NationStates Jolt Archive

While skipping about the internet I found this article from 04 which takes an interesting view of Islamic radicals;

http://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion/editorials/2004-11-16-peters-edit_x.htm

You don't need to understand Arabic to get the message of those videotaped beheadings, with their rituals and liturgy. The sermon precedes the sacrifice. Then the human calf, shivering with terror, has his throat slit by the "priest."

At first blush it seems a bit radical to consider it any reflection on more conventional Muslims, but then I considered this;

http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewForeignBureaus.asp?Page=\ForeignBureaus\archive\200507\FOR20050715b.html
The percentage of those who said they had "a lot/some" confidence in the al-Qaeda terrorist leader were: Jordan 60 percent, Pakistan 51, Indonesia 35, Morocco 26, Turkey 7 and Lebanon 2.

Now - we know that Bin Ladin is connected to terrorism - including the video-taped human sacrifices in Iraq. We also know that in a country like Jordan and even Pakistan - over 50% of the people believe that human sacrifice (killing people to 'glorify' their deity) is acceptable and good.

In no other nation or religion of scale will you find anything resembling a 50% approval of human sacrifice! Yet there are many people who do not consider this to be a problem with the Muslim or Arab community. That somehow human sacrifice is the fault of the victim. That Arabs and Muslims are justified in pursuing a policy of human sacrifice.

A reasonable argument could be made against civilian deaths as a part of war resulting from collateral or even intentional damage. However - human deaths as a part of religious philosophy is simply human sacrifice - indefensible, barbaric and intolerable. No religion which endorses or even tolerates this should be given any merit among civilized people. The question is a two part one - Will the Muslim faith in those places accept their role as a civilized faith or embrace their role as murderers? And - will the Muslims in places more civilized allow their faith to be tarnished with the blood of the human sacrifices done in a parody of their peaceful religion?

The data from the second poll listed shows some progress - yet I find it incredulous that support for the practice of human sacrafice and those who perform it is even a question for any population of substantial number...

This is pathetic, even from you.

What about your state-sponsored, secular 'human sacrifice' that so many of your countrymen ardently support? No civilisation that supports such barbarity should be tolerated.

and Jews use Christian blood in their religious services.:mad:

racist bullshit.

How is the killing of civilians to inact political change human sacrifice by one side, but not by the other?

Our blind dedication to the strength and distribution of liberal democracy rivals any dedication these people have to theocracy.

Our blind dedication to the strength and distribution of liberal democracy rivals any dedication these people have to theocracy.

Since when have we had a "blind dedication to the strength and distribution of liberal democracy"? For that matter, since when have we had any kind of "dedication to the strength and distribution of liberal democracy"?

We also know that in a country like Jordan and even Pakistan - over 50% of the people believe that human sacrifice (killing people to 'glorify' their deity) is acceptable and good.

I mean, honestly. :rolleyes:

This is pathetic, even from you.

What about your state-sponsored, secular 'human sacrifice' that so many of your countrymen ardently support? No civilisation that supports such barbarity should be tolerated.

I did make mention that this is a worthy point to argue - however the point is - the beheadings were ritualistic and religious inspored. As the victim was killed the perpetrators shouted 'God is Great" ("Allah hu Akbar") and often covered themselves with the blood of the victim. THAT is human sacrafice. There is no moral equivalence you can draw to any casualties of war - intentional or accidental.

How is the killing of civilians to inact political change human sacrifice by one side, but not by the other?

Our blind dedication to the strength and distribution of liberal democracy rivals any dedication these people have to theocracy.


See my prior post - I can't beleive you would consiedr that a 'political' act. I certainly hope I never have to play your 'politics'.

Since when have we had a "blind dedication to the strength and distribution of liberal democracy"? For that matter, since when have we had any kind of "dedication to the strength and distribution of liberal democracy"?
In case you've been sleeping over the past five or six decades, the US has been exporting it's particular brand of liberalism quite forcibly, resulting in far more deaths than any Islamic terrorist. Whatever the philosophy, religious or secular, pushing your agenda over the lives of humans is abhorent.

I mean, honestly. :rolleyes:

Is it that difficult for you to connect the dots??

Here;

Two...
You don't need to understand Arabic to get the message of those videotaped beheadings, with their rituals and liturgy.

Plust two...
The percentage of those who said they had "a lot/some" confidence in the al-Qaeda terrorist leader were: Jordan 60 percent, Pakistan 51

Is four.
Now - we know that Bin Ladin is connected to terrorism - including the video-taped human sacrifices in Iraq. We also know that in a country like Jordan and even Pakistan - over 50% of the people believe that human sacrifice (killing people to 'glorify' their deity) is acceptable and good.

Let me know if the big words are too tough for you...

I did make mention that this is a worthy point to argue - however the point is - the beheadings were ritualistic and religious inspored. As the victim was killed the perpetrators shouted 'God is Great" ("Allah hu Akbar") and often covered themselves with the blood of the victim. THAT is human sacrafice. There is no moral equivalence you can draw to any casualties of war - intentional or accidental.
I was referring to the death penalty, executions which are also highly ritualistic, especially to someone outside this culture looking in.

In case you've been sleeping over the past five or six decades, the US has been exporting it's particular brand of liberalism quite forcibly, resulting in far more deaths than any Islamic terrorist.

Yes, Pinochet, Somoza, Duvalier, etc. were all known for their liberal democratic practices.

I'd like to be the first to point out the very...relevant fact, that the Original Poster....................















..........Is a Floridiain.

Yes, Pinochet, Somoza, Duvalier, etc. were all known for their liberal democratic practices.
I like Pinochet.

and Jews use Christian blood in their religious services.:mad:

racist bullshit.
Now there's a worthy addition to the conversation. I bet you use that alot - calling a person a racist is a sure way to get them to shut up without having to give away that you have completely failed to engace anything resembling intellect...

Since when have we had a "blind dedication to the strength and distribution of liberal democracy"? For that matter, since when have we had any kind of "dedication to the strength and distribution of liberal democracy"?

Perhaps you missed the massive cultural imperialism that the US took on in the 20th and 21st Centuries?

We fought the Cold War, Korean War, Vietnam War, and our most current war in the name of democracy and liberalism.

Let me know if the big words are too tough for you...
Ah yes, I wondered when the typical B0zzy arrogance was going to come shining through. Doubtless this beligerence will become more pronounced the more untenable your position becomes.

Human Sacrifice? You must be kidding.

Then what would you say about the worship of Baal?

I was referring to the death penalty, executions which are also highly ritualistic, especially to someone outside this culture looking in.
Punishment for infringing the laws of a society is not ritualistic, even if it would seem so. It cannot be equated to sacrifice by any stretch of imagination...unless you say sacrifice for the greater good of the society...though that is not a religion per se.

Perhaps you missed the massive cultural imperialism that the US took on in the 20th and 21st Centuries?

We fought the Cold War, Korean War, Vietnam War, and our most current war in the name of democracy and liberalism.
Maybe it's only bad if it's done in the name of religion?

Perhaps you missed the massive cultural imperialism that the US took on in the 20th and 21st Centuries?

We fought the Cold War, Korean War, Vietnam War, and our most current war in the name of democracy and liberalism.
And WW I...Wilson had an ideological war going against Austria...the foolish hypocrite.

In case you've been sleeping over the past five or six decades, the US has been exporting it's particular brand of liberalism quite forcibly, resulting in far more deaths than any Islamic terrorist. Whatever the philosophy, religious or secular, pushing your agenda over the lives of humans is abhorent.


Liberalism?? Huh??? I would suggest - if anything - it has been their fundamentalism.

In either case - I haven't seen a single video of an American decapitating anyone while shouting "Jesus Saves!" - and had they - I don't think you'd find any European nations providing a 50-60% rate of support.

Is it that difficult for you to connect the dots??

:rolleyes:


Two...
You don't need to understand Arabic to get the message of those videotaped beheadings, with their rituals and liturgy.
Thats an opinion. Not fact. I don't agree with it.

Plust two...
The percentage of those who said they had "a lot/some" confidence in the al-Qaeda terrorist leader were: Jordan 60 percent, Pakistan 51
Confidence to do what? Attack the West? Spread Islam? Have everyone wear long beards? Prove one can live in a cave in this day and age?


Now - we know that Bin Ladin is connected to terrorism - including the video-taped human sacrifices in Iraq. We also know that in a country like Jordan and even Pakistan - over 50% of the people believe that human sacrifice (killing people to 'glorify' their deity) is acceptable and good.
We also know Bin Laden lives in a cave. Ergo, using your logic, one in two love living in caves.

We fought the Cold War, Korean War, Vietnam War, and our most current war in the name of democracy and liberalism.

Fair enough. Let me refine my question:

For that matter, since when have we had any kind of "dedication to the strength and distribution of liberal democracy," outside of official propaganda?

Yes, Pinochet, Somoza, Duvalier, etc. were all known for their liberal democratic practices.
Liberal democracies, exported by the US, were nothing but window dressing for the real goal...stable economies, which dictatorships provide.

Liberal economies, for sure. Democracy was not considered worthy of the Latin Americans, nonetheless, a farce of democracy was almost always maintained.

Now there's a worthy addition to the conversation. I bet you use that alot - calling a person a racist is a sure way to get them to shut up without having to give away that you have completely failed to engace anything resembling intellect...
Ok, if you say so. Racist. Now shut up, already.

After all, I don't want anyone to know how I've failed to 'engace' (whatever that means) anything 'resembling' (properly spelled 'ressembling', by the way) intellect.

But more than anything, I'll do whatever you want just to get you to shut up.

Yes, Pinochet, Somoza, Duvalier, etc. were all known for their liberal democratic practices.

Pinochet gained power with our support because of his neoliberal policies.

How about Cuba, Panama, Guatamala, and Venezuela? Tell me they don't feel the strain of our cultural imperalism.

I like Pinochet.
Tell that to my husband's uncle who was kidnapped, tortured, murdered, and dumped into the sea for the crime of being a University student.

Jackass.

I was referring to the death penalty, executions which are also highly ritualistic, especially to someone outside this culture looking in.

I would agree with you - the death penalty is pointless and SHOULD be abolished. Do you really want the same government which can't even balance their checkbook to decide matters of life and death? There ain't no fixing it when fuck those up!

Ok, if you say so. Racist. Now shut up, already.

If you wanna be accurate, call him an islamophobe...throwing around the word racist all the time kind of renders itself idiotic.

Ok, if you say so. Racist. Now shut up, already.

After all, I don't want anyone to know how I've failed to 'engace' (whatever that means) anything 'resembling' (properly spelled 'ressembling', by the way) intellect.

But more than anything, I'll do whatever you want just to get you to shut up.
Thats not very open minded of you, Mr. Epitome of Leftism.

See my prior post - I can't beleive you would consiedr that a 'political' act. I certainly hope I never have to play your 'politics'.

Fantastic argument.

Liberal democracies, exported by the US, were nothing but window dressing for the real goal...stable economies, which dictatorships provide.

Liberal economies, for sure. Democracy was not considered worthy of the Latin Americans, nonetheless, a farce of democracy was almost always maintained.

Yes, precisely. I was objecting to the notion that because our leaders say that we are slaughtering people for liberal democracy, it follows that we are in fact slaughtering people for liberal democracy.

Tell that to my husband's uncle who was kidnapped, tortured, murdered, and dumped into the sea for the crime of being a University student.

Jackass.
I am so tired of this vindictive little thug.

I am so tired of this vindictive little thug.
Wanna suppress his opinion, eh, Nazi boy?

...

Thats not very open minded of you, Mr. Epitome of Leftism.
When spoken to, sonny. When spoken to.

Now go find some blind man to poke sticks at, will you?

Punishment for infringing the laws of a society is not ritualistic, even if it would seem so. It cannot be equated to sacrifice by any stretch of imagination...unless you say sacrifice for the greater good of the society...though that is not a religion per se.
So it's not in a religious context? That invalidates it as human sacrifice? These murdered 'sacrifices' infringed upon the cultural laws of their murderers...does that justify their deaths?

In my mind, the beheadings are criminal acts...not ritualistic sacrifice as an inherent part of the Islamic faith. Murders committed by the state, for whatever reason, are not human sacrifice. Neither of these acts can be equated to sacrifice.

Both are murders, plain and simple.

Wanna suppress his opinion, eh, Nazi boy?

...
Wanna suppress your food tube. In a big way.

Tell that to my husband's uncle who was kidnapped, tortured, murdered, and dumped into the sea for the crime of being a University student.

Jackass.

*Faces South*
"I like Pinochet."

Newsflash, alot of people like Pinochet, in the Wiki article it states that Chile is split 50/50 half hating him, half loving him. Reagan and Thatcher also supported him, by the way.

Liberal democracies, exported by the US, were nothing but window dressing for the real goal...stable economies, which dictatorships provide.

Liberal economies, for sure. Democracy was not considered worthy of the Latin Americans, nonetheless, a farce of democracy was almost always maintained.
Liberal economies (provided they are free of monopolies...otherwise they do not deserve the name) eventually erode state control over the citizenry. It's easier to start with one and then progressively move to a liberal democracy than the opposite.

Fair enough. Let me refine my question:

For that matter, since when have we had any kind of "dedication to the strength and distribution of liberal democracy," outside of official propaganda?

Everyone of our Presidents of the past century have felt that democracies are the best way to bring about a stable and happy country.

Only with the last rash of believers, the neocons, has that idea been proven to be dangerously untrue.

Ah yes, I wondered when the typical B0zzy arrogance was going to come shining through. Doubtless this beligerence will become more pronounced the more untenable your position becomes.

Just to help you out - I think you meant belligerence NOUN: A hostile or warlike attitude, nature, or inclination;

Need help with any more big words?

(hehe - take it in the fun it was meant - I couldn't help myself)

Both are murders, plain and simple.
If, in the mind of the perpetrators, they are fulfilling a religious purpose, then yes, it is sacrifice. If not, it is murder.

*Faces South*
"I like Pinochet."

Newsflash, alot of people like Pinochet, in the Wiki article it states that Chile is split 50/50 half hating him, half loving him. Reagan and Thatcher also supported him, by the way.
Oh well shit. That justifies liking a mass murdering, corrupt bastard then.

Wanna suppress your food tube. In a big way.
Nice to see your "liberal" predilections surfacing. :)

Liberalism?? Huh??? I would suggest - if anything - it has been their fundamentalism. The US brand of liberalism is anything but liberal.

In either case - I haven't seen a single video of an American decapitating anyone while shouting "Jesus Saves!" - and had they - I don't think you'd find any European nations providing a 50-60% rate of support.
You see what you want, B0zzy. You ignore the crimes against other human beings, pepretrated by those of your own culture, if you agree with their motivation. You rationalise away these crimes and consider them justified. In that way, you are exactly like those professing support for these murders.

Pinochet gained power with our support because of his neoliberal policies.

Indeed. "Neoliberalism" is not equivalent to "liberal democracy."

How about Cuba, Panama, Guatamala, and Venezuela? Tell me they don't feel the strain of our cultural imperalism.

Why stop with them? Pretty much all of Latin America, most of the Middle East, Indochina, Central Asia... they have all felt our imperialism, and "liberal democracy" is rarely and only coincidentally a result (and pretty much never a motive.)

I am so tired of this vindictive little thug.
Waaaah.....what exactly do you plan on doing about it? I'm presenting my opinions...this is a political forum...and its only natural that you are going to find opinions you disagree with. I disagree with your views on transgenderd people being perfectly acceptable...but thats just something I'm going to have to live with.

See, having an open mind can be fun.

Need help with any more big words?

(hehe - take it in the fun it was meant - I couldn't help myself)
*glances at thread title*

How ironic.

We also know Bin Laden lives in a cave. Ergo, using your logic, one in two love living in caves.
Thank you, that is an excellent point.

The conclusions drawn in the OP are tenuous and unsupportable as they stand.

Oh well shit. That justifies liking a mass murdering, corrupt bastard then.
Well, yeah...it does.

Need help with any more big words?

You mean like, 'engage'? Or 'ressembling'?

Prat.

Fair enough. Let me refine my question:

For that matter, since when have we had any kind of "dedication to the strength and distribution of liberal democracy," outside of official propaganda?
What makes you think that the current group of people waging jihad have any sort of real dedication outside of official propaganda? As in all cases of imperialism, political, religious, or cultural, the 'foot soliders' may believe...but those pulling the strings are generally incurable cynics.

I would agree with you - the death penalty is pointless and SHOULD be abolished. Do you really want the same government which can't even balance their checkbook to decide matters of life and death? There ain't no fixing it when fuck those up!
Can your culture be judged by the overwhelming support for this practice then?

:rolleyes:



Thats an opinion. Not fact. I don't agree with it.

Umm - ok. When people take out a victim who is bound and helpless, then chant 'God is Great' while cutting through the persons throat and removing their head. What sort of practice would you consider that? Studying anantomy?


Confidence to do what? Attack the West? Spread Islam? Have everyone wear long beards? Prove one can live in a cave in this day and age?

Confidence to wear tredy and hip mountaiwear - what the fuck did you think they were talking about? I have an inspired idea - read the article and find out! I can't believe you have that much difficulty overcoming your own willful ignorance. The sand must be warm on your ears.

Everyone of our Presidents of the past century have felt that democracies are the best way to bring about a stable and happy country.

Like Nixon, whose government supported the coup that destroyed democracy in Chile?

Or Eisenhower, under whose government the CIA organized the coups that destroyed democracy in Guatemala and Iran?

Or Reagan, under whose government the US supported despotic right-wing terrorist regimes in Central America?

And so on.

Waaaah.....what exactly do you plan on doing about it? I'm presenting my opinions...this is a political forum...and its only natural that you are going to find opinions you disagree with. I disagree with your views on transgenderd people being perfectly acceptable...but thats just something I'm going to have to live with.

See, having an open mind can be fun.
Care to embarass yourself any more tonight?

I give the floor over to the emotionally-needy child running around waving his arms and screaming, "Lookit meeeeee!". He obviously is starved for any sort of attention in his real life, so... go for it, hon.

It's all yours.

Ok, if you say so. Racist. Now shut up, already.

After all, I don't want anyone to know how I've failed to 'engace' (whatever that means) anything 'resembling' (properly spelled 'ressembling', by the way) intellect.

But more than anything, I'll do whatever you want just to get you to shut up.


Really? You'd eat shit and die just for me? (flattered)

Umm - ok. When people take out a victim who is bound and helpless, then chant 'God is Great' while cutting through the persons throat and removing their head. What sort of practice would you consider that? Studying anantomy?
I wouldn't call it religious anyway.


Confidence to wear tredy and hip mountaiwear - what the fuck did you think they were talking about? I have an inspired idea - read the article and find out! I can't believe you have that much difficulty overcoming your own willful ignorance. The sand must be warm on your ears.
I don't know- 'confidence in Bin Laden' is a pretty open ended statement.

Indeed. "Neoliberalism" is not equivalent to "liberal democracy."

It was the capitalism in Pinochet's place. Capitalism is as important as democracy, and is a major component of American Liberalism.

Why stop with them? Pretty much all of Latin America, most of the Middle East, Indochina, Central Asia... they have all felt our imperialism, and "liberal democracy" is rarely and only coincidentally a result (and pretty much never a motive.)

What were our goals in the Middle East and Asia, then?

Obviously, America has pursued economic control Latin America, spreading capitalism over democracy. But that is no less an example of our cultural imperialism.

If you wanna be accurate, call him an islamophobe...throwing around the word racist all the time kind of renders itself idiotic.

ROFLMAO!

Islamophobe - how convenient. Yet another way to completely avoid the issue.

A statement like that deserves one of comparable maturity - hmmm.. I know. I think it starts "Sticks and stones..."

Yes, precisely. I was objecting to the notion that because our leaders say that we are slaughtering people for liberal democracy, it follows that we are in fact slaughtering people for liberal democracy.
I don't believe for a second that duplicity among leaders is a Western plague alone.

Care to embarass yourself any more tonight?


Dissent is futile, eh? :)

I am so tired of this vindictive little thug.
You're not the only one. He thinks he's cute.

Fantastic argument.

Thank you. I value compliments from people as enlightened as you.

What makes you think that the current group of people waging jihad have any sort of real dedication outside of official propaganda? As in all cases of imperialism, political, religious, or cultural, the 'foot soliders' may believe...but those pulling the strings are generally incurable cynics.

Why are we arguing again? That's exactly what I've been trying to say.

Edit: I see what you are saying now... yes, I agree. Osama Bin Laden is no more principled than the gang that controls the US.

Wanna suppress his opinion, eh, Nazi boy?

...
:confused:

ROFLMAO!

Islamophobe - how convenient. Yet another way to completely avoid the issue.

A statement like that deserves one of comparable maturity - hmmm.. I know. I think it starts "Sticks and stones..."
I'm not opposing you neither am I endorsing your view...I am just correcting his idiotic use of the word 'racist'.

:confused:
He knows.

When spoken to, sonny. When spoken to.

Now go find some blind man to poke sticks at, will you?


He can't - you have to take it out of your... oh, nevermind - he says you can keep it.

I don't believe for a second that duplicity among leaders is a Western plague alone.

I don't either. It's a pretty typical characteristic of leaders.

*Faces South*
"I like Pinochet."

Newsflash, alot of people like Pinochet, in the Wiki article it states that Chile is split 50/50 half hating him, half loving him. Reagan and Thatcher also supported him, by the way.
Newsflash...professing love for a dictator that had women raped by dogs, children cut out of their mother's wombs, and countless others tortured, murdered and disappeared...is not cool.

I am so tired of this vindictive little thug.

And I am tired of smug drama queens who continuously play to the fourth wall. Join the discussion or stop posting. Don't perpetuate this pissing contest.

Care to embarass yourself any more tonight?

I give the floor over to the emotionally-needy child running around waving his arms and screaming, "Lookit meeeeee!". He obviously is starved for any sort of attention in his real life, so... go for it, hon.

It's all yours.
*Looks for person you described.....doesnt see him*

*takes the floor in his place*

I like Pinochet because he took over a country ravaged by socialists and fought back. He freed up the market, made the country rich, safeguarded democracy for when the time was right to return it, and because of him, Chile is the best country in South America, to this day.

That is my opinion, I dont care about Sinuhue's brothers sisters unlces former roomates daughter-in-law...that is what I think.

So it's not in a religious context? That invalidates it as human sacrifice? These murdered 'sacrifices' infringed upon the cultural laws of their murderers...does that justify their deaths?

In my mind, the beheadings are criminal acts...not ritualistic sacrifice as an inherent part of the Islamic faith. Murders committed by the state, for whatever reason, are not human sacrifice. Neither of these acts can be equated to sacrifice.

Both are murders, plain and simple.

That is a thoughtful response and worth contribution to the thread. Thank you.

I would agree that the beheadings should be illegal - were a cult anywhere else in the world to perform such things I think it would be. However - you mention that you don't consider it a part of the Islamic faith. Please explain to me what you think makes it seperate from the Islamic faith considering the considerable Islamic rhetoric used during these acts and the considerable support from the Islamic public these groups enjoy...

You're not the only one. He thinks he's cute.
And what really floors me is when a 'respectable' poster like Peechland goes out of her way to defend his brand of thuggery in Moderation with the hilariously inappropriate line that "he's really a nice guy, honestly".

For shame, Peechland - I hope you're reading this thread (and every other thread TAI 'contributes' to).

Liberal economies (provided they are free of monopolies...otherwise they do not deserve the name) eventually erode state control over the citizenry. It's easier to start with one and then progressively move to a liberal democracy than the opposite.
Wow...it sounds strangely like the theory of a dictatorship of the proletariat that is supposed to melt away...

Nice fantasies.

A key component of human sacrifice is that the life being offered is being offered in return for some kind of intervention. Better harvest, more rain, plentiful game, that kind of stuff. From the first article, it sounds like these killings are simply being done in the name of Allah. Without some kind of translation of whatever the terrorists were chanting when they kill their victims, you can't call it sacrifice until you hear them calling for something in return for the life given. It seems more like execution done in the name of their god, a kind of killing hardly limited to Islam.

(hehe - take it in the fun it was meant - I couldn't help myself)
Says the man who spelled it Sacrafice:D

If, in the mind of the perpetrators, they are fulfilling a religious purpose, then yes, it is sacrifice. If not, it is murder.
What a fine distinction. So if you kill someone, but do it in the name of god, you are guilty of sacrificing, but not murdering a human? Are there different jail times for that?

It was the capitalism in Pinochet's place. Capitalism is as important as democracy, and is a major component of American Liberalism.

I don't think they were interested in spreading liberalism, though; some of the people the US overthrew, like Arbenz in Guatemala and Mossadegh in Iran, were hardly Communists and didn't really threaten any tenet of US liberalism.

What they threatened was US dominance, so they were removed.

What were our goals in the Middle East and Asia, then?

In Central Asia it was mostly to contain the Soviets (and today it is to contain China and Russia), and in doing so we supported plenty of viciously illiberal people, even against relatively progressive forces who happened to be not as anti-Soviet as our preferred factions were.

In the Middle East it was mostly access to the oil, as it is today, and, analogously, we supported plenty of illiberal people to achieve that objective - even against relatively liberal and popular forces.

Obviously, America has pursued economic control Latin America, spreading capitalism over democracy. But that is no less an example of our cultural imperialism.

I don't know if I'd call it "cultural imperialism," but I haven't been objecting to the notion that the US has been engaged in imperialism.

See, having an open mind can be fun.
My sig is meant for you.

You see what you want, B0zzy. You ignore the crimes against other human beings, pepretrated by those of your own culture, if you agree with their motivation. You rationalise away these crimes and consider them justified. In that way, you are exactly like those professing support for these murders.
Maybe so - but this isn't a thread about moral relativism or moral equivalency - is it.

What a fine distinction. So if you kill someone, but do it in the name of god, you are guilty of sacrificing, but not murdering a human? Are there different jail times for that?
Hardly. But the definition properly used would be sacrifice. Murder is implicit in the word...

Wow...it sounds strangely like the theory of a dictatorship of the proletariat that is supposed to melt away...

Nice fantasies.
It killed ancien regime France...so yeah, not theory...

Thank you, that is an excellent point.

The conclusions drawn in the OP are tenuous and unsupportable as they stand.

You fail to demonstrate anything even remotely close. I don't see the point of congratulating one another on such failure.

Newsflash...professing love for a dictator that had women raped by dogs, children cut out of their mother's wombs, and countless others tortured, murdered and disappeared...is not cool.
Meh....every South American country has its problems, its revolutions and its dictators and terrible governments....Chile just happend to produce good out of it.
Like I said:
"I like Pinochet because he took over a country ravaged by socialists and fought back. He freed up the market, made the country rich, safeguarded democracy for when the time was right to return it, and because of him, Chile is the best country in South America, to this day."

Hardly. But the definition properly used would be sacrifice. Murder is implicit in the word...
If that's what you really think, then you don't understand the nature of sacrifice. You've been addled by doctrine.

If that's what you really think, then you don't understand the nature of sacrifice. You've been addled by doctrine.
Then what, pray tell, is the nature of sacrifice?

You mean like, 'engage'? Or 'ressembling'?

Prat.


Hehe - it is so fun and easy to frustrate the simple minded.

Dissent is futile, eh? :)
You're not usually such an ass. What gives?

Meh....every South American country has its problems, its revolutions and its dictators and terrible governments....Chile just happend to produce good out of it.
Like I said:
"I like Pinochet because he took over a country ravaged by socialists and fought back. He freed up the market, made the country rich, safeguarded democracy for when the time was right to return it, and because of him, Chile is the best country in South America, to this day."
So you have no moral or ethical dilemmnas building "paradise" on the bones of innocents?

I am so unsurprised.

You're not usually such an ass. What gives?
I'm just teasing him about his view on free speech.

Then what, pray tell, is the nature of sacrifice?

Its a bargain struck between the sacrificer and the god who recieves the sacrfice. A life in exchange for divine intervention.

Cutting off someone's head while saying "Allah is great" doesn't qualify.

You're not usually such an ass. What gives?
He's angry with me because I don't believe in allowing the propogation of hate speech through convenient channels.

Old business.

Its a bargain struck between the sacrificer and the god who recieves the sacrfice. A life in exchange for divine intervention.

Cutting off someone's head while saying "Allah is great" doesn't qualify.
Notice, however, that I did qualify it as having a religious purpose...I never said that that alone renders it a sacrifice.

And what really floors me is when a 'respectable' poster like Peechland goes out of her way to defend his brand of thuggery in Moderation with the hilariously inappropriate line that "he's really a nice guy, honestly".

For shame, Peechland - I hope you're reading this thread (and every other thread TAI 'contributes' to).
Maybe because I AM:eek: a nice guy, except to a few people on this website...people who call me a "vindictive little thug" aka YOU..being one of them.

Peechland is a nice woman, who I have no problems with whatsoever, and I have no idea why you are bringing her, or her defense of me weeks ago, into this thread.

Get over it, your like a middle school girl with a crush.

Its a bargain struck between the sacrificer and the god who recieves the sacrfice. A life in exchange for divine intervention.

Cutting off someone's head while saying "Allah is great" doesn't qualify.
Sane Outcasts is much closer to it than EM could ever hope to be.

Sane Outcasts is much closer to it than EM could ever hope to be.
Your powers of interpretation must really be lacking then.

That is a thoughtful response and worth contribution to the thread. Thank you.

I would agree that the beheadings should be illegal - were a cult anywhere else in the world to perform such things I think it would be. However - you mention that you don't consider it a part of the Islamic faith. Please explain to me what you think makes it seperate from the Islamic faith considering the considerable Islamic rhetoric used during these acts and the considerable support from the Islamic public these groups enjoy...
They aren't practised in a mosque.

Real religious sacrifices are not only sanctioned by the culture they are practiced in, (or were practiced in), but are solemn occasions with purpose. They are not carried out by fanatics in hiding.

So you have no moral or ethical dilemmnas building "paradise" on the bones of innocents?

I am so unsurprised.
Opposed to when people were dying because they had no money to buy food because the money was worth as much as your life because the economy was in ruins due to the Socialists?

No, I dont have a problem with someone saving his country, even if it means killing the socialists who want to bring it back down to the level it was. After all, "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." Take that as you will.

Maybe because I AM:eek: a nice guy, except to a few people on this website...people who call me a "vindictive little thug" aka YOU..being one of them.

Peechland is a nice woman, who I have no problems with whatsoever, and I have no idea why you are bringing her, or her defense of me weeks ago, into this thread.

Get over it, your like a middle school girl with a crush.
How does stalking posters from thread to thread qualify you as anything other than a sadistic boor with too much time on his hands?

How 'nice' is it to toss away the lives of innocents in favour of 'opening markets' in your fab-o version of Chile?

You aren't 'nice' at all, sir. And I call you 'sir' because of the nature of your genitals, nothing else...

Your powers of interpretation must really be lacking then.
Or perhaps it's your powers of persuasion that are at an ebb.

Maybe so - but this isn't a thread about moral relativism or moral equivalency - is it.
Actually, I think that's exactly what it is.

Or perhaps it's your powers of persuasion that are at an ebb.
Wow, then how did you fail to realise I was arguing that the death penalty is not a form of sacrifice...?

Meh....every South American country has its problems, its revolutions and its dictators and terrible governments....Chile just happend to produce good out of it.
Like I said:
"I like Pinochet because he took over a country ravaged by socialists and fought back. He freed up the market, made the country rich, safeguarded democracy for when the time was right to return it, and because of him, Chile is the best country in South America, to this day."
Save it for another thread where you can cut and paste other people's opinions for 'shock value'.

Wow, then how did you fail to realise I was arguing that the death penalty is not a form of sacrifice...?
Wow, maybe it's due to the reason I just wrote about.

Opposed to when people were dying because they had no money to buy food because the money was worth as much as your life because the economy was in ruins due to the Socialists?

No, I dont have a problem with someone saving his country, even if it means killing the socialists who want to bring it back down to the level it was. After all, "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." Take that as you will.

Were you alive in Chile during his rule?

Because Sinuhue's husband's uncle was.

Who do you think has better grounds for an opinion here, you or her?

How does stalking posters from thread to thread qualify you as anything other than a sadistic boor with too much time on his hands?

How 'nice' is it to toss away the lives of innocents in favour of 'opening markets' in your fab-o version of Chile?

You aren't 'nice' at all, sir. And I call you 'sir' because of the nature of your genitals, nothing else...
Uh, I dont stalk posters.

You keep repeating the fact that Pinochet killed people, yet you are denying to see the reasons WHY he killed people to do what he did that I support.

I am nice, just, like I said before, not to you.

And dont talk about my genitals....it makes me feel uncomfterable when it comes from somebody who is mentally unsure about "its" own.

Wow, maybe it's due to the reason I just wrote about.
Okay, then your argument only but strengthens mine.

Okay, then your argument only but strengthens mine.
A few minutes with you, and it's like a walk in the park. Everywhere-a-twitter.

Can your culture be judged by the overwhelming support for this practice then?
Ahh! A great point! Better than the ones you were self congratulating each other on earlier. THAT is the sort of discourse I wish was more common here.

The most obvious point is that capital punishment is far more common in Muslim societies than anywhere else in the world. Also of note is that the justice system is far less thorough is establishing guilt.

The second point is - What culture would you be reflecting on regarding capital punishment? Muslim? White? Texan? Califorinan? Japanese? South American? Chinese?

Finally - you used the term 'culture' - the topic in this thread is religion. There is a considerable difference between human sacrafice and a death penalty. There is no moral equivalence which can be drawn. There is no debate about them both being immoral IMHO - but that is about where the similarity differs. One involves punishing people found guilty of breaking pre-defined laws. The other is about killing people simply to satisfy the demands of an imaginary friend.

Opposed to when people were dying because they had no money to buy food because the money was worth as much as your life because the economy was in ruins due to the Socialists?

No, I dont have a problem with someone saving his country, even if it means killing the socialists who want to bring it back down to the level it was. After all, "The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants." Take that as you will.
Save the hijacking. Start another thread if you really want to discuss it.

Were you alive in Chile during his rule?

Because Sinuhue's husband's uncle was.

Who do you think has better grounds for an opinion here, you or her?
When has it EVER mattered what grounds one has to voice an opinion.

No matter what side of the political spectrum we are on, I think we can both agree that everybody, regardless of their grounds to do so, is allowed to support an opinion.

Save the hijacking. Start another thread if you really want to discuss it.

Tell that to Dobbs and yourself..as you were the ones who pressed me for a reply/explanation.

Were you alive in Chile during his rule?

Because Sinuhue's husband's uncle was.

Who do you think has better grounds for an opinion here, you or her?
Actually, so was my husband, though he was young.

My inlaws all lived through that regime. Atlantian Islands has the luxury of glorifying something he does not in the least bit understand.[/hijack]

A few minutes with you, and it's like a walk in the park. Everywhere-a-twitter.
Read my original argument, read your argument. You will realise that you essentially bolstered mine. So, if you have some sort of vendetta you'd like to go on with, save it for later.

And dont talk about my genitals....it makes me feel uncomfterable when it comes from somebody who is mentally unsure about "its" own.
Does it now? Does it make your lil' testes get aaaaaall shrivelly to know I've got titties and legs that won't quit, with an inch-long pecker hiding like a monster in my pants?

Awww. The poor lil' hawk. Can't handle what's between a dove's legs. There, there, now...

When has it EVER mattered what grounds one has to voice an opinion.

No matter what side of the political spectrum we are on, I think we can both agree that everybody, regardless of their grounds to do so, is allowed to support an opinion.

When has it ever mattered to have first hand experience of something versus something you fantasised about from a book.....

Please don't tell me that's what you're asking?

I wouldn't call it religious anyway.

Really? Shouting 'God is Great' in front of a banner proclaiming the same is not religious to you?


I don't know- 'confidence in Bin Laden' is a pretty open ended statement.

It was not so open ended in the article - you should really try reading it. The hyperlink really does work.

Actually, so was my husband, though he was young.

My inlaws all lived through that regime. Atlantian Islands has the luxury of glorifying something he does not in the least bit understand.[/hijack]

My sympathies *bows*

[/hijack]

Were you alive in Chile during his rule?

Because Sinuhue's husband's uncle was.

Who do you think has better grounds for an opinion here, you or her?
LOL, Sinuhue has an opinion about everything, and I know that she regularly ignores the opinions of those who might seem better qualified in many areas. That said, her husband's uncle could easily have had a biased outlook, since Sinuhue does in most topics. So, I'll take historical fact over personal opinion for 500, Alex.

I'm not opposing you neither am I endorsing your view...I am just correcting his idiotic use of the word 'racist'.

Lableing me an Islamophobe is not constructive nor is it accurate. Don't kid yourself.

My apologies for hijacking. My sympathies for your in-laws, Sin.

Lableing me an Islamophobe is not constructive nor is it accurate. Don't kid yourself.
I am not even labelling you...learn to detect support from whence it originates.

Does it now? Does it make your lil' testes get aaaaaall shrivelly to know I've got titties and legs that won't quit, with an inch-long pecker hiding like a monster in my pants?

Awww. The poor lil' hawk. Can't handle what's between a dove's legs. There, there, now...
pfffft...hahaha...you refer to yourself as "dove":D

LOL, Sinuhue has an opinion about everything, and I know that she regularly ignores the opinions of those who might seem better qualified in many areas. That said, her husband's uncle could easily have had a biased outlook, since Sinuhue does in most topics. So, I'll take historical fact over personal opinion for 500, Alex.
Oh look, the little troll.

Yes, one generally has a biased outlook about being tortured and murdered.

Historical fact backs up the death count, and the number of tortured, and the methods of torture. Do a little research beyond grand theories of 'salvation'.

Says the man who spelled it Sacrafice:D


hehe - that was why I just coudn't help myself. You know me well enough to know I'm no grammar-nazi. I was entertained by my own irony.

I am not even labelling you...learn to detect support from whence it originates.
I think you're falling down on the job of effective communications, EM. Looks like I'm not the only one who isn't "getting it". Maybe the problem doesn't lie with the people reading what you're saying.

What a fine distinction. So if you kill someone, but do it in the name of god, you are guilty of sacrificing, but not murdering a human? Are there different jail times for that?


Probably not - but I bet there is a difference in the legitimacy of the religion...

Actually, so was my husband, though he was young.

My inlaws all lived through that regime. Atlantian Islands has the luxury of glorifying something he does not in the least bit understand.[/hijack]

I am not "glorrifying" it...like I said..every South American country had terrible problems with its governments...Chile just happend to have good come out of it.

I think you're falling down on the job of effective communications, EM. Looks like I'm not the only one who isn't "getting it". Maybe the problem doesn't lie with the people reading what you're saying.
You labelled him as a 'racist' on the basis of certain views you perceive him to hold against Muslims. I corrected you. If anything, it is definitely not I who is in the wrong here.

pfffft...hahaha...you refer to yourself as "dove":D
Skin softer than a dove's downfeathers, sweetikins.

Probably not - but I bet there is a difference in the legitimacy of the religion...
You'll have to elaborate.

When has it ever mattered to have first hand experience of something versus something you fantasised about from a book.....

Please don't tell me that's what you're asking?

Hardly first hand..these are people she knows..not her.

I am not "glorrifying" it...like I said..every South American country had terrible problems with its governments...Chile just happend to have good come out of it.
Again, it's something I'd be willing to discuss with at more length elsewhere (checks clock) and at a different time.

You labelled him as a 'racist' on the basis of certain views you perceive him to hold against Muslims. I corrected you. If anything, it is definitely not I who is in the wrong here.
No, I called him a "racist" because he'd as much as promised to shut up if called that in a previous post. God, are you so literal-minded that you completely missed the point of a throwaway gag like that?

How young are you, anyway?

Its a bargain struck between the sacrificer and the god who recieves the sacrfice. A life in exchange for divine intervention.

Cutting off someone's head while saying "Allah is great" doesn't qualify.

Why not? Expand on your theory and justify your assumptions. As I recall there is a considerable bargain for Muslims - something to do with the number 72... not to mention their worldly aspirations which they feel Allah has commanded them to achieve with bloodshed.

Oh look, the little troll.

Yes, one generally has a biased outlook about being tortured and murdered.

Historical fact backs up the death count, and the number of tortured, and the methods of torture. Do a little research beyond grand theories of 'salvation'.
Historical fact also backs up the fact that he saved the country, and made it South Americans best, most stable, and most free market country today.

LOL, Sinuhue has an opinion about everything, and I know that she regularly ignores the opinions of those who might seem better qualified in many areas. That said, her husband's uncle could easily have had a biased outlook, since Sinuhue does in most topics. So, I'll take historical fact over personal opinion for 500, Alex.

Agreed 100%, good to have you in the thread, buddy.:)

Oh look, the little troll.

Yes, one generally has a biased outlook about being tortured and murdered.

Historical fact backs up the death count, and the number of tortured, and the methods of torture. Do a little research beyond grand theories of 'salvation'.
Actually, I never stated what my opinions were on this subject, just that I don't take your word as being worth much. And I'm not normally a troll, you just bring it out. :)

No, I called him a "racist" because he'd as much as promised to shut up if called that in a previous post. God, are you so literal-minded that you completely missed the point of a throwaway gag like that?

How young are you, anyway?
It wouldn't be the first time you've thrown around that word, missy...or is that mister? :)

Hardly first hand..these are people she knows..not her.
I'm going to take someone who lived through it (i.e her husband and by extension her) over someone who has a fetish for anything that's a Reagan wet dream. [end point, end of hijack]

Agreed 100%, good to have you in the thread, buddy.:)


Aww...
:fluffle:

They aren't practised in a mosque.
You really don'tknow that. Regardless - what does location have to do with it?

Real religious sacrifices are not only sanctioned by the culture they are practiced in, (or were practiced in), but are solemn occasions with purpose. They are not carried out by fanatics in hiding.
Not really. In some, yes, but in many it was not.

Skin softer than a dove's downfeathers, sweetikins.
Good to know, I'll pass that info on if I know anyone whos into "its" with mental disorders, boobs and inch long dicks.;)

I'm going to take someone who lived through it (i.e her husband and by extension her) over someone who has a fetish for anything that's a Reagan wet dream. [end point, end of hijack]
LOL, Sinuhue claims first hand experience in every argument she has ever had. Apparently she's sort of like God, everywhere at once.

Good to know, I'll pass that info on if I know anyone whos into "its" with mental disorders, boobs and inch long dicks.;)
Watch it. You're treading on thin ice with that one.

I'm going to take someone who lived through it (i.e her husband and by extension her) over someone who has a fetish for anything that's a Reagan wet dream. [end point, end of hijack]
Which goes back to my original point of everyones allowed to have their opinion.

Actually, I never stated what my opinions were on this subject, just that I don't take your word as being worth much. And I'm not normally a troll, you just bring it out. :)
I share this sentiment towards you as well.

LOL, Sinuhue claims first hand experience in every argument she has ever had. Apparently she's sort of like God, everywhere at once.
You haven't read every argument I've had.

And if you have, you know you're full of it.

I have extensive experience with Latin America.

You can't claim the same.

You'll have to elaborate.


Ummm - a religion which endorses or tolerates human sacrifice is not legitimate. You need that elaborated?

You haven't read every argument I've had.

And if you have, you know you're full of it.

I have extensive experience with Latin America.

You can't claim the same.


I like tacos - does that count for anything? :)

It was the capitalism in Pinochet's place. Capitalism is as important as democracy, and is a major component of American Liberalism.


Ah, I missed this one. You the latter without the former. :)

Why did people think this shite topic was worth 150 posts?

Why not? Expand on your theory and justify your assumptions. As I recall there is a considerable bargain for Muslims - something to do with the number 72... not to mention their worldly aspirations which they feel Allah has commanded them to achieve with bloodshed.

Sacrifical bargains are never made with rewards in the afterlife in mind. It's always living-world, physical intervention, like favorable weather, better harvest, even greater fertility. The only reason I can think of for a terrorist to make this kind of a sacrifice would be to gain some kind of power to destroy the enemy.

Unfortunately, unless they said something beyong "Allah is great", then these killings do not fit sacrificial killings. They fit the profile of executions done in the name of their deity. They praise Allah as proof that they are fulfilling what they believe is their duty, not that they are asking anything of Allah in exchange for the life taken.

Ummm - a religion which endorses or tolerates human sacrifice is not legitimate. You need that elaborated?
Sorry, where in the Koran does it endorse human sacrifice? (

Ummm - a religion which endorses or tolerates human sacrifice is not legitimate. You need that elaborated?
According to whom?

That may seem logical to you, but it is by no means a natural law.

Edit: I don't actually consider any religion to be legitimate...but that's just my opinion...not a fact that makes it so.

Why did people think this shite topic was worth 150 posts?
It's gone off the rails a few times.

I like tacos - does that count for anything? :)
That...was...classic!! You deserve a medal.

That...was...classic!! You deserve a medal.
Oh look, has he signed in under a puppet?

You haven't read every argument I've had.

And if you have, you know you're full of it.

I have extensive experience with Latin America.

You can't claim the same.
You also have extensive experience with Europe, the Middle East, and everywhere apparently but Canada. Oh wait, and don't forget the colors. I almost forgot those ;) . You also refuse to admit when you make an incorrect statement, which I inherently mistrust. And of course I have no experience with Latin America. After all, you know me so well! See, claims like that are why I know you really ARE full of it. You constantly make claims that you have no backing for, and then blindly support your own ramblings. Thats usually a bad thing.

Watch it. You're treading on thin ice with that one.
oOoOoOo

Getting offended over a comment from a little blond Floridian boy?

Now, isnt it more fun to just not be at each others throats...this all started with you calling me a (I forget the adjective) thug.

Can we...relax now, now that I've struck a nerve?

You also have extensive experience with Europe, the Middle East, and everywhere apparently but Canada. Oh wait, and don't forget the colors. I almost forgot those ;) . You also refuse to admit when you make an incorrect statement, which I inherently mistrust. And of course I have no experience with Latin America. After all, you know me so well! See, claims like that are why I know you really ARE full of it.You constantly make claims that you have no backing for, and then blindly support your own ramblings. Thats usually a bad thing.
It's funny...all of the accusations you've made about me precisely describe my opinion of you.

Please...I've never claimed to be an expert in Middle Eastern affairs, or European affairs...and yet I know a heck of a lot about Canada...so maybe you're mixed up?

In any case...mistrust all you like...utilise your ignore function...do what you like...you don't really have a coherent message worth paying attention to anyway other than, 'I don't like you because you make me feel stupid'.

Again, it's something I'd be willing to discuss with at more length elsewhere (checks clock) and at a different time.
That, I will hold you to.

That, I will hold you to.
Or maybe you can just dredge up my previous posts on that very topic and save me the time and effort.

Oh look, has he signed in under a puppet?
No, he actually has an ultra-liberal alternate personality that he is unaware of. Bozzy, this is your ultra-liberal personality speaking. Shame on you for hating Muslims. Islam is the religion of peace, and we need to be more tolerant of other faiths. Now I'll just go away and read my latest Allen Franken book.

Or maybe you can just dredge up my previous posts on that very topic and save me the time and effort.
No, if I wanted your brothers uncles former roomates old college buddy's opinon, I wouldnt have said, I'll hold you to that.

Can we...relax now, now that I've struck a nerve?
Considering this here, I hope it stalks you to the ends of the earth, beyond Hades, to the eternal pits of the enfernos of hell.:)I shouldn't think so, no. I think I can honestly remain on my guard at all times on NSG until such time as you grow bored and move on. Gee, thanks. It's such an honour having my very own sociopathic stalker to insult, belittle, and denigrate me in unclever and tedious ways at every turn to the end of my days. Wow, however did I get on without you?

Oh I remember now - famously.

Oh man, I think you have seriously mixed up the muslim religion with the culture and society of those living in the middle east. If your figures are correct, then your not including the amount of people of the muslim faith who live in other countries, such as the U.S., France, The U.K., Belgium... Its usually not best to make wide sweeping generalizations about a religion or race.

No, if I wanted your brothers uncles former roomates old college buddy's opinon, I wouldnt have said, I'll hold you to that.
You know, you don't have to be such a disparaging and condescending little person all the time.

No, if I wanted your brothers uncles former roomates old college buddy's opinon, I wouldnt have said, I'll hold you to that.
LOL
Come on now, be fair. She read it in the news first before it came through the grapevine.

Oh man, I think you have seriously mixed up the muslim religion with the culture and society of those living in the middle east. If your figures are correct, then your not including the amount of people of the muslim faith who live in other countries, such as the U.S., France, The U.K., Belgium... Its usually not best to make wide sweeping generalizations about a religion or race.:p

You know, you don't have to be such a disparaging and condescending little person all the time.
He's not. Only to people who are disparaging and condescending in turn. That's usually how it works.

LOL
Come on now, be fair. She read it in the news first before it came through the grapevine.
Get stuffed, turkey-trous.

He's not. Only to people who are disparaging and condescending in turn. That's usually how it works.
Indeed.

He's not. Only to people who are disparaging and condescending in turn. That's usually how it works.
No. That post was, clearly.

I can't answer this poll; because it deals in absolutes. It assume ALL muslims are one or the other. However, there are many different shades, so this poll is unanswerable.

It's such an honour having my very own sociopathic stalker to insult, belittle, and denigrate me
:D Dont flatter yourself, I'm not your stalker. Nor would I ever WANT to stalk an it.

You know, you don't have to be such a disparaging and condescending little person all the time.
I know I dont have to...but I choose to when (Sinuhue and Dobbs) engage me in such a way that all forms of nice-ness go out the window.

He's not. Only to people who are disparaging and condescending in turn. That's usually how it works.

Indeed.
Thanks, guys.:)


Get stuffed, turkey-trous.
Oh what is this, middle school?:rolleyes:
Atleast provide good material.

I kow I dont have to...but I choose to when (Sinuhue and Dobbs) engage me in such a way that all forms of nice-ness go out the window.
I smell prunes.

I smell prunes.
.....as in, that little stub of a prune you have between your legs?:confused:

Thanks, guys.:)
Don't mention it. ;)

Oh what is this, middle school?:rolleyes:
Atleast provide good material.
The intolerance is bewildering, no?

My lord, this is better than SNL.

My lord, this is better than SNL.
Want some free pop-corn? :)

My lord, this is better than SNL.
We try.


Be sure to tip your waitress, she'll be there all night.

My lord, this is better than SNL.
Want some free pop-corn? :)

Want some free pop-corn? :)

Hunny, I would love some free, capitalist flavored popcorn.

Hunny, I would love some free, capitalist flavored popcorn.
There are going to be <other> flavors in there aswell...is that a problem?;)

From my studies of the religion (which have been less than extensive but more than that of most people) I find that the Muslim faith at its base texts does not promote bloodshed or murder anymore than the other two religions of the book (Christianity and Judaism). What has caused problems is not the tenets of the faith itself, but radical fundementalists alter the meanings of certain passages to protect their goals and completely ignore other facets. It's the same with any religious figure who has a violent political agenda. The atrocities commited in the name of Jehovah (bastardisation of the hebrew word but understandable), Jesus and his parentage, and Allah itself (It's not a him, Allah is a genderless word). I could go into a list of crimes commited in the name of a deity by people with politically minded religious convictions but the list would take me hours to write so I'll abstain.

Islam as a faith, taken the right way, is no more a violent religion than catholicism, Juddaism. Buddhism, Hinduism or any of a host of others (except maybe Satanism, that in fact promotes violence). So rather than lump all muslims into one violent and angry bucket, why don't you go out and read the scriptures (difficult since they're all in Arabic, thats right, no translations are supposed to be made, though some may be available) and then make an infomed opinion of the religious group.

There are going to be <other> flavors in there aswell...is that a problem?;)

None at all. I enjoy variety in my edibles.

Yet another installment in the popular show "Muslims R 3B1L."

:rolleyes:

Yes, only Evil, Wicked Islam is the sole religion in the world that advocates human sacrifice.

Oh wait...

BAM!! (http://www.blueletterbible.org/Gen/Gen022.html)

And pick which version, biotch!

Yet another installment in the popular show "Muslims R 3B1L."

:rolleyes:

Yes, only Evil, Wicked Islam is the sole religion in the world that advocates human sacrifice.

Oh wait...

BAM!! (http://www.blueletterbible.org/Gen/Gen022.html)

And pick which version, biotch!

Abraham did not sacrifice Isaac/Ismael.

None at all. I enjoy variety in my edibles.
But do you enjoy variety in your beverages, now THAT..is the real question.

Abraham did not sacrifice Isaac/Ismael.

But he would have on God's orders. The point is that Buzzy wants to add more to the crap collage of "Muslims R 3B1L" and I'm saying that human sacrifice was a concept dating back to Abraham.

But do you enjoy variety in your beverages, now THAT..is the real question.

I shall rephrase.

I enjoy variety in my consumables.

I shall rephrase.

I enjoy variety in my consumables.
You would!:eek:

Meh. All religions suck, and are an impediment to world peace. Islam is no different than Christianity, Judaism, Wicca or Buddhism.

No, he actually has an ultra-liberal alternate personality that he is unaware of. Bozzy, this is your ultra-liberal personality speaking. Shame on you for hating Muslims. Islam is the religion of peace, and we need to be more tolerant of other faiths. Now I'll just go away and read my latest Allen Franken book.


HAHA! You are my puppet! Dance while I pull the strings!!! See - I pull this one a few times and it looks like you are humping Sinuhue's leg...

ROFLMAO!

Some folks are quite too paraniod to take seriously.

Now - what was I saying? Oh yes, Taco's are good, no? What do you think is better - ground beef or shredded?

But he would have on God's orders. The point is that Buzzy wants to add more to the crap collage of "Muslims R 3B1L" and I'm saying that human sacrifice was a concept dating back to Abraham.


Well, first of all - that is old testament - it is part of Judaism, Muslim and Christian faith.

Second - is that the best you could do? An example from several millenia ago?