NationStates Jolt Archive

I wanted to do a poll of all the NSers out there, and see whom among you would class them-self as "stereotypically gay"(not that there is anything bad or wrong with that). For the men, it would be the guy who goes around with a lisp, or talks feminine, is interested in interior designing(which i like and I am not gay:P), and says things like FABULOUS! With the women, it is a lesbian, who has the short crew cut hair, possibly a mullet, talks with a deeper voice, and doesn't shave legs, pits, or sometimes even their backs.

You see i have this theory that most homosexual people are not like that at all, and its the media that puts these images of men acting like girls, and vice versa in our head, as if to make them look bad or something. To me, there is nothing wrong if a guy talks with a lisp, or is the more feminine type of gay. Like wise with the stereotypical lesbian. However, to some straight people, this, again, would seem dishonorable and such. Maybe even in the gay community it is looked down upon.I don't know. I want to hear the voices of the NS gay and lesbian community about what they think of the stereotypical gay portrayed so often in the media.

And I think there will be a poll too.

I don't mind women with a mullet, though I must say guys that swish and lisp get on my nerves rather quickly.

I defy all labels! :)

I'm straight, but I can't keep away from polls.

I'm a straight man and a stereotypical lesbian. Apart from the crew cut/mullet.

I defy all labels! :)

Thats a given ;)

Straight man who wanted to vote in the poll!

I am a bisexual man (at times in a gay relationship) and I live and work on a farm. Am into hunting fishing and Offroading. I drive a ¾ Ton Diesel pickup truck and yet go to collage and am an employed computer geek

:)

I think I defy most stereotypes

I don't mind women with a mullet, though I must say guys that swish and lisp get on my nerves rather quickly.

And you are gay right?(or i atleast i thought i remembered you were) So that kind of would prove my point about this image of a gay man, say like that of the Fab 5 or what not, is not really too prevalent among the gay community, or at least maybe is looked down upon.

I am a bisexual man (at times in a gay relationship) and I live and work on a farm. Am into hunting fishing and Offroading. I drive a ¾ Ton Diesel pickup truck and yet go to collage and am an employed computer geek

:)

I think I defy most stereotypes

:)

I would have put an option on there about bisexual men and women, but i don't think there are any stereotypes for them that are prevalent in the media.

And you are gay right?(or i atleast i thought i remembered you were) So that kind of would prove my point about this image of a gay man, say like that of the Fab 5 or what not, is not really too prevalent among the gay community, or at least maybe is looked down upon.

By some … it does not particularly bother me in of itself … at least not on its existence. Sometimes it is annoying to work with when you have to get someone like that to do something … but no more so then “Girly girls” or valley girls

:)

I would have put an option on there about bisexual men and women, but i don't think there are any stereotypes for them that are prevalent in the media.

Yeah I just voted as gay because for a long time I thought I was ... and it seemed to have fit better

I wanted to do a poll of all the NSers out there, and see whom among you would class them-self as "stereotypically gay"(not that there is anything bad or wrong with that). For the men, it would be the guy who goes around with a lisp, or talks feminine, is interested in interior designing(which i like and I am not gay:P), and says things like FABULOUS! With the women, it is a lesbian, who has the short crew cut hair, possibly a mullet, talks with a deeper voice, and doesn't shave legs, pits, or sometimes even their backs.

You see i have this theory that most homosexual people are not like that at all, and its the media that puts these images of men acting like girls, and vice versa in our head, as if to make them look bad or something. To me, there is nothing wrong if a guy talks with a lisp, or is the more feminine type of gay. Like wise with the stereotypical lesbian. However, to some straight people, this, again, would seem dishonorable and such. Maybe even in the gay community it is looked down upon.I don't know. I want to hear the voices of the NS gay and lesbian community about what they think of the stereotypical gay portrayed so often in the media.

And I think there will be a poll too.

The key is that it is supposed to be bad for a man to "act like a woman," or for a woman to "act like a man." Because, supposedly, men and women are totally different by nature, and it is "unnatural" for women to want to wear pants and build things just as it is "unnatural" for men to want to wear dresses and cuddle kittens.

The worst possible thing for a Real Man(tm) is to be called FEMININE (because girls have cooties!), and being gay is bad because it means you are feminine. The worst possible thing for a Real Woman(tm) is to be called MASCULILNE (because then you'll never get a husband!), and being lesbian is bad because...well, because you won't get a husband, which is supposed to be pretty much a fate worse than death.

It's kind of funny, when you think about it. Supposedly, men and women are innately different, yet we have to go to all this trouble to force people to conform to their gender roles. We have to punish and demonize people who, quite naturally, just like what they like regardless of their gender. We have to beat it into them that no, BOYS DO NOT LIKE PLAYING WITH DOLLS!!

If men and women are biologically wired to be so different, then why do we have to spend so much energy forcing them to behave according to these stereotypes?

By some … it does not particularly bother me in of itself … at least not on its existence. Sometimes it is annoying to work with when you have to get someone like that to do something … but no more so then “Girly girls” or valley girls

Yes girly girls are *very* annoying. -reminisces to High school-

The key is that it is supposed to be bad for a man to "act like a woman," or for a woman to "act like a man." Because, supposedly, men and women are totally different by nature, and it is "unnatural" for women to want to wear pants and build things just as it is "unnatural" for men to want to wear dresses and cuddle kittens.

The worst possible thing for a Real Man(tm) is to be called FEMININE (because girls have cooties!), and being gay is bad because it means you are feminine. The worst possible thing for a Real Woman(tm) is to be called MASCULILNE (because then you'll never get a husband!), and being lesbian is bad because...well, because you won't get a husband, which is supposed to be pretty much a fate worse than death.

It's kind of funny, when you think about it. Supposedly, men and women are innately different, yet we have to go to all this trouble to force people to conform to their gender roles. We have to punish and demonize people who, quite naturally, just like what they like regardless of their gender. We have to beat it into them that no, BOYS DO NOT LIKE PLAYING WITH DOLLS!!

If men and women are biologically wired to be so different, then why do we have to spend so much energy forcing them to behave according to these stereotypes?

Interesting … wonder what that says about me that I prefer to not work with “girly girls” (you know the type “oh I cant do THAT … Im just an idiot” sort of attitude)

I am not saying not feminine but there is some that got that “Blond” helpless attitude that is so annoying.

I tend to catch that out of some of the stereotypical gay guy too (very flaming) and it annoys me as much there as it does in the girls

I am not saying their feminine quality’s are not hot as hell (for girls) just there are levels of attitudes that get annoying when they don’t do anything for themselves besides bitch.

(I keep trying to explain better and it keeps coming out more and more wrong … oh well)

The key is that it is supposed to be bad for a man to "act like a woman," or for a woman to "act like a man." Because, supposedly, men and women are totally different by nature, and it is "unnatural" for women to want to wear pants and build things just as it is "unnatural" for men to want to wear dresses and cuddle kittens.

It's kind of funny, when you think about it. Supposedly, men and women are innately different, yet we have to go to all this trouble to force people to conform to their gender roles. We have to punish and demonize people who, quite naturally, just like what they like regardless of their gender. We have to beat it into them that no, BOYS DO NOT LIKE PLAYING WITH DOLLS!!

If men and women are biologically wired to be so different, then why do we have to spend so much energy forcing them to behave according to these stereotypes?


That is a very good point. And you know really with gender roles and what not, it only really applies to western societies, as they share the common patriarchial society, where men are honored more or less. However, as has been seen in various other tribes, or civilizations, sometimes it is perfectly okay for the men and women to switch roles, like the...Berdache( i think).

However, as I was alluding to, the media makes it seem bad to be a feminine gay or a masculine lesbian. They put shows on with radically gay people and make it seem like its a bad thing to be this way. Like i said, personally I don't care either way. I really just want to see what the gay community thinks about it, and what their demographics are in this scenario.

Interesting … wonder what that says about me that I prefer to not work with “girly girls” (you know the type “oh I cant do THAT … Im just an idiot” sort of attitude)

I am not saying not feminine but there is some that got that “Blond” helpless attitude that is so annoying.

I tend to catch that out of some of the stereotypical gay guy too (very flaming) and it annoys me as much there as it does in the girls

I am not saying their feminine quality’s are not hot as hell (for girls) just there are levels of attitudes that get annoying when they don’t do anything for themselves besides bitch.

(I keep trying to explain better and it keeps coming out more and more wrong … oh well)


Honestly I understand what you are trying to say. I felt for a little while there I was doing the same thing, having it come out wrong that is.

I'm a bisexual male who grew up on a farm in the midwest. I cannot dance particularly well (not that this stops me), have never attended a Pride event, and I cannot think of too many gay things in which I have any interest. A gay guy I know once said that he likes boys but hates fags, a statement with which I would have to agree.

:)

I would have put an option on there about bisexual men and women, but i don't think there are any stereotypes for them that are prevalent in the media.

Perhaps that we're just f-cking greedy. That said, UpwardThrust, Bottle, how you doin'? ;)

And you are gay right?(or i atleast i thought i remembered you were) So that kind of would prove my point about this image of a gay man, say like that of the Fab 5 or what not, is not really too prevalent among the gay community, or at least maybe is looked down upon.

Gay as springtime, or so the saying goes. Drive a pickup truck, own a dog, don't lisp or swish. It doesn't really bother me that much those who do, I just think they're annoying. Which isn't a huge condemnation, I think most people are annoying.

I am a straight man, but sometimes acting stereotypically gay can be fun.

I am neither gay or straight, nor am I asexual.

I wanted to do a poll of all the NSers out there, and see whom among you would class them-self as "stereotypically gay"(not that there is anything bad or wrong with that). For the men, it would be the guy who goes around with a lisp, or talks feminine, is interested in interior designing(which i like and I am not gay:P), and says things like FABULOUS! With the women, it is a lesbian, who has the short crew cut hair, possibly a mullet, talks with a deeper voice, and doesn't shave legs, pits, or sometimes even their backs.

You see i have this theory that most homosexual people are not like that at all, and its the media that puts these images of men acting like girls, and vice versa in our head, as if to make them look bad or something. To me, there is nothing wrong if a guy talks with a lisp, or is the more feminine type of gay. Like wise with the stereotypical lesbian. However, to some straight people, this, again, would seem dishonorable and such. Maybe even in the gay community it is looked down upon.I don't know. I want to hear the voices of the NS gay and lesbian community about what they think of the stereotypical gay portrayed so often in the media.

And I think there will be a poll too.
Haha I'm a lesbian, and I think I am not your stereotype... I shave, I don't act manly, I have long hair ;).

These stereotypes are pretty bad, but you are right, these stereotypes are on the TV, and people think every gay person is like that.

I doubt we ever abolish these stereotypes, we just have to get used to it :)

I am bisexual, and neither a girly girl, nor butch. I am just a person.

It doesn't bother me at all whatever people act like, as long as they are happy with who they are. If a guy wants to swish and lisp, that is fine, if a girl wants to be butch, that is fine too. I am only annoyed when someone assumes that sex/sexuality is a limiting factor, such as women who think they can't do something just because "I am a girl", or men who think they are better simply because they are male.

I wanted to do a poll of all the NSers out there, and see whom among you would class them-self as "stereotypically gay"(not that there is anything bad or wrong with that). For the men, it would be the guy who goes around with a lisp, or talks feminine, is interested in interior designing(which i like and I am not gay:P), and says things like FABULOUS! With the women, it is a lesbian, who has the short crew cut hair, possibly a mullet, talks with a deeper voice, and doesn't shave legs, pits, or sometimes even their backs.

You see i have this theory that most homosexual people are not like that at all, and its the media that puts these images of men acting like girls, and vice versa in our head, as if to make them look bad or something. To me, there is nothing wrong if a guy talks with a lisp, or is the more feminine type of gay. Like wise with the stereotypical lesbian. However, to some straight people, this, again, would seem dishonorable and such. Maybe even in the gay community it is looked down upon.I don't know. I want to hear the voices of the NS gay and lesbian community about what they think of the stereotypical gay portrayed so often in the media.

And I think there will be a poll too.


Looks like somebody read Dan Savage today...

Nah, not stereotypical.

Okay, massive post, and much of it hijack, for which I appologize (but I'm going to do it anyway :D)...

Interesting … wonder what that says about me that I prefer to not work with “girly girls” (you know the type “oh I cant do THAT … Im just an idiot” sort of attitude)

I am not saying not feminine but there is some that got that “Blond” helpless attitude that is so annoying.

You answered your own question.

Your feelings have absolutely zip to do with actual "masculinity" or "femininity," and everything to do with ditziness. You don't like working with airheads. I'm guessing you wouldn't like hanging around with airheads who were all about "masculine" activities (like trucks or something) any more than you like hanging around with "girly" airheads.

I'm also guessing that you would enjoy working with non-airheads who happen to enjoy "girly" things. If there are smart, interesting, capable people around who just happen to like building dollhouse furniture on the weekends, I'm guessing you wouldn't have much of a problem with it.

The trouble is that "girlishness" and "girly" activities are virtually always associated with stupidity and/or passiveness in one way or another. Look at dolls as an example:

Boys play with dolls as often as girls do, we just call them "action figures" when boys play with them. Boys' dolls tend to have more points of articulation, meaning they can move more and engage in more activities. Boys' dolls tend to have far greater range of occupations and functions, from firefighters and army men to superheros and robots. In advertisements for boys' dolls we will see boys engage in a wide range of active play.

Girl's dolls tend to be very passive, with fewer articulation points, and tend to fall into one of two groups: baby, or Barbie. Girls' dolls exist to be dressed up or down...and that's about it. In commercials for girls' dolls, a very tiny range of activities are usually portrayed; caring for baby, dressing up/down dolly, or cuddling dolly.

Why am I harping on dolls? To make the point that it's not so much about an individual's particular interests. Both boys and girls play with dollies, yet I have always been bored out of my mind with "girly" doll-play. The fact that girls play with dolls is not the problem. It's that girls are taught to play only a very narrow range of one-dimensional and (frankly) boring games with their dollies, while boys are encouraged to have more stimulating adventures with their dollies.


I tend to catch that out of some of the stereotypical gay guy too (very flaming) and it annoys me as much there as it does in the girls

I am not saying their feminine quality’s are not hot as hell (for girls) just there are levels of attitudes that get annoying when they don’t do anything for themselves besides bitch.

(I keep trying to explain better and it keeps coming out more and more wrong … oh well)
Again, these aren't "feminine" qualities at all. What you are describing is called "stupid." It's just that females are trained to express "stupid" in particular ways, and some gay men also choose to express their "stupid" in these ways.

Do remember that women are strongly encouraged to be stupid, particularly if they do so in feminine-stupid ways. Women are constantly reminded to not look too smart or be too threatening, lest they be passed over by potential husbands. Well, it stands to reason that if a man is trying to attract other men then he may take cues from what hetero women do (particularly if the gay man comes from a traditional background).

Also, a lot of people believe there are two possible settings for humans: MASCULINE and FEMININE. A man who has sex with other men cannot be MASCULINE (according to the traditionalists), so he must be FEMININE by default. Some gay men fall into this trap.

Also, a lot of people believe there are two possible settings for humans: MASCULINE and FEMININE. A man who has sex with other men cannot be MASCULINE (according to the traditionalists), so he must be FEMININE by default. Some gay men fall into this trap.

I don't think it's a "trap". Some gay men I've met behave this way, and have done so since childhood. It's just the way they are.

That said, it has become a stereotype, and a particularly inaccurate method of identifying a man as gay.

I don't think it's a "trap". Some gay men I've met behave this way, and have done so since childhood. It's just the way they are.

I think it is a trap if it keeps a person from feeling able to do the things they secretly want to do.

I expect that there are people who naturally fall at one end of the masculine-feminine spectrum. However, I don't think most people do, and I do think that a great many people think that they need to FORCE themselves to do so. That's what bums me out.

I've talked with gay men who basically felt that they couldn't be a "man's man" and be gay, so they made themselves give up things they liked in order to fit the "right" image of a gay man. How rotten is that? I've also hung out with lesbian women who feel uncomfortable admitting to "girly" hobbies, because they think they will lose lesbo street cred or something.

I don't have a problem if people just are really "girly" or really "boyish." What gets to me is when girls or boys don't feel free to just like the shit that they like because they like it! It bugs me that we have to shove everything into these stupid gendered categories and then judge each other for how well we fit in to some arbitrary set of rules for Real Men and Real Women.

I think it is a trap if it keeps a person from feeling able to do the things they secretly want to do.

I expect that there are people who naturally fall at one end of the masculine-feminine spectrum. However, I don't think most people do, and I do think that a great many people think that they need to FORCE themselves to do so. That's what bums me out.

I've talked with gay men who basically felt that they couldn't be a "man's man" and be gay, so they made themselves give up things they liked in order to fit the "right" image of a gay man. How rotten is that? I've also hung out with lesbian women who feel uncomfortable admitting to "girly" hobbies, because they think they will lose lesbo street cred or something.

I don't have a problem if people just are really "girly" or really "boyish." What gets to me is when girls or boys don't feel free to just like the shit that they like because they like it! It bugs me that we have to shove everything into these stupid gendered categories and then judge each other for how well we fit in to some arbitrary set of rules for Real Men and Real Women.

Agreed. Especially about the "street cred" thing.

Agreed. Especially about the "street cred" thing.
When it comes to "girly" stuff in particular, there is an added worry. A lot of women feel that they will be taken less seriously if they admit to liking "girly" things.

I know this feeling very well. I mentioned the making of dollhouse furniture in an earlier post, and it's not just a random example. My mother has several dollhouses, and one of my favorite hobbies used to be making stuff for them. But I would have DIED before I let anybody know. Because I didn't want anybody to think I was the kind of girl who liked dollhouses.

Girly stuff is associated with airheadedness in a whole lot of contexts. I often had to fight to be taken seriously among even some of my groups of friends, and I wasn't about to risk myself by admitting that kind of "weakness."

I certainly could never admit it to most of the boys I hung around with, because they would take it as proof that I was "really a girl deep down," which of course would mean that I couldn't possibly also be a person who liked baseball and transformers. You must be one or the other, remember, and I didn't want to risk being forced into the "girl" camp.

Most homosexuals don't act like stereotypes in my experience.

Those who do are obviously gay and you know it immediately, but I have friends that I knew for a few months before I learned that they were gay/lesbian.

I certainly could never admit it to most of the boys I hung around with, because they would take it as proof that I was "really a girl deep down," which of course would mean that I couldn't possibly also be a person who liked baseball and transformers.
Transformers and action man are equally 'idiotic' to dolls houses. If not more so!

When it comes to "girly" stuff in particular, there is an added worry. A lot of women feel that they will be taken less seriously if they admit to liking "girly" things.

I know this feeling very well. I mentioned the making of dollhouse furniture in an earlier post, and it's not just a random example. My mother has several dollhouses, and one of my favorite hobbies used to be making stuff for them. But I would have DIED before I let anybody know. Because I didn't want anybody to think I was the kind of girl who liked dollhouses.

Girly stuff is associated with airheadedness in a whole lot of contexts. I often had to fight to be taken seriously among even some of my groups of friends, and I wasn't about to risk myself by admitting that kind of "weakness."

I certainly could never admit it to most of the boys I hung around with, because they would take it as proof that I was "really a girl deep down," which of course would mean that I couldn't possibly also be a person who liked baseball and transformers. You must be one or the other, remember, and I didn't want to risk being forced into the "girl" camp.


Oh it's worse as a guy, there's a huge range of things you cannot admit to. Heaven forbid you have any emotions aside from belly laughs or rage.

:)

I would have put an option on there about bisexual men and women, but i don't think there are any stereotypes for them that are prevalent in the media.

I'd've voted, but there wasn't an option for bisexual men or women.

Oh it's worse as a guy, there's a huge range of things you cannot admit to. Heaven forbid you have any emotions aside from belly laughs or rage.
Oh, yeah, I didn't mean to imply that this problem is unique to girls. I just talked about the girl end of things because I've never been a guy, so I can't speak to it personally.

I'd've voted, but there wasn't an option for bisexual men or women.

There never is.

Oh, yeah, I didn't mean to imply that this problem is unique to girls. I just talked about the girl end of things because I've never been a guy, so I can't speak to it personally.

One of the perks of being gay, you can do things most men would never admit to. Though old habits die hard.

Well I see who is leading this poll :D

*looks at poll* What, there are only 7 other bisexuals on this forum?

I'd've voted, but there wasn't an option for bisexual men or women.

Thats my bad. I should have put an option up there for ya'll, seein as i did do gay, lesbian and straight...I recommend just voting other.

Man, i always screw up polls.

You see i have this theory that most homosexual people are not like that at all, and its the media that puts these images of men acting like girls, and vice versa in our head, as if to make them look bad or something. To me, there is nothing wrong if a guy talks with a lisp, or is the more feminine type of gay. Like wise with the stereotypical lesbian. However, to some straight people, this, again, would seem dishonorable and such. I'm not certain why it is the stereotypes that get put out there, but it is true that most gays don't fit the stereotype.

Maybe even in the gay community it is looked down upon.I don't know. I want to hear the voices of the NS gay and lesbian community about what they think of the stereotypical gay portrayed so often in the media.Yes, there are homophobic gays, too.

With the women, it is a lesbian, who has the short crew cut hair, possibly a mullet, talks with a deeper voice, and doesn't shave legs, pits, or sometimes even their backs.

What's hilarious is I know a girl like that. She tries the hardest she possible can to be a butch lesbian then she has one of the highest pitched voices I have ever heard. The contrast is humorous to say the least.

I'd say I'm halfway stereotypical... I have a few feminine tendancies. ppl don't seem to notice though.

Transformers and action man are equally 'idiotic' to dolls houses. If not more so!
Meh. It's a matter of opinion.

I have never enjoyed actually playing with doll's houses, because domestic chores are boring enough when you have to do them in real life. How can it possibly be fun to PLAY at cooking and cleaning a house?! How can it be fun to play changing baby's diaper? I don't want to do those things in real life, so why would I fantasize about doing them when I play?

On the other hand, I would absolutely love to be a Transformer or a superhero. I'd love to have lazer cannons for arms, which I would use to thwart the nefarious plans of Dr. Cyborg and his army of half-robot half-zombie ninja assassins.

The thing is, I know many people who feel the opposite about their play. And I don't think either side is "idiotic." I just think it's stupid to try to MAKE yourself feel one way or the other. Like what you like, and don't worry about whether it's "manly" or "womanly" enough.

I'm a lesbian trapped in a perverted old man's body.