NationStates Jolt Archive

Hmm, lets see if I can make a poll, if the damned tools'll work.

It seems to me that sometimes the more we try to evade something, the more we bring it closer to fruition. I'm wondering if that's simply an ironic pattern in the universe or if there's more, if somehow one's actions are determined by all that came before.

Hmm, lets see if I can make a poll, if the damned tools'll work.

It seems to me that sometimes the more we try to evade something, the more we bring it closer to fruition. I'm wondering if that's simply an ironic pattern in the universe or if there's more, if somehow one's actions are determined by all that came before.


You are a human being the most advanced animal on this planet, you have total and I mean total control over your life. You have the capability and the skill to do, or learn how to do anything that your mind, and your willpower setysout to achive.

If you really, and I mean if you really do not agree with this statement then there is nowt that can help you. Your fate is up to you.

You are a human being the most advanced animal on this planet, you have total and I mean total control over your life. You have the capability and the skill to do, or learn how to do anything that your mind, and your willpower setysout to achive.

If you really, and I mean if you really do not agree with this statement then there is nowt that can help you. Your fate is up to you.
Or do I? Maybe it is already determined that I agree or disagree. I won't tell you either way. Or maybe it has been determined that I won't tell you. Or that I'll tell you later, despite my efforts not to.

Or do I? Maybe it is already determined that I agree or disagree. I won't tell you either way. Or maybe it has been determined that I won't tell you. Or that I'll tell you later, despite my efforts not to.


Hehe yeah and maybe some people just can't make up their minds.

I believe in probability, everything is possible, most things are not highly probable though.

If something highly probable happens we call it "life", if something moderately probable happens we call it "fate", if something highly improbable happens we call it a miracle.

;)

Men at some time are masters of their fates:
The fault, dear Brutus, is not in our stars,
But in ourselves ...

I don't really believe in Fate as an outside agency directing things, but it is true that what you do is a result of what you have done, in a lot of ways.

Fate relies on pre-determination, which would in turn rely on a guiding power in our lives.

Short of an actual god who's got everything mapped out (in the most horrific way possible), that's not likely.

I believe in probability, everything is possible, most things are not highly probable though.

If something highly probable happens we call it "life", if something moderately probable happens we call it "fate", if something highly improbable happens we call it a miracle.

;)
Hmm, I'm not so sure. Probability implies a sense of randomness to it. I don't think anything is truly random. We may not understand why, but there's something behind it. Influences.

You are a human being the most advanced animal on this planet, you have total and I mean total control over your life. You have the capability and the skill to do, or learn how to do anything that your mind, and your willpower setysout to achive.

If you really, and I mean if you really do not agree with this statement then there is nowt that can help you. Your fate is up to you.


Untrue. A person has only control over part of their own thoughts and some of their own actions and none of the actions or thoughts of others no matter what hangs in the balance.

To believe otherwise is fantasy wishful thinking or mental illness.

Die Hard 4 will suck, even though i havn't seen it or know anything about it. Is that fate?

Nah, I don't really believe in predetermination. There are patterns, though, and complex systems that we cannot fathom - but humans have the ability to break those patterns through the power of irrationality and free will :)

W00t! Fascist D the thread maker! *Whistles*

Hmm, I'm not so sure. Probability implies a sense of randomness to it. I don't think anything is truly random. We may not understand why, but there's something behind it. Influences.
Probability has nothing to do with randomness, your actions define the events probablity in your life, things can be more probable for some people and less for others.

*note: I am not talking about probablity in a mathmatical sense.

I don't really believe in Fate as an outside agency directing things, but it is true that what you do is a result of what you have done, in a lot of ways.
I didn't just mean what we have done, but also what those before us have done. Their actions influence us, and we, in turn, react, which causes more reactions.

Fate relies on pre-determination, which would in turn rely on a guiding power in our lives.

Short of an actual god who's got everything mapped out (in the most horrific way possible), that's not likely.
Not necessarily. Maybe it's just a logical progression of events.

I didn't just mean what we have done, but also what those before us have done. Their actions influence us, and we, in turn, react, which causes more reactions.
Ah, I see. Like the tee-shirt I saw in a catalogue the other day that said, "A butterfly flapping its wings in the Amazon made me do it."

You can make that argument but I don't see much point in wasting many brain cells over it.

Untrue. A person has only control over part of their own thoughts and some of their own actions and none of the actions or thoughts of others no matter what hangs in the balance.

To believe otherwise is fantasy wishful thinking or mental illness.
No, it isn't fantasy. I've got that one covered. :p

Of course I do! She is invading me at this very moment! (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=491690) It's hard to be a skeptic when that sort of hullaballoo is going on.

Die Hard 4 will suck, even though i havn't seen it or know anything about it. Is that fate?
:eek: (http://img215.imageshack.us/img215/431/spammers0mr.jpg) Get your own thread!:p

Nah, I don't really believe in predetermination. There are patterns, though, and complex systems that we cannot fathom - but humans have the ability to break those patterns through the power of irrationality and free will :)

W00t! Fascist D the thread maker! *Whistles*
Or maybe our own attempts to do so are a part of the systems. Our own actions could be directing them to a particular end, through no real intention of our own.

I completely fail to see any ramp of probability nor any past behaviors nor any reasonable explanation other than fate which could foretell FD making a serious thread, keeping it on topic and denying his beloved smileys.




EDIT: well no smileys before post ten anyway

W00t! Fascist D the thread maker! *Whistles*
BTW: You like it?:)

Probability has nothing to do with randomness, your actions define the events probablity in your life, things can be more probable for some people and less for others.

*note: I am not talking about probablity in a mathmatical sense.
No, that's post hoc reasoning, my dear. Not probability. It's the idea that influences have effect. The outcome depends on how the influences balance as they afflict the person. And some have longer lasting impressions than others.

Or maybe our own attempts to do so are a part of the systems. Our own actions could be directing them to a particular end, through no real intention of our own.
True, we cannot know. I just don't believe it personally :)

BTW: You like it?:)
It's a new side of you - it'll take some getting used to :p

Ah, I see. Like the tee-shirt I saw in a catalogue the other day that said, "A butterfly flapping its wings in the Amazon made me do it."

You can make that argument but I don't see much point in wasting many brain cells over it.
No, not like that. More like an educator teaching a student compassion, who then influences others into being more compassionate...or annoyed that he's so damned cheery. Something more like that.

I completely fail to see any ramp of probability nor any past behaviors nor any reasonable explanation other than fate which could foretell FD making a serious thread, keeping it on topic and denying his beloved smileys.




EDIT: well no smileys before post ten anyway
It's not probability. It's who I am...or who the universe has influenced me to be. You just don't know me that well. :p

No, not like that. More like an educator teaching a student compassion, who then influences others into being more compassionate...or annoyed that he's so damned cheery. Something more like that.
Kind of like the movie Pay It Forward? It's a good idea. Impractical, because all that compassion stuff isn't going to get you a good mark on the standardized tests you have to take these days, but you get a couple points for trying.

Of course I do! She is invading me at this very moment! (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=491690) It's hard to be a skeptic when that sort of hullaballoo is going on.
Riiiight. Good piece, though. Everyone should listent to “Dies Irae”. *nods*

True, we cannot know. I just don't believe it personally :)
But it doesn't hurt to discuss the possibilities. "It is the mark of an educated mind to entertain a notion without accepting it." ~Aristotle.

Hmm, lets see if I can make a poll, if the damned tools'll work.

It seems to me that sometimes the more we try to evade something, the more we bring it closer to fruition. I'm wondering if that's simply an ironic pattern in the universe or if there's more, if somehow one's actions are determined by all that came before.
I would like to think I have control over my life, not fate. But it seems theres at least a bit of fate working, as well. Can't it be a combination of the two?

It's a new side of you - it'll take some getting used to :p
Then you'll love my next one. It'll have Eut and his trout as a joke option.:D

I believe in probability, everything is possible, most things are not highly probable though.

If something highly probable happens we call it "life", if something moderately probable happens we call it "fate", if something highly improbable happens we call it a miracle.

;)
Quoted for truth

Kind of like the movie Pay It Forward? It's a good idea. Impractical, because all that compassion stuff isn't going to get you a good mark on the standardized tests you have to take these days, but you get a couple points for trying.
You fail at life.

I would like to think I have control over my life, not fate. But it seems theres at least a bit of fate working, as well. Can't it be a combination of the two?
Of course. They aren't mutually exclusive. I just wanted to know what others thought of the notion that their lives may not be entirely in their control.

Kind of like the movie Pay It Forward? It's a good idea. Impractical, because all that compassion stuff isn't going to get you a good mark on the standardized tests you have to take these days, but you get a couple points for trying.
Maybe, just maybe there is more to life than standardized tests? Whats the point of being brilliant and getting into an ivy league school if you aren't happy, or aren't a compassionate person.

If I had my way, all people (especially my children, if i ever have any) would be intelligent AND compassionate. But if I have to choose, I'd rather my children be compassionate.

Of course. They aren't mutually exclusive. I just wanted to know what others thought of the notion that their lives may not be entirely in their control.
I'd have to be brain dead to not realize my life is not entirely within my control. But I do have a series of options, put together by fate, and I have some control over which option I choose. That is what makes me responsible for my actions.

Maybe, just maybe there is more to life than standardized tests? Whats the point of being brilliant and getting into an ivy league school if you aren't happy, or aren't a compassionate person.

If I had my way, all people (especially my children, if i ever have any) would be intelligent AND compassionate. But if I have to choose, I'd rather my children be compassionate.
Thank you for attempting to define why he fails at life.

You fail at life.
You fail at sarcasm-recognition. :rolleyes:

Thank you for attempting to define why he fails at life.
My pleasure, darlin' ;)

I'd have to be brain dead to not realize my life is not entirely within my control. But I do have a series of options, put together by fate, and I have some control over which option I choose. That is what makes me responsible for my actions.
Or maybe choice is the illusion. You could just be a pure product of causal relationships.

You fail at sarcasm-recognition. :rolleyes:
No, I don't. You fail at producing good sarcasm.

No, I don't. You fail at producing good sarcasm.
Mmm, maybe. It's been that sort of day.

Then you'll love my next one. It'll have Eut and his trout as a joke option.:D
I'm scared already.

My pleasure, darlin' ;)
I never said you succeeded. :p

This forum requires that you wait 30 seconds between posts. Please try again in 1 seconds.

But it doesn't hurt to discuss the possibilities. "It is the mark of an educated mind to entertain a notion without accepting it." ~Aristotle.
Indeed. Cheers! :)

Mmm, maybe. It's been that sort of day.
Then I apologize. I know all too well what it's like to have those sorts of days.
Have a :fluffle: from the Fuffle Queen in absentia.
Don't tell her I'm usurping her authority.;)

I'm scared already.
You should be.:D Well, not really. You'll prolly like that thread. Might be easy to spam, depending on how things go initially.

Indeed. Cheers! :)
But....but...you've stopped entertaining notions!:eek:

:p

But....but...you've stopped entertaining notions!:eek:

:p
I only entertain before teatime. *nods*

No. It's something conjured up, like religion, to explain what can't be explained by science.
I know how bored people get sometimes, so if you wan too... (http://kevan.org/brain.cgi?Alonocus)

I only entertain before teatime. *nods*
Ah, yes, well....what time is it in Norwegia as of your reply to this post?

No. It's something conjured up, like religion, to explain what can't be explained by science.
I know how bored people get sometimes, so if you wan too... (http://kevan.org/brain.cgi?Alonocus)
Dude. WTF!?

Then I apologize. I know all too well what it's like to have those sorts of days.
Have a :fluffle: from the Fuffle Queen in absentia.
Don't tell her I'm usurping her authority.;)
Gosh, thanks! :D

Gosh, thanks! :D
Is that more sarcasm? :p

NOOOOOOOO i dont believe in fate

oh and FD, i thought you never made threads, you just hijacked and spammed existing ones...

I picked hot date, but I wanted to pick option 4 too.

I never said you succeeded. :p
I said it was my pleasure to try!:p

Well, to put a little topic back.

NO I don't accept the idea of fate, that everything ends up the same no matter whet your actions as it was pre-determined to do so.

If you believe in God (and I don't) then he/she/it gave man free-will. The idea of fate removes said free will.


I'm a control-freak and I won't accept that I have no input into my life.

Well, to put a little topic back.

NO I don't accept the idea of fate, that everything ends up the same no matter whet your actions as it was pre-determined to do so.


Well, your actions would be predetermined as well.

Well, your actions would be predetermined as well.

yup. that is what I said, then also your and this response also was ;)

I hold no beliefs whatever.

I hold no beliefs whatever.

therefore you are never wrong! :)

23:05
Ah. Heh. She's on late....

NOOOOOOOO i dont believe in fate

oh and FD, i thought you never made threads, you just hijacked and spammed existing ones...
You never showed up to my dearly departed first thread, did you?:(

I don't believe in fate, mainly 'cause I have no reason to, and partly because I don't like the idea at all. I don't believe we have total control over our lives though - obviously factors around us affect things, and some you can't change.

I picked hot date, but I wanted to pick option 4 too.
That's why I didn't make it multiple choice. :p

therefore you are never wrong! :)

We have a winner.

I said it was my pleasure to try!:p
And fail? :p

As a Calvinist, yes, I believe Fate exists.

Well, to put a little topic back.

NO I don't accept the idea of fate, that everything ends up the same no matter whet your actions as it was pre-determined to do so.

If you believe in God (and I don't) then he/she/it gave man free-will. The idea of fate removes said free will.


I'm a control-freak and I won't accept that I have no input into my life.
I'm not suggesting you have no "control." I'm saying that maybe your "control" is subject heavily to a variety of influences beyond your control. And perhaps you are a control freak because you are terrified to admit that you don't have so much control as you like to think. There are, in fact, things you don't control.

No, but now I've got a cool name for the next pet I get. :D

Well, your actions would be predetermined as well.
Even if he didn't realize it. *nods*

My friend, Kyle Reese, always says:

"There is no fate but what we make for ourselves."

And I believe him.

therefore you are never wrong! :)
Or he's never right....

As a Calvinist, yes, I believe Fate exists.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/50/Calvin_%26_Hobbes_-_Calvin.png

I don't believe in fate, mainly 'cause I have no reason to, and partly because I don't like the idea at all. I don't believe we have total control over our lives though - obviously factors around us affect things, and some you can't change.
You don't have to like it. Or even resign yourself to the notion. Though that's not entirely up to you. It's those influences upon us which we cannot change, nor often see, that could be called fate. They make their impressions upon us and are beyond all efforts to dislodge them, should one even notice.

My friend, Kyle Reese, always says:

"There is no fate but what we make for ourselves."

And I believe him.
:eek:
Your friend is Sarah Connor from the Terminator??

No, but now I've got a cool name for the next pet I get. :D
Get a cat. Preferably a black one.:D

:eek:
Your friend is Sarah Connor from the Terminator??
No, his friend is her dead lover. Pay attention! :p

My friend, Kyle Reese, always says:

"There is no fate but what we make for ourselves."

And I believe him.
I was wondering when someone would catch onto that.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/50/Calvin_%26_Hobbes_-_Calvin.png
*FLORT!*

No, his friend is her dead lover. Pay attention! :p
Ach, laddie! Ye be rrrrrrright! :eek:
Meh, I'll rather sneak away unnoticed :cool:
*Sneaks away unnoticed*

Ach, laddie! Ye be rrrrrrright! :eek:
Meh, I'll rather sneak away unnoticed :cool:
*Sneaks away unnoticed*
Ha! I caught you!
*grabs Gravlen's shirt collar*

Damn you, FD. :p

Damn you, FD. :p
Yes?:D

Yes?:D

*proceeds to slap you with two pilchards to light-hearted music*

*proceeds to slap you with two pilchards to light-hearted music*
Was there a particular reason you were cursing me?o.O

short answer: fate doesnt exist. Nothing suggests its existence. Its just our interpretation of things.

short answer: fate doesnt exist. Nothing suggests its existence. Its just our interpretation of things.
Qualify that and I might consider it valid.

Or he's never right....

No reason both can't be true at the same time.

However, since I think most people jump to conclusions far earlier than the data warrant, I would assert that my failure to hold beliefs makes me right more often than not.

short answer: fate doesnt exist. Nothing suggests its existence. Its just our interpretation of things.

Absence if evidence is not evidence of absence. That we have no evidence only tells us that we shouldn't conclude that fat exists. But to conclude that fate doesn't exist in reaction would be an equal logical error.

Was there a particular reason you were cursing me?o.O

You beat me to Gravlen.

No reason both can't be true at the same time.

However, since I think most people jump to conclusions far earlier than the data warrant, I would assert that my failure to hold beliefs makes me right more often than not.
Maybe. Or maybe you're just as wrong. I tend to think of my beliefs more as fluid ideas than concreate ideals.

You beat me to Gravlen.
Well, it is my thread.:p

Maybe. Or maybe you're just as wrong. I tend to think of my beliefs more as fluid ideas than concreate ideals.
Not only would that make you highly unusual (most people's beliefs introduce a strong confirmation bias into any new information they see), but it also makes you wilfully wrong most of the time.

You're basically saying that you hold beliefs based on what you already suspect is incomplete information, and yet you hold that belief anyway, knowing that it's subject to future revision. Which could also be premature, and thus also wrong.

Well, it is my thread.:p

Your point?

*dresses up in a safari outfit and dances very silly, slapping you with the pilchards*

Not only would that make you highly unusual (most people's beliefs introduce a strong confirmation bias into any new information they see), but it also makes you wilfully wrong most of the time.

You're basically saying that you hold beliefs based on what you already suspect is incomplete information, and yet you hold that belief anyway, knowing that it's subject to future revision. Which could also be premature, and thus also wrong.
I don't presume to believe what I know as truth is always truth. If it ever changes, I'm willing to accept that I was wrong or did not understand the whole of it and correct it. So I'm not wrong more than others, I simply adapt to the truth instead of forcing a perception of the truth to adapt to me.

Your point?

*dresses up in a safari outfit and dances very silly, slapping you with the pilchards*
Do I ever have a point? :confusion:

I believe in probability, everything is possible, most things are not highly probable though.

If something highly probable happens we call it "life", if something moderately probable happens we call it "fate", if something highly improbable happens we call it a miracle.

;)


Oh, anything with a probability of less than 20%.
--Enrico Fermi (1901-1954)
(When asked what he meant by a miracle)

I don't presume to believe what I know as truth is always truth. If it ever changes, I'm willing to accept that I was wrong or did not understand the whole of it and correct it. So I'm not wrong more than others, I simply adapt to the truth instead of forcing a perception of the truth to adapt to me.


It has often been said that 'nature is simple' - illusion! It is our mind
which looks for simplicity to avoid effort.
~ L. Brillouin, in Scientific Uncertainty and Information

Hmm, lets see if I can make a poll, if the damned tools'll work.

It seems to me that sometimes the more we try to evade something, the more we bring it closer to fruition. I'm wondering if that's simply an ironic pattern in the universe or if there's more, if somehow one's actions are determined by all that came before.

I believe in fate and karma

Oh, anything with a probability of less than 20%.
--Enrico Fermi (1901-1954)
(When asked what he meant by a miracle)
Heh. Italian funnyman.

I believe in fate and karma
So how are those hot dates going, then?;)

This forum requires that you wait 30 seconds between posts. Please try again in 1 seconds.

It has often been said that 'nature is simple' - illusion! It is our mind
which looks for simplicity to avoid effort.
~ L. Brillouin, in Scientific Uncertainty and Information
I find as much to be the truth.

So how are those hot dates going, then?;)
what hot dates? :p

what hot dates? :p
The ones with fate and karma. Unless you have others you'd like to share.;)

The ones with fate and karma. Unless you have others you'd like to share.;)
i never kiss and tell :p

i never kiss and tell :p


Just this once?

Just this once?
lol

oh ok .. just for you

*whispers*

I haven't had any dates recently

there... happy! *sulks*

lol

oh ok .. just for you

*whispers*

I haven't had any dates recently

there... happy! *sulks*

No!
Care to go to dinner and maybe catch a flick?

No!
Care to go to dinner and maybe catch a flick?
How Kind of you, but pitty dates aren't my thing ;)

How Kind of you, but pitty dates aren't my thing ;)

Pity date? I think not!

I wont try again though I hate getting shot down like this.

I don't believe in fate any more than I believe in free will. I believe in determinism. I may be wrong, of course, but it seems to be the most probable, when you consider it objectively.

Oh, and:

It is our mind
which looks for simplicity to avoid effort.
~ L. Brillouin, in Scientific Uncertainty and Information

I've said the exact same many times. I'm glad to see I'm not the only one.

Pity date? I think not!

I wont try again though I hate getting shot down like this.

Mother always said I'd be heart breaker

awww ... ok.. I'll go on a date with you

Where shall we eat?

Mother always said I'd be heart breaker

awww ... ok.. I'll go on a date with you

Where shall we eat?

My country or yours?

My country or yours?

where are you?

where are you?

In my living room.













California

I had to say "Who put you up to this?o.O", just because of the "o.O" :D

:fluffle:

In my living room.













California

Oh yours.. definatley

Oh yours.. definatley

OK then to get the true flavor of Cakifornia we will go to a Mexican restaurant.

OK then to get the true flavor of Cakifornia we will go to a Mexican restaurant.

I love mexican food

and beer

corona

mmmm

Oh the spam.. Yum! :p

Oh the spam.. Yum! :p
says the head spam distributor :p

I love mexican food

and beer

corona

mmmm

Strangely enough Im drinking a Newkie right now.

Oh the spam.. Yum! :p

You are just jealous

says the head spam distributor :p

*Wink wink nudge nudge* Say no more ;) :p

Strangely enough Im drinking a Newkie right now.
if i wasnt at work, and it wasnt 9:34 am.. i'd be drinking beer too

You are just jealous

That you got into the spam before I did? :p

I think tequila was my fate. Among other things not necessarily good for my health and life expectancy.

I think tequila was my fate. Among other things not necessarily good for my health and life expectancy.

What a horrible fate! I hate tequila :s :p

What a horrible fate! I hate tequila :s :p

Yes, many people do. I'm one of those who appreciate it, which is a good thing considering my fate is to drink it.

i never kiss and tell :p
Heh. I like my response better when someone teases me like that: "A gentleman does not discuss such things." (cookies for the reference)

I had to say "Who put you up to this?o.O", just because of the "o.O" :D

:fluffle:
I did that just for you.:)

:fluffle:

I did that just for you.:)

:fluffle:

Why thankyou [/sleazy grin]

:fluffle:

Oh the spam.. Yum! :p
says the head spam distributor :p
Only because you all waited till I left to spam my thread.:(

Only because you all waited till I left to spam my thread.:(

Hey, I only just got here!

Why thankyou [/sleazy grin]

:fluffle:
Any time, sweetheart. [/sleazier, lop-sided grin]

:fluffle:

Hey, I only just got here!
Oh, so you waited until right before I logged in to spam my thread? Just to rub it in my face? :p

Any time, sweetheart. [/sleazier, lop-sided grin]

:fluffle:

Lop sided, eh? ;)

:fluffle:

Oh, so you waited until right before I logged in to spam my thread? Just to rub it in my face? :p

I haven't spammed yet *insert angel smile here* ;)

Lop sided, eh? ;)

:fluffle:
Yup.;)
*thinks Indiana Jones*

Yup.;)
*thinks Indiana Jones*

Linky? Remember, I've never watched it :p

I haven't spammed yet *insert angel smile here* ;)
Liar. :) [/lovingly]

Liar. :) [/lovingly]

Lol, You're just jealous of my high quality spam :D

Linky? Remember, I've never watched it :p
I'm ravaging Google for a good photo as I post. The things I do for you.;)

I'm ravaging Google for a good photo as I post. The things I do for you.;)

I'm worth it tho :p ;)

:fluffle:

Lol, You're just jealous of my high quality spam :D
Not at all. I'm glad you were willing to spam my thread in my absence, as I did for you.:D

I'm worth it tho :p ;)

:fluffle:
It's Google we're talking about, so barely.:p But yeah, you really are more than worth it.

:fluffle:

Heh. I like my response better when someone teases me like that: "A gentleman does not discuss such things." (cookies for the reference)

Studio 8 TV, is it not? Gentleman Brock?

Studio 8 TV, is it not? Gentleman Brock?
NO.

NO.

Damn!

That you got into the spam before I did? :p

That must be it!

Damn!
Guess again!

It seems to me that sometimes the more we try to evade something, the more we bring it closer to fruition. I'm wondering if that's simply an ironic pattern in the universe or if there's more, if somehow one's actions are determined by all that came before.
No; but your use of the word "ironic" is a key as to why you have to wonder about it.

Here's a clue: you give it meaning.

I don't presume to believe what I know as truth is always truth. If it ever changes, I'm willing to accept that I was wrong or did not understand the whole of it and correct it. So I'm not wrong more than others, I simply adapt to the truth instead of forcing a perception of the truth to adapt to me.
But then why decide in the first place? Why not simply remain uncertain?

No; but your use of the word "ironic" is a key as to why you have to wonder about it.

Here's a clue: you give it meaning.
I know I give it meaning, in a sense. But is the meaning really my own or simply the natural result of colliding energies, the effect of mingling causes? How autonomous are we really?

But then why decide in the first place? Why not simply remain uncertain?
Is not my questioning of my own ideals uncertainty?

I know I give it meaning, in a sense. But is the meaning really my own or simply the natural result of colliding energies, the effect of mingling causes? How autonomous are we really?
If YOU do it, then it doesn't matter if it's colliding energies, or whatever. :)

If YOU do it, then it doesn't matter if it's colliding energies, or whatever. :)
I suppose, but I'm still curious to understand if it really is a matter of free will or cosmic causality.

Is not my questioning of my own ideals uncertainty?
But you're still holding unjustified beliefs along the way.

But you're still holding unjustified beliefs along the way.
No, they're justified until that justification falls through. It's a matter of perspective.

Absence if evidence is not evidence of absence. That we have no evidence only tells us that we shouldn't conclude that fat exists. But to conclude that fate doesn't exist in reaction would be an equal logical error.


there is no evidence to suggest the existence of unicorns. Nor is there any to disprove this. We can dismiss it.

there is no evidence to suggest the existence of unicorns. Nor is there any to disprove this. We can dismiss it.
Sure, we can dismiss it. But we can also dismiss that you have a basic right to life. Let's dismiss your "free speech" as well while we're at it.

there is no evidence to suggest the existence of unicorns. Nor is there any to disprove this. We can dismiss it.
We can dismiss the question as unanswerable (for the time being), but that's no reason to believe that unicorns don't exist.

I don't presume to believe what I know as truth is always truth. If it ever changes, I'm willing to accept that I was wrong or did not understand the whole of it and correct it. So I'm not wrong more than others, I simply adapt to the truth instead of forcing a perception of the truth to adapt to me.
on the one hand, this is brilliant. on the other hand, i dont want to "feed the ego." What to do?

Hmm, lets see if I can make a poll, if the damned tools'll work.

It seems to me that sometimes the more we try to evade something, the more we bring it closer to fruition. I'm wondering if that's simply an ironic pattern in the universe or if there's more, if somehow one's actions are determined by all that came before.

I think it's because we're subconsciously drawn to the things we try to avoid. Humanity has always flirted with the brink.

I suppose, but I'm still curious to understand if it really is a matter of free will or cosmic causality.
The matter of one is not the matter of the other.

on the one hand, this is brilliant. on the other hand, i dont want to "feed the ego." What to do?
Consider it fed. You'll just have to suck out some of the...hot air.;):p

I think it's because we're subconsciously drawn to the things we try to avoid. Humanity has always flirted with the brink.
I guess I slipped and fell into the abyss once....What? I was curious. But that's another matter.

The matter of one is not the matter of the other.
I suppose they aren't exclusive...but if I understand your eloquent, but somewhat ambiguous, claim, I disagree. I think they are very much matters of each other. If both are true, they both balance as opposites. After all, "The opposite of a great truth is another great truth."

Fate is a word for a likely future, that is hard to avoid. I believe all supernatural truths may be true, but aren't supernatural.

It's a bad idea to open an umbrella inside, to mock a priest in his church, to mess with things you don't understand, etc. The subconscious is powerful, and the rules it plays by seem supernatural. The collective unconscious is exteremly powerful, but it's power can be understood by the proper application of meme theory.

Fate is a word for a likely future, that is hard to avoid. I believe all supernatural truths may be true, but aren't supernatural.

It's a bad idea to open an umbrella inside, to mock a priest in his church, to mess with things you don't understand, etc. The subconscious is powerful, and the rules it plays by seem supernatural. The collective unconscious is exteremly powerful, but it's power can be understood by the proper application of meme theory.
And now you're going to explain this meme theory in detail, yes?

And now you're going to explain this meme theory in detail, yes?

I'm inclined to cheat, and just provide a link to wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meme

However I am so into Meme theory I will go into detail :)

Take any idea, and treat it as a being. Call it's category of being, a meme. Then apply the theories of natural selection and evolution and apply it to the meme. The mediums in which Memes live are the conscious minds of humans, the subconscious, the collective subconscious, the written word, and the internet.

Meme's compete with each other, merge with each other, seperate, poach each others followers. They meme for war acts a lot like one of the ancient gods of war. Things that would piss off Mars tend to cause a reaction fromt he War meme as well.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y223/GermanNightmare/NoFate.jpg

That pretty much says it all.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y223/GermanNightmare/NoFate.jpg

That pretty much says it all.

What does it say?

What does it say?
Since you can write I take it you can read as well? :confused:

Question on open poll: Do you believe in Fate? Hence my vote and picture reply.

Since you can write I take it you can read as well? :confused:

Question on open poll: Do you believe in Fate? Hence my vote and picture reply.

I read very little, but it is supposed to say it all?

Only in a Chaos-theory-style mathematically-predictable-progression-of-consequences way.

Only in a Chaos-theory-style mathematically-predictable-progression-of-consequences way.

Exactly, except I'm not good enough at Chaos theory that I find it predictable.

I read very little, but it is supposed to say it all?
Yeah. There is no fate.

I'm inclined to cheat, and just provide a link to wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meme

However I am so into Meme theory I will go into detail :)

Take any idea, and treat it as a being. Call it's category of being, a meme. Then apply the theories of natural selection and evolution and apply it to the meme. The mediums in which Memes live are the conscious minds of humans, the subconscious, the collective subconscious, the written word, and the internet.

Meme's compete with each other, merge with each other, seperate, poach each others followers. They meme for war acts a lot like one of the ancient gods of war. Things that would piss off Mars tend to cause a reaction fromt he War meme as well.
I'm too lazy to reply right now. Please leave a message at the tone.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y223/GermanNightmare/NoFate.jpg

That pretty much says it all.
Except why you think that.

Only in a Chaos-theory-style mathematically-predictable-progression-of-consequences way.
Well, that is one perspective of it, which I've described in many more words.