NationStates Jolt Archive

I've looked at it, and it looks pretty average. The gameplay seems pretty basic, the PvP is poor and the graphics make Doom 3 and Prey look like videos of real life. Hardly seems worth paying $20 a month for.

If I'll pay for an MMO, it'll be WAR. That's a massive if.

It's getting old. It's fun for a few months of so, but I got sick of it after that.

I've looked at it, and it looks pretty average. The gameplay seems pretty basic, the PvP is poor and the graphics make Doom 3 and Prey look like videos of real life. Hardly seems worth paying $20 a month for.

If I'll pay for an MMO, it'll be WAR. That's a massive if.

WoW is just a repackaging of MMOs that have been done before and will be done again. Try something different.

Personally, I'm partial to City of Heroes. I like it's total lack of a complex economy. *nod*

I would imagine like most MMORPGs it really depends on the people you play with. I'd rather play an ok looking game with a good crowd, than a perfectly looking game with a bad crowd.

I would imagine like most MMORPGs it really depends on the people you play with. I'd rather play an ok looking game with a good crowd, than a perfectly looking game with a bad crowd.

I've heard that the player base has much to be desired.

If you've played and liked Diablo, you'll like WoW.

Personally, I got sick of it and didn't renew my subscription after the initial round expired.

I've heard that the player base has much to be desired.

Yeah. It's better if you've got some friends to play with, but I joined at the time when most of mine that played already had maxed out characters.

I've looked at it, and it looks pretty average. The gameplay seems pretty basic, the PvP is poor and the graphics make Doom 3 and Prey look like videos of real life. Hardly seems worth paying $20 a month for.

If I'll pay for an MMO, it'll be WAR. That's a massive if.
I guess it all depends on what you are looking for in a game. I've found WoW to be entertaining and worth the money for the last few months, but I'm not really into hardcore gaming and I've long since over-dosed on Doom games. I also don't have that great a computer, so I always have to run games at the lowest graphics settings anyhow.

The PvP is a bit repetative, but it's improving with time. The world is very large, and also expanding with time, so PvE can't get repetative unless you play CONSTANTLY and always with the same toon.

Frankly, the only thing I really hate about the game is the game concept itself...I hate elves and magical spells and dragons and crap like that. I wish City of Heroes hadn't gone into the toilet so I could still be playing superhero on the weekends. :)

I've heard that the player base has much to be desired.
I've found it to be about average, myself. There are always stupid little twits who decide to live in MMORPGs like WoW, of course, but they're easily identified in WoW because they all do the exact same stuff. Such as roll a night elf hunter or a paladin who is "spec'ed for DPS." You can spot them a mile away and ignore them quite easily.

I guess it all depends on what you are looking for in a game. I've found WoW to be entertaining and worth the money for the last few months, but I'm not really into hardcore gaming and I've long since over-dosed on Doom games. I also don't have that great a computer, so I always have to run games at the lowest graphics settings anyhow.

The PvP is a bit repetative, but it's improving with time. The world is very large, and also expanding with time, so PvE can't get repetative unless you play CONSTANTLY and always with the same toon.

Frankly, the only thing I really hate about the game is the game concept itself...I hate elves and magical spells and dragons and crap like that. I wish City of Heroes hadn't gone into the toilet so I could still be playing superhero on the weekends. :)

I'm looking for a decent space based game personally. Maybe Starcraft Online will offer that, that'd rock. Eve Online is good, but gah is it complicated.

As for WoW I personally enjoy it, but not because of the game, the people are what make it. Playing it solo is absolutely horrific, can't stand soloing anymore.

City of Heroes hadn't gone into the toilet so I could still be playing superhero on the weekends. :)

:confused:

Are you referring to Issue 5?

Meh - I wish I had your problems on deciding which game to get.

With me, it's more finding any game that would actually run on my computer...

If you've played and liked Diablo, you'll like WoW.

Personally, I got sick of it and didn't renew my subscription after the initial round expired.

Diablo was ok. It's the closest thing to an original concept Blizzard has.

Meh - I wish I had your problems on deciding which game to get.

With me, it's more finding any game that would actually run on my computer...

www.adom.de

www.t-o-m-e.net

They're both free.

:confused:

Are you referring to Issue 5?
I was in the Beta for CoH, and I found the game becoming worse with every successive issue. The patch where they put in the Arena was the real beginning of the end. The whole mess with Hamidon was a joke. I tried the CoV Beta test, too, and it was the worst beta I have ever participated in. I was honestly embarassed for them. I never bought CoV. :P

Meh ... I enjoy WoW. But, then, it's better if some of your IRL friends play it with you and you have Teamspeak.

If you're ever on Staghelm, Horde. Holler at Cenobite. :)

Meh ... I enjoy WoW. But, then, it's better if some of your IRL friends play it with you and you have Teamspeak.

That does make a big difference. I lucked out and got into a great guild with my first toon, so I've had fun because the people are a hoot. I think that is why I have enjoyed it as much as I have.

WoW is OK. It grinds heavy, it's too linear, and its PvP isn't all that impressive, but it's got fun progression and a huge population.

I was in the Beta for CoH, and I found the game becoming worse with every successive issue. The patch where they put in the Arena was the real beginning of the end. The whole mess with Hamidon was a joke. I tried the CoV Beta test, too, and it was the worst beta I have ever participated in. I was honestly embarassed for them. I never bought CoV. :P

What was it specifically that turned you off?

WoW is OK. It grinds heavy, it's too linear, and its PvP isn't all that impressive, but it's got fun progression and a huge population.
Oh yeah, and that's another thing about WoW:

I'm a meta-geek because I find myself fascinated by the economy of WoW. By coincidence, I was taking an econ class when I first started playing, and I always get a kick out of watching market models come to life in that game. The huge population on some of the servers actually gives serious statistical significance to a lot of what goes on, and you can switch to other servers to see a kind of "alternate reality" in terms of market. You can go to new servers to look at what happens in blooming economies, and you can visit old ones to see how established economies differ.

Don't look at me like that. I told you I was a meta-geek.

I loved WoW. I had a character for 1.5 years and literally did all 100% of the content till i got bored of waiting for the new content to catch up to where we were. So i sold my Mage for $850 and bought xbox360 with it ;)

Like any game, when it's new, it's addictive because the world hasn't been explored and all the niches haven't been found. After about a year, any MMORPG can seem stale. Remember EverQuest? I was blown away when I first saw it, and equally so by World of WarCrack.

With the three months I had (one free, two purchased), I took one character to 25th level and decided to experience as many race-class combinations as I could (undead-necromancer, night elf-hunter, human-warrior, dwarf-paladin), and engaged in all the professions and skills. I like the depth of character development, but like any depth, it can be sounded and the bottom found, and thus, boredom.

I think anyone who likes RPGs will love WoW, and anyone who doesn't probably won't. The only RPG that is relatively limitless isn't on a computer. It's getting off your ass and going outside. I play games to escape -- not as a substitute for -- reality.

Besides, I'd rather go into a sniper server in UT2k4 or Halo and search for the "pink cloud". Much more release of aggravation from a simulated headshot. :D

What was it specifically that turned you off?The priorities of the developers were attrocious. They focused on adding unnecessary content instead of expanding essential content and addressing serious performance issues. The Arena was the ultimate example of this; while an ever-increasing population screamed about the total lack of end-game content, the devs instead focused on adding a totally new game element that then sucked away almost all their attention. I waited a while for them to do something after Arena, and when they did...it was to nerf the only end-game activity (Hamidon) so that raiding was even more pointless than it already had been.

They also make the mistake of trying to achieve game balance via nerfing, whereas games like WoW achieve it by progressively improving classes. CoH patches were regarded with dread by most players, since they always brought a round of power-downs. Basically, it became "City Of Average-To-Middling Citizens In Tights." The CoH devs insisted that they had no choice, because to do otherwise was to risk "inflation" of power, but WoW proves them wrong with every class review.

Oh, and I almost forgot one of the best things about WoW: the level of sexism in the game is pretty low. They still have most of the female toons do stupid sexy dance emotes while male characters get much better dances, but aside from that it's pretty tame.

Compare that to CoH, where there are two types of male toon (regular and huge) and only one type of female (because females can't be huge), and until one of the later patches you had no choice but to have size DDD boobs and a 20 inch waist. Most of the villain groups didn't have any female mobs at all until later patches slowly started adding a few. Female costume options were heavy on the school-girl skirts and underwear motifs, while male toons couldn't even be put in a pair of short pants until late in the game. The devs were clearly the kind of guys who can't figure out that they should keep their porn and their comics on separate shelves.

The priorities of the developers were attrocious. They focused on adding unnecessary content instead of expanding essential content and addressing serious performance issues. The Arena was the ultimate example of this; while an ever-increasing population screamed about the total lack of end-game content, the devs instead focused on adding a totally new game element that then sucked away almost all their attention. I waited a while for them to do something after Arena, and when they did...it was to nerf the only end-game activity (Hamidon) so that raiding was even more pointless than it already had been.

They also make the mistake of trying to achieve game balance via nerfing, whereas games like WoW achieve it by progressively improving classes. CoH patches were regarded with dread by most players, since they always brought a round of power-downs. Basically, it became "City Of Average-To-Middling Citizens In Tights." The CoH devs insisted that they had no choice, because to do otherwise was to risk "inflation" of power, but WoW proves them wrong with every class review.

In the early days, I strongly advocated a shift away from a level-based system, or at least to de-prioritize it. I also am frustraed that they did not put in some sort of crafting or other non-combat source of experience. There simply isn't enough to do.

Fortunately, they have been laying off the 'nerf' stick lately and have been improving various archetypes. Masterminds recently got a significant improvement as have dominators. Dominators are supposedly getting another buff soon.

I'm still reeling from the gutting to tankers from issues 4 and 5, however. :(

That does make a big difference. I lucked out and got into a great guild with my first toon, so I've had fun because the people are a hoot. I think that is why I have enjoyed it as much as I have.

Aye. I played it for about 3 weeks and got bored of it until I was talking to a couple of friends over lunch and it turned out they were trying it too. So, long story short, we all got on the same realm and it's been a blast ever since.

Aye. I played it for about 3 weeks and got bored of it until I was talking to a couple of friends over lunch and it turned out they were trying it too. So, long story short, we all got on the same realm and it's been a blast ever since.
It doesn't hurt that my boyfriend plays WoW. :) We were doing the long-distance thing for a while, and it was wonderful to get to play together because it was something we could DO. Talking on the phone is great, but it's even more fun to get to feel like you are "spending time" with somebody who you don't get to see in person as often as you'd like. A friend from school also plays with us sometimes, and we'd never get to "see" him otherwise.

It doesn't hurt that my boyfriend plays WoW.

Now that's just cool. Do you have celebratory make-out sessions when one of you dings? :D Hehehe.

I would.

Now that's just cool. Do you have celebratory make-out sessions when one of you dings? :D Hehehe.

I would.
Oddly enough, one of the first things I ever did in WoW was attend an in-game wedding. My boyfriend had been playing for several months, and the leaders of his guild got married in real life so they had a little ceremony and reception in game with their main toons. I confess, I am enough of a fogey that I was a little freaked out by the whole thing...it almost scared me away from WoW entirely because I was so worried about the kinds of weirdos who would be living in the game.

In game weddings are always creepy. They've been around as long as the internet has had games.


Creepy!

In game weddings are always creepy. They've been around as long as the internet has had games.


Creepy!
At least this couple was actually married in real life, so it was a little less creepy. I've had to totally avoid the RP servers in WoW, because it gets really disturbing how some people pour themselves into their characters and start believing that their uber-twinked paladin is really married to that hot rogue chick. Particularly since said hot rogue chick is probably a 45 year old man in real life, while the twink pali is a 14 year old boy.

Ironically, my fiancee' and I just set up our 10-day trials of WoW the night recently, and played.

See, we've been playing for a long time in EverQuest II and since it was released at the same time as WoW, the two have often been compared and usually people like WoW better.... So we decided to try it and see what it was about. X-Play gave it a 5/5, ehich is very rare, so off we went.

And we hate it.

The gameplay isn't very different from EQ2. I played a human Paladin and she played a human Cleric and it wasn't very unlike our Paladin-Mystic duo in EQ2. So far so good.

The artwork was meh... I know they're not trying to generate uber-graphics so we weren't expecting it. What disappointed me was that as I looked down at my Pally from a bird's eye view, the grass/flowers looked like the carpet in a daycare center.

What really turned us off was the player base. I had heard for a long time that WoW tended to attract younger players while EQ2 attracted older gamers. WoW levels faster, has blood effects when you hit monsters, and had the vivid colorful art. EQ2 tends to level more slowly, no blood (Except for a particle effect on certain DoT spells) and the art is meant to have a more realistic look and feel.

The chat channel looked like a pack of 14-year-olds having a belching contest. EQ2 isn't heavily moderated but I can tell you very little of what went on in that WoW chat would fly in EQ2. I haven't seen the word "fag" used that many times since the last time I saw the movie Falling Down. It got to the point where we would have WELCOMED a Chuck Norris convo.

So the short answer is, no, WoW isn't that good.

I've heard that the player base has much to be desired.

Sometimes ... but it is such a massive player base it adds to the game imensly being able to interact like that

Your mistake was in rolling alliance. Bunch of damn kids.

Horde is considerably more mature, wether they're older or not I dunno, but they're more mature. All the kiddies and pervs are attracted to the alliance. I blame night elves and I lament the choice of blood elves as Horde. I say we round 'em all up and beat 'em to death with stripper poles.

I'm still holding out for Warhammer Online. It has everything that WoW has, except better (PvP is going ot be revolutionary, a strong possibility of mounted combat, more interesting combat system), it's got far better graphics, a better background world, a better atmosphere, and awesome race cultures (for example, the Empire is Germany :D and the Greenskins are gangstas).

What really turned us off was the player base. I had heard for a long time that WoW tended to attract younger players while EQ2 attracted older gamers.

...

The chat channel looked like a pack of 14-year-olds having a belching contest. EQ2 isn't heavily moderated but I can tell you very little of what went on in that WoW chat would fly in EQ2. I haven't seen the word "fag" used that many times since the last time I saw the movie Falling Down. It got to the point where we would have WELCOMED a Chuck Norris convo.

You play MMORPGs and you leave the chat channels enabled?! Wow, you're brave souls.

I deactivate most chat channels unless I am currently looking for a group. In-game chats are usually eye-bleedingly bad in every game I've tried.


WoW levels faster... EQ2 tends to level more slowly...

I have to say, that's one of the things I love about WoW. After the tedious grind of CoH, I love being able to constantly get new abilities and upgrades as I play. But then, I get bored easily, and I'm probably one of the immature gamer types that annoy you.

I also like the blood effects because they're so pixelated and cartoonish. Reminds me of Mortal Kombat back in the day...FINISH HIM!

Sometimes ... but it is such a massive player base it adds to the game imensly being able to interact like that

I don't like massive player bases. No MMO is able to handle them realistically yet. No, not even WoW. You have 100000 players stuffed into this little city.

I wonder why that is... I've noticed a similar effect in EQ2 although not as distinct... but I've found that my evil characters (Freeport) tend to have an easier time finding a good group and helpful allies than my good characters (Qeynos).

I also like the blood effects because they're so pixelated and cartoonish. Reminds me of Mortal Kombat back in the day...FINISH HIM!

You thought MK was CARTOONISH?

Horde is considerably more mature, wether they're older or not I dunno, but they're more mature. All the kiddies and pervs are attracted to the alliance. I blame night elves and I lament the choice of blood elves as Horde.

GAAAAAAAAH YES!!!! Stupid blood elves!!!!

99% of what is wrong with WoW can be directly attributed to the presence of elves in the game. Horde has been the safe zone because it's elf-free, so all the twits have to roll their Leggolass hunters on Alliance.

I don't like massive player bases. No MMO is able to handle them realistically yet. No, not even WoW. You have 100000 players stuffed into this little city.

Why are you playing a MASSIVE multy player game if you dont like large player bases?

I'm still holding out for Warhammer Online. It has everything that WoW has, except better (PvP is going ot be revolutionary, a strong possibility of mounted combat, more interesting combat system), it's got far better graphics, a better background world, a better atmosphere, and awesome race cultures (for example, the Empire is Germany :D and the Greenskins are gangstas).

I wanted to play Warhammer Online, but you can't play Bretonnia!

GAAAAAAAAH YES!!!! Stupid blood elves!!!!

99% of what is wrong with WoW can be directly attributed to the presence of elves in the game. Horde has been the safe zone because it's elf-free, so all the twits have to roll their Leggolass hunters on Alliance.

That's why WAR has the elves completely overshadowed by Empire, Dwarves, Chaos and Greenskins.

You thought MK was CARTOONISH?
In comparison to today's games, yup.

Why are you playing a MASSIVE multy player game if you dont like large player bases?

I don't like large player bases because nobody's been able to integrate them well yet. If it was done well, then...

I wanted to play Warhammer Online, but you can't play Bretonnia!

Bugger Bretonnia! We've got Germa... Empire!

I wanna see how they balance WAR, though. A standard Chaos has always been able to beat the crap out of a standard Empire character.

I have to say, that's one of the things I love about WoW. After the tedious grind of CoH, I love being able to constantly get new abilities and upgrades as I play. But then, I get bored easily, and I'm probably one of the immature gamer types that annoy you.

I also like the blood effects because they're so pixelated and cartoonish. Reminds me of Mortal Kombat back in the day...FINISH HIM!

I don't have anything against people that like to level fast. I only sat that tends to attract a younger crowd, generally.

My best friend plays Star Wars:Galaxies (which I used to play also) and he's a power gamer in the sense that he can't stand to move slow. He likes to get going and grind XP like it's going out of style. We're a contrast, he and I. It blows his mind that my EQ2 Paladin has been around since the day EQ2 went online, and yet is only level 41. (Max level in EQ2 is currently 70.) I just have a LOT of alts and I like to stop & smell the roses. (EQ2 has really good content.)

I don't like large player bases because nobody's been able to integrate them well yet. If it was done well, then...

Wow does not do it THAT bad ... I dont mind the people there ... besides the machine intensive nature (not an issue with my current setup but still....)

Bugger Bretonnia! We've got Germa... Empire!

I wanna see how they balance WAR, though. A standard Chaos has always been able to beat the crap out of a standard Empire character.

Empire schmemipre. My son plays Empire in Warhammer Fantasy Battles and I pwned him with my Bretonnian knights. Empire knights have glass jaws!

Wow does not do it THAT bad ... I dont mind the people there ... besides the machine intensive nature (not an issue with my current setup but still....)

Still... no MMO can handle massive player bases yet.

Empire schmemipre. My son plays Empire in Warhammer Fantasy Battles and I pwned him with my Bretonnian knights. Empire knights have glass jaws!

But the Empire has Sigmar Warrior Priests!

It blows his mind that my EQ2 Paladin has been around since the day EQ2 went online, and yet is only level 41. (Max level in EQ2 is currently 70.) I just have a LOT of alts and I like to stop & smell the roses. (EQ2 has really good content.)
That tends to be my problem: I like to make and play a lot of alts, but in games like CoH that used to mean that none of my toons were leveling at all. (In CoH, this was especially problematic because the content at each level bracket was so damn repetative and boring after a while.) I don't feel the need to powerlevel, and I certainly don't fancy grinding, so I enojy games where I can feel like I'm leveling pretty regularly without having to do any of that stuff. I like getting new powers because that is what keeps the game fresh for me...I get sick of hitting the same two buttons in every encounter! :)

But the Empire has Sigmar Warrior Priests!

Priceless: Watching an Empire mortar land directly on a unit of Bretonnian Knights of the Realm, kill one, and take out 5 of the Teutogen Guard they were in hand to hand combat with.

That tends to be my problem: I like to make and play a lot of alts, but in games like CoH that used to mean that none of my toons were leveling at all. (In CoH, this was especially problematic because the content at each level bracket was so damn repetative and boring after a while.) I don't feel the need to powerlevel, and I certainly don't fancy grinding, so I enojy games where I can feel like I'm leveling pretty regularly without having to do any of that stuff. I like getting new powers because that is what keeps the game fresh for me...I get sick of hitting the same two buttons in every encounter! :)

It is so very satisfying to gain abilities that have been hitherto the realm of people far above my level. Summoning a horse at level 20, summoning a squire at level 40... Soon my Pally will even be able to rez.

I love that there's more content than one can possibly do with one character. (Well, you CAN do it all, but no XP anymore for the lowbie stuff once you reach a certain level.) This way my Templar (29) can level doing entirely different things than what my Paly did.

Problem is, of course, it's ot just having a Paly and a Templar... it's also my Mystic, my Shadowknight, my Warlock, my Conjurer, my Fury, my Ranger, etc....

Yes.. I have 10 toons.

I'd rather play DnD with my friends on a Saturday night than waste my time with an MMORPG. My dad is big on WOW. That's all he does nowadays. So I guess it's good. <.<

That tends to be my problem: I like to make and play a lot of alts, but in games like CoH that used to mean that none of my toons were leveling at all. (In CoH, this was especially problematic because the content at each level bracket was so damn repetative and boring after a while.) I don't feel the need to powerlevel, and I certainly don't fancy grinding, so I enojy games where I can feel like I'm leveling pretty regularly without having to do any of that stuff. I like getting new powers because that is what keeps the game fresh for me...I get sick of hitting the same two buttons in every encounter! :)

That's actually a recurring problem with wow, most classes only have to hit a few buttons. Rogues it's sinister strikex5 Eviserate. Wee... Hunters just auto attack. Warriors, atleast tanks are more interesting in that we target switch, sunder armor, switch stances. Warriors are surprisingly one of the most complex classes.

Though sometimes they're too much work, or I'm being lazy, then I play my mage. Frostbolt spam!


I'd never play another EQ type game. I had quite enough of forced grouping (even though I loathe soloing). Got a wizard up to 62 in EverQuest along with a 56 Shadowknight. I don't even know what the max level is now.

I'd rather play DnD with my friends on a Saturday night than waste my time with an MMORPG. My dad is big on WOW. That's all he does nowadays. So I guess it's good. <.<

1st Edition AD&D. Nothing else exists in my universe.

That's actually a recurring problem with wow, most classes only have to hit a few buttons. Rogues it's sinister strikex5 Eviserate. Wee... Hunters just auto attack. Warriors, atleast tanks are more interesting in that we target switch, sunder armor, switch stances. Warriors are surprisingly one of the most complex classes.

A lot of people bitch that being a priest is just like playing whack-a-mole over and over with heals, but I find it to be really fun. I really enjoy priest-yoinking, which is basically reverse-ganking...it's so satisfying when a mob (or a player in PvP) thinks they have one of my teammates almost dead, and I pop a shield and some heals and "reverse gank" the kill from them! Oh, so you think you're going to kill my tank? YOINK! No, you're not. :D


Though sometimes they're too much work, or I'm being lazy, then I play my mage. Frostbolt spam!

Yeah, mages are easy mode, which can be nice sometimes. Playing my warlock is fun because I can go into a kind of easy mode (pet tank, dot dot dot, shadowbolt rinse repeat), but I also can choose to do more complicated things if the fancy strikes me. I've also found that game play for warlocks changes a ton with different specs, something that hasn't seemed to be the case for some of the other classes.

I don't like MMO's all that much, so I really wouldn't like WoW. Give me a good, straightforward story line, you know, like in Oblivion, and I'll dither away my days, but WoW doesn't cut it.

Maybe my Paly in WoW isn't high enough level yet, but to tanks in WoW get a taunt? When I was tanking, it was hard to keep agro off the healer (my fiancee).

One annoying thing we found is no implied targeting. In EQ2, let's say you're the healer and you have the tank targeted. When you cast heals, the tank gets healed. BUT... You also, in turn, have whatever the tank has targeted as your impled target, so that without switching targets, you can use your smite to do some direct damage to the mob. It also means your auto attack keeps hitting the mob when you're not casting.

Wow didn't seem to have that, so when the healer wanted to do some direct damage, she had to switch targets, then switch back to me to heal.

Only class that gets a taunt is warriors, hence we tank. Paladins can do it, but the others in the group need to watch their aggro a bit more.

It's exactly opposite of EQ1 where paladins and shadowknights could taunt like crazy and everyone had to be careful when a warrior was tanking.

Maybe my Paly in WoW isn't high enough level yet, but to tanks in WoW get a taunt? When I was tanking, it was hard to keep agro off the healer (my fiancee).

As I understand it, the paladin is not meant to be a tank in the classical sense. They do have high armor, but they aren't meant to be main-tanking because they lack taunts and aren't designed for heavy damage that can help hold agro.


One annoying thing we found is no implied targeting. In EQ2, let's say you're the healer and you have the tank targeted. When you cast heals, the tank gets healed. BUT... You also, in turn, have whatever the tank has targeted as your impled target, so that without switching targets, you can use your smite to do some direct damage to the mob. It also means your auto attack keeps hitting the mob when you're not casting.

Wow didn't seem to have that, so when the healer wanted to do some direct damage, she had to switch targets, then switch back to me to heal.
I would love that kind of implied targetting! They only recently added the feature that automatically makes you cast a heal on yourself when you have no target or a hostile target, and I can't believe they left that out for as long as they did. It's so handy.

I don't like the cartoonish feeling of the world, or the simplicity of the gameplay. You can't even choose your own stats when you level up, and you don't even level up that often because they capped it at 60 so it takes longer than if the level cap was 99.

I don't like the cartoonish feeling of the world, or the simplicity of the gameplay. You can't even choose your own stats when you level up, and you don't even level up that often because they capped it at 60 so it takes longer than if the level cap was 99.

Why would you choose your stats? Your stats don't even level up in EQ. WoW they just automatically go up as you level, to say nothing of your gear. Most of your stats are based solely on gear. If you want to change them, change gear. It's pretty easy. Hell my priest has very low int/spirit and massive +healing.

Only class that gets a taunt is warriors, hence we tank. Paladins can do it, but the others in the group need to watch their aggro a bit more.

It's exactly opposite of EQ1 where paladins and shadowknights could taunt like crazy and everyone had to be careful when a warrior was tanking.

Well for what it's worth, Paladins and Shadowknights to get a taunt in EQ2, but it's not very effective compared to that of Guardians/Berzerkers. Combined with the low DPS, Pallys have a tough time holding agro sometimes.

So it looks like I made false assumptions when I created my WoW character. Ah well, wouldn't be my first dunderheaded move.

I don't like the cartoonish feeling of the world, or the simplicity of the gameplay. You can't even choose your own stats when you level up...
Sure you can...buy gear! You have tremendous control over the stats on your toon, and you can make adjustments even when you aren't leveling at all by simply buying or finding new stuff to equip.

As I understand it, the paladin is not meant to be a tank in the classical sense. They do have high armor, but they aren't meant to be main-tanking because they lack taunts and aren't designed for heavy damage that can help hold agro.
Gah. My bad then. I had assumed they'd have a taunt of some kind to go with the heavy armor.


I would love that kind of implied targetting! They only recently added the feature that automatically makes you cast a heal on yourself when you have no target or a hostile target, and I can't believe they left that out for as long as they did. It's so handy.

I'm kind of shocked.. when I said I couldn't find implied targets I figured someone woudl point out that I'd missed it somehow. Thay make life SO much easier. Consider this further benefit:

If you're a big dps class like a Ranger or a Warlock, if you zap a grouped mob that isn't currently being hit by anyone else, you're probably going to get its attention and pull agro. It might be hard to keep up with the tank if he/she switches targets or there's a lot of clutter on screen.

By contrast, by targeting the tank, then you zap whatever he/she is hitting and taunting, and leaving the other stuff alone for the time being. This makes it a lot easier on the tank, and keeps you alive.

Why would you choose your stats? Your stats don't even level up in EQ. WoW they just automatically go up as you level, to say nothing of your gear. Most of your stats are based solely on gear. If you want to change them, change gear. It's pretty easy. Hell my priest has very low int/spirit and massive +healing.

Still, I don't like the idea of the game telling me what stats to level up. It's like, I wanna create a rogue that crits more often, so I wanna take points away from str and put them into luck without having to do repetitive raids to find the right equipment to do so - nevermind the fact that I'd have to wait to get to a certain level to even begin to have access to equipment that affects my stats, and by then I'm bored to tears.

It just doesn't make sense to me that I'm not allowed to choose how I want my character to evolve. It'd make it a lot easier to get through the repetition and tedium if my character was more my own rather than the result of what the game's told me to be.

Sure you can...buy gear! You have tremendous control over the stats on your toon, and you can make adjustments even when you aren't leveling at all by simply buying or finding new stuff to equip.

I'd still see this as a weakness in WoW, only because of what I'm used to. In EQ2 you can fine tune your stats by buying the right gear, but you also improve stats as you level, and every few levels you can choose specific stats to give an extra boost to. You can also choose your player race by what stats they're strong in.

For example, if I want a character with a good high strength, I won't choose a High Elf, but I'd probably choose a Barbarian.

Every 8 levels I can boost his/her strength if I want to, so I COULD do the High Elf and compensate for the low strength, or have a Barbarian that can lift a Buick.

Sure you can...buy gear! You have tremendous control over the stats on your toon, and you can make adjustments even when you aren't leveling at all by simply buying or finding new stuff to equip.

Again, you assume this is a level 60 character I'm talking about. No, I'm talking when you're below level 20 and you want to start customizing your character but haven't gotten any decent stat-altering equipment. Why should you be unable to make your character YOURS? This system just makes the characters seem more like clones with different clothes.

I'd still see this as a weakness in WoW, only because of what I'm used to. In EQ2 you can fine tune your stats by buying the right gear, but you also improve stats as you level, and every few levels you can choose specific stats to give an extra boost to. You can also choose your player race by what stats they're strong in.

For example, if I want a character with a good high strength, I won't choose a High Elf, but I'd probably choose a Barbarian.

Every 8 levels I can boost his/her strength if I want to, so I COULD do the High Elf and compensate for the low strength, or have a Barbarian that can lift a Buick.

Exactly. I'm such a D&Dork, I much prefer the NWN/EQ style stuff over what WoW has.

Gah. My bad then. I had assumed they'd have a taunt of some kind to go with the heavy armor.

Yeah, I think paladins are one of the most misunderstood classes. I think the devs intended them to be a sort of support class, with buffs and some heals and the potential to off-tank, but they don't do a very good job of making it clear that this is what they were going for. Most people I know who rolled paladins did not get what they expected from their toon.


I'm kind of shocked.. when I said I couldn't find implied targets I figured someone woudl point out that I'd missed it somehow. Thay make life SO much easier. Consider this further benefit:

If you're a big dps class like a Ranger or a Warlock, if you zap a grouped mob that isn't currently being hit by anyone else, you're probably going to get its attention and pull agro. It might be hard to keep up with the tank if he/she switches targets or there's a lot of clutter on screen.

By contrast, by targeting the tank, then you zap whatever he/she is hitting and taunting, and leaving the other stuff alone for the time being. This makes it a lot easier on the tank, and keeps you alive.
Indeed! Hell, in CoH you could do this, and I think I've made it clear how low my opinion of that game is. :) I'm also shocked at the crappy system for finding groups in WoW; again, CoH even had a good system for this, but WoW just has this really annoying global channel, which used to not even be global! Finding teams used to mean sitting in one of the major cities for 45 minutes looking for a group...at least now you can be out questing or PvPing while you wait. Still, they've got a long way to go on that.

Again, you assume this is a level 60 character I'm talking about. No, I'm talking when you're below level 20 and you want to start customizing your character but haven't gotten any decent stat-altering equipment. Why should you be unable to make your character YOURS? This system just makes the characters seem more like clones with different clothes.
Hmm. This may just be a difference in temperment, but I don't really worry much about customizing toons when they are that low level. I'm usually just getting the hang of the class and exploring stuff. I also find that one levels up so quickly in WoW that my toons pass level 20 before I really notice :P.

If you are really interested in customizing at low levels, then I can understand why you would be frustrated. Not much to do about that. :(

Indeed! Hell, in CoH you could do this, and I think I've made it clear how low my opinion of that game is. :) I'm also shocked at the crappy system for finding groups in WoW; again, CoH even had a good system for this, but WoW just has this really annoying global channel, which used to not even be global! Finding teams used to mean sitting in one of the major cities for 45 minutes looking for a group...at least now you can be out questing or PvPing while you wait. Still, they've got a long way to go on that.

SWG was like that too... I remember whenever I wanted a group I'd head on over to the bazaar area in Bestine on Tatooine and there was usually a crowd of people hanging out and preparing to go raid the Squill Cave or something.

In those days, SWG had no levels. You used XP to buy your skill upgrades. When they switched to the level system my Bounty Hunter became level 51... but suddenly I felt like a noob again. I *still* don't know a good way to find groups in SWG, so I generally play (which is rare) when I know my buddies are on.

Still, I don't like the idea of the game telling me what stats to level up. It's like, I wanna create a rogue that crits more often, so I wanna take points away from str and put them into luck without having to do repetitive raids to find the right equipment to do so - nevermind the fact that I'd have to wait to get to a certain level to even begin to have access to equipment that affects my stats, and by then I'm bored to tears.

It just doesn't make sense to me that I'm not allowed to choose how I want my character to evolve. It'd make it a lot easier to get through the repetition and tedium if my character was more my own rather than the result of what the game's told me to be.

1) There is no luck stat.
2) You start getting stat changing gear at level 6.
3) Unless you want massively high end stuff you don't have to raid. I don't.
4) Using the AH you can customize your stats massively.

Hmm. This may just be a difference in temperment, but I don't really worry much about customizing toons when they are that low level. I'm usually just getting the hang of the class and exploring stuff. I also find that one levels up so quickly in WoW that my toons pass level 20 before I really notice :P.

If you are really interested in customizing at low levels, then I can understand why you would be frustrated. Not much to do about that. :(

Yar, I like being able to attack as fast as possible, even if that means to max out my dex and luck in lieu of def and constitution (hp).

1) There is no luck stat.
2) You start getting stat changing gear at level 6.
3) Unless you want massively high end stuff you don't have to raid. I don't.
4) Using the AH you can customize your stats massively.

1. There should be - this is another reason I don't like this game.
2. Yeah, defense +1. Woo.
3. I do want massively high-end stuff. That's the point, to get as strong as possible.
4. I hate AH. Stuff's too expensive, and it takes way too long to walk there. Another reason I don't like the game, the walking - the world is so large, but you have to walk all the way over to this town across the planet to learn how to swing a sword. Wtf.

Also, I dislike the negligence of the "fist" weapons. So few of them compared to the other types.

3. I do want massively high-end stuff. That's the point, to get as strong as possible.
Then you have to raid or PVP like a fiend. If it were easy to get the high-end stuff, it wouldn't be high-end any more because everybody would have it.

Then you have to raid or PVP like a fiend. If it were easy to get the high-end stuff, it wouldn't be high-end any more because everybody would have it.

And I'm fine with that - I'm fine with huge equipment being hard to get, and giving huge rewards to those that are able to obtain them. My beef is that you don't get to seriously alter your stats until you can either A: afford insanely expensive stuff at the AH, or B: do an assload of raids. Till then, you're static.

And I'm fine with that - I'm fine with huge equipment being hard to get, and giving huge rewards to those that are able to obtain them. My beef is that you don't get to seriously alter your stats until you can either A: afford insanely expensive stuff at the AH, or B: do an assload of raids. Till then, you're static.
I dunno, I've found it relatively easy to get some significant stat changes from quest items, mid level instances, and normal PVP rewards. Enchantments also can help. As a matter of fact, the stat boosts one gets from enchantments actually make a much much larger impact for low-level toons...try a level 19 WSG against twinks and you'll see what I mean! :P

Money would be the only limiting factor for those, and it's really not that hard to get money if you go with two gathering professions and use the AH. I've got over 200g on my level 29 priest, which is more than enough to "twink" myself to hell and gone if I want to.

Only class that gets a taunt is warriors, hence we tank.

Tell that to my feral druid...
I find that talents do individualise a toon far better than simple attribute distribution could. Equip does a lot of work as well, but talents are the most important thing. Problem is, a lot of people are too lazy, too stupid or to easily impressed by fail-safe how-tos to come up with their own style of character.
Individualising the player base is even better, have a well kept ignore list and an even longer one with friends and a fun guild (instead of one that doesnt leave room to breathe and calls you for farming and grinding every other second), well then you can really enjoy it.

But remember the golden rule: Never group with people who have stupid or embarassing names! It saves you sooo much frustration...

I dunno, I've found it relatively easy to get some significant stat changes from quest items, mid level instances, and normal PVP rewards. Enchantments also can help. As a matter of fact, the stat boosts one gets from enchantments actually make a much much larger impact for low-level toons...try a level 19 WSG against twinks and you'll see what I mean! :P

Money would be the only limiting factor for those, and it's really not that hard to get money if you go with two gathering professions and use the AH. I've got over 200g on my level 29 priest, which is more than enough to "twink" myself to hell and gone if I want to.

Agreed, you can alter your stats through other means. My point is, you could alter them EVEN MORE if you had control of what stats were increased during a level up, and that's mostly what bothers me, the fact that I COULD have more control over my character, but for some reason they saw fit to just not allow me that luxury.

One of the things that turned me off of WOW was the lack of options in creating a character. In EQ2 there are 16 character race classes, 5 that are strictly good and bad (unless you betray to the other city). There are also 24 profession classes. As with the races some are good and some are bad but there is no restriction on what class a character can be. As for the betrayal, is there anything like that in WOW?

One of the things that turned me off of WOW was the lack of options in creating a character. In EQ2 there are 16 character race classes, 5 that are strictly good and bad (unless you betray to the other city). There are also 24 profession classes. As with the races some are good and some are bad but there is no restriction on what class a character can be. As for the betrayal, is there anything like that in WOW?

Negative - the plotline doesn't even really make all that much sense. Alliance and Horde are constantly killing eachother everywhere you look, yet they're not even enemies because they're supposed to be on the same team since this third enemy came up that they have to work together to defeat. Some kind of ancient evil - something stereotypical like that.

Regardless, Horde and Alliance are on the same side, yet they kill eachother. Doesn't make sense to me.

And no, you can't defect to the other side. You can't even speak the same language as those on the opposite team. Zug zug.

Tell that to my feral druid...
I find that talents do individualise a toon far better than simple attribute distribution could. Equip does a lot of work as well, but talents are the most important thing. Problem is, a lot of people are too lazy, too stupid or to easily impressed by fail-safe how-tos to come up with their own style of character.
Individualising the player base is even better, have a well kept ignore list and an even longer one with friends and a fun guild (instead of one that doesnt leave room to breathe and calls you for farming and grinding every other second), well then you can really enjoy it.

But remember the golden rule: Never group with people who have stupid or embarassing names! It saves you sooo much frustration...


Yeah, reason I haven't used this name anywhere else for probably 5 years.

As for druids, they're healers, not tanks. Get to healing, and give me my mark of the wild! Damn furries!

If you're ever on Lothar horde look up Geon or Eban. Or Silvermoon alliance Zakisha.

Tell that to my feral druid...
I find that talents do individualise a toon far better than simple attribute distribution could. Equip does a lot of work as well, but talents are the most important thing. Problem is, a lot of people are too lazy, too stupid or to easily impressed by fail-safe how-tos to come up with their own style of character.
Individualising the player base is even better, have a well kept ignore list and an even longer one with friends and a fun guild (instead of one that doesnt leave room to breathe and calls you for farming and grinding every other second), well then you can really enjoy it.

But remember the golden rule: Never group with people who have stupid or embarassing names! It saves you sooo much frustration...

Talents are nifty. They're a ripoff of D&D, but they're nifty.

WoW essentially took D&D, shredded everything great about it, turned it into a cartoon, and replaced the storyline with a crappy one.

Talents are nifty. They're a ripoff of D&D, but they're nifty.

WoW essentially took D&D, shredded everything great about it, turned it into a cartoon, and replaced the storyline with a crappy one.

D&D iessentially took LoTR, shredded everything great about it, turned it into a nerdfest, and replaced the storyline with a crappy one.

D&D iessentially took LoTR, shredded everything great about it, turned it into a nerdfest, and replaced the storyline with a crappy one.

Yeah, except LoTR wasn't a game. Good try, though.

EDIT: Also, I don't remember anyone casting magic missile anyplace in LoTR, or using almost any magic. Sure, there are similar races, and similar monsters, but aside from then, the comparisons pretty much lose cohesion.

Yeah, except LoTR wasn't a game. Good try, though.

EDIT: Also, I don't remember anyone casting magic missile anyplace in LoTR, or using almost any magic. Sure, there are similar races, and similar monsters, but aside from then, the comparisons pretty much lose cohesion.

Ohhh magic missile

Somehow strikes me as falling under the “nerdfest” comment
:p

As for druids, they're healers, not tanks. Get to healing, and give me my mark of the wild! Damn furries!
Fighters are stupid berserkers who couldnt hold aggro if it had handles. :D

Rather unlikely we meet online, seeing that i play on european servers.

Besides, with stupid names i meant ones like Deadkiller and Grandmasta and with embarassing ones like Asshol and Gândalph, yours is ok in my book. ;)

Ohhh magic missile

Somehow strikes me as falling under the “nerdfest” comment
:p

I never said D&D wasn't a nerdfest - I'm proud to be a nerd.

1. There should be - this is another reason I don't like this game.
2. Yeah, defense +1. Woo.
3. I do want massively high-end stuff. That's the point, to get as strong as possible.
4. I hate AH. Stuff's too expensive, and it takes way too long to walk there. Another reason I don't like the game, the walking - the world is so large, but you have to walk all the way over to this town across the planet to learn how to swing a sword. Wtf.

Also, I dislike the negligence of the "fist" weapons. So few of them compared to the other types.

Well .....

At level 6, you can't expect a whole lot. If you do, you're better off playing a game like Halo or whatever. I mean ... lvl 6, you're squishy and weak and, well, you're supposed to be! What do you want ... godly gear on your lvl 6 rogue?

AH is pretty obnoxious sometimes, but you don't have to go that far for it. For alliance, there are auction houses in Darnassus, Iron Forge, and Stormwind (all of which have readily accessable flight paths - no walking!) and for Horde there's the AH in Orgrimmar, Undercity, and Thunder Bluff. Not to mention the neutral auction houses in Booty Bay and Gadgetzan.

WoW is constantly updating (including an upcoming expansion with 2 new races and new professions plus a raise in the level cap to 70 and flying mounts) and improving. Fist weps are annoying in their lack, but that will change.

As for the stats problem, remember you also have fully customizable talent points to spend starting at level 10. So your level 20 rogue won't necessarily be the same as the level 20 rogue you're standing next to, even if you're wearing the exact same gear.

One of the things that turned me off of WOW was the lack of options in creating a character.

WoW: 2 Factions, 4 (soon to be 5) races in each, 8 classes (race restrictive), 3 mix-and-matchable talent trees, 9 (soon to be 11) major professions and 3 secondary professions.

I've say there are a lot of options in creating a character.

You could be an Undead Combat Assassin Rogue Engineer or an Undead Ninja Rogue Alchemist or a Troll Elemental Shaman Tribal Leatherworker or whatever.

The possibilities are wide and varied.

Well .....

At level 6, you can't expect a whole lot. If you do, you're better off playing a game like Halo or whatever. I mean ... lvl 6, you're squishy and weak and, well, you're supposed to be! What do you want ... godly gear on your lvl 6 rogue?

AH is pretty obnoxious sometimes, but you don't have to go that far for it. For alliance, there are auction houses in Darnassus, Iron Forge, and Stormwind (all of which have readily accessable flight paths - no walking!) and for Horde there's the AH in Orgrimmar, Undercity, and Thunder Bluff. Not to mention the neutral auction houses in Booty Bay and Gadgetzan.

WoW is constantly updating (including an upcoming expansion with 2 new races and new professions plus a raise in the level cap to 70 and flying mounts) and improving. Fist weps are annoying in their lack, but that will change.

As for the stats problem, remember you also have fully customizable talent points to spend starting at level 10. So your level 20 rogue won't necessarily be the same as the level 20 rogue you're standing next to, even if you're wearing the exact same gear.

I know you're supposed to be weak at level 6, but at the very least I'd like to attack as fast as a level 6 can attack.

AH is still annoying and costly even if the walk is negated.

Talent points are bollocks - you get only one per level up. They're no substitute for actual stat points.

I played MxO. That got boring because all of the missions (quest) were the same. Go talk to someone, kill them etc. Plus there was too much complaining on the forums about how SoE was ruining the game etc.

I also played Runescape, I was a magician and that got old because in order to do certain things and quest, certain abilities had to be at a certain level, so it just got too complicated and too time consuming. Also the world was too big for walking.

Right now I am waiting for VanGuard. www.vanguardsoh.com So far it looks promising. The only thing that worries me about it is SoE.

Agreed, you can alter your stats through other means. My point is, you could alter them EVEN MORE if you had control of what stats were increased during a level up, and that's mostly what bothers me, the fact that I COULD have more control over my character, but for some reason they saw fit to just not allow me that luxury.
Fair enough. I'm annoyed that they won't allow me to customize my character's appearance more! CoH really spoilt me that way, since you could customize so much about your toon, so WoW seems like a world full of clones by comparison.

Fair enough. I'm annoyed that they won't allow me to customize my character's appearance more! CoH really spoilt me that way, since you could customize so much about your toon, so WoW seems like a world full of clones by comparison.

We had exactly the same problem. The nice thing about SWG and EQ2 was you could change everything, including facial features, size and even eye color... using a color selector similar to the one you use to make custom colors in MS Paint.

In SWG you could even adjust the build of the character's body as well as female breast size. (You can imagine most female characters ran around maxed out on that one...)

In SWG you could even adjust the build of the character's body as well as female breast size. (You can imagine most female characters ran around maxed out on that one...)

I bet that made the guys happy. Me, I'm more of an A-B cup man myself, dunno why.

We had exactly the same problem. The nice thing about SWG and EQ2 was you could change everything, including facial features, size and even eye color... using a color selector similar to the one you use to make custom colors in MS Paint.

In SWG you could even adjust the build of the character's body as well as female breast size. (You can imagine most female characters ran around maxed out on that one...)

Guess they figure once you slap a helmet on you're pretty interchangable with everyone else. Just wish Undead and Trolls would stand up straight. I'm more than 4 feet tall! Oh and I want my spine to stop showing through my armor and clothes. I question the value of armor that's all torn up and has my damn spine exposed.

My only real issue with EQ2 is that there are two different model sets. You have the standard set of character models, or, if you want to you can change to display a set of alternate asian-styled models.

IMHO, some are better in the asian versions, some not so good, and luckily you can pick and choose.

My issue: Movement. If you have a female character and she's running across Norrath (using standard model) her feet plant one in front of the other. makes the view not-at-all-unpleasant and is failry natural looking.

The alternate model set has the character planting each foot in a separate track, and it looks like she's running with a broomstick in her butt.

The range of customizations in the alternate set is also not quite as wide as in the standard model set, but I can live with that. It's still better than WoW.

Apparently its quite addictive. Thats the reason why my brother dropped out of college, cuz he was addicted to WoW.

I've heard that the player base has much to be desired.

QFE. The community of little tweens is what drove me away from that game.

Apparently its quite addictive. Thats the reason why my brother dropped out of college, cuz he was addicted to WoW.

I guess that why they called the game WoW...

I've heard of one guy killing himself over a betryal in an MMORPG, don't remember which one it was.

Personally I think these people were messed up before they started playing MMORPGs.

It was ok for a while but after the 5th character I got to lvl 60 the max lvl it got old fast and that only took about 3 months.

I guess that why they called the game WoW...

I've heard of one guy killing himself over a betryal in an MMORPG, don't remember which one it was.

Personally I think these people were messed up before they started playing MMORPGs.

I wonder if that's anything like the incident back in the early 80s where some kid in college killed himself and they tried to blame Dungeons & Dragons. As it turned out, D&D had nothing to do with the suicide, but that didn't stop some fundie group from financing the movie Mazes & Monsters (Starring Tom Hanks.. go figure) about a guy who goes crazy from playing D&D in college.

Star Wars Battlefront II is better. :p

Guess they figure once you slap a helmet on you're pretty interchangable with everyone else. Just wish Undead and Trolls would stand up straight. I'm more than 4 feet tall! Oh and I want my spine to stop showing through my armor and clothes. I question the value of armor that's all torn up and has my damn spine exposed.

Yeah, I never understood that... you're a zombie. You have no physical strength because your tendons are GONE, not to mention your brain rotting to crap. I can't imagine what they were thinking having them as a race in WoW.

"Let's think of the most impractical race ever and pretend they're not supposed to suck."

WoW: 2 Factions, 4 (soon to be 5) races in each, 8 classes (race restrictive), 3 mix-and-matchable talent trees, 9 (soon to be 11) major professions and 3 secondary professions.

I've say there are a lot of options in creating a character.

You could be an Undead Combat Assassin Rogue Engineer or an Undead Ninja Rogue Alchemist or a Troll Elemental Shaman Tribal Leatherworker or whatever.

The possibilities are wide and varied.

Bah. Look again at what AL Said:
One of the things that turned me off of WOW was the lack of options in creating a character. In EQ2 there are 16 character race classes, 5 that are strictly good and bad (unless you betray to the other city). There are also 24 profession classes...

That's 2 factions, 16 races, 24 Adventuring classes, and since you included secondaries... 9 Tradeskill classes.

And, while starting classes are race/class restricted, they don't stay that way. It is entirely possible to have a Troll Paladin or a High Elf Necromancer.

Yeah, I never understood that... you're a zombie. You have no physical strength because your tendons are GONE, not to mention your brain rotting to crap. I can't imagine what they were thinking having them as a race in WoW.

"Let's think of the most impractical race ever and pretend they're not supposed to suck."

Too bad you can't have combos, like an undead Troll... that would rock!

I wonder if that's anything like the incident back in the early 80s where some kid in college killed himself and they tried to blame Dungeons & Dragons. As it turned out, D&D had nothing to do with the suicide, but that didn't stop some fundie group from financing the movie Mazes & Monsters (Starring Tom Hanks.. go figure) about a guy who goes crazy from playing D&D in college.

I wonder if that's a good movie. But I dunno, I'm trying to find the story, but I don't know what game he was playing or anything lol.

Too bad you can't have combos, like an undead Troll... that would rock!

Yeah, undead isn't a 'race', it's a status. What the hell was Blizzard smoking when they did that? Anything can be undead.

I wonder if that's a good movie. But I dunno, I'm trying to find the story, but I don't know what game he was playing or anything lol.

go to Wikipedia and look under Mazes & Monsters. You should be able to find those details there.

I own a copy of the DVD, found it in the cheapie bin at Walmart. As a long-time D&D player I had to have it!

And no, it's not a very good movie. The depiction of the kids sitting at the table playing Mazes&Monsters (Read: D&D) is hilarious in its silliness.

Yeah, I never understood that... you're a zombie. You have no physical strength because your tendons are GONE, not to mention your brain rotting to crap. I can't imagine what they were thinking having them as a race in WoW.

"Let's think of the most impractical race ever and pretend they're not supposed to suck."
Dude, we're talking about a world where cow-people ride around on dinosaurs and dragons can be killed by shooting pink sparkles at them.

Zombies are downright scientific by comparison.

Of course, I think the Horde races should be zombies, cyborgs, ninjas, and pirates.

The theory being that since a vast majority of the undead were once humans that undead only get human models. Ignoring of course that 90% of the population of high elves was wiped out by Arthas and doubtlessly turned undead. Why we don't get elven zombie models I dunno. There is an undead gnome in Undercity, Apothecarium, the unused side.

The theory being that since a vast majority of the undead were once humans that undead only get human models. Ignoring of course that 90% of the population of high elves was wiped out by Arthas and doubtlessly turned undead. Why we don't get elven zombie models I dunno. There is an undead gnome in Undercity, Apothecarium, the unused side.
I reflexively loathe any efforts to increase the amount of elf in WoW. But zombie gnomes would rock.

I reflexively loathe any efforts to increase the amount of elf in WoW. But zombie gnomes would rock.

Seems to me that WoW just went the wrong way with elves. I mean, I respect them trying to create a "unique" elven theme, but people have come to expect certain elf archetypes. Changing that is like altering the formula for a Big Mac for the sake of variety.

EQ2 has Dark Elves for evil, which is basically like drow in D&D. On the good side, you have High Elves and Wood Elves, and both factions have Half Elves.

Pulls it off rather well, I think.

Oh I forgot to mention... new playable race coming out in the next expansion: fey!

Dude, we're talking about a world where cow-people ride around on dinosaurs and dragons can be killed by shooting pink sparkles at them.

Zombies are downright scientific by comparison.

Of course, I think the Horde races should be zombies, cyborgs, ninjas, and pirates.

Psh, Ninjas and Pirates have to be on opposite sides.

In fact, Ninjas should have their own side and kill everyone else.

Psh, Ninjas and Pirates have to be on opposite sides.

In fact, Ninjas should have their own side and kill everyone else.
The other day my boyfriend and I were discussing the tensions between ninja and pirate factions these days, and we discovered (to my horror) that he is a strong ninja supporter whilst I back the pirate cause.

We should have left well enough alone at that point, and simply agreed never to speak of it again, but we had to keep talking about it. We further learned that he is, at heart, a cyborg ninja, while I am most certainly a zombie pirate.

And from forth the fatal loins of these two foes, a pair of star-crossed lovers take their life...

Guess they figure once you slap a helmet on you're pretty interchangable with everyone else. Just wish Undead and Trolls would stand up straight. I'm more than 4 feet tall! Oh and I want my spine to stop showing through my armor and clothes. I question the value of armor that's all torn up and has my damn spine exposed.

I love the fact that, with armor on a female, the more skin you have exposed, the better the armor is.

And no, you can't defect to the other side. You can't even speak the same language as those on the opposite team. Zug zug.

I know a Tauren Hunter who regularly speaks Dwarven, actually. =)

It's a weapon proc.

Maybe my Paly in WoW isn't high enough level yet, but to tanks in WoW get a taunt? When I was tanking, it was hard to keep agro off the healer (my fiancee).

If it's just you and a healer, as a pally, it's probably a good idea to throw a few heals on yourself sometimes as well. That way the healer isn't getting *all* the aggro.

One annoying thing we found is no implied targeting. In EQ2, let's say you're the healer and you have the tank targeted. When you cast heals, the tank gets healed. BUT... You also, in turn, have whatever the tank has targeted as your impled target, so that without switching targets, you can use your smite to do some direct damage to the mob. It also means your auto attack keeps hitting the mob when you're not casting.

Wow didn't seem to have that, so when the healer wanted to do some direct damage, she had to switch targets, then switch back to me to heal.

It is perfectly possible to keep auto attacking a mob and still cast heals. You don't automatically target what the tank is targetting, but that's actually a good thing, especially in a situation where lots of mobs are being fought. The tank is going to be constantly switching between targets, trying to hold aggro on all or most of them. The rest of the party, however, should be focusing damage on one of them at a time. If your target was constantly switching with the tanks target, that would be impossible.

If you want to be hitting a mob and still healing your party, it's easy. Simply start auto-attack. Then cast a heal (without changing targets). You'll basically hold the spell until you choose who to cast it on, while still auto-attacking. Click on the person's name in the party or raid display, rather than clicking directly on their toon. You heal them, while still beating on whatever mob you're beating on. ((This also comes in handy when you're doing some sort of crowd control. I can sleep a mob, never switch targets so that I can watch to be able to resleep it, but still be healing))

As for ways to get a target, it really isn't hard. If you want to target whatever the tank/off-tank is targetting, you simply assist them (click on them and then hit f). If you want to target the nearest mob in the combat, just hit auto-attack, it will start attacking (but be careful using this if your party/raid is using crowd control. We don't like it when you hit something that is sheeped/sleeped/seduced/etc.).

=)

I'm such a geek.

Of course, I think the Horde races should be zombies, cyborgs, ninjas, and pirates.

The Alliance could have robots, vampires, aliens and clowns.

The other day my boyfriend and I were discussing the tensions between ninja and pirate factions these days, and we discovered (to my horror) that he is a strong ninja supporter whilst I back the pirate cause.

We should have left well enough alone at that point, and simply agreed never to speak of it again, but we had to keep talking about it. We further learned that he is, at heart, a cyborg ninja, while I am most certainly a zombie pirate.

And from forth the fatal loins of these two foes, a pair of star-crossed lovers take their life...

Just for you:

http://www.burningsea.com/

The artwork was meh... I know they're not trying to generate uber-graphics so we weren't expecting it. What disappointed me was that as I looked down at my Pally from a bird's eye view, the grass/flowers looked like the carpet in a daycare center.

I think this is probably a matter of taste. One of the things graphics designers have realized is that when a game really tries to make characters look realistic - people are disappointed. No matter how hard they try, the flaws come out. The WoW designers decided to deal with that by intentionally making the game cartoony and more fun. It isn't meant to look real, just fun.

What really turned us off was the player base. I had heard for a long time that WoW tended to attract younger players while EQ2 attracted older gamers.

I don't know. I think it just depends what server you get on and what groups you fall in with. My guild is made up almost completely of people in their 20's and 30's. There are several married/engaged couples in it, and quite a few people with children of their own.

At the moment graphics cards can't do photo-realism yet (atleast at a decent frame rate), and attempts to do so end up looking disturbing. Symmetry is nice, perfect symmetry is creepy. Just doesn't look right.

I think some of the background scenery is nice.

http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h224/Snoo_Snoo/sunrise.jpg

Although it is clear who the target audience is ...

http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h224/Snoo_Snoo/daisy.jpg

It was ok for a while but after the 5th character I got to lvl 60 the max lvl it got old fast and that only took about 3 months.

To me the game didnt even start till after lvl 60 so having 5 60s isnt 5x more fun or anything. My goal was to take one toon and do every single thing that the game had and up to the point i quit 4 months ago we had completed all of the content that exoisted in the game. My guild was one of the first 10 guilds on all the worlds servers to kill cthun and i had every piece of gear hyou could imagine. I PvPed to rank 13 out of boredom cause we lacked so much content. But PvPing was pointless because the gear from PVP was WAY inferior to raid gear. I got bored after a year and a half and 130 days /played and sold my toon for a fortune. I hear there is alot more content now but meh.

I quite like WoW - it's not the greatest, most brilliant game ever made, but it's definitely fun, especially if you find good people to play with.


Horde is considerably more mature, wether they're older or not I dunno, but they're more mature. All the kiddies and pervs are attracted to the alliance. I blame night elves and I lament the choice of blood elves as Horde. I say we round 'em all up and beat 'em to death with stripper poles.

Horde is more mature? Seriously? My experience has always been that the absolute worst, stupidest, most "U R GAY"-filled chat takes place in the Barrens, and I've had more trouble finding non-idiots in Horde areas than Alliance by far. Maybe it varies realm to realm.


Oh, and I almost forgot one of the best things about WoW: the level of sexism in the game is pretty low. They still have most of the female toons do stupid sexy dance emotes while male characters get much better dances, but aside from that it's pretty tame.


I dunno - there are the clothing items that display drastically differently on male and female characters. My poor female pally was wandering around in what looked like a metal thong for the longest time, and I haven't encountered chest armor that will cover her midriff yet. (Personally, I'd be happy if they'd just make those items look similarly stupid on the males. Who wouldn't be amused by a burly dwarf guy in a thong?)


Also, out of curiosity, does anyone here play on Skywall or Shadow Moon?

Although it is clear who the target audience is ...

http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h224/Snoo_Snoo/daisy.jpg

...People who are attracted to what looks like a piece of cardboard, cut-out with a hacksaw, and then painted to resemble what a woman looks like when seen through beer goggles?

The other day my boyfriend and I were discussing the tensions between ninja and pirate factions these days, and we discovered (to my horror) that he is a strong ninja supporter whilst I back the pirate cause.

We should have left well enough alone at that point, and simply agreed never to speak of it again, but we had to keep talking about it. We further learned that he is, at heart, a cyborg ninja, while I am most certainly a zombie pirate.

And from forth the fatal loins of these two foes, a pair of star-crossed lovers take their life...

Pirates never stood a chance against ninjas, ever.http://drmcninja.com/page.php?issue=2 Read the entire thing!

Truthfully, though, speaking in context of historical ninjas, they wouldn't give the pirates a chance to kill them - they'd throw bombs in their sleeping cabins at night. End of battle.

In a straight one-on-one fight, a historical ninja MIGHT lose, but then again, a historical ninja almost NEVER fought fair, and never stuck around once things weren't in his favor. He'd run away and come back later when the pirate wasn't expecting it.

I quite like WoW - it's not the greatest, most brilliant game ever made, but it's definitely fun, especially if you find good people to play with.



Horde is more mature? Seriously? My experience has always been that the absolute worst, stupidest, most "U R GAY"-filled chat takes place in the Barrens, and I've had more trouble finding non-idiots in Horde areas than Alliance by far. Maybe it varies realm to realm.




I dunno - there are the clothing items that display drastically differently on male and female characters. My poor female pally was wandering around in what looked like a metal thong for the longest time, and I haven't encountered chest armor that will cover her midriff yet. (Personally, I'd be happy if they'd just make those items look similarly stupid on the males. Who wouldn't be amused by a burly dwarf guy in a thong?)


Also, out of curiosity, does anyone here play on Skywall or Shadow Moon?

Turn off barrens chat, infact turn off all chat channels. I think I did that as soon as I found out what the command was.

As for male toons in absurd costumes, my undead mage is wearing a pink fucking dress. I kid you not.

http://wow.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?witem=13314

Granted it's a very nice pink dress, but when you add in my pink hat and purple and gold shoulder pads I look like a flaming undead drag queen.

Turn off barrens chat, infact turn off all chat channels. I think I did that as soon as I found out what the command was.

As for male toons in absurd costumes, my undead mage is wearing a pink fucking dress. I kid you not.

http://wow.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?witem=13314

Granted it's a very nice pink dress, but when you add in my pink hat and purple and gold shoulder pads I look like a flaming undead drag queen.

I also turned off chat channels as soon as I found out what the command was - it just took me a few months. :p

And that is a fabulous dress. Positively fahbulous. (That said, I still think flaming undead drag queens are slightly less ridiculous looking than kinky stripper holy warriors. Oh, my platemail thong, how I do not miss thee...)

...People who are attracted to what looks like a piece of cardboard, cut-out with a hacksaw, and then painted to resemble what a woman looks like when seen through beer goggles?

Bingo.

I had been playing EQ2 since its launch day.

Its a great game, and I do intend to start it back up, once the new expansion comes out for it in Nov.

Until then, Im enjoying W.o.W.

Blizzard did some things that Sony didnt do.
It seems as though Blizzard understands some very crucial things that Sony never realized.

Falling damage sucks.
In EQ2, even short falls tend to be lethal.
In Wow, its no big deal....rarely fatal, unless you fall off a very tall height.

Quest sharing.
If two people are in one group, and only one has a certain quest, one person can automatically give that person the same quest, without having to run back to town and find the NPC.

Crafting is far, far easier.

Sony believes crafting is an entirely different aspect of the game, and should be just as hard as adventuring.

Blizzard does not.

Im with Blizzard.

EQ has better graphics where individual characters are concerned, although too often everyone is wearing the same thing.
A lvl 70 Kerra wizard, will likely be dressed just the same as every other lvl 70 Kerra wizard.

WoW has better landscapes.
The areas feel more vibrant and alive.

The reason that Blizzard is so successful where other companies have failed is quite simple: The artwork. The graphics quality on WoW are less than some other MMOs, but the quality of the art is much higher and it keeps people hooked. Even though there are aspects of that game which are lacking most people have a hard time switching games because everything else looks ugly in comparison.

The reason that Blizzard is so successful where other companies have failed is quite simple: The artwork. The graphics quality on WoW are less than some other MMOs, but the quality of the art is much higher and it keeps people hooked. Even though there are aspects of that game which are lacking most people have a hard time switching games because everything else looks ugly in comparison.

...what artwork?

The Alliance could have robots, vampires, aliens and clowns.
Zomg.

Somebody make this game. RIGHT. NOW.

...what artwork?

1) Undercity
2) Ashenvale
3) Maraudon
4) Thunderbluff
5) Stormwind
6) Bootybay (particularly at sunrise/sunset)

Honestly the game is gorgeous in many places, just not in a horrifyingly high poly count way, it's got style.

I dunno - there are the clothing items that display drastically differently on male and female characters. My poor female pally was wandering around in what looked like a metal thong for the longest time, and I haven't encountered chest armor that will cover her midriff yet. (Personally, I'd be happy if they'd just make those items look similarly stupid on the males. Who wouldn't be amused by a burly dwarf guy in a thong?)

My boyfriend's gnome warriar constantly was showing his belly button, until he bought some shirts to cover his shame.

But yes, it's still far from perfect. I guess my standards have dropped since most games are still targetted at the lowest common male denominator.


Also, out of curiosity, does anyone here play on Skywall or Shadow Moon?
Feel free to drop a word to Moquequeloa on Skywall if you like. And if you see Swath or Gigantimus running around, that's my boyfriend and you should throw things at him.

If it's just you and a healer, as a pally, it's probably a good idea to throw a few heals on yourself sometimes as well. That way the healer isn't getting *all* the aggro.



It is perfectly possible to keep auto attacking a mob and still cast heals. You don't automatically target what the tank is targetting, but that's actually a good thing, especially in a situation where lots of mobs are being fought. The tank is going to be constantly switching between targets, trying to hold aggro on all or most of them. The rest of the party, however, should be focusing damage on one of them at a time. If your target was constantly switching with the tanks target, that would be impossible.

If you want to be hitting a mob and still healing your party, it's easy. Simply start auto-attack. Then cast a heal (without changing targets). You'll basically hold the spell until you choose who to cast it on, while still auto-attacking. Click on the person's name in the party or raid display, rather than clicking directly on their toon. You heal them, while still beating on whatever mob you're beating on. ((This also comes in handy when you're doing some sort of crowd control. I can sleep a mob, never switch targets so that I can watch to be able to resleep it, but still be healing))

As for ways to get a target, it really isn't hard. If you want to target whatever the tank/off-tank is targetting, you simply assist them (click on them and then hit f). If you want to target the nearest mob in the combat, just hit auto-attack, it will start attacking (but be careful using this if your party/raid is using crowd control. We don't like it when you hit something that is sheeped/sleeped/seduced/etc.).

=)

I'm such a geek.
*swoon*

She argues with me, she digs the science, and she plays videogames...

Demi, I regret to inform you that we are no longer able to issue you coolness points, as you have overloaded the Magical Coolness Point Generator with your overwhelming awesomeness.

My boyfriend's gnome warriar constantly was showing his belly button, until he bought some shirts to cover his shame.

But yes, it's still far from perfect. I guess my standards have dropped since most games are still targetted at the lowest common male denominator.

Heh. Poor gnome. I'm used to the lowest-common-denominator phenomenon as well, and really don't mind it too awfully much except when I'm stuck wearing a platemail thong from level 40 to level 47 before I can find a new pair of pants. I couldn't fathom why enemies wouldn't just chop my legs off, as it looked quite easy for them to do so. (Of course, it generally looks very easy for them to stab me in the heart, too, but I'm so used to cleavage-baring armor by now that I barely even notice it anymore.)

Feel free to drop a word to Moquequeloa on Skywall if you like. And if you see Swath or Gigantimus running around, that's my boyfriend and you should throw things at him.

Sure, I'll add those chars to my friends lists over there and poke and/or throw things if I happen to see you. And do feel free to poke Eleressea, Aelis, Miri, or Satrina if you see them. (Alliance, Alliance, Horde, and Horde respectively - all relatively low level, sadly, as my high-power characters are on Shadow Moon.) :)

*swoon*

She argues with me, she digs the science, and she plays videogames...

Demi, I regret to inform you that we are no longer able to issue you coolness points, as you have overloaded the Magical Coolness Point Generator with your overwhelming awesomeness.

Teehee. =)

Doesn't the Coolness Point Generator just cycle back over to 0? If so, I'm going to have to work hard to get all those points back.... =)

WoW bored me after 6 days. By comparison, I played EQ for 15 months. I played EQ2 for a year. I was in the Anarchy Online beta for about 8 weeks. I was in the SWG beta for nearly 12 weeks.
Eve Online is good, but gah is it complicated.
EVE is easily my favourite of all the MMOGs I have played (and I've played a lot of them). I even completely rewrote the wikipedia article to deal with NPOV complaints.

It does have a pretty sick learning curve, but it has a wonderful balance of solo vs. group play, and PvP vs. PvE content. Plus I love the economic system.

And, frankly, I like the learning curve. Everything in WoW is just so easy.

I've looked at it, and it looks pretty average. The gameplay seems pretty basic, the PvP is poor and the graphics make Doom 3 and Prey look like videos of real life. Hardly seems worth paying $20 a month for.

If I'll pay for an MMO, it'll be WAR. That's a massive if.

Ahem:
15$ a month...

If you dont pay for it, how do you know about that pvp?

Doom3 and Prey are FPS, i don't think you can support several thousand people at once, unless the servers and clients are running on super computers?

I agree on your gameplay dispute, it is basic. The genuine fun in the game is leveling from 1 to 60. at 60 you run 40man instances and often you run them everyday from 7pm-12pm.


To Llewdor: Eve is good, i played it for a long time. But there is no end to it, no matter how long and how many hours a day you play there will be people who have been there sense day 1 that will always dominate. To be honest you can never get ahead.

To Llewdor: Eve is good, i played it for a long time. But there is no end to it, no matter how long and how many hours a day you play there will be people who have been there sense day 1 that will always dominate. To be honest you can never get ahead.
If you're trying to compete with them directly on their terms, sure.

But why do that? You'll never have as many skills trained as someone who started earlier, but you don't really need to. There are so many more skills than one player can learn; the game rewards specialisation.

Only read the first page of replies...

If you're looking for something different, try http://www.vendetta-online.com . I was an alpha and beta tester for it, but sadly, I don't pay to play[anything], so I've had to leave it. It's really cool, it takes place in space. If you like backstories, there's pages of it, if not, it's not required reading to play. it's got some pretty awesome graphics (I guess not THE WOMFGAWSOMEST but pretty awesome), though I've always been more of a gameplay dude myself.

If you're trying to compete with them directly on their terms, sure.

But why do that? You'll never have as many skills trained as someone who started earlier, but you don't really need to. There are so many more skills than one player can learn; the game rewards specialisation.

yeah i know what you mean how it isn't needed for success in the game. but you kind of have to start out putting points into mining skills to support yourself and then you eventualy want to own a battleship so you can say you have one. I just kept getting that sinking feeling that you can never be the best, and after all isnt that what we all strive for in a video game?

I had been playing EQ2 since its launch day.

Its a great game, and I do intend to start it back up, once the new expansion comes out for it in Nov.

Until then, Im enjoying W.o.W.

Blizzard did some things that Sony didnt do....

Crafting is far, far easier.

Sony believes crafting is an entirely different aspect of the game, and should be just as hard as adventuring.

Blizzard does not.


You may not know it, since it's a new development, but EQ2 has gotten rid of subcombines. W00t! Now you only need all of your raws to go straight to a completed item in one step.

..and there was much rejoicing...

WoW is constantly updating (including an upcoming expansion with 2 new races and new professions plus a raise in the level cap to 70 and flying mounts) and improving. Fist weps are annoying in their lack, but that will change.

Flying mounts shlying mounts. There's pointless to me without mount combat. It's like having a gun with no ammo.

Ahem:
15$ a month...

USD15. AUD20.

If you dont pay for it, how do you know about that pvp?

I hear things. Things about lame PvP.

Doom3 and Prey are FPS, i don't think you can support several thousand people at once, unless the servers and clients are running on super computers?

Nevertheless, the graphics of some games which came out only a few months later run circles around WoW.

http://i65.photobucket.com/albums/h224/Snoo_Snoo/daisy.jpg

*cries* It looks like Runescape!

http://www.warhammeronline.com/english/media/screenshots/full/SS_0706_02.jpg
http://www.warhammeronline.com/english/media/screenshots/full/SS_0706_04.jpg
http://www.warhammeronline.com/english/media/screenshots/full/SS_0706_05.jpg
http://www.warhammeronline.com/english/media/screenshots/full/SS_May_2006_16.jpg

Now that's an MMO!

Also, one of the things I dislike about WoW is the lame races. Gnomes? Trolls? Blood Elves? Run out of ideas much?

And don't say anything about WAR having similar races; we were pioneers in the fantasy business.

WoW is massively overrated. The entire genre of MMORPG is, it is currently underdeveloped. Don't worry, it'll get better once they an figure out how to include a dynamic, conplex and continuous plot. It shouldn't be too hard, though it might be expensive. Personally when I do feel MMO inclined I like to play an adorable french MMORPG called 'Dofus'. It is 2d, runs entirely on flash and ultra-sexy in its ridiculuous french self-mockery and sexy design.

We further learned that he is, at heart, a cyborg ninja, while I am most certainly a zombie pirate.

Imagine what the kids will look like! :p

WoW is massively overrated. The entire genre of MMORPG is, it is currently underdeveloped. Don't worry, it'll get better once they an figure out how to include a dynamic, conplex and continuous plot.

That's what I've been saying all along.

That's what I've been saying all along. I know, man, won't it be awesome when they do. I mean right now, MMO is kind of boring beyond it's social value. But if they could have some kind of algorithm to create a unique and personalised story relevant to your actions it would be a gaming epoch. Right now we are used to the concept of 'lives' or success=progression. If you fail a level/mission, you lose a life (Or something to that effect) and try again. Imagine a game where a failure of a particular mission just creates a different outcome. What if failure and success are left up to you to evaluate. Players could concieve their own motivations and goals and work towards those. It'd be fantastic. Completely different, though. Any one game would have virtually unlimited lifetime. I think this would create game series, with seasons. Instead of constantly re-releasing new games, producers would release new seasons of the same game, for people to experience. Imagine an endlessly updating FFVII. Always growing, ever developing. Occasionally, they would release an entire engine upgrade every year or two. *sigh* until then, I will play my SNES in defiance.

It's a competition now; when there's only one person in the group without WoW, he becomes "The One."

I WILL BE THE ONE!

You may not know it, since it's a new development, but EQ2 has gotten rid of subcombines. W00t! Now you only need all of your raws to go straight to a completed item in one step.

..and there was much rejoicing...
That's a terrible idea. Subcombines were a major source of crafting XP, and it eliminates interdependency.

I guess I'm not going back to EQ2. My slate of twelve characters with complementary crafting skills will now be worthless.

Yay for EVE-Online!

There was a massive Anti-American rant on one of the Corp boards the other day.

It brought a tear to my eye... Nationstates in spaaaaacce.....

Yay for EVE-Online!

There was a massive Anti-American rant on one of the Corp boards the other day.

It brought a tear to my eye... Nationstates in spaaaaacce.....
I once spent weeks cataloguing the inventories of all the bases in high-sec space, and then I built an Access database which would tell me what the most lucrative high-sec trade runs starting in each region were given the size of the ship I happened to be flying.

It was really cool.

This is why I think that the Warhammer universe in general is better than WoW.

An Ork
http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/579/relic00006lc4.th.jpg (http://img84.imageshack.us/my.php?image=relic00006lc4.jpg)

Not an Ork
http://img84.imageshack.us/img84/9590/inwow3795jn4.th.jpg (http://img84.imageshack.us/my.php?image=inwow3795jn4.jpg)

I have high hopes for WAR.