NationStates Jolt Archive

Students see red over Mao send-up

THURSDAY , 18 MAY 2006

By CAITLIN MCKAY
A mob of angry Chinese students protested at Massey University yesterday after Chairman Mao was lampooned on the cover of the student newspaper.

Students likened the cover of Chaff, which this week satirises women's magazine Cosmopolitan, to the anti-Muslim cartoons circulated around the world in February.

Tempers flared outside Massey's library as about 50 Chinese Massey and UCOL students and a Chinese lecturer confronted Chaff staff.

Students said the issue is racist and the last straw, as many have also suffered verbal abuse on the streets of Palmerston North.

Tianxiang Mao said it was common for Asian students to be lambasted with racial slurs when driving.

"People yell `F-ing Asians' when we are in the car driving down the road. I don't say anything. What can I do?"

UCOL student Xing Tang said Chaff staff are ignorant of Chinese culture.

"Chairman Mao is like Jesus to us," he said on the verge of tears.

"We pay $20,000 in fees and a Musa fee (which funds Chaff) and this is how we are treated."

Student Ronnie Cao likened the cover to the anti-Muslim cartoons.

"This is discrimination against us."

It will have a huge effect on New Zealand's reputation, Mr Cao said.

However, compared with the United States, New Zealand is still considered a safe place for Chinese parents to send their children, he said.

Yang Chenglin said students are proud of their Chinese culture.

"Mao gave us independence. He's no more a killer than George Washington or George W Bush.

"He is the father of China - without Mao, there is no China."

Mao Zedong, or Chairman Mao, was the founder of the People's Republic of China and one of the most prominent figures in Chinese history.

He is also revered as a great spiritual leader and cultural symbol.

Students gathered in tight circles outside the library yesterday, signing a petition demanding an apology.

Students also want remaining copies pulled out of circulation.

Tensions flared as agitated students confronted Chaff editor Edrei Valath and news editor Matt Russell.

"It was an arbitrary decision to run the cover of Mao," Mr Russell said, adding it was intended as a joke.

"We were looking for a picture of Marx or Lenin and we couldn't use Castro because he had a beard and it just didn't work. I didn't think it would offend."

Mr Valath said students are "enraged for the sake of being enraged".

"It is ironic - in China, the students would have no forum in which to complain."

He said Chinese students studying here should be made aware a good sense of humour is part of Kiwi culture.

But students likened the situation to a racial slur expressed in Victoria University's latest student magazine Salient. The "Top Five Things to Be Wary of" rated the Chinese at No 5.

Dogs also featured in the same line-up, the students said.

Salient editor James Robinson said the Top Five column and the Chaff cover are both "culturally insensitive".

"We are getting hate mail by the minute," Mr Robinson said.

Salient has been in strife over the Top Five column and the item has appeared on a Chinese news website.

Massey University finance lecturer Fei Wu, who's Chinese, said students deserve an explanation.

"This shows no respect to our people.

"There are 1000 Chinese students here who spend a lot of money to study here and this is an insult.

"Students come here for a better environment to get away from class and culture differences. This doesn't solve the problem."

However, Chinese Massey student Tony Song said protesters were being "too sensitive".

"It's been done to the Queen before. I'm not offended at all. I was laughing."

Massey University international office director Bruce Graham said the Chaff cover is in "extremely poor taste". However, he accepted Chaff has editorial independence.

"This shows a lack of respect. Chinese students are an important part of the university's community."

Mr Graham has suggested to Chaff an apology is required.




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Why only highlight some responses to prove your point?

I think that it was a bit of a stupid move by the magazine.

How would you like an English SU magazine with a fairly large NZ-er population putting New Zealand's prime minister on the front cover with "what a bitch"?

People might be a bit less pissed off, but then NZ and the UK's culture are closer than China's.

Maybe it's because Mao is a homicidal tyrant who killed more people than Hitler? That bit?

Your article also indicated other students who were nonplussed by this. Meh.

So if we did this same thing with a Hitler picture and some Neo-Nazis were offended, should one have apologized? :D

Maybe it's because Mao is a homicidal tyrant who killed more people than Hitler? That bit?

Irrelevant. There are a lot of people that weren't that bothered by it, you just indulged in your prejudices a bit by showing people who were pissed off.

*edits*

Mao and Hitler were rather different, you're not really showing like with like. I can also tell you now that if you rubbed it in the face of any German students, they would probably be a bit sad about it, although I'm sure that most Germans have to put up with it every day anyway (I occasionally talk in German on Counter-Strike to be polite to German people and immediately the mood with the English speakers changes from "Eccentric Englander" to people actually shouting out "Oh my God you Nazi"... eugh...)

Yeah, it's my right to indulge in my preferences by criticizing the people I don't like, your point?

I've always likened the Chairman Mao to President Richard M. Nixon. It was only until, what, the last decade of his life that he really wanted to stay in power, and did everything he could towards that goal. People have pointed out the population that Mao slaughtered, but what about the more people that would have starved to death anyhow?

For the magazine: Smooth :rolleyes:

I find it ironic that one says Mao is no killer, considering the PRC in 1981 decided he was responsible for the 'Culture revolution' (which had it's 40th anniversary May 16th btw) which led to the deaths of millions.

I also find it ironic that the first thing these people, coming as they do from a 'socialist' country, do when they protest is bring up the issue of money and threaten the other side with financial hardship if their demands are met.

Mao and Hitler were rather different, you're not really showing like with like.


...you mean Mao was in some way morally superior to Hitler?

The point is he has arranged, deliberately, the murder of dozens of millions of innocent people, often merely for practicing a 'bourgeois profession.'

What?

Those Chinese kids can shut the fuck up. No-one, in the West or anywhere else, should have to apologise for disrespecting a GENOCIDAL MANIAC. Mao is not a cultural hero, he was a tyrant and a murderer, and the people need to know that.

Yeah, it's my right to indulge in my preferences by criticizing the people I don't like, your point?

My point is that you're tarring all of the students with one brush. It's like me showing a bunch of in-bred Southern Americans, who live in a trailer and own vast amounts of weaponry, and have about 23 children and say "all of America is like this".

I'm only tarring all the ones who are defending Mao in one brush.

Yes. I have no respect for those who respect Mao Tse Tung. His legacy should be treated like that of Stalin after the XX Party Congress.

I'm only tarring all the ones who are defending Mao in one brush.

Yes. I have no respect for those who respect Mao Tse Tung. His legacy should be treated like that of Stalin after the XX Party Congress.

Yeah, but just remember that China is still a communist, one-party state and people get educated about how great he is. Maybe if it becomes a democratic, several-party state, where people get educated about what bad things he did, then public Chinese opinion of his would change.

Until then, you have to factor in that a lot of people see him as the saviour of China, simply because they don't really know much else.

I'm only tarring all the ones who are defending Mao in one brush.

Yes. I have no respect for those who respect Mao Tse Tung. His legacy should be treated like that of Stalin after the XX Party Congress.

I agree, but you should know that there are many Chinese students who consider Mao a dictator, but who are not quite as vocal. As an interesting point I observed that students from the coastal cities (with longer capitalist traditions pre-Mao) tend to be more openly critical of Mao then those from inland cities (the hotbed of the CPC).

Anyway I watched a documentary a while back about the legacy of Stalin in modern Russia. I recall a scene where a family in rural Vladivostok was asked about Stalin, and they said that life was better under Stalin's rule. The narrator was shocked that while Stalin was killing millions, many in rural Russia still yearn for those days.

I know this - I only spoke about the ones who voiced their (idiotic) opinion. Franky, these particular students are living in the West, they should long know better. Even in China today you can find out (the Great Firewall is just not all that effective) who he was.

I know this - I only spoke about the ones who voiced their (idiotic) opinion. Franky, these particular students are living in the West, they should long know better. Even in China today you can find out (the Great Firewall is just not all that effective) who he was.

Some people are patriotic no matter what. See the people who still love Bush, even after his incredible cock-ups, seemingly "because he's a Republican".

Yeah, but just remember that China is still a communist, one-party state and people get educated about how great he is. Maybe if it becomes a democratic, several-party state, where people get educated about what bad things he did, then public Chinese opinion of his would change.

Until then, you have to factor in that a lot of people see him as the saviour of China, simply because they don't really know much else.

Public opinion of Mao has already begun to shift, bearing in mind that the architect of modern China's economy, the still-revered patriarch Deng Xiaoping, was Mao's old enemy. The CPC non-event of the 40th anniversary of the Cultural Revolution is an indication of the official distance from Mao Zedong.

Will China ever become a democratic, multi-party state though? The way things go now, tough. Not this century.

Some people are patriotic no matter what. See the people who still love Bush, even after his incredible cock-ups, seemingly "because he's a Republican".

Yeah, but it;'s not like Bush is anywhere near Mao or Hitler.

Yeah, but it;'s not like Bush is anywhere near Mao or Hitler.

On a smaller scale, he is.

And China might become a multi-party state, to be honest, it's not really the world's business. They don't force communism on us, why should we force 'democracy' on them, to be honest?

here's the cover they're so angry and upset about:
http://www.barking-moonbat.com/images/uploads/mao1.jpg
imo, if they can't see that's this is a pisstake and is obviously satire, I have no sympathy for them.
for Mao's sake, get a sense of humour!

here's the cover they're so angry and upset about:
http://www.barking-moonbat.com/images/uploads/mao1.jpg
imo, if they can't see that's this is a pisstake and is obviously satire, I have no sympathy for them.
for Mao's sake, get a sense of humour!

403'd, and I'm not allowed to access it again... thanks...

On a smaller scale, he is.

Under this argument, anybody who ever kills another person (no matter for what reason, no matter how legitimate) or declares war on a foreign nation is Hitler.

403'd, and I'm not allowed to access it again... thanks...
The article and picture is here:
Mao send-up (http://www.barking-moonbat.com/index.php/weblog/most_ridiculous_item_of_the_day17)

The article and picture is here:
Mao send-up (http://www.barking-moonbat.com/index.php/weblog/most_ridiculous_item_of_the_day17)

That suddenly reminded me of all those Che Guevara T-shirts floating around. Damned you mass-customization! :(

Under this argument, anybody who ever kills another person (no matter for what reason, no matter how legitimate) or declares war on a foreign nation is Hitler.

Or locks up his citizens because they "might be a threat", or lets the police arrest people with no actual reason, or indeed sets up several organisations to spy on the general populace.

...in this case, ANY world leader is no different from Mao or Hitler since of course there's no difference between Blair's SAS killing off 2 IRA fighters and the mass slaughter of random millions.

Or locks up his citizens because they "might be a threat", or lets the police arrest people with no actual reason, or indeed sets up several organisations to spy on the general populace.

As non-USAmerican I must say that though I don't think Bush is a saint, or even a good man, I certainly don't consider him a baddie on par with Hitler or Mao. It's a question of degrees.

...in this case, ANY world leader is no different from Mao or Hitler since of course there's no difference between Blair's SAS killing off 2 IRA fighters and the mass slaughter of random millions.
Yeah, Bush and Blair have only managed a million.

Yeah, Bush and Blair have only managed a million.

How did you arrive at that figure?

I just love the 'Free Speech Gives You Herpes?' head line to the right of Mao's head...

My take on it.

Some people seem to be looking for trouble, but they are allowed to protest under the laws of that country, so quite frankly they can go right ahead and do it. They were brought up to think of Mao as a massive symbol for China so you can vaguely see why they would do this, but if we disagree we just have to non forcefully educate them otherwise, if they're willing to listen. Probably impossible I'll grant you, but if we're not going to end up as hypocrites then it's the only way of doing things. Thing is, the very way they are saying that "Mao is like Jesus" is most likely highly offensive to a great many people, yet they are going to be protected under the right of free speech in the very same way that those who produced the article and front cover. So I'll cry 'hypocrisy' for now.

In 'the West' we have lampooned every national leader, raligious leader and economics giant at some point. Bush with his lack of command of the English language, Blair for his mannerisms and Jesus was pictured smoking a joint. Of course much worse can be found on the internet, yet when published in a student magazine all hell breaks loose. Of course there were protests, well maybe only at the Jesus one, but they were still allowed. The same people who protested at the cartoons of Mohammed were using the VERY SAME RIGHT that those who published the cartoons used. There was no difference.

Quite frankly, to quote Thomas Sutcliffe, "The problem is that free speech has never been defended by protecting the saying of things that nobody minds being uttered." What kind of freedom is that? The freedom to not insult people? The freedom to state the obvious? That's no freedom at all. If freedom of speech is to exist, everyone much accept the fact that at some point someone will challenge their beliefs, values, politics and religion and you will have the right to express why you believe what you do back. If you can't accept that, then don't go protesting, because you yourself will be a hypocrite.

Mao ... the Cultural Revolution trashed so much Chinese history in the effort to get Mao as the replacement Chinese Emperor in the guise of Communism.

He was probably the reason why my Chinese ancestors ran from China to Malaysia ;)

Mao ... the Cultural Revolution trashed so much Chinese history in the effort to get Mao as the replacement Chinese Emperor in the guise of Communism.

He was probably the reason why my Chinese ancestors ran from China to Malaysia ;)

Only to fall in love with Chin Peng?;)

Only to fall in love with Chin Peng?;)

Hehe, nope my family are mainly conservative capitalist Chinese, no Commies except I'm more left than the rest of the family. I don't like Communism as Mao wanted it.

Hehe, nope my family are mainly conservative capitalist Chinese, no Commies except I'm more left than the rest of the family. I don't like Communism as Mao wanted it.

Yes, Chin Peng, a devastatingly handsome man in his youth. Those were the heady days when the Chinese were equated with communism. I hope not for long.

BTW I noticed that Chinese Malaysians are overwhelmingly pro-China. The grand total of pro-Taiwan independence dudes I have met comes up to zilch.

But students likened the situation to a racial slur expressed in Victoria University's latest student magazine Salient. The "Top Five Things to Be Wary of" rated the Chinese at No 5.

Dogs also featured in the same line-up, the students said.

Salient editor James Robinson said the Top Five column and the Chaff cover are both "culturally insensitive".

"We are getting hate mail by the minute," Mr Robinson said.

Salient has been in strife over the Top Five column and the item has appeared on a Chinese news website.



I go to Victoria University and as a result, read craplient.. sry 'Salient' most weeks. They rip on everybody in their top 5 lists, and they are in no way meant to be taken seriously. The fact that the chinese students have taken so much offence to that top 5 bit is absolutely crazy, considering that salient did 3000 words the previous week on how overseas students were being charged too much and protests about it were being organised. But hey, they're racist apparently.


In case anyone wants some context, here is a random top 5 from last year: http://www.salient.org.nz/index.php?i=46&c=53. They're stupid, yes. And they're meant to be. Unfortunitely I can't give you the one that is being talked about because the salient team have been a bit lax with the website this year..


Holy shit, I just read through the top 5 I posted, and right down there is this:
People worse than Hitler

1. Josef Stalin
2. Mao Zedong
3. Pol Pot
4. Osama Bin Laden
5. Bill Clinton


I can assure you that there was no uproar over this from chinese students last year...

I read about it in the Dominion Post, i laughed, they are lucky they aren't imprisoned for blasphemy.

I've always likened the Chairman Mao to President Richard M. Nixon. It was only until, what, the last decade of his life that he really wanted to stay in power, and did everything he could towards that goal. People have pointed out the population that Mao slaughtered, but what about the more people that would have starved to death anyhow?

For the magazine: Smooth :rolleyes:


Mao created the circumstances under which millions of people starved to death in his "Great Leap Forward", the program which was to make China a super power. Mao created the circumstances under which people committed acts of cannabalism to survive. Mao Tse Tung was the biggest monster the world has ever known. He was a phsyco path and in many speeches he talked about a nuclear war so that socialism would take the globe, he said (and was probably right) that a nuclear war against China could not be succesful because they could not kill all the chinese. And he said of his "Great Leap Forward" when he was told about starving villagers that "Half of China may well have to die" (250 million people at the time). Under Mao food (that could not be spared) was shipped out of the country to purchase military goods, as well as to gain favor with third world countries, the Chinese people were rationed less calories then those which had lived in Nazi Concetration camps.

And on the bit that Mao liberated China, and is the father of China, is just wrong. The father of modern day China, the man that put in the system of the central government overriding the provinces was Generalismo Chaing Kiashek. This man was driven out of mainland China by Mao and founded Tiawan. Mao is also many times thought to be a geurilla against the Japanese, in fact he ordered Communist troops not to attack Japanese troops. He helped Japan in order to keep and gain control over more provinces. After the Japanese drove off the Nationalists, they didn't have enough troops to occupy China, so they let the communists (who were horrible fighters and had before world war 2 recieved a beating from the Nationalists on a regular basis) occupy the provinces for them. On the one occasion that the communists did fight the Japanese the commander was reprimanded by Mao.

The cult of Mao has remained persistent in China thanks to the Chairman that have followed him. They must legitimate Mao and make him god-like so that their government can continue on.

Hehe, nope my family are mainly conservative capitalist Chinese, no Commies except I'm more left than the rest of the family. I don't like Communism as Mao wanted it.


Mao didn't want communism. In fact in his early days when he was both a member of the Nationalist Party and a leader of the Communist Party, he made it further in the ranks of the Nationalists. He only went with the Communists because he saw his chance to steal a force of about 15,000 troops and take over a province. Mao wanted to be a dictator, he wanted power and comfort, he would have done anything to get it. He wasn't a communist or anything else, he was just selfish.

Public opinion of Mao has already begun to shift, bearing in mind that the architect of modern China's economy, the still-revered patriarch Deng Xiaoping, was Mao's old enemy. The CPC non-event of the 40th anniversary of the Cultural Revolution is an indication of the official distance from Mao Zedong.

Will China ever become a democratic, multi-party state though? The way things go now, tough. Not this century.


You couldn't call Deng Xiaoping and Mao enemy's. In fact Mao only imprisoned Deng Xiaoping because he was after bigger fish in his later years. the fact that he didn't have Deng Xiaoping executed or tortured is evidence that he did not see Deng Xiaoping as an enemy.Deng Xiaoping only took over China because Mao allowed him. Mao let Deng out of prison (an event that was very very very rare).

The magazine can say whatever it wants, provided I can say anything I like about George Bush without the Bushitters bitching.

Will China ever become a democratic, multi-party state though?

Bet = placed.

Man, the flaws of past socialist leaders are so depressing. I'm almost tempted to give up socialism entirely.