NationStates Jolt Archive

Some people have critiscized me for using the term "Raghead" to describe terrorists and insurgents. However, one can't help but notice what these three pictures have in common.

Yes, I use the term "Raghead" to demean those who blow up carbombs in crowded streets, although you'd think people would get angry at the insurgents killing innocent people, they seem to take offense at the perception of racism on my part. Bah, I can't please everyone. :p

http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=6/15600540045.jpg&s=f5

http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=6/15600551633.jpg&s=f5

http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=6/15600580962.jpg&s=f5

Some people have critiscized me for using the term "Raghead" to describe terrorists and insurgents. However, one can't help but notice what these three pictures have in common.

Yes, I use the term "Raghead" to demean those who blow up carbombs in crowded streets, although you'd think people would get angry at the insurgents killing innocent people, they seem to take offense at the perception of racism on my part. Bah, I can't please everyone. :p

http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=6/15600540045.jpg&s=f5

http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=6/15600551633.jpg&s=f5

http://putfile.com/pic.php?pic=6/15600580962.jpg&s=f5
I would bet that many of the Iraqi people would draw the same inflection off of pictures of us service men and women as well

http://www.irlnet.com/saoirse/graphics/martina.jpg

So this is a raghead then?

(Martina Anderson, IRA terrorist convicted for conspiracy to cause explosions in the UK in 1986)

I would bet that many of the Iraqi people would draw the same inflection off of pictures of us service men and women as well

Ah, now that you mention it, I've heard from Iraqi vets that they have a special slur for US soldiers too - "The Jews."

http://www.irlnet.com/saoirse/graphics/martina.jpg

So this is a raghead then?

(Martina Anderson, IRA terrorist convicted for conspiracy to cause explosions in the UK in 1986)

Her hair looks pretty raggady.

Ah, now that you mention it, I've heard from Iraqi vets that they have a special slur for US soldiers too - "The Jews."
How did that slur originate? (curious)

The same as these do

http://www.katu.com/news/images/story2004/040704iraqi_insurgent.jpg

http://www.islammemo.cc/news/newsimages/iraq2/An%20Iraqi%20insurgent%20celebrates.jpg

They are pictures of paramilitary forces in Iraq.

Its hot as hell in iraq. Alot of people where rags like that to keep out the heat, or for religious purposes. To say raghead is similar to saying arab, and meaning terrorist/paramilitary is stereotypical and just stupid.

Some people have critiscized me for using the term "Raghead" to describe terrorists and insurgents. However, one can't help but notice what these three pictures have in common.

Yes, I use the term "Raghead" to demean those who blow up carbombs in crowded streets, although you'd think people would get angry at the insurgents killing innocent people, they seem to take offense at the perception of racism on my part. Bah, I can't please everyone. :p


Come off it. Its a derogatory slang word referring to any Arab or Middle Eastern person and you know it.

When I say the word Raghead, rest assured I am referring to a 22 year old male who executes, bombs, and attacks coalition forces AND Iraqi civilians. Somehow someone seems to think I'm being racist against arabs...rest assured I am not. If you don't bomb, behead, or attack civilians or Coalition...then congratulations, you have just failed the test for being branded a raghead.

When I say the word Raghead, rest assured I am referring to a 22 year old male who executes, bombs, and attacks coalition forces AND Iraqi civilians. Somehow someone seems to think I'm being racist against arabs...rest assured I am not. If you don't bomb, behead, or attack civilians or Coalition...then congratulations, you have just failed the test for being branded a raghead.

Sorry. You are (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raghead) using an ethnic slur whether you think you are or aren't.

Raghead is an ethnic slur generally denigrating a male who wears a type of clothing on the head, usually Arab, Pashtun, Middle Eastern or South Asian descent.

Following from the September 11, 2001 attacks where Osama bin Laden was identified as the Al Qaeda leader behind the plot, this slur has increasingly meant Arabs and Muslims in general.

When I say the word Raghead, rest assured I am referring to a 22 year old male who executes, bombs, and attacks coalition forces AND Iraqi civilians. Somehow someone seems to think I'm being racist against arabs...rest assured I am not. If you don't bomb, behead, or attack civilians or Coalition...then congratulations, you have just failed the test for being branded a raghead.
I could re-define ****** to mean 22 year old white woman, but I would have to be an idiot to use it and not expect people to pounce on the more commonly known deffinition

How did that slur originate? (curious)

An association of the United States with Israel and Zionism, coupled with the perception that Zionism has as its goal a destruction of Arabs and Islam.

Much like bin Laden's last tape where he said the West was waging a 'crusader Zionist war on Islam.'

When I say the word Raghead, rest assured I am referring to a 22 year old male who executes, bombs, and attacks coalition forces AND Iraqi civilians. Somehow someone seems to think I'm being racist against arabs...rest assured I am not. If you don't bomb, behead, or attack civilians or Coalition...then congratulations, you have just failed the test for being branded a raghead.


Now please, O great and enlightend source of all things concerning the English language, would you please inform us poor mere mortals as to the meaning of the word 'toves'. This has been greatly perplexing us for some time now.

Come off it. Its a derogatory slang word referring to any Arab or Middle Eastern person and you know it.

How?

And no...if all Middle easterners bomb and kill innocent people, cut their heads off, and rape and loot a country, YES I WILL CALL EVERY ONE A RAGHEAD, HADJI, TOWEL HEADED GOAT HUMPER, GUYS IN DIRTY NIGHTSHIRTS, AK MONKEY PUMPER, or any other demeaning name, which is based on their ACTIONS, not ethnicity.

Stop being racist, very few middle easterners are involved with alqaeda.

How did that slur originate? (curious)

"Jew" is the ultimate muslim insult.

How did that slur originate? (curious)

The US and Israel are allies...

The arabs HATE the jews because the Jews are "mud people" and "descendants of monkeys"....

Sorry. You are (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raghead) using an ethnic slur whether you think you are or aren't.

Maybe some xenophobist has used raghead to mean Arabs and muslims in general. However, I do not. I use it to refer to a certain section of the population in the middle east who follow Osama Bin laden and actively seek to destroy America and the west.

When I say the word Raghead, rest assured I am referring to a 22 year old male who executes, bombs, and attacks coalition forces AND Iraqi civilians. Somehow someone seems to think I'm being racist against arabs...rest assured I am not. If you don't bomb, behead, or attack civilians or Coalition...then congratulations, you have just failed the test for being branded a raghead.


That would equate to calling black people "niggers" and saying it only applies to a certain number of blacks. A racial slur is hateful towards all you direct it at. Don't try to rationalize it with your weak arguments, it just highlights your ignorance. :rolleyes:

When I say the word Raghead, rest assured I am referring to a 22 year old male who executes, bombs, and attacks coalition forces AND Iraqi civilians. Somehow someone seems to think I'm being racist against arabs...rest assured I am not. If you don't bomb, behead, or attack civilians or Coalition...then congratulations, you have just failed the test for being branded a raghead.

So why say Raghead then? Why not terrorist, as most on your side of the compass use? At least thats a bit closer.

Now please, O great and enlightend source of all things concerning the English language, would you please inform us poor mere mortals as to the meaning of the word 'toves'. This has been greatly perplexing us for some time now.

What is a "toves"? Beats me.

Maybe some xenophobist has used raghead to mean Arabs and muslims in general. However, I do not. I use it to refer to a certain section of the population in the middle east who follow Osama Bin laden and actively seek to destroy America and the west.

You do not get to decide what the term means. Sorry, but that is not the way it works.

What is a "toves"? Beats me.

Last word, first line. (http://www.jabberwocky.com/carroll/jabber/jabberwocky.html)

How?

And no...if all Middle easterners bomb and kill innocent people, cut their heads off, and rape and loot a country, YES I WILL CALL EVERY ONE A RAGHEAD, HADJI, TOWEL HEADED GOAT HUMPER, GUYS IN DIRTY NIGHTSHIRTS, AK MONKEY PUMPER, or any other demeaning name, which is based on their ACTIONS, not ethnicity.

Stop being racist, very few middle easterners are involved with alqaeda.

Uh right. I'm "being racist" for pointing out that YOU are using an ethnic slur?

Seems to me like your sole intention in creating this thread was an opportunity to say "raghead" and "goat humper" a lot and then call others "racist" if they point out your own racism.

Maybe some xenophobist has used raghead to mean Arabs and muslims in general. However, I do not. I use it to refer to a certain section of the population in the middle east who follow Osama Bin laden and actively seek to destroy America and the west.

That's nice. I can make that same argument to use ANY derogatory term and get away with it. It's not a valid argument.

That would equate to calling black people "niggers" and saying it only applies to a certain number of blacks. A racial slur is hateful towards all you direct it at. Don't try to rationalize it with your weak arguments, it just highlights your ignorance. :rolleyes:

I've never seen a blackperson wear "******" on his head.

That would equate to calling black people "niggers" and saying it only applies to a certain number of blacks. A racial slur is hateful towards all you direct it at. Don't try to rationalize it with your weak arguments, it just highlights your ignorance. :rolleyes:
I seem to remember making a similar (and in my opinion very valid) analogy

So is he a "raghead" too?

http://www.mugshots.net/timothy_mcveigh/

If not, then you ARE being racist by singling out just one race for your little title.

I've never seen a blackperson wear "******" on his head.
That matters how?

So why say Raghead then? Why not terrorist, as most on your side of the compass use? At least thats a bit closer.

It's demeaning, funny, and accurate.

Wow, okay. So it wasn't an act.

Okay, first-I can insist that when I say, "Pencil" I mean "Peanut butter," but I'm going to have to eat a lot of pencil and jelly sandwiches because people are going to hand me a pencil when I ask for a "Pencil" (peanut butter).

Second, the guys in your picture have something in common with a lot of people in that region. Please excuse wiki (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Turban), but damn this is obvious;
In Arab culture, the turban (imamah) is an important spiritual element of the cultural faith. Ancient Arabs wore them and took pride in them; to be deprived of one's turban was humiliating, and knocking a man's turban off was considered an insult. In daily life, the turban was very useful for fending off the desert sand and protecting the face from high temperatures and strong sunlight. In modern Persian Gulf countries, the turban has been replaced by the white or red-and-white checkered scarf (called keffiyeh, ghutrah or shumagh), though the turban tradition is still strong in Oman (see, for example, Sultan Qaboos of Oman). In Sudan, a large white turban is worn and can indicate social status. Islamic leaders can be seen wearing turbans, in particular Shia Muslim scholars who have become famous for them (e.g., Ayatollah Khomeini, Ayatollah Khamenei, Hezbollah head Sayyid Hassan Nasrallah, and newcomers to the world stage, like Iraq's Grand Ayatollah Ali al-Sistani). These are worn by Persian and Arab scholars alike; the black colour indicates a sayyid, a descendant of the Prophet Muhammad. Jews in Arabic countries often wore turbans as well, due to assimilation. The traditional color is black.
It'd be funny if they started calling us meshheads due to truckers wearing mesh baseball hats, but I digress...

Because of willfully ignorant shit like what's been put forth, we have:
The wearing of turbans sparked some hate crimes in the United States as a consequence of the September 11, 2001 attacks, since some people assumed that people that wore turbans were Muslim. In fact, Sikhs make up the overwhelming majority of turban-wearers in the Western world and are neither Muslim nor Arab.


So the majority isn't even in the group you're trying to reduce, but you'll use the word anyway. Fucking stupid.

Really, enough with the "I'm not racist, but..." It demeans all of us...

I seem to remember making a similar (and in my opinion very valid) analogy
He needs things repeated, multiple times.

With pictures.

Funny, noone has mentioned the thing all three pictures have in common...hmmm.....

Funny, noone has mentioned the thing all three pictures have in common...hmmm.....
Maybe we don’t care to play the game … its either the tasteless obvious or it is something trivial in the background that most people are going to miss while you play your game of re-defining what words mean.

Funny, noone has mentioned the thing all three pictures have in common...hmmm.....

Oh, I think I know. They all have rags on their heads. :D

Funny, noone has mentioned the thing all three pictures have in common...hmmm.....

...all of them were posted by a bigot who has no argument?

Funny, noone has mentioned the thing all three pictures have in common...hmmm.....
Same thing they have in common with these people listening to fucking Gandhi (http://www.artsci.wustl.edu/~ssen/Snapshots1.jpg). I swear the next thing out of your mouth is going to be "Some of my best friends are..."

It's demeaning, funny, and accurate.

And can broadly describe a fast number of people in the middle east.

Instead of explaining to every single person you meet that by your broad, racist slang, you actually mean only a select group of people within the term, why not just change the fucking term so you dont sound like such a racist?

Now please, O great and enlightend source of all things concerning the English language, would you please inform us poor mere mortals as to the meaning of the word 'toves'. This has been greatly perplexing us for some time now.
Nice reference. I am pleased. :D

Funny, noone has mentioned the thing all three pictures have in common...hmmm.....

Yes, I did. They are all paramilitary forces in Iraq.

That would equate to calling black people "niggers" and saying it only applies to a certain number of blacks. A racial slur is hateful towards all you direct it at. Don't try to rationalize it with your weak arguments, it just highlights your ignorance. :rolleyes:
I think you give him too much credit by calling him ignorant--ignorance supposes that he just doesn't know better. No, it's clear now, if it wasn't before, that Designated Marksman is a deliberate and open racist.

He needs things repeated, multiple times.

With pictures.
And maybe punctuated with a sharp, pointy stick.

He needs things repeated, multiple times.

With pictures.

Preferably pictures that pop up out of the book they are in.

Instead of explaining to every single person you meet that by your broad, racist slang, you actually mean only a select group of people within the term, why not just change the fucking term so you dont sound like such a racist?

I have an idea for a more accurate slang term than 'ragheads' for terrorists. Why don't we call them 'cannibals' or 'blood drinkers' since they are constantly talking about drinking the blood of Westerners, such as in this Hamas video where a suicide bomber states, "There is no better blood than the blood of Jews" and "We will drink the blood of the Jews."

Video (http://www.pmw.org.il/asx/PMW_Hamas_suicide.asx)

You know, DesignatedMarksman, that many many Iraqi men who have nothing to do with Al Queda or any armed group in Iraq wear kheffiyahs? In fact, when I was deployed to Iraq a lot of guys in my unit would wrap kheffiyahs around their faces to keep the dust out.

You keep talking as though you're in some way connected to the military, but this right here tells me that you're definately not. And if you are, you're in some pogue REMF job that has never seen a real, live Iraqi. You're like a damned PX Ranger.

Funny, noone has mentioned the thing all three pictures have in common...hmmm.....

Appalling.

You know, DesignatedMarksman, that many many Iraqi men who have nothing to do with Al Queda or any armed group in Iraq wear kheffiyahs? In fact, when I was deployed to Iraq a lot of guys in my unit would wrap kheffiyahs around their faces to keep the dust out.

Lots of US soldiers wear keffiyehs as well, as do non-Arabs and non-Muslims. Rags on the head are common attire for virtually everyone.

Its surprising they never caught on in Europe.

You know, DesignatedMarksman, that many many Iraqi men who have nothing to do with Al Queda or any armed group in Iraq wear kheffiyahs? In fact, when I was deployed to Iraq a lot of guys in my unit would wrap kheffiyahs around their faces to keep the dust out.

You keep talking as though you're in some way connected to the military, but this right here tells me that you're definately not. And if you are, you're in some pogue REMF job that has never seen a real, live Iraqi. You're like a damned PX Ranger.
Yep. Besides, it's clear to anyone who has watched significant footage of the Iraq War that the modern term is "hajji," not "raghead." Raghead is the term used by tough talking, small-penised members of the 101st Fighting Keyboarders.

Yep. Besides, it's clear to anyone who has watched significant footage of the Iraq War that the modern term is "hajji," not "raghead." Raghead is the term used by tough talking, small-penised members of the 101st Fighting Keyboarders.
Quality.

Yep. Besides, it's clear to anyone who has watched significant footage of the Iraq War that the modern term is "hajji," not "raghead." Raghead is the term used by tough talking, small-penised members of the 101st Fighting Keyboarders.

Good sir.

You're a dick.

:rolleyes:

'nuff said.

You're a dick.
Yeah, just like the guys in the pictures he posted. (The thing they have in common is that they're all male, right?)

How?

And no...if all Middle easterners bomb and kill innocent people, cut their heads off, and rape and loot a country, YES I WILL CALL EVERY ONE A RAGHEAD, HADJI, TOWEL HEADED GOAT HUMPER, GUYS IN DIRTY NIGHTSHIRTS, AK MONKEY PUMPER, or any other demeaning name, which is based on their ACTIONS, not ethnicity.How do these demeaning names refer to the actions of bombing and killing innocent people?

Some people have critiscized me for using the term "Raghead" ...

You ingorant hack. It's not a rag, it's a sheet! So you have to refer to them as 'sheet heads'.

You call that a rag? This (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuareg) is a rag.

And by the way, it's 47°C in Baghdad today. Wanna count how many US and Iraqi government soldiers are running around with rags, towels or sheets on their heads right now?

In fact...
http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/World/2005/12/26/cnews_iraq400.jpg
http://www.thestandard.com.hk/stdn/std/World/images/iraq0530.jpg

You call that a rag? This (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tuareg) is a rag.

And by the way, it's 47°C in Baghdad today. Wanna count how many US and Iraqi government soldiers are running around with rags, towels or sheets on their heads right now?

In fact...
http://www.thewe.cc/thewei/&/images3/2004_war_photos_3/national_guard_in_mask.jpe
http://cnews.canoe.ca/CNEWS/World/2005/12/26/cnews_iraq400.jpg
http://www.thestandard.com.hk/stdn/std/World/images/iraq0530.jpg


RAGHEAD!

It's demeaning, funny, and accurate.

Were you "home schooled" by any chance?

Funny, noone has mentioned the thing all three pictures have in common...hmmm.....
Ooh! I know! I know!

They all have GUNS!

GUN NUTS! That's what we should call the terrorists. Hell, every teorrist regardless of their religion always have guns!

So, NSGeneral, I here by designate Gun Nut as our special slur for terroists.

And, if it should offend law abiding gun owners... well, I'm sure they'll understand we only mean terrorists.

Maybe some xenophobist has used raghead to mean Arabs and muslims in general. However, I do not. I use it to refer to a certain section of the population in the middle east who follow Osama Bin laden and actively seek to destroy America and the west.

I completely agree with your point. I, for example, use raghead to refer to buffoons who arbitrarily redefine ethnic slurs, then expect others to agree with the definition.

I further define "chink" to refer to my grandmother, "spic" to refer to your mom, and "******" as a nice pan of 6-layer lasagna.

Just so everyone knows what I mean when I use those words.

I completely agree with your point. I, for example, use raghead to refer to buffoons who arbitrarily redefine ethnic slurs, then expect others to agree with the definition.

I further define "chink" to refer to my grandmother, "spic" to refer to your mom, and "******" as a nice pan of 6-layer lasagna.

Just so everyone knows what I mean when I use those words.

A forceful first post. :D

Welcome to NSG!

A forceful first post. :D

Welcome to NSG!

Wait, didn't he break some kind of rule by not using gun smilies?

And just for fun....

OH NOES!!! I have a gun and a "rag" on my head!!! I must be a terrorist raghead!!!11!1eleventy!!1shift+1!

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a353/tuebor/CIMG0524.jpg

Wait, didn't he break some kind of rule by not using gun smilies?
Oops... forgot... :sniper:

I completely agree with your point. I, for example, use raghead to refer to buffoons who arbitrarily redefine ethnic slurs, then expect others to agree with the definition.

I further define "chink" to refer to my grandmother, "spic" to refer to your mom, and "******" as a nice pan of 6-layer lasagna.

Just so everyone knows what I mean when I use those words.

:D

Oops... forgot... :sniper:

That's better. Tradition has been upheld...

Oops... forgot... :sniper:

It's a tradition/curse in this forum for new posters to put several meaningless gun smilies in their first posts. Exactly why this happens, nobody knows.

Anyway, I think your first post was rather spot on.

I guess this guy must be the king of all the terrahists judging by the size of his rag head :rolleyes:

http://www.tropicalisland.de/india/delhi/thumbnails/DEL%20Delhi%20-%20Gurdwara%20Bangla%20Sahib%20Sikh%20temple%20portrait%20with%20colourful%20turban%2001%203008x2000 .jpg

OH MY GOD A TERRORIST WHO DOESNT WEAR A TURBAN! (http://www.rotten.com/library/bio/crime/terrorists/timothy-mcveigh/1101950501_400.jpg)

I guess this guy must be the king of all the terrahists judging by the size of his rag head :rolleyes:




If you look here (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=11103694&postcount=60) you'll clearly see that I am king of teh evil terrahists!

If you look here (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=11103694&postcount=60) you'll clearly see that I am king of teh evil terrahists!
The DHS is watching you.

If you look here (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=11103694&postcount=60) you'll clearly see that I am king of teh evil terrahists!

Yeah I saw that....then decided that boundries were needed....:cool:

YES I WILL CALL EVERY ONE A RAGHEAD, HADJI, ... based on actions not ethnicity.


The action in this case being taking a pilgrimage to Mecca?

Kinda basing it on ethnicity there. Unless you are planning to dictate to the Muslim world what arabic words mean as well.

I've never seen a blackperson wear "******" on his head.

I've never seen an arab wear a "rag" on theirs.

Would this guy be a raghead too?

http://wavecaps.com/images/durags/du_rag.jpg

And no...if all Middle easterners bomb and kill innocent people, cut their heads off, and rape and loot a country, YES I WILL CALL EVERY ONE A RAGHEAD, HADJI, TOWEL HEADED GOAT HUMPER, GUYS IN DIRTY NIGHTSHIRTS, AK MONKEY PUMPER, or any other demeaning name, which is based on their ACTIONS, not ethnicity.

DO you know what the word 'hadji' actually means? - one who goes on a pilgrimage to Mecca. So you are know unequivocally stating that an 'AK monkey pumper' or a 'towel headed goat humper' is a term equally applicable to any Muslim who goes on a pilgrimage to Mecca.

Catch yourself on there, your ignorance is showing and it's embarassing to all of us.

DM, the Iraqis who actually shot at me were called "step-ons". That is, I shot back, and when we found their bodies, I could only call it a confirmed kill if I could "step on" them.

No need in disrespecting your opponents - that leads to a sense of complacency about their capabilities.

They are rather dedicated, cunning, and violent opponents. Please do not get the idea that they are something less.

Has anyone else noticed that most civilizations touched by Christianity and Western culture seem to do better than most societies that have converted to Islam? Sure, there are exceptions everywhere, but I used the word 'most'. Is this observation wrong?

What is a "toves"? Beats me.

Last word, first line. (http://www.jabberwocky.com/carroll/jabber/jabberwocky.html)
I think a "slithy tove" is obviously DesignatedMarksman.

Has anyone else noticed that most civilizations touched by Christianity and Western culture seem to do better than most societies that have converted to Islam? Sure, there are exceptions everywhere, but I used the word 'most'. Is this observation wrong?

There's a similar pattern where Buddhism was adhered to tightly. Religions that encourage a fatalistic worldview aren't conducive to technological progress.

Japan prospered when they entered the Meiji Period precisely because they steered themselves willingly into modernity.

Has anyone else noticed that most civilizations touched by Christianity and Western culture seem to do better than most societies that have converted to Islam? Sure, there are exceptions everywhere, but I used the word 'most'. Is this observation wrong?
:D

You're funny :)

Yep. Besides, it's clear to anyone who has watched significant footage of the Iraq War that the modern term is "hajji," not "raghead." Raghead is the term used by tough talking, small-penised members of the 101st Fighting Keyboarders.
Damn, I thought Hadjii was the sidekick on Johnny Quest.

Has anyone else noticed that most civilizations touched by Christianity and Western culture seem to do better than most societies that have converted to Islam? Sure, there are exceptions everywhere, but I used the word 'most'. Is this observation wrong?

A large part of that may be culture and geography unrelated to either religion, i.e. Western culture in general vs Middle Eastern culture.

There's a similar pattern where Buddhism was adhered to tightly. Religions that encourage a fatalistic worldview aren't conducive to technological progress.

Japan prospered when they entered the Meiji Period precisely because they steered themselves willingly into modernity.
I just read you new .sig. Laughed my head off. How can anyone that has ever watched network TV be that ignorant?

DM is an idiot, plain and simple.

In basic terms, so he can understand it:

The majority of Muslims wear a wrap on their head for religious purposes, which is where the "rag" of "rag-head" comes from. Rag, on their head. Raghead. If you want to call the terrorists something that doesn't at the same time catch every other Muslim in the crossfire, feel free - call them Brown Bombers - note how it only affects brown people who bomb stuff, as opposed to every brown person.

Using the term "raghead" is automatically negative and condescending of the Islamic religion, and frankly its this type of ignorance that's gotten us into so much trouble with the mid-east and many other cultures of the world.

Using the term "raghead" is automatically negative and condescending of the Islamic religion, and frankly its this type of ignorance that's gotten us into so much trouble with the mid-east and many other cultures of the world.
As opposed the the types that fly airplanes into buildings. I think I'd rather be neighbors with DM.

DM is an idiot, plain and simple.

In basic terms, so he can understand it:

The majority of Muslims wear a wrap on their head for religious purposes, which is where the "rag" of "rag-head" comes from. Rag, on their head. Raghead. If you want to call the terrorists something that doesn't at the same time catch every other Muslim in the crossfire, feel free - call them Brown Bombers - note how it only affects brown people who bomb stuff, as opposed to every brown person.

Meh: why not 'insurgents', or if that feels too clinical 'paramilitaries'? Does one have to be brown to fight the coalition forces in Iraq?

As opposed the the types that fly airplanes into buildings. I think I'd rather be neighbors with DM.

Those people should be seen as "people who kill people" rather than "ragheads".

Meh: why not 'insurgents', or if that feels too clinical 'paramilitaries'? Does one have to be brown to fight the coalition forces in Iraq?

No, but he seems intent on blaming just the brown people.

As opposed the the types that fly airplanes into buildings. I think I'd rather be neighbors with DM.

That made no sense.

What "type"? I made no mention of a type in what you quoted.

Those people should be seen as "people who kill people" rather than "ragheads".
Forget about the term raghead. I don't use that, but I certainly do realize that fundamentalist Muslims are the cause of most strife in the world today. The idea that there are terrorists that kill people for some particular cause is fine in an abstract sort of way, but in the real world, it's Islamists that kill anyone, who's death will serve their purpose.

That made no sense.

What "type"? I made no mention of a type in what you quoted.
No, but you insinuated that it's the West's fault, through derogatory remarks, that we have bad relations with practictioners of that religion of peace, Islam. My claim was that we have bad relations with Islamists because they try to kill us.

Forget about the term raghead. I don't use that, but I certainly do realize that fundamentalist Muslims are the cause of most strife in the world today. The idea that there are terrorists that kill people for some particular cause is fine in an abstract sort of way, but in the real world, it's Islamists that kill anyone, who's death will serve their purpose.

Negative. The cause of most strife in the world is starvation, greed, ignorance, and humanity's tendency to not care about any of it. You don't have to be any specific religion or skin color to cause any of those things - more of it happens in Africa and Asia than in the mid-east, simply because those are larger regions with more people, and in turn, more overall suffering.

No, but you insinuated that it's the West's fault, through derogatory remarks, that we have bad relations with practictioners of that religion of peace, Islam. My claim was that we have bad relations with Islamists because they try to kill us.

I said it's ignorance's fault. Whether someone in Russia or Asia or Britain, if they're ignorant, they're perpetuating untrue stereotypes, and persecuting people for something they didn't do. I made no mention of the USA being the only problem, though it is a breeding ground for ignorance these days.

My claim was that we have bad relations with Islamists because they try to kill us.

Some Muslims tried/try to kill us. (Part of the reason) we have bad relations is that too many Americans believe (or at least speak as if they believe) that all Muslims tried/try to kill us.

Damn, I thought Hadjii was the sidekick on Johnny Quest.
He was--I think that's where the nickname came from.

He was--I think that's where the nickname came from.

Yeah, most likely because he was the first well-known pop icon that people saw to represent the Muslim culture, though of course he didn't.

tough talking, small-penised members of the 101st Fighting Keyboarders




Bwaaaaaaaaaaaahahahahaaha ROTFFLMATFO...:D :D :D :D :D :D

I almost choked on my coffee...***** ahhhh thats a good one


Size doesnt matter....

They're all wearing towels on their heads? Did I miss something, cuz that's all I see...

My claim was that we have bad relations with Islamists because they try to kill us.

And lets ignore the reasons they try to kill us...

And lets ignore the reasons they try to kill us...

Ah, because we won't submit to becoming Muslims, and won't let them turn the whole world into Dar al-Islam?

Ah, because we won't submit to becoming Muslims, and won't let them turn the whole world into Dar al-Islam?

Yeah Im sure thats the reason :rolleyes:

DM, you don´t happen to have any Kievan-Prussian blood in your ancestry?
I´m reminded of the 'Let's call all Middle-Easterners Arabs'-farce.
If you don´t want to be perceived as racist scum, don´t use racist scum vocabulary, no matter how much you try to redefine it.

Yeah Im sure thats the reason :rolleyes:
I guess you don't read a lot of Bin Laden's original writings as to why the WTC attack.

That's ok - you can be ignorant of why Bin Laden wants to kill us. It doesn't make any practical difference.

I guess you don't read a lot of Bin Laden's original writings as to why the WTC attack.

That's ok - you can be ignorant of why Bin Laden wants to kill us. It doesn't make any practical difference.
So it wasn't due to US support of Israel, US "occupation" of the Arabian Peninsula, and previous US "aggression" against the Iraqi people?

Text of the 1998 fatwah (http://www.ict.org.il/articles/fatwah.htm)

So it wasn't due to US support of Israel, US "occupation" of the Arabian Peninsula, and previous US "aggression" against the Iraqi people?

Of course not.

DEY HATE UR FREEDUMS

Past historical perspective:


The West owes a great debt to Islam, because learning flourished in Muslim countries at a time when the Church in the west severely limited scientific and other research. "The Arab world used to be the most literate part of the planet." 11


Balancing that goodwill has been the long history of conflict between Christian and Islamic countries. Islam once controlled parts of Europe, including, at its greatest extent, part of Spain and Eastern Europe as far west as Vienna. The Roman Catholic Church initiated a number of Crusades between the 11th and 15th centuries CE. These were holy wars in which soldiers of the church attempted to drive Muslims out of the Holy Land -- Palestine. The atrocities committed by Christians during the crusades are still a source of anger among many Muslims to this day.


First half of the 20th Century:


Many middle-eastern countries suffered under the colonial rule of European super-powers. Three examples are:


Following World War I, Britain sub-divided the old Ottoman province of Syria, and created the Kingdom of Jordan. They installed the Hashemite ruling family in power.


France carved Lebanon out of Syria as an attempt to assure that a majority Maronite Christian state would control much of the formerly Syrian coastline. This was a recipe for disaster as the country's minority Muslim population gradually became dominant.


Britain imposed a Hashemite monarchy on Iraq and gave the Sunni Muslim minority population control of the country.


At the time, there was an immense reservoir of good-will towards the U.S. because America was not one of the colonial powers oppressing Muslims.


America built up more good-will by contributing to education through the establishment of American Universities in Egypt, Lebanon, and elsewhere in the Middle East.


The creation of the state of Israel in 1948 sent shock waves throughout the Muslim world which continue today. It is commonly referred to as "the catastrophe."


Second half of the 20th Century:


Relations between Islamic countries and the U.S. were profoundly affected by the west's cold war on communism. U.S. foreign policy promoted the creation and training of terrorist, gorilla, and military units. Usama Bin Laden's group was originally trained by the CIA.


The U.S. fought the growth of a pan-Arab nationalism in the region. Rather than supporting it as a cohesive force -- a source of stability -- throughout the Middle East, the U.S. encouraged divisions among Islamic states.


Some believe that the U.S. government supported Fundamentalist religious movements as an additional mechanism to fragment the Arab world.


Petro-dollars brought enormous wealth to many Muslim countries. Unfortunately, only Turkey out of the 50 or so Islamic countries involved are democracies. The leaders are generally autocratic, unelected, and not particularly accountable to public opinion. Their governments see no need to be responsive to the needs of their people. Civil liberties are sharply curtailed.


Political commentator Gynne Dyer writes: "The West created the modern Middle East, from its rotten regimes down to its ridiculous borders, and it did so with contemptuous disregard for the wishes of the local people. It is indeed a problem that most Arab governments are corrupt autocracies that breed hatred and despair in their own people, which then fuels terrorism against the West, but it was the West that created the problem -- and invading Iraq won't solve it. If the U.S. really wants to foster Arab democracy, it might try making all that aid to Egypt conditional on prompt democratic reforms. But I wouldn't hold my breath." 11


Millions of Palestinian refugees have been created as a result of the 1948 and 1967 wars in Palestine. Yet Muslim states have not accepted many into their countries; the refugees have been trapped in camps for decades. "...throughout the Middle East [many] cherish photos, house keys, and deeds to homes that no longer exist or which have housed Israelis for generations." 7


Governments in the region tended to invest in major infrastructure projects, but not in education improvements or activities that would bring economic opportunities to the people. Currently, "Almost half of Arabic-speaking women are illiterate." 11


Some of the countries have made moves towards democratization, and increased participation by the people in government. Turkey remains the only democracy among the 50 or so predominately Muslim countries. The Muslim world generally has few political parties, little press freedom, and few ways to express political dissent.


In many Arab/Muslim countries, the youth suffer immense frustration, created by high unemployment rates, poverty, lack of education, and lack of hope. They have little stake in the political system. They are not allowed to demonstrate against their government. Many deflect anger towards the U.S. - a government that they are often allowed to demonstrate against.


Some Muslims are angry that the U.S. has not spoken out against human rights abuses by those Middle Eastern governments that America supports. John Voll, professor of Islamic history at Georgetown University commented: "People there [in the Middle East] are convinced citizens in the United States have freedoms others don't have, [and] that the United States is also the chief supporter of suppressing democracy." 9 Walter Denny, professor of art history and Middle Eastern studies at the University of Massachusetts said: "The most important question we should be asking ourselves is 'Why do you think they hate us so much?' And if you look at our foreign policy that question is not too difficult to answer." He says that the key grievance is hypocrisy. The U.S. has repeatedly sided with authoritarian regimes such as Algeria, Egypt, Jordan, Morocco, and Turkey. These are regimes that grant their citizens few human rights. They have no free press. Denny concluded: "We [the U.S.] don't trust democracy there. We believe stability is better than democracy. But it's a false kind of stability." 9


In recent years, the U.S. was involved in the Gulf War to liberate Kuwait from Iraqi aggression. They played a major role in ending the genocide against Muslims in Bosnia and the mass crimes against humanity in Kosovo. This has resulted in a favorable towards the U.S. among Muslims in the former Yugoslavia, and among the Saudis and Kuwaitis. But these feelings never spread to other countries.


Countering this is the great sympathy that many Muslims in the Middle East have for the Iraqi people who suffered under past U.S. bombing, a U.S. maintained economic blockade, and a U.S.-led invasion.


Many Muslims object to American culture which has become all-pervasive throughout the world -- particularly among the young. They see it as degenerate and immoral.


"Moderate Muslims are loath to criticize or debunk the fanaticism of the [Islamic] fundamentalists. Like the moderates in Northern Ireland, they are scared of what would happen to them if they speak their mind." 10


The Israeli - Palestine problem: There is a fundamental rule that firefighters use: it is always easier to quench a fire if the source of fuel is first turned off. In the Middle East, the Israeli - PLO conflict is fueling much of the anger, instability, unrest, distrust, hostility, and feelings of victimization in the region. The U.S. is seen as favoring and supporting Israel. They have given over three billion dollars a year in military and economic aid to Israel. The lack of a peace settlement, the continuing expansion of Jewish settlements in occupied lands, the status of the Dome of the Rock at the Temple Mount in Jerusalem -- the third most sacred spot in Islam -- and the status of the Muslim section in East Jerusalem are major flash points. 5 On 2001-SEP-28, the Infatada (uprising) by the Palestinians against Israel passed its first yearly anniversary. It has resulted in the deaths "of 647 people on the Palestinian side, 177 on the Israeli side," and the wounding of many thousands. 8 "Over the past year, Arab TV stations have broadcast countless pictures of Israeli soldiers shooting at Palestinian youths, Israeli tanks plowing into Palestinian homes, Israeli helicopters rocketing Palestinian streets." 7 Rafiq Hariri, the prime minister of Lebanon commented: "You see this every day, and what do you feel? It hurts me a lot. But for hundreds of thousands of Arabs and Muslims, it drives them crazy. They feel humiliated." The ratio of Palestinian to Israeli deaths has been relatively constant at 3 to 1 ever since.


The 9/11 terrorist attack on New York City and the Pentagon proved to be a watershed in US - Middle East relations. At the time, Palestinians and Israelis were involved in a small-scale war -- the Intifada. The U.S. had imposed sanctions on Pakistan because of their nuclear bomb activity. Osama Bin Laden had operated freely in Afghanistan. By late 2001-SEP, there were some promising signs. Most of the Muslim governments in the world backed the U.S. in a combined war against terrorism. Under what must have been immense pressure from the U.S., Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat and Israeli Foreign Minister Simon Peres reached an temporary agreement. Arafat promised to reduce the level of anti-Israeli and anti-Jewish rhetoric emanating from Palestinian radio, TV and religious centers. He has also promised to arrest and disarm terrorists working in PLO territory. The Israeli government promised to lift the siege of enclaves ruled by the PLO, withdraw his troops, prevent attacks on Palestinians, and -- perhaps most important of all -- to freeze Israeli settlement growth in the occupied area. Unfortunately, these improvements were short-lived.


The future: Massive problems continue, including: Jewish settlements in Palestinian areas, Palestinian statehood, sovereignty over Jerusalem, and control of the Al-Harem Al-Sharif (temple mount). Al Qaeda, whose influence had been in decline prior to 9-11, has had a new lease on life. They are experiencing a groundswell of support since the U.S.-led invasions of Afghanistan and Iraq.

Across the Middle East, a number of factors will continue to feed a mood of resentment towards the West in general and the U.S. in particular: "the injustice done to the Palestinians, the cruelty of continued sanctions against Iraq.... the repressive and corrupt nature of US-backed Gulf governments." 7 A surgical strike might assassinate Ben Laden and his high command. But as long as these major irritants continue, other terrorists will rise to take his place. Al Qaeda is not an organization; it is a philosophy.

Im sure it adds up.

So it wasn't due to US support of Israel, US "occupation" of the Arabian Peninsula, and previous US "aggression" against the Iraqi people?

Text of the 1998 fatwah (http://www.ict.org.il/articles/fatwah.htm)
You should read all the way back to 1993.

And, you should read everything he's written. He is echoing the writings of a 10th century writer named Zangi.

The ultimate goal is to turn the world into Dar al-Islam. And to kill us by any means possible. And to negotiate with us when they need to concentrate their forces elsewhere.

And lets ignore the reasons they try to kill us...

When someone is out to kill me they can stick the reasons up their ass...I want to kill them first .

Or do you prefer being a sacrificial lamb ?

Well let me just put my head on that chopping block...your reasons are so sincere and logical..you just convinced me to chop my own head off !

Reason comes before killing..not after .

The ultimate goal is to turn the world into Dar al-Islam. And to kill us by any means possible. And to negotiate with us when they need to concentrate their forces elsewhere.

Actually the ultimate goal is to prevent Dar al-harb to expand into Dar al-Islam.

Unfortunately, we (Dar al-Harb) have overstepped boundaries.

Actually the ultimate goal is to prevent Dar al-harb to expand into Dar al-Islam.

Unfortunately, we (Dar al-Harb) have overstepped boundaries.
Nope. The only way to prevent it from expanding into Dar al-Islam, Dar al-Harb must be destroyed.

Not conquered. Not enslaved. Destroyed.

When someone is out to kill me they can stick the reasons up their ass...I want to kill them first .

Or do you prefer being a sacrificial lamb ?

Well let me just put my head on that chopping block...your reasons are so sincere and logical..you just convinced me to chop my own head off !

Reason comes before killing..not after .

Yeah lets ignore all the atrocities we have committed and only call it an atrocity when they do something bad to us.

Here's his reasons...

Shaykh Usamah Bin-Muhammad Bin-Ladin
Ayman al-Zawahiri, amir of the Jihad Group in Egypt
Abu-Yasir Rifa'i Ahmad Taha, Egyptian Islamic Group
Shaykh Mir Hamzah, secretary of the Jamiat-ul-Ulema-e-Pakistan
Fazlur Rahman, amir of the Jihad Movement in Bangladesh


Praise be to Allah, who revealed the Book, controls the clouds, defeats factionalism, and says in His Book: "But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the pagans wherever ye find them, seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem (of war)"; and peace be upon our Prophet, Muhammad Bin-'Abdallah, who said: I have been sent with the sword between my hands to ensure that no one but Allah is worshipped, Allah who put my livelihood under the shadow of my spear and who inflicts humiliation and scorn on those who disobey my orders.

The Arabian Peninsula has never -- since Allah made it flat, created its desert, and encircled it with seas -- been stormed by any forces like the crusader armies spreading in it like locusts, eating its riches and wiping out its plantations. All this is happening at a time in which nations are attacking Muslims like people fighting over a plate of food. In the light of the grave situation and the lack of support, we and you are obliged to discuss current events, and we should all agree on how to settle the matter.

No one argues today about three facts that are known to everyone; we will list them, in order to remind everyone:

First, for over seven years the United States has been occupying the lands of Islam in the holiest of places, the Arabian Peninsula, plundering its riches, dictating to its rulers, humiliating its people, terrorizing its neighbors, and turning its bases in the Peninsula into a spearhead through which to fight the neighboring Muslim peoples.

If some people have in the past argued about the fact of the occupation, all the people of the Peninsula have now acknowledged it. The best proof of this is the Americans' continuing aggression against the Iraqi people using the Peninsula as a staging post, even though all its rulers are against their territories being used to that end, but they are helpless.

Second, despite the great devastation inflicted on the Iraqi people by the crusader-Zionist alliance, and despite the huge number of those killed, which has exceeded 1 million... despite all this, the Americans are once against trying to repeat the horrific massacres, as though they are not content with the protracted blockade imposed after the ferocious war or the fragmentation and devastation.

So here they come to annihilate what is left of this people and to humiliate their Muslim neighbors.

Third, if the Americans' aims behind these wars are religious and economic, the aim is also to serve the Jews' petty state and divert attention from its occupation of Jerusalem and murder of Muslims there. The best proof of this is their eagerness to destroy Iraq, the strongest neighboring Arab state, and their endeavor to fragment all the states of the region such as Iraq, Saudi Arabia, Egypt, and Sudan into paper statelets and through their disunion and weakness to guarantee Israel's survival and the continuation of the brutal crusade occupation of the Peninsula.

All these crimes and sins committed by the Americans are a clear declaration of war on Allah, his messenger, and Muslims. And ulema have throughout Islamic history unanimously agreed that the jihad is an individual duty if the enemy destroys the Muslim countries. This was revealed by Imam Bin-Qadamah in "Al- Mughni," Imam al-Kisa'i in "Al-Bada'i," al-Qurtubi in his interpretation, and the shaykh of al-Islam in his books, where he said: "As for the fighting to repulse [an enemy], it is aimed at defending sanctity and religion, and it is a duty as agreed [by the ulema]. Nothing is more sacred than belief except repulsing an enemy who is attacking religion and life."

On that basis, and in compliance with Allah's order, we issue the following fatwa to all Muslims:

The ruling to kill the Americans and their allies -- civilians and military -- is an individual duty for every Muslim who can do it in any country in which it is possible to do it, in order to liberate the al-Aqsa Mosque and the holy mosque [Mecca] from their grip, and in order for their armies to move out of all the lands of Islam, defeated and unable to threaten any Muslim. This is in accordance with the words of Almighty Allah, "and fight the pagans all together as they fight you all together," and "fight them until there is no more tumult or oppression, and there prevail justice and faith in Allah."

This is in addition to the words of Almighty Allah: "And why should ye not fight in the cause of Allah and of those who, being weak, are ill-treated (and oppressed)? -- women and children, whose cry is: 'Our Lord, rescue us from this town, whose people are oppressors; and raise for us from thee one who will help!'"

We -- with Allah's help -- call on every Muslim who believes in Allah and wishes to be rewarded to comply with Allah's order to kill the Americans and plunder their money wherever and whenever they find it. We also call on Muslim ulema, leaders, youths, and soldiers to launch the raid on Satan's U.S. troops and the devil's supporters allying with them, and to displace those who are behind them so that they may learn a lesson.

Almighty Allah said: "O ye who believe, give your response to Allah and His Apostle, when He calleth you to that which will give you life. And know that Allah cometh between a man and his heart, and that it is He to whom ye shall all be gathered."

Almighty Allah also says: "O ye who believe, what is the matter with you, that when ye are asked to go forth in the cause of Allah, ye cling so heavily to the earth! Do ye prefer the life of this world to the hereafter? But little is the comfort of this life, as compared with the hereafter. Unless ye go forth, He will punish you with a grievous penalty, and put others in your place; but Him ye would not harm in the least. For Allah hath power over all things."

Almighty Allah also says: "So lose no heart, nor fall into despair. For ye must gain mastery if ye are true in faith."


now ask me if I care .........

Nope. The only way to prevent it from expanding into Dar al-Islam, Dar al-Harb must be destroyed.

Not conquered. Not enslaved. Destroyed.

While the general condition of conflict between the two may stem from the Islamic mission to convert, specific instances of warfare are believed to be always due to the immoral and disordered nature of dar al-harb regions.

While the general condition of conflict between the two may stem from the Islamic mission to convert, specific instances of warfare are believed to be always due to the immoral and disordered nature of dar al-harb regions.

It's no longer the mission to convert.

Bin Laden has written at length, often quoting Zangi. Yes, to them we are immoral and disordered. We are also not considered human, or of any value in life. We are a threat - not just the US, but the entire Western way of life and thought.

As such a threat, we must be eliminated. Entirely. A Final Solution, so to speak.

Here's his reasons...




now ask me if I care .........
Do you care?

Nope. The only way to prevent it from expanding into Dar al-Islam, Dar al-Harb must be destroyed.

Not conquered. Not enslaved. Destroyed.

I really can't see any relation between that stated aim and the attacks made thus far. They've flown planes into buildings, set bombs on trains, and inspired suicide bombers. None of these actions move towards destroying anything, just unbalancing their targets and inspiring violence against Islam.

Why haven't they tried hitting power plants, agriculture, water sources, really vital targets? They don't select for actual detrimental impact, just psychological shock value.

In the Name of Allah, the Most Gracious, the Most Merciful,
"Permission to fight (against disbelievers) is given to those (believers) who are fought against, because they have been wronged and surely, Allah is Able to give them (believers) victory" [Quran 22:39]

"Those who believe, fight in the Cause of Allah, and those who disbelieve, fight in the cause of Taghut (anything worshipped other than Allah e.g. Satan). So fight you against the friends of Satan; ever feeble is indeed the plot of Satan."[Quran 4:76]

Some American writers have published articles under the title 'On what basis are we fighting?' These articles have generated a number of responses, some of which adhered to the truth and were based on Islamic Law, and others which have not. Here we wanted to outline the truth - as an explanation and warning - hoping for Allah's reward, seeking success and support from Him.

While seeking Allah's help, we form our reply based on two questions directed at the Americans:

(Q1) Why are we fighting and opposing you?
Q2)What are we calling you to, and what do we want from you?

As for the first question: Why are we fighting and opposing you? The answer is very simple:

(1) Because you attacked us and continue to attack us.

a) You attacked us in Palestine:

(i) Palestine, which has sunk under military occupation for more than 80 years. The British handed over Palestine, with your help and your support, to the Jews, who have occupied it for more than 50 years; years overflowing with oppression, tyranny, crimes, killing, expulsion, destruction and devastation. The creation and continuation of Israel is one of the greatest crimes, and you are the leaders of its criminals. And of course there is no need to explain and prove the degree of American support for Israel. The creation of Israel is a crime which must be erased. Each and every person whose hands have become polluted in the contribution towards this crime must pay its*price, and pay for it heavily.

(ii) It brings us both laughter and tears to see that you have not yet tired of repeating your fabricated lies that the Jews have a historical right to Palestine, as it was promised to them in the Torah. Anyone who disputes with them on this alleged fact is accused of anti-semitism. This is one of the most fallacious, widely-circulated fabrications in history. The people of Palestine are pure Arabs and original Semites. It is the Muslims who are the inheritors of Moses (peace be upon him) and the inheritors of the real Torah that has not been changed. Muslims believe in all of the Prophets, including Abraham, Moses, Jesus and Muhammad, peace and blessings of Allah be upon them all. If the followers of Moses have been promised a right to Palestine in the Torah, then the Muslims are the most worthy nation of this.

When the Muslims conquered Palestine and drove out the Romans, Palestine and Jerusalem returned to Islaam, the religion of all the Prophets peace be upon them. Therefore, the call to a historical right to Palestine cannot be raised against the Islamic Ummah that believes in all the Prophets of Allah (peace and blessings be upon them) - and we make no distinction between them.

(iii) The blood pouring out of Palestine must be equally revenged. You must know that the Palestinians do not cry alone; their women are not widowed alone; their sons are not orphaned alone.

(b) You attacked us in Somalia; you supported the Russian atrocities against us in Chechnya, the Indian oppression against us in Kashmir, and the Jewish aggression against us in Lebanon.

(c) Under your supervision, consent and orders, the governments of our countries which act as your agents, attack us on a daily basis;

(i) These governments prevent our people from establishing the Islamic Shariah, using violence and lies to do so.

(ii) These governments give us a taste of humiliation, and places us in a large prison of fear and subdual.

(iii) These governments steal our Ummah's wealth and sell them to you at a paltry price.

(iv) These governments have surrendered to the Jews, and handed them most of Palestine, acknowledging the existence of their state over the dismembered limbs of their own people.

(v) The removal of these governments is an obligation upon us, and a necessary step to free the Ummah, to make the Shariah the supreme law and to regain Palestine. And our fight against these governments is not separate from out fight against you.

(d) You steal our wealth and oil at paltry prices because of you international influence and military threats. This theft is indeed the biggest theft ever witnessed by mankind in the history of the world.

(e) Your forces occupy our countries; you spread your military bases throughout them; you corrupt our lands, and you besiege our sanctities, to protect the security of the Jews and to ensure the continuity of your pillage of our treasures.

(f) You have starved the Muslims of Iraq, where children die every day. It is a wonder that more than 1.5 million Iraqi children have died as a result of your sanctions, and you did not show concern. Yet when 3000 of your people died, the entire world rises and has not yet sat down.

(g) You have supported the Jews in their idea that Jerusalem is their eternal capital, and agreed to move your embassy there. With your help and under your protection, the Israelis are planning to destroy the Al-Aqsa mosque. Under the protection of your weapons, Sharon entered the Al-Aqsa mosque, to pollute it as a preparation to capture and destroy it.

(2) These tragedies and calamities are only a few examples of your oppression and aggression against us. It is commanded by our religion and intellect that the oppressed have a right to return the aggression. Do not await anything from us but Jihad, resistance and revenge. Is it in any way rational to expect that after America has attacked us for more than half a century, that we will then leave her to live in security and peace?!!

(3) You may then dispute that all the above does not justify aggression against civilians, for crimes they did not commit and offenses in which they did not partake:

(a) This argument contradicts your continuous repetition that America is the land of freedom, and its leaders in this world. Therefore, the American people are the ones who choose their government by way of their own free will; a choice which stems from their agreement to its policies. Thus the American people have chosen, consented to, and affirmed their support for the Israeli oppression of the Palestinians, the occupation and usurpation of their land, and its continuous killing, torture, punishment and expulsion of the Palestinians. The American people have the ability and choice to refuse the policies of their Government and even to change it if they want.

(b) The American people are the ones who pay the taxes which fund the planes that bomb us in Afghanistan, the tanks that strike and destroy our homes in Palestine, the armies which occupy our lands in the Arabian Gulf, and the fleets which ensure the blockade of Iraq. These tax dollars are given to Israel for it to continue to attack us and penetrate our lands. So the American people are the ones who fund the attacks against us, and they are the ones who oversee the expenditure of these monies in the way they wish, through their elected candidates.

(c) Also the American army is part of the American people. It is this very same people who are shamelessly helping the Jews fight against us.

(d) The American people are the ones who employ both their men and their women in the American Forces which attack us.

(e) This is why the American people cannot be not innocent of all the crimes committed by the Americans and Jews against us.

(f) Allah, the Almighty, legislated the permission and the option to take revenge. Thus, if we are attacked, then we have the right to attack back. Whoever has destroyed our villages and towns, then we have the right to destroy their villages and towns. Whoever has stolen our wealth, then we have the right to destroy their economy. And whoever has killed our civilians, then we have the right to kill theirs.

The American Government and press still refuses to answer the question:

Why did they attack us in New York and Washington?

If Sharon is a man of peace in the eyes of Bush, then we are also men of peace!!! America does not understand the language of manners and principles, so we are addressing it using the language it understands.

(Q2) As for the second question that we want to answer: What are we calling you to, and what do we want from you?

(1) The first thing that we are calling you to is Islam.

(a) The religion of the Unification of God; of freedom from associating partners with Him, and rejection of this; of complete love of Him, the Exalted; of complete submission to His Laws; and of the discarding of all the opinions, orders, theories and religions which contradict with the religion He sent down to His Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him). Islam is the religion of all the prophets, and makes no distinction between them - peace be upon them all.

It is to this religion that we call you; the seal of all the previous religions. It is the religion of Unification of God, sincerity, the best of manners, righteousness, mercy, honour, purity, and piety. It is the religion of showing kindness to others, establishing justice between them, granting them their rights, and defending the oppressed and the persecuted. It is the religion of enjoining the good and forbidding the evil with the hand, tongue and heart. It is the religion of Jihad in the way of Allah so that Allah's Word and religion reign Supreme. And it is the religion of unity and agreement on the obedience to Allah, and total equality between all people, without regarding their colour, sex, or language.

(b) It is the religion whose book - the Quran - will remained preserved and unchanged, after the other Divine books and messages have been changed. The Quran is the miracle until the Day of Judgment. Allah has challenged anyone to bring a book like the Quran or even ten verses like it.

(2) The second thing we call you to, is to stop your oppression, lies, immorality and debauchery that has spread among you.

(a) We call you to be a people of manners, principles, honour, and purity; to reject the immoral acts of fornication, homosexuality, intoxicants, gambling's, and trading with interest.

We call you to all of this that you may be freed from that which you have become caught up in; that you may be freed from the deceptive lies that you are a great nation, that your leaders spread amongst you to conceal from you the despicable state to which you have reached.

(b) It is saddening to tell you that you are the worst civilization witnessed by the history of mankind:

(i) You are the nation who, rather than ruling by the Shariah of Allah in its Constitution and Laws, choose to invent your own laws as you will and desire. You separate religion from your policies, contradicting the pure nature which affirms Absolute Authority to the Lord and your Creator. You flee from the embarrassing question posed to you: How is it possible for Allah the Almighty to create His creation, grant them power over all the creatures and land, grant them all the amenities of life, and then deny them that which they are most in need of: knowledge of the laws which govern their lives?

(ii) You are the nation that permits Usury, which has been forbidden by all the religions. Yet you build your economy and investments on Usury. As a result of this, in all its different forms and guises, the Jews have taken control of your economy, through which they have then taken control of your media, and now control all aspects of your life making you their servants and achieving their aims at your expense; precisely what Benjamin Franklin warned you against.

(iii) You are a nation that permits the production, trading and usage of intoxicants. You also permit drugs, and only forbid the trade of them, even though your nation is the largest consumer of them.

(iv) You are a nation that permits acts of immorality, and you consider them to be pillars of personal freedom. You have continued to sink down this abyss from level to level until incest has spread amongst you, in the face of which neither your sense of honour nor your laws object.

Who can forget your President Clinton's immoral acts committed in the official Oval office? After that you did not even bring him to account, other than that he 'made a mistake', after which everything passed with no punishment. Is there a worse kind of event for which your name will go down in history and remembered by nations?

(v) You are a nation that permits gambling in its all forms. The companies practice this as well, resulting in the investments becoming active and the criminals becoming rich.

(vi) You are a nation that exploits women like consumer products or advertising tools calling upon customers to purchase them. You use women to serve passengers, visitors, and strangers to increase your profit margins. You then rant that you support the liberation of women.

(vii) You are a nation that practices the trade of sex in all its forms, directly and indirectly. Giant corporations and establishments are established on this, under the name of art, entertainment, tourism and freedom, and other deceptive names you attribute to it.

(viii) And because of all this, you have been described in history as a nation that spreads diseases that were unknown to man in the past. Go ahead and boast to the nations of man, that you brought them AIDS as a Satanic American Invention.

(xi) You have destroyed nature with your industrial waste and gases more than any other nation in history. Despite this, you refuse to sign the Kyoto agreement so that you can secure the profit of your greedy companies and*industries.

(x) Your law is the law of the rich and wealthy people, who hold sway in their political parties, and fund their election campaigns with their gifts. Behind them stand the Jews, who control your policies, media and economy.

(xi) That which you are singled out for in the history of mankind, is that you have used your force to destroy mankind more than any other nation in history; not to defend principles and values, but to hasten to secure your interests and profits. You who dropped a nuclear bomb on Japan, even though Japan was ready to negotiate an end to the war. How many acts of oppression, tyranny and injustice have you carried out, O callers to freedom?

(xii) Let us not forget one of your major characteristics: your duality in both manners and values; your hypocrisy in manners and principles. All*manners, principles and values have two scales: one for you and one for the others.

(a)The freedom and democracy that you call to is for yourselves and for white race only; as for the rest of the world, you impose upon them your monstrous, destructive policies and Governments, which you call the 'American friends'. Yet you prevent them from establishing democracies. When the Islamic party in Algeria wanted to practice democracy and they won the election, you unleashed your agents in the Algerian army onto them, and to attack them with tanks and guns, to imprison them and torture them - a new lesson from the 'American book of democracy'!!!

(b)Your policy on prohibiting and forcibly removing weapons of mass destruction to ensure world peace: it only applies to those countries which you do not permit to possess such weapons. As for the countries you consent to, such as Israel, then they are allowed to keep and use such weapons to defend their security. Anyone else who you suspect might be manufacturing or keeping these kinds of weapons, you call them criminals and you take military action against them.

(c)You are the last ones to respect the resolutions and policies of International Law, yet you claim to want to selectively punish anyone else who does the same. Israel has for more than 50 years been pushing UN resolutions and rules against the wall with the full support of America.

(d)As for the war criminals which you censure and form criminal courts for - you shamelessly ask that your own are granted immunity!! However, history will not forget the war crimes that you committed against the Muslims and the rest of the world; those you have killed in Japan, Afghanistan, Somalia, Lebanon and Iraq will remain a shame that you will never be able to escape. It will suffice to remind you of your latest war crimes in Afghanistan, in which densely populated innocent civilian villages were destroyed, bombs were dropped on mosques causing the roof of the mosque to come crashing down on the heads of the Muslims praying inside. You are the ones who broke the agreement with the Mujahideen when they left Qunduz, bombing them in Jangi fort, and killing more than 1,000 of your prisoners through suffocation and thirst. Allah alone knows how many people have died by torture at the hands of you and your agents. Your planes remain in the Afghan skies, looking for anyone remotely suspicious.

(e)You have claimed to be the vanguards of Human Rights, and your Ministry of Foreign affairs issues annual reports containing statistics of those countries that violate any Human Rights. However, all these things vanished when the Mujahideen hit you, and you then implemented the methods of the same documented governments that you used to curse. In America, you captured thousands the Muslims and Arabs, took them into custody with neither reason, court trial, nor even disclosing their names. You issued newer, harsher laws.

What happens in Guatanamo is a historical embarrassment to America and its values, and it screams into your faces - you hypocrites, "What is the value of your signature on any agreement or treaty?"

(3) What we call you to thirdly is to take an honest stance with yourselves - and I doubt you will do so - to discover that you are a nation without principles or manners, and that the values and principles to you are something which you merely demand from others, not that which you yourself must adhere to.

(4) We also advise you to stop supporting Israel, and to end your support of the Indians in Kashmir, the Russians against the Chechens and to also cease supporting the Manila Government against the Muslims in Southern Philippines.

(5) We also advise you to pack your luggage and get out of our lands. We desire for your goodness, guidance, and righteousness, so do not force us to send you back as cargo in coffins.

(6) Sixthly, we call upon you to end your support of the corrupt leaders in our countries. Do not interfere in our politics and method of education. Leave us alone, or else expect us in New York and Washington.

(7) We also call you to deal with us and interact with us on the basis of mutual interests and benefits, rather than the policies of sub dual, theft and occupation, and not to continue your policy of supporting the Jews because this will result in more disasters for you.

If you fail to respond to all these conditions, then prepare for fight with the Islamic Nation. The Nation of Monotheism, that puts complete trust on Allah and fears none other than Him. The Nation which is addressed by its Quran with the words: "Do you fear them? Allah has more right that you should fear Him if you are believers. Fight against them so that Allah will punish them by your hands and disgrace them and give you victory over them and heal the breasts of believing people. And remove the anger of their (believers') hearts. Allah accepts the repentance of whom He wills. Allah is All-Knowing, All-Wise." [Quran9:13-1]

The Nation of honour and respect:

"But honour, power and glory belong to Allah, and to His Messenger (Muhammad- peace be upon him) and to the believers." [Quran 63:8]

"So do not become weak (against your enemy), nor be sad, and you will be*superior ( in victory )if you are indeed (true) believers" [Quran 3:139]

The Nation of Martyrdom; the Nation that desires death more than you desire life:

"Think not of those who are killed in the way of Allah as dead. Nay, they are alive with their Lord, and they are being provided for. They rejoice in what Allah has bestowed upon them from His bounty and rejoice for the sake of those who have not yet joined them, but are left behind (not yet martyred) that on them no fear shall come, nor shall they grieve. They rejoice in a grace and a bounty from Allah, and that Allah will not waste the reward of the believers." [Quran 3:169-171]

The Nation of victory and success that Allah has promised:

"It is He Who has sent His Messenger (Muhammad peace be upon him) with guidance and the religion of truth (Islam), to make it victorious over all other religions even though the Polytheists hate it." [Quran 61:9]

"Allah has decreed that 'Verily it is I and My Messengers who shall be victorious.' Verily Allah is All-Powerful, All-Mighty." [Quran 58:21]

The Islamic Nation that was able to dismiss and destroy the previous evil Empires like yourself; the Nation that rejects your attacks, wishes to remove your evils, and is prepared to fight you. You are well aware that the Islamic Nation, from the very core of its soul, despises your haughtiness and arrogance.

If the Americans refuse to listen to our advice and the goodness, guidance and righteousness that we call them to, then be aware that you will lose this Crusade Bush began, just like the other previous Crusades in which you were humiliated by the hands of the Mujahideen, fleeing to your home in great silence and disgrace. If the Americans do not respond, then their fate will be that of the Soviets who fled from Afghanistan to deal with their military defeat, political breakup, ideological downfall, and economic bankruptcy.

This is our message to the Americans, as an answer to theirs. Do they now know why we fight them and over which form of ignorance, by the permission of Allah, we shall be victorious?


He still gets a missle in the face as soon as he crawls out of his hole .
He and his followers can kiss my ass.

He still gets a missle in the ass as soon as he crawls out of his hole .

You know what? Go find him instead of acting like a moron on the internet.

I really can't see any relation between that stated aim and the attacks made thus far. They've flown planes into buildings, set bombs on trains, and inspired suicide bombers. None of these actions move towards destroying anything, just unbalancing their targets and inspiring violence against Islam.

Why haven't they tried hitting power plants, agriculture, water sources, really vital targets? They don't select for actual detrimental impact, just psychological shock value.

Bin Laden has acknowledged that they don't yet have the ability to do all of this. Hence the need to acquire nuclear weapons and biological weapons.

Also, they negotiate truces - such as the one with Spain - they won't attack Spain until they are finished with other countries like the US and UK.

They are planning to proceed beyond shock value. It was laid out over a decade ago.

Are there any ragheads, niggers, paddy's, chinks, spicks or ivan's to comment on this subject? Apparantly all the crackers had a shot at it...:sniper:

Are there any ragheads, niggers, paddy's, chinks, spicks or ivan's to comment on this subject? Apparantly all the crackers had a shot at it...:sniper:

Technically, I'm not a cracker.

A gook/kike maybe, but not a cracker.

I prefer to call the people that get shot "step ons" regardless of whose side they are on.

I really can't see any relation between that stated aim and the attacks made thus far. They've flown planes into buildings, set bombs on trains, and inspired suicide bombers. None of these actions move towards destroying anything, just unbalancing their targets and inspiring violence against Islam.

Why haven't they tried hitting power plants, agriculture, water sources, really vital targets? They don't select for actual detrimental impact, just psychological shock value.


9/11 was a strategic target of economic value. I don't know how much money was lost and how many people lost their jobs, but it was a very big hit.

You know what? Go find him instead of acting like a moron on the internet.


whats the matter little boy...You get all flustered when someone calls your bullshit ? :D :D

Technically, I'm not a cracker.

A gook/kike maybe, but not a cracker.

I prefer to call the people that get shot "step ons" regardless of whose side they are on.

Sorry, I missed out on the kikes, I hope you don't feel discriminated now ;)

PS: Chink=Gook

whats the matter little boy...You get all flustered when someone calls your bullshit ? :D :D

Saying "I dont care" and "he gets a missile in his face as soon as he crawls out of his hole" is not calling anyones bullshit, kid.

And has anyone read this:

UMMAT: You have been accused of involvement in the attacks in New York and Washington. What do you want to say about this? If you are not involved, who might be?

USAMA BIN LADEN: In the name of Allah (God), the most beneficent, the most merciful. Praise be to Allah, Who is the creator of the whole universe and Who made the Earth as an abode for peace, for the whole humankind. Allah is the Sustainer, who sent Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) for our guidance. I am thankful to the Ummat Group of Publications, which gave me the opportunity to convey my viewpoint to the people, particularly the valiant and momin (true Muslim) people of Pakistan who refused to believe the lies of the demon (Pakistani military dictator General Pervez Musharraf).

I have already said that I am not involved in the 11 September attacks in the United States. As a Muslim, I try my best to avoid telling a lie. I had no knowledge of these attacks, nor do I consider the killing of innocent women, children and other humans as an appreciable act. Islam strictly forbids causing harm to innocent women, children and other people. Such a practice is forbidden even in the course of a battle. It is the United States, which is perpetrating every maltreatment on women, children and common people of other faiths, particularly the followers of Islam. All that is going on in Palestine for the last 11 months is sufficient to call the wrath of God upon the United States and Israel. There is also a warning for those Muslim countries, which witnessed all these as a silent spectator. What had earlier been done to the innocent people of Iraq, Chechnya and Bosnia? Only one conclusion could be derived from the indifference of the United States and the West to these acts of terror and the patronage of the tyrants by these powers that America is an anti-Islamic power and it is patronizing the anti-Islamic forces. Its friendship with the Muslim countries is just a show, rather deceit. By enticing or intimidating these countries, the United States is forcing them to play a role of its choice. Put a glance all around and you will see that the slaves of the United States are either rulers or enemies of Muslims.

I mean he says he wants to destroy dar al-harb, but at the same time does not?

Saying "I dont care" and "he gets a missile in his face as soon as he crawls out of his hole" is not calling anyones bullshit, kid.

And has anyone read this:



I mean he says he wants to destroy dar al-harb, but at the same time does not?

Read some Zangi first, and then come back. You'll be shocked.

They are free to lie to us, or to delay parts of the plan. So he will sound as though he is wanting to kill us and not kill us. But what they want to do is kill us. It's easier if we are divided about what they plan to do.

Like I said, read Zangi. It's Osama's playbook.

When I say the word Raghead, rest assured I am referring to a 22 year old male who executes, bombs, and attacks coalition forces AND Iraqi civilians. Somehow someone seems to think I'm being racist against arabs...rest assured I am not. If you don't bomb, behead, or attack civilians or Coalition...then congratulations, you have just failed the test for being branded a raghead.
Perhaps you are just looking for a way to "justify" using ethnic slurs?

From Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Raghead):

Raghead is an ethnic slur generally denigrating a male who wears a type of clothing on the head, usually Arab, Pashtun, Middle Eastern or South Asian descent.

Following from the September 11, 2001 attacks where Osama bin Laden was identified as the Al Qaeda leader behind the plot, this slur has increasingly meant Arabs and Muslims in general.

Now if you continue to use the term, knowing that it is indeed an "ethnic slur", then you will be demonstrating your bigotry.

Yeah Im sure thats the reason :rolleyes:

Well, just because the Ottoman empire wanted to invade Austria and gain control over Europe and put it under islamic rule doesn't mean we have to fight back, let's just roll on our backs and give 'em an easy victory, eh?
*Treehugging*:headbang:

You should read all the way back to 1993.

And, you should read everything he's written. He is echoing the writings of a 10th century writer named Zangi.

The ultimate goal is to turn the world into Dar al-Islam. And to kill us by any means possible. And to negotiate with us when they need to concentrate their forces elsewhere.
Isn't that kinda similar to your earlier expressed desire to wipe out all of Afghanistan and North Korea?

Extremists obviously exist on both sides of the planet?

Isn't that kinda similar to your earlier expressed desire to wipe out all of Afghanistan and North Korea?

Extremists obviously exist on both sides of the planet?

I don't have 100,000 or more followers willing to die for my cause.

I don't have 100,000 or more followers willing to die for my cause.
Oh because a raving lunatic doesn't have anyone willing to follow him, it makes it okay?

I don't have 100,000 or more followers willing to die for my cause.
Don't worry, bin Laden is out in the cold anyway. Ayman al-Zawahiri is mostly calling the shots these days.

(Isn't that comforting? ;) )

For some reason I have never been able to replicate that look no matter what bed sheet I use.

Hmm... I always thought "raghead" was more of an insult to a man who is of Sikh faith and wore a turban on his head.

Those guys have fundamentalist insanity problems in common.

Oh because a raving lunatic doesn't have anyone willing to follow him, it makes it okay?
Yes, because I'm not really a danger to the world since I have no followers.

Hmm... I always thought "raghead" was more of an insult to a man who is of Sikh faith and wore a turban on his head.

Those guys have fundamentalist insanity problems in common.

Not in recent years, it hasn't. I lived in the middle east for a few years there, and the term 'raghead' was very taboo. You don't want to be dead? Don't say that word...

Whatever it's origin may be, it is now a general derogatory word meant in the direction of all Muslims, particularly Arabs.

It's just not nice, people! :(

True in a few cases...but...

Well, just because the Ottoman empire wanted to invade Austria and gain control over Europe and put it under islamic rule doesn't mean we have to fight back, let's just roll on our backs and give 'em an easy victory, eh?
*Treehugging*:headbang:
I always miss the part where 'understanding a motivation' became equivocated with capitulation. Crazy me, I always thought we had two different words for the concepts because they where two different concepts. But that's me, using my words...

Of course failing to understand the history and attitudes of south east Asian countries didn't have disastrous results for us in the past, so why start understanding now? What could we possibly fuck up when dealing with it...

There's a similar pattern where Buddhism was adhered to tightly. Religions that encourage a fatalistic worldview aren't conducive to technological progress.

Japan prospered when they entered the Meiji Period precisely because they steered themselves willingly into modernity.
I don't even know where to begin with this one, I really, really don't.

Can I just state that you really missed the mark about the Meiji Restoration and what was going on and leave it at that?

Has anyone else noticed that most civilizations touched by Christianity and Western culture seem to do better than most societies that have converted to Islam? Sure, there are exceptions everywhere, but I used the word 'most'. Is this observation wrong?
It obviously doesn't have to do with Christianity. Neither with most of "Western Culture" whatever you will call it.

There are two factors involved here: A certain level of meritocratic humanism, and capitalism.
In fact, look at some of the earlier Islamic kingdoms etc, these were relatively open socially and a lot more meritocratic than Europe was - and they did much better. Once they reverted to more oppressive forms of society, they declined, just as Europe was developing capitalism (the ultimate expression of meritocratic humanism).

Are there any ragheads, niggers, paddy's, chinks, spicks or ivan's to comment on this subject? Apparantly all the crackers had a shot at it...:sniper:

Hey, as a nominal Protestant on the isle of Ireland I qualify as a paddy (although not a mick), and I've already had my say.