NationStates Jolt Archive

COMMENTARY: I can't imagine doing such a thing, but then again, I was always taught "look, but don't touch." As a man, have you ever done such a thing? And for the ladies on here, have you ever had this happen? I'm just curious as to how much of a problem this is.


Women Have Seen It All on Subway, Unwillingly (http://www.nytimes.com/2006/06/24/nyregion/24harass.html?_r=1&th&emc=th&oref=slogin)


By ANEMONA HARTOCOLLIS
Published: June 24, 2006
It is a hidden reality of the New York City subway system, and perhaps mass transit systems everywhere since the first trolley car took to the tracks. It begins with a pinch or a shove, someone standing too close. But it can be much worse.

This week, as the Police Department announced the arrest of 13 men charged with groping and flashing women in the subways, women around the city nodded. Yes, they said, this had happened to them. Yesterday. Last month. Last fall. Twenty years ago.

"Every girl I know has at least one story," said Barbara Vencebi, 23, a studio photographer standing outside the No. 6 train station at 116th Street in East Harlem yesterday.

It is a crime abetted by the peculiar landscape of the underworld that is the subway system, by the anonymity of a crowded car where everybody is avoiding eye contact. And by the opportunity for a quick escape at the next stop, to disappear behind a pillar, into a tunnel, up an escalator.

An impromptu survey of riders during the morning rush yesterday found that, for many women who have experienced it, the worst part of the crime is the sense of helplessness. What is the right way to react to a humiliating, but not life-threatening, situation? Should you announce to an entire car of strangers that you have just been violated?

Most of the time, the women said, they seethe inwardly but say nothing.

"I looked back and I couldn't do anything because a lot of people were behind me," said Suany Baca, 32, a waitress who was going up the stairs at 86th Street in the No. 6 train station last November, when she was groped by a man who passed her going down.

"I pretended like it didn't happen," she said. "I don't know what they get out of it."

Those who single out women on the subways do not care about race, if yesterday's interviews were any indication — black, Asian, Hispanic and white women all had stories to tell. But they do seem to discriminate by age.

Most of the women who reported recent incidents were in their 20's and younger. But the experience, women said, is so universal, and so scarring, that they continue to feel paranoid and to put on their body armor — the big bag, the bad face — no matter how old they get.

Women know the drill. Just as some men reflexively check to see if they have their wallets on a crowded train, women check their bodies.

Pull in your backside and your front. Wedge a large bag for protection between yourself and the nearest anonymous male rider, who might, just might, be planning something. Put on your fiercest face, and brace yourself for contact that seems too deliberate to be accidental, too prolonged to be random.

And not just in New York. Mexico City and Tokyo have reacted to subway gropers by instituting all-female subway cars. But as one New York woman said yesterday, wouldn't that make a nice target?

The crackdown in New York followed a number of highly publicized cases in which women helped the police arrest flashers by snapping pictures of them with their cellphone cameras.

Some women said yesterday that they did not expect the police effort — 13 suspected gropers and flashers were arrested over 36 hours last month — to make a big dent in the problem. But, they added, it was a start.

"I feel better they caught these guys," said Juliette Fairley, 35, an actress who said that she encountered a flasher on her N train at 42nd Street not long ago. "But there will always be people out there like this."

Some crime and subway experts with long memories offered a cautionary tale yesterday. A subway police squad in 1983 and 1984 looking for lewd behavior led to the false arrest of scores of men, most of them black and Hispanic. The men were accused of "bumping," the jargon for men who rubbed up against women, and other petty crimes.

The arrests turned out to be part of a scheme by transit police officers to inflate their productivity and win promotion, and it became a major scandal. "It is extremely hard in a crowded subway station to tell right from wrong when somebody is up close to somebody else," Richard Emery, a lawyer who won a class-action suit on behalf of the falsely arrested men, said yesterday.

Any sting operation, he said, has to be carefully planned. Stan Fischler, a subway historian and author of "The Subway and the City," made a similar point. The IRT cars of the kind used on the No. 1 line, he said, are skinnier than those used on the IND and BMT lines, and it is almost impossible during the morning and evening rush not to rub up against someone. "Half the time you don't know whether it's accidental or not," he said.

Jenna Caccaro, 22, a fashion student who lives in Brooklyn, said she was first flashed on the subway when she was 15. She thought it might have been because she was wearing her Catholic school uniform. "I thought that maybe I'd done something to attract him," she said, "but my family reassured me he was just a sleaze."

Sara Payne, 25, of Manhattan, who takes the No. 1 train to work for a jewelry company in the Bronx, said she has been flashed about six times on the subway in the eight years she has lived in New York. She said it happened more when she was a freshman in college than it does now.

"Maybe I'm a little more confident now," she said, "so people are less prone to try and intimidate me."

Vivian Lynch, 68, used to take the F train home to Queens. She shivered at the memory. "It happened to me in the 70's," she said. "Men used to touch women on the train and stand close to them and ruin their clothes."

In some ways, groping seems almost an accepted part of subway culture. Stephanie Vullo, 43, said she had dealt many times with men rubbing up against her or trying to touch her on crowded No. 4 or 5 trains in the morning when she takes her daughter to school. "It's worse in the summer months when everyone is wearing less clothing," she said. "The first time I turned around and yelled at the guy, but with my daughter, I don't want to get her upset."

Many women said they were not so much frightened by the subway encounters as they were appalled that men would do something so pathetic.

Like Ms. Fairley, the actress. "All of a sudden," she said, "this man moved into my frame of reference, and I was staring at a penis. I couldn't believe it."

Ms. Fairley said she was embarrassed, but felt even worse, in a way, for the man. "They need help, bless their hearts," she said.

I let women grope me all the time :D

I let women grope me all the time :D
LOL! You dweeb! :p

Apparently it's such a big problem on the Tokyo Metro, they have seperate carriages for women, if they so wish.

LOL! You dweeb! :p


:D Hey, i have to have my share of fun sometimes!

Apparently it's such a big problem on the Tokyo Metro, they have seperate carriages for women, if they so wish.
that the problem should be so bad, it is grotesque.

I've been groped. :(

Apparently it's such a big problem on the Tokyo Metro, they have seperate carriages for women, if they so wish.
And in Mexico City as well, if the article is to be believed. :(

I've been groped. :(
Hey! I already apologized for that. You can just go ahead and erase those digital camera photos. :p

that the problem should be so bad, it is grotesque.
It's also sad in a way. I imagine that most of those men wouldn't do that sort of thing if they were getting what they need from their respective wives and girlfriends. Then again, I'm sure there are those who would do that irregardless. Sigh. Humans!

Hey, no need to leave out us Parisians. We've got quite a metro ourselves, and i've seen more than one girl groped when it was rush hour. Thank Heaven most Parisian girls are ballsy enough to slap someone, even in a crowded subway car!

Hey, no need to leave out us Parisians. We've got quite a metro ourselves, and i've seen more than one girl groped when it was rush hour. Thank Heaven most Parisian girls are ballsy enough to slap someone, even in a crowded subway car!
I recommend carrying a ten-lb weight in your purse. Not only will it dissuade gropers when swung properly, it will help keep the body toned and fit. :)

I recommend carrying a ten-lb weight in your purse. Not only will it dissuade gropers when swung properly, it will help keep the body toned and fit. :)

Problem is, it most needs swinging during rush hours, when it's not easy to swing a purse.

Apparently it's such a big problem on the Tokyo Metro, they have seperate carriages for women, if they so wish.
Wow, really? What a shame that things like that become necessary.


And yeah, I've had it happen, Not groping, but rubbing. Linky (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frotteurism).
Only once, though, thank God.

A couple of times, I've had the misfortune to encounter exhibitionists jerking off in front of me and my girlfriends. That wasn't in the subway, though. It still is something that can drag me down like few things can. It made feel incredibly used and dirtied, and full of outrage that someboy could have that power over me. Fuckers.

Problem is, it most needs swinging during rush hours, when it's not easy to swing a purse.
Hmmm. How about one of those spring-loaded batons then? You know ... the kind where you hit the button and the collapsed baton suddenly springs out to about 3 feet! :D

Hey! I already apologized for that. You can just go ahead and erase those digital camera photos. :p

I kind of like the pictures. :)

Wow, really? What a shame that things like that become necessary.


And yeah, I've had it happen, Not groping, but rubbing. Linky (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frotteurism).
Only once, though, thank God.

A couple of times, I've had the misfortune to encounter exhibitionists jerking off in front of me and my girlfriends. That wasn't in the subway, though. It still is something that can drag me down like few things can. It made feel incredibly used and dirtied, and full of outrage that someboy could have that power over me. Fuckers.
:(

Let me know if that happens again so I can kill 'em for ya! ;)

Interesting link, btw.

I kind of like the pictures. :)
Eeep! :eek:

That's ... disturbing, on sooo many levels! :D

Eeep! :eek:

That's ... disturbing, on sooo many levels! :D

If I can't disturb people on at least three levels per day, I'm not doing my job. :)

This is a sticky thread

Why would I grope some random lady.. I can grope myself.





I don't see how a 1 second grope gives anything to a man..

LOL! You dweeb! :p
*Comment of the day*:D

As I was walking off the stage from one of my gigs, i wen't through a crowd of girls, who all groped me. It was great :D but a bit weird.

In April when I was in NYC I saw a guy quickly push a girl up against a building and he humped her 12 or more times than ran off. :confused: :(

Disgusting bastard.

In April when I was in NYC I saw a guy quickly push a girl up against a building and he humped her 12 or more times than ran off. :confused: :(

Disgusting bastard.
Ha ha ha ha ha
Women should stop being so sexy.

As I was walking off the stage from one of my gigs, i wen't through a crowd of girls, who all groped me. It was great :D but a bit weird.
Lucky stiff. Literally. :D

i've done it as a joke to a few female friends of mine, they weren't offended any more then 'ha-ha you perv' offended.

i think too much of an issue is being made of it. some things in life you just have to bear. those guys are pretty pathetic, and i would never grope some random chick like that... but going after them legally? that's stupid. Just smack 'em, or point em out to everyone else as a perv. If a cop's right there, then sure. But don't turn it into a crusade or anything. They'll get their's eventually.

lol i think the guys who wrote that are a little thick... no shit younger chicks are getting groped more often. younger chicks are hotter. why would you ever feel up some old woman if you could go after somebody younger? not that i would....

EDIT: humped twelve times???? now that's just eff'd up. That guy needs some jail time.

Lucky stiff. Literally. :D

Lol, some people just have it:D

In April when I was in NYC I saw a guy quickly push a girl up against a building and he humped her 12 or more times than ran off. :confused: :(

Disgusting bastard.
Sigh. Actually, he's probably more to be pitied than anything else. Can you imagine what life must be like for someone with that problem? :(

Doesn't much help the girl, though. I'm sure she was totally repulsed.

Humans! :(

Lol, some people just have it:D
Oh go flaggelate yourself! :p

LOL!

Never happened to me but then I'm over six feet tall and in good shape. Plus I did not grow up in any of those places. Anyone assaulting me will be lucky if both he and his ability to father children are both intact. Very Lucky.

I've been groped. :(
me too...never bothered me...:cool:

I tripped the guy with my crutch when he ran by and he fell face first into the pavement, and people clapped. :) :cool:

The bastard still got away.

A bussiness man was tackled by passengers and died after molesting a young woman on a packed train in Japan.
Police said the 40-year-old man groped the student in Osaka.
When he tried to run off at a busy station he was tackled by an off-duty police officer and three male passengers.
He lost consciousness and died

http://z13.invisionfree.com/Athar/index.php?showtopic=254&hl=
Crazy Japanese.:D

Never happened to me but then I'm over six feet tall and in good shape. Plus I did not grow up in any of those places. Anyone assaulting me will be lucky if both he and his ability to father children are both intact. Very Lucky.
Oooooooo! And you're female??? OMG!

http://z13.invisionfree.com/Athar/index.php?showtopic=254&hl=
Crazy Japanese.:D
LOL! Serves him right, although capital punishment for a grope seems rather extreme.

Oooooooo! And you're female??? OMG!

I'll take that as a compliment thanks! :)

me too...never bothered me...:cool:
Well, DUH! Heh!

Well, DUH! Heh!
hey, I take what I can get.

I'll take that as a compliment thanks! :)
It was intended as such. I'm a great admirer of the self-capable female of the species. I like the idea that my partner can stand at my back and cut 'em down when they come from that direction! Makes lovin' more interesting too! :D

LOL! Serves him right, although capital punishment for a grope seems rather extreme.
He kinda died doing what he loves...
Being a dirty old man.

hey, I take what I can get.
What male doesn't? ;)

It was intended as such. I'm a great admirer of the self-capable female of the species. I like the idea that my partner can stand at my back and cut 'em down when they come from that direction! Makes lovin' more interesting too! :D

Yeah I agree with all of that. :-) You almost make wish I swung that way. :)

He kinda died doing what he loves...
Being a dirty old man.
Hmmm. Well, there's dirty and then there's *DIRTY*! I certainly plan to die as I've lived: a dirty old man with class and experience. But I've never had to resort to groping strange females. Most of the females who've been attracted to me have been so because I'm a dirty old man. :D

Yeah I agree with all of that. :-) You almost make wish I swung that way. :)
LMAO! Never too late for a conversion, Amazon Woman! :D

Happened to me frequently in the NY subway. Bastards would grab my privates, and I'd punch theirs. End of grope. Some tried to be sneaky about it -- in a really crowded train (where if you fainted, you wouldn't fall down) they'd find themselves pressed up against some lady and try to "casually" hump her hip. One guy tried that with me and got the hard corner of my purse crammed into his dick. No words or anger, just embarrassment and going away. One guy masturbated in front of me. Caught him at it a few yards away when I looked up from my magazine. He was sitting there, stroking and grinning at me. I went back to reading my magazine. It didn't look much different from the monkeys at the zoo, and I didn't get upset about that, either. Losers. But you know, when you cram upwards of 7 million people into one place, you're going to get some under-developed ones in the mix.

I've seen crazy people on the subway trying to get too close to women, and a couple of times, I've seen other men block them by closing ranks around the women. Chivalry isn't really dead. Now you know how New York just got rated the world's most polite city. :p

Yep had it happen to me three separate times.

First time was while I was on my first job straight out of college -- I had a briefcase with me, and so I wedged it between me and my groper. Didn't deter him. Used my knee to push it out from my body to try to get him away. Didn't deter him. Body checked him HARD with my shoulder, and then he started screaming like a stuck pig, "Young people, they have no respect for the old!"

"If you want respect STOP GROPING WOMEN ON THE TRAIN, old man! You touch me again and you'll end up facedown on the tracks!!!"

Amazing. A three foot radius of space opened around me.


Second time was a guy leaning on me hard. I had got bolder by then, and yelled at him that if I couldn't put him on my taxes as a dependent, then I was NOT gonna support him.


Last time was some bastard rubbing up against my back on the subway. I got rid of HIM by yelling, "That better be a gun in my back, or I'm gonna rip it off and ram it down your damn throat!"

Welcome to the NYC Subway System. Making a big loud fuss makes these cowardly bastards disappear.

New York, New York, it's a wonderful town
The Bronx is up and the Battery's down
And people ride around in a hole in the ground...

:D

Happened to me frequently in the NY subway. Bastards would grab my privates, and I'd punch theirs. End of grope. Some tried to be sneaky about it -- in a really crowded train (where if you fainted, you wouldn't fall down) they'd find themselves pressed up against some lady and try to "casually" hump her hip. One guy tried that with me and got the hard corner of my purse crammed into his dick. No words or anger, just embarrassment and going away. One guy masturbated in front of me. Caught him at it a few yards away when I looked up from my magazine. He was sitting there, stroking and grinning at me. I went back to reading my magazine. It didn't look much different from the monkeys at the zoo, and I didn't get upset about that, either. Losers. But you know, when you cram upwards of 7 million people into one place, you're going to get some under-developed ones in the mix.

I've seen crazy people on the subway trying to get too close to women, and a couple of times, I've seen other men block them by closing ranks around the women. Chivalry isn't really dead. Now you know how New York just got rated the world's most polite city. :p
Three cheers for NYC! Yayyyy! [ applauds ] :)

Yep had it happen to me three separate times.

< snip >

Welcome to the NYC Subway System. Making a big loud fuss makes these cowardly bastards disappear.
LOL! You GO, girl! [ high fives ]

BTW ... remind me never to get to close to you! Heh!

New York, New York, it's a wonderful town
The Bronx is up and the Battery's down
And people ride around in a hole in the ground...

:D
Springfield Springfield...

Eh, no worries, YOU have some CLASS. ;)

I can't say I've personally seen it happen here on the Toronto subways. But we do get instances of sexual assault on subways on the news. The majority of Toronto subway riders have decency to just look rather than touch.

Sexism!
You should have add the options: Ladies, have u done it too? Guys, have u let that happen?
Those things happen for real....

If a woman groped me I'd poke her in the eye! Get off me girl!

I can't say I've personally seen it happen here on the Toronto subways. But we do get instances of sexual assault on subways on the news. The majority of Toronto subway riders have decency to just look rather than touch.
I've been groped a few times on the TTC. And it's never been anyone attractive doing it, let me tell you.

I've been groped a few times on the TTC. And it's never been anyone attractive doing it, let me tell you.

Thats unfortunate... I spose groping is their last resort, considering they have no luck with their unattractiveness... :rolleyes:

Three cheers for NYC! Yayyyy! [ applauds ] :)
Urban survival 101: Carry a hard-edged purse or an umbrella to ward off crowd-pervs. Carry a separate (small) wad of cash as "mugging money"; when robbed, hand it over and keep your mouth shut about what else you're carrying (good against pickpockets, too). Alternative: When a mugger demands your wallet, and your wallet is in your pocket, and you are carrying a huge gym bag full of smelly clothes, throw the bag down on the ground, saying "it's in the bag, just take it, man"; and run away. Corrollary: Always carry a large, unweildy bag full of worthless junk. ;)

Thats unfortunate... I spose groping is their last resort, considering they have no luck with their unattractiveness... :rolleyes:
Ha! If a sexy person does it, we call it love at first sight, not a grope. :D

Sexism!
You should have add the options: Ladies, have u done it too? Guys, have u let that happen?
Those things happen for real....
An uncle of mine was gropped in the Mexico City subway. He was surprised, but glad for the attention. Later he realized his wallet was missing. :D

When I used to work as a waitress around the times the bars would close I would get guys who would slap me on the ass when I was walking by their tables, I suppose that doesn't count though.........

I really wonder what posseses someone to do that though (other than too much alcohol) I mean the first rule in elementary school is "keep your hands feet and all other objects to yourself"

Urban survival 101: Carry a hard-edged purse or an umbrella to ward off crowd-pervs. Carry a separate (small) wad of cash as "mugging money"; when robbed, hand it over and keep your mouth shut about what else you're carrying (good against pickpockets, too). Alternative: When a mugger demands your wallet, and your wallet is in your pocket, and you are carrying a huge gym bag full of smelly clothes, throw the bag down on the ground, saying "it's in the bag, just take it, man"; and run away. Corrollary: Always carry a large, unweildy bag full of worthless junk. ;)
Question: So, if I walk around the city carrying a purse, and umbrella, an extra wad of cash, a wallet, and a large, unwieldy bag - wouldn't that kinda make me a target for muggers in the first place? :p

But it sure would make it more difficult to actually reach anything gropable, I'll give you that. *nods*

An uncle of mine was gropped in the Mexico City subway. He was surprised, but glad for the attention. Later he realized his wallet was missing. :D
Heee. :p

If I were a chick I'd have a tazer in my hand at all times in public transport. Of course then you'd tend to kind of zap people as a warning and you never know what'd happen after that.

I can tell you if there were groups of guys roaming public transport in homoassfondlinggruppen (tm pending) tazer sales to blokes would hit the roof.

Well, while I personally have never groped I do have something to say about this article.

At a night club I've been to, I was trying to get through to the bar (with one arm infront, and one behind so i could open spaces up for myself) when I (unintentionally) brushed a womans ass. She turned around and gave me the dirtiest look.

I think that this is what mostly happens on public transport aswell. Not every piece of contact like that is intentional.

Not being female, I dont have much of a perspective on this problem, but I can think of one way to discourage it, its quite easy.
Stare for a second, then break down laughing.
Now, imagine what THAT would do to a guys self esteem.

Well, while I personally have never groped I do have something to say about this article.

At a night club I've been to, I was trying to get through to the bar (with one arm infront, and one behind so i could open spaces up for myself) when I (unintentionally) brushed a womans ass. She turned around and gave me the dirtiest look.

I think that this is what mostly happens on public transport aswell. Not every piece of contact like that is intentional.

The protocol is simple. If you should accidentaly touch someones ass with your hand you must without pause and loudly utter the phrase "D'oh!". This will allow you to be considered a lummox but not a brute. Otherwise yer dead.

Question: So, if I walk around the city carrying a purse, and umbrella, an extra wad of cash, a wallet, and a large, unwieldy bag - wouldn't that kinda make me a target for muggers in the first place? :p

But it sure would make it more difficult to actually reach anything gropable, I'll give you that. *nods*
Nah, muggers and pervs don't need targets. They're like asteroids. They just fly around loose and randomly collide with people. Think of all that stuff as bumpers, so they'll just bump off you.

Well, while I personally have never groped I do have something to say about this article.

At a night club I've been to, I was trying to get through to the bar (with one arm infront, and one behind so i could open spaces up for myself) when I (unintentionally) brushed a womans ass. She turned around and gave me the dirtiest look.

I think that this is what mostly happens on public transport aswell. Not every piece of contact like that is intentional.
Yeah, uh-huh. Some guy accidentally reaches down and shoves his hand between my legs 'cause, you know, you need to hold onto something when the train is moving. *shrugs* I often find that guys who aren't pervs have a hard time believing perv stories, until they see one in action. Trust me, I've spent enough hours on trains so crowded the only thing stopping an orgy from breaking out was that nobody could move, so I know the difference between an accidental rub-up and deliberate sneak-humping.

I can say that I've never groped a woman on the subway but I have gotten my fair share of beautiful visuals on the subway, especially when its skirt weather. It's a shame more women are wearing pants more often. Show those beautiful legs off, please, for us men who are just really bored because we forgot our iPOD.

Been there, done that, mostly on the NYC subway.

First, there was the "oops, I accidentally brushed your breast with my arm" guy. It was almost believable until he "accidentally" did it the fourth time in about a minute, at which point I "accidentally" hit him fairly hard with my backpack, and he decided that maybe he didn't actually need to stand quite so close to me, seeing as the train wasn't even especially crowded.

Then, there was mister "golly gee, these women's bottoms just keep bumping into my hands." He wins the award for Persistence in Perversion, since he had one woman on the NY subway tell him, quite loudly, that if he touched her ass again she was going to rip his testicles off, yet as soon as she got off the train, I quite clearly saw him grab the rears of the next two women to walk on. I unfortunately had to walk past him to exit myself, and he was quite blatantly leaning over and stretching his arm out towards my bottom before I jumped out of the way. Ick.

Last, but definitely not least, was a guy on an especially crowded ride who didn't actually try to grope me, but instead creeped me out far more thoroughly by whispering at me. Spending a ten-minute ride crushed up against a very dirty (like, in the sense of "encrusted with dirt") man who has decided to locate his mouth no more than half an inch from your ear while hissing "hey slut slut slut ass slut hey tits tits ass tits slut hey" is not an experience I recommend. It left me pretty damn disturbed.

The sad thing is that all three of these happened to me over the space of only a few months, and I'm not even especially attractive. Heaven only knows what good-looking women living in NYC full-time have to put up with...

I'm a guy and those dirty ass, smelly, disgusting people skeeve me out too. When I see them get on I want to go as far away from them as possible. I don't care where they sit or stand, I don't want to be less than 10 feet from them.

Never happened to me but then I'm over six feet tall and in good shape. Plus I did not grow up in any of those places. Anyone assaulting me will be lucky if both he and his ability to father children are both intact. Very Lucky.
That is unbelievably sexy.
"If you want respect STOP GROPING WOMEN ON THE TRAIN, old man! You touch me again and you'll end up facedown on the tracks!!!"

Second time was a guy leaning on me hard. I had got bolder by then, and yelled at him that if I couldn't put him on my taxes as a dependent, then I was NOT gonna support him.

Last time was some bastard rubbing up against my back on the subway. I got rid of HIM by yelling, "That better be a gun in my back, or I'm gonna rip it off and ram it down your damn throat!"

Again, that is unbelievably sexy.

Back to the groping subject, except for the time a girl grabbed my ass in jr. high, every groping involving me has been accidental. A couple incidents of a guy friend's hand accidentally brushing up against me. One incident of my hands accidentally brushing against breasts escaping some kind of hold. It was a long time ago, so I don't remember it well. In order to help judgemental people make an appropriate response, I will let you know I am male.

Gawd. If I had to put up with horrid housewives flapping bingo wings as they tried to grab my manly buttocks. Well I just keep coming up tazer.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H2zTjOy2YfE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LGgS5jICDuQ

When I was in highschool girls grabbed my ass occasionally. The one time it really annoyed me was when the girl doing the grabbing had these horribly long nails. That hurt. :(

i get groped all the time at work. it's really annoying.

edit: to clarify, i get groped by women. it's not just men that do sexual harassment.

I don't see the point of men flashing, what the fuck are they doing?
I mean groping, they are fulfilling their need to grab-ass but, what is the point of whipping out willy?

<snip>
Last, but definitely not least, was a guy on an especially crowded ride who didn't actually try to grope me, but instead creeped me out far more thoroughly by whispering at me. Spending a ten-minute ride crushed up against a very dirty (like, in the sense of "encrusted with dirt") man who has decided to locate his mouth no more than half an inch from your ear while hissing "hey slut slut slut ass slut hey tits tits ass tits slut hey" is not an experience I recommend. It left me pretty damn disturbed.
<snip>
Those guys -- the crazy, burnt-out, not-medicated-enough dudes -- are seriously scary. Sometimes, I would get off at the wrong stop and either change cars or wait for the next train to get away from one of those. Once, during one of those sane-guys-block-crazy-guy-from-getting-to-woman situations, the crazy man -- poor, raving bastard -- pulled out a plastic table knife and started brandishing it at people. Then he ran off the train at the next stop.

And I've also had my share of lewd remarks and cat-calls from guys not encrusted with dirt. :rolleyes: Maybe they don't get enough real sex. Can't afford it, probably -- not likely they'd get it for free.

Those guys -- the crazy, burnt-out, not-medicated-enough dudes -- are seriously scary. Sometimes, I would get off at the wrong stop and either change cars or wait for the next train to get away from one of those. Once, during one of those sane-guys-block-crazy-guy-from-getting-to-woman situations, the crazy man -- poor, raving bastard -- pulled out a plastic table knife and started brandishing it at people. Then he ran off the train at the next stop.

Yeesh. That poor man. I did feel sorry for the "hey slut slut ass" guy, too, in between being scared to death of him. I suppose being a crazy dirt-encrusted pervert is probably even more depressing than being accosted by one...

Apparently it's such a big problem on the Tokyo Metro, they have seperate carriages for women, if they so wish.

Yes indeed, and not just in Tokyo. In fact they got started in Japan here in Osaka. However on the various train lines (not just the subways), the female only cars are only run during the morning and evening rush hours.

http://z13.invisionfree.com/Athar/index.php?showtopic=254&hl=
Crazy Japanese.:D

Have you got a linky for the original story? I live here in Osaka and don't remember seeing that in the news...

And I know too many stories about gropings and worse on the train. Every last Japanese woman the topic has come up with has been assaulted in some fashion.

On the warped side of all this is Japan's sex industry. You can hire a sex worker and a "play room" set up like a train car, complete with taped train announcements and assorted other sounds, in which you can molest all you want and more.

I don't see the point of men flashing, what the fuck are they doing?
I mean groping, they are fulfilling their need to grab-ass but, what is the point of whipping out willy?

Flashing sounds like a power display to me I mean its displaying a well known weak point in a blatant manner and by showing of their usualyl covered up and protected weak point they are playing with power. It sad but people do weird things for power & control and retaining it.
Mind you flashing/taunting in this manner opens up the flasher for a counter attack and where should you strike? Well they ARE asking for it.

Also..
That is unbelievably sexy.

Never happened to me but then I'm over six feet tall and in good shape. Plus I did not grow up in any of those places. Anyone assaulting me will be lucky if both he and his ability to father children are both intact. Very Lucky

AND


"If you want respect STOP GROPING WOMEN ON THE TRAIN, old man! You touch me again and you'll end up facedown on the tracks!!!"

Second time was a guy leaning on me hard. I had got bolder by then, and yelled at him that if I couldn't put him on my taxes as a dependent, then I was NOT gonna support him.

Last time was some bastard rubbing up against my back on the subway. I got rid of HIM by yelling, "That better be a gun in my back, or I'm gonna rip it off and ram it down your damn throat!"

Here here I agree with theoretical physicts with this one, I think its grose and hawt, having a gal gets all aggro when it counts like that because the guy defintely deserves it.
that comes from a guy who stands about 165cm (~5"'2')

I have to say if I saw something like that going on I'd bust the guy in the chops. That perv who got beaten to death, noone is going to launch an inquiry tribunal or whatever into his death. It's amazing how a good tooth rattling clatter in the chops can put manners on someone.

An uncle of mine was gropped in the Mexico City subway. He was surprised, but glad for the attention. Later he realized his wallet was missing. :D

Heh. I carry my wallet in a front pocket, pretty far down. Somebody tries to "grope" me like that, male or female, they're highly likely to end up with a broken arm. :)

I used to get groped quite frequently, but that was all part of my life back then, and I didn't let it bother me. If they wanted to get any more intimate it was going to cost them money up front and it didn't hurt to let them "sample the goods". Now, though, it most certainly does bother me, and the last guy who tried (about a year ago on a public bus) found out that a petite, 5'4" girl is quite capable of slamming him to the floor -- and nobody on the bus who saw the altercation made a move to help him back up, and one nice fellow actually traded seats with me, putting me closer to the front of the bus. No, I don't live in New York. :p

I used to get groped quite frequently, but that was all part of my life back then, and I didn't let it bother me. If they wanted to get any more intimate it was going to cost them money up front and it didn't hurt to let them "sample the goods". Now, though, it most certainly does bother me, and the last guy who tried (about a year ago on a public bus) found out that a petite, 5'4" girl is quite capable of slamming him to the floor -- and nobody on the bus who saw the altercation made a move to help him back up, and one nice fellow actually traded seats with me, putting me closer to the front of the bus. No, I don't live in New York. :p

Hell New York, nobody would have noticed you slamming him down on the floor of the bus.

I recommend carrying a ten-lb weight in your purse. Not only will it dissuade gropers when swung properly, it will help keep the body toned and fit. :)
Somehow doubt that there will be enough swing room in a crouded car like that lol

COMMENTARY: I can't imagine doing such a thing, but then again, I was always taught "look, but don't touch." As a man, have you ever done such a thing? And for the ladies on here, have you ever had this happen? I'm just curious as to how much of a problem this is.


Women Have Seen It All on Subway, Unwillingly (http://www.nytimes.com/2006/06/24/nyregion/24harass.html?_r=1&th&emc=th&oref=slogin)


By ANEMONA HARTOCOLLIS
Published: June 24, 2006
It is a hidden reality of the New York City subway system, and perhaps mass transit systems everywhere since the first trolley car took to the tracks. It begins with a pinch or a shove, someone standing too close. But it can be much worse.

This week, as the Police Department announced the arrest of 13 men charged with groping and flashing women in the subways, women around the city nodded. Yes, they said, this had happened to them. Yesterday. Last month. Last fall. Twenty years ago.

"Every girl I know has at least one story," said Barbara Vencebi, 23, a studio photographer standing outside the No. 6 train station at 116th Street in East Harlem yesterday.

It is a crime abetted by the peculiar landscape of the underworld that is the subway system, by the anonymity of a crowded car where everybody is avoiding eye contact. And by the opportunity for a quick escape at the next stop, to disappear behind a pillar, into a tunnel, up an escalator.

An impromptu survey of riders during the morning rush yesterday found that, for many women who have experienced it, the worst part of the crime is the sense of helplessness. What is the right way to react to a humiliating, but not life-threatening, situation? Should you announce to an entire car of strangers that you have just been violated?

Most of the time, the women said, they seethe inwardly but say nothing.

"I looked back and I couldn't do anything because a lot of people were behind me," said Suany Baca, 32, a waitress who was going up the stairs at 86th Street in the No. 6 train station last November, when she was groped by a man who passed her going down.

"I pretended like it didn't happen," she said. "I don't know what they get out of it."

Those who single out women on the subways do not care about race, if yesterday's interviews were any indication — black, Asian, Hispanic and white women all had stories to tell. But they do seem to discriminate by age.

Most of the women who reported recent incidents were in their 20's and younger. But the experience, women said, is so universal, and so scarring, that they continue to feel paranoid and to put on their body armor — the big bag, the bad face — no matter how old they get.

Women know the drill. Just as some men reflexively check to see if they have their wallets on a crowded train, women check their bodies.

Pull in your backside and your front. Wedge a large bag for protection between yourself and the nearest anonymous male rider, who might, just might, be planning something. Put on your fiercest face, and brace yourself for contact that seems too deliberate to be accidental, too prolonged to be random.

And not just in New York. Mexico City and Tokyo have reacted to subway gropers by instituting all-female subway cars. But as one New York woman said yesterday, wouldn't that make a nice target?

The crackdown in New York followed a number of highly publicized cases in which women helped the police arrest flashers by snapping pictures of them with their cellphone cameras.

Some women said yesterday that they did not expect the police effort — 13 suspected gropers and flashers were arrested over 36 hours last month — to make a big dent in the problem. But, they added, it was a start.

"I feel better they caught these guys," said Juliette Fairley, 35, an actress who said that she encountered a flasher on her N train at 42nd Street not long ago. "But there will always be people out there like this."

Some crime and subway experts with long memories offered a cautionary tale yesterday. A subway police squad in 1983 and 1984 looking for lewd behavior led to the false arrest of scores of men, most of them black and Hispanic. The men were accused of "bumping," the jargon for men who rubbed up against women, and other petty crimes.

The arrests turned out to be part of a scheme by transit police officers to inflate their productivity and win promotion, and it became a major scandal. "It is extremely hard in a crowded subway station to tell right from wrong when somebody is up close to somebody else," Richard Emery, a lawyer who won a class-action suit on behalf of the falsely arrested men, said yesterday.

Any sting operation, he said, has to be carefully planned. Stan Fischler, a subway historian and author of "The Subway and the City," made a similar point. The IRT cars of the kind used on the No. 1 line, he said, are skinnier than those used on the IND and BMT lines, and it is almost impossible during the morning and evening rush not to rub up against someone. "Half the time you don't know whether it's accidental or not," he said.

Jenna Caccaro, 22, a fashion student who lives in Brooklyn, said she was first flashed on the subway when she was 15. She thought it might have been because she was wearing her Catholic school uniform. "I thought that maybe I'd done something to attract him," she said, "but my family reassured me he was just a sleaze."

Sara Payne, 25, of Manhattan, who takes the No. 1 train to work for a jewelry company in the Bronx, said she has been flashed about six times on the subway in the eight years she has lived in New York. She said it happened more when she was a freshman in college than it does now.

"Maybe I'm a little more confident now," she said, "so people are less prone to try and intimidate me."

Vivian Lynch, 68, used to take the F train home to Queens. She shivered at the memory. "It happened to me in the 70's," she said. "Men used to touch women on the train and stand close to them and ruin their clothes."

In some ways, groping seems almost an accepted part of subway culture. Stephanie Vullo, 43, said she had dealt many times with men rubbing up against her or trying to touch her on crowded No. 4 or 5 trains in the morning when she takes her daughter to school. "It's worse in the summer months when everyone is wearing less clothing," she said. "The first time I turned around and yelled at the guy, but with my daughter, I don't want to get her upset."

Many women said they were not so much frightened by the subway encounters as they were appalled that men would do something so pathetic.

Like Ms. Fairley, the actress. "All of a sudden," she said, "this man moved into my frame of reference, and I was staring at a penis. I couldn't believe it."

Ms. Fairley said she was embarrassed, but felt even worse, in a way, for the man. "They need help, bless their hearts," she said.

It's a communist muslim plot!

Hee. Best thread ever for a first post.

I was on the train the other day, and a man tried to grope me. I told him that if he didn't move away right that second, I would kick him in the balls so hard that he wouldn't be able to walk for a week.

That was amusing. Especially the look on his face when he realised that I was serious.

I agree that I don't see the point of flashing. It's just opening yourself up to ridicule - what bloke likes to have people laughing at him, rather then being intimidated? I'm guessing not many.

dosent happen on the warsaw metro.

I actually was on subway once and I honestly turned around too quickly in the mass of people and I bumped into a girl in front of me around my age. She thought I was perverted and gave me shit.

Yep, got that off my chest.

I actually was on subway once and I honestly turned around too quickly in the mass of people and I bumped into a girl in front of me around my age. She thought I was perverted and gave me shit.

Yep, got that off my chest.

I can see how that would happen.