NationStates Jolt Archive


Democrats, Republicans, Christians & Moveon.org on the Internet's side!

Eutrusca
28-05-2006, 12:43
COMMENTARY: It's been said that "politics makes strange bedfellows," and this must also be true of defense of the Internet. Dems., Reps., Christians and Moveon.org on the same side??? Amazing!

Two thumbs way, way up!

BTW ... if you want to help this effort to keep the Internet neutral, sign the petition at http://www.Savetheinternet.com


Why the Democratic Ethic of the World Wide Web May Be About to End (http://www.nytimes.com/2006/05/28/opinion/28sun3.html?th&emc=th)


By ADAM COHEN
Published: May 28, 2006
The World Wide Web is the most democratic mass medium there has ever been. Freedom of the press, as the saying goes, belongs only to those who own one. Radio and television are controlled by those rich enough to buy a broadcast license. But anyone with an Internet-connected computer can reach out to a potential audience of billions.

This democratic Web did not just happen. Sir Tim Berners-Lee, the British computer scientist who invented the Web in 1989, envisioned a platform on which everyone in the world could communicate on an equal basis. But his vision is being threatened by telecommunications and cable companies, and other Internet service providers, that want to impose a new system of fees that could create a hierarchy of Web sites. Major corporate sites would be able to pay the new fees, while little-guy sites could be shut out.

Sir Tim, who keeps a low profile, has begun speaking out in favor of "net neutrality," rules requiring that all Web sites remain equal on the Web. Corporations that stand to make billions if they can push tiered pricing through have put together a slick lobbying and marketing campaign. But Sir Tim and other supporters of net neutrality are inspiring growing support from Internet users across the political spectrum who are demanding that Congress preserve the Web in its current form.

The Web, which Sir Tim invented as a scientist at CERN, the European nuclear physics institute, is often confused with the Internet. But like e-mail, the Web runs over the system of interconnected computer networks known as the Internet. Sir Tim created the Web in a decentralized way that allowed anyone with a computer to connect to it and begin receiving and sending information.

That open architecture is what has allowed for the extraordinary growth of Internet commerce and communication. Pierre Omidyar, a small-time programmer working out of his home office, was able to set up an online auction site that anyone in the world could reach — which became eBay. The blogging phenomenon is possible because individuals can create Web sites with the World Wide Web prefix, www, that can be seen by anyone with Internet access.

Last year, the chief executive of what is now AT&T sent shock waves through cyberspace when he asked why Web sites should be able to "use my pipes free." Internet service providers would like to be able to charge Web sites for access to their customers. Web sites that could not pay the new fees would be accessible at a slower speed, or perhaps not be accessible at all.

A tiered Internet poses a threat at many levels. Service providers could, for example, shut out Web sites whose politics they dislike. Even if they did not discriminate on the basis of content, access fees would automatically marginalize smaller, poorer Web sites.

Consider online video, which depends on the availability of higher-speed connections. Internet users can now watch channels, like BBC World, that are not available on their own cable systems, and they have access to video blogs and Web sites like YouTube.com, where people upload videos of their own creation. Under tiered pricing, Internet users might be able to get videos only from major corporate channels.

Sir Tim expects that there are great Internet innovations yet to come, many involving video. He believes people at the scene of an accident — or a political protest — will one day be able to take pictures with their cellphones that could be pieced together to create a three-dimensional image of what happened. That sort of innovation could be blocked by fees for the high-speed connections required to relay video images.

The companies fighting net neutrality have been waging a misleading campaign, with the slogan "hands off the Internet," that tries to look like a grass-roots effort to protect the Internet in its current form. What they actually favor is stopping the government from protecting the Internet, so they can get their own hands on it.

But the other side of the debate has some large corporate backers, too, like Google and Microsoft, which could be hit by access fees since they depend on the Internet service providers to put their sites on the Web. It also has support from political groups of all persuasions. The president of the Christian Coalition, which is allied with Moveon.org on this issue, recently asked, "What if a cable company with a pro-choice board of directors decides that it doesn't like a pro-life organization using its high-speed network to encourage pro-life activities?"

Forces favoring a no-fee Web have been gaining strength. One group, http://www.Savetheinternet.com, says it has collected more than 700,000 signatures on a petition. Last week, a bipartisan bill favoring net neutrality, sponsored by James Sensenbrenner, Republican of Wisconsin, and John Conyers Jr., Democrat of Michigan, won a surprisingly lopsided vote in the House Judiciary Committee.

Sir Tim argues that service providers may be hurting themselves by pushing for tiered pricing. The Internet's extraordinary growth has been fueled by the limitless vistas the Web offers surfers, bloggers and downloaders. Customers who are used to the robust, democratic Web may not pay for one that is restricted to wealthy corporate content providers.

"That's not what we call Internet at all," says Sir Tim. "That's what we call cable TV."
Super-power
28-05-2006, 12:56
Alert the Internet!!! :eek:
-Master Shake

Ok, now that I've gotten that out of my system...can't tiered pricing on the internet be considered unethical business practices?
Eritrita
28-05-2006, 12:57
Alert the Internet!!! :eek:
-Master Shake

Ok, now that I've gotten that out of my system...can't tiered pricing on the internet be considered unethical business practices?
And unethical business practices have stopped when?
Cannot think of a name
28-05-2006, 13:03
I'm having trouble understanding this one, they want to ding us coming and going?

We already pay for internet connections and web sites pay for web hosting-more for larger websites, more bandwidth, etc. What else is there left to charge for?
Rotovia-
28-05-2006, 13:06
You touch my bandwidth, you die!
Zagat
28-05-2006, 13:30
I'm having trouble understanding this one, they want to ding us coming and going?

We already pay for internet connections and web sites pay for web hosting-more for larger websites, more bandwidth, etc. What else is there left to charge for?
The same thing they already are charging for. It's kinda like if you own a phone and pay for the phone line and you ring someone. Either that someone pays your phone company money or the call is of very poor quality, or you buy a tv and plug it in to the electrical service you are paying for the tv works properly if the manufacturer has also paid the electrical service or only intermittently if the manufacturer has not.
Gravlen
28-05-2006, 13:43
I'm having trouble understanding this one, they want to ding us coming and going?

We already pay for internet connections and web sites pay for web hosting-more for larger websites, more bandwidth, etc. What else is there left to charge for?
Oh ye of little imagination :p

(This post = 0.30$)
Taldaan
28-05-2006, 13:57
Curses! I can't sign the petition because I don't live in the USA and therefore don't have a congressman, despite this being an issue about a British invention.
Non Aligned States
28-05-2006, 13:58
What else is there left to charge for?

Don't ask that question! If certain corp execs had their way, they'd be charging you for the air you breathe when you walk into their offices. Hell, they'd charge a viewing fee for looking at one of their products or even thinking about it, calling it 'thought piracy'.
Cannot think of a name
28-05-2006, 14:40
Don't ask that question! If certain corp execs had their way, they'd be charging you for the air you breathe when you walk into their offices. Hell, they'd charge a viewing fee for looking at one of their products or even thinking about it, calling it 'thought piracy'.
Hehe-on this-one of my jobs on occasion is to 'Greek' products that might be included in a shot-turn cans of soda so the logo isn't showing, tape over the names of products and symbols, etc. Turns out, and this is the weird one to me, if the corporation didn't pay for thier product to be in the shot they'd sue for use of thier tradmark-or so that's how it's been explained to me.

Still having trouble with what end of the exchange that they are trying to charge for. Bandwidth is already charged on a step scale, isn't that why sites get bothered by hotlinking images? And why Max had to move our rowdy asses to Jolt? Maybe I just don't know enough about how websites work or something. I have one, and I 'pay' for it by the host having ads on it. (it's really just a place for my resume etc, I don't do much with it.)
Eutrusca
28-05-2006, 14:56
Curses! I can't sign the petition because I don't live in the USA and therefore don't have a congressman, despite this being an issue about a British invention.
I was under the impression that anyone could sign the petition. You might want to check that again. There's a box for "Country."
Turquoise Days
28-05-2006, 15:24
I was under the impression that anyone could sign the petition. You might want to check that again. There's a box for "Country."
Doesn't let me sign. Says it's for the constituents of targeted descicionmakers - ie American politicians, I suppose.

There will be others somewhere.
Lunatic Goofballs
28-05-2006, 15:32
*holds up sign: "Will Work for Bandwidth".*

:p
Eutrusca
28-05-2006, 15:35
*holds up sign: "Will Work for Bandwidth".*

:p
[ holds up sign ] "Will work for sex!" :D

( I like mine better! ) Heh!
Assis
28-05-2006, 15:37
I'm having trouble understanding this one, they want to ding us coming and going?

We already pay for internet connections and web sites pay for web hosting-more for larger websites, more bandwidth, etc. What else is there left to charge for?
Isn't it obvious? Information. The more you download, the more you pay. Wanna be clever and informed? Sorry, you got to be rich first. Basically, you would pay for each search on Google, since Telecoms want to charge Google for supplying them with clients... What a joke...

Just another example of how Capitalism risks throwing the poorer classes into education levels that could be compared to those of mediaeval ages.
Lunatic Goofballs
28-05-2006, 15:38
[ holds up sign ] "Will work for sex!" :D

( I like mine better! ) Heh!

Someday, it might be the same thing:

On Virtual reality: "The day a big fat truck driver can have sex with Cindy Crawford whenever he wants is the day Virtual Reality makes crack look like corn flakes!" -Dennis Miller.

:) This is why we need a free and neutral internet.
The Lone Alliance
28-05-2006, 15:40
Wow, something that everyone (Besides corporate FatCats and their dwindling Government Puppets) agrees on? And people say it can't be done.
Sel Appa
28-05-2006, 15:43
Another reason we need some form of Marxism...
Lunatic Goofballs
28-05-2006, 15:45
Another reason we need some form of Marxism...

As long as it's Groucho Marxism, I'm there. :)
Zagat
28-05-2006, 16:58
Isn't it obvious? Information. The more you download, the more you pay. Wanna be clever and informed? Sorry, you got to be rich first. Basically, you would pay for each search on Google, since Telecoms want to charge Google for supplying them with clients... What a joke...

Just another example of how Capitalism risks throwing the poorer classes into education levels that could be compared to those of mediaeval ages.
Actually I dont think that is what is intended.
I understand that people already pay for their internet access and they are not (so far as I can see) expected to pay more (at least in connection with this particular scheme) but rather that what that money pays for will be determined by website hosts. Visit sites that 'pay up' to your internet provider and you wont notice the difference, visit sites that wont pay up, and their functionality (loading times etc) will be impaired if they retain any functionality at all.

Basically when you visit a site, your computer sends out a request to the web page server for data (html, steaming video, flash, what ever the elements of the web page are) to be sent to your computer. So your computer sends a message out to the web-server and the web-server sends info back down the line to you.

So you supply computer, the web page host supplies a computer that sends the web page info to you on request. The connection between the server and yourself that you pay for is the where the contention lies.

If you imagine instead that you purchase a phone service, you ring people up and you pay for all the call costs - then one day your telephone service provider says to themselves ''mmm, ok my customers use my phone lines to make calls, that's ok they pay me, but the person who they are ringing do not pay me in order to be able to answer the phone call even though they too send and recieve info through my lines during the phone call - the call reciever both recieves the voice data sent by the phoner and sends their own data down the phone line to the phoner, but it doesnt cost them anything. Right from now on anyone called by my customers either pays me money or the phone call wont function as it should.

So now you are still paying all your phone charges but your phone only works properly for phone calls to people who pay your telephone service provider for the ability to be called by you....

Now please dont think that the apparently ridiculous suggestion it appears I am making cannot be what I am in fact suggesting on account of it being such a frigging outrageously ridiculous and blatent rip-off, it's quite simply that this is how friggen bold and checky and 'entitled' these sods are and how friggen stupid and docile they think we all are and that's how in their pockets they believe the US government is...
Corneliu
28-05-2006, 17:22
Now this is interesting. W00T!!
Eutrusca
28-05-2006, 17:26
Someday, it might be the same thing:

On Virtual reality: "The day a big fat truck driver can have sex with Cindy Crawford whenever he wants is the day Virtual Reality makes crack look like corn flakes!" -Dennis Miller.

:) This is why we need a free and neutral internet.
Amen, my brutha! Amen! :D
Eutrusca
28-05-2006, 17:27
Wow, something that everyone (Besides corporate FatCats and their dwindling Government Puppets) agrees on? And people say it can't be done.
Which makes an even stronger argument for keeping the Internet neutral! It's one of the only ways small groups and individuals can make themselves heard.
The Black Forrest
28-05-2006, 18:03
[ holds up sign ] "Will work for sex!" :D

( I like mine better! ) Heh!

*X's out Sex and writes Cialis under it*

You just needed that small correction! :p
DrunkenDove
28-05-2006, 18:30
An internet petition actually achieved something? Wow.
Eutrusca
28-05-2006, 19:07
*X's out Sex and writes Cialis under it*

You just needed that small correction! :p
Bite me, dweeb! :D
Eutrusca
28-05-2006, 19:07
An internet petition actually achieved something? Wow.
Yes, by all reports. Power to teh Intraweb users! :D
Egg and chips
28-05-2006, 19:08
[ holds up sign ] "Will work for sex!" :D

( I like mine better! ) Heh!
[holds up sign] "WILL TRADE SEX FOR BANDWITH"

^Best.
Eutrusca
28-05-2006, 19:13
[holds up sign] "WILL TRADE SEX FOR BANDWITH"

^Best.
How about " Will trade bandwidth for cyber?" :D
Celtlund
28-05-2006, 19:16
Obviously the article is wrong "Sir Tim Berners-Lee, the British computer scientist who invented the Web" as everyone knows Al Gore invented the internet. :D

...i just couldn't resist...
Eutrusca
28-05-2006, 19:47
Obviously the article is wrong "Sir Tim Berners-Lee, the British computer scientist who invented the Web" as everyone knows Al Gore invented the internet. :D

...i just couldn't resist...
LOL! I was wondering when that would pop up on here, and who would post it! :D