NationStates Jolt Archive

VANCOUVER (CP) - British Columbia teachers voted 85.2 per cent Friday in favour of going on strike in the fall if they are unable to negotiate a new contract with school employers.

The strike vote was taken amid contract talks that have been hung up over wage demands.

More than 30,000 teachers voted.

The B.C. Teachers Federation has been seeking a 24 per cent wage increase over four years, while the Public School Employers Association has been offering eight per cent over four years.

Teachers say that's not enough to keep their wages competitive with what their counterparts earn in Ontario and Alberta.

Federation president Jenny Sims says the vote sends a strong message to the government that teachers want a significant wage increase.

The two sides have been working toward a June 30 deadline for getting a deal in order for the 38,000 teachers to qualify for a share of bonus money offered by the provincial government.

The teachers also want improved benefits and increased professional autonomy.

The employer says the union's proposal would increase the cost of public education by $3 billion over three years.


(cont. on http://www.canada.com/topics/news/national/story.html?id=518c197e-ef92-4126-8f10-cab981af9831&k=33303)


Okay, they're unhappy. We all get the point. But how will it help students to walk out again? It's my grad year next year, and I can't afford to miss a couple months of school because the teachers have a few qualms about their salary. Given the choice between a full school year in a class of 35 or a half of a year in a class of 28, I'd pick the first option.
And it's not just students that will get hurt. The teachers are screwing themselves over. They're all complaining right now that there is only one week left to teach twelve days worth of work. Guess what? When you spend two weeks getting paid to sit on your ass, you lose much needed instruction time.

FUCK! How can they do this? Wasn't the strike this year enough? Do they really need to screw themselves over, and the students, like this again? I heard they're in negotiations this weekend. Let's hope something good comes out of this. The strike last year at least had some legitimacy to it, since the teachers wanted better classroom conditions. But now that the classroom conditions are funded, they need their damned raise again? I'm on the teacher's side in all this, but don't they think a 24% raise is a bit too much to ask, especially since our province is royally screwed thanks to the impending Olympic hosting?

:headbang:

The Olympics isnt the teachers fault and 8% over 4 years is ridiculously low.
If youve got more than 8 out of 10 teachers voting to strike then in my opinion you probably arent treating them fairly.

considering the fact that, with a 3% inflation rate, the offered raise would actually result in the teachers making less than they do currently in real terms, I'd say they are pretty justified in being pissed.

Maybe sometimes, teachers aren't thinking about the students. Maybe they're thinking more along the lines of "Can I pay rent this month" or "Can I put gas in my car to get to work this week". Sometimes, it isn't about the students.

They are working toward their own needs not against the needs of students.

They are working toward their own needs not against the needs of students.

Except that the students need to be in the classroom, learning, and by striking, teachers are taking away that basic right.

BC Teachers in Favour of Strike this Fall
Canadian spelling is so funny. You say 'favour', but then follow it up with 'fall.'

Canadian spelling is so funny. You say 'favour', but then follow it up with 'fall.'

You'd prefer Autumn? We use both.

Except that the students need to be in the classroom, learning, and by striking, teachers are taking away that basic right.
Does the student's right to an education overrite(sp?) a teacher's right to fair pay?

The teacher's in Ireland had a couple of walk out about 4 years ago. So we(the students) had a walk out as well.

Except that the students need to be in the classroom, learning, and by striking, teachers are taking away that basic right.

You can still learn on your own if that is your main problem with the potential strike. If the problem is somehow tied to getting a degree to earn money then maybe their right to earn is as important as yours is.

The strike in Quebec ended this year with the teachers accepting a really low pay raise. I forgot the exact amount. 12% over 6 years, was it? Whatever.

My senior year starts in September and should go on without a hitch. Lucky me! :D

Going on a grad Eurotrip next year (to Switzerland, Italy, and France).

Except that the students need to be in the classroom, learning, and by striking, teachers are taking away that basic right.
first of all, education is not a right, it is a privilege. You are in no way entitled to an education just by being human.
second of all, teachers DO have the right to demand higher salaries and better benefits or to find a different job. However, if the 85.2% of the teachers who voted to strike chose to find a different job , I'd say you'd be pretty screwed.
Under the current proposal, they would make LESS than they do today in terms of their purchasing power. Yes, they are making 8% more, but money is worth 12% less. That means they are losing 4% of their purchasing power. When you are already a low paid profession, particularly one with such high responsibility, that is absolutly rediculous.

You'd prefer Autumn? We use both.
lol, I'm not particually bothered either way, I know what you mean. It's just one of those small pieces of trivial that shows how much of a fusion of cultures Canada is.

first of all, education is not a right, it is a privilege. You are in no way entitled to an education just by being human.
The UN disagrees.

There are a total of thirty articles outlining people's human rights, but the most important principles declared are considered to be the following:

* The right to life, liberty and security of person.

* The right to an education.

* The right to participate fully in cultural life.

* Freedom from torture or cruel, inhumane treatment or punishment.

* Freedom of thought, conscience and religion.

* Freedom of expression and opinion.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Declaration_of_human_rights

lol, I'm not particually bothered either way, I know what you mean. It's just one of those small pieces of trivial that shows how much of a fusion of cultures Canada is.
That's what you get when the British stick around for another 84 years in a North American colony (84 years after the American Revolution).

The UN disagrees.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Declaration_of_human_rights

Is the UN preparing to send in emergency teachers then?

first of all, education is not a right, it is a privilege. You are in no way entitled to an education just by being human.
second of all, teachers DO have the right to demand higher salaries and better benefits or to find a different job. However, if the 85.2% of the teachers who voted to strike chose to find a different job , I'd say you'd be pretty screwed.
Under the current proposal, they would make LESS than they do today in terms of their purchasing power. Yes, they are making 8% more, but money is worth 12% less. That means they are losing 4% of their purchasing power. When you are already a low paid profession, particularly one with such high responsibility, that is absolutly rediculous.

Sorry, but in Canada, students have a right to an education, and teachers do not have a right to protest. It's illegal, because education has been deemed an essential service.

The UN disagrees, I believe.
the UN says that everyone has the right to an education, yes. However, there is nothing that says you have the right to a formal education in a classroom with a teacher. Education =/= only that which happens in a school building. While education is a right, a formal education is a privilege

first of all, education is not a right, it is a privilege. You are in no way entitled to an education just by being human.
second of all, teachers DO have the right to demand higher salaries and better benefits or to find a different job. However, if the 85.2% of the teachers who voted to strike chose to find a different job , I'd say you'd be pretty screwed.
Under the current proposal, they would make LESS than they do today in terms of their purchasing power. Yes, they are making 8% more, but money is worth 12% less. That means they are losing 4% of their purchasing power. When you are already a low paid profession, particularly one with such high responsibility, that is absolutly rediculous.


You are absolutely right, education is not a basic human right. Just by being human means that you do not have the right to an education, it is a privilege.
However, as a Canadian citizen, you DO have the right to an education.
As this is a Canadian Province, these teachers may be infringing on those students rights.

WWJD
Amen.

You are absolutely right, education is not a basic human right. Just by being human means that you do not have the right to an education, it is a privilege.
However, as a Canadian citizen, you DO have the right to an education.
As this is a Canadian Province, these teachers may be infringing on those students rights.

WWJD
Amen.
ahh...wasn't aware that is was a right in Canada.

However, would it not also be a right for teachers to demand a fair paycheck? A teacher shouldn't have to choose between teaching or finding a new job because they can no longer afford to live.

the UN says that everyone has the right to an education, yes. However, there is nothing that says you have the right to a formal education in a classroom with a teacher. Education =/= only that which happens in a school building. While education is a right, a formal education is a privilege
Interesting point. In any case, a few days without teachers won't do that much damage to those in their final years(or any other significant year)

ahh...wasn't aware that is was a right in Canada.

However, would it not also be a right for teachers to demand a fair paycheck? A teacher shouldn't have to choose between teaching or finding a new job because they can no longer afford to live.

Teachers have a right to get another job, but they don't have the right to collectively walk out on their current jobs.

You are absolutely right, education is not a basic human right. Just by being human means that you do not have the right to an education, it is a privilege.
However, as a Canadian citizen, you DO have the right to an education.
As this is a Canadian Province, these teachers may be infringing on those students rights.

WWJD
Amen.

Do Canadian students have a right to an education on their own time frame or do they have a right to an education when it can be practicably be done?

Interesting point. In any case, a few days without teachers won't do that much damage to those in their final years(or any other significant year)

This year, it was two weeks, which amounts to approx. 13 hours taken away from each of our classes that semester, which is alot.

Do Canadian students have a right to an education on their own time frame or do they have a right to an education when it can be practicably be done?
Education is a provincial matter, is it not? So I think it differs.

In Quebec, classroom attendance is compulsory up to the age of 16.

Interesting point. In any case, a few days without teachers won't do that much damage to those in their final years(or any other significant year)

I would suspect that every year is as important as every other year. It's a building process. You cant really just skip unimportant years.

Teachers have a right to get another job, but they don't have the right to collectively walk out on their current jobs.
and what, may I ask, is the difference?

if 30,000 teachers all say "I quit" at the same time, how is that different from a strike?
The answer is that with a strike, you atleast have a decent chance at getting those teachers back quickly, assuming you can come to an agreement.

Teachers do have a right to demand fair pay.

is 24% high? yes. is 8% low? yes. This is where this little thing called compromise comes in. What an amazing concept, no?

and what, may I ask, is the difference?

if 30,000 teachers all say "I quit" at the same time, how is that different from a strike?
The answer is that with a strike, you atleast have a decent chance at getting those teachers back quickly, assuming you can come to an agreement.

Teachers do have a right to demand fair pay.

is 24% high? yes. is 8% low? yes. This is where this little thing called compromise comes in. What an amazing concept, no?

The difference is that, during a strike, no one new can be hired to take their place, meaning children are barred from getting an education. Yes, teachers have the right to ask for more, but they do not have the right to hurt children to make their point with the government.

The difference is that, during a strike, no one new can be hired to take their place, meaning children are barred from getting an education. Yes, teachers have the right to ask for more, but they do not have the right to hurt children to make their point with the government.
few problems:
first, if 30,000 teachers quit, there would be no possible way to hire that many back any time soon.
second, how exactly are teachers supposed to make their point then? By continuing to do the same work for the same pay? Because that would work so well.
In a case of a strike, I generally blame it on asshattery from both sides. This is no different.

The difference is that, during a strike, no one new can be hired to take their place, meaning children are barred from getting an education. Yes, teachers have the right to ask for more, but they do not have the right to hurt children to make their point with the government.

It sounds like they have the right to strike then if you cannot hire new teachers. Not that you could find 30,000 teachers willing and able to fill the shoes of those you already have. If teachers are so important to the rights of all BC children and therefore the future of BC perhaps they should be paid enough to at least keep up with inflation.

If BC is not willing to pay teachers that much money then lower the standards of teachers. Since it is a right to be educated and BC is unwilling to pay much to supply and to keep teachers maybe BC get an all volunteer teacher corps. Or perhaps BC should teach with machines and filmstrips that dont need to pay rent and dont have human needs or rights like teachers do.

Sorry, but in Canada, students have a right to an education, and teachers do not have a right to protest. It's illegal, because education has been deemed an essential service.
In BC they arenot allowed, because the Libs are too cheap to give anybody but themselves a raise. The teachers do technically have the right to protest, the Liberals just used the notwithstanding clause to override the right.

Besides, this was my grad year, and all the teachers managed to fit in the entire ciriculum with two weeks to review before the final.