NationStates Jolt Archive

Ok. In the 1st part, europeans have won. Now 2ns part is about discussing which europeans make the best cars. Not the 'best' one but best ones in general. Actually, the answer is obvious, but lets see if there will be a surprise or with how wide margin will the germans win....

Obviously the Italians.

Ferraris are best.

I hate falling into your prediction, but there isn't a German manufacturer that I don't like at least a little (and that 'at least a little' is Mercedes Benz. Every now and then they do something I kinda like, like the new look for the SLK.)

And of course Porsche...

I hate falling into your prediction, but there isn't a German manufacturer that I don't like at least a little (and that 'at least a little' is Mercedes Benz. Every now and then they do something I kinda like, like the new look for the SLK.)

And of course Porsche...

Yeah but BMW is better. And some audis (a6!!) look just too damn fine!

Porsche of course.

But a close 2nd and not on the list is Japan!!

the Barvarian Motor Works own all other European Manufacturers.

They all excel at different things

Italians - exotic supercars, small town cars
Germans - luxury executive saloons
French - small town cars, and large floaty saloons
British - small, low-volume, front-engined, rear-wheel drive, sports cars
Spanish - more small town cars
Swedes - safe, well-priced cars, that have a decent turn of speed and will go on forever
Czechs - Skodas

So it's impossible to pick the best. Each excels in their own field.

No one. Cars are ebul!!!

They all excel at different things

Italians - exotic supercars, small town cars
Germans - luxury executive saloons
French - small town cars, and large floaty saloons
British - small, low-volume, front-engined, rear-wheel drive, sports cars
Spanish - more small town cars
Swedes - safe, well-priced cars, that have a decent turn of speed and will go on forever
Czechs - Skodas

So it's impossible to pick the best. Each excels in their own field.

Liar...You couldnt come up with something for the czechs....:D

Liar...You couldnt come up with something for the czechs....:D

Come now, the Czechs really are very good at making Skodas. Probably the best.


Mainly because nobody else does...

European cars suck ass. They rust liek am mother****er and are expensive to maintain. They also have either bland, innoffensive styling, or sin ugly styling.

European cars suck ass. They rust liek am mother****er and are expensive to maintain. They also have either bland, innoffensive styling, or sin ugly styling.

:confused:

Italians:
Ferrari, Masserati, Alpha Romeo's, Lamborghini, Lancia, even the little fiats. Pure class

Yeah but BMW is better. And some audis (a6!!) look just too damn fine!
BMW is better than Benz? That I'll accept.

Porsche? We might have to take it outside...

BMW is better than Benz? That I'll accept.

Porsche? We might have to take it outside...

Well, the Z4M coupe is better than the Cayman S, but the Z4M roadster is worse than the Boxter S.

Suppose it depends on the car. And there's not really a BMW really to compare with the 911. M6, maybe, but it's not got the same target.

Deutschland uber alles. :)

Germans are the best engineers in all aspects, end of discussion, anything you disagree with, consider yourself a foolish retard. :)

Right now, I'd say the best cars overall in Europe are made by the Germans. However, each nationality specializes in its own field of manufacturing but I would say the Germans have the overall edge in most fields. At the same time, however, overall dominance means they don't truly excel in any one field but rather have high marks overall.


(The US used to make some of the best cars...not anymore:()

European cars suck ass. They rust liek am mother****er and are expensive to maintain. They also have either bland, innoffensive styling, or sin ugly styling.
Wait wait wait wait.
You're talking from the country that did this (http://www.musclecarclub.com/musclecars/plymouth-superbird/images/plymouth-superbird-1a.jpg) and thinks that the guy who did this (http://www.nashnut.com/archives/59caddy-frt.jpg) is spiritually carried on by this (http://skycar.diy.myrice.com/Html/mczhb/Buick%20New%20Century(1).JPG).

You are going to call cars like this (http://skycar.diy.myrice.com/Html/mczhb/Buick%20New%20Century(1).JPG) bland in comparison to this (http://vnexpress.net/Vietnam/Oto-Xe-may/2004/02/3B9CF61C/Mercury_Montego_1B.jpg)? C'mon now...it's okay to like American cars if that's your thing, but be realistic...

Deutschland uber alles. :)

:eek:

You should say "Deutche Autos Über Alles"

if it is deutches or some other silly artikel thingies and you correct me...be prepared for this :mp5:

Of course Germany. Who wouldn't pick Germany?

Well, maybe someone who really likes Aston Martin. Or the Tifosi.

And me. I chose Czech, because I've always had a soft spot for Skodas.

:eek:

You should say "Deutche Autos Über Alles"

if it is deutches or some other silly artikel thingies and you correct me...be prepared for this :mp5:
I'm not scared of silly little guns...and anyway, I am really not sure. :p

Again though, Deutschland Über Alles". :) Sing it.

Wait wait wait wait.
You're talking from the country that did this (http://www.musclecarclub.com/musclecars/plymouth-superbird/images/plymouth-superbird-1a.jpg) and thinks that the guy who did this (http://www.nashnut.com/archives/59caddy-frt.jpg) is spiritually carried on by this (http://skycar.diy.myrice.com/Html/mczhb/Buick%20New%20Century(1).JPG).

You are going to call cars like this (http://skycar.diy.myrice.com/Html/mczhb/Buick%20New%20Century(1).JPG) bland in comparison to this (http://vnexpress.net/Vietnam/Oto-Xe-may/2004/02/3B9CF61C/Mercury_Montego_1B.jpg)? C'mon now...it's okay to like American cars if that's your thing, but be realistic...

America hit its peak in the 1950's and 1960's...it's all been downhill from there. I still shudder at the thought of the Pontiac Aztek...

Wait wait wait wait.
You're talking from the country that did this (http://www.musclecarclub.com/musclecars/plymouth-superbird/images/plymouth-superbird-1a.jpg) and thinks that the guy who did this (http://www.nashnut.com/archives/59caddy-frt.jpg) is spiritually carried on by this (http://skycar.diy.myrice.com/Html/mczhb/Buick%20New%20Century(1).JPG).

I would love to have a Plymouth Superbird. I can't imagine a more absurd car. And only Americans are good at building vans conducive to painting murals on the side. There's a place for that.

Well, the Z4M coupe is better than the Cayman S, but the Z4M roadster is worse than the Boxter S.

Suppose it depends on the car. And there's not really a BMW really to compare with the 911. M6, maybe, but it's not got the same target.
Nothing compares to the 911. Dammit.

I'm still in my honeymoon with the Cayman S and will hear no ill speak of it. It can leap building and stop speading locomotives. It has staved off my "Have a full racing program you selfish bastards" rant for a year. Not that they care what I think of them or their business decisions...

America hit its peak in the 1950's and 1960's...it's all been downhill from there. I still shudder at the thought of the Pontiac Aztek...
Even Pontiac shudders at the thought of the Pontiac Aztek at this point...

Alfa Romeo is unbeatable :) My last ride: http://w1.401.telia.com/~u40100700/pictures/pagan2.jpg
Now I've got the hots for the Mini One (http://www.racers.jp/mini/83/mini_one_titelbild.jpg) and wouldn't mind having the Alfa Romeo 159 (http://www.reportmotori.it/Alfa%20Romeo%20159%20-%20Profilo800.jpg)

Nothing compares to the 911. Dammit.

I'm still in my honeymoon with the Cayman S and will hear no ill speak of it. It can leap building and stop speading locomotives. It has staved off my "Have a full racing program you selfish bastards" rant for a year. Not that they care what I think of them or their business decisions...

You got Cayman S????????!???? :eek:
Or is that your fantasy honeymoon? :D

Even Pontiac shudders at the thought of the Pontiac Aztek at this point...

That truly was a monstrosity...GM literally couldn't sell enough of them to recoup their cost even with fleet sales and employee purchases.

I would love to have a Plymouth Superbird. I can't imagine a more absurd car. And only Americans are good at building vans conducive to painting murals on the side. There's a place for that.

Here-here!!

if anyone can find a piccy of a Corvette '64 or '69 please post them as examples of america doing right. Needless to say they still didn't go round bends proprley ;)

Nothing compares to the 911. Dammit.

I'm still in my honeymoon with the Cayman S and will hear no ill speak of it. It can leap building and stop speading locomotives. It has staved off my "Have a full racing program you selfish bastards" rant for a year. Not that they care what I think of them or their business decisions...
Ah man, the Z4 M Coupe is, from everything I've seen and read, a better driving machine. That's all that matters in the end.

Plus, it looks far better ;)

24 votes and none for Français? LOL...Those Rénaults just hurt my eyes...

You got Cayman S????????!???? :eek:
Or is that your fantasy honeymoon? :D
No no no...ha haaaaa...NO!

I should have been more clear. I'm just a huge fan of Porsche and when they release something new it gets all romantisized in my brain, like they're doing it just for me (which made me wonder what I did to deserve the Cheyanne...but I digress) and the car is all singing all dancing in my eyes for a while. No...

I used to own a 914, and even that wasn't a 2.0 litre...I'm poor.

Nothing compares to the 911. Dammit.

execpt the Porsche Carrera GT!!

No no no...ha haaaaa...NO!

I should have been more clear. I'm just a huge fan of Porsche and when they release something new it gets all romantisized in my brain, like they're doing it just for me (which made me wonder what I did to deserve the Cheyanne...but I digress) and the car is all singing all dancing in my eyes for a while. No...

I used to own a 914, and even that wasn't a 2.0 litre...I'm poor.

LOL....There are actually people in Germany (Bavaria?) who take Porsche and make it FOR YOU...They add lots of kewl modifications. Needless to say it's for über rich....or for people who live in countries without taxes....

LOL....There are actually people in Germany (Bavaria?) who take Porsche and make it FOR YOU...They add lots of kewl modifications. Needless to say it's for über rich....or for people who live in countries without taxes....
Maybe I'll get daddy to buy me one soon. :)

Ah man, the Z4 M Coupe is, from everything I've seen and read, a better driving machine. That's all that matters in the end.

Plus, it looks far better ;)
Now you're just trying to hurt me...

I hadn't seen it, so I looked it up. Too RX-8y for my blood, but I have the clearly mentioned biases. I miss the old M Coupe with that weird butt that had to grow on you. I kinda like looks that have to grow on you.

I wish they would race Caymans and Z4 Ms and whatever else in a series I can watch. I had to add that last part, I don't get the Speed Channel (even though I work for them ever year...) and I live in the US so I'm cut off to some ass kicking racing sometimes in favor of sillohuette sedans and people talking about sillohuette sedans...

execpt the Porsche Carrera GT!!
Once you get into that region they become Cartoon cars to me-street legal in the same way a tiger is tame. Sure it is, but you still might want to think twice about having it as a pet.

At a certain point I would say, if you're going to have a race car, have a race car. Those cars make good corperate flagships and posters for teenagers, but they're not daily drivers-and I'm a guy who keeps trying to make vintage cars daily drivers...

LOL....There are actually people in Germany (Bavaria?) who take Porsche and make it FOR YOU...They add lots of kewl modifications. Needless to say it's for über rich....or for people who live in countries without taxes....
Ah yes, my teenage years where spent 'deciding' between Kramer and Ruf for the builder of my super-Porsche...I know them well...

:confused:

Italians:
Ferrari, Masserati, Alpha Romeo's, Lamborghini, Lancia, even the little fiats. Pure class
Exception to the rule: Lambos, vintage Ferraris, and Alfas.

Ah yes, my teenage years where spent 'deciding' between Kramer and Ruf for the builder of my super-Porsche...I know them well...

And driving them in German AutoBahn....Ahhhhhhhhh

Once you get into that region they become Cartoon cars to me-street legal in the same way a tiger is tame. Sure it is, but you still might want to think twice about having it as a pet.

At a certain point I would say, if you're going to have a race car, have a race car. Those cars make good corperate flagships and posters for teenagers, but they're not daily drivers-and I'm a guy who keeps trying to make vintage cars daily drivers...

Sure, i agree completley. You could lose you licence in first gear, and probably get an ASBO for starting it in a residential area!

But its SOOOOO sexy

Now you're just trying to hurt me...

I hadn't seen it, so I looked it up. Too RX-8y for my blood, but I have the clearly mentioned biases. I miss the old M Coupe with that weird butt that had to grow on you. I kinda like looks that have to grow on you.

Man, come on, look!

http://www.autoblog.com/media/2006/01/mcoupefront.JPG

Fantastic looking car

I wish they would race Caymans and Z4 Ms and whatever else in a series I can watch. I had to add that last part, I don't get the Speed Channel (even though I work for them ever year...) and I live in the US so I'm cut off to some ass kicking racing sometimes in favor of sillohuette sedans and people talking about sillohuette sedans...

I suppose that's one of the advantages to living in the UK...BTCC is shown regularly, so is F1, GP2, and WRC all on ITV1. Then Motors TV shows things like CART, IRL, NASCAR (urgh...), ALMS etc..

On top of that, there are loads of racing events going on throughout the year that are easy to get to.

I feel for you.

And driving them in German AutoBahn....Ahhhhhhhhh
I'm just old enough to know tangetially about the days in Nevada when they had no speed limit on the roads out of towns. That's where I always imagined opening things up, or the coastal freeways that where near my house.

That or showing up in Hazzard County in an Audi Quattro GT Rally car and saying, "Now what, bitches?"

Man, come on, look!



Fantastic looking car



I suppose that's one of the advantages to living in the UK...BTCC is shown regularly, so is F1, GP2, and WRC all on ITV1. Then Motors TV shows things like CART, IRL, NASCAR (urgh...), ALMS etc..

On top of that, there are loads of racing events going on throughout the year that are easy to get to.

I feel for you.

Tsk Tsk Tsk....Posting pics of "that" instead of m6???!??

http://img221.imageshack.us/img221/733/bmw4vk.jpg

http://img119.imageshack.us/img119/941/bmw28js.jpg

Looking these pics makes me :( or :headbang:

Yeah, I'm happy to admit that I don't get the M6. Just looks ugly.

Yeah, I'm happy to admit that I don't get the M6. Just looks ugly.

What are you? And alien from outer space? Just look at its back!!

In Soviet Russia car drives you!:eek:

Man, come on, look!

http://www.autoblog.com/media/2006/01/mcoupefront.JPG

Fantastic looking car
Yeah, but look-
Z4 m (http://www.autorevue.cz/obrazky/2005/09zari/bmwz4/12964.jpg) and RX-8 (http://carsmedia.ign.com/cars/image/article/633/633018/rx-8-20050712053501658.jpg).
And the Mazda has that crazy half-door. Now the Cayman looks cat like...(bias, remember...You'd do better capping on my mama...)



I suppose that's one of the advantages to living in the UK...BTCC is shown regularly, so is F1, GP2, and WRC all on ITV1. Then Motors TV shows things like CART, IRL, NASCAR (urgh...), ALMS etc..

On top of that, there are loads of racing events going on throughout the year that are easy to get to.

I feel for you.
I am a stones throw from Laguna Seca, though. And every year (yay, I got hired back) I get to work the Historics where my job, I kid you not, is to locate badass vintage race cars and look for good racing and tell people about it.

If I had Speed, and Speed hadn't been bought by Fox, and Fox hadn't turned it into more or less the NASCAR network to make up for thier liscencing fees they paid to NASCAR, I could watch all these things. Though if I had woke up on time I could have watched the Monaco GP and the Indy 500 in one fabulous sitting. I wish I could get the money together to upgrade my cable before the weekend of the 16th so I could watch my favorite, the 24 Hours of Le Mans...

What are you? And alien from outer space? Just look at its back!!

Ah come on, it's ugly as sin!

What are you? And alien from outer space? Just look at its back!!
The back looks kinda like a Lexus to me. Man, big resurgence of this style of car...the 944 should make a come back...

Yeah, but look-
Z4 m (http://www.autorevue.cz/obrazky/2005/09zari/bmwz4/12964.jpg) and RX-8 (http://carsmedia.ign.com/cars/image/article/633/633018/rx-8-20050712053501658.jpg).
And the Mazda has that crazy half-door. Now the Cayman looks cat like...(bias, remember...You'd do better capping on my mama...)

Yeah, but the Z4 has those gorgeous curves and creases, the RX-8 is bland.

As for the Cayman...cat? More like push me pull me :p




I am a stones throw from Laguna Seca, though. And every year (yay, I got hired back) I get to work the Historics where my job, I kid you not, is to locate badass vintage race cars and look for good racing and tell people about it.

If I had Speed, and Speed hadn't been bought by Fox, and Fox hadn't turned it into more or less the NASCAR network to make up for thier liscencing fees they paid to NASCAR, I could watch all these things. Though if I had woke up on time I could have watched the Monaco GP and the Indy 500 in one fabulous sitting. I wish I could get the money together to upgrade my cable before the weekend of the 16th so I could watch my favorite, the 24 Hours of Le Mans...

Yeah, I can't wait for Le Mans. (Mostly) Live on Motors TV. I won't be watching it all, but I'll definitely try to keep up with the standings and see as much as I can. I'd love to go some year.

Why are there all European countries? There are other countries on this Earth too. Is this another attempt at indirect regional nationalism/racism by you?

Yeah, but the Z4 has those gorgeous curves and creases, the RX-8 is bland.

As for the Cayman...cat? More like push me pull me :p






Yeah, I can't wait for Le Mans. (Mostly) Live on Motors TV. I won't be watching it all, but I'll definitely try to keep up with the standings and see as much as I can. I'd love to go some year.
I'll ignore the Cayman remark 'cause I like ya...

It's a dream of mine to go as well. If you ever make it and you see someone who looks like an American biker who got lost and isn't having a good time it'll be me, and I won't be lost and I'll be having a fantastic time.

Why are there all European countries? There are other countries on this Earth too. Is this another attempt at indirect regional nationalism/racism by you?

What is this? "Jump to stupid conclusion without reading the OP" week?

Ok. In the 1st part, europeans have won. Now 2ns part is about discussing which europeans make the best cars.

There was a poll about which area makes best cars. Europe won. Now the poll is to decide which country in Europe makes the best.

Best country that makes cars: Cote d'Ivoire. You seriously can't deny it!

Why are there all European countries? There are other countries on this Earth too. Is this another attempt at indirect regional nationalism/racism by you?
Read the opening post, try and think why this is a part II. He did a large poll, apparently in that larger poll Europe won, now he wants to know where in Europe as a contiuation of that conversation, thus why it still says world even though we are talking just Europe now.

Why are there all European countries? There are other countries on this Earth too. Is this another attempt at indirect regional nationalism/racism by you?

Idiot...This is the 2nd Part...

*creams himself*

It's here!

http://www.porsche.com/all/911gt3rs/images/page1.jpg

European cars suck ass. They rust liek am mother****er and are expensive to maintain. They also have either bland, innoffensive styling, or sin ugly styling.
No sir. American Cars suck arse. They are overly large, and they are eyesores, with their sizes being one of the reasons why they are eyesores. Worst of all, they are not fuel efficient one bit, and not only does that mean lots of pollution, but also you have to get petrol, more often, and that will cost a lot if you have it for some time.

*creams himself*

It's here!

http://www.porsche.com/all/911gt3rs/images/page1.jpg
You know a company is bad ass when they're not afraid to put out a car in Safety Orange.

I'll ignore the Cayman remark 'cause I like ya...

It's a dream of mine to go as well. If you ever make it and you see someone who looks like an American biker who got lost and isn't having a good time it'll be me, and I won't be lost and I'll be having a fantastic time.

I'll bear that in mind ;)

*creams himself*

It's here!

http://www.porsche.com/all/911gt3rs/images/page1.jpg

I prefer 911 Turbo

*bows before German Engineering*

http://www.porsche.com/uk/models/911/911-turbo/

What are you? And alien from outer space? Just look at its back!!

Stop insulting me huh (speciesist).

Anyway the Brits make the best cars. (or did :( )

Aston
Bentley
Bristol
Jaguar
Lotus
Mclaren
MG
Rolls
TVR

*creams himself*

It's here!

http://www.porsche.com/all/911gt3rs/images/page1.jpg

RS's look amazing in white with red trim...yum.

Just look at its back! 310 km/h top speed. I wonder how fast you can go with it in autobahn.....

http://img213.imageshack.us/img213/7060/porsche0eq.jpg

British make the best - it's all about Land Rover. Who cares how fast you can go around the mountain when you can just hop off the road and go right over it? Not too mention they could crush those pansy Ferrari's anyway =P

British make the best - it's all about Land Rover. Who cares how fast you can go around the mountain when you can just hop off the road and go right over it? Not too mention they could crush those pansy Ferrari's anyway =P

LOL...Cayenne and X5 is better....Although they arent as "rough" as the reall off road 4x4, Land Rover....

Stop insulting me huh (speciesist).

Anyway the Brits make the best cars. (or did :( )

Aston
Bentley
Bristol
Jaguar
Lotus
Mclaren
MG
Rolls
TVR

But don't forget people like Noble, Westfield, Radical, Ariel etc...the low volume manufacturers. They make amazing cars.

Anyway the Brits make the best cars. (or did :( )
Don't forget Morgan. Although a German company makes a similar sort of car.
http://www.wiesmann-mf.com/ewirstart.html
I like the GT.

Just look at its back! 310 km/h top speed. I wonder how fast you can go with it in autobahn.....
As fast as the traffic jams will allow it.

*creams himself*

It's here!

http://www.porsche.com/all/911gt3rs/images/page1.jpg

I love that car. Do they do it in the lime green too? I wonder if my soul's worth three hundred-odd grand?

Germany.. Mmmm, sexy.

Anyway the Brits make the best cars. (or did :( )

Aston
Bentley
Bristol
Jaguar
Lotus
Mclaren
MG
Rolls
TVR


I just got back from britian and the bottom line is the coolest cars over there are not allowed in the US and that just sucks. My personal experience has been that if its not made in the US its probably a good car.

Obviously the Italians.

Ferraris are best.

if it was possible,i would have sex with a ferrari!

that said and for the purpose of this thread.....the chevy corvette...dollar for dollar is hands down outstanding,the 100.000.00 you save on the other big time cars in it's performance class...you could take it to a custom upholsterer and have them hand stitch napa leather everywere and still have another 60 grand for performance goodies.

but ferrari's oh baby!

Obviously the Italians.

Ferraris are best.

if it was possible,i would have sex with a ferrari!

that said and for the purpose of this thread.....the chevy corvette...dollar for dollar is hands down outstanding,the 100.000.00 you save on the other big time cars in it's performance class...you could take it to a custom upholsterer and have them hand stitch napa leather everywere and still have another 60 grand for performance goodies.

but ferrari's oh baby!

Don't forget Morgan. Although a German company makes a similar sort of car.
http://www.wiesmann-mf.com/ewirstart.html
I like the GT.


As fast as the traffic jams will allow it.


MG is Morgan Garages. :)

Germany, Hands down. I own a 1980 Mercedes Benz 300SD turbo...greatest car, EVER! 200k on the clock with original engine, transmission, EVERYTHING! Built like a tank. 45 gallon diesel fuel tank in the trunk, and it gets awesome gas mileage-30/35 on the highway (AC on or off) and 25-30 in the city. Plus I use it to pull stumps all the time:D Diesel engines are AWESOME!

Yes, cars may be the only thing Germany is good at. And they're all so expensive that only the 8 richest kings of Europe can afford them.

Yes, cars may be the only thing Germany is good at. And they're all so expensive that only the 8 richest kings of Europe can afford them.
I own two.

Yes, cars may be the only thing Germany is good at. And they're all so expensive that only the 8 richest kings of Europe can afford them.
Germany's not too bad at soccer either.

I own two.

Veronica and ? What's the other one?

Deutscheland, Deutscheland uber alles!

Veronica and ? What's the other one?
The Lego, an 85 Vanagon cargo my brother salvaged for my college graduation, I use it for work.

They're also my second and third German cars, the first being my little scraggly 914 that I bought for $900. I paid too much...(but I loved that little fucker...)

Don't forget Morgan. Although a German company makes a similar sort of car.
http://www.wiesmann-mf.com/ewirstart.html
I like the GT.


As fast as the traffic jams will allow it.

You are so annoying....

Don't forget Morgan. Although a German company makes a similar sort of car.
http://www.wiesmann-mf.com/ewirstart.html
I like the GT.


As fast as the traffic jams will allow it.
Ah, see-now thats what I'm talking about. That car is funky as all hell and takes some growin' on you. I can see some people thinking that car is ugly, but I likes it.

I have this fantasy car company, and I'm sure there are a ton of people willing to tell me how much it wouldn't work and whatever, but fuck those motherfuckers, it's a fantasy. I'm not within a million miles of being able to start a car company, good or bad-

Basicly it would be like the old Talbot style coachworks type of thing. My company would only really make chassis-a GT, Saloon, and maybe a mid-engine balls out. No fucking SUVs. Maybe a low cost hot compact chassis that I'll get to later.

Then we'd liscence coachwork companies that would build up the rest of the car. I know the Maybach is individually appointed, but this would be the whole asthetic design of the car. And not in this 'building a Vickie' hot rod thing that's done now. I understand all of that but I want new designs. They can hint at styles but these wouldn't be replicas of anything.

And here's where I start adding the fairies and pixie dust-

One coachwork group would be attached to the main instead of liscenced-it would be worked by design and fabrication interns who make low cost compacts and finish thier internships out by making two for themselves that they can either sell to cover left over school costs or start thier own liscensed coach shop or just have thier own bad ass car.

I just want at least one company outside of the hot rod world to regard the car as a piece of art again.

I just want at least one company outside of the hot rod world to regard the car as a piece of art again.

If I was making cars I would want them to be absolutely beautiful looking, a seriously gorgeous car that makes everybody stop and stare at it.

And I would want it to handle sublimely, and be exceedingly fast. All while having a top class luxury interior.

In short; what a Jaguar or Aston should be.

If I was making cars I would want them to be absolutely beautiful looking, a seriously gorgeous car that makes everybody stop and stare at it.

And I would want it to handle sublimely, and be exceedingly fast. All while having a top class luxury interior.

In short; what a Jaguar or Aston should be.
Amen sister, amen.

I think some of those do look pretty good, but none of them are destined for the Smithsonian.

Amen sister, amen.

I think some of those do look pretty good, but none of them are destined for the Smithsonian.


Well, their best attempt was probably the DB7. That car is really very beautiful. But not arty.

Can't really think of one that's really what you would put in a gallery...

Well, their best attempt was probably the DB7. That car is really very beautiful. But not arty.

Can't really think of one that's really what you would put in a gallery...
And that's a cryin' shame. I remember last year at the historics watching a 33 Talbot Lago get sold for $3.25 million. By sheer luck I happened to be walking by when they drove it from the auction block back to the concours. You couldn't move, you had to look at it, listen to it, soak it in. If you took your eyes off it you might be robing yourself of some of its beauty. It was a damn good looking car-you could hang it on a wall. I miss that, even though that approach to car making stopped long before I ever born.

And that's a cryin' shame. I remember last year at the historics watching a 33 Talbot Lago get sold for $3.25 million. By sheer luck I happened to be walking by when they drove it from the auction block back to the concours. You couldn't move, you had to look at it, listen to it, soak it in. If you took your eyes off it you might be robing yourself of some of its beauty. It was a damn good looking car-you could hang it on a wall. I miss that, even though that approach to car making stopped long before I ever born.

Ah yeah, they really made some amazing cars in the 30s...probably couldn't do it anymore with safety regulations...

Japanese.:cool:

because I have an Accord. :p

Ah yeah, they really made some amazing cars in the 30s...probably couldn't do it anymore with safety regulations...
I think they should approach safety bumpers and crumple zones as a challenge...they have gotten better with that, with the body mold bumpers and such, but there is always that slight uglification that a kick ass car goes through from autoshow concept to production car. The Ford Fifty-One to the 500...sweet crap, it's almost a crime. Ford came within an inch of making a fabulous coupe and then...

I think they should approach safety bumpers and crumple zones as a challenge...they have gotten better with that, with the body mold bumpers and such, but there is always that slight uglification that a kick ass car goes through from autoshow concept to production car. The Ford Fifty-One to the 500...sweet crap, it's almost a crime. Ford came within an inch of making a fabulous coupe and then...

Well, this is their concept for the new Mondeo:

http://www.channel4.com/4car/media/concepts/F/ford/iosis/03-large/f3q-stu.jpg

http://www.channel4.com/4car/media/concepts/F/ford/iosis/03-large/f-doors-open-stu.jpg

http://www.channel4.com/4car/media/concepts/F/ford/iosis/03-large/r3q-stu.jpg

http://www.channel4.com/4car/media/concepts/F/ford/iosis/03-large/f3q-f.jpg

I think I remember reading that they were going to be as true to the concept as possible, because they'd factored in all the safety crap. I hope it looks 50% as nice as that.

Although, the latest Vauxhall/Opel Astra is probably the nicest car on the road. You wouldn't think looking at it immediately, but when you actually look you realise it's exceptionally well designed. Looks great for a Golf-sized family hatchback.

http://forums.autoweek.com/servlet/JiveServlet/download/31-11861-224223-2094/Astra%2004%20fr.jpg

Well, this is their concept for the new Mondeo:

http://www.channel4.com/4car/media/concepts/F/ford/iosis/03-large/f3q-stu.jpg

http://www.channel4.com/4car/media/concepts/F/ford/iosis/03-large/f-doors-open-stu.jpg

http://www.channel4.com/4car/media/concepts/F/ford/iosis/03-large/r3q-stu.jpg

http://www.channel4.com/4car/media/concepts/F/ford/iosis/03-large/f3q-f.jpg

I think I remember reading that they were going to be as true to the concept as possible, because they'd factored in all the safety crap. I hope it looks 50% as nice as that.

Although, the latest Vauxhall/Opel Astra is probably the nicest car on the road. You wouldn't think looking at it immediately, but when you actually look you realise it's exceptionally well designed. Looks great for a Golf-sized family hatchback.

http://forums.autoweek.com/servlet/JiveServlet/download/31-11861-224223-2094/Astra%2004%20fr.jpg

Yeah, we're not getting any of that. I think because the American branch of Ford is required by some mission statement to not do anything bold, maybe to make thier "Bold Moves" slogan ironic...

I like the Mk 5 Golf GTi, but I had to see it in person first. Some cars don't photo well.

Yeah, we're not getting any of that. I think because the American branch of Ford is required by some mission statement to not do anything bold, maybe to make thier "Bold Moves" slogan ironic...

I like the Mk 5 Golf GTi, but I had to see it in person first. Some cars don't photo well.

Yea, the new Golf is a nice car. But that Astra made it look dated before it was released...

This is the Astra's GTi equivalent (the VXR):
http://www.carpages.co.uk/vauxhall/vauxhall_images/vauxhall_astra_vxr_16_04_05.jpg

I reckon they overdid the Astra a little bit. I prefer the Focus ST...it's the sort of design I like.

http://carsmedia.ign.com/cars/image/article/588/588066/focus-st-20050215031808052.jpg

I reckon they overdid the Astra a little bit. I prefer the Focus ST...it's the sort of design I like.

http://carsmedia.ign.com/cars/image/article/588/588066/focus-st-20050215031808052.jpg

I actually can't get over how boring the new Focus is though...

I actually can't get over how boring the new Focus is though...
The standard one, yes. Although I do like the hood-headlight arrangement.

But I think the ST has just enough little gimmicks to make it interesting. Although I haven't seen it in the metal.

Yea, the new Golf is a nice car. But that Astra made it look dated before it was released...

This is the Astra's GTi equivalent (the VXR):
http://www.carpages.co.uk/vauxhall/vauxhall_images/vauxhall_astra_vxr_16_04_05.jpg

While Astra looks kewl, especially in that metallic blue, I think BMW 1 series is a better hatchback.

http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/3383/bmw1seriesscreensaver13ar.png

Japanese, duh...

lambos are us owned

WTF Japan should have been the first option on there.

lambos are us owned

Virtually everything is US owned, but the ownership of the company is irrelevant to this thread. It is a matter of tradition, styling, and public association. Lambos are thought of as being, and are in design and tradition, very Italian.

And why the hell is there a discussion of Fords and GMs or Jap cars in a thread that is about European cars. The first post makes it clear that this is a part II thread, with the participants of part I having selected European as being better than US or Japanese etc.

But whatever.

While Astra looks kewl, especially in that metallic blue, I think BMW 1 series is a better hatchback.

http://img101.imageshack.us/img101/3383/bmw1seriesscreensaver13ar.png
You must be joking. It's an ugly car, an expensive car and not a particually good car.

I like the new Focus in many ways, but its exterior design is incredibly dull. It looks better in the metal than on paper, but it's still just an ordinary looking car.

This is a very vague question. When you say "best", what is the criteria?

A Ferrari is great for going really fast and making tight turns. It is not however very good for daily commute.

In Japan, you have basic commuters all the way up to performance racers. In the US it's the same, as in most countries with automotive exports.

I think overall, Toyota builds the best cars. They have the best reliability and overall quality. In addtion they typically have very good fuel economy. But since this is a European poll... I'm going to go with the Germans. They seem to be the most innovative and technically advanced.

You did forget the Russians in the poll. However, that is if you really want to count a Volga or a Lada as a viable form of transportation. ;)

lambos are us owned
That was two owners ago, now they're owned by Audi.

That was two owners ago, now they're owned by Audi.

And Audi is owned by VW I guess?

And Audi is owned by VW I guess?
After Piech's 'buying spree' everything is owned by VW...dude went nuts...

After Piech's 'buying spree' everything is owned by VW...dude went nuts...

LOL...They also own Skoda. Hence the identical look of Skoda's to Passats...

While Astra looks kewl, especially in that metallic blue, I think BMW 1 series is a better hatchback.

Yeah, if by "better" you mean "uglier", "cramped interior", "ridiculously expensive", "poor ride" or "under-specced".

After Piech's 'buying spree' everything is owned by VW...dude went nuts...
Yep. Fucked the company up too. That and the Phaeton...what was the guy thinking?

As for the 1-Series. Bugger that...unless...Hartge (http://www.pistonheads.com/doc.asp?c=100&i=13409) makes it. :p

Yep. Fucked the company up too. That and the Phaeton...what was the guy thinking?

As for the 1-Series. Bugger that...unless...Hartge (http://www.pistonheads.com/doc.asp?c=100&i=13409) makes it. :p
The Phaeton was a bit of a mis-step, but I think VW did fairly well under him-in a lot of ways he turned them around.

And I'm always going to have a soft spot for that guy after he designed the 917.

I voted German.

Italias spend too much time designing their carsin wind tunnels, and arerather uglybecause of it, Brit cars have dependability issues (and don't wow me visually either), Swedish cars=box. German cars are the only acceptable choice. Thay are a tad bit small though.

German cars are the only acceptable choice. Thay are a tad bit small though.
Small? Compared to what? A tank?

Small? Compared to what? A tank?
Headroom-wise. To be fair though, any car built since the 70's hasn't had sufficient headroom. They seem to think that people stop growing at 5'9.

Headroom-wise. To be fair though, any car built since the 70's hasn't had sufficient headroom. They seem to think that people stop growing at 5'9.
Hmmm, as far as I'm concerned, if I don't hit my head on the roof, it's got enough head room. I'm 1.87m, I've sat in about a thousand German cars and I've never had a problem.
But then, I'd fold myself into a Lotus Exige, so perhaps space isn't particularly important to me.

Hmmm, as far as I'm concerned, if I don't hit my head on the roof, it's got enough head room. I'm 1.87m, I've sat in about a thousand German cars and I've never had a problem.
But then, I'd fold myself into a Lotus Exige, so perhaps space isn't particularly important to me.
I'm 1.88m (that's 6'2 to all you normal people). I am a sloucher, and find my hair is just touching the roof of most cars. Sitting striaght up is futile, even if Itilt my head asfar as I can, I can't manage to do it. Audi's appear to have a bit more head room, but the other German cars I've seen have lacked headroom just as much as anybody else, except Ford, who is know advertizing the fact that their cars have less headroom than before.

I voted German.

Italias spend too much time designing their carsin wind tunnels, and arerather uglybecause of it, Brit cars have dependability issues (and don't wow me visually either), Swedish cars=box. German cars are the only acceptable choice. Thay are a tad bit small though.
Let's have a look at Brit cars...

http://matforever56.turboblog.fr/photos/uncategorized/auston_1.JPG

http://www.femalefirst.co.uk/images/aston-martin-vanquish-s.jpg

http://www.pistonheads.com/pics/news/11743/Jaguar_XK_2005-2-L.jpg

http://www.femalefirst.co.uk/images/caterham-7.jpg

http://www.barbashov.com/Assets/Images/Jotterpics/American-Hobby/1966_AC_Cobra.jpg

http://www.carpages.co.uk/bristol/bristol_images/bristol_fighter_03_06_05.jpg

http://www.carros.nl/foto/foto2373.jpg

http://www.webwombat.com.au/motoring/news_reports/images/tvr-sagaris2.JPG

http://images.securedwebform.com/stock/300/bentley/continental%20gt/2004/2co-4.jpg

And then German cars...

http://www.caradisiac.com/media/images/le_mag/mag242/volkswagen-passat-break-1-big.jpg



NB: may be biased.

Aston Martin looks sooo kewl....But brits still cant beat germans...

http://cj.livedoor.biz/58575116.jpg

http://www.bil-online.dk/tests/fotos/0508-audi-a6/3s.jpg

http://www.e-cesko.cz/images/downloads/auto-mercedes-SLR-114-7ec4.jpg

Aston Martin looks sooo kewl....But brits still cant beat germans...

http://cj.livedoor.biz/58575116.jpg



You really think that looks good?

You really think that looks good?

Yes, I want to lick the BMW emblem too...

Yes, I want to lick the BMW emblem too...
Eww...the Mercedes one is more lick-able.

Let's have a look at Brit cars...

http://matforever56.turboblog.fr/photos/uncategorized/auston_1.JPG
That is the car equivilant of grabbing you cheecks and pulling back three feet. It looks terrible.
http://www.femalefirst.co.uk/images/aston-martin-vanquish-s.jpg
Looks better from this angle, but the car is still a butter face.
http://www.pistonheads.com/pics/news/11743/Jaguar_XK_2005-2-L.jpg
Yeah an ad!
http://www.femalefirst.co.uk/images/caterham-7.jpg
Not my thing.
http://www.barbashov.com/Assets/Images/Jotterpics/American-Hobby/1966_AC_Cobra.jpg
Are you sure that is british.
http://www.carpages.co.uk/bristol/bristol_images/bristol_fighter_03_06_05.jpg
Side is nice. What does the front and ass look like?
http://www.carros.nl/foto/foto2373.jpg
For a supercar, it is only average.
http://www.webwombat.com.au/motoring/news_reports/images/tvr-sagaris2.JPG
Good thing I am not drinking anything. I'd need a new keyboard:p
http://images.securedwebform.com/stock/300/bentley/continental%20gt/2004/2co-4.jpg
The grill is a bit ug, but that might just be the pixilation of the photo. Defently the best of the list.

And then German cars...
http://www.irancar.com/images/Gallery-larg-1024-768/Porsche/porsche_911_gt2_2003_03_m.jpg

http://www.new-dream.de/image/wallpaper/auto/porsche/porsche-04.jpg

http://audi.org.ua/DyWP/bindata/_0002628_newsimage.jpg

http://www.boston-bmwcca.org/friends/images/bmw-m5-2123-800.jpg

The Shelby Cobra's an American car from the 1960's. Look it up.

As for the "best" European manufacturers? I can't quite say there's a best, but I do have a favorite.

http://www.sfondi-gratis.org/sfondi_grandi/Lamborghini%20Countach%202.jpg

http://www.sfondi-gratis.org/sfondi_grandi/lamborghinidiablo02_1024x768.jpg

http://members.lycos.nl/nickrdg/1994%20Lamborghini%20Diablo%20VT%20side.jpg

I think that pretty much says it all. I seem to be drawn to the 1994 Diablo model most of all (the one in the bottom pic). It's like a sophisticated Countach --- just curvy enough while maintaining the hard edges. Perfect.

The Shelby Cobra's an American car from the 1960's. Look it up.


You're going to get hurt for this, so I'm going to do it because I'll be nicer.

The Cobra is based on an AC model, which is a British company. The American part is Carol Shelby taking first a 289 and later a 427 side-oiler into the AC chassis and then making it look like it was trying out for Mr. Universe. But AC made Cobras for the rest of the world and Shelby made them for us, so they get at least partial credit for the car. It's actually one of two cars that Shelby did that to, and I'm partial to the other-the Sunbeam Tiger which is an Alpine with a 260 or 289 in it.

The Shelby Cobra's an American car from the 1960's. Look it up.
I know, they are fucking sweet. That's why I asked Nad if he was sure it was Brititsh.

I am partial to Chevelles:
http://forum.avtoindex.com/foto/data/media/27/chevrolet_chevelle_ss_2.jpg
Too bad their owners are totally unable to take decent pictures.

You're going to get hurt for this, so I'm going to do it because I'll be nicer.

The Cobra is based on an AC model, which is a British company. The American part is Carol Shelby taking first a 289 and later a 427 side-oiler into the AC chassis and then making it look like it was trying out for Mr. Universe. But AC made Cobras for the rest of the world and Shelby made them for us, so they get at least partial credit for the car. It's actually one of two cars that Shelby did that to, and I'm partial to the other-the Sunbeam Tiger which is an Alpine with a 260 or 289 in it.

Well, I was just going by what the car bios on Gran Turismo III said. Interesting, though.

I know, they are fucking sweet. That's why I asked Nad if he was sure it was Brititsh.

I am partial to Chevelles:
http://forum.avtoindex.com/foto/data/media/27/chevrolet_chevelle_ss_2.jpg
Too bad their owners are totally unable to take decent pictures.

Well, first of all, Nad's not a dude. :p

And while Chevelles are nice, Chargers are infinitely better.

http://www.napalm.ch/napalm/users/marx/Musclecars/Dodge%20Charger/1972Charger%5B1%5D.jpg

So wait.. if I have a cherry red sports car.. and I crash it.. does that mean I poped its cherry?

So wait.. if I have a cherry red sports car.. and I crash it.. does that mean I poped its cherry?

You popped a cherry. If you want to pop a car's cherry, well, you have to find what part might be called a cherry. I'm guessing that'd be the exhaust pipe(s).

>.>

If I was to get an American rod I would have to go with the art-deco lead sleds, kinda like this:
http://www.zippy.com.au/internal/red_hot_cars/image-full/49-caddy-coupe-deville.jpg
Once you have that you can totally pull off flame tatoos on your forearms...

The concept for that hot rod's nice, but the construction and workmanship look so cheap and rushed.

If I was to get an American rod I would have to go with the art-deco lead sleds...

Once you have that you can totally pull off flame tatoos on your forearms...


Amen, brother.

Nice catch on the AC/Shelby thing though. If you hadn't gotten it I would have.

Well, first of all, Nad's not a dude. :p

And while Chevelles are nice, Chargers are infinitely better.

http://www.napalm.ch/napalm/users/marx/Musclecars/Dodge%20Charger/1972Charger%5B1%5D.jpg
I don't care that Nads a she dude.:D

Chargers are nice, but the very front of the roof, right above the windshield, is quite hideous and really brings the car down.

Barracudas were nice for a couple years.
http://www.fastcoolcars.com/images/chrysler/73cuda1.jpg

Some of the best-looking cars at the moment are the TVR Tuscan S, the Lotus Exige, the Lambo Gallardo, the Ferrari 599 GTB (I like that one!), and the Maserati QP.

Some of the best-looking cars at the moment are the TVR Tuscan S, the Lotus Exige, the Lambo Gallardo, the Ferrari 599 GTB (I like that one!), and the Maserati QP.

It looks great on the outside, but from what I've heard, it doesn't have the "feel" of a true Lamborghini on the inside. Apparently, Volkswagen's pretty much ruined the spartan spirit of Lamborghinis (they now resemble luxury cars inside). It's a shame, really.

The concept for that hot rod's nice, but the construction and workmanship look so cheap and rushed.
I think it might be a bad photo, too. The thing I don't like on that one is the fins.

Here's some more:
http://www.thewarfields.com/img/Cars/GoodGuysNov04/PB130317.JPG
http://www.donshotrodpage.net/Editorials/custom043.JPG
For some reason, as of late, I've been intrigued by hot rodding a Nash-
http://www.pnwnash.org/images/50/50nash8.jpg
Though I was thinking a 49 Ambassador:
http://jeffersontx.com/rodrun/2001/custom1.jpg

with a 55 grill:
http://www.pnwnash.org/Portland/55nac1.jpg
lowered and skirted all the way around so it almost looks like a hovercar.

Now those are nice... Save for the bottom one. Ick.

Now those are nice... Save for the bottom one. Ick.
You should see the new bottom ones...I have a funky asthetic...

The two you just added are much better than the former bottom one.

The two you just added are much better than the former bottom one.
If I felt like futzing around with photoshop I could put that 55 grille on the 49 Ambassador to see if it looks as cool as it does in my head, but that's a lot of effort to go through for a thread jack...one of these days, though...

Adtrans

=^^=
.../\...

http://www.e-cesko.cz/images/downloads/auto-mercedes-SLR-114-7ec4.jpg

That'll be both British and German...

That is the car equivilant of grabbing you cheecks and pulling back three feet. It looks terrible.

Are you sure that is british.
The body's British, an AC Cobra

For a supercar, it is only average.
It's not a supercar

Porsche of course.

But a close 2nd and not on the list is Japan!!


very true, japan makes honda, and hondas are great. they are affordable and never break down. and they look nice. the accord is a nice drive and the new civics are good lookin'
and you can run hondas into the ground and they'll still keep running.

That'll be both British and German...

Oh come on...Mercedes is German...

I think it might be a bad photo, too. The thing I don't like on that one is the fins.

Here's some more:

http://www.donshotrodpage.net/Editorials/custom043.JPG

lowered and skirted all the way around so it almost looks like a hovercar.

For some reson this one looks very futuristic instead of vintage....