Nadkor
17-05-2006, 17:51
ory leader David Cameron has accused Prime Minister Tony Blair of being "rattled" over immigration, foreign prisoners and human rights laws.
In fierce Commons exchanges, Mr Cameron also repeated his claim these issues showed the government's "paralysis".
The PM acknowledged there was "far more" to do but said Mr Cameron had opposed many key security measures.
Ministers are under fire after an immigration chief said he did not know how many illegal immigrants there were.
Mr Blair confirmed there were no official estimates of the number of illegal immigrants, but asylum applications were down and the numbers of failed asylum seekers being deported had increased since 1999.
The introduction of "electronic borders" planned for 2007 and the planned identity card scheme would help control immigration, he added.
He also hit back at criticism from Mr Cameron that he was "making it up as he went along" over the deportation of jailed foreign prisoners.
Mr Blair insisted the government had not shifted its position.
He said there would be an "automatic presumption" to deport foreign prisoners, although he conceded it would not apply to a small number who had served short sentences.
'Right man?'
Mr Cameron said the foreign prisoner debacle - taken together with immigration and the government's failure to reform human rights legislation - showed it was in "paralysis".
"After four home secretaries, 43 pieces of legislation in nine years, should anyone believe he is the right man to sort it out?", asked Mr Cameron.
Home Secretary John Reid was earlier criticised for trying to shift the blame for failing to keep track of illegal immigrants to the Tories.
Mr Reid said Labour had "inherited a legacy of an unknown number" from the Conservatives nine years ago.
Ex-Tory Home Secretary Michael Howard hit back, saying Labour had "abandoned" the Tory government's efforts to track down illegal immigrants.
"Under the previous government, illegal immigrants could expect a knock on the door from the immigration service or police and under this government that has just been abandoned. They have given up on it," Mr Howard told BBC Radio 4's Today programme.
The row erupted after the UK's head of immigration removals David Roberts told MPs on Tuesday he did not "have the faintest idea" of the numbers.
'Mockery'
Mr Roberts told the Commons home affairs committee there was little point trying to hunt people who overstayed their visas and resources had been targeted instead on firms employing illegal workers.
He also said he did not know how many people had been ordered by the Home Office to leave the country - a situation described as "amazing" and "a mockery of the immigration control system" by Labour MP David Winnick.
Committee chairman John Denham told the BBC it was "not so much the absolute numbers" that was worrying but Mr Roberts' "inability to answer what seemed to us some quite basic questions about how the system was operating".
He said Mr Roberts had been too focused on meeting targets and had "lost sight of the bigger picture".
Liberal Democrat home affairs spokesman Nick Clegg said Mr Roberts' "breathtaking admission" confirmed "what many people have suspected for some time: the government's management of our immigration system is completely incompetent".
Tentative estimates on illegal immigrants drawn up for ministers range from 300,000 to 570,000. Source (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/4988816.stm)
So, the government does not "have the faintest idea" how many people are living and working in the UK illegaly? Frankly, I couldn't really care how many people are living here illegaly, but it would be nice to think that the government would at least have some idea of how many there were.
And John Reid blaming the Tories? Dude, your lot have been in power for 9 years, you can't possibly still be blaming the last government. For god sake stand up and acknowledge the governments failings in that time.
In fierce Commons exchanges, Mr Cameron also repeated his claim these issues showed the government's "paralysis".
The PM acknowledged there was "far more" to do but said Mr Cameron had opposed many key security measures.
Ministers are under fire after an immigration chief said he did not know how many illegal immigrants there were.
Mr Blair confirmed there were no official estimates of the number of illegal immigrants, but asylum applications were down and the numbers of failed asylum seekers being deported had increased since 1999.
The introduction of "electronic borders" planned for 2007 and the planned identity card scheme would help control immigration, he added.
He also hit back at criticism from Mr Cameron that he was "making it up as he went along" over the deportation of jailed foreign prisoners.
Mr Blair insisted the government had not shifted its position.
He said there would be an "automatic presumption" to deport foreign prisoners, although he conceded it would not apply to a small number who had served short sentences.
'Right man?'
Mr Cameron said the foreign prisoner debacle - taken together with immigration and the government's failure to reform human rights legislation - showed it was in "paralysis".
"After four home secretaries, 43 pieces of legislation in nine years, should anyone believe he is the right man to sort it out?", asked Mr Cameron.
Home Secretary John Reid was earlier criticised for trying to shift the blame for failing to keep track of illegal immigrants to the Tories.
Mr Reid said Labour had "inherited a legacy of an unknown number" from the Conservatives nine years ago.
Ex-Tory Home Secretary Michael Howard hit back, saying Labour had "abandoned" the Tory government's efforts to track down illegal immigrants.
"Under the previous government, illegal immigrants could expect a knock on the door from the immigration service or police and under this government that has just been abandoned. They have given up on it," Mr Howard told BBC Radio 4's Today programme.
The row erupted after the UK's head of immigration removals David Roberts told MPs on Tuesday he did not "have the faintest idea" of the numbers.
'Mockery'
Mr Roberts told the Commons home affairs committee there was little point trying to hunt people who overstayed their visas and resources had been targeted instead on firms employing illegal workers.
He also said he did not know how many people had been ordered by the Home Office to leave the country - a situation described as "amazing" and "a mockery of the immigration control system" by Labour MP David Winnick.
Committee chairman John Denham told the BBC it was "not so much the absolute numbers" that was worrying but Mr Roberts' "inability to answer what seemed to us some quite basic questions about how the system was operating".
He said Mr Roberts had been too focused on meeting targets and had "lost sight of the bigger picture".
Liberal Democrat home affairs spokesman Nick Clegg said Mr Roberts' "breathtaking admission" confirmed "what many people have suspected for some time: the government's management of our immigration system is completely incompetent".
Tentative estimates on illegal immigrants drawn up for ministers range from 300,000 to 570,000. Source (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/4988816.stm)
So, the government does not "have the faintest idea" how many people are living and working in the UK illegaly? Frankly, I couldn't really care how many people are living here illegaly, but it would be nice to think that the government would at least have some idea of how many there were.
And John Reid blaming the Tories? Dude, your lot have been in power for 9 years, you can't possibly still be blaming the last government. For god sake stand up and acknowledge the governments failings in that time.