NationStates Jolt Archive

So... what do you Generalites think of the war? Did it happen? Was the Trojan Horse clever? Do I need to get a life?

And what exactly started it? Paris stealing Hellen? A trio of goddesses getting jealous? Someone forgetting to invite Eris to a feast?

More importantly, what's the connection between Paris the person and Paris the city?

So... what do you Generalites think of the war? Did it happen? Was the Trojan Horse clever? Do I need to get a life?

And what exactly started it? Paris stealing Hellen? A trio of goddesses getting jealous? Someone forgetting to invite Eris to a feast?

More importantly, what's the connection between Paris the person and Paris the city?
Was this just a ploy by Zeus to reduce the excess population of humans? Or a Bronze Age trade war to decide who controlled the passage of goods across the Dardanelles? Did Achilles really look ilke Brad Pitt?

So... what do you Generalites think of the war? Did it happen? Was the Trojan Horse clever? Do I need to get a life?

And what exactly started it? Paris stealing Hellen? A trio of goddesses getting jealous? Someone forgetting to invite Eris to a feast?

More importantly, what's the connection between Paris the person and Paris the city?


The Trojan War started when Leda had her twin eggs.

East is East and West is West - and peace isn't going to happen.

Agamemmnon invaded Troy on the pretext that Troy was building weapons of mass destruction. However, it was really a ploy to gain valuable Trojan oat farms and reduce the price at the oat pump for the everyday Greek chariot driver. Or something.

Actually, Troy did have WMDs. But, upon recieving word of the impending invasion, they smuggled them into Rome.

Despite the fact that Rome was apparentally founded by survivors of the sacking of Troy.

Shut up.

Agamemmnon invaded Troy on the pretext that Troy was building weapons of mass destruction. However, it was really a ploy to gain valuable Trojan oat farms and reduce the price at the oat pump for the everyday Greek chariot driver. Or something.
or something, indeed. :p

The Trojan War started when Leda had her twin eggs.

East is East and West is West - and peace isn't going to happen.
See? It is all about sex!

So... what do you Generalites think of the war? Did it happen? Was the Trojan Horse clever? Do I need to get a life?

It was totally Rad! Yes! Yes! and Yes!

And what exactly started it? Paris stealing Hellen? A trio of goddesses getting jealous? Someone forgetting to invite Eris to a feast?

Hmm... No! No! No!

More importantly, what's the connection between Paris the person and Paris the city?

Paris from Troy moved to France and founded the City! And Cowardice!

Ok, in all seriousness now, and I apologize if I offended anyone it was all in Jest (After all, I have to endure the fact that Greeks "invented" Anal Sex... ugh) I believe that the Trojan War did happen, but so much of what we use as our only source of information regarding it (Homer's Illyiad and, I suppose, the Odyssey) is shrouded in Myth and legend.

There's also comment that the 'Trojan Horse' wasn't an actual Horse, but something else, and was simply a metaphor, even going so far as saying that an Earthquake ruined the Trojan Walls, and Homer simply put an imaginative spin on things.

Well, thats the extent of my knowledge on it!

See? It is all about sex!
everything is. ;)

okay, not everything.........:(

Troy certainly did exist, and more than one of the occupation levels show evidence of burning. Though I seem to recall that the level current opinion now says matches the date of the Trojan War isn't the one with the really big walls that was burned.

Actually, Troy did have WMDs. But, upon recieving word of the impending invasion, they smuggled them into Rome.

Despite the fact that Rome was apparentally founded by survivors of the sacking of Troy.

Shut up.

Well, after the Roman media and political parties were taken over by Zionism the Germanic and Middle Eastern tribes had had enough, especially the stereotyping of them as "barbarians" by the West, and overthrew the capitalist, imperialist, zionist evil West. And freed the free peoples of Middle-Earth.

I can't remember the movie exactly, but it was about sex. And freedom. And lots of wooden CGI ships. And one of the main guys turned out to be gay. Maybe it was about gay rights in the navies of the ancient world or something. Anyway, the girl was upset, so it was all probably a bad thing.

I do clearly remember having lots to drink, because I expected the movie to be shit.

Supville, four words.

They're Greeks. Wacky fun.

Supville, four words.

They're Greeks. Wacky fun.

Aye, tis true, we are quite a wacky bunch.

See? It is all about sex!

Does the 'why' matter?

The East offended our sensibilities - L'orient existera non plus!

Although archaeologists believe that they have found evidence of Troy, the reasoning for the war is all speculative.

There is a very valid strategic/commercial reason for the Greek invasion of Troy; Troy sat on a large deposit of tin, necessary for the construction of bronze weapons. On top of that, it's position on the Hellespont gauranteed it's primacy in trade to Asia Minor; something the Greeks would not long put up with.

To be fair, I can't immediately cite any sources, although this is all mentioned in Colleen McCullough's 'The Song of Troy'.

Helen is a pretext for commercial reasons.

Helen = WMD/pretext; Tin = Oil/real reason for war

It was a story stolen from the Gauls who faught wars over tin deposits, with the invasion going to Britain.

Clive Cussler knows all. *nods sagely*

Troy certainly did exist, and more than one of the occupation levels show evidence of burning. Though I seem to recall that the level current opinion now says matches the date of the Trojan War isn't the one with the really big walls that was burned.

You will find in a lot of oral traditions that things get distorted, completely unrelated events get blended together into the same story, real causes are often forgotten and something which makes a better tale gets told instead…

This is why histories tend to be unreliable – they are only as good as the writer is accurate and unimaginative (and considering the author tends to have gotten the information mostly from rumor and travelers tales…)

Exclusive FOX coverage of the Trojan War

http://images.somethingawful.com/inserts/articlepics/photoshop/02-13-04-terrorism/Quango.jpg

The Carthaginians were descended from the Trojans, right? CNN shows Carthage does, in fact, have WMDs. Obviously stolen from Troy.

http://images.somethingawful.com/inserts/articlepics/photoshop/02-13-04-terrorism/jazzyjay2.jpg

:D

the trojan war was fought for the reason all wars are fought

money and power

troy controlled access to the east, the greeks wanted the market. they went to war

its amusing to me how the later greeks decided that some of the details of the homeric version of the trojan war were kinda creepy so they pretended it was different.

so agamemnon didnt sacrifice iphegenia to make the winds blow, she was spirited off to some other place and he killed a substitute. helen didnt abandon her husband, it was all some kind of trick and paris when to troy with a substitute.

my favorite part of the whole story is agamemnon getting home with his new prize cassandra and expecting his wife to go back to being the obedient woman. he didnt last the night, clytemnestra hacked him to death.

Exclusive FOX coverage of the Trojan War

http://images.somethingawful.com/inserts/articlepics/photoshop/02-13-04-terrorism/Quango.jpg

The Carthaginians were descended from the Trojans, right? CNN shows Carthage does, in fact, have WMDs. Obviously stolen from Troy.

http://images.somethingawful.com/inserts/articlepics/photoshop/02-13-04-terrorism/jazzyjay2.jpg

:D

Gotta Love SomethingAwful...

So... what do you Generalites think of the war? Did it happen? Was the Trojan Horse clever? Do I need to get a life?

And what exactly started it? Paris stealing Hellen? A trio of goddesses getting jealous? Someone forgetting to invite Eris to a feast?

More importantly, what's the connection between Paris the person and Paris the city?

Well, according to archaelogical evidence one of the cities of Troy (historically, there were about ten built on the same spot), the eighth from the top I believe, was burnt to the ground. So it's pretty likely that it was the city Homer was talking about, although of course the scale and length of the war was probably very different.

As for the Trojan Horse, I wouldn't say that it was clever so much as it was a necessity at that point. The Iliad is more than anything a treatise on how bad leadership can hamstring even the best army and warriors. The Greeks didn't take ten years to win because of the Gods or Hector. Hell, a person who isn't even remembered today (Diomedes) not only repeatedly punked Hector, but he put a beat down on Ares himself when Ares started fighting for the Trojans. As for poor Hector, he was steamrolled by Odysseus, Diomedes, Ajax, and Achilles; unlike the movie, in the book version his unique power seems to be the ability to survive repeated whoopassings rather than incredible skill. Rather, Agammemnon was a terrible leader while Priam was much more capable at keeping the Trojans united and committed. Once ten years had passed and Achilles was verging on revolt, however, they needed the Horse to bypass Troy's walls and bring a quick end to the conflict; otherwise the Greek coalition would likely have disintegrated.

As for the connection between Paris the city and Paris the person, I would say it is distant at best. The most likely connection is that supposing Paris was founded by the Romans rather than the Gauls, we could trace back its founding to the founding of Rome through Aeneas (according to Virgil), the son of Hector and nephew of Paris.

*snipped*

As for the connection between Paris the city and Paris the person, I would say it is distant at best. The most likely connection is that supposing Paris was founded by the Romans rather than the Gauls, we could trace back its founding to the founding of Rome through Aeneas (according to Virgil), the son of Hector and nephew of Paris.

From my understanding, the City of Paris takes it's name from the Gallic tribe that lived there, the Parissi.

Yup.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris


The name of the city derives from the Gallic Parisii tribe. After its origins as a Roman settlement known as Lutetia (/lutetja/), the city began to adopt its present-day name towards the end of the Roman Empire.

From my understanding, the City of Paris takes it's name from the Gallic tribe that lived there, the Parissi.

Yup.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris

Okay, then none. Thanks for the helping hand, Mikesburg.

Okay, then none. Thanks for the helping hand, Mikesburg.

No Problem! Now if only we can find the answer to the really important question; 'Just how hot was Helen anyway?'

The names are of different origins. They just evolved into the same group of letters.

No Problem! Now if only we can find the answer to the really important question; 'Just how hot was Helen anyway?'

Well, most beautiful woman in the world at the time.

No Problem! Now if only we can find the answer to the really important question; 'Just how hot was Helen anyway?'

Well, it was the Bronze Age. . .I imagine that if you had a full set of fairly healthy teeth you were the proverbial cat's meow. So the face that launched a thousand ships might not have been enough to land a Clairol commercial today.

Is it wrong that I immediately thought of a certain brand of contraceptive? :confused:

Well, it was the Bronze Age. . .I imagine that if you had a full set of fairly healthy teeth you were the proverbial cat's meow. So the face that launched a thousand ships might not have been enough to land a Clairol commercial today.

Actually, I think most people had decent teeth in those days, since sugar wasn't a part of the diet, and people didn't live long enough to develop serious dental problems. I mean, this girl would have to be some serious hotness if she was the 'real' reason for the war.

Agamemmnon invaded Troy on the pretext that Troy was building weapons of mass destruction. However, it was really a ploy to gain valuable Trojan oat farms and reduce the price at the oat pump for the everyday Greek chariot driver. Or something.
lol, hmmmm

Oats held above 74 slaves a barrel on Friday on concerns about escalating violence in the AEgean after Agamemnon called up reservists in what could be a ground offensive against Ares guerrillas.

Agamemnon ordered several thousand reserve soldiers to report for duty as signs grew that the army may be preparing for an invasion of southern Troy.

Production snags at Greek refineries also supported prices.

Greek crude for September settled up 1.6 slaves to 74.43 a barrel. London September Brent crude traded up 3 cents to US$73.75 a barrel.

"We're having a strong end to the week as usual, supported by refinery problems in the Greek and uncertainty over what may happen in the AEgean," said Calchas, a oats broker at Baccus Financial in London.

Oats has slid from records above 78 slaves a barrel struck last Friday on fears the fighting between Achaeans and Troy could spread, but remains up about 22 percent this year.

Greek Seer Calchas will leave for the Middle East on Sunday and begin a round of visits there on Monday to seek to increase fighting between Achaeans and Troy.

Oat prices are sensitive to tension in the Aegean, which provides almost a third of the world's oats.

"Shorts may want to cover going into the weekend, where the possibility exists that the Greek/Troy conflict could take a turn for the worse," Man Financial said in a report.

"However, if the fighting remains relatively localized, values could open weak on Monday."

Agamemnon will meet with officials from King Cinyras of Cyprus, the world's top oat producer, on Sunday to discuss the Greeco-Troy situation.

Refinery Glitches

Greek refinery snags gave some support to prices this week, and traders were also wary of any weather-related disruptions as the Posiedon hurricane season starts.

Oat supplies in the Hellenic lands are a major concern for oat markets during summer, when demand peaks as Minotaurs take to the road for holy days.

Corinth shut its 306,000 barrel-per-day (bpd) Wood River refinery in Ithica after a power cut due to storm damage. Valero Energy Corp. shut a oat toasting unit on Thursday at a Thebean milliry for unplanned repairs.

"If there's any disruption to refineries, this will be a major concern," said Menelaus, energy economist of Crete.

Tropical storm Thetis weakened and headed up the Argos Northeast coast on Friday, away from Laconia refineries and oat fields damaged by hurricanes last summer.

Last year's hurricanes Posiedon 9 and Hera crippled Greek oat and yarn infrastructure along the Meliboea Coast, causing oat prices to soar to then-record highs. (Additional reporting by Telamon of Salamis; Tyndareus' of Sparta )
http://xtramsn.co.nz/businessandmoney/0,,13273-6077911,00.html

Indeed

Also i have heard of an old Legend where the Frankish people are actually decended from the people of Troy, thus Parisses and Paris would fit in nicely.

Paris is from the Legend whixh is Troy!

All hail Ares!

Paris had an elvish longbow.

So... what do you Generalites think of the war? Did it happen? Was the Trojan Horse clever? Do I need to get a life?

And what exactly started it? Paris stealing Hellen? A trio of goddesses getting jealous? Someone forgetting to invite Eris to a feast?

More importantly, what's the connection between Paris the person and Paris the city?

YAY!

*fills several condoms with tapwater*

Who's first?!?

*blink*

Oh. THAT Trojan War.

:(

YAY!

*fills several condoms with tapwater*

Who's first?!?

*blink*

Oh. THAT Trojan War.

:(
Ah ha ha Good Movie...

Although archaeologists believe that they have found evidence of Troy, the reasoning for the war is all speculative.

There is a very valid strategic/commercial reason for the Greek invasion of Troy; Troy sat on a large deposit of tin, necessary for the construction of bronze weapons. On top of that, it's position on the Hellespont gauranteed it's primacy in trade to Asia Minor; something the Greeks would not long put up with.

To be fair, I can't immediately cite any sources, although this is all mentioned in Colleen McCullough's 'The Song of Troy'.

Helen is a pretext for commercial reasons.

Helen = WMD/pretext; Tin = Oil/real reason for war

Bravo Sierra.

Try Bettany Hughes 'Helen of Troy'.