NationStates Jolt Archive

Is insulting and/or attacking someone just because their fat a form a racism or "fattism"?

I will not confusingly grope what may or may not just be a skin fold! Seriously, fat people are gross.

Segregation such as racism, sexism and in this case fattism only further to encourage such actions. Can't we all just see each other for who we really are; people?

Segregation such as racism, sexism and in this case fattism only further to encourage such actions. Can't we all just see each other for who we really are; people?

Or in this case, Fat people.
;)

Or in this case, Fat people.
;)

I'm not fat, my youthful metabolism keeps me in fine form.

And I'm just big bonered. I know what I said.

Attacking someone for being fat is wrong. Attacking someone for saying being fat is okay is NOT wrong.

My favorite episodes of the Maury show are the ones where the fat people get on stage and the audience yells at them to stop eating, but the fat guests just make some obscene hand gestures and say they'll eat as much as they want. They usually don't live past 30.

I'm not fat, my youthful metabolism keeps me in fine form.
the binge drinking, vomiting, and passing out head first in the toilet doesn't hurt either;)

What I hate is fat people who try to make excuses for why they're fat. Why don't they just accept that they made themselves fat because more went into one hole than what came out the other hole.

To Fat People: You're fat because you ate too damn much, so stop blaming your fatness on other people and realize that it was your own damn fault. Now, if you want to eat tonight, get on the trendmill because that's the only thing powering the kitchen right now.

it could quite possibly come under discrimination, if you're judging them on their looks

deadset, fat people are people too
just with a bit more to love...

but really, really, really fat people deserve everything they get. they should have tackled the problem before it got that bad

the binge drinking, vomiting, and passing out head first in the toilet doesn't hurt either;)

Now you're getting it. Just have to [insert random running for my life] into the mix and I'm as healthy as can be.

My favorite episodes of the Maury show are the ones where the fat people get on stage and the audience yells at them to stop eating, but the fat guests just make some obscene hand gestures and say they'll eat as much as they want. They usually don't live past 30.

Here's what I love about those talk shows. One day they'll have fat people that need to slim down and get sexy. Then the next day they'll have skinny people who dress too sexy.

Jeez make up your mind!

I'm okay with fat people, even though, 9 times out of 10, it is their fault(the remaining 1 is reserved for people who takes medications that have a side effect that involves severely increased appitite and other people with something similar going on). No, fattism isn't like making fun of a person for being black or being born with AIDS. Most fatties can actually help it. Blacks and people born with AIDS can't help their skin color or disease they were born with.

What bugs me are those people who are PROUD of their weight. Sure, it makes them different and is considered a disability, but so does paralysis, AIDS, and diabetis. Those things aren't something to be ashamed of, but they aren't exactly bragging rights. Having a disability and still managing to beat a genius at chess IS a bragging right. Curing cancer is a bragging right. Playing an Aquaman game all the way from beginning to end without touching the power button is a bragging right. Those things take alot of hard work and determination. Eating yourself disabled doesn't, really.

Huh? Wtf..

How is fattism racism?

Huh? Wtf..

How is fattism racism?

That's what I'm wondering. It's amazing how people can equate racism to anything. Oh don't like Michael Jackson, well you're a racist. Hmm, don't care for rap, you are a racist. Oh, so you prefer to live in a gated community on the good side of town, you are a racist. etc.

That's what I'm wondering. It's amazing how people can equate racism to anything. Oh don't like Michael Jackson, well you're a racist. Hmm, don't care for rap, you are a racist. Oh, so you prefer to live in a gated community on the good side of town, you are a racist. etc.
Indeed. Perhaps one of the most poorly written questions I've seen here on NS. A dissapointing first post by the OP'er.. Needed some :gundge: or :mp5:.. *nods

Indeed. Perhaps one of the most poorly written questions I've seen here on NS. A dissapointing first post by the OP'er.. Needed some :gundge: or :mp5:.. *nods

*nods back*

That's what I'm wondering. It's amazing how people can equate racism to anything. Oh don't like Michael Jackson, well you're a racist. Hmm, don't care for rap, you are a racist. Oh, so you prefer to live in a gated community on the good side of town, you are a racist. etc.

Umm, how is any of that racism? Racism, ageism, sexism, all are an extreme discrimination against the norm or the majority. Disliking Michael Jackson is not racism, disliking him because he happens to be of a diffrent racial origin is racism. So disliking an obese person because they have a different haircut is not fattism, but disliking them because they are obese is fattism.

That's pretty much how society sees it. I disagree, labeling people as a different is both good and bad. It brings about individuality and tightens bonds between groups but can also bring about hatred be it race or weight. Personally I feel if we stopped labeling people as and just saw them as people we would be a much happier society.

Well I think we can all agree that fat people aren't a race. They aren't usually that big :p

Well I think we can all agree that fat people aren't a race. They aren't usually that big :p

What about the race to become the world's fattest man? Would that count?

but disliking them because they are obese is fattism.


Is disliking them because they are draining a disproportionate amount of resources from the NHS fattism?

Is disliking them because they are draining a disproportionate amount of resources from the NHS fattism?

Some form of a Healthcare system I'm assuming?

Same could be asked about smokers. Instead of attacking the victims (yes smokers are victims, as are many obese people) why not attack the problem?

Some form of a Healthcare system I'm assuming?

Same could be asked about smokers. Instead of attacking the victims (yes smokers are victims, as are many obese people) why not attack the problem?

The difference is that smokers (in this country at any rate) pay 10.5 billion extra pounds in tobacco duty every year. More then enough to meet the costs of smoking related illnesses.

Is disliking them because they are draining a disproportionate amount of resources from the NHS fattism?

and how about disliking the bigger ones because they look disgusting?

fat people are not a seperate race but ordinary human beings who, by their own action in most cases but sometimes through diseaese, have dramatically transformed their body image. This is not racism, people are not born fat and do not become fat overnight and should expect criticism for moaning about having to lie in the bed they've made for themselves.

I'm guessing there'll be a poll soon enough about smokism and pedestrianism...

I think it's pretty simple : my body, my choice. Not yours. If you feel the need to criticize, start with your own shortcomings.
People who don't feel well with their bodies should do something about it. People who feel ok with it shouldn't.

I think it's pretty simple : my body, my choice. Not yours. If you feel the need to criticize, start with your own shortcomings.
People who don't feel well with their bodies should do something about it. People who feel ok with it shouldn't.

Amen to that.

Yes, and TS if you are an overweight blob with a BMI of 35.

In a world where starvation exists, you are a disgrace to the human race.

Yes, and TS if you are an overweight blob with a BMI of 35.

In a world where starvation exists, you are a disgrace to the human race.

Because if I wasn't eating that extra cheeseburger they'd be shipping it off to the Sudan or Ethiopia or Mozambique or wherever it is that we're going to save this week... Sure, ok.

Oh, and TS??:confused:

Because if I wasn't eating that extra cheeseburger they'd be shipping it off to the Sudan or Ethiopia or Mozambique or wherever it is that we're going to save this week... Sure, ok.

Oh, and TS??:confused:

Rockhard Feaces.

You can just NOT buy it, and donate the money to Sally Army or summat.

Rockhard Feaces.

You can just NOT buy it, and donate the money to Sally Army or summat.

*applause*

Think of the starving kiddies!

Think of your own cholesterol-choked arteries and horrendous fatty liver!

Rockhard Feaces.

You can just NOT buy it, and donate the money to Sally Army or summat.

Are you saying that you are donating all that money you save from not eating those cheeseburgers? Or are simply being a hypocrite?

*applause*

Think of the starving kiddies!

Think of your own cholesterol-choked arteries and horrendous fatty liver!


*points back at post 29*


Or think of your BMI.
Nobody forced you to eat.
You did so.
And we're free to loathe and destest you for your decision.

Are you saying that you are donating all that money you save from not eating those cheeseburgers? Or are simply being a hypocrite?

I'm saying my BMI is well below 30.
I don't buy fatty food, don't overeat, and exercise a lot.

Which percentage of my income goes to the Church is none of your business.

I'm saying my BMI is well below 30.
I don't buy fatty food, don't overeat, and exercise a lot.

Which percentage of my income goes to the Church is none of your business.

Well, what was that rant about giving to charity instead of eating about, then?

Well, what was that rant about giving to charity instead of eating about, then?

Because if I wasn't eating that extra cheeseburger they'd be shipping it off to the Sudan or Ethiopia or Mozambique or wherever it is that we're going to save this week... Sure, ok

Understood?

and how about disliking the bigger ones because they look disgusting?

If you are using that line of arguement then you'd have to accept a racist hating blacks if they think they look disgusting

Well, what was that rant about giving to charity instead of eating about, then?

He's trying to claim the moral highground.

If you are using that line of arguement then you'd have to accept a racist hating blacks if they think they look disgusting


You have a choice about eating.
You haven't got a choice about your skincolour.

Understood?

Oh, I did follow that. I was just pointing out that your argument that the money fat people don't use to buy food should go to people who need it is kind of bogus if non-fat people don't actually do that.

Thank you for proving my point there.

You have a choice about eating.
You haven't got a choice about your skincolour.

So, you are saying you hate people because of their lifestyle choices, even though they don't even marginally affect you?

Hooray for tolerance...

You have a choice about eating.
You haven't got a choice about your skincolour.

That is irrelevent. If you want to hate an entire group of people on the way that they look then you have to accept that someone else can do that too.

(And ask Michael Jackson about skincolour and choice ;))

I'm guessing there'll be a poll soon enough about smokism and pedestrianism...

I think it's pretty simple : my body, my choice. Not yours. If you feel the need to criticize, start with your own shortcomings.
People who don't feel well with their bodies should do something about it. People who feel ok with it shouldn't.Agreed, to a point. I believe fat people shouldn't be ridiculed at all. But, there ARE health problems they need to be aware of.


What bugs me are those people who are PROUD of their weight.Psychologically, the pride response is like gay pride. Basically it's what happens when people try to make others ashamed for things there's no need to be ashamed of. To overcome all the negativity, the Pride(tm) has to be heaped on.

Plus, it deters asshattery.

Why don't they just accept that they made themselves fat because more went into one hole than what came out the other hole. Agh. That's not how weight gain works! Excess calories are stored--but waste passes through just like it ought to!

What makes a person fat is eating more calories than they USE.


Now, if you want to eat tonight, get on the trendmill because that's the only thing powering the kitchen right now.While that would cause a morbidly obese person to lose weight--due to starvation, or dysentary caused by eating raw food due to lack of power in the kitchen--walking's really not the best exercise to start with. By that point all the joints and muscles are stiffened and don't want to move. A long walk cannot happen, since extreme pain will stop the activity long before any good can come of it! This process is evil and insidious; the person likely doesn't realize it's "that bad" (from a health standpoint) until it seems like it's too late!

A SWIMMING regimen, however, loosens the parts back up. No need for speed at this phase. After mobility is restored (about 2 months of swimming 3x/week), THEN it's time for the walking program.

Also most sites recommend a walking speed of something like 3MPH. Ain't gonna happen! The person needs to start out realll slow and work up over several weeks.

I think a lot of obese people don't try to exercise because they try walking right away, find they can't do it, and just give up.

Oh, I did follow that. I was just pointing out that your argument that the money fat people don't use to buy food should go to people who need it is kind of bogus if non-fat people don't actually do that.

Thank you for proving my point there.

*drives a stake through your heart*

No.
He has the choice.
He can choose not to overeat.
He can choose not to indulge.
And if he moans that it wont help the 3rd world,
then he can choose to serve the 3rd world financially with the money he saved by REFUSING to indulge.

That is irrelevent. If you want to hate an entire group of people on the way that they look then you have to accept that someone else can do that too.

(And ask Michael Jackson about skincolour and choice ;))

Your conception, not mine.

How many blacks have MJ's financial resources to do so?

*drives a stake through your heart*

No.
He has the choice.
He can choose not to overeat.
He can choose not to indulge.
And if he moans that it wont help the 3rd world,
then he can choose to serve the 3rd world financially with the money he saved by REFUSING to indulge.

You're getting incoherent now... you were the one who pointed out that fat people ought to be ashamed because people in the 3rd world are starving.

Nobody said it wasn't a choice when you get down to it. People just tend to make the mistake to think that it's a simple choice, and that all it takes is a decision.

No.
He has the choice.
He can choose not to overeat.
He can choose not to indulge.
And if he moans that it wont help the 3rd world,
then he can choose to serve the 3rd world financially with the money he saved by REFUSING to indulge.

Problem. I'm overweight (slightly), but my BMI has been the same for about three years. In other words, the number of calories I consume is approximately equal to the number I use. So do you still believe I should be diverting part of what we could call my food budget to charity?

Nobody said it wasn't a choice when you get down to it. People just tend to make the mistake to think that it's a simple choice, and that all it takes is a decision.
*Nods* It's certainly not simple to just decide to stop eating so much.
You will be changing your lifestyle. That's not easy.

If you are using that line of arguement then you'd have to accept a racist hating blacks if they think they look disgusting

Alright so I didnt really mean it, but its still rather hard not to be disgusted byt the 20st+ people waring skimpy clothes in summer.

People just tend to make the mistake to think that it's a simple choice, and that all it takes is a decision.

True. I am slighty over weight and am trying to lose weight. I'm having a fair degree of success, but it isn't as easy as simply making a decision.

I found quitting smoking a lot easier.

Alright so I didnt really mean it, but its still rather hard not to be disgusted byt the 20st+ people waring skimpy clothes in summer.

I know.. Sorry, rather tetchy this morning.

Alright so I didnt really mean it, but its still rather hard not to be disgusted byt the 20st+ people waring skimpy clothes in summer.

What keeps you from looking away?

Alright so I didnt really mean it, but its still rather hard not to be disgusted byt the 20st+ people waring scanty clothes in summer.

Yes, but is that because they're fat or because they're dressed a certain way?

Much like if really really old people started dressing like that, or if a group of super-attractive people started dressing in clothing sporting repulsive slogans (racist, anti-semitic, pedophilic etc.)

We should turn fat people into soylent green. We could feed all the starving without any problems that way. Ofcourse, we could already do that.

What really bugs me is when thin people like myself are attacked for being thin.
"Hey boney"
"Wow, you're just skin and bones today"
"LOL, even in that coat you still look anorexic"
You'd never do this to a fat person, so why do people have the right to do it to thin people?
You'd never say...
"Wassup fatty?"
"Wow, you're looking flabby today"
"Even in that skintight swimming costume you still look 300lbs!"
Come on, give skinny people a break. We still feel it when people pay us out...

We should turn fat people into soylent green. We could feed all the starving without any problems that way. Ofcourse, we could already do that.Eat fatty food, and you'll get fat yourself.

Maybe we should turn athletic types into soylent green, since that'd be so much healthier.

Yes, but is that because they're fat or because they're dressed a certain way?

Much like if really really old people started dressing like that, or if a group of super-attractive people started dressing in clothing sporting repulsive slogans (racist, anti-semitic, pedophilic etc.)

To clarify: its not like I want to force any of these people to get thin, or to wear clothes that I approve of. They just look bad, and that makes me feel bad.

I don't spend more money on food, I simply don't burn off as many calories. I eat two moderate meals a day, sometimes one. If I started exercising I'd have to eat more because I'd be burning off calories. Thusly I'd have to buy more, and thusly, spend more money. Don't you think if there was someway to save up enough to buy the things I want I'd do it?

We should turn fat people into soylent green. We could feed all the starving without any problems that way. Ofcourse, we could already do that.
Soylent Green is made from soya and lentils, hence the name.
Read the book! That would be "Make Room! Make Room!" by Harry Harrison, by the way.

*GrumbleSoylentGreenIsn'tPeopleGrumble*

Fergi America']Eat fatty food, and you'll get fat yourself.

Maybe we should turn athletic types into soylent green, since that'd be so much healthier.

Hmm...you got a point. However i'm certain there is some way to filter out most of the fat from a soylent-green-to-be fatty. It couöd be boiled away and be sold as snacks? We need more fatties for more soylent green after all ;)

We could make lots of explosives from fat people.

To clarify: its not like I want to force any of these people to get thin, or to wear clothes that I approve of. They just look bad, and that makes me feel bad.

*lol
Hey, I live in Ireland. You just get used to people dressing in horrible clothes, wearing the most revolting colours imaginable. Doesn't matter if they're fat or skinny, they just look awful...

anyone who makes fun of anyone is moronic


and in this case this whole topic is moronic

To clarify: its not like I want to force any of these people to get thin, or to wear clothes that I approve of. They just look bad, and that makes me feel bad.
Shouldn't it make you feel better? *Confused*

Shouldn't it make you feel better? *Confused*

Why on earth would looking at fat people make me feel better?

Why on earth would looking at fat people make me feel better?
I assume you're skinny? Wouldn't you feel better by comparing yourself to us?

Shouldn't it make you feel better? *Confused*


i feel better and i am not looking at you, because i already know i am better than you

The heaviest people in this nation are addicts. Just like heroin, meth, alcohol or tobacco addicts. They are addicted to fat (butter, oils, etc), sugar, in its various forms, starch (which turns into sugar) and various other calorie packing additives. Unless you have been addicted to something, its very hard to understand it.

Treatment resources are needed on a large scale, because in this country, we have been in denial of food addiction for a very long time. You can't just tell a fat person to quit eating with any greater success than you can just tell a drunk to quit drinking. Until the underlying issues are exposed and forced to be reckoned with, these people are going to be out of control with their problem.

Insults only exacerbate the situation as it is emotional pain that leads to substance abuse in the first place. I don't feel it is the fast food industry's fault that people are fat anymore than I feel it is the tobacco industry's fault that people are 3 pack a day smokers. But when we sued the tobacco company's and won, we started down this slippery slope. Of course it is the consumer's fault they over-consume. But this is not a nation of moderation. This is a nation of excess and we are surrounded by good examples of it, not just fat people.

For alot of people its just junk and crap. Consumerism is an addiction too. If your room is so full you can't walk through it. If you have more video games than sense. If you need to rent a storage shed, you have an addiction you need to look at or address.

Further, meaness is like an addiction. Being mean keeps our focus away from our own issues, the pain that we refuse to deal with. As long as we are taking that bottled up rage and focusing it on fat people, we don't have to feel it inflicted inward in the form of addiction and neurosis. Just know what you are doing when you abuse someone else....

i feel better and i am not looking at you, because i already know i am better than you

But I know I'm better than you. My ability to use punctuation actually makes me a better person than you. Little known fact, that.

I assume you're skinny? Wouldn't you feel better by comparing yourself to us?

Not really no. I dont compare myself to people like that. And Im not really skinny, just in the middle of the healthy BMI range I think.

The heaviest people in this nation are addicts. Just like heroin, meth, alcohol or tobacco addicts. They are addicted to fat (butter, oils, etc), sugar, in its various forms, starch (which turns into sugar) and various other calorie packing additives. Unless you have been addicted to something, its very hard to understand it.

Treatment resources are needed on a large scale, because in this country, we have been in denial of food addiction for a very long time. You can't just tell a fat person to quit eating with any greater success than you can just tell a drunk to quit drinking. Until the underlying issues are exposed and forced to be reckoned with, these people are going to be out of control with their problem.

Insults only exacerbate the situation as it is emotional pain that leads to substance abuse in the first place. I don't feel it is the fast food industry's fault that people are fat anymore than I feel it is the tobacco industry's fault that people are 3 pack a day smokers. But when we sued the tobacco company's and won, we started down this slippery slope. Of course it is the consumer's fault they over-consume. But this is not a nation of moderation. This is a nation of excess and we are surrounded by good examples of it, not just fat people.

For alot of people its just junk and crap. Consumerism is an addiction too. If your room is so full you can't walk through it. If you have more video games than sense. If you need to rent a storage shed, you have an addiction you need to look address.

Further, meaness is like an addiction. Being mean keeps us focus away from our own issues, the pain that we refuse to deal with. As long as we are taking that bottled up rage and focusing it on fat people, we don't have to feel it inflicted inward in the form of addiction and neurosis. Just know what you are doing when you abuse someone else....


haha no there not, i ate, ate and ate and i never gained a pound, maybe its cause i have a disease but being heavy has nothing to do with fatty foods, its genetic

Your body can't just create new mass. You need to put something in before you get the fun of obesity.

Just don't eat like a pig!

But I know I'm better than you. My ability to use punctuation actually makes me a better person than you. Little known fact, that.

no if i wanted to i would be using punctuation, but i see no point to it as it means nothing.

and if you eat healthy food the same thing will happen just not as fast , my mother is diabetic so dont think i dont know this crap.

no if i wanted to i would be using punctuation, but i see no point to it as it means nothing.

Errr... If punctuation meant nothing it wouldn't be used ever, surely?

You fail at English.

haha no there not, i ate, ate and ate and i never gained a pound, maybe its cause i have a disease but being heavy has nothing to do with fatty foods, its genetic
:rolleyes:
And I ate less and did more exercise and lost five stone. But that's a coincidence, it was the intensive gene therapy really.

no if i wanted to i would be using punctuation, but i see no point to it as it means nothing.
ive been sayin the same thing u r so right u know we all should type like this dont u think mate its much easier

Your body can't just create new mass. You need to put something in before you get the fun of obesity.

Just don't eat like a pig!
You eat the same amount if not more food that we do, you simply burn it off.

take it 2 the extrme it r soo gd lolololol urleet.

ive been sayin the same thing u r so right u know we all should type like this dont u think mate its much easier
Sarcasm! I'd fluffle you if I didn't know you hated it.

You eat the same amount if not more food that we do, you simply burn it off.

Now there's a thing to say to somebody whose eating habits you don't know.

Sarcasm! I'd fluffle you if I didn't know you hated it.
I love fluffles! :fluffle:

I just really hate puppies...*drowns a puppy*

74|< 17 2 7|-|3 3><7|2|\/|3 17 |2 5()() 9c| |_0|_0|_0|_0|_ |_||2|_337.
P|-|1><0|23c|.

Now there's a thing to say to somebody whose eating habits you don't know.
I should of said odds are. Considering I don't eat until I'm dizzy many mornings and often skip lunch or dinner wouldn't you agree?

I love fluffles! :fluffle:

I just really hate puppies...*drowns a puppy*
Oh... perhaps you'd like to hear about my puppy-based atomic weapon model? It consists of an implosion device from an atomic bomb using live puppies spray painted green to represent uranium. It's rather fun to watch. ;) (I'm probably on the CIA/ASPCA's watchlist now :p)

It's not racist from the point of view that fat people aren't a race in themselves. That said I don't agree with the view point that that makes assault or verbal abuse of these people right. However I really dislike seeing fat people trying to prettend they're not fat or trying to fool themselves into thinking that it's alright to be fat. It's not. They increase their risk of contracting various conditions such as heart disease and diabetes, as well as being an eyesore. Finally, most of the fat people I've met have serious issues which they feel justified on taking out on other people.

(In short: Violence/abuse is bad but so is obesity.)

no if i wanted to i would be using punctuation, but i see no point to it as it means nothing.

Well maybe this classic example will help show you the usefulness of punctuation:


"Every good dog know it[']s master."

The ['] makes all the difference to the meaning of the sentence.

NO!!! its not "fattism" or discrimination, fat people are fat because they overeat and dont exercise, i know this as i used to be one at 24-25 stone.

It really p***es me off when fat people say dieting does'nt work for them because they only lost 1 pound in a week, WELCOME TO DIETING, a pound off is a pound off.They expect to lose half a stone in 1 week,which for some it happens for others it doesn't its the way it is, the amount you lose fluctuates...........BAH, i'v had my rant.

Is insulting and/or attacking someone just because their fat a form a racism or "fattism"?

Being purely picky about words - fat is not a racial group.

It's not racist from the point of view that fat people aren't a race in themselves. That said I don't agree with the view point that that makes assault or verbal abuse of these people right. However I really dislike seeing fat people trying to prettend they're not fat or trying to fool themselves into thinking that it's alright to be fat. It's not. They increase their risk of contracting various conditions such as heart disease and diabetes, as well as being an eyesore. Finally, most of the fat people I've met have serious issues which they feel justified on taking out on other people.
In a nation without socialized healthcare where I can't afford insurance how exactly does this affect you? We're all going to die, it's only a matter of when. :mad: :upyours: [/Rant]

I should of said odds are. Considering I don't eat until I'm dizzy many mornings and often skip lunch or dinner wouldn't you agree?

Well there's your problem, eating only once or twice a day is the best way to gain weight. You should spread the same amount of calories over 4 or 5 smaller meals throughout the day.

Well there's your problem, eating only once or twice a day is the best way to gain weight. You should spread the same amount of calories over 4 or 5 smaller meals throughout the day.

Yep, thats what bodybuilders do, speeds up motabolism so they dont gain weight via fat.

What about the race to become the world's fattest man? Would that count?
Heh, very funny.

Well there's your problem, eating only once or twice a day is the best way to gain weight. You should spread the same amount of calories over 4 or 5 smaller meals throughout the day.
I'd rather keep the weight then take that many breaks in my day. I don't really care about my health. Even if I get a disease, just less time existing.

Nobody forces people to be fat, They are risking their own health, and in countries like England they are a deliberate strain on the NHS like smokers.

I've no problem with people that are bit plump, but if we are talking about a serious weight problem, then yes, I think it is an issue, and people should be criticised for it.

If we don't, then we give the impression that it is little more than a harmless lifestyle choice and to compare it to someones ethnicity is patently absurd.

At the very least we should be taxing fast foods to cover for the strain they are putting on the health service, and we should properly educate children so that they know it isn't simply an acceptable lifestyle choice, but a dangerous, irresponsible, and unhealthy way to live

It's not racist from the point of view that fat people aren't a race in themselves. That said I don't agree with the view point that that makes assault or verbal abuse of these people right. However I really dislike seeing fat people trying to prettend they're not fat or trying to fool themselves into thinking that it's alright to be fat. It's not. They increase their risk of contracting various conditions such as heart disease and diabetes, as well as being an eyesore. Finally, most of the fat people I've met have serious issues which they feel justified on taking out on other people.

(In short: Violence/abuse is bad but so is obesity.)


its not alright to be fat? so you have to be anorexic? not everyone has that option, i bet atleast one person in your family was fat or is fat,

the only way to stop yourself from getting fat is surgery, if you dont do that its up to your genes not you

I also have serious issues with fat people getting the same luggage allowance as me on planes... and paying the same airport tax.

Weighing in at a poxy 9 stone i'm much less of a strain on the planes fuel supply. I should be allowed more luggage than them!

At the very least we should be taxing fast foods to cover for the strain they are putting on the health service, and we should properly educate children so that they know it isn't simply an acceptable lifestyle choice, but a dangerous, irresponsible, and unhealthy way to live
Doesn't sales tax cover food? :p

I also have serious issues with fat people getting the same luggage allowance as me on planes... and paying the same airport tax.

Weighing in at a poxy 9 stone i'm much less of a strain on the planes fuel supply. I should be allowed more luggage than them!
Right, because a few extra pounds is SO much closer to the SEVERAL TONS the plane weighs.:rolleyes:

We have luggage allowances because of the planes weight restrictions, logically people that weigh significantly less should be allowed more -

But before I get drawn into a debate, that post was actually a joke

We have luggage allowances because of the planes weight restrictions, logically people that weigh significantly less should be allowed more -

But before I get drawn into a debate, that post was actually a joke

and airlines here make people with a few extra pounds buy 2 seats

Doesn't sales tax cover food? :p

Nope, I'm talking about specific types of food that lead to an extra strain on our health system.
Just like smokers put an extra strain on it, so have to pay extra tax on tabaccco that goes to the NHS

It's not racism, since it's not a racial property. It expands to all people of different cultures.

and airlines here make people with a few extra pounds buy 2 seats

I think the trouble is with defining the word "fat".

In america it seems to mean anyone above a size 12.
In England "fat" means someone with a weight problem.

Anyway I don't know much about airlines, the only places I'd want to fly to would be Canada (Friends up there) or Japan (Just want to go) and I have the money for neither.

what is a weight problem in england? a woman being 249 pounds?

Nope, I'm talking about specific types of food that lead to an extra strain on our health system.
Just like smokers put an extra strain on it, so have to pay extra tax on tabaccco that goes to the NHS
Well then that's none of my business, my nation doesn't have such a system and I wouldn't change it for the world.


I think the trouble is with defining the word "fat".

In america it seems to mean anyone above a size 12.
In England "fat" means someone with a weight problem.
Define weight problem. *opens metric-US conversion calc in another tab*

Right, because a few extra pounds is SO much closer to the SEVERAL TONS the plane weighs.:rolleyes:
You have no idea...

what is a weight problem in england? a woman being 249 pounds?

I don't know pounds. We weigh people in stone.

A weight problem would naturally vary, everyone has different sizes that are healthy for them. I'm talking about someone who eats to ecess and is way above their recomended weight, as in, it poses a health risk

In a nation without socialized healthcare where I can't afford insurance how exactly does this affect you? We're all going to die, it's only a matter of when.

Ok, here's a tip: try taking in some of my post and try to understand what i just said. At no point did I ever claim it affected me and at no point did I imply that everyone should shut up and accept my view, so why do you feel so threatened by my exercising my right to an opinion?

I don't agree with the view point that that makes assault or verbal abuse of these people right

I'm one of these reasonable people who just lets others get on with their lives. I don't walk past people and snigger at their appearance or pass comment on their race/weight/gendre/height/etc. I try to be pleasant to everyone irespective of who they are.

I really dislike seeing fat people trying to prettend they're not fat or trying to fool themselves into thinking that it's alright to be fat.

I don't enjoy seeing flab hanging out all over the place just like I don't particularly enjoy seeing someone with a face so filled with botox that it's devoid of all expression. All I said was that I don't agree with the way many overweight people have this view that it's just the way they are. In a minority of cases this is true but for most it's a case of bad lifestyle.

They increase their risk of contracting various conditions such as heart disease and diabetes.

They do and although this has little effect on other people in countries like the US, where Healthcare isn't paid for by the government, I still feel saddened when people feel so little regard for their own lives that they're prepaired to risk their health just so that they can satisfy their desire to eat foods that are high in salt or sugar. Being a christian I'm encouraged to regard all life as being worthy of dignity and respect, neither of which are apparent when I see some guy, with a gut the size of a small planet, wheezing and out of breath after walking a hundred yards.

Finally, most of the fat people I've met have serious issues which they feel justified on taking out on other people.

Perhaps this is derived from the fact that they have been heaped with verbal abuse over the years or perhaps its just ingrown insecurity on their part but I don't appreciate being on the recieving end. This is especially true in light of the fact that I try treat everybody as I would like to be treated.

So before you go on a rant pal, consider the fact that I never made any insults in my post, I pointed out that I was against so called "Fattism" and that I only gave my opinion on the matter. The fact that you needed to make a rude gesture instead of arguing your point logically says it all...

I don't know pounds. We weigh people in stone.

A weight problem would naturally vary, everyone has different sizes that are healthy for them. I'm talking about someone who eats to ecess and is way above their recomended weight, as in, it poses a health risk


249.000 pound [lb] equivalent to: 17.78571 stone


so is that fat in england?

When someone, who is otherwise healthy, allows themselves to become so obese that they require handicap parking and disability payments, I really do think they deserve any verbal abuse they get.

249.000 pound [lb] equivalent to: 17.78571 stone


so is that fat in england?

It depends on the persons size and build, but for a female between 5 and 6 foot, yes I would call that fat.
Most adult rugby playing males of my age do not weigh in much different to that. And they are big lads

It is of course variable though,

Many of the girls at my judo club weigh in quite heavy, and yet are perfectly healthy for their size and build, and are fit enough to lift your average person up and throw them

its not alright to be fat? so you have to be anorexic? not everyone has that option, i bet atleast one person in your family was fat or is fat,

the only way to stop yourself from getting fat is surgery, if you dont do that its up to your genes not you

You know there is a middle ground mate. You don't need to be either fat or thin, you can be normal (Lean if you want to give it a fancy name). What Anorexia is has become a misconsception these days. IF you're anorexic you are so thin it becomes a serious strain on your health in the same sense that obesity is. Additionally Anorexia is a recognised mental condition but I won't get into that.

Oh and yes there are one or two fat people in my family and I don't approve of their lifestyle. However I must point out that those of them that are do try to cut down on their over-eating and try to exercise. Some of them weren't always overweight and I think that goes to prove the point that getting fat isn't nature taking its course but people letting themselves go.

Ok, here's a tip: try taking in some of my post and try to understand what i just said. At no point did I ever claim it affected me and at no point did I imply that everyone should shut up and accept my view, so why do you feel so threatened by my exercising my right to an opinion?
If it doesn't affect you I can't understand why you care? I don't feel threatened by you expressing anything, I just don't like being blamed for something that I don't believe is wrong.

They do and although this has little effect on other people in countries like the US, where Healthcare isn't paid for by the government, I still feel saddened when people feel so little regard for their own lives that they're prepaired to risk their health just so that they can satisfy their desire to eat foods that are high in salt or sugar. Being a christian I'm encouraged to regard all life as being worthy of dignity and respect, neither of which are apparent when I see some guy, with a gut the size of a small planet, wheezing and out of breath after walking a hundred yards.
So you'd rather we kill ourselves without feeling good while we're doing it? Personally I don't respect my life. If I didn't believe in God I'd kill myself for blissful oblivion but sadly he/she/it doesn't condone that. For whatever reason I, along with every other human was put on this earth and sentenced to suffer a horrible ordeal lasting in most cases many years. Is the thought of a momentary escape that repugnant?

It depends on the persons size and build, but for a female between 5 and 6 foot, yes I would call that fat.
Most adult rugby playing males of my age do not weigh in much different to that. And they are big lads

but what if you cant help that, with problems from birth ect

i havent seen many women that was over 6 feet, so for that size u have to be 7 foot?

You know there is a middle ground mate. You don't need to be either fat or thin, you can be normal (Lean if you want to give it a fancy name). What Anorexia is has become a misconsception these days. IF you're anorexic you are so thin it becomes a serious strain on your health in the same sense that obesity is. Additionally Anorexia is a recognised mental condition but I won't get into that.
Isn't the average american overweight? Making it in fact normal? (I have no Idea I'm asking here)

but what if you cant help that, with problems from birth ect

Then it isn't your fault is it.


But a lot of people claim it is their genes when in fact it isn't. It seems very popular in the states to claim that fat is because of genes, but if that were really true every country in the world would have an obesity rate to match America. The fact is, no one does, and England is heading the same way.
When some 40% of your nation is overweight, it isn't down to genes. It's down to large burgers

i havent seen many women that was over 6 feet, so for that size u have to be 7 foot?

I gave you a personal estimate. I'm not a doctor.
But yes, I think on the whole over 17 stone is not a healthy weight for a woman, this is not a medical opinion, and as I have stated, it is not a hard and fast rule. There are of course exceptions

really i see noone as fat unless you need to lose weight for your health

249.000 pound [lb] equivalent to: 17.78571 stone


so is that fat in england?


Fuck yeah, unless your over 6 feet I guess.

If it doesn't affect you I can't understand why you care? I don't feel threatened by you expressing anything, I just don't like being blamed for something that I don't believe is wrong.

Well fine then, that's your opinion and I respect that even though I disagree. All I'm asking is that in future you don't give the finger for expressing mine. Oh and I don't feel depressed by life. I enjoy it even though it gets tough sometimes.

(To answer your question, yes it's something like two out of three American's is over-weight.)

really i see noone as fat unless you need to lose weight for your health


I would agree

really i see noone as fat unless you need to lose weight for your health
So, you give every person you meeet a physical to assure that they need to lose weight before calling them fat?

Well fine then, that's your opinion and I respect that even though I disagree. All I'm asking is that in future you don't give the finger for expressing mine. Oh and I don't feel depressed by life. I enjoy it even though it gets tough sometimes.
Oh the finger? That was aimed at the world, it's 7:40AM here don't expect me to be too clear/happy. It had nothing to do with you. :)

ok its not racism as some people have voted in this, but it is discrimination so maybe they should ask that question, no i am not fat but my mother is but thats because of diabetes but either way i dont look at her any different

Then it isn't your fault is it.


But a lot of people claim it is their genes when in fact it isn't. It seems very popular in the states to claim that fat is because of genes, but if that were really true every country in the world would have an obesity rate to match America. The fact is, no one does, and England is heading the same way.
When some 40% of your nation is overweight, it isn't down to genes. It's down to large burgers

One could argue that it is in fact down to genes. Every animal on this plante is programmed to store as much fat and to lose as little energy as possible. It's a way to ensure survival.

Nature hasn't changed, but our environment has. Energy conservation and fat storage are no longer vitally needed, on the contrary. We live in a society where food (especially bad food) is readily available and physical exercise is almost completely avoidable. So, if we keep following our natural program, we'll end up obese.

Oh the finger? That was aimed at the world, it's 7:40AM here don't expect me to be too clear/happy. It had nothing to do with you. :)
Well ok I quoted you but I was giving the finger to other... it's late I can't explain things right. I'm sorry if I offended you.

So, you give every person you meeet a physical to assure that they need to lose weight before calling them fat?

well its not really hard to tell, just look at them, how they act when they walk if they struggle wouldnt that mean they need help? if they are fine with there weight what does it matter

Well ok I quoted you but I was giving the finger to other... it's late I can't explain things right. I'm sorry if I offended you.

Don't worry, we're cool.:cool:

Don't worry, we're cool.:cool:
Just wanted to be sure, I think I'm going to bed. Night.

Is insulting and/or attacking someone just because their fat a form a racism or "fattism"?
Attacking or insulting somebody for being fat isn't racism, it's just pathetic. I mean, really, is that the best you can come up with? "Eeew, fat, icky poo! You're a fatty fatty fat-fat!" Weak, man, really weak. You gotta come up with better material.

Of course not! A fat white person and a fat black person are both... fat. And fat people, that is, people fat enough that you actually can't help thinking "s/he's fat", not the mildly overweight, tend to be either amusing or pathetic. Probably I shouldn't think that way though.

I mean, no, you shouldn't make fun of them, but it's hard not to feel at least mildly superior to someone who was that... stupid. Because usually, you know, it's their own fault. People with actually medical disorders are different... I dunno.

Now, actually saying/doing something to insult a fat person... I guess that would be kinda on the same level as racism, as far as having no respect for the dignity of a person.

Blanket assumptions that someone is big because of food is ridiculous, and anyone who automatically thinks so is an idiot... for example, in my family there is a high rate of metabolic disorders, most of the members of my family take medication for them but they are still quite big. They dont eat any more then anyone else but people make automatic judgements based on what they look like so it tends to piss me off.

One could argue that it is in fact down to genes. Every animal on this plante is programmed to store as much fat and to lose as little energy as possible. It's a way to ensure survival.

Nature hasn't changed, but our environment has. Energy conservation and fat storage are no longer vitally needed, on the contrary. We live in a society where food (especially bad food) is readily available and physical exercise is almost completely avoidable. So, if we keep following our natural program, we'll end up obese.
well said

One could argue that it is in fact down to genes. Every animal on this plante is programmed to store as much fat and to lose as little energy as possible. It's a way to ensure survival.

Nature hasn't changed, but our environment has. Energy conservation and fat storage are no longer vitally needed, on the contrary. We live in a society where food (especially bad food) is readily available and physical exercise is almost completely avoidable. So, if we keep following our natural program, we'll end up obese.
What I find funny is that our definition of "fat" is currently pretty much unrelated to health. For instance, women are supposed to have more body fat than men, yet women who weigh exactly what they are supposed to are considered "fat" in our society, while men who are as much as 50 pounds overweight are not considered "fat." Women are told that "healthy" means having a body type with less than 20% body fat, even though this body type is actually profoundly unhealthy for them.

We also use very silly markers for when to consider somebody "overweight." The prime example is the "ideal BMI" numbers that are given out, supposedly to tell us all what our healthy weight range is. For women, the number is around 25, even though women with BMIs of closer to 35 have longer life expectancies. When, pray tell, did it become "unhealthy" to live longer?

When, pray tell, did it become "unhealthy" to live longer?
It's unhealthy for pension schemes...

Soylent Green is made from soya and lentils, hence the name.
Read the book! That would be "Make Room! Make Room!" by Harry Harrison, by the way.

*GrumbleSoylentGreenIsn'tPeopleGrumble*

You clearly didn't watch the movie.

It's unhealthy for pension schemes...
Heh, that's pretty much the lines I'm thinking along. "Health" used to refer to the well-being of one's own body, but now the "health" industry is about the health of investment portfolios. Women who like their bodies don't buy as much crazy snake oil, much like how men who aren't panicking over the size of their penis will usually not be willing to spring for $500 bottles of "Miracle Enhancement Vitamins."

"Healthy" now means "as artificial as you can possibly get." "Natural" means "use the same amount of artificial crap, just buy the products that have soy or ginger root extract in them." It's like Dove's campaign that is supposedly about natural beauty...they've got a commercial running right now that's all about how "a woman's glow is a beautiful thing," and therefore women need to buy their lotion with little flecks of glitter in it so that they will glow.

You clearly didn't watch the movie.
No, I haven't, although I will next time I notice it on. Apparently Harry Harrison was quite unhappy with the cannibalism thing; it wasn't in the book at all. The book's a detective story with lots of population-control, contraceptives-are-good stuff in it.

@Bottle: The amount of stuff that women seem expected to do to themselves seems very strange to me... Clean is good, I understand that. Shaving has advantages, although it's hardly necessary. Both of those hold for males too. but make-up? Why paint your eyelids blue, or risk sticking a brush in your eye?

Of course not! A fat white person and a fat black person are both... fat. And fat people, that is, people fat enough that you actually can't help thinking "s/he's fat", not the mildly overweight, tend to be either amusing or pathetic. Probably I shouldn't think that way though.

I mean, no, you shouldn't make fun of them, but it's hard not to feel at least mildly superior to someone who was that... stupid. Because usually, you know, it's their own fault. People with actually medical disorders are different... I dunno.

Now, actually saying/doing something to insult a fat person... I guess that would be kinda on the same level as racism, as far as having no respect for the dignity of a person.

Ok, let me quote myself as an example (again) : I'm fat. Definitely. Not fat as in "can't move any more or has difficulties climbing stairs", but obviously far nonetheless.

Yes, I did get fat by eating. I did overeat dramatically in my early teens. Why? A reaction to immense emotional stress and abuse, the same reason why I tried to commit suicide back then.
I'm in my early 30s now, and still carry that weight around, despite the fact that I eat quite normal now. To lose weight you have to eat less than normal. and to lose large amounts of weight (as in, more than 20 kilos), you have to continue eating a fraction of what would be normal for the rest of your life.
Your body percieves a diet as a period of low food supply, a period of starvation. Once that is over, it will store even more fat than before, to be prepared for the next period of starvation. Worked brilliantly for our ancestors, doesn't work so well now any more.

And I'm not going to starve myself for the rest of my life to adjust to your idea of how a clever person would look. Consider me stupid if you like, but that's at your own risk.

@Bottle: The amount of stuff that women seem expected to do to themselves seems very strange to me... Clean is good, I understand that. Shaving has advantages, although it's hardly necessary. Both of those hold for males too. but make-up? Why paint your eyelids blue, or risk sticking a brush in your eye?

*lol
That's what you do if nobody has taught you how to apply make-up. make-up should be seen, but not noticed ;)

Problem. I'm overweight (slightly), but my BMI has been the same for about three years. In other words, the number of calories I consume is approximately equal to the number I use. So do you still believe I should be diverting part of what we could call my food budget to charity?

What you need to do is some serious fasting.
As in: getting your intake below your consumption.
Just do it.

What you need to do is some serious fasting.
As in: getting your intake below your consumption.
Just do it.

Oh yes, and don't forget that once you start that, don't EVER stop that and go back to normal eating, because if you do, you'll soon have all that weight back on, with some additional kilos in the bargain.

@Bottle: The amount of stuff that women seem expected to do to themselves seems very strange to me... Clean is good, I understand that. Shaving has advantages, although it's hardly necessary. Both of those hold for males too. but make-up? Why paint your eyelids blue, or risk sticking a brush in your eye?
Here's the one that I've NEVER understood:

There's long been this idea that "real men don't cry." Yet women are the ones who are supposed to wear mascara. If we're going to have some bullshit rule where only one gender is allowed to cry, shouldn't we at least pick the gender that isn't expected to spend 45 minutes painting their eyelashes?

Oh yes, and don't forget that once you start that, don't EVER stop that and go back to normal eating, because if you do, you'll soon have all that weight back on, with some additional kilos in the bargain.

He can stop when his BMI is below 27 or summat.
Easy as ABC.
Check it out that your nearest NHS-center.

He can stop when his BMI is below 27 or summat.
Easy as ABC.

No, he cannot stop, because as soon as he stops his BMI will return to what it was originally.

Also, fasting in order to go down to a BMI of 27 will reduce his life expectancy. Why would he want to go to all that work and trouble, just to die younger?

Here's the one that I've NEVER understood:

There's long been this idea that "real men don't cry." Yet women are the ones who are supposed to wear mascara. If we're going to have some bullshit rule where only one gender is allowed to cry, shouldn't we at least pick the gender that isn't expected to spend 45 minutes painting their eyelashes?

Hehe I'd like to know where you got this rule, coz in my family real men do indeed cry, ohh and drink beer!

No, he cannot stop, because as soon as he stops his BMI will return to what it was originally.

BS. Excuses and excuses. And Denial is a river in Egypt.

Also, fasting in order to go down to a BMI of 27 will reduce his life expectancy. Why would he want to go to all that work and trouble, just to die younger?


*sings*
Just follow the NHS instructions.

Which part of just following approved Government recomendations is too tough for you?

Hehe I'd like to know where you got this rule, coz in my family real men do indeed cry, ohh and drink beer!
Hey, it's not my rule. It just seems to be one of those rules that "They" put in place, but nobody seems to know who "They" is. I just know that virtually every guy I've met admits to feeling like he's not "supposed" to cry.

Yet gay men, who seem to be more comfortable with the idea of applying eye makeup, tend to also be more comfortable with the idea of crying.

Crazy world.

*sings*
Just follow the NHS instructions.

Which part of just following approved Government recomendations is too tough for you?
Um, the part where the government recommendations have been instituted over the objections of doctors and researchers, who have conclusively shown that many of these recommendations are not consistent with improved health.

If the government recommended that you eat elephant feces twice a day, you'd just run right out and chow down, wouldn't you?

He can stop when his BMI is below 27 or summat.
Easy as ABC.
Check it out that your nearest NHS-center.

No such thing in Ireland. And no, you can't stop just like that. Your body won't let you do that. We are not talking about the odd one or two kilos going up or down, but changing your body permanently. Bodies fight weight loss, they're programmed to do that. Talk to someone who tried it.... and succeeded for more than 2 years.

BS. Excuses and excuses. And Denial is a river in Egypt.

Um, no, it's just medical reality. If you fast in order to lose weight, and then stop fasting, your weight will not remain at its low point. "Denial" would be believing that you can stop fasting and still have the body of a person who is fasting.

No such thing in Ireland. And no, you can't stop just like that. Your body won't let you do that. We are not talking about the odd one or two kilos going up or down, but changing your body permanently. Bodies fight weight loss, they're programmed to do that. Talk to someone who tried it.... and succeeded for more than 2 years.

How much for a bus from Dublin to Derry?

I don't buy that negative theory.
Lost some 12 kilos in the early nineties - they never came back.

The rather healthy outdoors life that Military service 'inflicts' does help just fine.

Um, no, it's just medical reality. If you fast in order to lose weight, and then stop fasting, your weight will not remain at its low point. "Denial" would be believing that you can stop fasting and still have the body of a person who is fasting.


Have you tried daily pushups?

Have you tried daily pushups?
That's not what you said. You said he could "stop" when he reached a BMI of 27. Obviously you didn't mean that, because you know as well as anybody that he couldn't "stop." He would have to continue to take action to maintain that weight level.

EDIT: Also, pushups aren't really a productive way to lose weight, nor are they the best way to maintain a weight loss. Aerobic exercise is much faster and more effective, with resistance training as a close second. Pushups are mostly just to impress the kind of girls who think pushups are impressive.

Have you tried daily pushups?

You are starting to contradict yourself again, honey.
You were just saying that all it takes is some fasting over a short period of time, and then he could go back to a normal lifestyle, with no need to continue fasting or excessive exercise...

You are starting to contradict yourself again, honey.
You were just saying that all it takes is some fasting over a short period of time, and then he could go back to a normal lifestyle, with no need to continue fasting or excessive exercise...
It's just so damn funny:

"You there, fat person! You need to engage in a starvation regime in order to force your body to fit my standards of beauty! So what if this is an unhealthy and medically-unsound practice? The GOVERNMENT says it's okay! And the government has never been wrong about health recommendations before! It'll be easy: just stop eating! There, was that so hard?"

That's not what you said. You said he could "stop" when he reached a BMI of 27. Obviously you didn't mean that, because you know as well as anybody that he couldn't "stop." He would have to continue to take action to maintain that weight level.

EDIT: Also, pushups aren't really a productive way to lose weight, nor are they the best way to maintain a weight loss. Aerobic exercise is much faster and more effective, with resistance training as a close second. Pushups are mostly just to impress the kind of girls who think pushups are impressive.

Whatever.
All he has to do is merely follow the NHS instructions.
Strike that.
Better to classify 'em as Government Orders.

Whatever.
All he has to do is merely follow the NHS instructions.
Strike that.
Better to classify 'em as Government Orders.

As a German, I'd advise him to be more than just a little sceptical about government orders

It takes time and some discipline to stay at a normal weight if your body and habits have led you to a higher than normal weight.

You need to eat a low calorie, balanced diet, and you need to do A LOT of aerobic exercise. Running, swimming, hiking with a pack, etc.

I swim 3km per week, and run 3 to 5 miles every morning. And I still have to watch what I eat, or I'll easily go over 90 kilos (198 pounds), which I've established as my upper limit.

I'm at around 12 percent body fat, which I think is a good place to be.

For 45 years of age, I'm not doing too badly. But it's more work than most people think.

You are starting to contradict yourself again, honey.
You were just saying that all it takes is some fasting over a short period of time, and then he could go back to a normal lifestyle, with no need to continue fasting or excessive exercise...

Bulldust.

Which part of sober, serious, alcohol-free, zero-redmeat life style is hard to understand?

Nobody forced you to enter some fast food joint, and no excuses.

Whatever.
All he has to do is merely follow the NHS instructions.
Strike that.
Better to classify 'em as Government Orders.
Sure. You just keep telling yourself that.

It amazes me how clueless some people are about this stuff. First of all, they assume that all fat people are total morons, and that all fat people have been living in caves for the last 10 years. Do you really think there's a fat person in America who hasn't been told to eat less and exercise more? Do you really think there's a person who has tried losing weight, but who hasn't ever tried reducing calorie intake and increasing activity level?

More importantly, do you really think that the TRILLION DOLLAR WEIGHT-LOSS INDUSTRY has not focused on this? Do you really think nobody has bothered to research this stuff? Do you really think that, if this shit actually worked for everybody, there is simply no company who's chosen to market it? Gimme a break.

As a German, I'd advise him to be more than just a little sceptical about government orders

As a Briton, I'd advise him to never ever listen to a German in the first place.


So who do you think you are kidding Mr Klinsmann
if you think Old England's done.

As a Briton, I'd advise him to never ever listen to a German in the first place.

Hehe, dammit, I fell for it again...I have to remember to turn on my Parody Detector(tm).

Hehe, dammit, I fell for it again...I have to remember to turn on my Parody Detector(tm).

*fluffles Bottle*
I'm as sarcastic as you.

But seriously, Heron-whatshisname ought to stop bemoaning that folks dislike him for his excessive bodyweight - and just deal with it.

I dunno, I eat my sandwich for lunch and two pages turn up...
Yet gay men, who seem to be more comfortable with the idea of applying eye makeup, tend to also be more comfortable with the idea of crying.
Probably 'cos they're poking themselves in the eye with the brush. That'd make anyone cry. Mascara: Just Say No.

I'm about 30kg lighter than I was in 1999, when I went to university. Why? Because before I went I ate too much and did almost no exercise. At university I couldn't afford to eat rubbish, so my diet improved, and I couldn't drive (London; no parking) or afford public transport. So I walked. Not far, only three miles or so a day. That's all it took. later I moved out a bit further, so I was cycling 10 miles or so a day. At my lightest (about 8kg lighter than I am now) I was cycling 19 miles a day, and I lost weight no matter what I was eating.
I maintain my weight (about 90kg. I'm 6'2") by eating fairly healthy stuff (mostly vegetables... They're cheaper and quicker to cook than meat ;) ) and walking to work, which is actually quite pleasant. Two miles each way.

Losing weight's really not so hard, if you want to. If I went back to driving everywhere and eating too much, of course I'd put it all back on... But that's obvious. That's why I gained it in the first place. The reason all those diet fads are a multi-trillion dollar industry is because they don't work; people keep going back for more.

I dunno, I eat my sandwich for lunch and two pages turn up...

Probably 'cos they're poking themselves in the eye with the brush. That'd make anyone cry. Mascara: Just Say No.

Or eyelash curlers. Have you seen those things?! Shudder.


I'm about 30kg lighter than I was in 1999, when I went to university. Why? Because before I went I ate too much and did almost no exercise. At university I couldn't afford to eat rubbish, so my diet improved, and I couldn't drive (London; no parking) or afford public transport. So I walked. Not far, only three miles or so a day. That's all it took. later I moved out a bit further, so I was cycling 10 miles or so a day. At my lightest (about 8kg lighter than I am now) I was cycling 19 miles a day, and I lost weight no matter what I was eating.
I maintain my weight (about 90kg. I'm 6'2") by eating fairly healthy stuff (mostly vegetables... They're cheaper and quicker to cook than meat ;) ) and walking to work, which is actually quite pleasant. Two miles each way.

Losing weight's really not so hard, if you want to. If I went back to driving everywhere and eating too much, of course I'd put it all back on... But that's obvious. That's why I gained it in the first place. The reason all those diet fads are a multi-trillion dollar industry is because they don't work; people keep going back for more.
Here's the thing.

I also found myself overweight at one point, and I knew it was due entirely to some lousy choices I had been making. I had been eating spaghetti for 2 meals a day, and my "exercise" consisted of walking 2 blocks over to my office.

I made some simple diet adjustments (I actually did not reduce calorie intake at all, just changed what kinds of foods I was eating) and made sure to get 20 minutes of aerobic exercise a day, and the problem is pretty much solved for me.

So yeah, changing diet and exercise can absolutely help some people lose weight or get into better shape.

However.

Plenty of people are actually in good shape already, they're just not skinny. It's stupid to tell people that they have to lose weight just because their body doesn't fit the outline you have in mind. It's even stupider to pick a number on a scale or a BMI score and use that as your benchmark. Keep in mind that most professional atheletes have "overweight" BMIs.

Also, diet and exercise changes can certainly help just about anybody improve their health, if they make the right changes. But being healthier doesn't necessarily mean getting skinnier. Some people simply have different set-points than others, and a healthy diet and exercise routine will still leave them at a higher BMI than the "average" person. Using thinness to measure health is a rotten idea.

Finally, there are people for whom no diet or exercise program is going to "fix" their weight. Just because it works for you doesn't mean it will work for everybody. It is really cruel to tell people that "losing weight isn't hard," when what you really mean is that YOU don't have much trouble losing weight. You imply that weight loss is easy, and therefore they are stupid or weak or failures for not being able to do something so simple. The reality is far more complicated.

I've never seen a fat Ethiopian.
So, the thing can be done.

Excuse major snipping, but databases need to watch their weight too.
Also, diet and exercise changes can certainly help just about anybody improve their health, if they make the right changes. But being healthier doesn't necessarily mean getting skinnier. Some people simply have different set-points than others, and a healthy diet and exercise routine will still leave them at a higher BMI than the "average" person. Using thinness to measure health is a rotten idea.

Agreed, it also depend on other things; you've already mentioned that women have more fat built in as standard, plus there's muscle, so on, so forth. I've often pointed out the silliness of girls I know going on diets "because they're under pressure to be thin" despite them being perfectly healthy as they are.
Someone with a BMI of 20 who is out of breath after walking a mile is just as unhealthy as someone with a BMI of 30 who's out of breath after a mile, and much less healthy than someone with a BMI of 35 who, after a mile, is just getting warmed up...

Finally, there are people for whom no diet or exercise program is going to "fix" their weight. Just because it works for you doesn't mean it will work for everybody. It is really cruel to tell people that "losing weight isn't hard," when what you really mean is that YOU don't have much trouble losing weight. You imply that weight loss is easy, and therefore they are stupid or weak or failures for not being able to do something so simple. The reality is far more complicated.
That's a fair point, and I was probably a bit harsh there. There are diseases and medications that cause weight gain, genetics, etc.
But, in most cases, people being overweight is caused by their own actions, and only their own actions can change this (if they wish to do so; their call, of course). And most (if not all) of those silly diet fads are just to keep you spending money, so it's no wonder people who've tried a few and achieved nothing will assume losing weight is impossible...

But seriously, Heron-whatshisname ought to stop bemoaning that folks dislike him for his excessive bodyweight - and just deal with it.

Actually, all I was doing (or at least, all I inteneded to do) was to point out that the assertion that all fat people consume more calories than they use is wrong, and therefore that any subsequent assertion that we should reduce our calorie intake to balance what we use and give the money saved to charity is also wrong. Frankly, I don't care what any of you think about my weight (on a personal level) because none of you have any idea what I look like, or know how much I actually weigh (as was demonstrated by the earlier post that I should stop losing weight when my BMI passes under 27. My BMI is already under 27)

Actually, all I was doing (or at least, all I inteneded to do) was to point out that the assertion that all fat people consume more calories than they use is wrong, and therefore that any subsequent assertion that we should reduce our calorie intake to balance what we use and give the money saved to charity is also wrong. Frankly, I don't care what any of you think about my weight (on a personal level) because none of you have any idea what I look like, or know how much I actually weigh (as was demonstrated by the earlier post that I should stop losing weight when my BMI passes under 27. My BMI is already under 27)

Why then, stop moaning!

It's not racism, since it's not a racial property. It expands to all people of different cultures.


Snort!

what is a weight problem in england? a woman being 249 pounds?


I don't know. Wouldn't that mean you were purchasing her? They use pounds for money and stones for weight.

I don't know. Wouldn't that mean you were purchasing her? They use pounds for money and stones for weight.
That's their own fault.

Agreed, it also depend on other things; you've already mentioned that women have more fat built in as standard, plus there's muscle, so on, so forth. I've often pointed out the silliness of girls I know going on diets "because they're under pressure to be thin" despite them being perfectly healthy as they are.
Someone with a BMI of 20 who is out of breath after walking a mile is just as unhealthy as someone with a BMI of 30 who's out of breath after a mile, and much less healthy than someone with a BMI of 35 who, after a mile, is just getting warmed up...

Indeed! I've got a "big boned" friend who runs marathons, yet if people see the two of us together they usually assume that I am "healthier" than she is. She's in MUCH better shape, it's just that her shape doesn't conform to their image of what a healthy person must look like.


That's a fair point, and I was probably a bit harsh there. There are diseases and medications that cause weight gain, genetics, etc.
But, in most cases, people being overweight is caused by their own actions, and only their own actions can change this (if they wish to do so; their call, of course). And most (if not all) of those silly diet fads are just to keep you spending money, so it's no wonder people who've tried a few and achieved nothing will assume losing weight is impossible...
Yes, there can be medical issues involved, but I was talking more about differences in people's bodies. Some people can see pretty dramatic changes in their body weight with relatively minor changes in lifestyle. But if another person made EXACTLY the same changes, they might get little or no results. This isn't because they're stupid or failing or anything like that, it's because people's bodies are different.

Think about it like medications. Most people will respond to a given medication in a way that fits within a certain range. However, there are also people who don't respond very well to that medication, or who respond a little too strongly to it. We don't tell those people to just TAKE MORE of the medication, and we certainly don't treat them like they're lazy or stupid because their body isn't responding the "right" way. So why do we automatically assume that there's a particular formula for weight loss that MUST work for all people? And, if a particular program isn't working, why do we tell fat people to just follow the same program MORE FANATICALLY?

It's wrong to be rude and discriminate against them because they are fat, but they need encouragement to lose some weight. Being fat will hurt them and they need to realize that being that way will cause some serious health issues.

Being fat is partially behavioral. I know that all too well from personal experience. I just cannot seem to shake these extra 15-20 pounds.

As such, there's nothing wrong with insulting someone fat, although, there's also nothing wrong with the fat person punching you in the face, and doing a body slam when you're on the ground.

It's discrimination, but technically it's not racism.

That's their own fault.


Good point. Why the hell are the Brits so bewildering?

Good point. Why the hell are the Brits so bewildering?
They even refuse to adopt the European standards.

"I can't stop eating! I eat because I'm unhappy and I'm unhappy because I eat." - Fat Bastard

Fattism - i went to the doctors the other day and he told me i was Obese i didnt mind i just hit him. Now when you say OBESE that means WOOOOO hes like a melon in a melon stand in melon lane!

but im 6ft2in
17stone i am. but when you look at me im actually more of a 14stone built up muscle guy lol but my body mass index was 32 so i was really Statistically Obese.

which for a 20year old is worrying but ....not really. Doctors should be shot. :sniper:

:mp5: :gundge: and that i stop eating and drinking such Fatty Salty foods hehehe :eek: MORE EXCERSISE as in more watching TV and Posting on Stupid Forums lol......