NationStates Jolt Archive

Was just thinking after the ornage walks this weekend does this happen in America? Not that the walks are sectarian at all (hmmm). I know alot of ulster scots emmigrated there and of course alot of Irish catholics, maybe i would have caused afew problems like it does in Glasgow. I didn't think so until the other week i met a guy from Boston and I asked if he was catholic as apparently Boston is really catholic and he got surprisingly defensive about it and i didnt want to keep prodding him about it. Can anyone enlighten me?

All nations over the world should help each other.
Big Snip

You didn't have to go and do that to get your point across.

Our sectarian holidays in the US are:

Cinco De Mayo
St. Patricks Day
Oktoberfest
Mardi Gras
Christmas

I kinda lost you there mate in the first sentence. All nations should what each other? might have to look over it again. I agree they should do as well but you need to know the problem first before you can help the country. So anyanswers to my OP?

Our sectarian holidays in the US are:

Cinco De Mayo
St. Patricks Day
Oktoberfest
Mardi Gras
Christmas

Are you joking? How are they sectarian? I mean as in violence, hostility or prejudice between catholics and protestants. Especially okeoberfest haha.

*cue trademark stunned look* eh?

I think I'll have a big cup o' WTF?

*drinks*

No, Catholics and Protestants feel no need to blow each other up in America, or beat each other's heads in.

I think I'll have a big cup o' WTF?

*drinks*

My head hurts.

Do you have some spare WTF I can borrow?

I can see by my resposnes that sectarianism isn't even an issue in america. The thought of it seems to confuse you. Thats a good thing. Might move there.

I can see by my resposnes that sectarianism isn't even an issue in america. The thought of it seems to confuse you. Thats a good thing. Might move there.

No, I just think your question confused people. Sectarianism isn't as much of an issue in the States because sectarianism belies a much deeper set of problems in Northern Ireland.

Its wholly wrong and stereotypical to portay the problems merely being "a war between Catholics and Protestants''.

How do you mean?

I'm guessing your from Northern Ireland. My point is that When Irish immigrants moved to Scotland it caused sectarian problems. What I'm talking about is reffering to catholic-protestant rivalry and seperation, where they had seperate schools, football teams, streets, companies to work for and people were and still are discriminate against because of it. I didn't expect there to be terorists or rebel groups in America. I know there's other forms of sectarianism but in this case i mean the catholic/protestant divide.

How do you mean?
It just.... wasn't very well structured that's all. :p

I'm guessing your from Northern Ireland.
I'm not, no. But there are several posters on here who are.

My point is that When Irish immigrants moved to Scotland it caused sectarian problems. What I'm talking about is reffering to catholic-protestant rivalry and seperation, where they had seperate schools, football teams, streets, companies to work for and people were and still are discriminate against because of it. I didn't expect there to be terorists or rebel groups in America. I know there's other forms of sectarianism but in this case i mean the catholic/protestant divide.

The reasons (although there are many) the situation is the way it is in Scotland, are because the traditional links both cultural, historical and geographical between especially the North of Ireland and Scotland, as well as the influence of England in both.

America is different (again for many reasons) but for one, it was simply far removed from the problems of sectarianism at home. It was a blank slate, a clean start in the 'New World'.

Don't forget, originally in Ulster it was not purely Catholics on one side and 'Protestants' on the other. The Presbyterians were often discriminated against by the majority (the Ascendancy) alongside the Catholics. For a long time (up until the late 19th C if I recall) the Presbyterians and Catholics were often united in their calls for equality.

In the States, these divisions were mainly left behind and the focus was on starting anew from scratch. In time, they became 'Americanised' and cared less about the religious divisions at home.

The last great divide I can think of would be when Kennedy was elected President. That scared a lot of people, purely because they thought his loyalties would be to Rome. (Reminds me of 'Home Rule=Rome Rule'). For the average person, today it means nothing. All that matters is whether or not you are American I suppose. :p

Don't forget, originally in Ulster it was not purely Catholics on one side and 'Protestants' on the other. The Presbyterians were often discriminated against by the majority (the Ascendancy) alongside the Catholics.

Not just the Presbyterians, Protestant Dissenters as a whole.

For a long time (up until the late 19th C if I recall) the Presbyterians and Catholics were often united in their calls for equality.

Case in point the Society of the United Irishmen; equal rights and freedom for "Protestant, Catholic and Dissenter"

Not just the Presbyterians, Protestant Dissenters as a whole.

*slaps forehead*
Dissenter! I knew I forgot something. :)


Case in point the Society of the United Irishmen; equal rights and freedom for "Protestant, Catholic and Dissenter"
Bless Second-Level history drilling that into me.

Bless Second-Level history drilling that into me.

And if they had succeeded we would have an Ireland completely independent since the late 18th C, with hardly a glimpse of the large social and religious problems in the north generated in the 19th C.

Pity, almost, but then the north (well, let's be honest, Belfast) also wouldn't have seen the massive industrial and economic growth it enjoyed in that same period.

wonder why that guy got so defensive then. Sure there's nothing like that around the Boston area?

wonder why that guy got so defensive then. Sure there's nothing like that around the Boston area?

I could be wrong or just looking the wrong direction but I havent seen anything like what you describe in the US. Ive shut down dinner conversation completely by asking about protestant v catholic in Bristol but never seen it here. We compensate with racism mostly. That will shut down dinner conversation here like nothing else.

Bristol, England? Thats strange, suppose it depends who was at the table. Were you in a church? There's anumber of ways you can shut down dinner conversations. You seem like an expert. How else have you done it?

Bristol, England? Thats strange, suppose it depends who was at the table. Were you in a church? There's anumber of ways you can shut down dinner conversations. You seem like an expert. How else have you done it?

Yes Bristol England.

No not at a church.

I can shut down dinner convos but have seldom silenced a Bostonian.

Are Bostonians quite talkative? Sorry I'm being nosy, just inetersted in the stereotypes Americans have of other Americans.

Are Bostonians quite talkative? Sorry I'm being nosy, just inetersted in the stereotypes Americans have of other Americans.

Yes but almost completely unintelligible when toasted.

What other stereotypes do you want?

New York, LA, Seattle any obvious 1s really. I heard New Yorkers are really fussy.

New York, LA, Seattle any obvious 1s really. I heard New Yorkers are really fussy.

I dont know any New Yorkers. Seattlites tend to be boring and oddly prideful of it. Angelinos are more laid back than is healthy until they drive and overcompensate for it.

Was just thinking after the ornage walks this weekend does this happen in America? Not that the walks are sectarian at all (hmmm). I know alot of ulster scots emmigrated there and of course alot of Irish catholics, maybe i would have caused afew problems like it does in Glasgow. I didn't think so until the other week i met a guy from Boston and I asked if he was catholic as apparently Boston is really catholic and he got surprisingly defensive about it and i didnt want to keep prodding him about it. Can anyone enlighten me?

There is sectarianism in North America but it is much more subtle in its form than in Northern Ireland and Scotland. Any Americans been in an Irish Bar in the States and been asked to donate "for the boys across the water"? IRA funding by any other name but shhhh Sinn Fein says that they don't get money that way. Also high political office tends not to go to Catholics, even white Catholics.

The various St Patricks Day Parades (dons helmet and body armour) have been hijacked by Irish Republicans and are not necessarily an expression of Irishness where certain people have tried to put an Anti-British agenda onto the parade. This can be seen as a logical course to take given the course of American History, because it gives common cause thus engenders support.

People seem to think that if you are Irish you are Catholic. Wrong.. read Frank McCourts autobiography and you will see that his father was protestant and was discriminated because of this after the formation of the Irish Free State. There is a small group in the US that collects money for the Unionist paramilitaries and once made statements to that effect on the BBC news.

On a lighter note, people couldn't understand why two hairy arsed Scots were pissing themselves laughing in Syracuse NY when they saw the name and Emblem of the local University Basketball team, the Syracuse Orangemen, whose emblem was an Orange Leprechaun. (FYI, an Orangeman is a Unionist usually quite radical and anti-catholic who see themselves as British first and foremost, whilst the leprechaun is seen as an Irish symbol.)

I dont know any New Yorkers. Seattlites tend to be boring and oddly prideful of it. Angelinos are more laid back than is healthy until they drive and overcompensate for it.


New Yorkers embrace the stereotype of the "rude New Yorker". In fact, they seem to play it up for the tourists.

While there may not be violence hear in the states over Catholic/Protestant, depending on where you live you will be treated differently and even with some prejudice. My mom is Catholic and she works for a Presbyterian school. The bitch principal treated her pretty harshly during her interview process. It's a surprise she even got the job. Keep in mind that this is Oklahoma. It has a huge Protestant population.

Don't forget all the fundamentalist nut jobs like Jack Chick, Bill Schnoebolen, and David Hunt who think Catholics are the devil, anti-christ, etc. Literary attacks are much more prevalent in America than physical attacks. Just go to your local Mardels if you don't believe me. You'll find all kinds of anti-catholic stuff in there.

Are you joking? How are they sectarian? I mean as in violence, hostility or prejudice between catholics and protestants. Especially okeoberfest haha.
Of course I'm joking. I'm making light of a serious issue, by virtue of the fact that individual ethnicities holiday's have been adopted by the entire country each as a special reason to drink heavily!

"Of course I'm joking. I'm making light of a serious issue, by virtue of the fact that individual ethnicities holiday's have been adopted by the entire country each as a special reason to drink heavily!"

Haha I thought you were joking but its hard to tell over the internet and for a split second I thought maybe you thought sectarianism was alcoholism or something.

Has there not been any catholic presidents then? Was Kennedy catholic?

Has there not been any catholic presidents then? Was Kennedy catholic?
Yep, Kennedy was Catholic.

We've had a couple Catholic candidates for the spot as well.

Has there not been any catholic presidents then? Was Kennedy catholic?

Yes, Kennedy was Catholic, but he was the first Catholic president (and only one, so far).

There isn't lots and lots of sectarianism now, but there used to be loads. The Cathedral in Philadelphia was built with its stained-glass windows higher than the height an average man can throw a brick. There are still Catholic schools, but they accept students of all or no faiths.

My friend told me that when she moved to Tennessee, her neighbor's told them, "y'all are real nice for Catholics.":rolleyes:

Yep, Kennedy was Catholic.

We've had a couple Catholic candidates for the spot as well.

Is kind of funny. Kennedy is by some respects still one of the most revered Presidents and no has knows exactly why. Something about charisma, tragic figure, and somewhere the reference camelot is in there :p

Yes, I would have to say the collection for IRA funds in the US is very overt, just go into an Irish bar. Was at its worst during the troubles, god knows how many tens of millions of dollars made it over the sea back then and armed the militias against the British.