NationStates Jolt Archive

Report: North Korean Missile Was Aimed at Hawaii (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,202469,00.html)

TOKYO — The long-range Taepodong-2 was part of a barrage of seven missiles test-fired by North Korea on Wednesday. They all fell harmlessly into the Sea of Japan, but South Korean officials said the long-range missile had malfunctioned, suggesting it was intended for a more remote target.

Japan's conservative mainstream daily Sankei said that Japanese and U.S. defense officials have concluded that the Taepodong-2 had targeted the U.S. state of Hawaii in the Pacific Ocean, after analyzing data collected from their intelligence equipment.

It isn't confirmed if it was or not since it failed shortly after take off but according to Japan, it appears that it was supposed to land near Hawaii. Again, this is all unconfirmed and it comes to us via data.

If accurate and succeeded, it was supposed to show that they can hit the United States but we'll never know since the missile failed seconds after take off.

What is your take on all of this?

It might be Japan garnering support for more US involvement in whatever they plan to do about Kim.

It might be Japan garnering support for more US involvement in whatever they plan to do about Kim.

The Hawaii thing was probably made up by Cheney and Rove to try to rally the republican base for the 2006 elections.

The truth is that North Korea has every right to nuclear weapons. Only the USA has actually used them against innocent Japanese civilians during World War II. And whatever republicans might say about President Jong-Il, at least everyone in North Korea has healthcare.

On another note, Hawaii is occupied and Hawaii should be returned to Native Hawaiians.

Well if it was Hawaii, us territory with the least amount of land to worry about hitting with wreakage.

Heck maybe they think Pearl Harbor would scare us?

We should retaliate by dropping the Pearl harbor movie on them! But that would only add to the torture problem. :D

If it's true and a missile actually DID land near Hawaii it would be tantamount to a declaration of war.

Forget Iran, nuke NK and send in the marines.

If it's true and a missile actually DID land near Hawaii it would be tantamount to a declaration of war.

Forget Iran, nuke NK and send in the marines.

OMG, that's why we need Bush impeached. I would feel bad for all the North Koreans. :(

The Hawaii thing was probably made up by Cheney and Rove to try to rally the republican base for the 2006 elections.

Oh brother. I see you do not read very well.

The truth is that North Korea has every right to nuclear weapons.

Ironically they can legally have them since they are no longer part of the NPT.

Only the USA has actually used them against innocent Japanese civilians during World War II.

Go back and learn history please.

And whatever republicans might say about President Jong-Il, at least everyone in North Korea has healthcare.

Do you know that NK has the worst poverty and no electricity?

What is your take on all of this?
Still the same: Why aren't we laughing our asses off at Kim and his wannabe missile?

He wanted to prove how great North Korea is. He did the test. Do you have any idea how much face he lost?

We should be broadcasting Western leaders laughing with the big speakers along the DMZ.

Do you know that NK has the worst poverty and no electricity?

Maybe you don't understand Juche. President Jong-Il realizes that people don't all want to pollute the Earth like the USA does.

Did you know that the US is 4% of the world's population, but uses 40% of its resources?

President Jong-Il and the North Korean people should be held up as models of what the future of the world could be, if the USA would stop exploiting the world's resources.

I fully support President Clinton's decision to send reparations in the form of grain and food to North Korea, because what we did in the Korean War to the North Koreans was unconsciable.

Attacking Hawaii is a good way to get fucked up, Japan should know.

On another note, Hawaii is occupied and Hawaii should be returned to Native Hawaiians.

Same could be said for all of the other 49 States ....

President Jong-Il realizes that people don't all want to pollute the Earth like the USA does.

Now *that's* spin, baby!

Same could be said for all of the other 49 States ....

Yes, most of the USA belongs to the Native Americans, with the exception of the Southwest, whose original name is Aztlan, being returned to the Latin Americans.

Still the same: Why aren't we laughing our asses off at Kim and his wannabe missile?

He wanted to prove how great North Korea is. He did the test. Do you have any idea how much face he lost?

We should be broadcasting Western leaders laughing with the big speakers along the DMZ.

I agree with you 100%! We should but then, that would be diplomatically impolite.

The Hawaii thing was probably made up by Cheney and Rove to try to rally the republican base for the 2006 elections.

The truth is that North Korea has every right to nuclear weapons. Only the USA has actually used them against innocent Japanese civilians during World War II. And whatever republicans might say about President Jong-Il, at least everyone in North Korea has healthcare.

On another note, Hawaii is occupied and Hawaii should be returned to Native Hawaiians.

Maybe you don't understand Juche. President Jong-Il realizes that people don't all want to pollute the Earth like the USA does.

Did you know that the US is 4% of the world's population, but uses 40% of its resources?

President Jong-Il and the North Korean people should be held up as models of what the future of the world could be, if the USA would stop exploiting the world's resources.

I fully support President Clinton's decision to send reparations in the form of grain and food to North Korea, because what we did in the Korean War to the North Koreans was unconsciable.

Mmmmm.... http://www.kcna.co.jp/index-e.htm is not a good source for your Korean related news...

Do you know that NK has the worst poverty and no electricity?

Huh? Here's an image from a hotel in Pyongyang:

http://www.kdvr.de/tour/pyongyang-koryo-hotel-4.jpg

There's a TV and a lamp ...

http://www.travel-earth.com/dprk/pyongyang/pyongyang-metro.jpg

Very well lighted for no electricity ...

http://www.travel-earth.com/dprk/pyongyang/pyongyang-ryugyong.jpg

Nice hotel for such poverty ...

http://www.travel-earth.com/dprk/pyongyang/pyongyang-night_2.jpg

Ooh! Lights!

It's like all those people who assume Iran is a big desert and they all ride camels. Don't be ignorant. It doesn't help matters much.

Yes, most of the USA belongs to the Native Americans, with the exception of the Southwest, whose original name is Aztlan, being returned to the Latin Americans.

And where, pray tell, should I go?

Maybe you don't understand Juche. President Jong-Il realizes that people don't all want to pollute the Earth like the USA does.

We don't either dude. Nice try with this line of attack.

Did you know that the US is 4% of the world's population, but uses 40% of its resources?

Yep. thanks for that.

President Jong-Il and the North Korean people should be held up as models of what the future of the world could be, if the USA would stop exploiting the world's resources.

*dies of laughter* You know nothing about Kim Jong Il do you? Nope didn't think so.

I fully support President Clinton's decision to send reparations in the form of grain and food to North Korea, because what we did in the Korean War to the North Koreans was unconsciable.

You do know that we can blame clinton for this right?

Maybe you don't understand Juche. President Jong-Il realizes that people don't all want to pollute the Earth like the USA does.

Did you know that the US is 4% of the world's population, but uses 40% of its resources?

President Jong-Il and the North Korean people should be held up as models of what the future of the world could be, if the USA would stop exploiting the world's resources.

You are nuts. Go visit NK's torture camps and witness it's brutality towards those who don't parrot the communist party line-they are sent to slave camps where they work for the rest of their lives.

I fully support President Clinton's decision to send reparations in the form of grain and food to North Korea, because what we did in the Korean War to the North Koreans was unconsciable.

Yeah, such as wiping out their army because they invaded south korea? Yeah....

If it was truly equitable, the north would be paying back South Korea and the US for the next 50 years.

You can't be real. You are just too....umm...naive.

Maybe you don't understand Juche.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=PXB187_hFkI&search=execution
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ITBqRSMBWaM&search=north%20korea
Warning. I didn't watch both videos all the way. They may or may not contain shocking scenes (although I don't think there'd be blood and gore). Only watch if you're sure you want to.

Maybe you don't? You must be the first person I have ever seen who actually supports Juche socialism, and its effects.

I agree with you 100%! We should but then, that would be diplomatically impolite.
As impolite as shooting a bunch of missiles in the general direction of all sorts of people, after having been asked repeatedly not to do it, allthewhile keeping up vile propaganda speeches.

Attacking Hawaii is a good way to get fucked up, Japan should know.

"What the F8ck was that?"

-Mayor of Hiroshima

Japan should know well :fluffle:

The Hawaii thing was probably made up by Cheney and Rove to try to rally the republican base for the 2006 elections.

The truth is that North Korea has every right to nuclear weapons. Only the USA has actually used them against innocent Japanese civilians during World War II. And whatever republicans might say about President Jong-Il, at least everyone in North Korea has healthcare.

On another note, Hawaii is occupied and Hawaii should be returned to Native Hawaiians.


Dude, tin foil hat much? Oh, by the way. Do not pass go. Do not collect diploma. Go straight to 9th grade.


Maybe you don't understand Juche. President Jong-Il realizes that people don't all want to pollute the Earth like the USA does.

Did you know that the US is 4% of the world's population, but uses 40% of its resources?

President Jong-Il and the North Korean people should be held up as models of what the future of the world could be, if the USA would stop exploiting the world's resources.

I fully support President Clinton's decision to send reparations in the form of grain and food to North Korea, because what we did in the Korean War to the North Koreans was unconsciable.


Dude, you realize if half the North Koreans read this they'd use what strength they had to strangle you to death, right? They don't even have clean and running water, for God's sake. And sure as hell they don't even understand the idea of conservation, with what little schooling they have. You realize you're voicing support for a regime that spends 90% of its money on the military and the other 10% on the political elite, while allowing the vast majority of the people in their territory slowly starve to death? They're lucky to be able to sneak rice from their own crops so they can continue to live and slave away for the NK military. You disgust me.

As impolite as shooting a bunch of missiles in the general direction of all sorts of people, after having been asked repeatedly not to do it, allthewhile keeping up vile propaganda speeches.

You have a point. Ok, I retract the diplomaticlly impolite line.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=PXB187_hFkI&search=execution
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ITBqRSMBWaM&search=north%20korea
Warning. I didn't watch both videos all the way. They may or may not contain shocking scenes (although I don't think there'd be blood and gore). Only watch if you're sure you want to.

Maybe you don't? You must be the first person I have ever seen who actually supports Juche socialism, and its effects.


As impolite as shooting a bunch of missiles in the general direction of all sorts of people, after having been asked repeatedly not to do it, allthewhile keeping up vile propaganda speeches.

:eek:

Conscience and truth: "But oh kim il jong is just so ronery! Oh so ronery! And all he wants to do is simply sit down at the table of nations and interact peacefully with his neighbors and spread happiness and cinnamon and flowers everywhere!"

:rolleyes:

Time to go kick some ass and free some starving people...

If that missile had landed, it would've been a declaration of war, effectively...Rational nations don't test weapon systems on others' territory...

Maybe you don't understand Juche. President Jong-Il realizes that people don't all want to pollute the Earth like the USA does.

Did you know that the US is 4% of the world's population, but uses 40% of its resources?

President Jong-Il and the North Korean people should be held up as models of what the future of the world could be, if the USA would stop exploiting the world's resources.

I fully support President Clinton's decision to send reparations in the form of grain and food to North Korea, because what we did in the Korean War to the North Koreans was unconsciable.

Well, since we're being so positive about the North Koreans, I have a contribution to make. They certainly have gorgeous, nearly traffic-free highways.

Oh, yes, that's because almost no one can afford a car.

With all due respect, you're either an idiot or a troller.

OMG, that's why we need Bush impeached. I would feel bad for all the North Koreans. :(

GO back to DU.

Warning. I didn't watch both videos all the way. They may or may not contain shocking scenes (although I don't think there'd be blood and gore). Only watch if you're sure you want to.

The US executes people after trials, too ..... and?

Still the same: Why aren't we laughing our asses off at Kim and his wannabe missile?

He wanted to prove how great North Korea is. He did the test. Do you have any idea how much face he lost?

We should be broadcasting Western leaders laughing with the big speakers along the DMZ.

The launch pads are probably covered with the dead bodies of the children of the missile techs.

All it takes is one MIRV to detonate and you have MAD. Not sure if the NK nukes have any, but even if they didn't detonate and landed in some cowfield, it would still cause a ruckus.

Conscience and Truth cannot be this naive, jeez, please don't tell me he's this igorant of worldly events.... :headbang:

Maybe you don't? You must be the first person I have ever seen who actually supports Juche socialism, and its effects.

I know a few Chongryon (the Korean Residents association in Japan that's associated w/ the DPRK) members who do. It's really weird. One of my old co-workers used to teach part-time at one of their local kindergartens, where they teach Juche.

GO back to DU.

LOL - I had to look that up - I didn't think Ducks Unlimited would want this person....

Huh? Here's an image from a hotel in Pyongyang:

http://www.kdvr.de/tour/pyongyang-koryo-hotel-4.jpg

There's a TV and a lamp ...

http://www.travel-earth.com/dprk/pyongyang/pyongyang-metro.jpg

Very well lighted for no electricity ...

http://www.travel-earth.com/dprk/pyongyang/pyongyang-ryugyong.jpg

Nice hotel for such poverty ...

http://www.travel-earth.com/dprk/pyongyang/pyongyang-night_2.jpg

Ooh! Lights!

It's like all those people who assume Iran is a big desert and they all ride camels. Don't be ignorant. It doesn't help matters much.

Look at NK from space, and compare it to South korea.

The US executes people after trials, too ..... and?

We don't execute people for saying bad things about President bush.

Look at NK from space, and compare it to South korea.

I have a tough time getting to space. I keep trying to throw myself at the ground and miss, but I just can't get distracted quite right.

I also do not believe the ability to expend energy is a mark of civilisation.

I was merely countering what Corn said about them having "no" electricity.

LOL - I had to look that up - I didn't think Ducks Unlimited would want this person....


No, not that du.



WHAT IS JUCHE?

We don't execute people for saying bad things about President bush.

We don't know why that man was executed. It's not included in the video. Speculation doesn't help much either.

Look at NK from space, and compare it to South korea.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/world/dprk/images/Korea-at-Night.jpg

Yep, a whole lotta 'lectricity going on north of the 'Z.

I have a tough time getting to space. I keep trying to throw myself at the ground and miss, but I just can't get distracted quite right.

I also do not believe the ability to expend energy is a mark of civilisation.

I was merely countering what Corn said about them having "no" electricity.

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?t=82755

North Korea is a turd world country. Only places that actually have utilites are the places the gov't wants to-places where tourists/journalists will be and see.

Those that actually support the current regime in North Korea are not the ones willing to stand at the opposite end of the guns that those executioners held. Malcolm X said that those unwilling to die for freedom should remove it from their dictionaries. I value my rights. I value my freedoms. And I'll be damned before I let any Communist pig try and tell me that my freedoms are worth nothing while I do nothing. North Korea needs a strict blockade, imposed and recognized by the International community, until they back off. Their record of human's rights violations is abhorrent.

Oh, and as for those photos of Pyongyang, you do realize that they are only of Pyongyang, a city inhabited only by those willing to toe the line, and that the rest of the country is a wreck. In North Korea, if you are not willing to submit to the all-pervasive police and military forces, then you are left in poverty, or worse, punished for criticizing a failing government.

Go ahead. Complain about America's government. Complain about the leaders of my country. But remember that we are a country that prides itself on being able to contradict the government without the fear of being put before the firing squad. North Korea can not say that, and now they have tested long range missiles? I'm glad that they have failed, and hope they continue to do so, as they probably will, ad if they should get it right, then it is time for brash action. Specifically, once a credible threat has been established, then the South would have every right to declare war, and I hope to God that us American boys are there to fight next to them, even if I have to be one of the ones at the front.

Yep, a whole lotta 'lectricity going on north of the 'Z.

http://dmsp.ngdc.noaa.gov/images/usa_small.gif

Looks like we need to do something about the fascist regime in Nevada.

No, not that du.

And now I know. Although that DU was much more fun. I suspect this DU doesn't raffel shotguns....

WHAT IS JUCHE?

The political philosophy of Kim Il-sung.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Juche
http://www.cnet-ta.ne.jp/juche/defaulte.htm

We don't execute people for saying bad things about President bush.

Only because there's a concept called Law and Order in the United States. As can be read in the latest Cindy "Nobody cared what I was doing until Busheviks brought it up" Sheehan thread, it doesn't mean there isn't any people out there who don't wish that people could be executed for saying bad things about Dear Leader.

And when I said Dear Leader, I wasn't talking about Kim Jong-Il even if he is The Original Dear Leader.

We don't know why that man was executed. It's not included in the video. Speculation doesn't help much either.

Many things in NK are executable offenses.

Think the US is bad about that? NK is ten times worse.

Of course, they are a little nicer in the fact that being executed is nicer than ending up in one of the slave camps that dot the country.

http://dmsp.ngdc.noaa.gov/images/usa_small.gif

Looks like we need to do something about the fascist regime in Nevada.

You do realize that NV is also sparsly populated and that they do have electricity as that map clearly shows.

North Korea is a turd world country. Only places that actually have utilites are the places the gov't wants to-places where tourists/journalists will be and see.

Uh huh ...

And I can show this:

http://www.imagist.com/photo/images/family_01.jpg

And say it's how all Americans live.

Doesn't mean it's true.

The US executes people after trials, too ..... and?
I don't think I said I agreed with the US justice system.

But seriously, are you going to argue that there is any sort of parity between what is happening there and what is happening in the US? You're better than that. Just stay rational.

http://www.bekkoame.ne.jp/ro/renk/ahnchol/ahnchol_e.htm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ct9EBaazVNE&search=north%20korea
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AUVyobZnhDo&search=north%20korea

I can deal with Iran, Venezuela and all the other countries the US declares evil from time to time. But North Korea is just taking things two or three levels above what I am willing to tolerate.

Not sure if the NK nukes have any, but even if they didn't detonate and landed in some cowfield, it would still cause a ruckus.
They probably don't even have the miniaturisation yet to fit a single warhead on a missile.

We don't know why that man was executed. It's not included in the video. Speculation doesn't help much either.
Allegedly they helped people escape North Korea.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0511/11/acd.01.html
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

FRANK SESNO, CNN CONTRIBUTING CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): North Korea, March 2005 -- a crowd has been ordered to gather in an open field. A party official makes an announcement.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (SPEAKING KOREAN)

SESNO: Children have been brought to watch. The sentence is about to be passed.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): All the workers who came here today are inhabitants of the nearby village, are about to learn the punishment for these crimes.

SESNO: Three men are about to die.

UNIDENTIFIED PERSON (through translator): How stupid these criminals are. Kim Jong Il is great in comparison to these worthless criminals.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): Carry out the death sentence immediately!

SESNO: These people have committed the crime most damaging to North Korea's leader, Kim Jong Il. They made contact with the outside world. UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): They have been involved in the illegal (SPEAKING KOREAN) aiding people to defect the country. They trafficked women across the border to China. We have to protect North Korea from the outside influence and build up a strong guard to keep those influences out.

SESNO: Three policemen stepped forward and raise their rifles. On the left, a prisoner is tied to a pole.

The next day, a different town, another public execution for the same crimes, helping people escape to the outside world. The man with the secret camera walks into a vacant building and talks to his audience.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): I witnessed soldiers executing people by firing squad. They were accused of human trafficking offenses. Men, women and children came to watch.

SESNO: This video was passed from person to person along a secret underground network, powerful evidence of public executions under the regime of Kim Jong Il.

Only because there's a concept called Law and Order in the United States. As can be read in the latest Cindy "Nobody cared what I was doing until Busheviks brought it up" Sheehan thread, it doesn't mean there isn't any people out there who don't wish that people could be executed for saying bad things about Dear Leader.

And when I said Dear Leader, I wasn't talking about Kim Jong-Il even if he is The Original Dear Leader.

Are you implying that I'd support executing people for making fun of Presidente Bush?

Dude, you're nuts.

Conscience and Truth cannot be this naive, jeez, please don't tell me he's this igorant of worldly events.... :headbang:

If you've read any of his other posts then you'd know that such statements aren't exactly rare.

If you've read any of his other posts you'd know the answer.

I have.... :headbang:

If you've read any of his other posts then you'd know that such statements aren't exactly rare.

Now that's a true statement.

You do realize that NV is also sparsly populated and that they do have electricity as that map clearly shows.

NK has electricity. I've already shown a pic of a very well lit Pyongyang at night.

I don't think I said I agreed with the US justice system.

But seriously, are you going to argue that there is any sort of parity between what is happening there and what is happening in the US? You're better than that. Just stay rational.

http://www.bekkoame.ne.jp/ro/renk/ahnchol/ahnchol_e.htm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ct9EBaazVNE&search=north%20korea
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AUVyobZnhDo&search=north%20korea

I can deal with Iran, Venezuela and all the other countries the US declares evil from time to time. But North Korea is just taking things two or three levels above what I am willing to tolerate.


They probably don't even have the miniaturisation yet to fit a single warhead on a missile.


Allegedly they helped people escape North Korea.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0511/11/acd.01.html

My heart breaks knowing what those people go through :( Man, that's gotta suck hard.

And I can show this -snip -and say it's how all Americans live.
So the fact that hundreds of thousands of people died in famines there doesn't tell you that perhaps living standards aren't all that high?

NK has electricity. I've already shown a pic of a very well lit Pyongyang at night.

lol. Actually you didn't.

I can deal with Iran


The hell? Did you know not a month or two ago they executed a 16-year old girl for defending herself from a rapist? Think they did her boyfriend for also trying to defend her. I'm going to assume you're ignorant of the fact that Iran is as easily as bad as NK, if in different ways.

Allegedly they helped people escape North Korea.


Seems odd, but when they say human trafficking, they could mean slave trade. We really have no way of knowing. I'd like to see the transcript from the DPRK court.

Uh huh ...

And I can show this:

*snip*

And say it's how all Americans live.

Doesn't mean it's true.


They're clearly from Arkansas, so it doesn't count. ;)

lol. Actually you didn't.

http://www.travel-earth.com/dprk/pyongyang/pyongyang-night_2.jpg

What do you think those are .... burning monks?

NK has electricity. I've already shown a pic of a very well lit Pyongyang at night.
Most of the country is rural sort of areas, where there is little if any electricity available. Pyongyang is generally considered a show city, the people who live there are mainly party members and the like.

Add to that a general order to keep lights out at night (still from the war officially), and the result is a whole lot of people living in the dark. Which was the point of the debate, wasn't it?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_North_Korea#Electricity_-_production

WOW....first of all.....I would personally like to tell "Conscience and Truth" to shut the hell up.....I mean come on shit for brains, I hope to God that you dont live in America because if u did i would like to tell you to get the hell out. Serioulsy where do you come up with all your bull-shit information from anyway, cuz buddy.... the National Enquier is made up. So please, for the sake of humanity and on behalf of the TRUE AMERICANS IN THIS GREAT COUNTRY.....SHUT UP!!!!!!!! :upyours:

PS. LOL i would LOVE to have this conversation with you face-to-face.

They're clearly from Arkansas, so it doesn't count. ;)

Appalachians, actually. ;)

OMG, that's why we need Bush impeached. I would feel bad for all the North Koreans. :(


I wouldn't. Let them burn in radioactive oblivion. Turn Pyong Yang into a Nuclear hell hole. Literally.

WOW....first of all.....I would personally like to tell "Conscience and Truth" to shut the hell up.....I mean come on shit for brains, I hope to God that you dont live in America because if u did i would like to tell you to get the hell out. Serioulsy where do you come up with all your bull-shit information from anyway, cuz buddy.... the National Enquier is made up. So please, for the sake of humanity and on behalf of the TRUE AMERICANS IN THIS GREAT COUNTRY.....SHUT UP!!!!!!!! :upyours:

PS. LOL i would LOVE to have this conversation with you face-to-face.

You're bringing nothing to this discussion and making the rest of us TRUE AMERICANS look bad. Learn to spell, deal with your grammar issues, and come to terms with the fact that not everybody in the United States believes in "kill 'em all and let god sort 'em out".

Flaming and threatening another poster is a sure fire way to get banned.

I would also love to have this conversation with you. Incidently, I do ... all the time ... with all kinds of people. Nobody ever gets angry or indignant and nothing ever comes to blows. I'm sorry you haven't evolved, but I have hope you'll figure it out in time.

Seems odd, but when they say human trafficking, they could mean slave trade. We really have no way of knowing. I'd like to see the transcript from the DPRK court.
You may or may not have noticed...there was no court. That's the point. People are tortured (want a video for that too? Kat might DEAT me again though) until they confess, then they're executed in public.

I'm going to assume you're ignorant of the fact that Iran is as easily as bad as NK, if in different ways.
It's bad too, but not as bad. The sort of trials that make the headlines are not nearly as representative of the country as a whole, as the executions are of North Korea.

But Iran probably isn't the topic of the thread, so I'll leave it at that. Suffice to say that I'm not ignorant of what happens there, rest assured.

I wouldn't. Let them burn in radioactive oblivion. Turn Pyong Yang into a Nuclear hell hole. Literally.

Are you racist against North Koreans or do you just hate the environment that much? Turning all of DPNK into a glass parking lot would have serious environmental repercussions that would effect us as well as everyone else.

http://www.travel-earth.com/dprk/pyongyang/pyongyang-night_2.jpg
What do you think those are .... burning monks?

North Korea (http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41297000/jpg/_41297455_ap_night203.jpg)

Pyongyang's lit, but no one else is...after all, it would be hard Most of the country has no electricity due to shortages, and even Pyongyang can't keep its lights on consistently. North Korea is nothing more than a repressive Third World hellhole that can't feed, clothe, or support its population due to its corrupt and backward regime.

You may or may not have noticed...there was no court. That's the point. People are tortured (want a video for that too? Kat might DEAT me again though) until they confess, then they're executed in public.

Seeing a few videos here and there, which may or may not be real, of some very strange and foreign ways of doing things and deciding that it's the status quo is no better than those who take a few incidences of rape and torture and murder of innocent Iraqi civilians by US Marines and claiming all military personnel are such animals.

Be objective. Be rational. We are not in possession of all of the facts.

Same could be said for all of the other 49 States ....

And almost every country in the world. Most people living in the modern countries you see today were not the original beings of that area.

I don't think we should do anything yet. The failure of that one missle was as crippling a loss to North Korea as the US losing an aircraft carrier; they're in such terrible shape that they probably can't afford to do it again, let alone hit something with it. We need to keep an eye on them, but I don't think retaliation is wise or necessary right now. In fact, we might make more progress negotiating with them than trying to sanction them.

Well well well...
If NZ has to fight, fight i shall.

I don't think we should do anything yet. The failure of that one missle was as crippling a loss to North Korea as the US losing an aircraft carrier;

Don't be so sure. Launch failures happen and we learn a lot from them.

SESNO: These people have committed the crime most damaging to North Korea's leader, Kim Jong Il. They made contact with the outside world. UNIDENTIFIED MALE (through translator): They have been involved in the illegal (SPEAKING KOREAN) aiding people to defect the country. They trafficked women across the border to China. We have to protect North Korea from the outside influence and build up a strong guard to keep those influences out.

Doesn't sound like slave trade to me... :rolleyes:

Doesn't sound like slave trade to me... :rolleyes:

Speculation from the crowd is not exactly solid evidence of anything.

People get arrested here and jailed for smuggling people out of Mexico, but they are lauded as heroes in Mexico.

One man's criminal, etc etc.

So who's side are we on? The criminal or the established law?

Don't be so sure. Launch failures happen and we learn a lot from them.

Yes, but the US and China have the resources to build more missles and the scientists to improve upon them. North Korea has very little of both, so it's not only going to have a hard time improving its designs but also difficulty in getting the parts and fuel for them. North Korea is so broke I'd be surprised if they even launch another Taepodong-2 within the next 5 years.

They've been working on it for 18 years and it's still a total failure; hopefully, the NK missle program will bankrupt the country enough to give us leverage to negotiate. Hard currency is scarce in Pyongyang; that's why North Korea is such a prolific counterfeiter, arms dealer, and drug smuggler...if they didn't supplement their economy with illicit funds, they'd literally be out of money.

Seeing a few videos here and there, which may or may not be real, of some very strange and foreign ways of doing things and deciding that it's the status quo is no better than those who take a few incidences of rape and torture and murder of innocent Iraqi civilians by US Marines and claiming all military personnel are such animals.
You're nuts, dude. Are you telling me these policemen, soldiers and otherwise uniformed Koreans were acting on their own, not on behalf of their government?

http://www.signonsandiego.com/uniontrib/20050515/news_mz1e15howard.html
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3071466/
http://www.hrwf.net/html/north_korea_project.html
http://www.boston.com/news/globe/editorial_opinion/oped/articles/2004/02/08/an_auschwitz_in_korea/

I suppose all these camps aren't official policy either. "A few bad apples" again...

The Hawaii thing was probably made up by Cheney and Rove to try to rally the republican base for the 2006 elections.

The truth is that North Korea has every right to nuclear weapons. Only the USA has actually used them against innocent Japanese civilians during World War II. And whatever republicans might say about President Jong-Il, at least everyone in North Korea has healthcare.

On another note, Hawaii is occupied and Hawaii should be returned to Native Hawaiians.
The fuck are you talking about? North Korea is in the in the Axis Of Evil, their generals would like nothing more than overtake South Korea and Japan, and when you say atleast everyone is North Korea has healthcare, well atleast everyone in the USA has food, their economy collapsed along with the USSR, and Hawaii is too startegically impostant to give up, it's where we house nearly all of the Pacific portion of our Navy, if it wasn't part of the USA some empirallistic country might take it over. Lastly what you said about the Atomic bomb, NK has no right to release nuclear weapons and we only released it in WWII to prevent massive civilian AND miltary casaulties on both sides, and after we bombed Hiroshima we offered Japan to surrender, but they refused. If the United States and our coalition decides to invade NK, it's going to protect most of Asia and the Pacific from Nuclear War.

...North Korea is in the in the Axis Of Evil...
:D

WOW....first of all.....I would personally like to tell "Conscience and Truth" to shut the hell up.....I mean come on shit for brains, I hope to God that you dont live in America because if u did i would like to tell you to get the hell out. Serioulsy where do you come up with all your bull-shit information from anyway, cuz buddy.... the National Enquier is made up. So please, for the sake of humanity and on behalf of the TRUE AMERICANS IN THIS GREAT COUNTRY.....SHUT UP!!!!!!!! :upyours:

PS. LOL i would LOVE to have this conversation with you face-to-face.

I love how you defend America - "the land where everything is right and moral and we're the 'most free' country in the world."

By telling people to shut up.

North Korea is in the in the Axis Of Evil

I would write a better reply to this, but I'm busy ducttaping every exit of my house and taking my Freedom Fries into by fallout shelter. :)

I love how you defend America - "the land where everything is right and moral and we're the 'most free' country in the world."

By telling people to shut up.
It's not perfect, but Conscience and Truth should shut the hell up, If his views were adopted this place would fall apart almost immediantly, his views are just out there.

I would write a better reply to this, but I'm busy ducttaping every exit of my house and taking my Freedom Fries into by fallout shelter. :)
No man, I'm a liberal on most things, not a redneck. I'm Anti Iraq, but when NK has nuclear capabilities, a dictatorship, and no good relations with us or our allies, they need to be taken out

The fuck are you talking about? North Korea is in the in the Axis Of Evil, their generals would like nothing more than overtake South Korea and Japan, and when you say atleast everyone is North Korea has healthcare, well atleast everyone in the USA has food, their economy collapsed along with the USSR, and Hawaii is too startegically impostant to give up, it's where we house nearly all of the Pacific portion of our Navy, if it wasn't part of the USA some empirallistic country might take it over. Lastly what you said about the Atomic bomb, NK has no right to release nuclear weapons and we only released it in WWII to prevent massive civilian AND miltary casaulties on both sides, and after we bombed Hiroshima we offered Japan to surrender, but they refused. If the United States and our coalition decides to invade NK, it's going to protect most of Asia and the Pacific from Nuclear War.


1. Not everyone in the US has food.
2. Axis of Evil? As an American, I hate that analogy. They want to reunify South Korea and the North, sure! But they have no thoughts of conquering Japan. Why would they?
3. You say we killed millions of people, and horribly diseased and mutilated millions more, to save a million lives by dropping an Atomic bomb on Hiroshima, then Nagasaki? That is insane. We could have used the bombs off their coast, and told them about the power we had, and peacefully ended the conflict. But no, we had to bomb them. Face it, they were of no threat to anyone at that point anyway.
4. If we invade North Korea, i'm going to be sad to us be defeated. At this time, the United States cannot win a war of that kind. Maybe the South Koreans, who, like our soldiers, are well trained, well disciplined, and well motivated, can put up a fight like they did in Vietnam (Watching ROK Marines fight is amazing). But the problem is that we are stretched too thin, and invading would just be a debacle. War is unlikely anyway.


Rant over.


I wouldn't worry about Kim Jung Il guys. He will not nuke anyone. He realizes if he does, that we will turn Pyong Yang into nuclear hell via Peacekeeper (ironic eh?) Missles should he try something.

all in all, nothing to fear from DPRK

We didn't kill "millions of people". From the two bombs the total death toll was maybe 300k and the total death toll from extended radiation effects was maybe a million. By comparison, if we would have had to invade, our soldiers would have killed every single person on that island because everybody on that island would have resisted until the bitter end. Better to bomb two medium-size cities than commit genocide, I say.

It's not perfect, but Conscience and Truth should shut the hell up, If his views were adopted this place would fall apart almost immediantly, his views are just out there.

Which is why you also have the ability to express your opinion that his views should not be adopted. He's not threat just because he can talk.

Are you implying that I'd support executing people for making fun of Presidente Bush?

Dude, you're nuts.

http://forums2.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=11218717&postcount=197

Maybe not in explicit words, but you'd support anyone who wished people speaking ill of Dear Leader died as in this little vignette. Close enough.

1. Not everyone in the US has food.
No, but this a major world power and cases of famine are incredibly rare compaered to NK, where there is more than 1 million people in famine, or atleast was when the economy crashed.
2. Axis of Evil? As an American, I hate that analogy. They want to reunify South Korea and the North, sure! But they have no thoughts of conquering Japan. Why would they?
They've been hostile since they were occupied by Japan in WWII, and in 1998they fire a missile launch OVER Japan's airspace. They're not gonna take it over but if there's a, regardless of who starts it, Japan will be attacked. Not to mention the 13 Japanese civilian hostages the NK gov. took in the 80s.
3. You say we killed millions of people, and horribly diseased and mutilated millions more, to save a million lives by dropping an Atomic bomb on Hiroshima, then Nagasaki? That is insane. We could have used the bombs off their coast, and told them about the power we had, and peacefully ended the conflict. But no, we had to bomb them. Face it, they were of no threat to anyone at that point anyway.
This is WAR we're talking about, the bomb's results were horrifying, but if it saves the lives of some our troops it's more effective; or we could've prolonged the war with your strategy, creating a death toll on both sides and an economic drain.
4. If we invade North Korea, i'm going to be sad to us be defeated. At this time, the United States cannot win a war of that kind. Maybe the South Koreans, who, like our soldiers, are well trained, well disciplined, and well motivated, can put up a fight like they did in Vietnam (Watching ROK Marines fight is amazing). But the problem is that we are stretched too thin, and invading would just be a debacle. War is unlikely anyway.
It would be difficult but it's not just the USA and SK, we are disscussing what to do with SK, China, Russia, Japan and Austrailia currently. Besides NK lacks the economical power that most of these countries have, and any allies that I know of.

We didn't kill "millions of people". From the two bombs the total death toll was maybe 300k and the total death toll from extended radiation effects was maybe a million. By comparison, if we would have had to invade, our soldiers would have killed every single person on that island because everybody on that island would have resisted until the bitter end. Better to bomb two medium-size cities than commit genocide, I say.


I say, why bomb them at all? Why needless slaughter when there was another strategic option, which I previously stated.

As a historian, I like debating subjects like these ;)

We didn't kill "millions of people". From the two bombs the total death toll was maybe 300k and the total death toll from extended radiation effects was maybe a million. By comparison, if we would have had to invade, our soldiers would have killed every single person on that island because everybody on that island would have resisted until the bitter end. Better to bomb two medium-size cities than commit genocide, I say.

*sigh*

We didn't have to invade. We could have blockaded them, while continuing to bomb military installations. We could have used the nukes on military installations as well. They wouldn't have been able to be a signifigant threat to us, and would eventually have had to surrendur, simply because there would be no enemy to fight(have people swim toward our ships with sticks?).

We were tired of 4 years of war, we wanted it over, so we went with the quickest method possible. It was not the most humane option, and it wasnt the only option other than an invasion.

No man, I'm a liberal on most things, not a redneck. I'm Anti Iraq, but when NK has nuclear capabilities, a dictatorship, and no good relations with us or our allies, they need to be taken out

I'm not a fan of "taking people out" because they don't want to be our friend and don't like western politics.

Also, I like this whole "nuclear capabilities" thing. The worse thing that could happen is to sell bombs to terrorists. But guess what? That's more likely to happen if we invade and crack the nation apart. As for strategic warfare... their missile destroyed itself before it was out of sight and it didn't even have a warhead.

Don't get a bunker yet.

Haven't read the posted article..nor have I watched the news.. but I think they will just test fire out into the ocean, like they did before. If I'm wrong and they DO purposely hit a country...or hell even accidentally .. their ass is grass. Meh. China would possibly come in on their side, Japan would probably be on our side. I really don't know. It depends on where our jewish lobby (conspiracy theory propoganda) wants us, as to tell where WE will be, and what side WE will be on. I'm not familiar with why exactly some countries are allowed nuks and others not.. I'm also sure that If I did know I'd see some unfair practices in that law.

I'm not a fan of "taking people out" because they don't want to be our friend and don't like western politics.

Also, I like this whole "nuclear capabilities" thing. The worse thing that could happen is to sell bombs to terrorists. But guess what? That's more likely to happen if we invade and crack the nation apart. As for strategic warfare... their missile destroyed itself before it was out of sight and it didn't even have a warhead.

Don't get a bunker yet.

As I pointed out before, it isn't needed. They wouldn't dare attack us. We have more than a few SSNs in the Sea of Japan, that are carrying Patriot or Peacekeeper (or was it maker?) Missles (Nuclear missles).

I'm not a fan of "taking people out" because they don't want to be our friend and don't like western politics.

Also, I like this whole "nuclear capabilities" thing. The worse thing that could happen is to sell bombs to terrorists. But guess what? That's more likely to happen if we invade and crack the nation apart. As for strategic warfare... their missile destroyed itself before it was out of sight and it didn't even have a warhead.

Don't get a bunker yet.
One Missile was destroyed, 5 others launched sucessfully, And the worst the could happen would either be: A full scale invasion of South Korea or Nuke sent to Haiwaii or California, namely Los Angeles, our biggest city. The missile might have fallen apart, but you can learn from failure, and in time they may have a working warhead. It's not that they "don't want to be our friend, It's they want to invade our allies. And lastly, I won't be getting a bunker, I live on the east coast :P

As I pointed out before, it isn't needed. They wouldn't dare attack us. We have more than a few SSNs in the Sea of Japan, that are carrying Patriot or Peacekeeper (or was it maker?) Missles (Nuclear missles).

Exactly. All they want is attention. That's all they need. No one would care about North Korea in the least if they didn't know they had a "madman" running the country.

The idea of panicing over a missile that didn't even break the horizon is funny.

*sigh*

We didn't have to invade. We could have blockaded them, while continuing to bomb military installations. We could have used the nukes on military installations as well. They wouldn't have been able to be a signifigant threat to us, and would eventually have had to surrendur, simply because there would be no enemy to fight(have people swim toward our ships with sticks?).

We were tired of 4 years of war, we wanted it over, so we went with the quickest method possible. It was not the most humane option, and it wasnt the only option other than an invasion.


Wow, you must not be not very well versed on what was possible and what wasn't. First, if we'd hit a Japanese military installation we would have taken out a city; they were as densely packed then as they are now, the concept of space between civilians and military centers hasn't been a valid correlation in a very long time for Japan. Second, pretty much all their military industry at that point was mom and pop shops spread in small buildings across just about every Japanese city, so massive civilian deaths would have still resulted. Third, we tried firebombing their factories and the like; the firebombing of Tokyo definately did kill a million people straight out. Fourth, perhaps you're not understanding just how fanatical these people were, a lot like the Jihadists in that sense, but the end result would have been much like invading would have been.

One Missile was destroyed, 5 others launched sucessfully, And the worst the could happen would either be: A full scale invasion of South Korea or Nuke sent to Haiwaii or California, namely Los Angeles, our biggest city. The missile might have fallen apart, but you can learn from failure, and in time they may have a working warhead. It's not that they "don't want to be our friend, It's they want to invade our allies. And lastly, I won't be getting a bunker, I live on the east coast :P

By the time they have a missile package that can carry a warhead and hit anything accurately, we'll have a railgun platform sitting behind the moon that can take out mailboxes.

Oh, and LA is the second largest city.

Wow, you must not be not very well versed on what was possible and what wasn't. First, if we'd hit a Japanese military installation we would have taken out a city; they were as densely packed then as they are now, the concept of space between civilians and military centers hasn't been a valid correlation in a very long time for Japan. Second, pretty much all their military industry at that point was mom and pop shops spread in small buildings across just about every Japanese city, so massive civilian deaths would have still resulted. Third, we tried firebombing their factories and the like; the firebombing of Tokyo definately did kill a million people straight out. Fourth, perhaps you're not understanding just how fanatical these people were, a lot like the Jihadists in that sense, but the end result would have been much like invading would have been.

And just where would they have gotten their resources after being cut off from all their offshore colonies?

As I pointed out before, it isn't needed. They wouldn't dare attack us. We have more than a few SSNs in the Sea of Japan, that are carrying Patriot or Peacekeeper (or was it maker?) Missles (Nuclear missles).


Okay, you have some concepts seriously mixed up. First, it's SSBN. Second, why in God's name would SSBNs be hanging out in the Sea of Japan where they be tracked down by Uncle Kim's SSKs when they can just launch from Bangor. Third, the Ohio class carries Trident II missiles. Fourth, in case you've missed it, Kimmie's insane; logic for him doesn't work like it does for normal people like you and me.

Wow, you must not be not very well versed on what was possible and what wasn't. First, if we'd hit a Japanese military installation we would have taken out a city; they were as densely packed then as they are now, the concept of space between civilians and military centers hasn't been a valid correlation in a very long time for Japan. Second, pretty much all their military industry at that point was mom and pop shops spread in small buildings across just about every Japanese city, so massive civilian deaths would have still resulted. Third, we tried firebombing their factories and the like; the firebombing of Tokyo definately did kill a million people straight out. Fourth, perhaps you're not understanding just how fanatical these people were, a lot like the Jihadists in that sense, but the end result would have been much like invading would have been.

I'm talking more about oil refineries, docks, etc where civilian deaths would have been less than targeting a civilian city in its own; My point was, we didn't have to slaughter civilians to defeat japan(regardless of reason, it was slaughter of innocent japanese).

Second, yes, but the most that could really be produced in these places was infantry weaponry. We wouldn't have troops on the ground, making it pretty much pointless.

Third, I didn't say anything about firebombing capitals. We were hitting plenty of military installations in japan before and after the nukes, like B-29 raids on oil refineries, etc. I'm not talking systematic; just enough to stop them making a force to break through, or even really threaten, a blockade.

Fourth, I fail to see what I'm not realizing. Obviously, but still. Explain it then. Yes, many were fanatical, so what? They didn't have the capability to attack us at that point. Their military was in shambles. A blockade would have forced them to eventually surrendur, or slowly die without imports, being such a barren country. The difference is, it would have been their choice when to give up, not a "well, a hundred thousand died in a minute. 50 thousand more will die in the next few days/weeks. Done yet?"

Again, nukes were the fast way. I don't have huge qualms with it, it was total war; I just hate when people act like it was the only option other than an invasion, when it clearly wasn't.

Okay, you have some concepts seriously mixed up. First, it's SSBN. Second, why in God's name would SSBNs be hanging out in the Sea of Japan where they be tracked down by Uncle Kim's SSKs when they can just launch from Bangor. Third, the Ohio class carries Trident II missiles. Fourth, in case you've missed it, Kimmie's insane; logic for him doesn't work like it does for normal people like you and me.

Bullshit. I would like to see some actual documentation linking him with mental illness.

He may be ruthless, not incredibly intelligent, etc... but he's like most other dictators; anything to stay in power. Using nuclear weapons will bring him out of power, and thats something he absolutely doesn't want.

The Hawaii thing was probably made up by Cheney and Rove to try to rally the republican base for the 2006 elections.
Because Democrats don't care if the US gets nuked. Hell, they'd just give Hawai'i to North Korea!

Because Democrats don't care if the US gets nuked. Hell, they'd just give Hawai'i to North Korea!

Whereas the Republicans want to turn it into a megachurch to hold megaconferences on how to raise money to fix all the problems in the world today.

Bullshit. I would like to see some actual documentation linking him with mental illness.

He may be ruthless, not incredibly intelligent, etc... but he's like most other dictators; anything to stay in power. Using nuclear weapons will bring him out of power, and thats something he absolutely doesn't want.


You know as well as I do no such documentation exists. Even if North Korea had competent psychiatrists to make such a diagnosis, you know as well as I do that no documentation would exist and even if it did exist we'd never see it. However, if you're sane you do not launch an ICBM at the world's greatest nuclear power after you've bragged that you have the means and will to mount a nuclear warhead on it.

Kim's damn lucky his little toy broke up. If it hadn't, there was about a 50/50 chance the ABM missiles at Alaska and California would have missed. The second the RV hit the atmosphere Cheyenne Mountain would have given Kim the finger and turned him and his pathetic country into glass.

You know as well as I do no such documentation exists. Even if North Korea had competent psychiatrists to make such a diagnosis, you know as well as I do that no documentation would exist and even if it did exist we'd never see it. However, if you're sane you do not launch an ICBM at the world's greatest nuclear power after you've bragged that you have the means and will to mount a nuclear warhead on it.

Kim's damn lucky his little toy broke up. If it hadn't, there was about a 50/50 chance the ABM missiles at Alaska and California would have missed. The second the RV hit the atmosphere Cheyenne Mountain would have given Kim the finger and turned him and his pathetic country into glass.

So you only have pure conjecture that he's insane? Thats what I figured.

He didn't launch an ICBM at the worlds greatest nuclear power. He launched it in the genereal direction of hawaii, so says the japanese. It was a show of force, him showing that he could hurt the US if they attempted to invade north korea. I see nothing demented about that. He is simply attempting his own form of MAD; he couldn't destroy america, but blowing up los angeles or san francisco would not be worth it to us to attack north korea. Logical to me.

Most likely, the missile was set to drop into the sea near hawaii(not in its actual territorial waters), to show that it could fire a missile that far.

We wouldn't have nuked north korea if they fired a missile into the atmosphere. You are the insane one if you believe that.

[QUOTE=

President Jong-Il and the North Korean people should be held up as models of what the future of the world could be, if the USA would stop exploiting the world's resources.
.[/QUOTE]

well, judging by his standards, Haiti must be truely "wonderful", and Chad and Niger too, oh, and Zimbabwae must seem like paridise to him.

Conscience and Truth:
President Jong-Il and the North Korean people should be held up as models of what the future of the world could be, if the USA would stop exploiting the world's resources.


well, judging by his standards, Haiti must be truely "wonderful", and Chad and Niger too, oh, and Zimbabwae must seem like paridise to him.

WOW....first of all.....I would personally like to tell "Conscience and Truth" to shut the hell up.....I mean come on shit for brains, I hope to God that you dont live in America because if u did i would like to tell you to get the hell out. Serioulsy where do you come up with all your bull-shit information from anyway, cuz buddy.... the National Enquier is made up. So please, for the sake of humanity and on behalf of the TRUE AMERICANS IN THIS GREAT COUNTRY.....SHUT UP!!!!!!!! :upyours:

PS. LOL i would LOVE to have this conversation with you face-to-face.


Knock it off, sparky.

Because Democrats don't care if the US gets nuked. Hell, they'd just give Hawai'i to North Korea!
:rolleyes:

Riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight.

It's not perfect, but Conscience and Truth should shut the hell up, If his views were adopted this place would fall apart almost immediantly, his views are just out there.

Conscience and Truth has exactly the same right to post his/her beliefs as you do. Try debating with them to take apart their argument rather than sitting back and telling them to shut up.

http://dmsp.ngdc.noaa.gov/images/usa_small.gif

Looks like we need to do something about the fascist regime in Nevada.

I'm more worried about the fascist regime in Canada, given the difference on the two sides of the map :p .

The Hawaii thing was probably made up by Cheney and Rove to try to rally the republican base for the 2006 elections.

The truth is that North Korea has every right to nuclear weapons. Only the USA has actually used them against innocent Japanese civilians during World War II. And whatever republicans might say about President Jong-Il, at least everyone in North Korea has healthcare.

On another note, Hawaii is occupied and Hawaii should be returned to Native Hawaiians.


Really? Really really?:eek:

Well if it was Hawaii, us territory with the least amount of land to worry about hitting with wreakage.

Heck maybe they think Pearl Harbor would scare us?

We should retaliate by dropping the Pearl harbor movie on them! But that would only add to the torture problem. :D

I miss you more then Michael Bay missed the mark
When he made Pearl Harbor
I miss you more than that movie missed the point
And that’s an awful lot girl
And now, now you’ve gone away
And all I’m trying to say is
Pearl Harbor sucked, and I miss you

I need u like Ben Affleck needs acting school
He was terrible in that film
I need u like Cuba Gooding needed a bigger part
He’s way better than Ben Affleck
And now all I can think about is your smile
and that shitty movie too
Pearl Harbor sucked and I miss you

Why does Michael Bay get to keep on making movies?
I guess Pearl Harbor sucked
Just a little bit more than I miss you

Just as a historical reminder, several nations (the US included) have the ability to determine the trajectory and probable landing area (usually an area shaped like an ellipse).

The data for the claim that the missile was headed in the general direction of Hawaii comes from the AEGIS missile cruisers that were off the North Korean coast.

Those ships are specifically fitted with radar and IR imaging sensors designed to track ballistic missiles. Considering that the systems are meant to determine an exact track for a missile in flight, the data is probably very accurate.

The point, however, is moot, since the North Korean missile was about as reliable as a busted condom.

Report: North Korean Missile Was Aimed at Hawaii (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,202469,00.html)

It isn't confirmed if it was or not since it failed shortly after take off but according to Japan, it appears that it was supposed to land near Hawaii. Again, this is all unconfirmed and it comes to us via data.

If accurate and succeeded, it was supposed to show that they can hit the United States but we'll never know since the missile failed seconds after take off.

What is your take on all of this?
If it is unconfirmed then it is rumour and innuendo and certainly not worth the bandwidth of this thread.

Well good thing for rumors and inuendo's ...because if that missile had made it the " vicinity " of Hawaii..we would all be talking about the hundreds of thousands of dead north koreans piled up and starting to smell .

It sure was going the wrong way to hit Hawaii. Make it Alaska and maybe you have something.

Well good thing for rumors and inuendo's ...because if that missile had made it the " vicinity " of Hawaii..we would all be talking about the hundreds of thousands of dead north koreans piled up and starting to smell .


The exact point I made to Chellis. If that missiles had survived the initial launch and then had its RV get through the ABM shield, the US would have been like, "F*ck you, Mr. Him. Say hello to the Instant Sunrise Company."

That's the bad thing about saying you have the warheads to mount on your ballistic missiles, other nations generally believe you.

You know, from listening to the 101st keyboarders and other military pundits I have come to the conclusion that we should invade the Us and bring a regime change. It's for the good of the world's environment and for the sake of humanity. Otherwise, they'll nuke the entire race into oblivion. If we had listened to them, North Korea, Irak, Iran, Afganistan, Palestine and probably France would have been hit by nuclear weapons. Think of what that'll do to our environement.

I see no other option that to invade and disarm the USA.

Yes, most of the USA belongs to the Native Americans, with the exception of the Southwest, whose original name is Aztlan, being returned to the Latin Americans.

Because there weren't any natives in the Southwest. None at all. Nope. None! I mean it! Really! These aren't the droids you're looking for!

Edit: Right! Back on topic!

But Pentagon officials said Thursday that the brief flight of the Taepodong-2 missile made it difficult to collect useful technical data, including its intended target, its payload and whether it was a two-stage or three-stage missile.

Some U.S. officials were even leaning toward the theory that it was configured as a space launch to deliver a satellite into orbit, rather than as a flight test of a ballistic missile.

And finally...

North Korea might have avoided targeting Alaska because of a risk that the missile could mistakenly hit a land area in that route, the report said.

What the hell? He's shooting a missile at the US, and he's afraid that he might hit someone else? That makes sense.

On the 4th I launched a bottle rocket aimed at Washington DC. It fell several thousand miles short.

So did the Korean missile.

You know, from listening to the 101st keyboarders and other military pundits I have come to the conclusion that we should invade the Us and bring a regime change. It's for the good of the world's environment and for the sake of humanity. Otherwise, they'll nuke the entire race into oblivion. If we had listened to them, North Korea, Irak, Iran, Afganistan, Palestine and probably France would have been hit by nuclear weapons. Think of what that'll do to our environement.

I see no other option that to invade and disarm the USA.

You'll notice in this thread that I have only advocated using defensive anti-ballistic missiles.

No advocation of sanctions, invasion, or nuking. So maybe the US has been going down the right track with this, seeing as the UN will not do anything other than write a letter saying how angry the UN is about this.

Actually we need more test data for our missile interception systems anyway . so we should just let the fool fire away and shoot his shit down .
look how much the patriot system was improved after we used it to shoot down scuds..it sucked in the beginning but now its in the high 90 percent hit rate..and even the miss counts are when its doesnt destroy the warhead and lets it drop out of the sky with the other missile parts . The best practice is live fire excercises...lets see if kim lil dong has the onions . As long as we shoot his crappy stuff down over international water ..WTF is he going to do ?

I dont see why ...except for the fact he holds South Korea hostage along with Japan we let him keep screwing around ....but hey sooner or later SK and Jaapan are going to decide its game over...its not like we have not planned to deal with North korea for fifty years... IMO ..as long as we have Mr balls to the wall in office ..if they keep pushing..they are headed for a huge smack down .

And a missile landing near hawaii would definately call for every Fuel air explosive ...cruise missile ..stealth bomber and other conventional weapon in the US arsenal to be used to dismantle his regime...along with a hellfire missle that will fly through his palace and up his ass while he's looking for his drool cup .

China can have the cratered landscape thats left over .

Okay.

For one, Who the hell would actually support North Korea?

I mean, yeah, I would support it's oppressed citizens. But their leader? Heck no! The Military of NK have taken everything away from it's citizens. They are even compared to countries like Sudan and Niger where people starve everyday. They have almost the most corruption of any other country in the world.

Other news.

Hawaii is not just a territory. They actually welcomed the U.S. and they wanted to become a state. I don't think that the military bases there are that important anymore (considering the navy is off in the Red Sea...or so they say they are.) But I do have to say that giving Hawaii back to the natives is like giving a child back his gameboy without the games.

Now me personally, I would not like it if I were suddenly attacked by a nuclear weapon. So why the freaking hell would you support a mad man that doesn't give a crap about his people and will develop nuclear weapons to use against other people so that he can take them over and oppress them as well? Does anyone have any common sense anymore?

Nuclear Power is fine. I'm okay with that. But Nuclear weapons in the wrong hands is a bad idea.

Yeah, I don't support Bush either. (He kinda smells...) But hey, he's got a year and a half to improve. Hopefully our next election won't be so...bleh!

We should be using our military for something more beneficial, like Liberating Sudan. Millions of people die each day there due to starvation caused by the warlords that control Sudan. This is just sickening.

Well, I hope you read this.

-=Alexander Ra'Baal=-

Actually we need more test data for our missile interception systems anyway . so we should just let the fool fire away and shoot his shit down .
look how much the patriot system was improved after we used it to shoot down scuds..it sucked in the beginning but now its in the high 90 percent hit rate..and even the miss counts are when its doesnt destroy the warhead and lets it drop out of the sky with the other missile parts . The best practice is live fire excercises...lets see if kim lil dong has the onions . As long as we shoot his crappy stuff down over international water ..WTF is he going to do ?

I dont see why ...except for the fact he holds South Korea hostage along with Japan we let him keep screwing around ....but hey sooner or later SK and Jaapan are going to decide its game over...its not like we have not planned to deal with North korea for fifty years... IMO ..as long as we have Mr balls to the wall in office ..if they keep pushing..they are headed for a huge smack down .

And a missile landing near hawaii would definately call for every Fuel air explosive ...cruise missile ..stealth bomber and other conventional weapon in the US arsenal to be used to dismantle his regime...along with a hellfire missle that will fly through his palace and up his ass while he's looking for his drool cup .

China can have the cratered landscape thats left over .


I couldn't of said it better myself.

Heck, NK is such a puny little country...and our technology is highly advanced. Their tanks (from what I have seen) are still Russian Grade Post WWII, Pre-Modern. That's gotta be low.

Actually we need more test data for our missile interception systems anyway . so we should just let the fool fire away and shoot his shit down .
look how much the patriot system was improved after we used it to shoot down scuds..it sucked in the beginning but now its in the high 90 percent hit rate..and even the miss counts are when its doesnt destroy the warhead and lets it drop out of the sky with the other missile parts . The best practice is live fire excercises...lets see if kim lil dong has the onions . As long as we shoot his crappy stuff down over international water ..WTF is he going to do ?

I dont see why ...except for the fact he holds South Korea hostage along with Japan we let him keep screwing around ....but hey sooner or later SK and Jaapan are going to decide its game over...its not like we have not planned to deal with North korea for fifty years... IMO ..as long as we have Mr balls to the wall in office ..if they keep pushing..they are headed for a huge smack down .

And a missile landing near hawaii would definately call for every Fuel air explosive ...cruise missile ..stealth bomber and other conventional weapon in the US arsenal to be used to dismantle his regime...along with a hellfire missle that will fly through his palace and up his ass while he's looking for his drool cup .

China can have the cratered landscape thats left over .


Ahem.

Here's a correction on your Patriot information.

Patriot was replaced by PAC-3.

It shot down 9 Iraqi missiles during the most recent invasion of Iraq - some of which were multiple targets at once, which the PAC-3 automatically engaged with ripple-fire.

Since the PAC-3 contains no explosives, and relies on direct impact to get a kill, it is far, far more certain than the original Patriot.

And it works.

You know, from listening to the 101st keyboarders and other military pundits I have come to the conclusion that we should invade the Us and bring a regime change. It's for the good of the world's environment and for the sake of humanity. Otherwise, they'll nuke the entire race into oblivion. If we had listened to them, North Korea, Irak, Iran, Afganistan, Palestine and probably France would have been hit by nuclear weapons. Think of what that'll do to our environement.

I see no other option that to invade and disarm the USA.
Yes, invading the US is such a brilliant solution. I don't really think you could invade the US without having the massive costs in human life and stuff that you were afraid of to begin with. Yeah, I know you were possibly joking but still, how would Canada invade the US to begin with? From all I have heard your military is diminishing at a fast rate.

Haven't read the posted article..nor have I watched the news..

Stop.

Go read it.

You'll notice in this thread that I have only advocated using defensive anti-ballistic missiles.

No advocation of sanctions, invasion, or nuking. So maybe the US has been going down the right track with this, seeing as the UN will not do anything other than write a letter saying how angry the UN is about this.

I have to agree with this as well.

But here's my thought.

Disarming the United States of America will bring doom to everyone else because from what I see, No one else cares. People in Sudan are murdered everyday. The United States has enough balls to send some aid. People in Iraq were being oppressed, we had the balls to go in there and kick some ass. Of course, then Bush declared this stupid "War On Terror" crap so now we look like the bad guys.

Look in the past. Such as WWII. The United States put in more effort in the rebuilding of Europe. So I would highly suggest you stop criticising them before your the country that is in need of help.

Yes, invading the US is such a brilliant solution. I don't really think you could invade the US without having the massive costs in human life and stuff that you were afraid of to begin with. Yeah, I know you were possibly joking but still, how would Canada invade the US to begin with? From all I have heard your military is diminishing at a fast rate.

Also there is the fact that Canada is allies with the United States and wouldn't dare attack them. It's called the fricken NATO!

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?t=82755

Oh yes, North Korea is a model for the world. *sarcasm*
North Koreans are oppressed, and fed propaganda everyday.

I dont see how comparing them to the US helps, because saying they barely have eletricity because they want to help the envoirement sounds incredibly silly, sorry. Sure, the US and many other contries over polute the world, thats a major problem today, but wouldnt you say it is a major problem that 20 millions of North Koreans are starving and have no personal freedoms whatsoever?

Pyongyang is like a model city for tourists, and not all of it is all shinny and pretty, oh and, someone posted a foto of a hotel saying that for a poor country they have nice hotels? Well, first of all, that hotel was undercontruction (not anymore), it stopped on '92, and the NKorean governament spends the little money they have on military and on "pretty things" for the political and military leaders, and on metro lines and hotels to show the tourists. Not to mention the huge statues of "the great leader".

Look in the past. Such as WWII. The United States put in more effort in the rebuilding of Europe. So I would highly suggest you stop criticising them before your the country that is in need of help.Oh, how nice. You're one of those "You're all eternally indebted to the U. S. of A." people, huh?

Also there is the fact that Canada is allies with the United States and wouldn't dare attack them. It's called the fricken NATO!NATO doesn't stop NATO members from attacking eachother...

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?t=82755

Oh yes, North Korea is a model for the world. *sarcasm*
North Koreans are oppressed, and fed propaganda everyday.

I dont see how comparing them to the US helps, because saying they barely have eletricity because they want to help the envoirement sounds incredibly silly, sorry. Sure, the US and many other contries over polute the world, thats a major problem today, but wouldnt you say it is a major problem that 20 millions of North Koreans are starving and have no personal freedoms whatsoever?

Pyongyang is like a model city for tourists, and not all of it is all shinny and pretty, oh and, someone posted a foto of a hotel saying that for a poor country they have nice hotels? Well, first of all, that hotel was undercontruction (not anymore), it stopped on '92, and the NKorean governament spends the little money they have on military and on "pretty things" for the political and military leaders, and on metro lines and hotels to show the tourists. Not to mention the huge statues of "the great leader".


Wow. Someone who actually said what I said...but with class. :p

Yes, invading the US is such a brilliant solution. I don't really think you could invade the US without having the massive costs in human life and stuff that you were afraid of to begin with. Yeah, I know you were possibly joking but still, how would Canada invade the US to begin with? From all I have heard your military is diminishing at a fast rate.
I was thinking more globally, like a coalition of the willing. But to assuage your fears, I will state that I was joking and trying to point out that advocating loss of life is not a good idea.

But, you should know that our current government is injecting quite a tidy sum into our military. Our military shall be stong again!

Oh, how nice. You're one of those "You're all eternally indebted to the U. S. of A." people, huh?


No, I just consider the facts. Unlike some individuals who are not appreciative of the efforts that the Americans have done for them. Why else do you think that the nuclear arsenal sitting under our rears is only a "Last Resort" in case if a catastrophe needed us to use them. We have developed better ways of dealing with countries. Cutting off trade with them is one.

Dude, Hawaii?

I have to agree with this as well.

But here's my thought.

Disarming the United States of America will bring doom to everyone else because from what I see, No one else cares. People in Sudan are murdered everyday. The United States has enough balls to send some aid. People in Iraq were being oppressed, we had the balls to go in there and kick some ass. Of course, then Bush declared this stupid "War On Terror" crap so now we look like the bad guys.

Look in the past. Such as WWII. The United States put in more effort in the rebuilding of Europe. So I would highly suggest you stop criticising them before your the country that is in need of help.
And from what I've seen , the US is the cause of quite a bit of these regime and is selling quite a bit to People in Sudan and elsewhere. Iraq is in worse shape now than when they were being oppressed.

And when I look in the past I see a great many countries who used all thwe ressources they could garner to help Europe after WW2. So I suggest that you leave my criticism of the warmongers alone.

Oh, how nice. You're one of those "You're all eternally indebted to the U. S. of A." people, huh?

I am not one of those people. Mind you, George Washington was right when he said that Europe would be the source of most foreign "entanglements". And he was right.

I am not one of those people. Mind you, George Washington was right when he said that Europe would be the source of most foreign "entanglements". And he was right.Damn those Europeans and their willingness to buy American products. The world would be so much better if there were no new markets.

And from what I've seen , the US is the cause of quite a bit of these regime and is selling quite a bit to People in Sudan and elsewhere. Iraq is in worse shape now than when they were being oppressed.

And when I look in the past I see a great many countries who used all thwe ressources they could garner to help Europe after WW2. So I suggest that you leave my criticism of the warmongers alone.


-shrugs-

You get rid of the United States and the Global Economy will falter. That's life for you.

Damn those Europeans and their willingness to buy American products. The world would be so much better if there were no new markets.

No, damn the Europeans and their hundred years of infighting. And their Communist revolutions. And their colonialism, and their abandonment of colonies.

Just goes to show you that the US has had plenty of instruction and example of how to conduct itself from Europe.

No, damn the Europeans and their hundred years of infighting. And their Communist revolutions. And their colonialism, and their abandonment of colonies.

Just goes to show you that the US has had plenty of instruction and example of how to conduct itself from Europe.


-Shrugs- I actually liked the Europeans. They have pretty good snipers. Other than that...I dunno. They have Activision, that's a plus.

No, damn the Europeans and their hundred years of infighting. And their Communist revolutions. And their colonialism, and their abandonment of colonies.

Just goes to show you that the US has had plenty of instruction and example of how to conduct itself from Europe.Yup. Europe's one rotten apple.

-shrugs-

You get rid of the United States and the Global Economy will falter. That's life for you.
-shrugs-
never said to get rid of the US. I merely suggested a regime change. Besides, the economy has been known to bounce back.

but that is inconsequential. My point was that I disagree with advocating nuking and war as a human life is a human life and we should try to save as much of them as we can. A nuke is never the answer.

Technical note:

Defensive missile systems are a good idea. The US has three systems in place.

PAC-3
SM-3
Ground Based Interceptor

The last one is what you hear about in the news concerning tests that seem iffy.

SM-3 is carried on AEGIS cruisers and has worked many times in tests, some of which were allowing the system scant seconds to react and fire.

PAC-3 was proven in combat, and is a major improvement over the original Patriot.

All three missiles use hit to kill technology - they have no explosives, but count on the high velocity at impact to destroy the target. This solves the "near miss" problem that was experienced during Patriot use in the 1991 Gulf War.

PATRIOT battalions with PAC-3 fire units were employed in Operation Iraqi Freedom (OIF) against TBMs. In OIF, PAC-3 interceptors were ripple-fired against ballistic missile threats, a user requirement that was not demonstrated during operational testing. This eliminated the need for a follow-on test to demonstrate this capability. All PATRIOT engagements were conducted in a complex operational environment. There were three instances of erroneous engagements between PATRIOT batteries and friendly aircraft. System performance against TBMs appears to have been highly effective and consistent with expectations documented in DOT&E’s beyond low-rate initial production report submitted to Congress in October 2002. PATRIOT performance during OIF is detailed in the classified FY03 BMDS annual report.

No, damn the Europeans and their hundred years of infighting. And their Communist revolutions. And their colonialism, and their abandonment of colonies.

Just goes to show you that the US has had plenty of instruction and example of how to conduct itself from Europe.

*Nods*

You should probably go in and enact a regime change now. For democracy, of course.

-shrugs-
never said to get rid of the US. I merely suggested a regime change. Besides, the economy has been known to bounce back.

but that is inconsequential. My point was that I disagree with advocating nuking and war as a human life is a human life and we should try to save as much of them as we can. A nuke is never the answer.

Which is why I had stated earlier that I am opposed to the Nuclear Arsenal. I also stated that it's a last resort.

Oh, and if your talking about a new regime. Just wait a few more years.
-laughs evilly-

I am willing to step up. I am a people's man. Not a bloody warmonger. I swear to that.

*Nods*

You should probably go in and enact a regime change now. For democracy, of course.


:D :D :D

Actually...

What needs to be done is a complete makeover of the Government System.
They are letting too many things slide these days....

Maybe you don't understand Juche. President Jong-Il realizes that people don't all want to pollute the Earth like the USA does.

Did you know that the US is 4% of the world's population, but uses 40% of its resources?

President Jong-Il and the North Korean people should be held up as models of what the future of the world could be, if the USA would stop exploiting the world's resources.

I fully support President Clinton's decision to send reparations in the form of grain and food to North Korea, because what we did in the Korean War to the North Koreans was unconsciable.
Held as models!? Are you joking? Lil'Kim is recognized as a madman by the Koreans and the Western world. The only reason they don't pollute is because they have NOTHING. No cars, education, food, or money. Some model.

http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums...ad.php?t=82755

Oh yes, North Korea is a model for the world. *sarcasm*
North Koreans are oppressed, and fed propaganda everyday.

I dont see how comparing them to the US helps, because saying they barely have eletricity because they want to help the envoirement sounds incredibly silly, sorry. Sure, the US and many other contries over polute the world, thats a major problem today, but wouldnt you say it is a major problem that 20 millions of North Koreans are starving and have no personal freedoms whatsoever?

Pyongyang is like a model city for tourists, and not all of it is all shinny and pretty, oh and, someone posted a foto of a hotel saying that for a poor country they have nice hotels? Well, first of all, that hotel was undercontruction (not anymore), it stopped on '92, and the NKorean governament spends the little money they have on military and on "pretty things" for the political and military leaders, and on metro lines and hotels to show the tourists. Not to mention the huge statues of "the great leader".
Wow. Someone who actually said what I said...but with class. :p


There's an even easier way to say all that - Potempkin Village...

The Hawaii thing was probably made up by Cheney and Rove to try to rally the republican base for the 2006 elections.

The truth is that North Korea has every right to nuclear weapons. Only the USA has actually used them against innocent Japanese civilians during World War II. And whatever republicans might say about President Jong-Il, at least everyone in North Korea has healthcare.

On another note, Hawaii is occupied and Hawaii should be returned to Native Hawaiians.

...

For Gods sake, please tell me you're kidding here. North Korea as a model country? What bloody planet are you living on mate?

In the past, I have rallied up support for a new control of the USA.

I know, it's actually kinda bad to think that, but I personally believe
that the corruption must come to an utter halt.

We should bring back all militant personel to homeland soil.

From there, we can regroup and rebudget everything.

The military, education, defence, policeforce, and healthcare (along with the enviroment) shall recieve decent sized portions of the budget.

I believe, correct me if I am wrong, but the yearly national budget for the Federal Governmetn is around 365 Billion Dollars.

(This of course sucks due to the substantial amounts of debt. Thank you dumb people running the budgets!)

Healthcare and Education needs a significant increase.

(I hate reading math books that date back to 1978. I mean, come on! Something must of changed sometime. No one where's their shorts that high anymore.)

I know, this is off topic. Way off topic. But I just want to show you guys that I am not a bloody war monger...even if I do portray it in the RP. :p

...

For Gods sake, please tell me you're kidding here. North Korea as a model country? What bloody planet are you living on mate?

Planet Massa-choo-sits!

PtowieeH

*spits all the way from his trailer in don'tMessWithTexas till New England*

I really wonder how that works out. 4% using 40%. Maybe it's because we know how to use that 40%? Or we have the actual ability to refine that 40%?

T&C, please, inform me of the substance you are currently intoxicating yourself with, it seems like it's a winner.

I really wonder how that works out. 4% using 40%. Maybe it's because we know how to use that 40%? Or we have the actual ability to refine that 40%?

Don't go that way. US uses waaaay too many resources. Im not easing the blames on other developed countries, but really, dont go that way.

Let's see. Countries that pollute more than the US.

Mexico
China
Russia

to name a few.

Let's see. Countries that pollute more than the US.

Mexico
China
Russia

to name a few.Pollute what?

Don't go that way. US uses waaaay too many resources. Im not easing the blames on other developed countries, but really, dont go that way.


Oh. (And this is the excuse I heard the current political leaders say.)

"We are using all of the other country's resources, so that when they run out...we have our own. Good plan, eh?"

I aughta slap them. Why can't we be like we were back in WWII recycling every bloody thing on sight?

Let's see. Countries that pollute more than the US.

Mexico
China
Russia

to name a few.

I didnt say the US polluted the most. Like i said, i wasnt trying to ease the blame on other developed countries, like you just did to the US.
We're getting way off topic too :D

Yes, most of the USA belongs to the Native Americans, with the exception of the Southwest, whose original name is Aztlan, being returned to the Latin Americans.
Um, shouldn't the Latin Americans go back to Spain and Portugal?

Oh. (And this is the excuse I heard the current political leaders say.)

"We are using all of the other country's resources, so that when they run out...we have our own. Good plan, eh?"

I aughta slap them. Why can't we be like we were back in WWII recycling every bloody thing on sight?

Because we are all humans, humans arent all that smart, really.

Pollute what?


Air pollution.
Water Contamination.
Soil irradiation. (Kidding.)

Because we are all humans, humans arent all that smart, really.

As opposed to...what?

Um, shouldn't the Latin Americans go back to Spain and Portugal?

:D

We all should go back to Africa. Humanity started there, didnt it?

Um, shouldn't the Latin Americans go back to Spain and Portugal?

And get those bloody Canadians back to France and England, too!

As opposed to...what?

To non-recycling.

Because we are all humans, humans arent all that smart, really.


True. But I mean, I actually separate my recycle-ables (SP?) from the trash trash. By Trash I mean...well...err...moldy food. Wait...no...I bury that. Err...umm...Soiled Diapers!

As opposed to...what?

Monkeys! Cute little furry Monkeys!

Air pollution.
Water Contamination.
Soil irradiation. (Kidding.)Link to it. Considering that the US is the world's largest producer of Carbon Dioxide (http://www.omsolar.net/en/omsolar1/co2_emissions.html), I find it rather unlikely that any other country would have them beat in air pollution...

To non-recycling.

I like my answer better.

Maybe you don't understand Juche. President Jong-Il realizes that people don't all want to pollute the Earth like the USA does.

Did you know that the US is 4% of the world's population, but uses 40% of its resources?

President Jong-Il and the North Korean people should be held up as models of what the future of the world could be, if the USA would stop exploiting the world's resources.

I fully support President Clinton's decision to send reparations in the form of grain and food to North Korea, because what we did in the Korean War to the North Koreans was unconsciable.

This guy has got to be trolling. Either that, or he's in grad school somewhere.

As for "what we did in the Korean War," the only "unconscionable" thing we did was not bombing the Yalu River bridges and liberating all of Korea. If that fool Harry Truman hadn't fired MacArthur, we would have eventually won the war and we wouldn't be facing this problem today.

I like my answer better.

I do like your answer better too. :p

Link to it. Considering that the US is the world's largest producer of Carbon Dioxide (http://www.omsolar.net/en/omsolar1/co2_emissions.html), I find it rather unlikely that any other country would have them beat in air pollution...

Actually, I was talking more of smog.

Actually, I was talking more of smog.Got any sources to back it up?

This guy has got to be trolling. Either that, or he's in grad school somewhere.

As for "what we did in the Korean War," the only "unconscionable" thing we did was not bombing the Yalu River bridges and liberating all of Korea. If that fool Harry Truman hadn't fired MacArthur, we would have eventually won the war and we wouldn't be facing this problem today.


Why did we sign a cease fire? WHY?!

...

For Gods sake, please tell me you're kidding here. North Korea as a model country? What bloody planet are you living on mate?

Haven't we beaten Conscience and Truth to a bloody pulp on this enough already?

Got any sources to back it up?

I watched this tape produced by the United Nations a few months ago.

Russia and China create more smog because they use the older and more crude methods of using those materials.

:D

We all should go back to Africa. Humanity started there, didnt it?
Back to Africa!?!? Read my sig. Better yet, click the link in it.

I think he's one of those silly Commie disinformation people.

Outside of that, he's clearly wrong. Jongo is a meglomanical, crazed leader who starves his people to maintain his massive million man army (which is horrdily outdated) and build nukes in some silly attempt to threaten Japan and South Korea into complying with their wishes.

Look at South Korea. A vibrant, properous capitalist Western democracy with a booming economy and educated and enlightened people.

Then, look at North Korea.

Starving, poor, and communist.

Haven't we beaten Conscience and Truth to a bloody pulp on this enough already?

A pulp is not good enough. He needs to be completely liquified!

I watched this tape produced by the United Nations a few months ago.

Russia and China create more smog because they use the older and more crude methods of using those materials.Anyone can say that. If what you say is true, you'll probably be able to find things on www.un.org on it.

Well, i don't think they were actually intended for Hawaii, since that'd just be stupid. It seems like the world would actually side with the US on this issue. No one in their right mind would attack us. This time Japan and South Korea would be providing a tons of support, too.

If North Korea attacked anywhere, it would be Yongsan Base in the middle of Seoul, which is both the capital of S. Korea and the closest American base to the 37th parallel. Then Osan, which is the main Air Force base in Korea.

And, im sure we have missiles point towards North Korea at this very moment also.

At least I think it was an UN tape...I'm not sure. All the guy said was UN related matters on the fuel crises.

Well, i don't think they were actually intended for Hawaii, since that'd just be stupid. It seems like the world would actually side with the US on this issue. No one in their right mind would attack us. This time Japan and South Korea would be providing a tons of support, too.

And, im sure we have missiles point towards North Korea at this very moment also.


Sh! Don't say that! Now those crazed maniacs will completely flame us Americans!

Well, i don't think they were actually intended for Hawaii, since that'd just be stupid. It seems like the world would actually side with the US on this issue. No one in their right mind would attack us. This time Japan and South Korea would be providing a tons of support, too.

And, im sure we have missiles point towards North Korea at this very moment also.

South Korea by herself could hold off a North Korean attack, simply put. They are supplied with modern US equipment such as F-16s and F-15s, and are superbly trained. On the northside of the DMZ, the People's Army (or whatever they like to call themselves) is equiped with 1960s era ex-Soviet crap, and are poorly trained and led, and lack the supplies necessary to sustain an invasion of their souther neighbor.

At least I think it was an UN tape...I'm not sure. All the guy said was UN related matters on the fuel crises.Citing a tape from which you're no longer sure of the content isn't a very reliable source.

Well, i don't think they were actually intended for Hawaii, since that'd just be stupid. It seems like the world would actually side with the US on this issue. No one in their right mind would attack us. This time Japan and South Korea would be providing a tons of support, too.

And, im sure we have missiles point towards North Korea at this very moment also.
What I think really hapened:

US: We need to stop NK! Now! They have missiles.

Rest of world: meh. You do to. We all have. We test them all the time.

US: Well, uh, see, they were aiming at, uh, mmm, Hawaii! They are clearly a threat.

Me: laughing hard. They were clrearly aiming at Hawaii, even when Japan is on the way. Clearly.

Let's see. Countries that pollute more than the US.

Mexico
China
Russia

to name a few.
I think you are reading the wrong fact books?

Carbon Dioxide:

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/env_pol_car_dio_fro_fos_fue_200-carbon-dioxide-fossil-fuels-2000

Carbon Dioxide per capita:

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/env_pol_car_dio_per_cap-pollution-carbon-dioxide-per-capita

CO2 per capita:

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/env_co2_emi_percap-environment-co2-emissions-per-capita

Threatened species by country:

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/env_thr_spe-environment-threatened-species

Waste generation by country:

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/env_was_gen-environment-waste-generation

If anyone is looking for a more reliable source than FOX NEWS, here is the CNN article.

http://www.cnn.com/2006/WORLD/asiapcf/07/07/korea.missile.us.0620/index.html


"But Japan's Sankei newspaper, citing U.S. and Japanese sources, reported Friday that the missile was aimed at an area of the ocean close to Hawaii."

I think you are reading the wrong fact books?

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/env_pol_car_dio_fro_fos_fue_200-carbon-dioxide-fossil-fuels-2000
Mexico City is the most polluted city in the world. I think he is right. We just use so much energy that we create tons of pollution from it, while China, Russia, ect don't use as much but cause just as much pollution.

If you guys think that the US pollutes alot, wait till China and India become fully modernized.

Hoho.

The Hawaii thing was probably made up by Cheney and Rove to try to rally the republican base for the 2006 elections.

The truth is that North Korea has every right to nuclear weapons. Only the USA has actually used them against innocent Japanese civilians during World War II. And whatever republicans might say about President Jong-Il, at least everyone in North Korea has healthcare.

On another note, Hawaii is occupied and Hawaii should be returned to Native Hawaiians.

I have to say I am in complete disagreement with this post...

First off, NK doesn't have the right to them, not with a psycho-dictator in charge. I mean we have them, but we only put the villiage idiot in charge of them. NK is a nuclear war waiting to happen, as is Iran. (Ok, your right about the health care thing)

Secondly, We called the Japanese Emperor and told him we were gonna use a new weapon that we didn't know what exactly would happen and it would be wise to move his people out of there... HE didn't listen. He had the chance to act and didn't so HIS bad.

The Hawaii thing I'm not even going to comment on...


Now, I've no love of the current leadership here... They're liars, they cheat the truth and betray the people of this country and those soldiers that now fight in forign conflicts...

We created Saddam, so it was right for us to correct that error... the blood he spilt and lives he ruined are on us. That being said, he will NEVER do that again now.. Afganistan... Hey, your either with us or against us, that son of a constipated camel hit us first... and not just the US, but everyone and anyone that had buisness in those towers that day.

You harbour a terrorist.. you are the enemy, and deserve whatever happens to you.

North Korea, his temperment is such that I can see him trying to fire on Hawaii to teach the Americans a lesson... of course there's a major difference. OUR missiles WORK and CAN reach him.

The admrial of the Japanese fleet noted that they had woken a sleeping giant when they hit Pearl. Hopefully none of these other monkeys will try that again lest they see what we can really do.

Back to Africa!?!? Read my sig. Better yet, click the link in it.

Ahah! Hillarious. :D

Mexico City is the most polluted city in the world. I think he is right. We just use so much energy that we create tons of pollution from it, while China, Russia, ect don't use as much but cause just as much pollution.Indeed, however Mexico City isn't it's own country.

I was thinking more globally, like a coalition of the willing. But to assuage your fears, I will state that I was joking and trying to point out that advocating loss of life is not a good idea.

But, you should know that our current government is injecting quite a tidy sum into our military. Our military shall be stong again!
Again?

Secondly, We called the Japanese Emperor and told him we were gonna use a new weapon that we didn't know what exactly would happen and it would be wise to move his people out of there... HE didn't listen. He had the chance to act and didn't so HIS bad.


Show me the evidence of this, if you please.

And it's quite hard to evacuate a large city in a short amount of time. I'll direct you to Hurricane Katrina.

The admrial of the Japanese fleet noted that they had woken a sleeping giant when they hit Pearl. Hopefully none of these other monkeys will try that again lest they see what we can really do.

Yeeha, motherfuckers!

I have to say I am in complete disagreement with this post...

First off, NK doesn't have the right to them, not with a psycho-dictator in charge. I mean we have them, but we only put the villiage idiot in charge of them. NK is a nuclear war waiting to happen, as is Iran. (Ok, your right about the health care thing)
That's your reason? Not that it destroys the environment, that it is a potential danger to your own people at it degrades and possible teft?

No, your argument is that he's a psycho-dicator? Sorry buddy but you'll have to find better to get the world to agree with you. After all, Pakistan's got some and many people call them crazy. Also, as noted earlier, nodoby has shown that Dear Leader is crazy. He has acted anything but crazy in firng missiles at the water and not at a target.

Secondly, We called the Japanese Emperor and told him we were gonna use a new weapon that we didn't know what exactly would happen and it would be wise to move his people out of there... HE didn't listen. He had the chance to act and didn't so HIS bad.
Gee. Because everybody listens to his ennemy in time of war. Misinformation has never been used in the history of mankind. :rolleyes:

Not to mention that "abort" has always have been possible since we knew he didn't evacuate. No, the US cannot pass the buck to Japan for this one.

Again?
everything is relative. ;)

We did have quite a good force during WW2. It did quite a number on D-day.

Again?

Oy! We're talking about North Korea, not Canadian bashing.

http://www.globalsecurity.org/wmd/world/dprk/images/Korea-at-Night.jpg

Yep, a whole lotta 'lectricity going on north of the 'Z.

It's said NK had a blackout at that moment..
it's also said that would probably happens all the time :p

That's your reason? Not that it destroys the environment, that it is a potential danger ...
No, your argument is that he's a psycho-dicator? Sorry buddy but you'll have to find better to get the world to agree with you. After all, Pakistan's got some and many people call them crazy. Also, as noted earlier, nodoby has shown that Dear Leader is crazy. He has acted anything but crazy in firng missiles at the water and not at a target.
Actually, after the bomb dropped, Hiroshima experienced exponential plant growth throughout the city. Somehow it triggered the plants to start growing rapily. But that was after everything was OBLITERATED.

However, everyone seems to forget that people were actually saved from this bomb. 100,000+ people immediately died in the Hiroshima bomb (over 200,000+ people counting Nagasaki also). How many millions of Japanese soldiers do you think would have been killed if we continued the war?

Actually, after the bomb dropped, Hiroshima experienced exponential plant growth throughout the city. Somehow it triggered the plants to start growing rapily. But that was after everything was OBLITERATED.

However, everyone seems to forget that people were actually saved from this bomb. 100,000+ people immediately died in the Hiroshima bomb (over 200,000+ people counting Nagasaki also). How many millions of Japanese soldiers do you think would have been killed if we continued the war?
Continuing the war =/= mass invasion. There was the simple siege option, plus there's the whole argument about differences in the peace demands before and after the bombings which people argue show that the US wanted to test the bombs anyway.

Lastly it definitely shows that the USA has, in the past, been prepared to use nuclear weapons when it was NOT a last resort.




First off, NK doesn't have the right to them, not with a psycho-dictator in charge. I mean we have them, but we only put the villiage idiot in charge of them. NK is a nuclear war waiting to happen, as is Iran. (Ok, your right about the health care thing)
And what right does the US have to say who can and who can't have them? Other than "might is right" of course. Since they're not part of the NPT, legally they have a complete right to MAD.


Secondly, We called the Japanese Emperor and told him we were gonna use a new weapon that we didn't know what exactly would happen and it would be wise to move his people out of there... HE didn't listen. He had the chance to act and didn't so HIS bad.
The "I'm going to punch that space and if you're going to get in the way it's your fault" argument?
1. US could easily have been lying
2. Evacuating a big city is hardly like making a phone call. Look at New Orleans and Katrina for example. And that was in a place where lots of people had cars etc.


We created Saddam, so it was right for us to correct that error... the blood he spilt and lives he ruined are on us. That being said, he will NEVER do that again now.. Afganistan... Hey, your either with us or against us, that son of a constipated camel hit us first... and not just the US, but everyone and anyone that had buisness in those towers that day.
And here's me thinking it was an independant terrorrist organisation called Al'qaida (sp?) did I miss the newsflash where the Afghan government claimed responsibility?


You harbour a terrorist.. you are the enemy, and deserve whatever happens to you.
Proof is wonderful thing. One man's terrorrist is another man's freedom fighter etc. Apparently (meaning I can't be bothered to look up substantial proof at the moment) the CIA harboured Nazi war criminals because of their spying expertise against the Soviets.


North Korea, his temperment is such that I can see him trying to fire on Hawaii to teach the Americans a lesson... of course there's a major difference. OUR missiles WORK and CAN reach him.

Or he was making what arguably would the sensible move of trying to send a missile to crash in to international waters near Hawaii as a warning to the USA that he could reach them, and hence invading was a lot more trouble than it's worth.

hey Dephire, thanks for correcting this little bit of information. :) Hawaii is not just a territory. They actually welcomed the U.S. and they wanted to become a state. I don't think that the military bases there are that important anymore (considering the navy is off in the Red Sea...or so they say they are.) But I do have to say that giving Hawaii back to the natives is like giving a child back his gameboy without the games.


kinda sad that it took 120+ posts for someone to correct it.

hey Dephire, thanks for correcting this little bit of information. :)

kinda sad that it took 120+ posts for someone to correct it.

Kinda missed the bit about American planters leading the revolution, didn't he?

The Hawaii thing was probably made up by Cheney and Rove to try to rally the republican base for the 2006 elections.

The truth is that North Korea has every right to nuclear weapons. Only the USA has actually used them against innocent Japanese civilians during World War II. And whatever republicans might say about President Jong-Il, at least everyone in North Korea has healthcare.

On another note, Hawaii is occupied and Hawaii should be returned to Native Hawaiians.
Maybe you don't understand Juche. President Jong-Il realizes that people don't all want to pollute the Earth like the USA does.

Did you know that the US is 4% of the world's population, but uses 40% of its resources?

President Jong-Il and the North Korean people should be held up as models of what the future of the world could be, if the USA would stop exploiting the world's resources.

I fully support President Clinton's decision to send reparations in the form of grain and food to North Korea, because what we did in the Korean War to the North Koreans was unconsciable.
HA HA HA HA HA HA That was all part of some kind of bad joke.... right?


Yes, most of the USA belongs to the Native Americans, with the exception of the Southwest, whose original name is Aztlan, being returned to the Latin Americans.
Wrong, earlier Americans.

And no, sorry, I don't think so. :rolleyes:

The Hawaii thing was probably made up by Cheney and Rove to try to rally the republican base for the 2006 elections.

The truth is that North Korea has every right to nuclear weapons. Only the USA has actually used them against innocent Japanese civilians during World War II. And whatever republicans might say about President Jong-Il, at least everyone in North Korea has healthcare.

On another note, Hawaii is occupied and Hawaii should be returned to Native Hawaiians.

Absolutely not. North Korea does not have a right to nuclear weapons. The international community at large must do its best to prevent the spread of WMDs--not promote them. Everyone in North Korea may have healthcare, but its obviously not enough to keep people from fleeing South. And Hawaii is not occupied. They are a state. They are as occupied as Virginia or Texas.

Continuing the war =/= mass invasion. There was the simple siege option, plus there's the whole argument about differences in the peace demands before and after the bombings which people argue show that the US wanted to test the bombs anyway.


Simple siege option? Sitting around on our asses waiting for Japan to say "ok, we give up" wouldn't work. A siege would involve massive bombing campaigns over the course of months or years, which might end up killing just as many folks. :headbang:

hey Dephire, thanks for correcting this little bit of information. :)

kinda sad that it took 120+ posts for someone to correct it.


It's alright. I read the first post, then the last post. After that, I was hooked. I mean, what better to argue about than politics? -chuckles- We can all have a good laugh.

Okay. Do you want the basics for what we are trying to explain? Here they are...

Giving Nuclear Weaponary to North Korea (or allowing them rather) is the same as:

1) Granting the President Unlimited Power (United States)
2) Giving Russia Three Trillion Dollars
3) Giving Iran Three Trillion Dollars
4) Handing yourself to the Police after bombing New York City, London, Paris, Mecca, Jerusalem, and Moscow.
5) Smoking Pot. (The Stupidity Issues...)
6) Jumping into a blender.
7) Jumping into a pit of lava.
8) Jumping into a blender while falling into a pit of lava while smoking some pot.
9) Giving some Trigger Happy National Guardsmen Mini-Guns and unlimited Ammunition. (Border Issues)
10 ) Handing the World on a Platter
11) Shooting a rocket for the moon, though it's aimed at the Sun.
12) [The list goes on and on]

Simple siege option? Sitting around on our asses waiting for Japan to say "ok, we give up" wouldn't work. A siege would involve massive bombing campaigns over the course of months or years, which might end up killing just as many folks. :headbang:

Just leave him to his ignorance. Let him believe that war is pretty, and that it would be better to lose many more American lives for the sake of the same number of Japanese dead.

Just leave him to his ignorance. Let him believe that war is pretty, and that it would be better to lose many more American lives for the sake of the same number of Japanese dead.

Why not make a giant moat around North Korea? Or Better yet, make NK drift away.

Kidding.

Why not make a giant moat around North Korea? Or Better yet, make NK drift away.

Kidding.

Ha. Perhaps all the nukes in the world could be used to forge a crevasse between N Korea and Asia...and force it off to sea...:)

Why are you guys going for the hard option? Take down the air defense leading to and aroung Pyongyang, drop a Ranger battalion, and have them take out the NK leadership. Maybe a couple Delta platoons in support, to specifically take out Kimmie.

It makes you wonder how a nuclear missle with the destructive range of five-ten miles can create a nuclear winter...

The truth is that North Korea has every right to nuclear weapons. Only the USA has actually used them against innocent Japanese civilians during World War II. And whatever republicans might say about President Jong-Il, at least everyone in North Korea has healthcare.



Like hell they have healthcare. Most don't have enough money to feed their families, let alone get medical cover. Where the hell do u get ure screwed up facts from

Why are you guys going for the hard option? Take down the air defense leading to and aroung Pyongyang, drop a Ranger battalion, and have them take out the NK leadership. Maybe a couple Delta platoons in support, to specifically take out Kimmie.


It would have to be a joint effort, but I think that what you just said is physically feasible.

Like hell they have healthcare. Most don't have enough money to feed their families, let alone get medical cover. Where the hell do u get ure screwed up facts from


The Average Korean (Non-militant) Boy is about six times smaller than anyother in the world. This is true. I have read it in the "The Top Twenty Worst Dictators of 2005"

Take down the air defense leading to and aroung Pyongyang, drop a Ranger battalion, and have them take out the NK leadership. Maybe a couple Delta platoons in support, to specifically take out Kimmie.

Just get a couple of B-52s and level Kim's command centre. Hell, maybe through in Delta Force, Navy Seals or why not try and rope in some British SAS. That will finish Kimmie off

Well. I think that North Korea has practically the same defenses as in Vietnam. Tunnels. Lots and lots of bloody freaking Tunnels! ARGH! I HATE YOU TUNNELS!!!

Like hell they have healthcare. Most don't have enough money to feed their families, let alone get medical cover. Where the hell do u get ure screwed up facts from

They have "healthcare", but no medicine or trained doctors. Kim prefers to spend money on himself, his army, and his ridiculous missle program rather than on feeding his people or supplying them with basic necessities. Hell, he can barely feed or equip the army due to the economic collapse of the 1990's; it's a wonder they're not trying to overthrow him.

It's ironic that North Korea in no way resembles the Juche philosophy that it was purportedly built on, but then again most Communist nations ended up like that.

Attacking Hawaii is a good way to get fucked up, Japan should know.


hahah funniest thing said. and true also..


NK has every right to pursue nuke weps.. and the US has every right to consider that a threat.

The Bush doctrine clearly points out what we do to those we consider threats.

Thats the game of Foreign Politics... may the strongest nation survive. :)

They have "healthcare", but no medicine or trained doctors. Kim prefers to spend money on himself, his army, and his ridiculous missle program rather than on feeding his people or supplying them with basic necessities. Hell, he can barely feed or equip the army due to the economic collapse of the 1990's; it's a wonder they're not trying to overthrow him.

It's ironic that North Korea in no way resembles the Juche philosophy that it was purportedly built on, but then again most Communist nations ended up like that.


Why can't there ever be a nice dictator?

hahah funniest thing said. and true also..


NK has every right to pursue nuke weps.. and the US has every right to consider that a threat.

The Bush doctrine clearly points out what we do to those we consider threats.

Thats the game of Foreign Politics... may the storngest nation survive. :)


Which makes you love ICBM's more and more everyday.

Are typing this at gunpoint from North Korea? The MAJORITY of N.Koreans are able to eat only because of outside aid, without this aid MILLIONS would die of starvation but they can afford missle and warhead research? WTF The US should IMMEDIATLY stop ALL food to NK until they stop their missle tests.


Maybe you don't understand Juche. President Jong-Il realizes that people don't all want to pollute the Earth like the USA does.

Did you know that the US is 4% of the world's population, but uses 40% of its resources?

President Jong-Il and the North Korean people should be held up as models of what the future of the world could be, if the USA would stop exploiting the world's resources.

I fully support President Clinton's decision to send reparations in the form of grain and food to North Korea, because what we did in the Korean War to the North Koreans was unconsciable.

I suggest you familiarize yourself with the NK use of propaganda.


Huh? Here's an image from a hotel in Pyongyang:

http://www.kdvr.de/tour/pyongyang-koryo-hotel-4.jpg

There's a TV and a lamp ...

http://www.travel-earth.com/dprk/pyongyang/pyongyang-metro.jpg

Very well lighted for no electricity ...

http://www.travel-earth.com/dprk/pyongyang/pyongyang-ryugyong.jpg

Nice hotel for such poverty ...

http://www.travel-earth.com/dprk/pyongyang/pyongyang-night_2.jpg

Ooh! Lights!

It's like all those people who assume Iran is a big desert and they all ride camels. Don't be ignorant. It doesn't help matters much.

Why can't there ever be a nice dictator?

The old cliche "absolute power corrupts absolutely" explains why.

Ironically, the original underpinning of Juche was chajusong or "independence". The people were supposed to have complete freedom in thought and politics...but that was swept away in favor of "molding" people to constructing socialism through loyalty to the party.

Are typing this at gunpoint from North Korea? The MAJORITY of N.Koreans are able to eat only because of outside aid, without this aid MILLIONS would die of starvation but they can afford missle and warhead research? WTF The US should IMMEDIATLY stop ALL food to NK until they stop their missle tests.

*Nods* Most food goes to their milirary, anyway. It is a tragedy that those who suffer are some of the most unfortunate people in the world, but propping up NK only ensures that that continues.

The Hawaii thing was probably made up by Cheney and Rove to try to rally the republican base for the 2006 elections.

The truth is that North Korea has every right to nuclear weapons. Only the USA has actually used them against innocent Japanese civilians during World War II. And whatever republicans might say about President Jong-Il, at least everyone in North Korea has healthcare.

On another note, Hawaii is occupied and Hawaii should be returned to Native Hawaiians.
Why I think your opinion is stupid:

1. Cheney and Rove didn't say that, the Japanese did. Strike 1.

2. The leader of North Korea is a f-ing nutcase. Giving him nuclear weapons is like giving a child to a child molester. Strike 2

3. USA used them because the "civilians" were also trained to fight by the Japanese forces. The Japanese culture of the time was one of determination and honor, something big had to be done in order to end the war. Also, it has been determined hundreds of thousands more people, be they Japanese civilians, Japanese troops, or US troops, would have died if the US decided to invade Japan instead. Do you think US leaders actually wanted to nuke Japan? They had no choice. Strike 3

4. Dictator(Not President, NK isn't a democracy by any means) Kim Jong-Il starves his own people, has secret police that cause any dissenters to "disappear", surpresses free enterprise, free speech, and freedom of religion, and has done many other horrible things, but, hey, they get free healthcare, so life must be good...oh wait, the healthcare system there sucks and gets near no funding. Strike 4.

5. Hawaii is a part of the United States, if the natives aren't citizens of our country, then make them such and they'll be happy. Strike 5

5 strikes, or 1 and 2/3s outs.

Just like to point out to the idiot who said we should give back Hawaii, the HAWAIIANS WANTED TO BECOME A STATE, THEY APPROACHED US!!

Just like to point out to the idiot who said we should give back Hawaii, the HAWAIIANS WANTED TO BECOME A STATE, THEY APPROACHED US!!
Think that's stupid? He/She(Don't know which, no offense) also said North Korea(In other words, Kim Jong Il) has the right to nukes and that life's good in North Korea because they receive free healthcare.

Which makes you love ICBM's more and more everyday.


Or, as I pointed out on another board, take a couple JASSMs, mount W-81 warheads on them, and blow both Pyongyang and the nuclear production facility to glowing rubble.

South Korea by herself could hold off a North Korean attack, simply put. They are supplied with modern US equipment such as F-16s and F-15s, and are superbly trained. On the northside of the DMZ, the People's Army (or whatever they like to call themselves) is equiped with 1960s era ex-Soviet crap, and are poorly trained and led, and lack the supplies necessary to sustain an invasion of their souther neighbor.

The problem is, the North doesn't need to invade the South. They have tens of thousands of artillery pieces and rocket launchers within range of Seoul. They could do tremendous damage to the city and thus to the nation. They would also be very hard to take out anytime soon.

Remember that the next time someone whines, "Why did the US invade Iraq and not North Korea?"

Or, as I pointed out on another board, take a couple JASSMs, mount W-81 warheads on them, and blow both Pyongyang and the nuclear production facility to glowing rubble.


Why don't we ever do that??? WHY?!

I have a summary of what Conscience and Truth believes: Read Mao Zedong's little red book.

The US should simply assinate Kim Jong Il, and his advisors/staff, so no one like him can take his place, and there is a rift between Kim and the military anyways, however, The US has never been good at assinating people, However the Mafia has, I believe the US should hire the mob to take out Kim and his friends. :fluffle:

Are typing this at gunpoint from North Korea? The MAJORITY of N.Koreans are able to eat only because of outside aid, without this aid MILLIONS would die of starvation but they can afford missle and warhead research? WTF The US should IMMEDIATLY stop ALL food to NK until they stop their missle tests.

C&T evidently believes that the US attacked North Korea to start the Korean War.

He evidently doesn't know that North Korea, all on its own initiative, attacked South Korea, and the United Nations decided to help stop North Korea from invading the South.

Must not be too well read...

The old cliche "absolute power corrupts absolutely" explains why.

Ironically, the original underpinning of Juche was chajusong or "independence". The people were supposed to have complete freedom in thought and politics...but that was swept away in favor of "molding" people to constructing socialism through loyalty to the party.


Well. I mean, I think that it's silly.

Me personally, I would use my power to benefit the people.

They can have the freedom of trade (Free Trade, Also known as Capitalism).

But I would make the laws that would seem moral.

Such as the intensity of the crime determines the sentence.

So, if someone bombed NYC. They would more than likely be killed on the spot.

Now, they can have lower-leveled elections like for Governor of a State...or mayor of a city, but There would be One Grand Leader.

The US should simply assinate Kim Jong Il, and his advisors/staff, so no one like him can take his place, and there is a rift between Kim and the military anyways, however, The US has never been good at assinating people, However the Mafia has, I believe the US should hire the mob to take out Kim and his friends. :fluffle:

No. If we did that, then the United States would get flamed even further.

The US should simply assinate Kim Jong Il, and his advisors/staff, so no one like him can take his place, and there is a rift between Kim and the military anyways, however, The US has never been good at assinating people, However the Mafia has, I believe the US should hire the mob to take out Kim and his friends. :fluffle:
I'll drink to that. The US once did employ the Mafia to protect us from Nazi spies on the water front. Let me give you a scenario:

Spy: Berlin, Berlin. Come in Berlin, transport has just left New York harbor at
5:00 PM EST. This is Hans on West 31st, come in Berlin.

(Mafia guy bursts into room)

Mobster: Mind explaining to me what's going on in here?

Spy: Uh....nothing

Mobster: Don't give me that BS. You're a spy, you got morse code lists, telegrams, a telegraph, a CB radio, the works.

Spy: What are you going to do about it?

(Mobsters knocks spy cold, puts spy's feet into a bucket, fills bucket with cement and throws the spy into the harbor)

Mobster: I heard fish like German cuisine.

[QUOTE=DesignatedMarksman]"What the F8ck was that?"

-Mayor of Hiroshima

QUOTE]

you got that email 2?

they don't have the balls to use them anyway because every dumbass and their grandma knows what happened last time someone tried to attack Hawaii.

No. If we did that, then the United States would get flamed even further.

I think we're on the right track. You know, Japan reports it to the UN. The US tries to go the multilateral route and get other nations involved in talking to North Korea (as I recall, we were soundly lambasted for not doing the multilateral thing with Iraq, so don't complain).

And when it all goes to crap, and the North Koreans attack, the US will be blameless.

Just like to point out to the idiot who said we should give back Hawaii, the HAWAIIANS WANTED TO BECOME A STATE, THEY APPROACHED US!!
I think C&T is referring to the Overthrow of the Hawaiian Monarchy... an event that happened way before Hawaii became a State.

I think C&T is referring to the Overthrow of the Hawaiian Monarchy... an event that happened way before Hawaii became a State.
True, but, as the rest of his reasoning is psychotic, it is highly unlikely his idea Hawaii should be returned the natives is psychotic as well.

I'll drink to that. The US once did employ the Mafia to protect us from Nazi spies on the water front. Let me give you a scenario:

Spy: Berlin, Berlin. Come in Berlin, transport has just left New York harbor at
5:00 PM EST. This is Hans on West 31st, come in Berlin.

(Mafia guy bursts into room)

Mobster: Mind explaining to me what's going on in here?

Spy: Uh....nothing

Mobster: Don't give me that BS. You're a spy, you got morse code lists, telegrams, a telegraph, a CB radio, the works.

Spy: What are you going to do about it?

(Mobsters knocks spy cold, puts spy's feet into a bucket, fills bucket with cement and throws the spy into the harbor)

Mobster: I heard fish like German cuisine.
I don't think they were employed by the US military.

after all, our mobsters are Gangsters... but they'er AMERICAN Gangsters.

True, but, as the rest of his reasoning is psychotic, it is highly unlikely his idea Hawaii should be returned the natives is psychotic as well.
he/she should meet our Trask Sisters here... damn those gals are psycho when it comes with their idea of solverncy... :rolleyes:

I think even C&T would admit not to give Hawaii back to Hawaiians after spending some time with them...

I don't think they were employed by the US military.

after all, our mobsters are Gangsters... but they'er AMERICAN Gangsters.
Damn straight, everyone wants to be an American, why would we get scorned in other countries for being one then? I'll tell you why. Because everyone else is jealous.

RE:1The difference is in the US the VAST majority is very well fed and those that aren't can get help as aposed to eating grass or dying.

Re:2 They don't want to invade Japan ...just destroy it and kill all the people in payback for WWII

Re3:Dude do some research especially on the invasion of Okinawa, then rethink your answer also realize the Japanese didn't surrender until after the 2nd bomb.

Re:4 We would not invade NK we would carpet bomb.


1. Not everyone in the US has food.
2. Axis of Evil? As an American, I hate that analogy. They want to reunify South Korea and the North, sure! But they have no thoughts of conquering Japan. Why would they?
3. You say we killed millions of people, and horribly diseased and mutilated millions more, to save a million lives by dropping an Atomic bomb on Hiroshima, then Nagasaki? That is insane. We could have used the bombs off their coast, and told them about the power we had, and peacefully ended the conflict. But no, we had to bomb them. Face it, they were of no threat to anyone at that point anyway.
4. If we invade North Korea, i'm going to be sad to us be defeated. At this time, the United States cannot win a war of that kind. Maybe the South Koreans, who, like our soldiers, are well trained, well disciplined, and well motivated, can put up a fight like they did in Vietnam (Watching ROK Marines fight is amazing). But the problem is that we are stretched too thin, and invading would just be a debacle. War is unlikely anyway.


Rant over.


I wouldn't worry about Kim Jung Il guys. He will not nuke anyone. He realizes if he does, that we will turn Pyong Yang into nuclear hell via Peacekeeper (ironic eh?) Missles should he try something.

all in all, nothing to fear from DPRK