NationStates Jolt Archive

Teachers should stop calling bright pupils "clever" for fear they might not be considered "cool" by classmates, a union has been told.

Last year, the union voted to replace the word "failure" with "deferred success".

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/5241524.stm

This is so stupid I can't even parody it.

Wow, and I thought America was nuts.

It's part of the political promise that "in our district, everyone is above average".

Point out that no matter what you do, half the people are going to be less educated and more stupid than the average person, and you make people upset.

Try telling some parent that because they aren't arsed enough to read to their child every night that their kid is struggling in school and they turn around and blame the school.

Hell, we've got teachers here in Massachusetts that aren't allowed to mark up tests, quizzes and papers with red pen anymore, because the red might "hurt the students' confidence." :rolleyes:

We're raising a generation of wusses.

Hell, we've got teachers here in Massachusetts that aren't allowed to mark up tests, quizzes and papers with red pen anymore, because the red might "hurt the students' confidence." :rolleyes:

We're raising a generation of wusses.

Here in Virginia, until you reach high school, if you turn in a paper, they can't mark you down for bad spelling or improper grammar on the idea that you might be insulting someone's cultural background.

I read it at work.

British companies face a massive recruitment problem because virtually no applicants can express themselves eloquently in written and spoken form, let alone do maths or possess initiative and a hunger for knowledge.

That is, applicants who are British nationals. Foreign nationals do just fine.

Hell, we've got teachers here in Massachusetts that aren't allowed to mark up tests, quizzes and papers with red pen anymore, because the red might "hurt the students' confidence." :rolleyes:

We're raising a generation of wusses.
Actually, that can be a reasonable fair cultural thing. In some parts of the Far East, red ink is considered too hostile and green ink is used for marking purposes instead. You are still told you're rubbish though. Just in a culturally appropriate colour.

ha! "deffered success"! ha! that's hilarious. rather than giving kids a false sense of hope that they might all potentially good at the same things wouldn't it be better to give kids an opportunity to find things they can be good at. i'm saying this because i've nearly finished uni and i still haven't found anything i'm better than just above average at.

Actually, that can be a reasonable fair cultural thing. In some parts of the Far East, red ink is considered too hostile and green ink is used for marking purposes instead. You are still told you're rubbish though. Just in a culturally appropriate colour.

Here (and I forget which school disctrict it is right now), red was simply deemed "too harsh." Teachers have to use purple ink.

Actually, that can be a reasonable fair cultural thing. In some parts of the Far East, red ink is considered too hostile and green ink is used for marking purposes instead. You are still told you're rubbish though. Just in a culturally appropriate colour.
"Time to go."
"Wrong do it again!"
"If you don't eat your meat, you can't have any pudding, how can you have any pudding if you don't eat your meat!"
"You! Yes, you! behind the bikesheds, stand still laddie!"

Are the British trying to be more American or do they just happen to believe in the same "feelings are more important than, you know, actual skills they can use to, you know, survive" shit as the American politicians and teachers? If it's the latter, then that's one freaky coincidence there.

Here in Virginia, until you reach high school, if you turn in a paper, they can't mark you down for bad spelling or improper grammar on the idea that you might be insulting someone's cultural background.
Goddamn, I didn't think 'Dumbass' was a cultural background.

"Time to go."
"Wrong do it again!"
"If you don't eat your meat, you can't have any pudding, how can you have any pudding if you don't eat your meat!"
"You! Yes, you! behind the bikesheds, stand still laddie!"
i still find that song one of the creepiest the floyd have done.

i still find that song one of the creepiest the floyd have done.
Ah, Pink Floyd? That would be why the response held no meaning.

Here in Oklahoma children aren't allowed to get a D or an F, anything below a 70 is marked a C regardless. :rolleyes:

Goddamn, I didn't think 'Dumbass' was a cultural background.

If you're a redneck, or you're a poor urban black, the state is not allowed to point out that you're being intentionally ignorant until you reach high school.

Then the state competency tests will rapidly decant your ass out of high school.

Hell, we've got teachers here in Massachusetts that aren't allowed to mark up tests, quizzes and papers with red pen anymore, because the red might "hurt the students' confidence." :rolleyes:

We're raising a generation of wusses.
Oh no!! NOT THE RED PEN OF ANTI-SELFCONFIDENCE!! Now we'll never raise children with the arrogance that they need!

Ah, Pink Floyd? That would be why the response held no meaning.
it was by pink floyd wasn't it? i've got the song on my mp3 player but i always have it on shuffle and i rarely bother to check what the song is.

it was by pink floyd wasn't it? i've got the song on my mp3 player but i always have it on shuffle and i rarely bother to check what the song is.

Yes. "Another Brick in the Wall, Part II."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/5241524.stm

This is so stupid I can't even parody it.

You defer success.

You defer success.
Ah, so when a young man is unsuccessful at finding a young woman (or young man, or both) to have sex with, he's "deferring sex".

"The year was 2006, and everyone was finally equal (http://instruct.westvalley.edu/lafave/hb.html)..."

"The year was 2006, and everyone was finally equal (http://instruct.westvalley.edu/lafave/hb.html)..."
I remember that story. Instead of naking the worse better, they made the better worse. Damn them to hell. I'll have the gaming skills of a guy in a coma and the eye sight of a blind man. To quote what Darth Vader really said, "What the hell are you talking about? Child support? I don't even have any kids. What the hell are you talking about. Those kids you say I'm supporting don't even exist. For the last time, Luke, I'm not your father. Where the hell did you get that idea?"

You know, that hurts me, deep down inside. Red's my favourite colour. And I'm studying to become a teacher. I WANT to use red all over my students' work!

Ah well. Maybe I'll get some pink sparkly gel pens. Because writing a big fat "F" in pink sparkles is a much nicer thing to do than writing it in red.

Oh, but what's this I see? No more F? Only C? Well, maybe instead of writing a letter grade, I'll simply write "Pass (but you can hide this from your friends if you want to seem cool)" or "Deferred success" in sparkly pink gel pen.

Because we all know that sugarcoating makes the world go 'round!:rolleyes:

You know, that hurts me, deep down inside. Red's my favourite colour. And I'm studying to become a teacher. I WANT to use red all over my students' work!

Ah well. Maybe I'll get some pink sparkly gel pens. Because writing a big fat "F" in pink sparkles is a much nicer thing to do than writing it in red.

Oh, but what's this I see? No more F? Only C? Well, maybe instead of writing a letter grade, I'll simply write "Pass (but you can hide this from your friends if you want to seem cool)" or "Deferred success" in sparkly pink gel pen.

Because we all know that sugarcoating makes the world go 'round!:rolleyes:
In some cultures, writing in red is the equivilant of a death threat. In said cultures, it's exactly is like a death threat because it is one. Probably because blood usually is red. So, not using red is understandable. Some kids from other countries are struggling to master a completely new culture, complete with rules and new customs and whatnot.

However, when a kid is failing, he or she NEEDS to know it. I mean, if you want to learn, you HAVE to make mistakes to learn from because we, as a species, learn more from failure than from success.

I almost dread the fact that eventually my children are going to be in school. I'm going to have serious issues with the faculty. :(

I almost dread the fact that eventually my children are going to be in school. I'm going to have serious issues with the faculty. :(
You don't know the half of it, my friend.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/5241524.stm

This is so stupid I can't even parody it.


Maybe we should call the kids who are just doing time and failing without attempting any effort "observers" and the ones who are working, "participants."

And then since "teacher" is a word that implies authority, "learning partner/facilitator" should be substituted.

And we shouldn't call them "tests" or "exams" because those terms have too many negative connotations. How about "Success Opportunities"?

Homework assignments could be renamed "synthesis applications".

You don't know the half of it, my friend.

I'd home school my kids, but there are important social lessons to be learned in public schools. At least, there used to be. :(

Here (and I forget which school disctrict it is right now), red was simply deemed "too harsh." Teachers have to use purple ink.

This pisses me off no end simply because it's a personal style I've had for about 20 years to write in purple (8 years in the education world). I'm no longer "eccentric", I'm average. :p

Now I have to find a new color no one else uses.

Maybe we should call the kids who are just doing time and failing without attempting any effort "observers" and the ones who are working, "participants."

And then since "teacher" is a word that implies authority, "learning partner/facilitator" should be substituted.

And we shouldn't call them "tests" or "exams" because those terms have too many negative connotations. How about "Success Opportunities"?

Homework assignments could be renamed "synthesis applications".

Or we could just feed our kids Cocoa Puffs and let them run and run. :p

This pisses me off no end simply because it's a personal style I've had for about 20 years to write in purple (8 years in the education world). I'm no longer "eccentric", I'm average. :p

Now I have to find a new color no one else uses.

Red. :)

I'd home school my kids, but there are important social lessons to be learned in public schools. At least, there used to be. :(
there are no important social lessons to be learned in school that can't be learned elsewhere...just a thought.

Here in Oklahoma children aren't allowed to get a D or an F, anything below a 70 is marked a C regardless. :rolleyes:

...I fully understand why you are educating your own kids then. Shame the other parents aren't up in arms about this and threatening to sue for grade inflation which will only insure their kids remain badly educated.

I'd home school my kids, but there are important social lessons to be learned in public schools. At least, there used to be. :(

Just you wait. Depending on where you are, the level of craziness will vary. As will the topic du jour.

You'll actually hear parents (and teachers) discuss the "possibility" of teaching ID, or hear a teacher explain sex in a sex ed class in a way you thought you hadn't heard since 1970, or hear about how evil all white men were, are, and ever will be. Your kid will come home with papers full of spelling errors that the teacher could care less about - they're too burdened with taking care of the two kids in class who can't even read (and have trouble remembering to breathe).

there are no important social lessons to be learned in school that can't be learned elsewhere...just a thought.

I can't very well give my own kids wedgies, can I?

:p

Your kid will come home with papers full of spelling errors that the teacher could care less about

Heh. And I'm told I'm too harsh because I actually do correct them all.
"Hurting their confidence" and all that shit.

(Note: correcting them does not mean I am taking a point off for each one -- simply writing the proper spelling or explaining the grammatical rule in the margin (there, their and they're, for instance).

When I gave one girl a 95 on her essay test for a technically correct answer that was fraught with spelling errors, she actually had the nerve to tell me, "You can't take points off for THAT."

And I replied, "100 means perfection. This paper is not perfect. It's very good, though."

Fortunately when she went to whine to my supervisor, he told her, "Ms. K has been very generous. If I were to mark this in my class, you'd have gotten a lower grade."

Heh. And I'm told I'm too harsh because I actually do correct them all.
"Hurting their confidence" and all that shit.

(Note: correcting them does not mean I am taking a point off for each one -- simply writing the proper spelling or explaining the grammatical rule in the margin (there, their and they're, for instance).

When I gave one girl a 95 on her essay test for a technically correct answer that was fraught with spelling errors, she actually had the nerve to tell me, "You can't take points off for THAT."

And I replied, "100 means perfection. This paper is not perfect. It's very good, though."

Fortunately when she went to whine to my supervisor, he told her, "Ms. K has been very generous. If I were to mark this in my class, you'd have gotten a lower grade."

Refreshing to know there are still some good teachers out there. :)

I can't very well give my own kids wedgies, can I?

:p

And why not? :p

And why not? :p
I have given some of my own children wedgies, mostly as a means of instructing them on how to effectively do it to others.

I have refrained from teaching them how to do swirlies, mostly because my wife would kill me.

I have given some of my own children wedgies, mostly as a means of instructing them on how to effectively do it to others.

I have refrained from teaching them how to do swirlies, mostly because my wife would kill me.

See that's the good thing about having two older brothers, I knew how to do all that crap. Not that I did, I was the good son.

I could however kick the crap out of anyone who was dumb enough to start something. Ah school, it was horrifying.

I have given some of my own children wedgies, mostly as a means of instructing them on how to effectively do it to others.

I have refrained from teaching them how to do swirlies, mostly because my wife would kill me.

I got the most evil look from my gf when I explained to her daughter what a swirlie is. :D

Heh. And I'm told I'm too harsh because I actually do correct them all.
"Hurting their confidence" and all that shit.

(Note: correcting them does not mean I am taking a point off for each one -- simply writing the proper spelling or explaining the grammatical rule in the margin (there, their and they're, for instance).

When I gave one girl a 95 on her essay test for a technically correct answer that was fraught with spelling errors, she actually had the nerve to tell me, "You can't take points off for THAT."

And I replied, "100 means perfection. This paper is not perfect. It's very good, though."

Fortunately when she went to whine to my supervisor, he told her, "Ms. K has been very generous. If I were to mark this in my class, you'd have gotten a lower grade."

I'm glad I teach an absolute subject (Physics and General Science). You are either absolutely correct or absolutely wrong. No quibbles.

Mind you one kid described me as "Sir, see you, you're the scariest b*stard that has ever taught me". :D I wonder why my classes scores higher than average?

I have given some of my own children wedgies, mostly as a means of instructing them on how to effectively do it to others.

I have refrained from teaching them how to do swirlies, mostly because my wife would kill me.

Well for instructional purposes, I suppose. But they still need others to practice on. After all, what good is showing my kids how to start food fights with milk grenades if there is no cafeteria to engage?

I got the most evil look from my gf when I explained to her daughter what a swirlie is. :D

It's important health information! :)

Well for instructional purposes, I suppose. But they still need others to practice on. After all, what good is showing my kids how to start food fights with milk grenades if there is no cafeteria to engage?

True. Which is why I have five children.

Our house is also popular with the neighborhood children, so there is plenty of practice for my children.

They seem to do quite well at school in terms of "social" activity.

Fargozia']IMind you one kid described me as "Sir, see you, you're the scariest b*stard that has ever taught me". :D I wonder why my classes scores higher than average?

Take no prisoners! :D

"The year was 2006, and everyone was finally equal (http://instruct.westvalley.edu/lafave/hb.html)..."
And that is why I think a psychotic religious theocracy is better than an ultra-leftis 'everybody is equal' dictatorship. At least the psychotic religious theocracy would be INTERESTING. And they would just execute you for displeasing them.
Of course, this would be a wet dream for many politicians, it seems sometimes. Every voter at least ten times dumber than you >_>

Fargozia']I'm glad I teach an absolute subject (Physics and General Science). You are either absolutely correct or absolutely wrong. No quibbles.
Ahem ...

Heisenberg and Schodinger were driving down the autobahn one day and Heisenberg says, "I think you ran over a cat back there."

Schodinger asks, "Is it dead?"

And Heisenberg answers, "I can't be certain."

Ahem ...

Heisenberg and Schodinger were driving down the autobahn one day and Heisenberg says, "I think you ran over a cat back there."

Schodinger asks, "Is it dead?"

And Heisenberg answers, "I can't be certain."


Schrödinger.

Ahem ...

Heisenberg and Schodinger were driving down the autobahn one day and Heisenberg says, "I think you ran over a cat back there."

Schodinger asks, "Is it dead?"

And Heisenberg answers, "I can't be certain."

That's just bloody awful. :p

Schrödinger.
:rolleyes:

True. Which is why I have five children.

Our house is also popular with the neighborhood children, so there is plenty of practice for my children.

They seem to do quite well at school in terms of "social" activity.

A brief moment of seriousess:

Dealing with peers is very important. I'm not just referring to friends, either. Dealing with rivals and bullies teach different and important life lessons. In the course of our lives we learn that certain people can't be reasoned with. We learn that certain people are better at certain things that you are. We learn when it's important to confront conflict and when it's important to avoid it. We learn how to accept failure and grow from the experience.

At least, those are the lessons that a well adjusted child with active paricipation from his or her parents can learn from public schools. Academic education is not the only thing of value schools teach, and it's not the only thing that schools are subpar at teaching without active participation from parents.

Here in Oklahoma children aren't allowed to get a D or an F, anything below a 70 is marked a C regardless. :rolleyes:
That can't be true. Please. FUCK. That can't be true.

That can't be true. Please. FUCK. That can't be true.
Hey, at least they use grades lower than A+'s, meaning that the uberPCdictators haven't won yet.

They need to go back to this grade system (the one WE have):

A= 100-89.5 (excellent)
B= 89.4-79.5 (above average)
C= 79.4-69.5 (average)
D= 69.5-59.5 (below average)
F= 59.4 and below (FAILURE)

And I think red ink is OK... as well as complementing the smart and letting the idiot's know that they aren't smart.

GUNDGES!!

:gundge: :gundge: :gundge: :gundge: :gundge: :gundge: :gundge: :gundge: :gundge:

They need to go back to this grade system (the one WE have):

A= 100-89.5 (excellent)
B= 89.4-79.5 (above average)
C= 79.4-69.5 (average)
D= 69.5-59.5 (below average)
F= 59.4 and below (FAILURE)

And I think red ink is OK... as well as complementing the smart and letting the idiot's know that they aren't smart.
Just because someone gets bad grades and does poorly in school doesn't mean they're not smart.

I mean, I'm smart, and my GPA is hovering around 0.8...

Here in Virginia, until you reach high school, if you turn in a paper, they can't mark you down for bad spelling or improper grammar on the idea that you might be insulting someone's cultural background.

That is unbelievable! Does the state of Virginia think that by grading papers this way it'll really prepare its students for high school? Give me just a small break.

Just because someone gets bad grades and does poorly in school doesn't mean they're not smart.

I mean, I'm smart, and my GPA is hovering around 0.8...
Yes, and people want it to be higher than 0.8. Now the best way to encourage improvement is to show a difference between doing good and doing poorly. Saying that it is all good won't really help. After all, the difference between a higher grade and a lower grade isn't just intelligence, it is also effort.

I think this is bad for male students in particular (the majority of them anyway) Men like the idea of a challenge and the opertunity to prove some one wrong. If you say to a male student "You aren't good enough, you can't do it" It motivates them to try harder so they can rub it in that teacher's face. If you were to say "You can do it if you try" then the student is going to be like "Well, what have I got to prove? Everyone knows Im smart I don't have to show them"

They need to go back to this grade system (the one WE have):

A= 100-89.5 (excellent)
B= 89.4-79.5 (above average)
C= 79.4-69.5 (average)
D= 69.5-59.5 (below average)
F= 59.4 and below (FAILURE)
:

The honors classes I took at my HS had a grading scale like this:

A:92<
B:92-84
C:83-75
D:74-66
F:66>

Now that was a rigorous system; it sucked to get an 83 on a project and end up with a C, but it did motivate you to work harder. I still prefer the simple 10-point system, but this one was also quite effective.

A= 100-89.5 (excellent)
B= 89.4-79.5 (above average)
C= 79.4-69.5 (average)
D= 69.5-59.5 (below average)
F= 59.4 and below (FAILURE)




Thats still quite lenient. The school(s) I attended have always had a grading style like this:

100-90=A
89-80=B
79-70=C
Everything below 70 is a failing grade


And PC crazies appear to have no influence, as none of the previously mentioned idiocy (in all the pages preceding) have been innacted.

However, certain religious student organizations have been under attack in my district, but that is another story.

Yes, and people want it to be higher than 0.8. Now the best way to encourage improvement is to show a difference between doing good and doing poorly. Saying that it is all good won't really help. After all, the difference between a higher grade and a lower grade isn't just intelligence, it is also effort.
I don't think it's "all good", but I can't get my GPA over 2.0, and you need 3.0 or better to get into anything other than community college. And you can get into community college with a GED... so I have no reason to even complete my senior year, let alone improve my grades.

These people need a light slap to the face or a cutting, I'm-going-to-commit-suicide-now-level sarcastic remark. Preferably both. They're just idiots - dangerous idiots, too. How can they fail to realize that the more they cater to the lowest common denominator and try to homogenize the student population in terms of success and intellect, the more they destroy the success of the educational system?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/5241524.stm

This is so stupid I can't even parody it.

OMG. The title of the thread is perfect.

Just because someone gets bad grades and does poorly in school doesn't mean they're not smart.

I mean, I'm smart, and my GPA is hovering around 0.8...

I was reffering to those who are incompetent in that area... I was just saying it simply cuz I had to go do something that is unimportant now. And by simply I mean bluntly... sry. Those who are not academically inclined are not idiots...

I'm waiting for someone to ban the word "nerd" on the basis that nerds are considered "uncool". At which point, I will declare war on them.

The honors classes I took at my HS had a grading scale like this:

A:92<
B:92-84
C:83-75
D:74-66
F:66>

Now that was a rigorous system; it sucked to get an 83 on a project and end up with a C, but it did motivate you to work harder. I still prefer the simple 10-point system, but this one was also quite effective.

The advantage of the 10-point system is that it works awesomely with 1, 2, 5, and 10 question quizzes... Simple for grading... not much division.

I'm waiting for someone to ban the word "nerd" on the basis that nerds are considered "uncool". At which point, I will declare war on them.

I already "dislike intently" (:D) those who try to ban words...

The honors classes I took at my HS had a grading scale like this:

A:92<
B:92-84
C:83-75
D:74-66
F:66>

Now that was a rigorous system; it sucked to get an 83 on a project and end up with a C, but it did motivate you to work harder. I still prefer the simple 10-point system, but this one was also quite effective.My schools always had that scale for everyone, regardless of what they took. They only changed it a couple years ago to the college scale. It made me wonder how many decent grades I missed out on.

I don't think it's "all good", but I can't get my GPA over 2.0, and you need 3.0 or better to get into anything other than community college. And you can get into community college with a GED... so I have no reason to even complete my senior year, let alone improve my grades.
I've heard of people failing to get into community college even w/ a diploma or GED.

I don't think it's "all good", but I can't get my GPA over 2.0, and you need 3.0 or better to get into anything other than community college. And you can get into community college with a GED... so I have no reason to even complete my senior year, let alone improve my grades.
Right, it isn't all good, you would have preferred not to have been forced into that choice, however, the rule exists because a .8 GPA shows little merit and due to the need for distinction between students merit must be assessed. Of course, like you recognized there are chances to try again and do better, GED and community college but that isn't the easy path. I do think I am being a bit of a cold bastard right now, and I apologize for it. However, if you could go back and redo things would you do them the same?

I've heard of people failing to get into community college even w/ a diploma or GED.
I thought community colleges accepted most people who were willing to pay the money to do the coursework? Maybe I was wrong.

Right, it isn't all good, you would have preferred not to have been forced into that choice, however, the rule exists because a .8 GPA shows little merit and due to the need for distinction between students merit must be assessed. Of course, like you recognized there are chances to try again and do better, GED and community college but that isn't the easy path. I do think I am being a bit of a cold bastard right now, and I apologize for it. However, if you could go back and redo things would you do them the same?
No need to apologize. Losers like me are used to being frowned upon, and I get much worse from my family and myself every day.
If I could go back in time to when I gave up in school (6th grade-ish...), yeah, I'd work at it and get a 3.0 or better in high school. Since I don't have a time machine, there's really no point to my saying this.

To be completely honest, though, I have no idea what I'd do with a college education. My whole life, I've only wanted two occupations, and neither of them need degrees in anything: either United States Army Infantry, or MMA Light/Middleweight.

To be completely honest, though, I have no idea what I'd do with a college education. My whole life, I've only wanted two occupations, and neither of them need degrees in anything: either United States Army Infantry, or MMA Light/Middleweight.
lol.. absolutely no reason you can't have both.

No need to apologize. Losers like me are used to being frowned upon, and I get much worse from my family and myself every day.
If I could go back in time to when I gave up in school (6th grade-ish...), yeah, I'd work at it and get a 3.0 or better in high school. Since I don't have a time machine, there's really no point to my saying this.

To be completely honest, though, I have no idea what I'd do with a college education. My whole life, I've only wanted two occupations, and neither of them need degrees in anything: either United States Army Infantry, or MMA Light/Middleweight.
A loser is defined by the content of their character, not on bad choices made in the past. To claim that you are a loser means that you have failed to learn, not that that you have never made mistakes. Getting a GED and pushing through community college is a way to address your mistake, if you have another opportunity you can always take it.

Go for what is practical. You have a life, you have some ability to choose what you want to do with it. Try to see if one of your dreams is a good option, or try to see what you are good at and major at that. People go to college to help themselves reach their goals whether it is self-improvement or to reach a career if one of those applies go for that, if neither then try to forge your own path. I think that going to college is in your best interest, however, only you know what you want to do and only you can help yourself reach that goal.

A loser is defined by the content of their character, not on bad choices made in the past. To claim that you are a loser means that you have failed to learn, not that that you have never made mistakes. Getting a GED and pushing through community college is a way to address your mistake, if you have another opportunity you can always take it.
Why are you assuming that his not getting a GED is a mistake. The world does not need the same abilities from everyone. It seems to me that far too much emphasis is placed on 'academic' ability - or the ability to pass exams, and far too little attention is paid to the development of skills and talemnts that fall outside of this academic world. A good motor mechanic, or a skilled welder does not need the academic skills. A talented musician or a top rate sportsman doesnt need the academic certificates. What is important in what Liberated New Ireland wrote is that he wouldn't know what to do with a college education. It simply would not help in his achieving his goals. So let it be at that. There is no point in his going to community college if it doesn't help him get to where he wants to be. More power to him, and to all of those that recognise that there are alternatives to academic success that may well be more appropriate to them.

Why are you assuming that his not getting a GED is a mistake. The world does not need the same abilities from everyone. It seems to me that far too much emphasis is placed on 'academic' ability - or the ability to pass exams, and far too little attention is paid to the development of skills and talemnts that fall outside of this academic world. A good motor mechanic, or a skilled welder does not need the academic skills. A talented musician or a top rate sportsman doesnt need the academic certificates. What is important in what Liberated New Ireland wrote is that he wouldn't know what to do with a college education. It simply would not help in his achieving his goals. So let it be at that. There is no point in his going to community college if it doesn't help him get to where he wants to be. More power to him, and to all of those that recognise that there are alternatives to academic success that may well be more appropriate to them.
You are right, it might not achieve his goals and that should be his focus. I did inject a bit of my bias into this, however, for the average person academics often helps them. Now, I did admit perhaps clumsily that he might not want to go to college "People go to college to help themselves reach their goals whether it is self-improvement or to reach a career if one of those applies go for that, if neither then try to forge your own path." even stating that he can choose his own path and not go. After all, his career dreams did not require college and he might persue those. However, he might want to address the problems of the past, in which he didn't do as well as he could have academically. Just because there are some good musicians and some good athlete does not mean that we should ignore the fact that they are not the majority; I will admit that trade school is a good option and not one that comes readily to my mind(I didn't know if he needed a GED for that or not though, so better safe than sorry). However, he admitted that he was intelligent and he did admit that the reason he didn't do well was because he stopped trying, that sounds like there might be some academic potential but that is my poor opinion speaking there. At the very least, he will have a better time at things if he can get his GED because people view some form of diploma as an accomplishment.

I like my district. One of the most respected teachers (by his peers) has the highest fail rate in the district. However, the student has no excuses. He is at school from 730-1600, he phones parents when the student misses an assignment, he makes the students vote on the criteria on all projects. There is no just letting things slide in his class. Failure is a choice.

But, he is able to successfully link his lessons to Simpsons episodes, and Monty Python and the Holy Grail.:D

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/5241524.stm

This is so stupid I can't even parody it.


You know, that is so unfathomably stupid, it is almost sig worthy. Not that i want it in my sig of course.

They need to go back to this grade system (the one WE have):

A= 100-89.5 (excellent)
B= 89.4-79.5 (above average)
C= 79.4-69.5 (average)
D= 69.5-59.5 (below average)
F= 59.4 and below (FAILURE)

The Canadian system is as follows:
A= 80-100 (excellent)
B= 70-79 (above average for university, average for high school)
C= 60-69 (average for university, below average for high school)
D= 50-59 (below average)
F= 49 and below (FAILURE)
It's the same, but with smaller numbers. It's not that we're more lenient, our teachers and university professors design assignments such that the course averages will be as I described. Although, In university I've seen course averages range from D+ to B-, and in high school I had a course where the class average was in the high 80's.

I think this is bad for male students in particular (the majority of them anyway) Men like the idea of a challenge and the opertunity to prove some one wrong. If you say to a male student "You aren't good enough, you can't do it" It motivates them to try harder so they can rub it in that teacher's face. If you were to say "You can do it if you try" then the student is going to be like "Well, what have I got to prove? Everyone knows Im smart I don't have to show them"
That is an interesting theory.

I am bloody sick and tired of all this political correctness!

Half the kids are dumber than the other half. Half the adults are dumber than the other half. If they don't like their standing then work on it!!!!! If they don't like the fact that they FAIL, yes FAIL, and not pass then tough shit for them!!! Live with it, deal with it.

Am I supposed to be nice to you because you're too dumb to get the job I have offered????? NO!! So deal with it on your time.

Do I have to give you the job because you aren't qualified for it? NO!

I had a teacher tell me that we have raised a generation of kids that are unable to deal with rejection in many ways. Whose fault is that? OURS!

Can you kid read and write properly? Believe me, most can't unless you count "Spell check" on the computer and that, in to way, catches everything.


One last question for you....does this mean a woman who is a slut is actually 'horizontally available" ??????????????????????????????????????????

That is unbelievable! Does the state of Virginia think that by grading papers this way it'll really prepare its students for high school? Give me just a small break.

I'm not a racist, but I did middle school in Virginia and intentionally wrote a racist and ubiquitously error-stricken paper that still got a 100. I complained and told the teacher they were being an idiot. The response was, I kid you not, "I can't take points off for you expressing your opinion."

Sad. Just so sad. :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :( :(

Thats still quite lenient. The school(s) I attended have always had a grading style like this:

100-90=A
89-80=B
79-70=C
Everything below 70 is a failing grade


And PC crazies appear to have no influence, as none of the previously mentioned idiocy (in all the pages preceding) have been innacted.

However, certain religious student organizations have been under attack in my district, but that is another story.

I changed schools between ninth and tenth. The ninth was an idiot-infested, PC-crazied public school shithole. My tenth grade school was private, and a lot better. The ninth grade school scale was:

A: >93.5
B: 83.5-93.49
C: 73.5-83.49
D: 64-73.49
F: <64
Not the most lenient, but insufficient.

Scale from school in tenth grade thru end of high school:
A: >94
B: 88-94
C: 78-88
D: 70-78
F: 70>

Much better, and I actually managed to stay on the honor roll all thru it. But even "honor roll" is a dumb idea. Anybody who can read should be able to manage at least a 2.5, but we had guys who couldn't do .5 at my ninth grade school.

Can you kid read and write properly? Believe me, most can't unless you count "Spell check" on the computer and that, in to way, catches everything.


I like how you included that misspelling for the PC idiots.

It's been demonstrated, time and again, that trying to protect children's poor little psyches from the consequences of failure does not help their "self-esteem." "Self-esteem" is earned through accomplishment, accomplishment is achieved through work, it isn't handed to anyone on a platter. And no matter how you spin the words, failure is still failure. California is a prime example of what happens when you pass kids for social reasons. We have a huge population of semi-lliterates - teachers have to pass a competency test to prove they know how to read, do math, etc. even though they've graduated from college and have a credential!

It's this kind of bullshit, the idea that if one student does well, it somehow harms the others if it's recognized, that is destroying our education system. And all of the "no child left behind" nonsense is going to help. Maybe if a few of them do get left behind, they'll start working harder and their parents will wake up to their responsibilities.

Hell, we've got teachers here in Massachusetts that aren't allowed to mark up tests, quizzes and papers with red pen anymore, because the red might "hurt the students' confidence." :rolleyes:

We're raising a generation of wusses.
Tell em, Ol' Geezer ;) :D :fluffle:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/5241524.stm

This is so stupid I can't even parody it.
So did you hear about Bah bah Rainbow Sheep?:rolleyes:

Heh. And I'm told I'm too harsh because I actually do correct them all.
"Hurting their confidence" and all that shit.

(Note: correcting them does not mean I am taking a point off for each one -- simply writing the proper spelling or explaining the grammatical rule in the margin (there, their and they're, for instance).

When I gave one girl a 95 on her essay test for a technically correct answer that was fraught with spelling errors, she actually had the nerve to tell me, "You can't take points off for THAT."

And I replied, "100 means perfection. This paper is not perfect. It's very good, though."

Fortunately when she went to whine to my supervisor, he told her, "Ms. K has been very generous. If I were to mark this in my class, you'd have gotten a lower grade."

My senior year english teacher would have us take 10 minutes at the beginning of each class to write a short journal entry (usually it was about 5 sentences long). She gave us topics to write about, but also the freedom to write about something else if we wanted to.

A journal entry with no grammatical or spelling errors was given an 80.

Well, if you want the Army, go to West Point and major in something with a battlefield application - communications, electrical engineering, military history, I don't know.

A couple years ago my friend got a bad test grade back and he yelled "Jesus Christ did I do bad". He got yelled at becuase the teacher said he was imposing his beliefs on others or something like that.

I don't know what it's like in the UK but at my school getting good grades does not make you uncool...

I'm sure the next step is to pass a law that states fire cannot be hotter than body temperature for fear of people injuring themselves.