODS.

I can say that the majority of Islam is peaceful.

I cannot say that about Arab or Persian Islam.

Generalizing muslim behaviour?

This is the general forum. Get used to it.

Muslims are hypocrites. :rolleyes: Next thread, please!

Let's compare the two religion

Jesus taught about love thy neighbor, peace, and love thy enemy.

Muhammed taught that A. Christians and Jews are second class citizens and thus must pay taxes to live in their land.

B. That there are two types of Jihad, one inward and one outward, guess which one Musliums like to use.

C. I'm not sure if Muhammed did teach this, but through his action, he did spread the religion Islam through the sword. Jesus spread it by preaching, teaching and dying.
Ok, let's do that.

First the New Testament, direct quotes from Jesus:

Don’t imagine that I came to bring peace on earth! No, rather a sword lf you love your father, mother, sister, brother, more than me, you are not worthy of being mine.

(Matthew 10:34)

Brother shall deliver up the brother to death, and the father the child: and the children shall rise up against their parents, and cause them to be put to death.

(Matthew 10:21)

He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death

(Matthew 15:4-7)

Now a handful from the Old Testament, out of a choice of many.

Cursed be he who does the Lords work remissly, cursed he who holds back his sword from blood.

(Jeremiah 48:10)

If your own full brother, or your son or daughter, or your beloved wife, or you intimate friend, entices you secretly to serve other gods, whom you and your fathers have not known, gods of any other nations, near at hand or far away, from one end of the earth to the other: do not yield to him or listen to him, nor look with pity upon him, to spare or shield him, but kill him. Your hand shall be the first raised to slay him; the rest of the people shall join in with you. You shall stone him to death, because he sought to lead you astray from the Lord, your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, that place of slavery. And all Israel, hearing of this, shall fear and never do such evil as this in your midst.

(Deuteronomy 13:7-12)

Anyone arrogant enough to reject the verdict of the judge or of the priest who represents the LORD your God must be put to death. Such evil must be purged from Israel.

(Deuteronomy 17:12)

So, what was that about the comparision of Islam with 'peaceful' Christianity?

I am so sick of the following conversation:

Dude 1: Islamists blow shit up!
Dude 2: Well, Christians have their fair share of crazies!
Dude 1: Christian crazies aren't as bad!

Guess what, kids, give the Christians their own country with its own Christian government and guess what you get: Inquisition.

You've got a lot of Islamist governments in power with lots of money. The only Christian government in power is spending all its time apologising for what it did when it had real power.

So, yeah, Christian crazies aren't as bad. They would be if you gave them power and money, though. I guarantee it.

the christians have 1 or 2 freaks like phelps being fucking fools.


Who here remembers Northern Ireland??

I do!

The prophet mohammed himself engaged troops in battle, beat and tortured slaves of his enemies and had spies killed. At least thats what it says and teaches in the Jihad guidelines and lessons book which was seized from an active cell in Manchester. Im such a courteous guy I'll even give you the source in both its handwritten original and also the translation to English.


Original hand written manual, part B (http://www.vaed.uscourts.gov/notablecases/moussaoui/exhibits/prosecution/AQ01677B.pdf)


English translation of manual, part B (http://www.vaed.uscourts.gov/notablecases/moussaoui/exhibits/prosecution/AQ01677TB.pdf)



In the English translation go to page 18 (of 73) in the pdf document and start reading from "12th Lesson Espionage (2) Information gathering using covert means"

In the original hand written manual the part which attributes these deeds to the prophet mohammed and verifies my post starts on page 20 of the pdf document. (Page 20 in pdf is the page which is hand numbered as 84 on the actual document)

In the original hand written manual the part which attributes these deeds to the prophet mohammed

Uh huh ... so ... I write a pamphlet all about having sex with rabbits and attribute it to the Prophet, you'll believe it's legitamite Islam?

Sweet. You're easily fooled. Give me your email address ... I got some pyramid scams I wanna lay on ya.

Uh huh ... so ... I write a pamphlet all about having sex with rabbits and attribute it to the Prophet, you'll believe it's legitamite Islam?

Sweet. You're easily fooled. Give me your email address ... I got some pyramid scams I wanna lay on ya.


I did not write the manual nor translate it nor seize it, I did read it though which is a hell of a lot more than you have done. The author of it tells where in the holy books these things are said, Youd know that if you were reading rather than spouting poo.

valid point.

however,and i am the first to defend the vast,vast majority of peacable muslims,your argument fails on 1 basic point.(i may be wrong)

i have lots of muslim friends,nicest people i have ever met...i also have tons of friends of the catholic persuasion(i was an alter boy)

the radical element of christians you analogise with muslims is a bit...shall we say...flawed.

the christians have 1 or 2 freaks like phelps being fucking fools.

if you look at isreal and iraq..seems they have an endless supply of jihadists willing to kill innocent people to further their cause.

your point would be more valid if christian zealots blew up innocents every day of the year,not the stray mcveigh or some other idiot runnning around in th woods after he blew up an abortion clinic.

you can draw the parallel..and your correct that religion seems to bring out the worse in some people.

but to compare the jihadists to a handfull of christian zealots is intellectually dishonest.

they commit unspeakable horror on a daily basis..whilst the fundies you point to are aberrations.

want to compare body counts?

i am not saying 1 is better then the other..i actually agree with you..but to compare the 2 is bullshit!

i think education and tolerance will be the only thing that saves islam from the dustbin of history...but unfortunately...they seem to have an endless supply of people willing to kill children in the name of god...daily!

to compare the 2 is dishonest...call a horse a horse if you must..but to compare the 2 is bullshit.

True, but it's not the religion's fault. It's the territory which they live in, it's their environment, it's their government, it's how they're being manipulated to do the bidding of those who wish for more power.

It's the fault of ignorance. Don't label the Muslim faith as violent because of the ignorance forced onto a people by their leaders.

I did not write the manual nor translate it nor seize it

No, but you believe it. That's what's important.


I did read it though which is a hell of a lot more than you have done.

Nor have I read the Protocols of the Elders of Zion. I don't believe it either, though.

The author of it tels wher in the holy books these things are said, Youd know that if you were reading rather than spouting poo.

Incidental. You haven't read Qur'an, but I have. I know that what's in the writing you posted is false whereas, had you read Qur'an, you'd know that too and wouldn't have posted your drivel.

Again ... gimme that email address. I love suckers.