NationStates Jolt Archive


How to cool an entire planet ... maybe!

Eutrusca
27-06-2006, 17:28
COMMENTARY: Few people with more than two brain cells to rub together would dispute that global warming is going to be a very serious ... perhaps disastrous ... problem. Here are some rather radical, but possibly workable, solutions from the new science of geoengineering. Can you say, "Holy shades of terraforming, Batman!" boys and girls? Do YOU have any suggestions about how to stop or at least control global warming?


How to Cool a Planet (Maybe) (http://www.nytimes.com/2006/06/27/science/earth/27cool.html?th&emc=th)


By WILLIAM J. BROAD
Published: June 27, 2006
In the past few decades, a handful of scientists have come up with big, futuristic ways to fight global warming: Build sunshades in orbit to cool the planet. Tinker with clouds to make them reflect more sunlight back into space. Trick oceans into soaking up more heat-trapping greenhouse gases.

Their proposals were relegated to the fringes of climate science. Few journals would publish them. Few government agencies would pay for feasibility studies. Environmentalists and mainstream scientists said the focus should be on reducing greenhouse gases and preventing global warming in the first place.

But now, in a major reversal, some of the world's most prominent scientists say the proposals deserve a serious look because of growing concerns about global warming.

Worried about a potential planetary crisis, these leaders are calling on governments and scientific groups to study exotic ways to reduce global warming, seeing them as possible fallback positions if the planet eventually needs a dose of emergency cooling.

"We should treat these ideas like any other research and get into the mind-set of taking them seriously," said Ralph J. Cicerone, president of the National Academy of Sciences in Washington.

The plans and proposed studies are part of a controversial field known as geoengineering, which means rearranging the earth's environment on a large scale to suit human needs and promote habitability. Dr. Cicerone, an atmospheric chemist, will detail his arguments in favor of geoengineering studies in the August issue of the journal Climatic Change.

Practicing what he preaches, Dr. Cicerone is also encouraging leading scientists to join the geoengineering fray. In April, at his invitation, Roger P. Angel, a noted astronomer at the University of Arizona, spoke at the academy's annual meeting. Dr. Angel outlined a plan to put into orbit small lenses that would bend sunlight away from earth — trillions of lenses, he now calculates, each about two feet wide, extraordinarily thin and weighing little more than a butterfly.

In addition, Dr. Cicerone recently joined a bitter dispute over whether a Nobel laureate's geoengineering ideas should be aired, and he helped get them accepted for publication. The laureate, Paul J. Crutzen of the Max Planck Institute for Chemistry in Germany, is a star of atmospheric science who won his Nobel in 1995 for showing how industrial gases damage the earth's ozone shield. His paper newly examines the risks and benefits of trying to cool the planet by injecting sulfur into the stratosphere.

The paper "should not be taken as a license to go out and pollute," Dr. Cicerone said in an interview, emphasizing that most scientists thought curbing greenhouse gases should be the top priority. But he added, "In my opinion, he's written a brilliant paper."

Geoengineering is no magic bullet, Dr. Cicerone said. But done correctly, he added, it will act like an insurance policy if the world one day faces a crisis of overheating, with repercussions like melting icecaps, droughts, famines, rising sea levels and coastal flooding.

"A lot of us have been saying we don't like the idea" of geoengineering, he said. But he added, "We need to think about it" and learn, among other things, how to distinguish sound proposals from ones that are ineffectual or dangerous.

Many scientists still deride geoengineering as an irresponsible dream with more risks and potential bad side effects than benefits; they call its extreme remedies a good reason to redouble efforts at reducing heat-trapping gases like carbon dioxide. And skeptics of human-induced global warming dismiss geoengineering as a costly effort to battle a mirage.

Even so, many analysts say the prominence of its new advocates is giving the field greater visibility and credibility and adding to the likelihood that global leaders may one day consider taking such emergency steps.

"People used to say, 'Shut up, the world isn't ready for this,' " said Wallace S. Broecker, a geoengineering pioneer at Columbia. "Maybe the world has changed."

Michael C. MacCracken, chief scientist of the Climate Institute, a private research group in Washington, said he was resigned to the need to take geoengineering seriously.

"It's really too bad," Dr. MacCracken said, "that the United States and the world cannot do much more so that it's not necessary to consider getting addicted to one of these approaches."

Martin A. Apple, president of the Council of Scientific Society Presidents, said of geoengineering at a recent meeting in Washington, "Let's talk about research funding with enough zeroes on it so we can make a dent."

The study of futuristic countermeasures began quietly in the 1960's, as scientists theorized that global warming caused by human-generated emissions might one day pose a serious threat. But little happened until the 1980's, when global temperatures started to rise.

Some scientists noted that the earth reflected about 30 percent of incoming sunlight back into space and absorbed the rest. Slight increases of reflectivity, they reasoned, could easily counteract heat-trapping gases, thereby cooling the planet.

Dr. Broecker of Columbia proposed doing so by lacing the stratosphere with tons of sulfur dioxide, as erupting volcanoes occasionally do. The injections, he calculated in the 80's, would require a fleet of hundreds of jumbo jets and, as a byproduct, would increase acid rain.

By 1997, such futuristic visions found a prominent advocate in Edward Teller, a main inventor of the hydrogen bomb. "Injecting sunlight-scattering particles into the stratosphere appears to be a promising approach," Dr. Teller wrote in The Wall Street Journal. "Why not do that?"

But government agencies usually balked at paying researchers to study such far-out ideas, and even ones that were more down to earth. John Latham, an atmospheric physicist at the National Center for Atmospheric Research in Colorado, told how he and his colleagues had unsuccessfully sought for many years to test whether spraying saltwater mists into low ocean clouds might increase their reflectivity.

"We haven't found a way in," Dr. Latham said of government financing. "It's been a bit dispiriting."

Other plans called for reflective films to be laid over deserts or white plastic islands to be floated on the world's oceans, both as ways to reflect more sunlight into space.

Another idea was to fertilize the sea with iron, creating vast blooms of plants that would gulp down tons of carbon dioxide and, as the plants died, drag the carbon into the abyss.

The general reaction to such ideas, said Alvia Gaskill, president of Environmental Reference Materials Inc., a consulting firm in North Carolina that advocates geoengineering, "has been dismissive and sometimes frightened — afraid that we don't know what the consequences will be of making large-scale changes to the environment."

Dr. Gaskill said small experiments would let researchers quickly pull the plug if such tinkering started to go awry.

Critics of geoengineering argued that it made more sense to avoid global warming than to gamble on risky fixes. They called for reducing energy use, developing alternative sources of power and curbing greenhouse gases.

But international efforts like the Kyoto Protocol — which the United States never ratified, and which China and India as members of the developing world never had to obey, freeing the current and projected leaders in greenhouse gas emissions from its restrictions — have so far failed to diminish the threat. Scientists estimate that the earth's surface temperature this century may rise as much as 10 degrees Fahrenheit.

Geoengineering's advocates say humankind is already vastly altering the global environment and simply needs to do so more intelligently.

Dr. Angel, the University of Arizona astronomer, told members of the science academy of his idea for an orbital sunshade, calling the proposal less important than the goal of encouraging bold thought.

"This could engage a whole generation," he said in an interview. "All I'm saying is, let's start thinking about these kinds of things in case we need them one day." Such visionary plans are still far from winning universal acclaim. James E. Hansen of the NASA Goddard Institute for Space Studies in New York, who attended the talk and strongly advocates curbing emissions, belittled the orbital sunshade as "incredibly difficult and impractical."

Dr. Crutzen, the Nobel laureate from the Max Planck Institute, has also drawn fire for his paper about injecting sulfur into the stratosphere. "There was a passionate outcry by several prominent scientists claiming that it is irresponsible," recalled Mark G. Lawrence, an American scientist who is also at the institute.

The stratospheric plan called for fighting one kind of pollution (excess greenhouse gases like carbon dioxide) with another (sulfur dioxide), though it appeared that any increase in sulfur at the earth's surface would be small compared with the tons already being emitted from the smokestacks of coal-fueled plants.

Dr. Cicerone of the science academy helped broker a compromise: Dr. Crutzen's paper would be published, but with several commentaries, including his own. They will appear in the August issue of Climatic Change. The other authors are Dr. Lawrence of the German chemistry institute, Dr. MacCracken of the Climate Institute, Jeffrey T. Kiehl of the National Center for Atmospheric Research, and Lennart Bengtsson of the Max Planck Institute for Meteorology in Germany.

In a draft of his paper, Dr. Crutzen estimates the annual cost of his sulfur proposal at up to $50 billion, or about 5 percent of the world's annual military spending.

"Climatic engineering, such as presented here, is the only option available to rapidly reduce temperature rises" if international efforts fail to curb greenhouse gases, Dr. Crutzen wrote.

"So far," he added, "there is little reason to be optimistic."
Teh_pantless_hero
27-06-2006, 17:30
We could launch a giant mirror into space that would cast a shadow over the earth and deflect sunlight and thus cool earth down!
Luporum
27-06-2006, 17:33
We could launch a giant mirror into space that would cast a shadow over the earth and deflect sunlight and thus cool earth down!

"Woah that's bright." *incinerates*
Llewdor
27-06-2006, 17:37
We could launch a giant mirror into space that would cast a shadow over the earth and deflect sunlight and thus cool earth down!

I've been advocating that ever since the launch of SOHO (the Solar and Heliospheric Observatory), because it demonstrated that we can hang an object at L1.

Though you'd probably want a filter rather than a mirror. You want to leave the UV alone so as to avoid reducing the earth's biomass.
Lunatic Goofballs
27-06-2006, 17:47
Yeah, right. Environmental scientists can't even figure out how to save sand dunes, and we're going to let them mess with global climate?

Just let me know when so I can find a nice deep cave and stock it with a few decades' worth of supplies. :p
The Nazz
27-06-2006, 17:49
We could launch a giant mirror into space that would cast a shadow over the earth and deflect sunlight and thus cool earth down!
Didn't I see that on Futurama?
Demented Hamsters
27-06-2006, 17:53
Why don't we break open all the pipes from those old refridgerators?
The stuff inside could be released in the atmosphere and cool things down.

Or we could:
Leave all our the fridge doors open;
Throw ice cubes into the sea;
Leave the air-con on all the time.

Lots of good ideas there!
Kazus
27-06-2006, 17:53
Didn't I see that on Futurama?

No. That was the "dropping a giant ice cube into the ocean every so often" trick.
Luporum
27-06-2006, 17:55
No. That was the "dropping a giant ice cube into the ocean every so often" trick.

It was, Wurmstrum built a giant mirrior to reflect the sunlight but it ended up flipping over nearly cutting the world in half. Same episode.
Bluzblekistan
27-06-2006, 18:03
I heard that if we were to stimulate and increase the growth of diatoms and other certain phytoplankton with iron nutrients in liquid for, that should be enoguh to start cooling the earth. How, you ask? Well, Diatoms can suck in huge amounts of CO2. The absoarb the iron nutrients and it causes them to multiply, FAST. So more diatoms, more CO2 gets sucked up. I heard about 200 tons of that liquid iron nutrient can bring about the Ice Age if it was all dumped into the water!
What do you think?
Sumamba Buwhan
27-06-2006, 18:27
I do my part by turning the A/C on full blast and keep my doors open :p

How about we fill the sky with clouds (possibly with a few nukes) to keep us all shaded for a bit.
Llewdor
27-06-2006, 18:34
Yeah, right. Environmental scientists can't even figure out how to save sand dunes, and we're going to let them mess with global climate?

Just let me know when so I can find a nice deep cave and stock it with a few decades' worth of supplies. :p

All they'd be doing is blocking like 1% of the sun's rays.

It's the best plan I've heard.
Lunatic Goofballs
27-06-2006, 18:41
All they'd be doing is blocking like 1% of the sun's rays.

It's the best plan I've heard.

*starts stocking up on toilet paper*
Russo-Soviets
27-06-2006, 19:12
There are good ways, however there comes the problem of figuring out exactly how much you need to reflect. Too much, and the Earth freezes, too little, and it becomes uninhabitable.They should be researched, and the fact that they cut out that much money out of the worlds military budget can only be a good thing.
Yossarian Lives
27-06-2006, 19:28
It's a nice idea, but who gets to say whether we put any of these plans into action? Do we vote at the UN? What if one or more countries like the changes global warming brings? Do we listen to them or will a straight majority be enough to change the climate overnight? And if it is some sort of adjustable reflector who's in charge of adjusting it?
The Black Forrest
27-06-2006, 19:29
We could launch a giant mirror into space that would cast a shadow over the earth and deflect sunlight and thus cool earth down!

SIMPSONS DID IT!
Kyronea
27-06-2006, 19:41
I heard that if we were to stimulate and increase the growth of diatoms and other certain phytoplankton with iron nutrients in liquid for, that should be enoguh to start cooling the earth. How, you ask? Well, Diatoms can suck in huge amounts of CO2. The absoarb the iron nutrients and it causes them to multiply, FAST. So more diatoms, more CO2 gets sucked up. I heard about 200 tons of that liquid iron nutrient can bring about the Ice Age if it was all dumped into the water!
What do you think?
I think you're the only one to come up with a plausible idea. Well done.

The mirror idea, also seemingly plausible, can't work because we could not possibly construct it with our current technology.
Lunatic Goofballs
27-06-2006, 19:53
I think you're the only one to come up with a plausible idea. Well done.

The mirror idea, also seemingly plausible, can't work because we could not possibly construct it with our current technology.

Current technology? No. But with the Space Elevator concept in the realm of feasibilty now, I don't see it as a major stretch. Of course, I have more faith in rocket science than in environmental science.
Heikoku
27-06-2006, 20:24
How... Phantasy-Star-ish. o_o

What's next? Domed cities? Interplanetary terraforming? Space opera-style technology? :p

Well, speaking for real now - it's good that they're beginning to think this through, but it should NOT be a free pass for polluting.
Llewdor
27-06-2006, 22:01
I think you're the only one to come up with a plausible idea. Well done.

The mirror idea, also seemingly plausible, can't work because we could not possibly construct it with our current technology.

Sure we could. It would only have to be several thousand metres across, and we could launch it folded and assemble it in space. And it's remarkably simply to float something at L1.
New Lofeta
27-06-2006, 22:04
Here's how we make the planet cool again-

Bring back the Fonz.
Yootopia
27-06-2006, 22:04
I've been advocating that ever since the launch of SOHO (the Solar and Heliospheric Observatory), because it demonstrated that we can hang an object at L1.

Though you'd probably want a filter rather than a mirror. You want to leave the UV alone so as to avoid reducing the earth's biomass.
Launching Soho into orbit probably would be good. Other than Milton Keynes, it's one of the more unpleasant places in the UK in my humble opinion.
Lunatic Goofballs
27-06-2006, 23:04
Here's how we make the planet cool again-

Bring back the Fonz.

Now that, I endorse! :)
Warta Endor
27-06-2006, 23:07
SIMPSONS DID IT!

An evil guy in the Power Puff Girls series did it :D
Kerblagahstan
27-06-2006, 23:34
How about we wait a hundred years till the earth becomes uninhabitable, then move to another planet. Wreck that one? Move again! Hell, in 100 years, we might be able to move the planet further away from the sun!
Der Fuhrer Dyszel
27-06-2006, 23:39
Maybe we should just accept that we are going to live in intense pain for the rest of our lives.....


-- Donut (I believe), modified RVB quote.
Demented Hamsters
28-06-2006, 15:43
Store the CO2 underground.




Don't laugh. They're actually doing it!

Japan to store CO2 underground (http://english.people.com.cn/200606/20/eng20060620_275594.html)
Greyenivol Colony
28-06-2006, 15:59
I'm uneasy with the thought of giving anyone control of technology that could potentially control the World's climate. I have images of the President of the United States on the phone to his Chinese counterpart saying, "for every minute you do not re-evaluate the yuan we will raise the temperature of your country by one million degrees!"

Global Warming is happening, it's too late to stop it, but our technologies may be able to limit it.
Teh_pantless_hero
28-06-2006, 16:04
I'm uneasy with the thought of giving anyone control of technology that could potentially control the World's climate. I have images of the President of the United States on the phone to his Chinese counterpart saying, "for every minute you do not re-evaluate the yuan we will raise the temperature of your country by one million degrees!"

Global Warming is happening, it's too late to stop it, but our technologies may be able to limit it.
For every sprinkle I find, I shall kill you.
Formidability
28-06-2006, 22:40
How... Phantasy-Star-ish. o_o

What's next? Domed cities? Interplanetary terraforming? Space opera-style technology? :p

Well, speaking for real now - it's good that they're beginning to think this through, but it should NOT be a free pass for polluting.
Why not? Earth stays cool, we pollute, everyone wins.
Darknovae
28-06-2006, 23:03
Greenhouse gases are coming from exhaust from FOSSIL FUELS.

My suggestion: STOP USING FOSSIL FUELS. :headbang:
Mooseica
29-06-2006, 00:40
Why not? Earth stays cool, we pollute, everyone wins.

Except the French. They just go on eating excessive amounts of cheese.

Of course, that's no bad thing. They do wate all that money on clean power plants though.
Llewdor
29-06-2006, 00:42
Greenhouse gases are coming from exhaust from FOSSIL FUELS.

My suggestion: STOP USING FOSSIL FUELS. :headbang:

But that's not nearly as much fun.
Mooseica
29-06-2006, 00:48
But that's not nearly as much fun.

Quite. Just ask the French :D
Urikistan
29-06-2006, 01:27
Greenhouse gases are coming from exhaust from FOSSIL FUELS.

My suggestion: STOP USING FOSSIL FUELS. :headbang:

That would be slightly, just slightly mind you, the end of civilization as we know it.
Vetalia
29-06-2006, 01:35
We could launch a giant mirror into space that would cast a shadow over the earth and deflect sunlight and thus cool earth down!

Or, it could turn upside down and burn a path of destruction across the globe...
Vetalia
29-06-2006, 01:37
That would be slightly, just slightly mind you, the end of civilization as we know it.

No it wouldn't. Fossil fuels are becoming increasingly unnecessary, so in 20-30 years they'll likely be totally obsolete. Oil's replaceable as is natural gas, and coal can be filtered to almost emissions-free levels (especially if combined with a switchgrass farm).
Llewdor
29-06-2006, 19:36
No it wouldn't. Fossil fuels are becoming increasingly unnecessary, so in 20-30 years they'll likely be totally obsolete. Oil's replaceable as is natural gas, and coal can be filtered to almost emissions-free levels (especially if combined with a switchgrass farm).

Unnecessary != Useless

As long as there's some value in burning fossil fuels, there will be incentive to do it.

And I don't see that value going away anytime soon. It's a compact and easily transportable source of energy
Saladador
29-06-2006, 19:54
Contrary to opinions intoned by alarmists, climate change will not result in the destruction of the earth. There are some big possible impacts, but they are a long ways away, and before we jump into projects like the Kyoto protocol head-first, it might be a good idea if we stopped and asked ourselves whether the negative impact on our economies, which will also have a profound impact on future generations, is worth it. Some studies of the economic impact of climate change versus Kyoto have shown that we would be better off just letting it happen. A global carbon tax is considered a better possibility (and might be better embraced, because countries would be allowed to keep the revenues of such a tax), but nonetheless costly.
Vetalia
29-06-2006, 20:01
Unnecessary != Useless As long as there's some value in burning fossil fuels, there will be incentive to do it.

Exactly. We're using fossil fuels because they are still economical, not because of some irreplaceable human need for them; they are as substitutable as any other good and will be replaced when they are no longer profitable to use. Consumers will adjust if oil and gas get too expensive relative to alternatives; it's already happening, for example with wind turbines instead of gas power plants or solar plants on rooftops for heating and electricity.

And I don't see that value going away anytime soon. It's a compact and easily transportable source of energy

They're getting more expensive to produce and energy companies are seeing their profit margins shrink because the market price is rising more slowly than the production cost; they've got most likely 20 or so years left of profitability depending on the market price.

Plus, from an energy perspective they are becoming unfavorable. Oil's only at a 5 or 7:1 ratio compared to 30:1 in the 70's and 100:1 in the 1940's. Most alternatives are energy-superior to fossil fuels, but are still more expensive.
Square rootedness
29-06-2006, 20:19
They should be researched, and the fact that they cut out that much money out of the worlds military budget can only be a good thing.


What?!! You kidding. Bush want more guns, more nukes, more flames. Bush only take money from education and environmental protection. Dur. And that go for all stupid, power hungry world leaders.

Grrr... Grog go crawl in cave now.
Xenophobialand
29-06-2006, 20:36
Even if we stopped producing emissions today, all the CO2 we've already pumped into the atmosphere would remain there for a fairly long period of time before existing global methods of absorbing CO2, such as the sink that the oceans provide, could bring us back to equilibrium. So we're not just talking about how to turn off the spigot for CO2 production; we're also talking about ways to counter the effects of CO2 already present.

Offhand I can think of several hypothetical ways. One way is to pump large quantities of reflective particles into the atmosphere. SO2, for instance, is just such a chemical, but the problem is that sulpher dioxide is first the major component of acid rain, second it remains in solution in the atmosphere for only a few weeks, whereas CO2 remains in the atmosphere for decades at a time. Another way is to seed the ocean floor with iron, which would increase the ocean's capacity for absorbing and holding CO2 in solution.

One thing is fairly certain, however: as global ocean temperatures increase, we are going to be more and more screwed, for no other reason than a basic principle of chemistry: as temperature increases, the amount of gas that a fluid can hold in solution decreases. That's why your soda goes flat when it warms: as temperatures increase, the ability of the soda to hold CO2 in solution decreases. The same principle applies to the ocean, except on a much more massive scale.