NationStates Jolt Archive

A group of prisoners in Indiana are sueing the department of corrections to restore their rights to read magazines and books such as Easyriders, Hustler, and National Geographic. What use is a constitutionally protected free press if the government can ban people from reading? Good luck to these fine felons. May you be victorious in your struggle for freedom and boobies.

http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060712/LOCAL/607120485

The policy could prohibit sexually explicit letters

You mean they are going to sensor their mail too? holy fuck I am on the fellons side in this case

You mean they are going to sensor their mail too? holy fuck I am on the fellons side in this case

The people running prisons make a habit of reading the mail that goes in and out of prison.

The people running prisons make a habit of reading the mail that goes in and out of prison.

I think they should check the mail for things involving illegal activities, but who cares if they're getting "sexually explicit" mail?

I think they should check the mail for things involving illegal activities, but who cares if they're getting "sexually explicit" mail?

Not sure about written content, but pornographic pictures can be fought over.

I don't run a prison, but I could see where that could start a fight.

I would think that could be alleviated by giving everyone some porn.

Of course, then you have a lot of sexually frustrated men being stimulated... could be a bad thing.

I tend to be way to the left on most things but I have a hard time justifying amenities for incarcerated felons. To my mind, if you committed a crime and were convicted and thrown in jail, you should spend at least some of that time reflecting on how you came to be in such a terrible place, not agitating to have the things you miss delivered to you. Rehabilitation, sure, but there's got to be an element of punishment in prison, wouldn't you think?

Not sure about written content, but pornographic pictures can be fought over.

I don't run a prison, but I could see where that could start a fight.

I would think that could be alleviated by giving everyone some porn.

Of course, then you have a lot of sexually frustrated men being stimulated... could be a bad thing.
Yeah, and horny guys with no sexual outlet, not even jerking off to a porno mag, can become violent and perhaps be more likely to rape other inmates.

Yeah, and horny guys with no sexual outlet, not even jerking off to a porno mag, can become violent and perhaps be more likely to rape other inmates.

Maybe they should give all prisoners injections of depo-provera, so they never get horny, and grow man boobs while in prison (no matter how much iron they pump during time in the exercise yard).

Maybe they should give all prisoners injections of depo-provera, so they never get horny, and grow man boobs while in prison (no matter how much iron they pump during time in the exercise yard).
Maybe they should just let them have porno magazines. It's probably cheaper to let the individual inmate subscribe to Hustler than for the state to pay for extra medical treatments.

A group of prisoners in Indiana are suing the department of corrections to restore their rights to read magazines and books such as Easyriders, Hustler, and National Geographic. What use is a constitutionally protected free press if the government can ban people from reading? Good luck to these fine felons. May you be victorious in your struggle for freedom and boobies.

http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060712/LOCAL/607120485
I ( somewhat reluctantly ) agree. Just because someone is incarcerated doesn't mean their ( non-crime related ) rights should be abridged.

but there's got to be an element of punishment in prison, wouldn't you think?

and what do you call absolute 24/7 control over what you do, where you go, being constantly watched, being subjected to arbitrary extra levels of punishment, etc?

Maybe they should just let them have porno magazines. It's probably cheaper to let the individual inmate subscribe to Hustler than for the state to pay for extra medical treatments.

Don't forget the hand cream (to prevent blistering) and the hand towels (to prevent messes).

You mean they are going to sensor their mail too? holy fuck I am on the fellons side in this case

prisons make a habit of censoring political mail too, despite numerous court cases saying they can't. if there is one thing prisons are good at, it is breaking the law.

and what do you call absolute 24/7 control over what you do, where you go, being constantly watched, being subjected to arbitrary extra levels of punishment, etc?
Well, it is prison, not a time-out ("You've been bad, go stand in a cell."). Arbitrary extra levels of punishment are something else and shouldn't be inflicted (though I'm sure they are). I don't think a lack of risque magazines constitutes an arbitrary extra level of punishment.

Well, it is prison, not a time-out ("You've been bad, go stand in a cell."). Arbitrary extra levels of punishment are something else and shouldn't be inflicted (though I'm sure they are). I don't think a lack of risque magazines constitutes an arbitrary extra level of punishment.
It removes one more control over the prisoners. The magazines can be taken out of the cell as punishment, but if they're not permitted in the cell to begin with you lack the ability to make that threat. Also the magazines keep prisoners occupied and calm. Magazines make prisoners easier to manage.

I don't think a lack of risque magazines constitutes an arbitrary extra level of punishment.

when given their sentence, i doubt many judges said "and no reading hustler, either." according to the way we run things, being imprisoned is itself the punishment.

Well, I hope that when they win their 'Hustler' mags back, they also win a years supply of socks to go with them.
In way of puntive damages.

I tend to be way to the left on most things but I have a hard time justifying amenities for incarcerated felons. To my mind, if you committed a crime and were convicted and thrown in jail, you should spend at least some of that time reflecting on how you came to be in such a terrible place, not agitating to have the things you miss delivered to you. Rehabilitation, sure, but there's got to be an element of punishment in prison, wouldn't you think?Visit a prison some time.

I take my students in "Politics of Crime and Criminal Justice" to tour the nearby state prison every year. Trust me, it's no picnic, no matter what "amenities" you manage to get.

For starters, imagine the smallest dorm room you have ever seen. Now cut it in half--twice. Now put two bunks, a toilet, and another human being in there. Now cram in what minimal "amenities" both of you get... and close the door. Yes, door... heavy metal door. I have been to several prisons in the area, and I've never encountered those nice airy bars you see in the movies--that must be a west coast thing or something.

When you stand up, you can barely turn around... so you spend most of the time lying on your bunk, which is either three feet from the bunk above you or three feet from the very low ceiling. You have no window to the outside, just the tiny window in your cell door--your only view is a prison hallway. Once or twice a day, your cell mate gets off his bunk to take a shit in the corner.

Of course, in most prisons these cells were originally built for one inmate... but, funding problems and overcrowding, you know?

Visit a prison some time.

I take my students in "Politics of Crime and Criminal Justice" to tour the nearby state prison every year. Trust me, it's no picnic, no matter what "amenities" you manage to get.

For starters, imagine the smallest dorm room you have ever seen. Now cut it in half--twice. Now put two bunks, a toilet, and another human being in there. Now cram in what minimal "amenities" both of you get... and close the door. Yes, door... heavy metal door. I have been to several prisons in the area, and I've never encountered those nice airy bars you see in the movies--that must be a west coast thing or something.

When you stand up, you can barely turn around... so you spend most of the time lying on your bunk, which is either three feet from the bunk above you or three feet from the very low ceiling. You have no window to the outside, just the tiny window in your cell door--your only view is a prison hallway. Once or twice a day, your cell mate gets off his bunk to take a shit in the corner.

Of course, in most prisons these cells were originally built for one inmate... but, funding problems and overcrowding, you know?
Must be why most of them are so afraid not to go back. It's just terrible for them

And as for them not getting the magazines...It's punishment. I don't understand what is so hard to grasp. They are there for breaking the law. They have chosen not to play nicely. They lose their "essential" rights. And I don't think there's any guarentee in the Constitution that a person has a right to read, only to write.

And if you think a sex offender has the right to read porn, please stand up...

:sniper:

A group of prisoners in Indiana are sueing the department of corrections to restore their rights to read magazines and books such as Easyriders, Hustler, and National Geographic. What use is a constitutionally protected free press if the government can ban people from reading? Good luck to these fine felons. May you be victorious in your struggle for freedom and boobies.

http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060712/LOCAL/607120485

Someone [I forget who] said that 'somebody only has the right to free press if he owns one.'

A group of prisoners in Indiana are sueing the department of corrections to restore their rights to read magazines and books such as Easyriders, Hustler, and National Geographic. What use is a constitutionally protected free press if the government can ban people from reading? Good luck to these fine felons. May you be victorious in your struggle for freedom and boobies.

http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060712/LOCAL/607120485
what are you serious? Criminals lose rights, that a good thing! If they didnt want to lose rights such as being free that they shouldnt have committed their crimes and becoming nothing but a disease to healthy societies. They shouldnt have tv, air condition, anything. Prison is supposed to be a punishment not a restort. Prisoners complaining about rights, laughable. What about the rights they took from their victims when they killed,raped, robbed them etc?

There really is a perspective issue here. They're not sueing to regain thier rights to vote and to try and be part of functioning society again. They're sueing to read porn. That says alot as to their mentalities.

You mean they are going to sensor their mail too? holy fuck I am on the fellons side in this case

Mail is already censored in and out.

Of course, then you have a lot of sexually frustrated men being stimulated... could be a bad thing.
That's why you never drop your soap in a prison shower... ;)

I ( somewhat reluctantly ) agree. Just because someone is incarcerated doesn't mean their ( non-crime related ) rights should be abridged.

They lose the right to vote and the right to have firearms as well. Even after prison.

They lose the right to vote and the right to have firearms as well. Even after prison.
I thought felons could vote in certain states and they can have blackpowder guns.

They lose the right to vote and the right to have firearms as well. Even after prison.

Not in every state. Anyway, the US constitution doesn't give a right to vote (I think) and any lawyer could the the "well ordered militia" bit to say that felons aren't covered.

There really is a perspective issue here. They're not sueing to regain thier rights to vote and to try and be part of functioning society again. They're sueing to read porn. That says alot as to their mentalities.

though considering the glorious history of the porn industry in securing freedom, the things it says aren't actually bad.

You mean they are going to sensor their mail too? holy fuck I am on the fellons side in this case

What a moron, if they want their rights to be intact guess what, DON'T COMMIT A FUCKING FELONY. I say outside of physical harm make their prison stays as inhospitable as possible, hopefully upon release they will remember why staying out of trouble is a good idea. Same goes for the captured terrorists in Gitmo, quit coddling these fucking criminals and make them regret their actions, give them a choice upon admission, toilet paper or prayer rug, koran or mattress to sleep on. Sorry criminals I'm tired of you having your cake and eating it too.

What a moron, if they want their rights to be intact guess what, DON'T COMMIT A FUCKING FELONY. I say outside of physical harm make their prison stays as inhospitable as possible, hopefully upon release they will remember why staying out of trouble is a good idea. Same goes for the captured terrorists in Gitmo, quit coddling these fucking criminals and make them regret their actions, give them a choice upon admission, toilet paper or prayer rug, koran or mattress to sleep on. Sorry criminals I'm tired of you having your cake and eating it too.

Why don't we just execute all criminals? .

Maybe reinstitute impaling and burning at the stake.

Who cares? They're criminals.


Ever heard of "wrongfully accused?"

Or truly repentant?

A group of prisoners in Indiana are sueing the department of corrections to restore their rights to read magazines and books such as Easyriders, Hustler, and National Geographic. What use is a constitutionally protected free press if the government can ban people from reading? Good luck to these fine felons. May you be victorious in your struggle for freedom and boobies.

http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060712/LOCAL/607120485

That has been banned? Damn, I hope these guys get their right back.

I ( somewhat reluctantly ) agree. Just because someone is incarcerated doesn't mean their ( non-crime related ) rights should be abridged.

OK so those covicted of rape should be able to feed their already unhealthy addiction to female nudity??? Use some common sense here WTF can possibly be gained by allowing felons to have porn? Absolutely NOTHING constructive, that's for sure...

OK so those covicted of rape should be able to feed their already unhealthy addiction to female nudity??? Use some common sense here WTF can possibly be gained by allowing felons to have porn? Absolutely NOTHING constructive, that's for sure...
1) Let them have porn and then you can threaten to take it away from them as punishment for bad behavior. A man with nothing to lose is more dangerous than a jerk off.

2) It calms them down and keeps them occupied instead of them getting bored, frustrated and violent.

I thought felons could vote in certain states and they can have blackpowder guns.

I thought they had to apply to have their rights regranted after release/completion of parole? I could easily be outdated in this belief. I admit not paying close enough track of how and when convicted felons rights are regranted lately.

OK so those covicted of rape should be able to feed their already unhealthy addiction to female nudity??? Use some common sense here WTF can possibly be gained by allowing felons to have porn? Absolutely NOTHING constructive, that's for sure...

Doesn't everyone look at porn?

1) Let them have porn and then you can threaten to take it away from them as punishment for bad behavior. A man with nothing to lose is more dangerous than a jerk off.

2) It calms them down and keeps them occupied instead of them getting bored, frustrated and violent.

This does not seem to work for them outside of prison or most wouldnt actually be in prison.

I therefore tend to doubt it works inside prison.

This does not seem to work for them outside of prison or most wouldnt actually be in prison.

I therefore tend to doubt it works inside prison.

It'll reduce rape in prisons, at least.

What a moron, if they want their rights to be intact guess what, DON'T COMMIT A FUCKING FELONY.You do realize that the legal distinction between a felony and a misdemeanor is, for practical purposes, essentially arbitrary? The rough-and-ready definition is that a crime is a "felony" if a convict faces a maximum penalty of more than one year incarceration. In any case, the penalty for a crime as well as its actual definition as a "felony" is simply up to the legislature... so that all sorts of relatively trivial offenses can actually get a felony conviction.

The worst part of the voting rights aspect of this is that it applies even to petty offenders who, in the opinion of the court, do not even deserve prison--they get off with probation or fines, but because the crime was defined as a felony they lose their most essential rights as democratic citizens.

This includes, obviously, many "victimless" crimes like drug possession; as well as many offenses that are frequently attached to political dissidents, such as "trespassing" on government property (e.g. at a protest).

This alone should suggest great potential for government abuse of felony voting restrictions. And where there is the possibility for abuse, in a free society we have a serious problem.

This does not seem to work for them outside of prison or most wouldnt actually be in prison.

I therefore tend to doubt it works inside prison.
Outside of prison there's a lot more temptation to rape. Women walking around all over the place half-naked, the dirty sluts, they want it, believe me they.... uh, nevermind.

It'll reduce rape in prisons, at least.

I doubt that.

Porn is more likely to increase libido than to decrease it.

Masturbation is not being banned porn is.

Porn is more likely to increase libido than to decrease it.Actually, last I heard the evidence went the other way... Men who love porn tend to be less interested in sex. The explanation usually runs as follows... Porn does two things: 1) It discharges the physical aspects of desire; 2) It depicts women and sexual situations that everyday life usually does not provide, thereby setting a standard against which real sex seems (paradoxically) less satisfying than porn-assisted masturbation.

There used to be quite a market in California max security prisons for handmade/hand drawn erotica. This black market activity should increase again if the lawsuit fails.

Speaking ofthe lawsuit has the ACLU picked it up yet?

Actually, last I heard the evidence went the other way... Men who love porn tend to be less interested in sex. The explanation usually runs as follows... Porn does two things: 1) It discharges the physical aspects of desire; 2) It depicts women and sexual situations that everyday life usually does not provide, thereby setting a standard against which real sex seems (paradoxically) less satisfying than porn-assisted masturbation.

There are few women to rape in men's institutions.

Id like to see the study though, it may still have some validity regarding men in prison as opposed to desire for sex at large where there is hope for consensual sex with a hetero partner.

Why don't we just execute all criminals? .

Maybe reinstitute impaling and burning at the stake.

Who cares? They're criminals.


Ever heard of "wrongfully accused?"

Or truly repentant?

I can play your game too, why not just release them all, wouldn't want the 1 or 2 wrongfully accused to serve any prison time with the thousands of truly guilty criminals. I think it is just as sad as anyone that a few wrongfully accused slip through the cracks but while the odds are still in favor (drastically I might add) that the legitimately accused are being punished it should not be a fucking vacation. Now go play "I'm a retarded socialist/ anarchist piece of shit" somewhere else, your argument is idiotic at best.

It'll reduce rape in prisons, at least.


Ohhh poor criminal, he got his shit pushed in by bubba, so fucking what. If you can't do the time don't do the crime. You would rather reward a rapist with pornography than have a criminal get turd tagged, WTF? Get your priorities in order...

May you be victorious in your struggle for freedom and boobies.
Quoted in sig :D

Ohhh poor criminal, he got his shit pushed in by bubba, so fucking what. If you can't do the time don't do the crime. You would rather reward a rapist with pornography than have a criminal get turd tagged, WTF? Get your priorities in order...
Rape is a punishment in inferior cultures, not in ours.

Ohhh poor criminal, he got his shit pushed in by bubba, so fucking what. If you can't do the time don't do the crime. You would rather reward a rapist with pornography than have a criminal get turd tagged, WTF? Get your priorities in order...

We do have our priorities in order, but it appears you are operating under a false assumption. Put simply, if you're looking for the Whisky Tango Foxtrot moment in this debate, consider what you've just said: the best way to deal with convicted murderers and rapists is to make their life living hells and just generally piss them off. Then, if it still hasn't occurred to you exactly how wrong what you've just suggested can go, try Googling "Attica State Prison Riot". Since you've obviously not considered that what might happen when you aggravate convicted murderers is that they kill a bunch of guards, hold others hostage, and require the National Guard to put them down with napalm, which is what happened at the tough-love Attica during the 1970's, it might just be educational.

Rape is a punishment in inferior cultures, not in ours.

I agree with your view point but I disagree with the term "inferior cultures" It's not inferior... just different.

OK so those covicted of rape should be able to feed their already unhealthy addiction to female nudity???

Just pointing out a fallacy in your argument; rape is rarely about sex and almost always about power or control.

I agree with your view point but I disagree with the term "inferior cultures" It's not inferior... just different.

. . .I'm going to go on the assumption that you missed part of what he just said. A society that punishes a person by raping him is decidedly inferior to a society that punishes him by putting him in a prison cell for an extended period of time. The latter shows a marked respect for the inherent dignity in a person even in spite of their breaking the law; the former does not.

Rape is a punishment in inferior cultures, not in ours.

I don't condone prison rape but I'm darn sure more concerned about handing porn to a rapist than if some bubba makes a playground out of his ass. If he didn't want to be prison raped he should not have gone to prison.

I agree with your view point but I disagree with the term "inferior cultures" It's not inferior... just different.
Well you're free to think cultures that use rape as punishment are equal to you, but I have higher standards.

Id like to see the study though, it may still have some validity regarding men in prison as opposed to desire for sex at large where there is hope for consensual sex with a hetero partner.The studies to which I refer did not consider prisoners... they looked at the general population.

I don't have them ready-to-hand, but I'll ask my dad next time we talk. He did his dissertation in psychology by designing an experiment to treat sex offenders, so I suspect he'll have a good idea of the facts.

Well you're free to think cultures that use rape as punishment are equal to you, but I have higher standards.

Well considering what goes on in Guantonamo we are that culture. Also, we are not able to look at it objectively because we were raised in this culture, we are raised to think it is better. This is not true all the time but in a lot of cases.... But either way one aspect shouldn't define the whole culture.


And let the inmates of their porno. They're getting punished enough as it is.

We do have our priorities in order, but it appears you are operating under a false assumption. Put simply, if you're looking for the Whisky Tango Foxtrot moment in this debate, consider what you've just said: the best way to deal with convicted murderers and rapists is to make their life living hells and just generally piss them off. Then, if it still hasn't occurred to you exactly how wrong what you've just suggested can go, try Googling "Attica State Prison Riot". Since you've obviously not considered that what might happen when you aggravate convicted murderers is that they kill a bunch of guards, hold others hostage, and require the National Guard to put them down with napalm, which is what happened at the tough-love Attica during the 1970's, it might just be educational.

Fuck waiting for the national guard, take away the bean bags and give the prison guards REAL shotgun shells and tazers w/ lethal voltages and let the prison guards do their job if the inmates get out of hand. BEFORE GUARDS GET KILLED. You disgusting pussies that want to coddle prisoners so they don't get upset are such a joke, YOU are the reason their prisons are more like resorts than f'ing prisons. These people committed crimes serious enough to land them there and the time they serve should be just as if not MORE serious, they need to learn a lesson. Thanks to people like you a good percentage of them end up right back in there. Make them regret their poor choices and give them some motivation to become productive members of society upon their return. If they return to society and repeat offend on serious offenses (murder, rape, etc, w/ indisputeable evidence since this sounds very extreme) execute their asses, they failed the final exam. Do it by federal statute as well so that the liberal states won't be safe havens for them either.

Just pointing out a fallacy in your argument; rape is rarely about sex and almost always about power or control.Well, that's a half-truth that's gotten a bit too much play.

Naturally rape is about sex, as there are plenty of alternative ways people work out their power issues; men are drawn to rape through a complex set of motivations, which may include power issues... but which probably also include sexual issues.

Commonly, rapists are repressing some complicated sexual conflict, including deeply repressed homosexuality. "Asserting" themselves as "woman-taking" men can be a way to avoid dealing with their real feelings.

This is even more common in the wide variety of "near-rape" victimizations--"near" in the legal sense, but probably actually rape under moral or ethical consideration. This includes men who routinely get women drunk to have sex with them, and men who exert various kinds of pressure (social and otherwise) to "get" sex.

There have been several interesting sociological studies finding that (some, not all) college fraternities are essentially organized "rape clubs," in which members help to create situations such as those above, and in which they routinely "cover" for their brothers' indiscretions. The same studies have revealed evidence that these particular "clubs" have major issues with their own sexuality.

Interesting stuff... and extremely difficult to treat.

EDIT: Difficult to treat largely because our society does not really consider most sexual victimization a "problem," so that men dealing with these issues rarely understand that they need help... until it's too late, and they graduate from legally allowable (or impossible to prosecute) victimizations to rape as it is legally defined.

Rapists don't come from "nowhere."

Ohhh poor criminal, he got his shit pushed in by bubba, so fucking what.

Oh, so rape is not illegal if you're raping a criminal?

If you can't do the time don't do the crime. You would rather reward a rapist with pornography than have a criminal get turd tagged, WTF?

I would rather give him the right to have porn than have him rape a criminal, yes.

Get your priorities in order...

They are, in fact, in order. If anything is not in order here, I believe it would be your empathy.

Fuck waiting for the national guard, take away the bean bags and give the prison guards REAL shotgun shells and tazers w/ lethal voltages and let the prison guards do their job if the inmates get out of hand. BEFORE GUARDS GET KILLED.

You disgusting pussies

Oh, so you like men, eh? I have a friend I can hook you up with, if you'd like.

that want to coddle prisoners so they don't get upset are such a joke, YOU are the reason their prisons are more like resorts than f'ing prisons.

Just because they committed a crime doesn't mean they shouldn't be treated humanely. You want to treat them like they're animals.

These people committed crimes serious enough to land them there and the time they serve should be just as if not MORE serious, they need to learn a lesson.

There's no reason they can't learn their lesson if they are treated humanely.

Thanks to people like you a good percentage of them end up right back in there.

Or could it be because of you?

Make them regret their poor choices and give them some motivation to productive members of society upon their return.

You seem to be missing a word in that sentence.

If they return to society and repeat offend on serious offenses (murder, rape, etc, w/ indisputeable evidence since this sounds very extreme) execute their asses, they failed the final exam.

Last time I checked, college professors don't shoot their students for failing the final exam.

Do it by federal statute as well so that the liberal states won't be safe havens for them either.

Yeah, and Britain has a low serious crime rate because they execute people.

I don't condone prison rape

I refer you to a quote of yours in an earlier post in this thread.

Ohhh poor criminal, he got his shit pushed in by bubba, so fucking what.

So that means you don't care if they get raped or not?

but I'm darn sure more concerned about handing porn to a rapist than if some bubba makes a playground out of his ass.

You seem to not be reading most of the arguments.

If he didn't want to be prison raped he should not have gone to prison.

So if an innocent man gets sent to prison and is repeatedly raped, it's his fault? Right.

So if an innocent man gets sent to prison and is repeatedly raped, it's his fault? Right.Or, for that matter, a man justly convicted on a minor charge... how is it just that he gets RAPED for it??

Last I heard, even the most conservative position on punishment stopped somewhere around "an eye for an eye." On that logic, rape would be a just punishment only for the rapist... not the burglar, the car thief, the tax evader and the defrauder!!

Give 'em National Geographic and Easyriders, if they're using their own money, let them have their Hustler too.

A group of prisoners in Indiana are sueing the department of corrections to restore their rights to read magazines and books such as Easyriders, Hustler, and National Geographic. What use is a constitutionally protected free press if the government can ban people from reading? Good luck to these fine felons. May you be victorious in your struggle for freedom and boobies.

http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060712/LOCAL/607120485

Convicted fellons, by reason of their conviction for crimes against the citizens, have forfited many of their "rights." Besides, there is no Constitutional right to read. :eek:

Besides, there is no Constitutional right to read. :eek:
Press? Doesn't that count as having access to Press?

Press? Doesn't that count as having access to Press?

No. Freedom of the press means they can print whatever they want, it does not mean you have a "right to read" what they print. If it did, every illiterate person in the country could sue someone because they can't read. :rolleyes:

Convicted fellons, by reason of their conviction for crimes against the citizens, have forfited many of their "rights." Besides, there is no Constitutional right to read. :eek:
They forfeit some rights in order to keep the rest of society safe. Stopping their access to read or filtering their letters that have nothing to do with a crime is a rather un-necessary wasteful and stupid restriction on rights.

No. Freedom of the press means they can print whatever they want, it does not mean you have a "right to read" what they print.
Actually, it may...

I'd have to search for the case law, but I'm pretty sure there are cases dealing with government attempts to prohibit certain items, not from being printed, but from being distributed through the mail... or perhaps other instances in which the attempt was to disrupt distribution rather than to restrict "printing."

Restrictions on materials available to inmates could face legal attacks along the same lines.

I think they should check the mail for things involving illegal activities, but who cares if they're getting "sexually explicit" mail?
I know right? I mean hell, they should have the right to read what they want, when they want.

I mean, it's not like they're in prison or anything. OH WAIT..

I know right? I mean hell, they should have the right to read what they want, when they want.

I mean, it's not like they're in prison or anything. OH WAIT..
And how does restricting their ability to read help ANYBODY? (assuming it is non crime related)

Seriously some people just do these things just to be petty … seems rather pathetic to me

OK so those covicted of rape should be able to feed their already unhealthy addiction to female nudity??? Use some common sense here WTF can possibly be gained by allowing felons to have porn? Absolutely NOTHING constructive, that's for sure...
Well, of course.
It's a well known fact that rapists have an unhealthy addiction to female nudity.
It's also a well-known fact that men rape cause they want to have sex due to then reading tons of porn before-hand.

Nothing to do with asserting power over the victims or anything, eh? Just all to do with sex, nofink else.

Ohhh poor criminal, he got his shit pushed in by bubba, so fucking what. If you can't do the time don't do the crime. You would rather reward a rapist with pornography than have a criminal get turd tagged, WTF? Get your priorities in order...
thank you! If they didnt want to get raped and deal with other prison issues, they shouldnt have committed a crime. I dont understand why its hard for bleeding hearts to understand.

thank you! If they didnt want to get raped and deal with other prison issues, they shouldnt committed a crime. I dont understand why its hard for bleeding hearts to understand.
And I don’t understand why so many of the heartless cant understand that just because they can not be members of society does not mean that we should just fuck with prisoners because we can

Seriously some people just do these things just to be petty … seems rather pathetic to me
Well, unless you're a congressmen, judge, officer, or prisoner, it doesn't matter what you think now, does it?

They're prisoners, prison isn't fun. They're lucky they have a bed to sleep in and food to eat. Prison costs me and everybody else up in hear tax dollars, who's being punished here?

Why should I have to pay my money so some lowlife can live a comfy life inside a jail cell where he can read, write, watch tv, workout, hell, we should all be so lucky as to be in prison!

The point of prison is to be a punishment. They're lucky they're not beaten daily as a partof thier discipline.. That's why our prisons are so crowded, people are not AFRAID of prison. If the prisons were dirty, deadly, and dangerous. I can assure you, there'd be alot less criminals. Or atleast they'd smarten up and get caught less..

Prisons are a violation of OUR rights. It's bad enough they're in prison for breaking the law, but then they only act criminal further by stealing OUR money to feed thier ass. Hell no. I want to know they're being treated poorly and cruely. THAT's justice..

And I don’t understand why so many of the heartless cant understand that just because they can not be members of society does not mean that we should just fuck with prisoners because we can
no, because criminals are a diease that would destroy society if left untreated they are scum. And we can fuck with them because they are scum, plain and simple. Their life has little value to me.

No. Freedom of the press means they can print whatever they want, it does not mean you have a "right to read" what they print. If it did, every illiterate person in the country could sue someone because they can't read. :rolleyes:

But what's the point of being able to print it if the gouvernment can restrict other peoples access. Note in my post I did not say right to read just the right to access it without gouvernment interference.

*I'm not a citizen of the USA therefore I'm not as informed of their your rights as I am of my own so I may be wrong but what you're saying just doesn't make sense to me.

no, because criminals are a diease that would destroy society if left untreated they are scum. And we can fuck with them because they are scum, plain and simple. Their life has little value to me.
Exactly, everytime I think about the tax dollars spent to keep these banes on society alive, I think about another healthcare plan gone down the drain, another college fund burned, another operation having to be postponed.

To keep rapists, serial killers, child-molesters, drug-dealers, and other miscrants alive and well..

mindless facist kneejerk immature reactions showing very little understanding and even less empathy or comphrehension.
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no, because criminals are a diease that would destroy society if left untreated they are scum. And we can fuck with them because they are scum, plain and simple. Their life has little value to me.
Hopefully society as a whole is more mature then that

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you can call me a troll or facist or whatever all you like. It still doesnt make me wrong on this, sorry.

you can call me a troll or facist or whatever all you like. It still doesnt make me wrong on this, sorry.
Ehh so far you have done nothing to show you are right either

Take away porn, let 'em have National Geographic. In fact, outlaw freeweights and stock a library instead. Or, even better: trade school. Hmm, now there's a novel idea: have prisoners do something productive while they're being punished. At least that was society has a net benefit when they get out.

Take away porn, let 'em have National Geographic. In fact, outlaw freeweights and stock a library instead. Or, even better: trade school. Hmm, now there's a novel idea: have prisoners do something productive while their being punished. At least that was society has a net benefit when they get out.
Now that sugestion is one of the better ones in this thread so far. Hopefully we can keep society safe while having them be productive and possibly learn something that if/when they get out they can possibly avoid the mistakes of their past

Ehh so far you have done nothing to show you are right either
Actually I have, if you read my posts. Criminals lose rights, thats part of life when commit crimes. For them to then complain and whine about their situation is truly laughable. I dont see how anyone can see it any different.

Actually I have, if you read my posts. Criminals lose rights, thats part of life when commit crimes. For them to then complain and whine about their situation is truly laughable. I dont see how anyone can see it any different.
I don’t know this little tool called empathy

Now we are not having issue with their loss of freedom and other rights that are necessary for society’s safety

Rather this petty little shit that does not help anyone except those that have a pathetic petty sense of vengeance that does not help anyone. We should be spending time and money on making sure society is safe

I don’t know this little tool called empathy

Now we are not having issue with their loss of freedom and other rights that are necessary for society’s safety

Rather this petty little shit that does not help anyone except those that have a pathetic petty sense of vengeance that does not help anyone. We should be spending time and money on making sure society is safe
I have ZERO empathy for criminals, although I have quite a bit for their victims of their crimes. I argee we should be spending time and money on making sure society is safe but doesnt mean giving criminals porn mags.

I have ZERO empathy for criminals, although I have quite a bit for their victims of their crimes. I argee we should be spending time and money on making sure society is safe but doesnt mean giving criminals porn mags.
No one was talking about GIVING it to them. This was a story about allowing them to be possessed by them

Not only that but if you actually read the story these rule sets can be used to filter LETTERS sent to them by spouses/friends.

I agree that this should not be a service provided by the state absolutely but we should not be filtering their personal letters either just because they have erotic content

No one was talking about GIVING it to them. This was a story about allowing them to be possessed by them
same difference

Not only that but if you actually read the story these rule sets can be used to filter LETTERS sent to them by spouses/friends.

I agree that this should not be a service provided by the state absolutely but we should not be filtering their personal letters either just because they have erotic content
their personal letters should of course be filtered, its part of being in prison. God knows what people would send them. Drugs, weapons, anything.

same difference

their personal letters should of course be filtered, its part of being in prison. God knows what people would send them. Drugs, weapons, anything.
No it is not in one case the state and the tax dollars is going to providing a luxery in the other the prisoner or his family does so if they please


For dangerous items yes things that are illegal yes but not because for non crime related content

Ok, since when did "the right to have porno mag" get added to the consitution? While I do agree that these prisons are more like resorts than actual pound in the ass prisons nowanddays, they do have to treat the prisoners humanily. And by humanily, I'm talking like three square meals a day, a bed, clothes, and some outdoor time. That should be it. It should be the bare minnimums. The only TV they should be allowed to have is in the communial room. Letters of course should be read, because they may stop a drug deal, or a bust out, whatever. I have no problem with prisoners working on a skill, or learning a skill that they can use outside the prison, but that is it.

Ok, since when did "the right to have porno mag" get added to the consitution? While I do agree that these prisons are more like resorts than actual pound in the ass prisons nowanddays, they do have to treat the prisoners humanily. And by humanily, I'm talking like three square meals a day, a bed, clothes, and some outdoor time. That should be it. It should be the bare minnimums. The only TV they should be allowed to have is in the communial room. Letters of course should be read, because they may stop a drug deal, or a bust out, whatever. I have no problem with prisoners working on a skill, or learning a skill that they can use outside the prison, but that is it.
Sense when did people have the right to a car in the constitution … or any of a thousand different things we take for granted. The 14th amendment grants those rights . As far as restricting some of them for safety sake (both ours and theirs) . I can understand

But how in the hell does this sort of non crime related restriction help anyone? Either society or them. I don’t see how it does in any way shape or form.

Ok, since when did "the right to have porno mag" get added to the consitution?

From the 14th ammendment:

nor shall any state deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law

So unless a court decides that the inmate should be deprived of pornography (which I could see in the case of truly sick sex criminals), they can't take away the porno mag, which is the inmate's property. While it's true that the court has already seen fit to deprive th inmate of his liberty, I think it would be unconstitutional to assume that it has also given the state the right to derpive him of property on a arbitrary basis.

From the 14th ammendment:



So unless a court decides that the inmate should be deprived of pornography (which I could see in the case of truly sick sex criminals), they can't take away the porno mag, which is the inmate's property. While it's true that the court has already seen fit to deprive th inmate of his liberty, I think it would be unconstitutional to assume that it has also given the state the right to derpive him of property on a arbitrary basis.
Agreed, if there were helping society or the inmate then possibly there could be some justification but so far no one has had any other then arbitrary petty reasoning for depriving them of more rights then necessary

Sense when did people have the right to a car in the constitution … or any of a thousand different things we take for granted. The 14th amendment grants those rights .


Actually, it's a privillage to drive, not a right. and section 1 of the 14th actually state,

Section 1. All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the State wherein they reside. No State shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any State deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.

Due Process of law means going to trail and be judged by your peers. So these people that are already in prison well they already went through the due process of law.


But how in the hell does this sort of non crime related restriction help anyone? Either society or them. I don’t see how it does in any way shape or form.

It helps them because Prison isn't susspose to be fun, it's susspose to be a hard and terrible place that you would want to avoid. Nowanddays prisoners can get cable TV, Internet, musical instruments etc. I mean jeez, what next a spa?

From the 14th ammendment:



So unless a court decides that the inmate should be deprived of pornography (which I could see in the case of truly sick sex criminals), they can't take away the porno mag, which is the inmate's property. While it's true that the court has already seen fit to deprive th inmate of his liberty, I think it would be unconstitutional to assume that it has also given the state the right to derpive him of property on a arbitrary basis.

Actually, they already went through the due process of law when they went to trial, sooo, sorry that argument falls flat on it's face.

snip

It helps them because Prison isn't susspose to be fun, it's susspose to be a hard and terrible place that you would want to avoid. Nowanddays prisoners can get cable TV, Internet, musical instruments etc. I mean jeez, what next a spa?
You people bitch but it is the prison administrators that wish for the cable TV lol

People always bring this up but they very rarely realize prison officials want it because it reduces prisoner violence.

You may not like it but I am sure the guards are happy being safer

You people bitch but it is the prison administrators that wish for the cable TV lol

People always bring this up but they very rarely realize prison officials want it because it reduces prisoner violence.

You may not like it but I am sure the guards are happy being safer

and yet, we still hear about prison violence on the evening news...

I really wish I was alive during the Alcatraz years, now THAT was a prison.

and yet, we still hear about prison violence on the evening news...

I really wish I was alive during the Alcatraz years, now THAT was a prison.
I said reduced not eliminated

I said reduced not eliminated

True. But how is it fair, that these prisoners get stuff like cable TV, Internet all that good stuff, when there are good hard working folks that can't get all the stuff that the prisoners get?

Actually, they already went through the due process of law when they went to trial, sooo, sorry that argument falls flat on it's face.

Read what I wrote next time instead of giving it a cursory glance.

The inmate has been deprived of his liberty and any appropriate property by judgement of the courts. That judgement however, does not entitle the govenrment to deprive him of property not ordered seized by the courts, does it?

True. But how is it fair, that these prisoners get stuff like cable TV, Internet all that good stuff, when there are good hard working folks that can't get all the stuff that the prisoners get?
How is it unfair? It’s a tool to keep the prison faculty safe.

If it were a Luxury just for the sake of luxury then I would be with you all the way but personally if it saves the life of law abiding prison staff it is worth every cent.

Read what I wrote next time instead of giving it a cursory glance.

The inmate has been deprived of his liberty and any appropriate property by judgement of the courts. That judgement however, does not entitle the govenrment to deprive him of property not ordered seized by the courts, does it?

Yea, but the consitution doesn't say only the rights and property that was ordered to be seized by the courts. It just says that Government should not infringed on the rights to Life, Liberty, and Property without due process of law. Since these guys have already went through the due process of laws, they lose these rights and any proprety that they held before, or any property that they may hold while in prison.

How is it unfair? It’s a tool to keep the prison faculty safe.

If it were a Luxury just for the sake of luxury then I would be with you all the way but personally if it saves the life of law abiding prison staff it is worth every cent.

If you want to protect the prison staff, then get rid of the stupid bean bag guns and give them REAL guns, with REAL bullets.

If you want to protect the prison staff, then get rid of the stupid bean bag guns and give them REAL guns, with REAL bullets.
Show me some good hard stats that show how that would make the prison system safer and I would probably back it.
Personally when I have done consulting work for the prison here the dogs and the sheer presence of guards is intense but we have a “Gateway” prison so it is a bit different then long term housing.