NationStates Jolt Archive

sometimes, i think they just don't get it. other times, i know so.

i mean, honestly (http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=NzZkNDU5MmViNzVjNzkzMDE3NzNlN2MyZjRjYTk4YjE=)

Yeah, it's kind of hard to rail against "the man" when you are, in fact, "the man." And these guys have no sense of irony, that's for damn sure. The way they misread "Sympathy for the Devil" is criminal, and the fact that they turned to Tammy Wynette for number 50--who could never be mistaken for rock--shows me that by that point, they figured no one with any sense would still be buying it, so it didn't matter what they put on the list.

Hahahaha!

I think whoever compiled that list has NO IDEA how to interpret lyrics.

personally, i sort of like the idea of the clash as noted conservatives

personally, i sort of like the idea of the clash as noted conservatives

I about pissed myself when I saw they had Zep, the Beatles, and U2 on there myself. My beverage actually did come out my nose.


edit: not to mention CCR, BOC, The Stones, and Rush as well.

I think whoever compiled that list has NO IDEA how to interpret lyrics.

"but the blink 182 song was called 'stay together for the kids'. it clearly must be about how wonderful family life is when that idea is tried out."

They put motherfucking "Godzilla" on there? How the fuck is a song based on an entity from movies that staunchly support environmentalism and oppose capitalism be conservative?

Hahahaha!

I think whoever compiled that list has NO IDEA how to interpret lyrics.
What they do have, however, is a notable talent for cherrypicking and taking original lines out of context. Like, for instance, choosing "My City Was Gone" by the Pretenders. The government in power when she wrote that song? President Ronald Reagan. Is it still a conservative anthem now?

These bastards are trying to claim The Beatles for themselves! Heads will roll for this bullshit!

I didn't realize that only conservatives opposed Stalin and Mao.

I didn't realize that only conservatives opposed Stalin and Mao.

Didn't you know? If you are not a conservative, then you obviously worship Stalin and Mao.

i saw a top 5 inluding the Who (I hope i die before i get old), the stones, the beatles (john lennon funding the IRA) and the beach boys and just stopped. the man is clearly either mental or mental.

***edit, i was weak and looked a bit more. the pistols, the clash, bob dylan, . fuck you miller.

i mean the clash are conservative becasue right wing radio played rock the casbah? is that the sound of joe strummer, the brixton rioter, spinning in his grave?

And these guys have no sense of irony, that's for damn sure.

i'm beginning to think that there might actually be some sort of causal connection here, actually. cause it seems far too common on that side to be purely coincidental. like when tom delay's legal fund people approvingly cited the colbert report.

i'm beginning to think that there might actually be some sort of causal connection here, actually. cause it seems far too common on that side to be purely coincidental. like when tom delay's legal fund people approvingly cited the colbert report.
That may be part of it. I think another part of it is that these guys fully subscribe to the notion that if they like something, it must be conservative, which is, of course, utter bullshit.

My favorite is "Why Don't You Get A Job?" by Offspring.

Great, a song that has nothing to do with unemployment, politics, economics...

*head explodes*

I didn't realize that only conservatives opposed Stalin and Mao.
Yes, it made the classic "liberals = communists" mistake.

Yes, it made the classic "liberals = communists" mistake.
You say that as though it wasn't intentional.

You say that as though it wasn't intentional.
You're right. The only possible explanation is outright stupidity.

...


wow. Just wow.

How exactly do The Beatles get labled as having any songs that are conservative anthems? Much less, having The Offspring? :rolleyes:

...


wow. Just wow.

How exactly do The Beatles get labled as having any songs that are conservative anthems? Much less, having The Offspring? :rolleyes:Especially, of all songs, Revolution.

Especially, of all songs, Revolution.
that bothers me almost as much as it being used by Nike.


I take that back. It bothers me more.

that bothers me almost as much as it being used by Nike.


I take that back. It bothers me more.
As well it should, my friend.

21. “Heroes,” by David Bowie. David Bowie - Heroes - Heroes ; buy CD on Amazon.com
A Cold War love song about a man and a woman divided by the Berlin Wall. No moral equivalence here: “I can remember / Standing / By the wall / And the guns / Shot above our heads / And we kissed / As though nothing could fall / And the shame / Was on the other side / Oh we can beat them / For ever and ever.”

Conservative values?

And you
You can be mean
And I
I'll drink all the time

Uh-huh.

Nevermind the fact that what side of the wall (if it is indeed the Berlin Wall) is being referred to, and who can beat whom is undefined, given that the columnist seems to be satisfied with only the most surface of readings.

...


wow. Just wow.

How exactly do The Beatles get labled as having any songs that are conservative anthems? Much less, having The Offspring? :rolleyes:

Hey, The Offspring do have a conservative song:

"You Gotta Keep'm Seperated (but equal.)"

They really don't get it do they?

29. “Rime of the Ancient Mariner,” by Iron Maiden. Iron Maiden - Live After Death - Rime of the Ancient Mariner ; buy CD on Amazon.com
A heavy-metal classic inspired by a literary classic. How many other rock songs quote directly from Samuel Taylor Coleridge?

Opium-headed bohemians are now classified as conservative founding fathers?

Conservative values?

And you
You can be mean
And I
I'll drink all the time

Uh-huh.

Nevermind the fact that what side of the wall (if it is indeed the Berlin Wall) is being referred to, and who can beat whom is undefined, given that the columnist seems to be satisfied with only the most surface of readings.
You're giving him credit in that you're saying he can read. I'll give him this one--number 4 is Sweet Home Alabama by Lynyrd Skynyrd, and while I think that just barely squeezes into the category of rock, it is decidedly conservative.

I'll give him this one--number 4 is Sweet Home Alabama by Lynyrd Skynyrd, and while I think that just barely squeezes into the category of rock, it is decidedly conservative.

Oh yeah, I'll certainly give him that one, but he seems a tad uninformed or possibly just aiming for laughs: I'm sure we could dig out some Nugent which would fit the bill a hell of a lot better than all his tenuous straw-grasping.

an interesting challenge - which songs on the list could plausibly be called conservative by non-idiots?

Oh yeah, I'll certainly give him that one, but he seems a tad uninformed or possibly just aiming for laughs: I'm sure we could dig out some Nugent which would fit the bill a hell of a lot better than all his tenuous straw-grasping.
When I first saw this list like a week ago and noticed that there was none of the Motor City Madman on it, I wondered why, since Nugent's politics are like a fat, straight changeup for a list like this. That makes me think that this list was meant to try to stretch "logic" to its most ridiculous limits so these clowns can claim some ownership of popular culture.

I'm never sure whether to take the Pistols seriously on "Bodies" (or whether, they are simply being sarcastic, or vulgar for fun), but to assume there is a thing conservative about the Pistols is folly bordering on total inanity.

To be fair, it's a hard list to compile.

I'm never sure whether to take the Pistols seriously on "Bodies" (or whether, they are simply being sarcastic, or vulgar for fun), but to assume there is a thing conservative about the Pistols is folly bordering on total inanity.

To be fair, it's a hard list to compile.
I'd say it's practically impossible, to be quite frank about it. The very essence of great rock music is the anti-establishment stance. If anything, rock music is generally to the left of left-wing politics; it's very nearly the antithesis of conservatism.

I'd say it's practically impossible, to be quite frank about it. The very essence of great rock music is the anti-establishment stance. If anything, rock music is generally to the left of left-wing politics; it's very nearly the antithesis of conservatism.

even when it isn't wearing its politics on its sleeves, it is never friendly to 'conservative values'. it's fucking devil music that's played too loudly, is openly sexual, and is just crass.

To be fair, it's a hard list to compile.

Plenty (although not all) of Christian rock could probably fit on the list.

even when it isn't wearing its politics on its sleeves, it is never friendly to 'conservative values'. it's fucking devil music that's played to loudly, is openly sexual, and is just crass.
And that's why it's been the dominant music form of the last sixty years or so.

They put motherfucking "Godzilla" on there? How the fuck is a song based on an entity from movies that staunchly support environmentalism and oppose capitalism be conservative?
That's where I stopped reading the list. They can't possibly have even seen the American Godzilla (if you can call it Godzilla, but that's another topic...). It's pretty fucking comical.

That's where I stopped reading the list.

quitter

quitter
To be fair, it took me a lot of whiskey and a massive suspension of disbelief. And I've built up a pretty good tolerance for wingnut bullshit.

Wow. I dock the Conservative movement 5 respect points.

The Author, I would kill on site for his criminal misinterpretation of lyrics.

He has no idea about The Beatles "Taxman".
Harrison wrote it because they were being taxed at 95% (:eek: ), hence the lines, "Let me tell you how it will be. There's one for you, nineteen for me...I'm the Taxman".
I think railing against a 95% tax rate is hardly a sign of ultra-conservatism.

I think after that, the Beatles moved to somewhere off-shore (like Jersey) where they didn't have to declare their incomes.

How in Lennon's name can they conceivavbly ever think of any Sex Pistols song as being conservative?
Mind you - I'd love to hear that being played at a GOP rally. It would cause quite a few infarctions.

One good point to note about this list - I didn't Motorhead did a version of "stand by your man" and am going to right now look for it on Lime. Incidentally, Lemmy et al do an awesome cover of AC/DC's "Long way to the top".

...


wow. Just wow.

How exactly do The Beatles get labled as having any songs that are conservative anthems? Much less, having The Offspring? :rolleyes:

I'm surprised there was no Dead Kennedys on the list.

Here's a question...

...what do you think the reaction would be from the artists themselves if they learned they were on this list??

“Sweet Home Alabama,” by Lynyrd Skynyrd. ; buy CD on Amazon.com
A tribute to the region of America that liberals love to loathe, taking a shot at Neil Young’s Canadian arrogance along the way: “A Southern man don’t need him around anyhow.”

There's a good song.

sometimes, i think they just don't get it. other times, i know so.

i mean, honestly (http://article.nationalreview.com/?q=NzZkNDU5MmViNzVjNzkzMDE3NzNlN2MyZjRjYTk4YjE=)

Wow.

Just - Wow.

“Sweet Home Alabama,” by Lynyrd Skynyrd. ; buy CD on Amazon.com
A tribute to the region of America that liberals love to loathe, taking a shot at Neil Young’s Canadian arrogance along the way: “A Southern man don’t need him around anyhow.”

There's a good song.
Well, I have no particular loathing for Alabama--spent many a fun night in Mobile, as a matter of fact. My beef with that song---the most appropriate on the list, by the way--comes from the lines

In Birmingham they love the governor (Wallace)
Now we all did what we could do.
Watergate does not bother me.
Does your conscience bother you?
Tell the truth.

Hmmm. Support for a racist governor and illegal presidential actions including domestic spying. That's certainly not liberalism they're describing.

The dope forgot the song that I quote in my sig.

Well, I have no particular loathing for Alabama--spent many a fun night in Mobile, as a matter of fact. My beef with that song---the most appropriate on the list, by the way--comes from the lines

In Birmingham they love the governor (Wallace)
Now we all did what we could do.
Watergate does not bother me.
Does your conscience bother you?
Tell the truth.

Hmmm. Support for a racist governor and illegal presidential actions including domestic spying. That's certainly not liberalism they're describing.
That and 'Stand by your man' are the only two on that list I'd consider conservative.
Especially 'Alabama', because of the above lyrics. Good one - I'm not bothered at all by the US President committing a criminal act, because he's a republican.
Now, I'm certain I've heard that before, only more recently than that song...


Speaking of 'Sweet home, Alabama', Killdozer do one awesome kick-ass version of it. Worth tracking down. It wasn't on any of their albums - was on a compilation LP (with stuff from Butthole Surfers, Big Black, Scratch Acid and a couple of other bands). LP called 'Dog's favourite God'. Unfortunately never released on CD, so pretty hard to come by nowadays.

you know, they really should have included rage against the machine's classic anti-gun control anthem, "down rodeo". or the pro-military and pro-family "bulls on parade".

What the fuck is this guy smoking?!?

The Beatles' "Revolution"?!?

The whole Chairman Mao and "ain't gonna make it with anyone anyhow" is a direct slam on conservatives who think Liberals are Communists!

Jesus, this guy is dense. Dense like a fox? Actually, this smacks of yet another attempt to redefine or re-interpret reality according to Neocon perception. As Paul or Ringo if they thought "Revolution" was in ANY way Conservative. Hold your ears when you do, the laughter might deafen you.

I think this is my favourite bit:
The Battle of Evermore - Led Zeppelin
The lyrics are straight out of Robert Plant’s Middle Earth period — there are lines about “ring wraiths” and “magic runes” — but for a song released in 1971, it’s hard to miss the Cold War metaphor: "The tyrant’s face is red."
I've heard of some wacky interpretations of Zeppelin songs, but that one about takes the biscuit.

I'm surprised there was no Dead Kennedys on the list.
Given the anticontextual nature of this horseshit list, you've got a very good point.

Here's a question...

...what do you think the reaction would be from the artists themselves if they learned they were on this list??
Earth shattering gut-laughter, if there's any justice.

Here's a question...

...what do you think the reaction would be from the artists themselves if they learned they were on this list??

I think someone needs to bring this list to the attention of Bono- he might have a little bit to say about it....

I think this is my favourite bit:

I've heard of some wacky interpretations of Zeppelin songs, but that one about takes the biscuit.
Better choice from Zeppelin is the song that Cadillac uses for it's commercials. If there was ever a conservative icon, the Caddy is it. Kinda funny that it's also an icon for pimps, too.

How did they miss Bruce Springsteen? Shit, they played "Born in the USA" at GOP political conventions in the 80s...despite it's mild chiding of Vietnam.

The way Miller's logic runs, where's Motley Crue's "Girls Girls Girls"? Shit, that's sexist and puts women in their proper place as playthings for men, right?

Okay, let's try and make a list that really reflects what this nutjob botched.

Bruce Springsteen, "Born in the USA"
Jars of Clay, "Flood"
Stryper, "To Hell With the Devil"
Charlie Daniels Band, "The Devil Went Down to Georgia" Country, but got Top 40 airplay for a long time.
Lee Greenwood, "God Bless the USA" -- okay, it's country, but it gets played like a rock anthem.

Shit, that's all I can think of off the top of my head.

However, in searching, I found that Miller is not the only guily asshole doing this. Check out this link -- there are duplicates, but even more alarming interpretations on it. And this page includes a debate about Ben Folds' "Brick".

http://www.bendomenech.com/blog/archives/000246.html

How did they miss Bruce Springsteen? Shit, they played "Born in the USA" at GOP political conventions in the 80s...despite it's mild chiding of Vietnam.

Bruce Springsteen, "Born in the USA"
According to Wikipedia, that's an urban legend. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Born_in_the_U.S.A._%28song%29#Urban_legend)

Considerable urban legend exists about the role of "Born in the U.S.A." in the 1984 presidential campaign beyond what is described above. In particular it is thought or claimed that Reagan specifically mentioned the song, clearly misinterpreted the song, explicitly misappropriated the song, or that the song was played at Reagan campaign rallies. It is also claimed that Mondale tried to appropriate the song in some way. None of these claims are true. Indeed, after the Hammonton speech, Springsteen was never again mentioned in the Reagan campaign. [2] Nor did Mondale's campaign, en route to a landslide defeat, make any further references to Springsteen of note.

George Will did, at least partly, misinterpret "Born in the U.S.A.", which may have led Reagan or those in his staff to do so. On the other hand, it is quite possible Reagan had never heard of this song or any other Springsteen song, and in the Hammonton speech may have just been attempting to ride the popularity of a local star, hardly an uncommon political practice.

Better choice from Zeppelin is the song that Cadillac uses for it's commercials. If there was ever a conservative icon, the Caddy is it. Kinda funny that it's also an icon for pimps, too.
"Been a Long Time Since I Rock an' Rolled"? Yeah, it'd fit the profile of older Conservatives, too -- who buy the Caddies and have likely never "rock an' rolled" in the way Robert Plant was singing about.

According to Wikipedia, that's an urban legend. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Born_in_the_U.S.A._%28song%29#Urban_legend)
That wasn't my point, but well-researched anyway. Good on ya.

However, in searching, I found that Miller is not the only guily asshole doing this. Check out this link -- there are duplicates, but even more alarming interpretations on it. And this page includes a debate about Ben Folds' "Brick".

http://www.bendomenech.com/blog/archives/000246.html

haha, radiohead's "electioneering"

now we already know that ben domenech is none too bright for other reasons, but i'll take it as another data point for my hypothesis that being a conservative necessarily requires a less than optimal level of brain functioning.

haha, radiohead's "electioneering"

now we already know that ben domenech is none too bright for other reasons, but i'll take it as another data point for my hypothesis that being a conservative necessarily requires a less than optimal level of brain functioning.
When you're talking about this particular type of conservatism---the pundit brand--intelligence is subsidiary to the willingness to be intellectually dishonest. For instance, when Jonah Goldberg really tries, he can make some engaging points--I still tend to disagree with them, but he's at least making a debatable argument. But most of the time, he just hacks all over the place. I can't think of a time when Domenech has made a salient argument, however.

I think someone needs to bring this list to the attention of Bono- he might have a little bit to say about it....

Why not? He certainly has plenty to say on everything else.

What I find ironic is that "America, Fuck Yeah!!" isn't even on the list, much less the Top 10. Despite it's satiric roots, the political climate in the U.S. is at the point where a whole lot of people would seriously adopt it as the new National Anthem.

What I find ironic is that "America, Fuck Yeah!!" isn't even on the list, much less the Top 10. Despite it's satiric roots, the political climate in the U.S. is at the point where a whole lot of people would seriously adopt it as the new National Anthem.
Someone (might have been you) mentioned the adoption of The Colbert Report's "defense" of Tom DeLay by DeLay's legal defense fundraiser, so there's no telling what these folks might decide to adopt.

Well, I have no particular loathing for Alabama--spent many a fun night in Mobile, as a matter of fact. My beef with that song---the most appropriate on the list, by the way--comes from the lines

In Birmingham they love the governor (Wallace)
Now we all did what we could do.
Watergate does not bother me.
Does your conscience bother you?
Tell the truth.

Hmmm. Support for a racist governor and illegal presidential actions including domestic spying. That's certainly not liberalism they're describing.
If you had any clue about Sweet Home, you'd realize that those lyrics are ironic. In fact, you forgot the fact that after the "In Birmingham they love the governor" they sing "boo, boo, boo!" The so called "feud" between LS and Neil Young also is bullshit. Hell, Neil played with LS live on stage repeatedly, and Van Zant is noted for having worn a Neil Young T-shirt on stage to screw with some of the fans.

If SWA has any message, it's that it is a big mistake to classify all southern men as racist sonsabitches. There are actually some decent people in the south, and to treat Alabamans the way Neil Young did in his song is just plain incorrect.

Sorry about being hostile in that previous post, not quite sure what got into me there, totally wrong place for me to flip out.

What part of this does seem like is that some of these songs have a somewhat libertarian bent. My experiences have shown that conservatives do tend to like to co-opt anything that they can find that's even remotely libertarian. But, all the same, that's only for a few of the songs. Some of the other songs on there are the result of some creative lyric interpretation, interpretation I certainly wouldn't use, but that doesn't necessarily invalidate it all the same. Art is art and it means different things to different people.

If you had any clue about Sweet Home, you'd realize that those lyrics are ironic.

so in other words, they don't even get that one

Sorry about being hostile in that previous post, not quite sure what got into me there, totally wrong place for me to flip out.

What part of this does seem like is that some of these songs have a somewhat libertarian bent. My experiences have shown that conservatives do tend to like to co-opt anything that they can find that's even remotely libertarian. But, all the same, that's only for a few of the songs. Some of the other songs on there are the result of some creative lyric interpretation, interpretation I certainly wouldn't use, but that doesn't necessarily invalidate it all the same. Art is art and it means different things to different people.
To an extent, I agree. Yes, a piece of art can have millions of different meanings. But a written piece will have the ability to make some interpretations invalid. If an interpretation is not sufficiently supported by the text, then it is an invalid interpretation. I see that as being the major flaw...while, yes, these select lines from this song say whathaveyou, the rest of the song contradicts it...if that made any sense....

To go back to the born in the USA example, Yes, the lines "Born in the USA" scream pride in America. However, the rest of the song contradicts that pride

If you had any clue about Sweet Home, you'd realize that those lyrics are ironic. In fact, you forgot the fact that after the "In Birmingham they love the governor" they sing "boo, boo, boo!" The so called "feud" between LS and Neil Young also is bullshit. Hell, Neil played with LS live on stage repeatedly, and Van Zant is noted for having worn a Neil Young T-shirt on stage to screw with some of the fans.

If SWA has any message, it's that it is a big mistake to classify all southern men as racist sonsabitches. There are actually some decent people in the south, and to treat Alabamans the way Neil Young did in his song is just plain incorrect.
The way I've always heard that song is with the words "true, true, true" but I'd be willing to accept the idea of the song being ironic. There is the line at the end which says "And the governor's true." If it's meant ironically, I'm missing something. And I knew the stuff about Neil Young was crap, which is why I didn't mention it. I'd much rather that the song be the way you describe it; let me think on it a bit.

Sorry about being hostile in that previous post, not quite sure what got into me there, totally wrong place for me to flip out.

What part of this does seem like is that some of these songs have a somewhat libertarian bent. My experiences have shown that conservatives do tend to like to co-opt anything that they can find that's even remotely libertarian. But, all the same, that's only for a few of the songs. Some of the other songs on there are the result of some creative lyric interpretation, interpretation I certainly wouldn't use, but that doesn't necessarily invalidate it all the same. Art is art and it means different things to different people.Don't sweat the hostility--I've certainly been known to flip out over things that others find inconsequential. ;)

As far as invalidating the interpretation, it's one thing to interpret a song in its entirety "creatively"; it's another thing altogether to pull two lines out of context and then claim they mean something altogether different (I'm thinking about the lines from "The Battle of Evermore" here) or to take them out of historical context and act like the situation now is the same as it was when the song was written (like in "Taxman").

:mad: The Sex Pistols at 8, and Rock the Casbah at 20? Where's my torch?! Where's my fucking torch?!

some additional suggestions for their list:

"the kkk took my baby away" by the ramones
and
"gay bar" by electric six

Stupidest. List. Ever.
Neocon talking heads should be banned from reviewing music on penalty of law.

Stupidest. List. Ever.
Neocon talking heads should be banned from reviewing music on penalty of law.
Heh. Indeed. ;)