NationStates Jolt Archive

I got inspired by Eut's bitching about Christianity in the US, to ask whether you lot would vote for an atheist president if there was a Christian alternative.

For the purposes of this poll, please assume that you agree or disagree equally with both the Christian & atheist candidate & that you have to vote for one of the two.

EDIT: Oki.. Time to clarify it seems.

1. This is a hypothetical scenario.
2. The sole grounds for picking either candidate is the candidate's Christian beliefs or lack there of.
3. If this is of no significance for you in any way, do feel free not to vote.
4. Damn.. I can't edit in an option so you lot can vote for something that isn't related to the poll. Sorry. I'll start a spam-thread for you if you want.
5. Read 1. again.
6. Read 2. again.

I personally will vote for the only deity in the next election: Hillary Clinton

I got inspired by Eut's bitching about Christianity in the US, to ask whether you lot would vote for an atheist president if there was a Christian alternative.

For the purposes of this poll, please assume that you agree or disagree equally with both the Christian & atheist candidate & that you have to vote for one of the two.

IF those are the only two choices and IF I agree with them equaly and IF neither has made a campaign promise to deny rights to any group (for example denying gays the right to marry) I would vote for the Atheist on the general principle of at least they will be able to keep their religion out of our damn laws. If they both vowed, for example, to prohibit gay marriage I would vote for myself.

I got inspired by Eut's bitching about Christianity in the US, to ask whether you lot would vote for an atheist president if there was a Christian alternative.

For the purposes of this poll, please assume that you agree or disagree equally with both the Christian & atheist candidate & that you have to vote for one of the two.

I'm a Pentacostal Christian.

While I really don't care what religion (or none) a candidate may personally follow, my only litmus test is that they aren't constantly making a joke of my beliefs.

Until the Democratic Party cracks down on various candidates who fake going to church only during elections, or who say they are familiar with the Bible and then can't remember a damned thing, or who get on the radio and joke about how stupid Christians are, I won't be voting Democratic Party any time soon.

Libertarian, yes. Republican, it depends (because Tom DeLay orchestrated pandering as well).

As long as Al Franken and the two people on his show (who are there I presume to make Al look "moderate") make daily jokes about fundamentalist Christians, fuck the Democratic Party and all of its candidates.

hmm.......I disagree or agree with them exactly the same?

how am I supposed to choose then?

I'm not a US citizen but I don't think religion would neccessarily be my main reason for choosing a candidate.

I personally will vote for the only deity in the next election: Hillary ClintonYou'll notice I didn't mention the upcomming election. This is a purely hypothetical situation. But ok, imagine you had two Hillarys to pick from, indentical in all respects, except one is a Christian & the other isn't. Which would you choose?

The non Christian one! Religion doesnt belong anywhere (except maybe in a Church)

You'll notice I didn't mention the upcomming election. This is a purely hypothetical situation. But ok, imagine you had two Hillarys to pick from, indentical in all respects, except one is a Christian & the other isn't. Which would you choose?

Whichever one wasn't making fun of my beliefs.

Sorry its Hillary Clinton. Either one would mock you.

I got inspired by Eut's bitching about Christianity in the US, to ask whether you lot would vote for an atheist president if there was a Christian alternative.

For the purposes of this poll, please assume that you agree or disagree equally with both the Christian & atheist candidate & that you have to vote for one of the two.

If you are saying that both candidates are equally apealing except for their religious beliefs?

Keep in mind that for me, one of the most important qualities a U.S. President can have is a strong desire to keep his religious beliefs(or lack thereof) to himself and to encourage others to do the same. That being the case, then it makes absolotely no difference to me what his personal faith is.

On the other hand, if both of these candidates pursued an agenda that attempted to forward the influence of their religion(or lack thereof), then both candidates would be equally unappealing to me and I would probably vote for Mr. Potatohead.

Mr. Potatohead doesn't judge. :)

There are two main groups of people that would never have my vote for ANY public office- Atheists and Muslims. I'd vote for a Buddhist, a Hindu, a Jew, a Christian, even a Pagan, but never those two. Don't trust either of them with a public office (I barely even trust those we currently put in office).

Sorry its Hillary Clinton. Either one would mock you.So very true :D

The last option on the poll should read "I'd pick the Christian, but I'm not American". Sorry about that.

Also, assume the candidates are equally appealing or unappealing to you in all respects, except one is Christian & the other is an atheist. This means; if one would mock your faith, the other would too.

If being a Christian or an atheist isn't a requirement, or even a minor issue for you, then you shouldn't cast a vote in the poll. I did, but only to make it easy for me to see the results of your votes. I wish I could have added an "other" option so you could do the same, but that's sadly too late. Sorry.

Finally, feel free to comment & debate.

I personally will vote for the only deity in the next election: Hillary Clinton
Ewww... Billary!?!

She can't win anyway. 50% of Americans polled said that they definately wouldn't vote for her. Another 30% or so were undecided.

Ewww... Billary!?!

She can't win anyway. 50% of Americans polled said that they definately wouldn't vote for her. Another 30% or so were undecided.

Well, that depends who she runs against, doesn't it? :p

Given the option, I'd rather NOT vote for her, But then again, Jeb Bush might run against her. Then what? :p

So, wait, the hypothetical situation is to show that we discriminate? It is similar to having a situation where there was a white dude and a black dude and we have to vote based upon their skin color. I dunno, I just think that a person's policy beliefs should be important, and not so much what they have for a religious belief. Frankly, the only religion I really distrust and might openly discriminate against(as opposed to unconscious bias) is Scientology and that because I think it is an evil cult.

Well, that depends who she runs against, doesn't it? :p

Given the option, I'd rather NOT vote for her, But then again, Jeb Bush might run against her. Then what? :p
Then its time to vote Libertarian.

I'm a Pentacostal Christian.

While I really don't care what religion (or none) a candidate may personally follow, my only litmus test is that they aren't constantly making a joke of my beliefs.

Until the Democratic Party cracks down on various candidates who fake going to church only during elections, or who say they are familiar with the Bible and then can't remember a damned thing, or who get on the radio and joke about how stupid Christians are, I won't be voting Democratic Party any time soon.

Libertarian, yes. Republican, it depends (because Tom DeLay orchestrated pandering as well).

As long as Al Franken and the two people on his show (who are there I presume to make Al look "moderate") make daily jokes about fundamentalist Christians, fuck the Democratic Party and all of its candidates.

So, what, Al Franken and his mates are the entire Democratic party?

Then its time to vote Libertarian.

Mr. Potatohead. *nod* :)

So, what, Al Franken and his mates are the entire Democratic party?

Might as well be their official voice.

The show is backed in its entirety by Democratic Party fundraisers, since it is unable to make any real money.

EDIT: Oki.. Time to clarify it seems.

...

3. If this is of no significance for you in any way, do feel free not to vote.
Not only would I not vote; I'd protest at a blatant attempt at putting a puppet government into power Yet Again.

Seriously, two identical candidates? There goes Democracy. Or whatever it is that the US has at the minute.

The Christian.

Not only would I not vote; I'd protest at a blatant attempt at putting a puppet government into power Yet Again.

Seriously, two identical candidates? There goes Democracy. Or whatever it is that the US has at the minute.
Reprehencible Fakeocracy.

Protest vote for neither. This is a shitty way to decide how to vote.

Reprehencible Fakeocracy.
There we go.

I'd vote for the atheist even though I believe in a creator. I would expect the atheist to avoid pandering to religious groups and actually do what was good for everyone and not just Christians. I think the atheist would be more even handed because he wouldn't have a religious bias towars any one certain religion but rather an equal bias against them all :D

There are two main groups of people that would never have my vote for ANY public office- Atheists and Muslims. I'd vote for a Buddhist, a Hindu, a Jew, a Christian, even a Pagan, but never those two. Don't trust either of them with a public office (I barely even trust those we currently put in office).

:eek:


If I agreed with them equally, I'd probably vote for the one who I thought could get the most done (ie. by who they influence). Religion wouldn't enter into it.

Until the Democratic Party cracks down on various candidates who fake going to church only during elections, or who say they are familiar with the Bible and then can't remember a damned thing,


Yeah, because Republicans know SO much more about Christianity.

And this guy proves it. (http://www.glumbert.com/media/colbert.html)

To the OP. It really doesn't matter too much to me either way. If there were no differences besides religion, I'd probably flip a coin.

Yeah, because Republicans know SO much more about Christianity.

It's not a matter of knowing - it's a matter of how many pretend that they know, and then turn around and make fun of Christians when they get the chance.

Republican, although they do it from time to time, do not seem to do it with the astonishing regularity of Democratic candidates.

Nor do I hear Republican party people, pundits, or shills making fun of Christians on a regular basis.

Quite unlike the Democratic Party.

As soon as they officially STFU about Christians, I'll be happy to listen to their proposals.

It's not a matter of knowing - it's a matter of how many pretend that they know, and then turn around and make fun of Christians when they get the chance.

Republican, although they do it from time to time, do not seem to do it with the astonishing regularity of Democratic candidates.

Nor do I hear Republican party people, pundits, or shills making fun of Christians on a regular basis.

Quite unlike the Democratic Party.

As soon as they officially STFU about Christians, I'll be happy to listen to their proposals.

It isn't really a hive mind you know. individual members have indiviual thoughts. I'm sure there's one's in the party that aren't as you describe.

Until the Democratic Party cracks down on various candidates who fake going to church only during elections, or who say they are familiar with the Bible and then can't remember a damned thing, or who get on the radio and joke about how stupid Christians are, I won't be voting Democratic Party any time soon.
Hear that Democrats, you'd better get as good at faking Christianity as the Republicans are!

I've said before how the Republicans pretend to be Christian, and then implement decidedly unChristian policies.

Now what's worse, offensive words or offensive actions?

As long as Al Franken and the two people on his show (who are there I presume to make Al look "moderate") make daily jokes about fundamentalist Christians, fuck the Democratic Party and all of its candidates.
Three radio hosts don't represent a party.

Why do you not expect liberal radio hosts not to make jokes about fundamentalist Christians? Don't conservative radio hosts make fun of gays and feminists? Fundie Christians are never going to vote Democrat, and gays and feminists never going to vote Republican, so I can see why shock-jocks like to make fun of them.

Don't complain about dishonesty. Be honest yourself. You vote Republican because you're a hardcore war hawk and so are they.

It's not a matter of knowing - it's a matter of how many pretend that they know, and then turn around and make fun of Christians when they get the chance.

Republican, although they do it from time to time, do not seem to do it with the astonishing regularity of Democratic candidates.

Nor do I hear Republican party people, pundits, or shills making fun of Christians on a regular basis.

Quite unlike the Democratic Party.

As soon as they officially STFU about Christians, I'll be happy to listen to their proposals.

Most fundamentalist christians are socially conservative. There's no way in hell they're going to vote for a democrat anyway. Franken and the rest are just doing what conservatives do when they talk about anti-war protestors or PETA.

It IS a mistake for the Dems to lash back at all Christians, but regardless, they ARE comedians and pundits. Making gross generalizations is what they do.

Ewww... Billary!?!

She can't win anyway. 50% of Americans polled said that they definately wouldn't vote for her. Another 30% or so were undecided.
So, more than half the country probably would vote for her? Assuming that some of the undecided can be brought over.

Um.

I'd have to say I'd vote for the christian candidate. Unfortuanately there are few that are actually christians and do christian things. Typically I find more vhristian members in republican party so you could technically say I am more a republican than not. Anyhow this society is already doomed to fail, regardelss of who is elected. We are facing a Roman Empire scenario here, minus being sakced by crazy germans (that still might happen, who knows?)

I think Ive decided to break off and form my own country, sort of start over type of thing.

I got inspired by Eut's bitching about Christianity in the US, to ask whether you lot would vote for an atheist president if there was a Christian alternative.

For the purposes of this poll, please assume that you agree or disagree equally with both the Christian & atheist candidate & that you have to vote for one of the two.

EDIT: Oki.. Time to clarify it seems.

1. This is a hypothetical scenario.
2. The sole grounds for picking either candidate is the candidate's Christian beliefs or lack there of.
3. If this is of no significance for you in any way, do feel free not to vote.
4. Damn.. I can't edit in an option so you lot can vote for something that isn't related to the poll. Sorry. I'll start a spam-thread for you if you want.
5. Read 1. again.
6. Read 2. again.

As long as he is strong on defense and National Security and does not try to outlaw any religion, I'll support him.

I got inspired by Eut's bitching about Christianity in the US, to ask whether you lot would vote for an atheist president if there was a Christian alternative.

For the purposes of this poll, please assume that you agree or disagree equally with both the Christian & atheist candidate & that you have to vote for one of the two.

EDIT: Oki.. Time to clarify it seems.

1. This is a hypothetical scenario.
2. The sole grounds for picking either candidate is the candidate's Christian beliefs or lack there of.
3. If this is of no significance for you in any way, do feel free not to vote.
4. Damn.. I can't edit in an option so you lot can vote for something that isn't related to the poll. Sorry. I'll start a spam-thread for you if you want.
5. Read 1. again.
6. Read 2. again.

The atheist, cause he's smarter. ;)

If you control for everything but religion, I'm neutral, I guess; if they're going to be advancing exactly the same policies, who cares?

If you are saying that the only difference between the two candidates that I'm aware of is religion, then I'd choose the atheist; in general, they tend to agree with me more than religious people do.

because atheists(in general, not all) tend to disagree with me on more things I'd vote religious, but then again it always depends on the candidate

This is a horrible way to decide how to pick our canidiate. There may be a liberal Christen and I aint sure as hell voting for them.

Looking at the poll, and assuming that most of the non-Americans are from Europe, I have to say:

Yep, the 19th and 20th centuries cured Europe!

EDIT: Hoping that people were smart enough to gloss over the typo in the last poll option.

Looking at the poll, and assuming that most of the non-Americans are from Europe, I have to say:

Yep, the 19th and 20th centuries cured Europe!

EDIT: Hoping that people were smart enough to gloss over the typo in the last poll option.

Don't they have "Christian Democratic" parties and such in Europe?

And didn't Tony Blair just appear on Parkinson and claim something about god and whatnot?

Let's be fair, this is a poll on an internet forum. I doubt it accurately reflects the state of affairs in the EU.

Let's be fair, this is a poll on an internet forum.
Heathen! Don't diss the NSG! :D

Don't they have "Christian Democratic" parties and such in Europe? YEa.. They're everywhere :(

And didn't Tony Blair just appear on Parkinson and claim something about god and whatnot? He did. Though he does claim his religious beliefs don't influence his policies.

Let's be fair, this is a poll on an internet forum. I doubt it accurately reflects the state of affairs in the EU.In this instance, it would seem to reflect the general opinion of the peoples of the EU. At least if you read it as whether or not we want another Christian US President. What we want for ourselves is another matter entirely, and the EU is too diverse a place for this poll to be of any use (and it's on a highly internationally minded liberal internet forum to boot).

He did. Though he does claim his religious beliefs don't influence his policies.

I wonder how he pulls that off. It's a bit have your cake and still eat it, isn't it?

In this instance, it would seem to reflect the general opinion of the peoples of the EU. At least if you read it as whether or not we want another Christian US President. What we want for ourselves is another matter entirely, and the EU is too diverse a place for this poll to be of any use (and it's on a highly internationally minded liberal internet forum to boot).

In that sense I agree. I don't doubt that most people in western europe would feel more comfortable with a less openly christian president. Unfortunately, I can pretty much guarantee that will not be the case. Pretty much since Carter they've all held themselves out that way. The best you can hope for is one that won't answer "the bible" when they are asked what was the last book they read.

Well, I'm no American, but there are 2 minimum requirements to be met before I'll support an american politician.

A] Must be either a church-going Christian or a practising Jew.
B] Must have a good military service record.
( Or - why I would not support the Shrub, but like McCain )

Well, I'm no American, but there are 2 minimum requirements to be met before I'll support an american politician.

A] Must be either a church-going Christian or a practising Jew.
B] Must have a good military service record.
( Or - why I would not support the Shrub, but like McCain )

Doesn't matter whether they support nationalisation of the railways or not, lowering taxes or not, or PR for the Commons or not. Let's just vote based on some good old right-wing prejudice.

Doesn't matter whether they support nationalisation of the railways or not, lowering taxes or not, or PR for the Commons or not. Let's just vote based on some good old right-wing prejudice.

Better that than the slightest stain of US style liberalism.
Pestilence and plagues on the libbies.

Speaking as an atheist it'd probably depend on which denomination the Christian was.

I’d have to go for the atheist, because it’s never a good idea to let weak minded people get to a position of authority.

Don't they have "Christian Democratic" parties and such in Europe?

And didn't Tony Blair just appear on Parkinson and claim something about god and whatnot?
He means that the 20th century cured Europeans of their naivity when politicians liked to say "God is on our side so support us!"

Christian Democrats tend to be secular. Tony Blair is secular.

Secular doesn't mean atheist.

I wonder how he pulls that off. It's a bit have your cake and still eat it, isn't it?
Blair's policies are clearly not at all influenced by his religion.

Well, I'm no American, but there are 2 minimum requirements to be met before I'll support an american politician.

A] Must be either a church-going Christian or a practising Jew.
B] Must have a good military service record.
Why?

He means that the 20th century cured Europeans of their naivity when politicians liked to say "God is on our side so support us!"

Christian Democrats tend to be secular. Tony Blair is secular.

Secular doesn't mean atheist.


Blair's policies are clearly not at all influenced by his religion.


Why?


A] Because I don't trust anyone who does not even pretend to listen to God.

B] Because I'm HIGHLY distrusting when it comes to handing Supreme Command, in Wartime, no less! to some dolt who hasn't got a clue about the nature of combat and war. I'd present as proof: Dubya. Clueless. Dilettant. And God knows what else.

If a man has 'other priorities' than a service-carreer in wartime ( Know whom I am referring to? ), then I'll bet long odds that he has other nasty spots as well.

I would have been delighted with either John Kerry - or Bush Senior - or McCain, or Kennedy.

A] Because I don't trust anyone who does not even pretend to listen to God.

B] Because I'm HIGHLY distrusting when it comes to handing Supreme Command, in Wartime, no less! to some dolt who hasn't got a clue about the nature of combat and war. I'd present as proof: Dubya. Clueless. Dilettant. And God knows what else.

a) history shows us, or me at least, that "Christian" rulers tend to either fuck up Christian values, or discriminate against denominations other than their own.
b) Sorry, I wasn't assuming that they "need" a war president. Maybe America could go a decade without going to war.


Interestingly, why would a Jew be acceptable? A Muslim? All three worship the same God.

I got inspired by Eut's bitching about Christianity in the US, to ask whether you lot would vote for an atheist president if there was a Christian alternative.

For the purposes of this poll, please assume that you agree or disagree equally with both the Christian & atheist candidate & that you have to vote for one of the two.

EDIT: Oki.. Time to clarify it seems.

1. This is a hypothetical scenario.
2. The sole grounds for picking either candidate is the candidate's Christian beliefs or lack there of.
3. If this is of no significance for you in any way, do feel free not to vote.
4. Damn.. I can't edit in an option so you lot can vote for something that isn't related to the poll. Sorry. I'll start a spam-thread for you if you want.
5. Read 1. again.
6. Read 2. again.

All other things being equal, I will always choose to be led by individuals who are not superstitious. It terrifies me to no end that superstitiousness is viewed as a QUALIFICATION for public office in my country. That's like saying that you feel a candidate is more qualified to hold office because he believes in leprechauns. Leprechaun-belief shouldn't automatically disqualify anybody, but if you think it's actually going to help that person be a good leader...well, you'd better damn well be a leprechaun, or else you're as crazy as they are.

a) history shows us, or me at least, that "Christian" rulers tend to either fuck up Christian values, or discriminate against denominations other than their own.
b) Sorry, I wasn't assuming that they "need" a war president. Maybe America could go a decade without going to war.


Interestingly, why would a Jew be acceptable? A Muslim? All three worship the same God.


As I see it islam is blasphemy, plain and simple.
Which precludes pretty much possibility of me working side-by-side with muslims.
I'd rather cooperate with Hindus and Buddhists.
( I have to, they run into the family anyway. )

BTW: can you prove that the guys hunting a snark are actually hunting the same snark?
This whole asumption of 'abrahamic' strikes me as a load of bulldust.
You may believe it, but I don't.

b) I'm not inclined to consider a non-war president as realistic.
What was the last one - Warren Harding?