NationStates Jolt Archive

Would this bother you if Muslims became the majority in Europe? Simple question really and why.

.. I really can't imagine that happening.

As I said before it would do you good.

It's a long-term inevitability given European birthrates, etc. I won't state my opinion, since I wouldn't have to live with it, although neither will Europeans, for another 50 years, give or take.

Bad mojo for everyone. Europe has nukes. Most of ME doesn't.

Only way we'd go to war with Europe again.

Would this bother you if Muslims became the majority in Europe? Simple question really and why.

Depends on whether the rate of secularization is greater than the rate of overpopulation (as compared to that of non-Muslims).

Would this bother you if Muslims became the majority in Europe? Simple question really and why.

Doesn't bother me much. No more than alarmist cries that Latinos will become the majority in the US.

Now, if you mean Islamic fundamentalist terrorists taking over Europe, that's a different story. But the two things are not the same, however much Islamophobes want us to believe they are.

Doesn't bother me much. No more than alarmist cries that Latinos will become the majority in the US.

Now, if you mean Islamic fundamentalist terrorists taking over Europe, that's a different story. But the two things are not the same, however much Islamophobes want us to believe they are.
Ah, I was about to say that. I second you.

I'm scared of the racism on this particular topic. Even if your objective, Islam has always been more advanced and more respectful of human rights than Europe, especially when it was more Christian. While, Europe is moving in the right direction, moving towards Islam and Muslims will help advance progress and make government provide more benefits to people.

Current Islam is not as good now compared to Europe as they used to be. As well, for example it is illegal to publicly worship if it is of a different religion. Also, to point Europe was the founder of the concept of the welfare state.

Current Islam is not as good now compared to Europe as they used to be. As well, for example it is illegal to publicly worship if it is of a different religion. Also, to point Europe was the founder of the concept of the welfare state.

Scandinvans, you are so right! Back when Europe was Christian, Islam was so advanced and tolerant towards wymin, something we could have learned from.

Would this bother you if Muslims became the majority in Europe? Simple question really and why.
Nope. I wouldn't bat an eye. I really don't care much what invisible man people pray to.

I'm scared of the racism on this particular topic. Even if your objective, Islam has always been more advanced and more respectful of human rights than Europe, especially when it was more Christian. While, Europe is moving in the right direction, moving towards Islam and Muslims will help advance progress and make government provide more benefits to people.
Lets outlaw homosexuality and worshipping other religions! while were at it lets burn witches at the stake and cut off thieves hands and oppress women back to their proper jobs!

I find it unlikely at best but an islamic world would not be a nice place to live.

Lets outlaw homosexuality and worshipping other religions! while were at it lets burn witches at the stake and cut off thieves hands and oppress women back to their proper jobs!

I find it unlikely at best but an islamic world would not be a nice place to live.

So you're resigned to the fact that European culture and western traditions along with christianity is weak enough to be obliterated by old radical muslim customs that even large segments of their own population chafes at?

Then good riddance. Nothing that weak deserves to survive.

So you're resigned to the fact that European culture and western traditions along with christianity is weak enough to be obliterated by old radical muslim customs that even large segments of their own population chafes at?

Then good riddance. Nothing that weak deserves to survive.

Obviously you didn't read my "unlikely at best" part.

Scandinvans, you are so right! Back when Europe was Christian, Islam was so advanced and tolerant towards wymin, something we could have learned from.To concur with you, Islam was did posses some good technologies, but still the Byzantine Empire was just as advanced if not more. Look at it really they were the successors of Rome and they preserved their technology, which to no offense was superior to that of the Islamic nations and they failed to copy all their technologies. Yet, I do admit that Catholic Europe was less advanced and less civilized then Europe, excluding Sicily, the Crusader kingdoms, and a number of northern Italian city states.

Nope. I wouldn't bat an eye. I really don't care much what invisible man people pray to.

What he/she said.

Radical Islamists, however...

Obviously you didn't read my "unlikely at best" part.

Oh, I did. But apparently you still fear exactly that despite all evidence to the contrary.

Oh, I did. But apparently you still fear exactly that despite all evidence to the contrary.
I'm saying i wouldn't want laws like the middle east have, how is that fearing it would actually happen.
First its not going to happen and secondly if things did start to look bad someone would end up doing something about it.

Lets outlaw homosexuality and worshipping other religions! while were at it lets burn witches at the stake and cut off thieves hands and oppress women back to their proper jobs!

I find it unlikely at best but an islamic world would not be a nice place to live.

Maslaland, you are a conservative, prtending to be liberal just to bash Islam. But no true progressive will bash Islam because Muslims vote Democrat because President Bush's illegal, unauthorized war. So, it's time to respect Islam and have some Islamic prayer in schools so school kids, like me, can learn more about Islam. But keep your Bible at home, thank you.

Maslaland, you are a conservative, prtending to be liberal just to bash Islam. But no true progressive will bash Islam because Muslims vote Democrat because President Bush's illegal, unauthorized war. So, it's time to respect Islam and have some Islamic prayer in schools so school kids, like me, can learn more about Islam. But keep your Bible at home, thank you.
I hate the bible more the koran! it supports genocide, stoning of gay people, slavery and even says mestruation is a sin. I hate all 3 of the abrahamic religions and if it were up to me they'd be outlawed. I don't like president bush myself, i'm english and i hate the conservative party more than tony blair, saying that i don't mind david cameron.

Look at the laws of the middle east and think would you want to live there?

Yes it would but it will never happen. and I wonder if any brits are voting "not european", even though britain is in europe.

Yes it would but it will never happen.
Simple version of what i think.

That would never happen and thats simply an impossibility. I dont care what any of you say about any statistics as europe wouldn't allow that to happen firstly. There is infact more of a possiblity of america and its allies destroying and conquering the rest of the world as together, they own the vast majority of the weapons and resources. Also, if they did take over europe, everyone would move to other places which would kind of screw up everything seeing as though they moved to europe because its run in a different way to the places they left. So yeah, it wouldn't be in their best interests to take it over, seeing as though they would be back in the situation they tried to get out of.

I'm saying i wouldn't want laws like the middle east have, how is that fearing it would actually happen.
First its not going to happen and secondly if things did start to look bad someone would end up doing something about it.

Then we're in agreement. Europe won't become a muslim country or series of muslim countries as Islam stands today.

What are we discussing?

But no true progressive will bash Islam because Muslims vote Democrat because President Bush's illegal, unauthorized war.To point theoretically since there was not a declaration of war and the U.S. Congress had allowed for the continued allotment of soldiers to Iraq it is not considered illegal even though the UN Security Council did not approve of force to be used. All of that thought of the only conclusion that could be stated that the War in Iraq is not justified.

Would this bother you if Muslims became the majority in Europe? Simple question really and why.
Yes and no. So called Christians are the majority at the moment. If so called Muslims become the majority it wouldn't bother me. I mean that Europe is quite secular right now and I prefer that it would stay that way. I hope that any religion won't take over Europe ever again.

Then we're in agreement. Europe won't become a muslim country or series of muslim countries as Islam stands today.

What are we discussing?
IF muslims took over europe whether we would mind, i said yes you said no.

IF muslims took over europe whether we would mind, i said yes you said no.

See, I thought we were discussing whether or not we would mind if muslims became the majority in Europe. Which is what the OP asked.

So the question I have to ask is; Why do you equate a majority with a takeover?

See, I thought we were discussing whether or not we would mind if muslims became the majority in Europe. Which is what the OP asked.

So the question I have to ask is why you equate a majority with a takeover?
Because with a majority they could vote people into positions of power that would actually be able to make a difference to laws. Seperation of church from state, based on whats in the middle east, would be eradicated.

Because with a majority they could vote people into positions of power that would actually be able to make a difference to laws. Seperation of church from state, based on whats in the middle east, would be eradicated.

But these muslims wouldn't be in the middle east. They'd be in Europe. They'd be Europeans. The only difference is that they'd pray to a different invisible man. Europeans grew out of religious tyranny long ago. Changing religions isn't going to change that.

But these muslims wouldn't be in the middle east. They'd be in Europe. They'd be Europeans. The only difference is that they'd pray to a different invisible man. Europeans grew out of religious tyranny long ago. Changing religions isn't going to change that.
Most of europe is athiest now, if people that vote are activly muslim they will want to vote for other faithful people. I don't want to see a europe ruled with laws from a fictional book like it was for so long.

Okay, here is the deal:

There is a proportion of the population in Europe that either immigrated or are children of immigrants. Ethnically, they're not your traditional European.

Of these, there is a proportion that comes from Muslim countries or societies.

Of these, there is a proportion that is actually Muslim, in other words actually cares about the religion. Coming from an urban area with lots of immigrants (HH-Jenfeld (http://a.relaunch.focus.de/img/gen/C/V/HBCVAmGaiyN_Pxgen_r_400xA.jpg), if you care), I can tell you that that proportion is not actually that high.

Of these Muslims, there is a small proportion who are extremists or ultra-conservative.

And of these there is a small proportion which is likely to actually make trouble.

Since the only answer various posters here seem to have is to either deport or completely restrict all immigration, their arguments are not to be taken seriously.

And personally, I don't give a shit what the denomination of religious people is. They're all crackpots as far as I'm concerned, and I went to a church kindergarten.

Also, this is a good site. I think both sides of the argument can take something out of it.
http://www.ejc.nl/hp/rem/contents.html

Most of europe is athiest now, if people that vote are activly muslim they will want to vote for other faithful people. I don't want to see a europe ruled with laws from a fictional book like it was for so long.
But most are still namely Christians. Why you assume that all Muslims are religious? I'm pretty sure there are quite secular Muslims too. (hey, I'm not pretty sure, I know there are. I know few.)

Most of europe is athiest now, if people that vote are activly muslim they will want to vote for other faithful people. I don't want to see a europe ruled with laws from a fictional book like it was for so long.

But you won't. I thought we already agreed on that.

But you won't. I thought we already agreed on that.
Talking hpothetically. IF there was a majority, which there won't be.

But most are still namely Christians. Why you assume that all Muslims are religious? I'm pretty sure there are quite secular Muslims too. (hey, I'm not pretty sure, I know there are. I know few.)
Secular Muslim is an oxymoron, I'd have no problem if they weren't religious.

Secular Muslim is an oxymoron, I'd have no problem if they weren't religious.
WTF? There are secular Muslims just like there are secular Christians.

http://www.secularislam.org/

WTF? There are secular Muslims just like there are secular Christians.

http://www.secularislam.org/
Got my meaning of secular wrong, i'd have no problem if they didn't follow the religion word for word.

Talking hpothetically. IF there was a majority, which there won't be.

You're probably right. Atheism will probably always be the majority in Europe.

Sorry, this is only in German. Ignore if you don't speak the language.

It's a big set of statistics regarding Turkish people in Germany. It was compiled by the Turkish embassy, but uses data from a study done by the Federal Government.
http://www.tcberlinbe.de/de/archiv/2002/ALKitap2002.pdf

Particular the thing about their children's education is interesting. And the most dangerous immigrants (crimewise) are from former Yugoslavia.

EDIT: Also neat, but also in German.
http://www.spiegel.de/kultur/gesellschaft/0,1518,423043,00.html - Germany in 2020

You're probably right. Atheism will probably always be the majority in Europe.
That's not really true either. If asked, most Europeans will answer they believe in some sort of religion.
Atheism is more acceptable in social circles than in the US, and people won't publicise their religion as much, but privately most people probably believe in some sort of god.

That's not really true either. If asked, most Europeans will answer they believe in some sort of religion.
Atheism is more acceptable in social circles than in the US, and people won't publicise their religion as much, but privately most people probably believe in some sort of god.
They believe in something just generally not a big religion, i'd say agnostics and athiests combined make up the majority of europe.

I wouldn't mind at all. It's only a religion, after all, and most Muslims are extremely good people.

They believe in something just generally not a big religion, i'd say agnostics and athiests combined make up the majority of europe.
Not according to the stats though. Religion doesn't play a public role, but it does play a big private one.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_the_European_Union#Religion

That may become less though. The church has been unable to cope with the changes in European society, and the sort of things that seem popular in the US certainly don't pull in Europe. Weird also that some people in the US seem quick to conclude that the decline of European christianity is causing the declining birth rates. Silly Yanks.

Among young people, you might be right then, but overall the majority of Europeans are of some version of Christian faith. I mean, just look at what happens whenever Pope Benedict looks out the window.

http://www.time.com/time/europe/html/030616/story.html
http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2005-08-10-europe-religion-cover_x.htm
http://www.csmonitor.com/2005/0222/p01s04-woeu.html
http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment/story/0,,1464532,00.html

I only know the situation in detail in my country (England) so yes religion may well be very important personally in the rest of europe. However i feel that any stats provided on the issue are a bit clouded, i am an athiest yet i still say i'm christian on the census (i know i shouldn't...).

As far as I am concerned, they can take over Hell and rot there.

I don't consider them my friends ( with individual exceptions ) and I have no intention of pretending otherwise.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/5118244.stm
In other Turkish areas it is no different. There were reports of celebratory gunshots over Berlin's Turkish neighbourhood of Kreuzberg after Germany's victory over Ecuador.
http://www.schildersmilies.de/noschild/laughoutloud.gif

.. I really can't imagine that happening.

It's a long-term inevitability given European birthrates, etc. I won't state my opinion, since I wouldn't have to live with it, although neither will Europeans, for another 50 years, give or take.

If current trends continue. Trends arent likely to last that long. However we should always discuss future based on current trends, that's how trends stop.

As I said before it would do you good.

Get a clue :rolleyes: If you like them so much, take them to Japan...

So you're resigned to the fact that European culture and western traditions along with christianity is weak enough to be obliterated by old radical muslim customs that even large segments of their own population chafes at?

Then good riddance. Nothing that weak deserves to survive.

When defending european culture against islamic culture becomes a taboo because of political correctness, it weakens european culture...

When defending european culture against islamic culture becomes a taboo because of political correctness, it weakens european culture...


Who gives a toss what the PC crowd thinks?
Since they wont fight for anyone, no one can feel the need to fight for them.

And no one can be really ... concerned... about thte consequences of lobbing them off.
Since they wont fight anyway.

Yes and no. So called Christians are the majority at the moment. If so called Muslims become the majority it wouldn't bother me. I mean that Europe is quite secular right now and I prefer that it would stay that way. I hope that any religion won't take over Europe ever again.

It wouldnt bother you? Look at ANY majority muslim country today. :rolleyes:

But these muslims wouldn't be in the middle east. They'd be in Europe. They'd be Europeans. The only difference is that they'd pray to a different invisible man. Europeans grew out of religious tyranny long ago. Changing religions isn't going to change that.

Many 2nd and 3rd generation "europeans" are still very muslim. Get a clue. You arent european, are you?

It wouldnt bother you? Look at ANY majority muslim country today. :rolleyes:
Well you think that all Muslims are crazy radicals who will come and rape everyone, put a bag over women's head and bomb every tall building in every European city. I said, that it would not bother me, as long as all of them are not Islamists. For your knowledge, most of them aren't.

I live in an area where there are thousands of Muslims. Only very few of them wear headscarves. They are just like everyone else except their haircolour is a bit darker.

Even if the majority of Europeans would be Muslims, Europe would not be like Afghanistan or Saudi Arabia.

Okay, here is the deal:

There is a proportion of the population in Europe that either immigrated or are children of immigrants. Ethnically, they're not your traditional European.

Of these, there is a proportion that comes from Muslim countries or societies.

Of these, there is a proportion that is actually Muslim, in other words actually cares about the religion. Coming from an urban area with lots of immigrants (HH-Jenfeld (http://a.relaunch.focus.de/img/gen/C/V/HBCVAmGaiyN_Pxgen_r_400xA.jpg), if you care), I can tell you that that proportion is not actually that high.

Of these Muslims, there is a small proportion who are extremists or ultra-conservative.

And of these there is a small proportion which is likely to actually make trouble.

Since the only answer various posters here seem to have is to either deport or completely restrict all immigration, their arguments are not to be taken seriously.

And personally, I don't give a shit what the denomination of religious people is. They're all crackpots as far as I'm concerned, and I went to a church kindergarten.

Also, this is a good site. I think both sides of the argument can take something out of it.
http://www.ejc.nl/hp/rem/contents.html


And how do you know if extremest are in small proportion? People are rarely what they seem:



Suicide bombers' 'ordinary' lives
Three of the four men behind the UK's first suicide bombings on 7 July last year were British and the other a Jamaican-born British resident. Below are profiles of the young men who went on to kill 52 people and injure hundreds.

MOHAMMAD SIDIQUE KHAN, 30, FROM DEWSBURY

Mohammad Sidique Khan had lived in the Beeston area of Leeds, then moved to Lees Holm in Dewsbury.

He was married to Hasina, and the couple had one young daughter.

The 30-year-old had been a teaching assistant at Hillside Primary School in Leeds since 2002.

Parents at the school told the BBC the teaching assistant had been highly regarded by children and parents.

"He was a good man, quiet," said one.

Khan was suspected ringleader

During its last Ofsted inspection in 2002, the school's learning assistants had been singled out for special praise in dealing with a transient pupil population from a socially deprived area.

Khan told the Times Educational Supplement at the time that "a lot of [the pupils] have said this is the best school they have been to".

Last November a BBC Radio 4 documentary found Khan spent most of his life as a westernised youth calling himself by the nickname "Sid" and did not talk about religion.

As a teenager, he shook off his Pakistani-Muslim identity, claim friends, and chose to present himself as an exclusively westernised young man going by the nickname "Sid".

A friend from school days, Rob Cardiss, said: "He used to hang around with white lads playing football.

"Some of the other Pakistani guys used to talk about Muslim suffering around the world but with Sidique you'd never really know what religion he was from."

BBC reporter Nasreen Suleaman talked to Khan's former friends, who said he later became radicalised when he joined a tight-knit group of young Muslim men from Dewsbury, Leeds and Huddersfield.

Khan was known to the MI5 but officers assigned to investigate him were diverted to another operation.

BBC News learned the security services had been so concerned about him they had planned to put him under a higher level of investigation. He was also known to the police for suspected petty fraud.

In November 2004, the teaching assistant travelled to the Pakistani city of Karachi along with fellow bomber Shehzad Tanweer.

It is not clear what the men did during the three months they spent there, but Pakistani records show the pair left on the same flight in early February.

On 7 July Mohammad Sidique Khan detonated enough explosives on a Circle Line train to kill seven people.

Documents belonging to him were found near the Edgware Road blast.

His family suggested in a statement that he had been "brainwashed".

In September 2005, a video featuring Khan was shown on the Arab TV network al-Jazeera, in which he was shown criticising British foreign policy and saying he was a soldier fighting a war.

But friends of Khan believed the message had been recorded some weeks or months before the bombings.

Experts in counter-terrorism told the BBC at the time of its release that the video did not prove the attacks were directly ordered by the al-Qaeda leadership.

HASIB MIR HUSSAIN, 18, FROM LEEDS

Teenager Hasib Hussain had been known as a tearaway during his early teens.

In the aftermath of the London bombings, newspapers reported how he would start fights with fellow pupils at the Matthew Murray Secondary school in Leeds.

He left school in July 2003 with seven GCSEs.

Around this time, he was sent to Pakistan to visit relatives. He also went on the Hajj pilgrimage to Mecca, grew a beard and began to wear robes.

Despite becoming devoutly religious, he was arrested for shoplifting during 2004.

Neighbours said the 18-year-old had lived all his life in Colonso Mount, in the Holbeck area of Leeds. One neighbour described the family as "very nice people".

Hussain 'lived ordinary life'

He said: "We all knew them but I wouldn't say I knew them well. They were just a very nice family."

Hasib Hussain had told his family he was going on a trip to London to visit friends.

But when he failed to return on Thursday, his parents reported him as missing to police.

He had in fact boarded the No 30 bus in London armed with enough explosives to rip the double-decker apart, killing 13 people.

His driving licence and cash cards were found in the mangled wreckage of the bus.

His family later said they were "devastated" by what had happened.

In a statement they described Hussain as "a loving and normal young man who gave us no concern".

"We are having difficulty taking this in," they said.

"Our thoughts are with all the bereaved families and we have to live ourselves with the loss of our son in these difficult circumstances.

"We had no knowledge of his activities and, had we done we would have done everything in our power to stop him. "


http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4678837.stm
(more nice people on this link)

Well you think that all Muslims are crazy radicals who will come and rape everyone, put a bag over women's head and bomb every tall building in every European city. I said, that it would not bother me, as long as all of them are not Islamists. For your knowledge, most of them aren't.

I live in an area where there are thousands of Muslims. Only very few of them wear headscarves. They are just like everyone else except their haircolour is a bit darker.

Even if the majority of Europeans would be Muslims, Europe would not be like Afghanistan or Saudi Arabia.

I dont think that (bolded area) I just think that there is a big chance europe may turn out to be like a majority muslim country, from Turkey(more likely) to Saudi Arabia(less likely)
You dont know that (2nd bolded area). Most muslims tend to be religious...

I dont think that (bolded area) I just think that there is a big chance europe may turn out to be like a majority muslim country, from Turkey(more likely) to Saudi Arabia(less likely)
You dont know that (2nd bolded area). Most muslims tend to be religious...
Religious Muslim and Islamist is not the same thing, you know.

I wouldn't mind at all. It's only a religion, after all, and most Muslims are extremely good people.

Like these people?


SHEHZAD TANWEER, 22, FROM LEEDS

Shehzad Tanweer, 22, was born in Bradford but lived most of his life in the Beeston area of Leeds - little over half a mile from his friend, Hasib Hussain.

He was a sports science graduate whose interests included cricket and ju-jitsu.

In 2004, he was arrested for disorderly conduct and cautioned.

In November the same year he travelled to the Pakistani city of Karachi along with Mohammad Sidique Khan.

Graduate spent time in Pakistan

Reports that he visited the eastern cities of Lahore and Faisalabad have not been confirmed, but his family has said he attended an Islamic school, or madrassa, during this visit.

Pakistani officials say he was also briefly in the country on at least one other occasion, possibly at the end of 2003.

Newspapers quoted friends who said Tanweer was quiet and very religious but did not express an interest in politics.
Tanweer's uncle, Bashir Ahmed, 65, said the family was "shattered" by the revelation that he appeared to have been involved in the bombings.

"He was proud to be British," he said. "He had everything to live for. His parents were loving and supportive.

"He was a very kind and calm person. He was respected by everyone."

Neighbours described the graduate, who studied at Leeds Metropolitan University, as a "good Muslim". Others said he was a "nice lad" who could "get on with anyone".

Yet Shehzad Tanweer detonated a bomb on a Circle Line train between Aldgate and Liverpool Street stations which killed seven people, including himself, and injured over 100 more.

The remains of Tanweer were buried near his ancestral town of Samundari in Punjab province, Pakistan, in October 2005.

GERMAINE LINDSAY, 19, FROM AYLESBURY, BUCKINGHAMSHIRE

The fourth suicide bomber was identified as Jamaican-born British resident Germaine Lindsay, who lived in Aylesbury.

Lindsay spent his teenage years in Huddersfield, West Yorkshire, like his fellow bombers.

He moved there in 1999 with his mother and sister, and moved away in 2003.

During this time he changed his name to Jamal Lindsay and began attending after-school classes to improve his knowledge of Islam.

Lindsay was 'the outsider'

Lindsay was married to Samantha Lewthwaite, with whom he had a young boy.

Since his death, Ms Lewthwaite has given birth to a daughter by Lindsay.

In a statement made just after Lindsay's death, Ms Lewthwaite said she "never predicted or imagined that he was involved in such horrific activities".

"He was a loving husband and father," she said.

"My whole world has fallen apart and my thoughts are with the families of the victims of this incomprehensible devastation."

In a subsequent interview with the Sun newspaper, in September 2005, she condemned his "abhorrent" Tube attack.

She said she wanted to remember the man she loved, but added: "The day will come when I'll have to tell [our children] what he did."

Trips to radical mosques had "poisoned" the "innocent, naive and simple" 19-year-old's mind, Ms Lewthwaite said.

A statement issued by his relatives Andrew, 49, Sabrina, 28, Allan, 25, and Carly, 21 said Lindsay "had a kind, caring and calming presence about him".

"He was a good and loving husband and a brilliant father, who showed absolutely no sign of doing this atrocious crime.

"We as a family had no idea of his plans and are as horrified as the rest of the world."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4678837.stm

Stop with the idiotic anectodal "evidences". They mean nothing. Even his parents didnt know him. How could you know all those muslims are extremely good?
Look at the bigger picture, data and statistics. Look how women is treated in ALL muslim countries, etc....

And how do you know if extremest are in small proportion?
In other words, you try to prove me, saying that there are a small proportion of extremists, wrong by talking about a small group of extremists? How does that prove anything?
As far as I'm concerned, if they have no intention of ever visiting Mecca, and they don't pray five times a day, they're not extremists.
And besides, if they are extremists, and they do plan to do something about it (which is another small proportion of those extremists who'd like to see change but never make steps toward that goal), that's when the police steps in. A few kids who played violent computer games went on rampages. Perhaps them playing those games even played a part in them doing it, just like Islam plays a part in the internal justification of the Islamist terrorist (politics comes first though). Is your solution to crack down on computer games?

Religion didn't seem that important to the people where I lived. Many of the women wore headscarves, which is more of a cultural thing. But pretty much none of them prayed five times a day, and the local Mosque had to run campaigns all the time to get people to attend services, just like the local church. The sort of immigrants I met were very different from the type you seem to imagine.

Azad (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4s1ZgIv91jY&search=azad) is an example. You might want to watch it - he's of Kurdish origin, but you tell me whether he's much of a Muslim. Any religious influence is completely drowned out by the reality of urban life.

Oboyoboy, when people can't make their point properly, they always tend to throw with long useless quotes of facts etc. From where comes this overly present irrational fear of all things called "muslim" etc? I'll bring in a "new" element: the media choose where you focus on. I myself fear anything dogmatic, and that stuff is present everywhere.
Thus, I won't fear a muslim invasion, I only fear the bringing down of liberties and social commitment towards any other. As a European, I see it happen not only in the frightening areas of fundamentalist networks, but also in any other society, depending on from which angle you look.

Well shit, I was expecting this to be posted by Ny Nordland. I'm sure it would've been his tenth or something, y'know, we could celebrate it. Maybe next time.

Yeah, I'm really worried that 700 MILLION muslims are going to secretly sneak into Europe over the next 50 or so years and no-one is going to notice, and every single one of them is going to be an islamist.

If the cowardly right weren't so stupid, it might be difficult to shoot down their racist scare mongering. Fortunately they only have 1 brain cell to rub together. "Muslims taking over Europe" :rolleyes: That's about as likely as morons taking over America. No... wait!

Yeah, I'm really worried that 700 MILLION muslims are going to secretly sneak into Europe over the next 50 or so years and no-one is going to notice, and every single one of them is going to be an islamist.

If the cowardly right weren't so stupid, it might be difficult to shoot down their racist scare mongering. Fortunately they only have 1 brain cell to rub together. "Muslims taking over Europe" :rolleyes: That's about as likely as morons taking over America. No... wait!
You know the thread is about whether you would mind, not if its going to happen.

Yeah, I'm really worried that 700 MILLION muslims are going to secretly sneak into Europe over the next 50 or so years and no-one is going to notice, and every single one of them is going to be an islamist.

If the cowardly right weren't so stupid, it might be difficult to shoot down their racist scare mongering. Fortunately they only have 1 brain cell to rub together. "Muslims taking over Europe" :rolleyes: That's about as likely as morons taking over America. No... wait!
So just because the ruler of America is a moron, it means the people that voted for him are? Ha! Thank me for a lot of niggers not being able to vote in the last elections. I say send all the muslims and niggers back to their own countries. Then we just need to construct good excuses to bomb them. We need to control the global population. We need to control these bastards who hate everyone that doesn't aggree with their views.

So just because the ruler of America is a moron, it means the people that voted for him are? Ha! Thank me for a lot of niggers not being able to vote in the last elections. I say send all the muslims and niggers back to their own countries. Then we just need to construct good excuses to bomb them. We need to control the global population. We need to control these bastards who hate everyone that doesn't aggree with their views.
Indeed. :rolleyes:

So just because the ruler of America is a moron, it means the people that voted for him are? Ha! Thank me for a lot of niggers not being able to vote in the last elections. I say send all the muslims and niggers back to their own countries. Then we just need to construct good excuses to bomb them. We need to control the global population. We need to control these bastards who hate everyone that doesn't aggree with their views.
You are a little over the top.....why don't you take your hate to a different location, or better yet, go back to where you came from.

Well shit, I was expecting this to be posted by Ny Nordland. I'm sure it would've been his tenth or something, y'know, we could celebrate it. Maybe next time.

Nope, he's already passed that barrier. I counted 14 "ZOMG MUSLIMS/IMMIGRANTS T3H EBILS" by ol' Ny. :D

You are a little over the top.....why don't you take your hate to a different location, or better yet, go back to where you came from.
I come from HELL and in HELL I am...

Current Islam is not as good now compared to Europe as they used to be. As well, for example it is illegal to publicly worship if it is of a different religion. Also, to point Europe was the founder of the concept of the welfare state.

Actually, the founding basics of the Welfare State were developed in the Ottoman Empire.

I come from HELL and in HELL I am...
Well stick to your kingdom....I am sure you will feel much more comfortable there?

People are rarely what they seem.
Exactly! Listen to this wise man. Unfortunately, the greatest super-power is ruled by a pathetic little thing who professes love for peace and freedom. Everybody knows he is as clear as water can be... He is a shame to mankind...

Well stick to your kingdom....I am sure you will feel much more comfortable there?
My kingdom is EVERYWHERE my word reaches. It is here. It is now.

My kingdom is EVERYWHERE my word reaches. It is here. It is now.
Well it might not be here much longer if you keep posting your hateful crap. :p

I wouldn't mind if the majority of Europe becomes Muslim even if Europe became a collection radical Muslim nations its democracy in action if that’s what the majority of the people want then that’s what the majority shall get

Do you mean if Islam were to become to dominant religion in Europe which is very unlikly given Europe's historically Christian and contemporary secular attitudes.

or People of Muslim decent becoming the largest ethnic group in Europe which is even more unlikely,

Chances are that as social attitudes change there will be a great deal more inter racial marriage in Europe and Islam will become increasingly moderate and mainstream, like the Church of England for example which is less about God than cake sales these days.

Well it might not be here much longer if you keep posting your hateful crap. :p
If such was true, why is it not already gone? HA-HA-HA.

WTF? There are secular Muslims just like there are secular Christians.

http://www.secularislam.org/

I find it ironic that an organisation which calls for the secularisation of the Middle East has the name of a pagan Semitic God as their acronym.

I find it ironic that an organisation which calls for the secularisation of the Middle East has the name of a pagan Semitic God as their acronym.
First secularisation, then, back to paganism.

*Helioterra bows to Godness of Magic*
(I'm getting ready for it)


in other words, I agree.

I find it ironic that an organisation which calls for the secularisation of the Middle East has the name of a pagan Semitic God as their acronym.
Conspiracy theories! It is a coincidence, nothing more, nothing more... But I shall investigate and if it proves to be true, I shall burn them all.

If such was true, why is it not already gone? HA-HA-HA.
Well, I have never lodged a complaint in Moderation about a poster before, but your posts sure do tempt me. :D

Well, I have never lodged a complaint in Moderation about a poster before, but your posts sure do tempt me. :D
For exposing reality instead of throwing my deceit? Do me that favour please! HA-HA-HA.

For exposing reality instead of throwing my deceit? Do me that favour please! HA-HA-HA.

Pretending to be Satan on an intarweb forum is stupid and lame.

*cough cough* if muslims could get some of their landback. :) there would be no need to move to europe.

Pretending to be Satan on an intarweb forum is stupid and lame.
Yes-yessss... Much more clever to be a wolf dressed in sheep's skin. Am I not the big pretender?

So just because the ruler of America is a moron, it means the people that voted for him are? Ha! Thank me for a lot of niggers not being able to vote in the last elections. I say send all the muslims and niggers back to their own countries. Then we just need to construct good excuses to bomb them. We need to control the global population. We need to control these bastards who hate everyone that doesn't aggree with their views.

Yeah! Kill dem Sand-Niggers! White Power!

Would this bother you if Muslims became the majority in Europe? Simple question really and why.
It bothers me when superstition dominates anywhere, whether it be Muslim superstition or Christian superstition or a belief in magical fairies.

Would this bother you if Muslims became the majority in Europe? Simple question really and why.
That's what muslims do.

Any European who isn't bothered by this eventuality is living in a fool's paradise.

It bothers me when superstition dominates anywhere, whether it be Muslim superstition or Christian superstition or a belief in magical fairies.
EXACTLY! Hence why I say burn the tibetean monks as well... Bloody superstitious peaceniks...

If they become the majority, what with it? Islam would become the national religion of nations with the highest concentration of Muslims, making them democratic Islamic nations.

Where do you see a problem? It's a religion like any other.

Wait, that is a problem...

That's what muslims do.
O.o

...riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight. The International Muslim Conspiracy, I almost forgot.
FNORD

No more afraid than of Christians taking over Europe.

That's what muslims do.

Any European who isn't bothered by this eventuality is living in a fool's paradise.
Everyone is living in a fool's paradise... I've been working for centuries on this. So easy, I tell you... Leaves me with plenty of spare time to torture a lot of souls.

Want to know how? First, make an excuse for peace-loving people to support killing them for centuries in their own countries. Good thing I have eternal life. Then, support the oppressors in their own countries. When they turn to angry and vengeful little things, they shall infiltrate the peace-loving lands and give their ancient masters a bit of their own medicine...

So easy... So easy...

Well shit, I was expecting this to be posted by Ny Nordland. I'm sure it would've been his tenth or something, y'know, we could celebrate it. Maybe next time.

Hmm...I had made a thread about Turkey, muslim rapes in Denmark, the latest EU muslim thread, progressive attitudes of muslims, what else? You can celebrate the 5th one. Drinks on you.

Yeah, I'm really worried that 700 MILLION muslims are going to secretly sneak into Europe over the next 50 or so years and no-one is going to notice, and every single one of them is going to be an islamist.

If the cowardly right weren't so stupid, it might be difficult to shoot down their racist scare mongering. Fortunately they only have 1 brain cell to rub together. "Muslims taking over Europe" :rolleyes: That's about as likely as morons taking over America. No... wait!

There might be 125 million of them in EU out of, like, 510 million by 2025. They breed fast...

I wouldn't mind if the majority of Europe becomes Muslim even if Europe became a collection radical Muslim nations its democracy in action if that’s what the majority of the people want then that’s what the majority shall get

Majority of Dutch dont want any more muslim immigrants. Who listens them?

O.o

...riiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiight. The International Muslim Conspiracy, I almost forgot.
FNORD


Meowwwwwwwwwwww. It was less irrevelant than yours, wasnt it?

That's what muslims do.

Any European who isn't bothered by this eventuality is living in a fool's paradise.

Because, obviously, geographic heritance and religious persuasion are two exclusive concepts.