NationStates Jolt Archive

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060705/ap_on_re_us/simpl_wurdz

I really want to know if these people are serious? Spelling in english isn't the easiest, but that doesn't mean we should change the spelling just to accomodate the lazy people and "make it easier for children to learn to read" I mean, I don't know about you, but I learned to read normal words.

How is that "literacy"?

It hurt my brain to read that :(

It's been 100 years since Andrew Carnegie helped create the Simplified Spelling Board to promote a retooling of written English and President Theodore Roosevelt tried to force the government to use simplified spelling in its publications. But advocates aren't giving up.

They even picket the national spelling bee finals, held every year in Washington, costumed as bumble bees and hoisting signs that say "Enuf is enuf but enough is too much" or "I'm thru with through."

Thae sae th bee selebraets th ability of a fue stoodents to master a dificult sistem that stumps meny utherz hoo cuud do just as wel if speling were simpler.

I cannot find a word for how stupid these people are. Truly, it is just completely, mind-numbingly stupid to picket spelling bees because the words are too hard to spell. I've tutored mentally-retarded students that could spell better than these people.

Spelling bees are a pointless waste of time though

Thae sae th bee selebraets th ability of a fue stoodents to master a dificult sistem that stumps meny utherz hoo cuud do just as wel if speling were simpler.

Americans doen't aulwaez go for whut's eezy — witnes th faeluer of th metric sistem to cach on. But propoenents of simpler speling noet that a smatering of aulterd spelingz hav maed th leep into evrydae ues.
stuff like that hurts my eyes

I understand if youre texting from your phone, or have a billion MSN convos going at once, but make that official spelling? bad idea, and I dont even live were theyre trying to do this, yet I will protest it if it comes "thru"

wouldn't that decrease literacy? I mean wading though it I had trouble keeping up....

It's not that hard to learn to read, and besides the current spelling of English words has helped me learn French, Spanish and of course Latin.

English is too much a mish mash of crap to adopt that.
The entire language would have to be overhauled, not just spelling.

The literacy rate is 96%... What's wrong with that?

Can you say "newspeak". Seriously this is stupid. It's dumb ideas like this that have given the stupid people the upper hand. You don't dumb down language because a few people don't want to go to the trouble of learning and using proper spelling. This is the stupidest thing I've ever heard. I feel dumber just thinking about.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060705/ap_on_re_us/simpl_wurdz

I really want to know if these people are serious? Spelling in english isn't the easiest, but that doesn't mean we should change the spelling just to accomodate the lazy people and "make it easier for children to learn to read" I mean, I don't know about you, but I learned to read normal words.

I fail to understand why any spelling is easier to learn than any other spelling. English isn't phonetic. It never has been.

Phonetic spellings are only easier if you learn the spoken language first. You could solve this problem by learning the two languages simultaneously. Or learning the written language first.

Thae sae th bee selebraets th ability of a fue stoodents to master a dificult sistem that stumps meny utherz hoo cuud do just as wel if speling were simpler.

Americans doen't aulwaez go for whut's eezy — witnes th faeluer of th metric sistem to cach on. But propoenents of simpler speling noet that a smatering of aulterd spelingz hav maed th leep into evrydae ues.
There's a few problems here...

Shouldn't the 'ae' to replace a long 'a' sound be 'ai'?
'witnes' should really be 'witnis'.
'metric' should be 'metrick' or 'metrik'

Idiots.

As for the actual issue, it would involve re-writing every piece of literature ever, in order to make it intelligible to future generations. That's just fucking stupid. Stick with the current system and shut the hell up about it.

It's not a good idea. It looks stupid, it works badly, and it will only serve to make the lazy lazier.

It took me longer to work out what the words actually ment like that, its crazy, I shouldnt have to spend so much time just working out what it means. I say er gat a :sniper: and despose of the supporters of this!

It hurt my brain to read that :(
Well then, let's have a look at it Mr. Gumby.

It hurt my brain to read that :(
Probably because whoever wrote it is a fucktard who can't even simplify the English language to its phonetic approximations properly.

When we lived in California, my daughters were the subjects of yet another experiment in public education. Apparently, spelling had fallen out of style and the traditional spelling lists were replaced by a bad idea known as "Whole Language". This amounted to sending kids home with a book a day, but without any instruction in how to read it. What a couple of frustrated kids we had. Writing was about the same. The kids would be asked to write something, but spelling and grammar were ignored.

Fortunately, we moved to a more traditional area, where we could find decent private schools that were able to undo the damage done by the government.

*wonders if those who are pushing for simpler spellings are the same people who barely passed english.*

Webster tried that in the early 19th century. It was, for lack of a better term, a fucking disaster that did nothing but waste time and money.

In theory, a revised simplified universal english language makes a certain kind of sense. But it reminds me of 1984 far too much.

Double-plus ungood.

*wonders if those who are pushing for simpler spellings are the same people who barely passed english.*
No offense to anyone who teaches, but they well could be Education majors. Those grads do the worst, statistically, on most GRE tests. Anecdotally, I see a lot of literature taught in schools, but not much grammar. It's kind of like teaching math with a calculator. Unless you learn the rules, you can't go on to advanced work.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060705/ap_on_re_us/simpl_wurdz

I really want to know if these people are serious? Spelling in english isn't the easiest, but that doesn't mean we should change the spelling just to accomodate the lazy people and "make it easier for children to learn to read" I mean, I don't know about you, but I learned to read normal words.
Because the PC police don't want the school's to hurt the feelings of the kids who get a lot of F's. That might make them feel bad! Oh no! Instead of teaching them proper English, let them be morons who have good self-esteem. Those people protesting correct spellings get my "Dumbass of the day" award(They will be sharing it with the moron who killed the Tongan royalty. If any of them are reading this(Which I doubt, as people who use this forum are overall highly intelligent) Allow me to dumb it down for them:

Helo, u gis r a bunch of dumasss nd r faleeurs at lif hoo cannot even git a job at Micdonolds beecuz theay dont ackcept peepel with IQs uf naguhtiv 2.

God, that was hard to do.

In theory, a revised simplified universal english language makes a certain kind of sense. But it reminds me of 1984 far too much.

Trying to standardize the language only causes it to stagnate; English is a dynamic language because it can evolve in response to changing trends, cultures and technology.

this is old, like old old.

Trying to standardize the language only causes it to stagnate; English is a dynamic language because it can evolve in response to changing trends, cultures and technology.

Yeah, I know. It's not french. But simplifying some of the rules might not be a bad idea.

But then again, most of us manage just fine.

Yeah, I know. It's not french. But simplifying some of the rules might not be a bad idea.

But then again, most of us manage just fine.

English spelling doesn't actually follow rules. Once people realise that, the problem goes away.

When we lived in California, my daughters were the subjects of yet another experiment in public education. Apparently, spelling had fallen out of style and the traditional spelling lists were replaced by a bad idea known as "Whole Language". This amounted to sending kids home with a book a day, but without any instruction in how to read it. What a couple of frustrated kids we had. Writing was about the same. The kids would be asked to write something, but spelling and grammar were ignored.

Fortunately, we moved to a more traditional area, where we could find decent private schools that were able to undo the damage done by the government.

I'm actually a big proponent of the whole language system, because it produces better readers. They don't subvocalise because they've internalised the written language just like most people do with the spoken language. They don't need to translate the written language into a spoken language in order to understand it, and thus tend to read much faster and with better retention.

But it only works on young children. Once they're in school, it's too late to teach them to read well.

Because the PC police don't want the school's to hurt the feelings of the kids who get a lot of F's. That might make them feel bad! Oh no! Instead of teaching them proper English, let them be morons who have good self-esteem.
I don't think this has anything to do with being PC. I think it has everything to do with being lazy dumbasses.

I'm actually a big proponent of the whole language system, because it produces better readers. They don't subvocalise because they've internalised the written language just like most people do with the spoken language. They don't need to translate the written language into a spoken language in order to understand it, and thus tend to read much faster and with better retention.

But it only works on young children. Once they're in school, it's too late to teach them to read well.
But don't we all do that with enough practice? When does the hard work on spelling and grammar start in this system?

I don't think this has anything to do with being PC. I think it has everything to do with being lazy dumbasses.
What's the difference between PC promoters and lazy dumbasses?

This is why we need to get administration of schools out of the government's hands, now, before they use all of their "good ideas" and turn every schoolkid into an ignorant moron.

This is why we need to get administration of schools out of the government's hands, now, before they use all of their "good ideas" and turn every schoolkid into an ignorant moron.

They already have. US students are dumber than students in most of the OECD and a few developing nations as well...it's going to be an economic crisis, considering that 60% of the jobs in the next century will require skills possessed by only 25% of the labor force today.

Even worse for the US, that labor force with the skills is mostly the well-educated and aging boomers and not the kids in school today!

They already have. US students are dumber than students in most of the OECD and a few developing nations as well...it's going to be an economic crisis, considering that 60% of the jobs in the next century will require skills possessed by only 25% of the labor force today.

Even worse for the US, that labor force with the skills is mostly the well-educated and aging boomers and not the kids in school today!

Well that's just fantastic. But hey, at least when I'm out of graduate school, I'll be in high demand. Thank God I didn't stay in public school.

English is my second language.

Enough said.

If a hundred million foreigners can speak it better, there is no excuse.

But don't we all do that with enough practice? When does the hard work on spelling and grammar start in this system?

That should happen after they already know how to read. But, since I'm advocating teaching the kids to read before they start school, I suppose then they'd do the hardcore spelling and grammar right about when you think they should - it just wouldn't be part of the "learning to read" process. It would be a refinement of their written language skills.

I am a spelling and grammar nazi. I do wholly approve of teaching this to children.

English is my second language.



It is???!!!!

what's your first language?

It hurt my brain to read that :(
Agreed. I had to stop.

Well seeing as American "English" is already a simplified version of English, I don't see how this is particularly shocking to most of you.

Still, it's a pretty stupid idea to be frank.

It is???!!!!

what's your first language?
Russian. Oh yes.

They used to spell like that all the time. It was called the dark ages.

It hurt my brain to read that :(

I agree. What the hell was that?

Hmmmm wasn't there a pseudo-language in Blade Runner? Seems like we are heading that way! :(

Liasia']They used to spell like that all the time. It was called the dark ages.
Pssh. In the Dark Ages, people actually spelt words with even more letters.

"The Orbe of Saturne" for example (that was what Saturn, the planet, was at one stage called).

I am a spelling and grammar nazi.

I must have you wondering how a retard could get on to a computer! :D

Pssh. In the Dark Ages, people actually spelt words with even more letters.

"The Orbe of Saturne" for example (that was what Saturn, the planet, was at one stage called).
More phonetic tho eh? Easier to remeber the rules, because you just made them up as you went along.

It hurt my brain to read that :(


Mine to. This is called stupid people trying to find a shortcut to education.

Mine to. This is called stupid people trying to find a shortcut to education.

I mean, come on, if you're calling people who can't spell stupid...

I must have you wondering how a retard could get on to a computer! :D

Well, yes, but your spelling and grammar have nothing to do with that.

:p

Losing the rich history behind the English language just so that kids can get higher grades with less work? Here's my message to the people pushing for simpler spelling: Words are spelt the way they sound. Some of them are Germanic, some of them are Norman, some of them are Latin, and some have even more obscure backgrounds. Simplification of English is an insult towards the language and those who speak it.

I'm all for it, we should also change other languages spelling while we are at it. We should force publishers to re-release all previous books in the new style of spelling as well.

Still though I don't think they made their new way of spelling things simple enough. We should not only simplify the spelling but the pronunciations of words so that easier spellign is facilitated.

They should also ban certain words if they have more than one meaning. Or eliminate one word if there is already another word for it (we'll keep the word that comes first alphabetically). Plus we'll need to change some words that sound the same but have different spellings and meanings (their, there, they're).

We've got a lot of work to do. We need to have a good old fashioned book burning so people forget the old language and there isn't a revival of the devil tongue.

Yep[/funny haha joke]

English is my second language.

Enough said.

If a hundred million foreigners can speak it better, there is no excuse.



The US government seems more interested in forcing people to learn spanish and help spanish speakers live without learning english than they are making people learn english.

Didn't you know it's racist to make non-english speakers learn english? Well thats what one democrat said when the republicans tried to make english the national..you can't call it official language of the USA. :rolleyes:

I mean, come on, if you're calling people who can't spell stupid...
That's more poor word choice then spelling. :p People confuse to and too all the time, it doesn't mean they can't spell the words.

That's more poor word choice then spelling. :p People confuse to and too all the time, it doesn't mean they can't spell the words.

Like then and than? :p

I mean, come on, if you're calling people who can't spell stupid...



Oh please, It's a minor error. It's not like I misspelled my own name.:rolleyes: I missed one word because I typed too fast.

That's more poor word choice then spelling. :p People confuse to and too all the time, it doesn't mean they can't spell the words.

you forgot to write two too :D

Liasia']More phonetic tho eh? Easier to remeber the rules, because you just made them up as you went along.
Debatable on the phonetic issue, but you're right, if something looked about right, then it was generally accepted by the academic community, which numbered about 3 people in the Dark Ages.

Like then and than? :p
God yes. affect and effect... their, they're, and there...

That's more poor word choice then spelling. :p People confuse to and too all the time, it doesn't mean they can't spell the words.


Yeah. I didn't misspell anything.:p

God yes. affect and effect... their, they're, and there...



Remember english isn't my first language.

Oh please, It's a minor error. It's not like I misspelled my own name.:rolleyes: I missed one word because I typed too fast.

I was just being pedantic. :/

English is my second language.

Enough said.

If a hundred million foreigners can speak it better, there is no excuse.

I agree whole heartedly. I speak English as a second language, and I have mastered it, and can speak through "AOL speak" (ie: whutz up, and thru, and lol, etc.). It is my belief that you should only be allowed to dumb down the English language if you hold at least a doctorate in English.

If one hundred million (sorry, had to correct your grammar :p ) foreigners can correct their American and English-as-a-first-language friends in the use of grammar and pronunciation, then there is something wrong.

I was just being pedantic. :/




People who are pedantic cause a caustic pain for me.:D

What's the difference between PC promoters and lazy dumbasses?
If PC promotors were lazy dumbasses, they wouldn't promote their views, they'd just sit on the couch.

It's typical that some people will seek to dumb down the language because of a few lazy people who can't be bothered to learn the language the way everyone else does. The proponents of these changes are probably of the same mentality as the morons who promoted Ebonics in the US. It's this kind of crap which makes me think that this country should introduce a national academy for the English language, based on the French model. Ideally we should have done it long ago, but we certainly need it more than ever now. Anything to prevent the English language from becoming a complete mockery.

To be onest, I doo not see a reeson to yoose the horribly irregoolar and irrational carrent riting system. I doo not see any reeson except maybee tradishen. Thät however is no reeson to mee bat onli feer of shanges. The Yooro-inglish was IMNSCO a GREAT! Ideea, iven tho, everion consders it a jok.

Well that's just fantastic. But hey, at least when I'm out of graduate school, I'll be in high demand. Thank God I didn't stay in public school.

I'm getting a finance degree with a math minor, so I'll be alright as well. It'll be a great time for skilled workers because there will be fewer and fewer of us but rising demand for our work...salaries are going to take off and prospects are going to be abundant for graduates. Grad students will be even better off...

To be onest, I doo not see a reeson to yoose the horribly irregoolar and irrational carrent riting system. I doo not see any reeson except maybee tradishen. Thät however is no reeson to mee bat onli feer of shanges. The Yooro-inglish was IMNSCO a GREAT! Ideea, iven tho, everion consders it a jok.

Can someone please translate this for me? I have better uses for 5-10 minutes.

This is a horrible idea, the English will never allow it. Neither will I if I can help it. In the article they were talking about how labour, honour and favour etc. dropped the u, only in "American English", to everybody learning English as a second (or more) language learn English English. The original and the best. :D

There have been other plans to simply spelling before, like this one. (http://www.ashvital.freeservers.com/ze_dream.htm)