NationStates Jolt Archive

So, what do you think? Were these dudes up to something nefarious or are the young entrepreneurs?

Hey, when you try to buy 80 cell phones, have thousands more in your van, and $11,000 in cash something is going on.


http://cbs11tv.com/topstories/local_story_223225924.html

http://www.columbusdispatch.com/news-story.php?story=dispatch/2006/08/12/20060812-A1-01.html

http://www.todaysthv.com/news/news.aspx?storyid=32673

and once again the suspect are Middle Eastern young men. Just like in 9/11, Midrid, London Bombing, and the recently foiled US-UK plot. However, we still can't profile because that would be wroooonnnngggg. :rolleyes:

The pair of 20-year-olds arrested in Marietta — Osama Abulhassan and Ali Houssaiky, both of Dearborn, Mich

Guilty. Sorry, I'm a bigot.

Why do I get the feeling that this is all based on them of seemingly Arab descent...

Now of course they "could" use those to make bombs, just like every law abiding gun owner "could" go out and rob a bank with their firearm. The potential of making bombs out of them as the main reasoning why they must be terrorists is a pretty shaky case when all you've got is a van full of cellphones.

Why do I get the feeling that this is all based on them of seemingly Arab descent...

Now of course they "could" use those to make bombs, just like every law abiding gun owner "could" go out and rob a bank with their firearm. The potential of making bombs out of them as the main reasoning why they must be terrorists is a pretty shaky case when all you've got is a van full of cellphones.
Law abiding people don't use fake names to buy cell phones or guns.

They also were charged with falsification for giving false names while buying three phones from a RadioShack.

Law abiding people don't use fake names to buy cell phones or guns.

The US requires you to give your name when buying electrical goods? Land of the free indeed.

Law abiding people don't use fake names to buy cell phones or guns.I don't say they're law abiding citizens. I'm saying that the conclusion that they're terrorists is a bit hasty. They could be using those phones for some scam which would make them equally loath to give their real names.

I don't say they're law abiding citizens. I'm saying that the conclusion that they're terrorists is a bit hasty. They could be using those phones for some scam which would make them equally loath to give their real names.

Then why were they taking the batteries out and putting them in one pile, and the phone in another?

Law abiding people don't use fake names to buy cell phones or guns.
Meh. I've given false information to Radio Shack before. They want to know your name, address, phone number and whatnot just to buy a stupid alarm radio. Well, that's none of their business and they're not a government agency so I will lie to them if I want to.

"So Mr...Smith, what do you want 80 cell phones for?"
"Oh...ah...were going to...SELL them. Yes. Sell them."

Yeah, would you be a bit suspicious? :P

The US requires you to give your name when buying electrical goods? Land of the free indeed.
No, but when activating a prepaid cell phone you provide information like your name, address, home phone number, etc. to the telephone service provider. Radio Shack is an authorized Cingular agent. I use Cingular for my phone service. I had to answer all those questions too.

They also only brought the cell phones three at a time so they don't trip off a alarm that Wal-Mart has in place. Still think they're just "selling" them?

Meh. I've given false information to Radio Shack before. They want to know your name, address, phone number and whatnot just to buy a stupid alarm radio. Well, that's none of their business and they're not a government agency so I will lie to them if I want to.
All you need to tell them when purchasing a clock radio is that it's none of their business who you are and where you live.

No, but when activating a prepaid cell phone you provide information like your name, address, home phone number, etc. to the telephone service provider. Radio Shack is an authorized Cingular agent. I use Cingular for my phone service. I had to answer all those questions too.

Why? When activating a prepaid cell in the UK its up to you whether or not you provide that information.

Then why were they taking the batteries out and putting them in one pile, and the phone in another?I have no clue why anyone would want that many cell phones either, but the implication that they could be using them to make bombs doesn't automatically make them terrorists. It's quite possible that they are and that that was the intention, but from what I'm seeing, all they really have released so far is that they had a massive load of cellphones in their van.

The claim that they must be terrorists if they collect that many cell phones is ridiculous.

They also only brought the cell phones three at a time so they don't trip off a alarm that Wal-Mart has in place. Still think they're just "selling" them?
Is it fun making stuff up? First you say they were taking the batteries out, they were only taking the charger out of the packging. Then you say they were buying in threes, but it doesn't say that anywhere else, in fact it was becaus they bought 80 at the same time that the police was alerted.

I think that by making stuff up you're trying to put us off from investigating you, you are the terrorist.

Law abiding people don't use fake names to buy cell phones or guns.

They also were charged with falsification for giving false names while buying three phones from a RadioShack.

Now on this charge, I can sympathize with the Arab criminals. You never tell Radio Shack the truth about your phone number or anything else. Otherwise, you end up on who-knows-how-many calling lists. The last thing you want is to have to answer the phone when you're trying to rig a suicide vest.

All you need to tell them when purchasing a clock radio is that it's none of their business who you are and where you live.
And then they come up with some customer service, store policy bullshit, and I'm not going to waste my time arguing with a cashier.

I am sure someone will correct me if I am wrong but is there not a limit on how much cash you can legally carry in the US? I vaguely recall $10k being the limit...

If these guys are guilty of a crime they will get tried. It matters not what names nor faith they are.

This is one area where Marge Thatcher was right in regards to the IRA...criminalise them. Do not treat them as a political force.

I have no clue why anyone would want that many cell phones either, but the implication that they could be using them to make bombs doesn't automatically make them terrorists. It's quite possible that they are and that that was the intention, but from what I'm seeing, all they really have released so far is that they had a massive load of cellphones in their van.

The claim that they must be terrorists if they collect that many cell phones is ridiculous.
I heard on the local news that parts of cell phone batteries can be used to make meth-amphetamine. I have no idea how, but then that's not my business.

Is it fun making stuff up? First you say they were taking the batteries out, they were only taking the charger out of the packging. Then you say they were buying in threes, but it doesn't say that anywhere else, in fact it was becaus they bought 80 at the same time that the police was alerted.

I think that by making stuff up you're trying to put us off from investigating you, you are the terrorist.

Actually I got that information from the Jeff Katz Show.

So, what do you think? Were these dudes up to something nefarious or are the young entrepreneurs?

Hey, when you try to buy 80 cell phones, have thousands more in your van, and $11,000 in cash something is going on.


http://cbs11tv.com/topstories/local_story_223225924.html

http://www.columbusdispatch.com/news-story.php?story=dispatch/2006/08/12/20060812-A1-01.html

http://www.todaysthv.com/news/news.aspx?storyid=32673

There is a great lack of solid evidence against them. I would find it sickening if they got indited for this insane paranoia of the so-called "National Security." I would start to lose faith in the legal system if the judge did not throw the case, or more accurately, lack of a case out. I would kill myself if they were put to death.

Actually I got that information from the Jeff Katz Show.
And where did he get it from?

I am sure someone will correct me if I am wrong but is there not a limit on how much cash you can legally carry in the US? I vaguely recall $10k being the limit...
That's the amount you can introduce to the US when travelling from abroad.

Why? When activating a prepaid cell in the UK its up to you whether or not you provide that information.
And if you don't the cell phone company still activates the phone?

Okay, let me get this straight - it's okay to only buy 3 cell phones, but when you do that on a regular basis, like each and every day, it's illegal?

I thought this was the capitalist way and now they're being prosecuted for it? Facing terrorism charges?

If there's not more than that, that honestly is ridiculous! Especially when you have a van with a 1000 more in it. That surely shows that they were selling'em.

Now, whether or not that is legal, I don't know - but you can't "buy" a telephone number here in Germany any more without leaving some sort of trace.
Maybe that's what the officials are getting at.

I mean, come on - a thousand "mobile bombs" or what?

Like those three cellphones each could buy wouldn't suffice if they were up to something!

And where did he get it from?

No clue, but he's one of the best talk show host around, so his source are pretty much soild about 98% of the time. All I know is that if you pull a van over, and it has three arabs guy in it, with 80 cell phones, and a big load of cash, something is going on, and it isn't legal.

No clue, but he's one of the best talk show host around, so his source are pretty much soild about 98% of the time. All I know is that if you pull a van over, and it has three arabs guy in it, with 80 cell phones, and a big load of cash, something is going on, and it isn't legal.
Sure, whatever you say.

All I know is that if you pull a van over, and it has three arabs guy in it, with 80 cell phones, and a big load of cash, something is going on, and it isn't legal.Yes, but that doesn't automatically mean it's terrorism.

And then they come up with some customer service, store policy bullshit, and I'm not going to waste my time arguing with a cashier.
I've never gotten an argument. They just tap a couple of buttons on the register and complete the transaction.

Okay, let me get this straight - it's okay to only buy 3 cell phones, but when you do that on a regular basis, like each and every day, it's illegal?

I thought this was the capitalist way and now they're being prosecuted for it? Facing terrorism charges?

If there's not more than that, that honestly is ridiculous! Especially when you have a van with a 1000 more in it. That surely shows that they were selling'em.

Now, whether or not that is legal, I don't know - but you can't "buy" a telephone number here in Germany any more without leaving some sort of trace.
Maybe that's what the officials are getting at.

I mean, come on - a thousand "mobile bombs" or what?

Like those three cellphones each could buy wouldn't suffice if they were up to something!


They don't use the cell phone as bombs, they use them to denonate the bombs.

And if you don't the cell phone company still activates the phone?

Yep, I have an unregistered prepaid sim card that I use for some of my more shady phone calls.

Yes, but that doesn't automatically mean it's terrorism.

True, but they should still be taken in for questioning.

No clue, but he's one of the best talk show host around, so his source are pretty much soild about 98% of the time. All I know is that if you pull a van over, and it has three arabs guy in it, with 80 cell phones, and a big load of cash, something is going on, and it isn't legal.

1. 98% isn't accurate enough.
2. All the reported evidence is circumstantial. It's like if I was arrested for piracy just because I bought a bunch of blank CDs and had internet access.

1. 98% isn't accurate enough.
2. All the reported evidence is circumstantial. It's like if I was arrested for piracy just because I bought a bunch of blank CDs and had internet access.

Well, one could draw from conclusion that you wanted to commit piracy... and nothing is ever 100% accurate. If they were, then we wouldn't need all the news station, radio stations that we have.

Well, one could draw from conclusion that you wanted to commit piracy...

One could also draw the conclusion that he was backing up his hard drive and has an interest in information.

Well, one could draw from conclusion that you wanted to commit piracy...
It's like when you own a gun. One can draw the conclusion that you will kill someone.

I'm somewhat interested in what you could do with 80 cellular phones.

1. Make meth?
2. Detonate bombs? (in which you wouldn't need that many phones because one phone = one bomb, and it's much more efficient to just use an actual detonator because then they could set off multiple bombs with one trigger)
3. ????
4. Profit?


Kudos to anyone who gets that.

It's like when you own a gun. One can draw the conclusion that you will kill someone.
More like, when you own EIGHTY guns, and keep them all in a van.

Absurd. Buying phones for resale is a lot more plausible than omg terrorism.

More like, when you own EIGHTY guns, and keep them all in a van.
But only if you're of Middle Eastern descent. The Second Ammendment doesn't apply to those people.

Well, one could draw from conclusion that you wanted to commit piracy... and nothing is ever 100% accurate. If they were, then we wouldn't need all the news station, radio stations that we have.

Of course nothing is 100% correct, but to base everything off of one source is just dumb. If he gave his sources, I would have considered whether it was true or not.

The US requires you to give your name when buying electrical goods? Land of the free indeed.

No. Radio Shack always asks for your name an phone number. The put it in the computer and then you are on their mailing list which they also sell. So, you end up with a ton of junk mail. You can always tell them your number is unlisted and you are paying cash so they say OK and press on.

I don't say they're law abiding citizens. I'm saying that the conclusion that they're terrorists is a bit hasty. They could be using those phones for some scam which would make them equally loath to give their real names.

I did read in one of the articles they buy the phones for $20 and sell them for $38 without the charger. Not a bad profit margin.

No. Radio Shack always asks for your name an phone number. The put it in the computer and then you are on their mailing list which they also sell. So, you end up with a ton of junk mail. You can always tell them your number is unlisted and you are paying cash so they say OK and press on.

Then why are the guys being charged with providing false information? :)

Is it fun making stuff up? First you say they were taking the batteries out, they were only taking the charger out of the packging. Then you say they were buying in threes, but it doesn't say that anywhere else, in fact it was becaus they bought 80 at the same time that the police was alerted.

I think that by making stuff up you're trying to put us off from investigating you, you are the terrorist.

I don't think Brother Wil is making anything up, I think he might have a reading comprehension problem. :eek:

That's the amount you can introduce to the US when travelling from abroad.

Well I did some digging around and it seems that if you withdraw $10k cash from a bank in the US the bank needs to fill out some forms for the government....

but that was only one website and no link to the applicable law...

I remember reading a news piece where the police found a person carrying a large amount of cash and had it confiscated.

Am trying to find this but with little luck.

Now on this charge, I can sympathize with the Arab criminals. You never tell Radio Shack the truth about your phone number or anything else. Otherwise, you end up on who-knows-how-many calling lists. The last thing you want is to have to answer the phone when you're trying to rig a suicide vest.

Especially if the phone is the trigger. :eek: :eek:

I am sure someone will correct me if I am wrong but is there not a limit on how much cash you can legally carry in the US? I vaguely recall $10k being the limit...

If these guys are guilty of a crime they will get tried. It matters not what names nor faith they are.

This is one area where Marge Thatcher was right in regards to the IRA...criminalise them. Do not treat them as a political force.

No limit at all to the amount of cash you can carry. However, the bank is required to notify the Federal authorities for all cash transactions over $10,000.00. The law was passed because of money laundering, organized crime, and drug dealers.

Okay, let me get this straight - it's okay to only buy 3 cell phones, but when you do that on a regular basis, like each and every day, it's illegal?

No it is not illegal, it is the policy of the store to sell only three at a time to a customer.

No. Radio Shack always asks for your name an phone number. The put it in the computer and then you are on their mailing list which they also sell. So, you end up with a ton of junk mail. You can always tell them your number is unlisted and you are paying cash so they say OK and press on.
I usually tell them it's none of their business, and they say "but the register needs your zip code before I can start" and I say "what's the zip code here?" and they look at me, and tell me, and I say "put that in"

after that they don't ask for much else.

I'm somewhat interested in what you could do with 80 cellular phones.

1. Make meth?
2. Detonate bombs? (in which you wouldn't need that many phones because one phone = one bomb, and it's much more efficient to just use an actual detonator because then they could set off multiple bombs with one trigger)
3. ????
4. Profit?


Kudos to anyone who gets that.

Hey, one of the articles said they sell for $300.00 a pop in China.

Then why are the guys being charged with providing false information? :)

I can't answer that, you'll have to ask the authorities. I just don't know unless it is a charge they are using while they investigate and will drop it later. Now, if they give false identity to the police that is a crime, but Radio Shack....:confused:

I usually tell them it's none of their business, and they say "but the register needs your zip code before I can start" and I say "what's the zip code here?" and they look at me, and tell me, and I say "put that in"

after that they don't ask for much else.

:p You also get strange looks when they ask your phone number and you tell them 911. One time I gave them a check and they wanted to see my ID and a credit card. I told them no way on the credit card and when they said store policy I simply took my check back, ripped it up, put it in my pocket, and walked out. I went to Wal-Mart and bought my phone.

No limit at all to the amount of cash you can carry. However, the bank is required to notify the Federal authorities for all cash transactions over $10,000.00. The law was passed because of money laundering, organized crime, and drug dealers.

Yeah that seems to be the case...thanks!

Now I need to figure where the hell I got the idea that there was a issue with carrying large sums... DOH!

How do we know they wren't just ripping off Walmart/Radioshack and doing a Delboy down the Market?

"Lovely phone, never been touched, only a few dollars less than the market price, lovely! Batteries seperate, ten dollars."


But noooo, they have Arabic names, so they must have been using them as bombs!

and once again the suspect are Middle Eastern young men. Just like in 9/11, Midrid, London Bombing, and the recently foiled US-UK plot. However, we still can't profile because that would be wroooonnnngggg. :rolleyes:

The IRA sure made a big racket back to their hayday. Plenty of bombs and bomb threats. Does that mean the UK should profile all Irish peoples as terror suspects?

'Timmy' McVeigh sure killed a lot of people in Oklahoma City Bombing - he was a born-and-bred United States white boy. He even served in the US Army, do we start profiling Gulf War Army vets as terrorists?

You're a bigot. Terrorism or not. I'm sure you'll find a niche on some neo-Nazi site.

:p You also get strange looks when they ask your phone number and you tell them 911. One time I gave them a check and they wanted to see my ID and a credit card. I told them no way on the credit card and when they said store policy I simply took my check back, ripped it up, put it in my pocket, and walked out. I went to Wal-Mart and bought my phone.
you and I would get along rather well. There is an Albertsons in OKC, where they have the register rigged to not ring anything up without your phone number, I went in got a gallon of milk and an orange, she says "I need your home phone number" and I said "why?" she then explained to me that she could not make the scanner scan without this information "what do you use it for?" she says we keep a database of what you buy and then send you coupons:eek: I told her I didn't want any coupons, I wanted milk and an orange, she called the manager, who after 20 minutes of trying got it to ring up my food without my number, only I couldn't pay without putting it in:mad: so, I told them that I was paying cash and they didn't need my number, they claimed I couldn't pay without providing it, so I left.

Won't be going back either.

what wil they be charged with? is it illegal to buy 1000 cellphones? is it illegal to violate walmart sales policies?

no one needs 1000 cellphones to detonate bombs, thats just ridiculous. maybe its a drug thing.... selling anonymous cellphones to drug runners around the country.

I'm somewhat interested in what you could do with 80 cellular phones.

1. Make meth?
2. Detonate bombs? (in which you wouldn't need that many phones because one phone = one bomb, and it's much more efficient to just use an actual detonator because then they could set off multiple bombs with one trigger)
3. ????
4. Profit?


Kudos to anyone who gets that.


Underwear knomes!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Absurd. Buying phones for resale is a lot more plausible than omg terrorism.

Why? Where is the profit in that? Unless you are trying to sell the phones as being untracable...but even then there are ways to do that anyway?

No limit at all to the amount of cash you can carry. However, the bank is required to notify the Federal authorities for all cash transactions over $10,000.00. The law was passed because of money laundering, organized crime, and drug dealers.

Well the part about importing and exporting is correct..

"There is no limit on the total amount of money or monetary instruments that may be brought into or taken out of the United States. However, if you transport or cause to be transported, more than $10,000 in monetary instruments on any occasion into or out of the United States, or if you receive more than that amount, in behalf of someone else and then transport it, you must file a Customs Form 4790 with U.S. Customs. Failure to comply can result in civil and criminal penalties, including seizure of the currency or monetary instruments. Monetary instruments include U.S. or foreign coins, currency, traveler's checks, money orders, and negotiable instruments or investment securities in bearer form are all considered when determining the total $10,000 reporting requirement.
"

But only if you're of Middle Eastern descent. The Second Ammendment doesn't apply to those people.

Untrue. Remember Waco and the white guy who thought he was Jesus?

and once again the suspect are Middle Eastern young men. Just like in 9/11, Midrid, London Bombing, and the recently foiled US-UK plot. However, we still can't profile because that would be wroooonnnngggg. :rolleyes:
LOL! I prefer the Carlos Mecia solution: Put up pictures of all the terrorists at every transportation hub and tell everyone that unless you look like them, just go get on your plane, train or bus. The ones who look like them, form over to the right ... we're doing a cavity search. Oh ... and if you don't look like them and are carrying a knife, go ahead and take it with you ... "And if Achmed gets crazy ... STAB that son-of-a-bitch!" :D

Given how much of a problem meth is in north Texas, if cell phone batteries can be used to make meth, then I feel that it's reasonable to conclude that these cell phones were going to be used to make drugs, not bombs.

Besides, the mandatory sentences for drug-related offenses are so long that we might as well just charge them for drug offenses and be done with it - we get to lock these three guys up and throw away the key, without the brouhaha of a terrorism case!

Why? Where is the profit in that?
:rolleyes:

There is profit in that, if you make one. What, never seen phones and other electronic equipment sold at street markets? Why do they bother, if there is no profit? Well there is, if the price you paid is low enough.

Wilgrove, you'd be a lot more convincing if you could psot an actual source, instead of saying I heard it on TV, and the TV guy has a good track record.

Here's how it's done:

FWIW, regarding the purchase limit of 3 cell phones at Wal Mart and the suspects subsequent rendering of them, this article covers that. Also of note is the phone company's policy regarding names, highlighted towards the end of the passage.

Around 1:00am August 11th the three men purchased cell phones from the Wal-Mart store on M-81 near the corner of M-24 in Caro. Wal-Mart places a limit on the number of cell phones that can be purchased at once, that number is three. The three men allegedly bought 80 by purchasing them three at time so that an alert wouldn't be triggered by the cash register. They also paid cash.

An alert clerk grew suspicious and called Tuscola County central dispatch. The Caro Police Department sent a unit and stopped the rented van on M-81 just east of Caro. The suspects were headed towards Bad Axe on M-81 where there is another Super Wal-Mart.

The three men are described as being of Palestinian descent but live in Texas. Police say the three, ages 19, 22, and 23 appear to be naturalized citizens.

One man was driving while the other two were in the back opening the phone packages with box cutters throwing the phones in one box, batteries in another and the packaging and phone charger in another container. The suspects had 1000 other cell phones in the van. There was also a bag of receipts showing that someone was in Wisconsin the day before.

The phones were Nokia TracFones selling for $20 at Wal-Mart. For your twenty dollars you receive a phone charger and 40 minutes of airtime. The phones do not have to be registered with a name. Also discovered was a laptop with store addresses and store logos.
http://www.wnem.com/Global/story.asp?S=5269589

http://www.wnem.com/Global/story.asp?S=5269589

I guess I missed the part where all of thise happened about 50 miles away from me. That's the local station I watch occaisionally.

Here's (http://www.wnem.com/global/category.asp?c=5517) a page with some videos on it. Apparently it happened in another town nearby (about 10 miles from where I grew up) and they have a video where they talk to some guy who saw them buying the phones at 2am. The guys said they were buying them for construction workers. It seems to me that if these guys aren't very bright.

Anyway, check out the one about the customer witness and the guys trying to buy some in Ithaca.

edit: I just watched the video about the local community reaction, and it creeped me the hell out. One lady said you need to report anything you think was suspicious. And I think about a quarter of the video was spent doing a closeup on the US flag, for no real reason.

They are probably buying the phones to resell overseas. I think it's like a 20$ profit on each phone, that's PRETTY GOOD for maybe 2 or 3 hours work.

If they're facing terror charges there is MORE to what they are doing than re selling phones.

North Texas is my stomping grounds.

I'm dissapointed I didn't pick up on this sooner.

:eek:

North Texas is my stomping grounds.

I'm dissapointed I didn't pick up on this sooner.

:eek:

Apparently they bought a bunch in North Texas and then came up to Mid Michigan (where I live) and got caught trying to buy a bunch up here.

They don't use the cell phone as bombs, they use them to denonate the bombs.
Well, duh! Hello, Captain Obvious, nice meeting you. :rolleyes:

Why? Where is the profit in that? Unless you are trying to sell the phones as being untracable...but even then there are ways to do that anyway?
This link is from the OP, please read at least the last sentence

http://www.todaysthv.com/news/news.aspx?storyid=32673

and then tell me that a profit of 47.4% isn't something that would let you pick up such a trade to earn you some bucks.

Apparently they bought a bunch in North Texas and then came up to Mid Michigan (where I live) and got caught trying to buy a bunch up here.

How far are you away from Pontiac and Holly? I had two roommates last semester who were from there, and I also knew this smoking hot chik from Pontiac.

How far are you away from Pontiac and Holly? I had two roommates last semester who were from there, and I also knew this smoking hot chik from Pontiac.

About two or three hours, depending on how you drive.

The State Police keep saying that they suspect they wanted to use them to make bombs, but they're clearly just speculating. They either don't know yet or aren't telling us yet.

Seems to me that there's a lot of this story that's not making the news--from what's being reported, there's no reason to charge them with terrorism, so I've got to think that there's more to the story than is being let out right now. That, or there's a really overzealous prosecutor on the loose.

Seems to me that there's a lot of this story that's not making the news--from what's being reported, there's no reason to charge them with terrorism, so I've got to think that there's more to the story than is being let out right now. That, or there's a really overzealous prosecutor on the loose.

Yeah, I can't find anything being said that would cause them to charge them with anything involving terrorism.

Here's a link to another article that goes a bit more in-depth. Apparently they say they were going to sell them overseas.

The men were from Texas, ages 19, 22, and 23, Stevenson said. They told police they were buying the phones to sell them to another man, who might then send them overseas.

Also, I didn't hear about this

Earlier in the week, prosecutors in Ohio charged two 20-year-old Dearborn men of Lebanese descent, Ali Houssaiky and Osama Abulhassan, with terrorism after they bought hundreds of cell phones. The family of Abulhassan released a statement Friday saying they were innocent men just trying to earn some money for college and were profiled because of their Arab ancestry.

Link (http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060812/NEWS99/60812002)

Yeah, I can't find anything being said that would cause them to charge them with anything involving terrorism.

Here's a link to another article that goes a bit more in-depth. Apparently they say they were going to sell them overseas.
And it wouldn't be the first time that a prosecutor went apeshit over nothing, especially since if the charges are reduced or dropped later, it can be done quietly and with little fanfare. Or it could be that there's something significant going on. At this point, no one outside the people directly involved know for certain.

Of course, simply questioning the arrest on any level is likely to get me labeled as a terrorist sympathizer by some around here.

And it wouldn't be the first time that a prosecutor went apeshit over nothing, especially since if the charges are reduced or dropped later, it can be done quietly and with little fanfare. Or it could be that there's something significant going on. At this point, no one outside the people directly involved know for certain.

Of course, simply questioning the arrest on any level is likely to get me labeled as a terrorist sympathizer by some around here.
I believe it's illegal to sell cellphones overseas, if that is what they were planning then they were legitimately arrested. I know that a friend of mine works for a computer company and they are not allowed to sell computers to certain countries and even have to flag certain purchases for the "management" to approve. I believe I heard that it's also illegal to sell some video game systems overseas as well.

I believe it's illegal to sell cellphones overseas, if that is what they were planning then they were legitimately arrested. I know that a friend of mine works for a computer company and they are not allowed to sell computers to certain countries and even have to flag certain purchases for the "management" to approve. I believe I heard that it's also illegal to sell some video game systems overseas as well.

I think they were probably justified in arresting the men, I just don't know if the allegations of "terrorism" are justified. I guess we'll have to wait and see.

I think they were probably justified in arresting the men, I just don't know if the allegations of "terrorism" are justified. I guess we'll have to wait and see.
I think the reason that it's illegal to sell cellphones, video game systems, computers ect. overseas is because it aids terrorists.....

*goes to look it up*

So, what do you think? Were these dudes up to something nefarious or are the young entrepreneurs?

Hey, when you try to buy 80 cell phones, have thousands more in your van, and $11,000 in cash something is going on.


http://cbs11tv.com/topstories/local_story_223225924.html

http://www.columbusdispatch.com/news-story.php?story=dispatch/2006/08/12/20060812-A1-01.html

http://www.todaysthv.com/news/news.aspx?storyid=32673

Maybe they're just sexually disturbed gentlemen who get turned on by mobile communication devices?

I think they were probably justified in arresting the men, I just don't know if the allegations of "terrorism" are justified. I guess we'll have to wait and see.
Given the history of muslim young men and terrorism, I'd say it's better their asses get thrown in jail than to have them out on the streets. Or in airplanes for that matter. I'll still have to read the articles, though.

Given the history of muslim young men and terrorism, I'd say it's better their asses get thrown in jail than to have them out on the streets. Or in airplanes for that matter. I'll still have to read the articles, though.
That's as ignorant a post as I've read around here, and you're up against some pretty stiff competition. Let's try this on for size--there have been some christians who have been convicted in the past for bombing abortion clinics. They make up a very small percentage of christians as a whole, but just to be safe, let's lock up all christians because it's better that their asses get thrown in jail than have them out on the streets where they might bomb abortion clinics.

Can you walk and breathe at the same time?

Apparently the men were arraigned, authorities suspect them of trying to blow up the Mackinack Bridge, the 5 mile long bridge that connects the two peninsulas of Michigan.

Muhareb told the magistrate: "This is a misunderstanding." He said he was selling the phones to earn money to help pay for his brother's college education.

Louai Othman's wife, Lina Odeh, said the men were buying the phones to sell to a man in Dallas for a profit of about $5 per phone. She said they were in Michigan because so many people in the Dallas area are doing the same thing that the phones are often sold out.

"All we did is buy the phones to sell and make money," Louai Abdelhamied Othman told the magistrate. He said authorities had previously stopped the group in North Dakota, South Dakota, Minnesota and Wisconsin.

"We've been checked by the
FBI before," he said. "They even gave us their card and everything."

Tuscola County Prosecutor Mark E. Reene told The Saginaw News that investigators believe the men were targeting the 5-mile long Mackinac Bridge. He declined to say what led investigators to that belief.

I find the accusation of wanting to blow up the bridge to be a bit specious with the current information. If you were going to use the phones as detonators, why would you buy over a thousand of them? Also, it's not as though you could just walk around on the bridge doing whatever you want. There are police on the bridge in little turnouts, and when I drove over it a couple of week ago they were doing work on it.

This may be a case of an overzealous prosecutor. I know that as a Michigander the idea of someone blowing up the Mackinack Bridge is absolutely horrifying. The bridge has become a symbol of our state in the 49 years it's been around. It seems almost as though the prosecutor came up with the thing that would cause the most symbolic damage in this state and ran with it. Again, we'll see how the details emerge.

Link to article (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060813/ap_on_re_us/phones_terror_charges)

That's as ignorant a post as I've read around here, and you're up against some pretty stiff competition. Let's try this on for size--there have been some christians who have been convicted in the past for bombing abortion clinics. They make up a very small percentage of christians as a whole, but just to be safe, let's lock up all christians because it's better that their asses get thrown in jail than have them out on the streets where they might bomb abortion clinics.

Can you walk and breathe at the same time?
The principle threat of terrorism comes from muslims not christians. If you deny that, then you are the one who is ignorant.

Given the history of muslim young men and terrorism, I'd say it's better their asses get thrown in jail than to have them out on the streets. Or in airplanes for that matter. I'll still have to read the articles, though.
And still, I'd rather have some shady character walking the streets freely than having one innocent man thrown in jail because of whatever charges based on wrong claims anyday.
You should remember, that one innocent person locked up in jail just for good measure could very well be you! :eek: Think about it. And please, for the love of Pete - at least read the damn articles, then think, then post. You simply jumped to the third, which usually ain't all that good. :rolleyes:

The principle threat of terrorism comes from muslims not christians. If you deny that, then you are the one who is ignorant.
And because of some tiny fraction of Muslims not following the rules of social living-together you are willing to treat them all inhumanely?
That truely is a sad show of character right there. Not only ignorant, but dangerous and paranoid.

I believe it's illegal to sell cellphones overseas, if that is what they were planning then they were legitimately arrested. I know that a friend of mine works for a computer company and they are not allowed to sell computers to certain countries and even have to flag certain purchases for the "management" to approve. I believe I heard that it's also illegal to sell some video game systems overseas as well.
It's not. There are some export regulations that they have to fulfill, of course, and there are restrictions on what you can export to certain countries, like Iran, Cuba, and such. But just selling cellphones overseas is not illegal. As long as you fill the paperwork before exporting your articles you have done nothing illegal.

And then they come up with some customer service, store policy bullshit, and I'm not going to waste my time arguing with a cashier.
...And so you fold in the face of the authority a cashier wields over you?

Hell's Bells, man.

I've been in that same spot, and literally walked away from it. Convenience doesn't trump privacy, not in my books.

...And so you fold in the face of the authority a cashier wields over you?

No, I give them false information. I want the article, I'm not going to waste my time arguing with stupid store policies or looking for it somewhere else when I have it in my hand.

It's not. There are some export regulations that they have to fulfill, of course, and there are restrictions on what you can export to certain countries, like Iran, Cuba, and such. But just selling cellphones overseas is not illegal. As long as you fill the paperwork before exporting your articles you have done nothing illegal.
so if they were selling the cell phones overseas without going through and fulfilling the proper regulations then they did break the law?

The principle threat of terrorism comes from muslims not christians. If you deny that, then you are the one who is ignorant.
Muslims aren't the ones targeting and murdering abortionists, and blowing up abortion clinics while staffers are inside. Those are Christians, man.

Check your pulse already.

The IRA sure made a big racket back to their hayday. Plenty of bombs and bomb threats. Does that mean the UK should profile all Irish peoples as terror suspects?

'Timmy' McVeigh sure killed a lot of people in Oklahoma City Bombing - he was a born-and-bred United States white boy. He even served in the US Army, do we start profiling Gulf War Army vets as terrorists?

You're a bigot. Terrorism or not. I'm sure you'll find a niche on some neo-Nazi site.

I am so tired of the Timmy McVeigh argument. I mean let's look at facts here.

1 white supremisit < 19+ Arab Hijackers on 9/11 3-4 arabs in the 1993 WTC bombings, Arabs who blew up our embessies and so far 21 arabs arrested in connection with the US-UK terrorist plot.

After you look at it like that, then you start to see that profiling is a good and sensible thing. My dad works with a guy named Muhammed Muhammed (yes that is his name, don't ask me.) and he gets searched twice, everytime he goes to the airport. It doesn't mean that he's a terrorist. It just means that since it was arabs that did the majority of attacks against the US, then it's logical to search them. Hell Muhammed doesn't mind, he's glad they're searching arabs, because if one of them has a bomb, he wants to know about it!

Wilgrove, you'd be a lot more convincing if you could psot an actual source, instead of saying I heard it on TV, and the TV guy has a good track record.

Here's how it's done:

FWIW, regarding the purchase limit of 3 cell phones at Wal Mart and the suspects subsequent rendering of them, this article covers that. Also of note is the phone company's policy regarding names, highlighted towards the end of the passage.


http://www.wnem.com/Global/story.asp?S=5269589

Jeff Katz must've read that exact report, because he said that from word to word.

so if they were selling the cell phones overseas without going through and fulfilling the proper regulations then they did break the law?
Yup. But they could be selling them to an exporting business that made all the paperwork.

and once again the suspect are Middle Eastern young men. Just like in 9/11, Midrid, London Bombing, and the recently foiled US-UK plot. However, we still can't profile because that would be wroooonnnngggg. :rolleyes:

Wilgrove, I've been wanting to ask you this for a while.

Should I profile you, and assume you are mentally retarded, because you look retarded? I'm basing this on the pictures you posted of yourself, having an obvious condition of sorts, which makes you look retarded, based on seeing other people who are retarded.

This isn't meant to be ad hominem, I'm just wondering if I should be assuming this, and maybe force you to wear a helmet everywhere you go, because of the way you look. Who knows, you could really be a retard, and just be rehearsing lines someone else told you to say.

Wilgrove, I've been wanting to ask you this for a while.

Should I profile you, and assume you are mentally retarded, because you look retarded? I'm basing this on the pictures you posted of yourself, having an obvious condition of sorts, which makes you look retarded, based on seeing other people who are retarded.

Eh go ahead, wouldn't be the first time, and I do get a bit of joy when I prove them wrong. So yea sure why not, comon, give me some joy!

Eh go ahead, wouldn't be the first time, and I do get a bit of joy when I prove them wrong. So yea sure why not, comon, give me some joy!

Im sure people of middle eastern descent are just giddy when they get searched, and the incredibly vast majority of them have nothing even slightly offensive.

And how can you prove you aren't one? You just happen to not be acting like one at certain moments(not to get into this thread, where thats arguable).

Again, should you be forced to wear a helmet wherever you go, just incase you really are a retard?

The principle threat of terrorism comes from muslims not christians. If you deny that, then you are the one who is ignorant.
Again with the ignorance. There are about a billion Muslims worldwide, and there's probably fewer than one one-thousandth of one percent who are terrorists. So we should just judge the lot of them because a small percentage happens to be douchebags? By what passes for logic with you, we should. :rolleyes:

Again with the ignorance. There are about a billion Muslims worldwide, and there's probably fewer than one one-thousandth of one percent who are terrorists. So we should just judge the lot of them because a small percentage happens to be douchebags? By what passes for logic with you, we should. :rolleyes:

By their logic, we should probably jail every young black male in america. I bet the likelihood of a young black male commiting a crime in his life is higher than the likelihood of a muslim man commiting a terrorist act in his life.

Im sure people of middle eastern descent are just giddy when they get searched, and the incredibly vast majority of them have nothing even slightly offensive.

So who should we search? Grandma, the Veteran in the wheelchair, or a mother with her two kids? The fact of the matter is that the majority (about 99%) of terrorist attacks against the United States are done by Arabs. We shouldn't scarafice security just because we might offend a few people. I would rather have an arab on my flight that is pissed off, than an arab that has a bomb.


And how can you prove you aren't one? You just happen to not be acting like one at certain moments(not to get into this thread, where thats arguable).


3.2 GPA, Eagle Scout, Hold a Private Pilot License, hold a Driver's License, IQ is above 100 (Don't know the exact number) and I have the ability to take words and put them into sentaces that make sense. Speaking used to be a problem, but six months of speech theraphy took care of that. Oh yea there's also the fact that I'll be getting my History BA this fall, and will be taking on a dual Masters. So yea.


Again, should you be forced to wear a helmet wherever you go, just incase you really are a retard?

You do realize that you're sterotyping and profiling right now right? I mean not all retards wear helments.... Just thought I would point that out.

So who should we search? Grandma, the Veteran in the wheelchair, or a mother with her two kids? The fact of the matter is that the majority (about 99%) of terrorist attacks against the United States are done by Arabs. We shouldn't scarafice security just because we might offend a few people. I would rather have an arab on my flight that is pissed off, than an arab that has a bomb.



3.2 GPA, Eagle Scout, Hold a Private Pilot License, hold a Driver's License, IQ is above 100 (Don't know the exact number) and I have the ability to take words and put them into sentaces that make sense. Speaking used to be a problem, but six months of speech theraphy took care of that. Oh yea there's also the fact that I'll be getting my History BA this fall, and will be taking on a dual Masters. So yea.



You do realize that you're sterotyping and profiling right now right? I mean not all retards wear helments.... Just thought I would point that out.

First paragraph: All of them, if they give us reason to be suspicious. Otherwise, only the standard security everyone has to go through. Nobody should be searched more carefully than others, based on things like gender, origin, religion, etc.

If one person got aids from a green apple, and nobody got it from any other apple, that would mean 100% of apple-related aids would have come from green apples. Doesn't mean we should just start testing green apples for aids, just to be safe, especially not while excluding others from the testing.

Just because a couple dozen middle-eastern descended people have commited terrorism, doesn't mean we should be extra careful around the millions of others. Thats retarded, on many levels.

Second paragraph: Could be all made up, or an elaborate ploy. You look retarded, so we need to be sure. No matter how un-retarded you act, you look the part, so we need to be precautious. At least, in your logic.

Third: I didn't say all retards wear helmets. Its an analogy to harder analysis of middle eastern people, because they are of middle eastern descent. Im saying you should wear a helmet, because you might be a retard, and we don't want to take chances you could hurt yourself.

First paragraph: All of them, if they give us reason to be suspicious. Otherwise, only the standard security everyone has to go through. Nobody should be searched more carefully than others, based on things like gender, origin, religion, etc.

Yea, but once a certain group of people start doing a negative act for a certain amount of time (like blowing our buildings, ships up and killing innocent people) I think it's time to tigthen the noose alittle. If the arabs don't want to be search, then get their country men to stop blowing stuff up!


If one person got aids from a green apple, and nobody got it from any other apple, that would mean 100% of apple-related aids would have come from green apples. Doesn't mean we should just start testing green apples for aids, just to be safe, especially not while excluding others from the testing.

Actually if it's just one, then it wouldn't make much sense. However if it was 19, 25, or 1,000's then yea I would support that analogy. However we're not talking about just one arab guy. We're talking about at least 50 arabs that have commit terrorist attacks against the USA.


Just because a couple dozen middle-eastern descended people have commited terrorism, doesn't mean we should be extra careful around the millions of others. Thats retarded, on many levels.

A couple dozens?? Dude, it was ALOT more than that, and honestly it's not just the attacks that are causing them to be suspicious. There's also the fact that they seem to celeberate the terrorist attacks, don't seem to really speak out against such attacks (yes there has been a few, but it's too far and few in between.) and for some reason get pissed as Hell about a cartoon of muhammed. So pissed that they're willing to hold up signs like "London, your 9/11 will come" or "Your Holocaust is coming." Once again, no one is condemming such things (beside the far in between ones).


Second paragraph: Could be all made up, or an elaborate ploy. You look retarded, so we need to be sure. No matter how un-retarded you act, you look the part, so we need to be precautious. At least, in your logic.

Yea, but your example fails really, because me wearing a helment would only protect me and no one else. However checking an arab guy who wears long robe and long shirt is in the intrest of those who are getting aboard a confined space.

Third: I didn't say all retards wear helmets. Its an analogy to harder analysis of middle eastern people, because they are of middle eastern descent. Im saying you should wear a helmet, because you might be a retard, and we don't want to take chances you could hurt yourself.

You never said that, you just made a sweeping generalization that all retards wear helements. and see my response above, and finally I tend to hurt myself almost on a daily basis. Eh it doesn't hurt me, 30-40 some odd surgeries tend to make my body deal with pain better.

edit: Here are those "innocent" arabs.

http://www.danzfamily.com/archives/blogphotos/06/345-muslim-outrage.jpg

Remember, they are angry over a cartoon.

:rolleyes:

There is profit in that, if you make one. What, never seen phones and other electronic equipment sold at street markets? Why do they bother, if there is no profit? Well there is, if the price you paid is low enough.

:rolleyes:

Those phones were purchased from a store. Who are they going to sell legally purchased phones to? What stops the buyer from just buying phones themselves?

The profit is if the phones were stolen...no money paid for them.

Those street stalls? Well if they are selling unopened boxes of goods or even brand new good out of the box chances are they are stolen. Esp if there are a large amount of goods of the same type/model.

The IRA sure made a big racket back to their hayday. Plenty of bombs and bomb threats. Does that mean the UK should profile all Irish peoples as terror suspects?

'Timmy' McVeigh sure killed a lot of people in Oklahoma City Bombing - he was a born-and-bred United States white boy. He even served in the US Army, do we start profiling Gulf War Army vets as terrorists?

You're a bigot. Terrorism or not. I'm sure you'll find a niche on some neo-Nazi site.

If 99.5% of the people presently trying to blow up the world are purple Smirfs, why the hell are we wasting our time and money strip searching 90 year old grandmothers and 12 year old kids? :rolleyes:

Yup. But they could be selling them to an exporting business that made all the paperwork.
why woudn't the exporting business just buy them wholesale? surely to add on to the markup in the store, plus the markup from these guys, then to do all the paperwork, pay those people a single cell phone would be so expensive that they wouldn't sell any. It sounds like a piss poor business plan to me.

I think the reason that it's illegal to sell cellphones, video game systems, computers ect. overseas is because it aids terrorists.....

*goes to look it up*

It has more to do with the technology. Any item, such as computers, where the technology can be used for either civilian or military applications requires special export licenses and permissions. Materials like that cannot be exported to some countries such as Iran because of the possible military application.

SNIP...Think about it. And please, for the love of Pete - at least read the damn articles, then think, then post. You simply jumped to the third, which usually ain't all that good. :rolleyes:

Some people are incapable of step two. :eek:

That's the amount you can introduce to the US when travelling from abroad.
The US damages its own tourist industry?

Now on this charge, I can sympathize with the Arab criminals. You never tell Radio Shack the truth about your phone number or anything else. Otherwise, you end up on who-knows-how-many calling lists. The last thing you want is to have to answer the phone when you're trying to rig a suicide vest.
Why do you think that all brown people are criminals?

Originally Posted by RockTheCasbah
The principle threat of terrorism comes from muslims not christians. If you deny that, then you are the one who is ignorant.

Again with the ignorance. There are about a billion Muslims worldwide, and there's probably fewer than one one-thousandth of one percent who are terrorists. So we should just judge the lot of them because a small percentage happens to be douchebags? By what passes for logic with you, we should. :rolleyes:

99.5% of Muslims are NOT terrorists, but 99.5% of the terrorists are Muslims.

The US damages its own tourist industry?

I sincerly doubt that any tourists carry $10,000.00 or more with them on a vacation and even if the did, for some strange reason, all they have to do is fill out the proper customs forms. :rolleyes: