NationStates Jolt Archive

Well, after the recent serge of religious topics, I am curiois how many of each religion we have here on the boards.

I apologise in advance for not dividing things up more accurately, but if I seperate protestant and catholic, then I must also seperate all variations of islam, all the brotherhoods of satanism and so forth.

Ick, Satanic should be Satanist.

I am a christian. I make the prediction that you will have a majority of Atheists, some agnostics, followed by christians, then whatever else.

I predict about 50% atheists, 40% christians and 10% miscellaneous. not to discriminate or anything.

Why so many bloody atheists? Perhaps the world is finally taking a step forward! Huzzah!

Though I myself lean toward Satanism...

Other (please specify) ? The specific answer you'll get is "None". I associate myself with no religion or lack thereof, for to do so is utterly meaningless in the context of either spiritual or scientific ideas and only harmful in any other social context.

Well, after the recent serge of religious topics, I am curiois how many of each religion we have here on the boards.

I apologise in advance for not dividing things up more accurately, but if I seperate protestant and catholic, then I must also seperate all variations of islam, all the brotherhoods of satanism and so forth.

I'm an atheist, but there's methodism in my madness.

Buddum tish.

Atheists are over-represented online it seems. It's not just here, I know a lot of atheists online, and almost none offline.

That meant, as an example, Church of Scientology. There are only ten options available. If your other is none at all, why bother to vote? Merely abstain. Though logically you really must be one, even if it is apathetic agnostic/atheist.

Why so many bloody atheists? Perhaps the world is finally taking a step forward! Huzzah!

Though I myself lean toward Satanism...
What kind of Satanism?

Aww, where's the fun in an anonymous poll? :(

I voted atheist, but I don't consider atheism a religion, but rather a belief that can be held by a person whether they voted religious or non-religious (not all religions necessarily contain "God" or an equivalent). I would be a non-religious atheist.

sikhism

Atheism is definitely a religion. You're belief is just not in a specific god. Instead it is a belief in the laws of science.

I'm Christian, or to specify, I'm Protestant (Evangelical-Lutheran like most people in this area), but with catholic tendencies.

Personally I lean toward the First Church of Satan and Order of the Left Hand path.

I simply whacked everything under the umbrella Religion.

Atheism doesn't require belief in the laws of science. It actually doesn't require believing in ANYTHING. Atheism is simply not believing in god. People like to mis-define it as "believing there is no god," but that's actually a very different concept. I do not believe in a god. I also do not disbelieve in a god. But I get annoyed by people who define atheism as things that it's not.

That meant, as an example, Church of Scientology. There are only ten options available. If your other is none at all, why bother to vote? Merely abstain. Though logically you really must be one, even if it is apathetic agnostic/atheist.
Religion and its opposing counterparts are nothing more or less than labels designed to ease social identification by philosophy. The use of the word Census implies that the question was directed to the general public and that therefore everyone involved is obligated to label themselves in some way or another. I actively refuse to do so, and feel that such a position is important enough to raise as an issue.

Current count:
Option:Votes:Percentage
Christian: 10: 41.67%
Jew: 0: 0%
Muslim: 0: 0%
Hindu: 0: 0%
Pagan: 1: 4.17%
Budhist: 0: 0%
Satanic: 0: 0%
Agnostic: 2: 8.33%
Atheist: 9: 37.50%
Other (Please Specify): 2: 8.33%

Atheism is definitely a religion. You're belief is just not in a specific god. Instead it is a belief in the laws of science.
No, you're all wrong. Atheism is not a religion. One can be atheist and not have religion, or atheist and still adhere to certain forms of buddhism or Taoism. Atheists can be totally unscientific too.

Personally I lean toward the First Church of Satan and Order of the Left Hand path.
First Church? They're not La Vey's church, right? Isn't there some kind of disagreement between the two?

Atheism is definitely a religion. You're belief is just not in a specific god. Instead it is a belief in the laws of science.
That's materialism. And materialism is a philosophy, not a science.

Atheism is just one belief. It just means not believing in God. You don't have to be materialist to be atheist.

A belief isn't the same thing as a religion. I believe that I have a jacket in my cupboard. That doesn't mean I have a jacket-and-cupboard-based religion.

Atheism doesn't require belief in the laws of science. It actually doesn't require believing in ANYTHING. Atheism is simply not believing in god. People like to mis-define it as "believing there is no god," but that's actually a very different concept. I do not believe in a god. I also do not disbelieve in a god. But I get annoyed by people who define atheism as things that it's not.
This is a considerable source of contention. In lacking organisation atheism is without the (sometimes)strictly defined nature of other religions. You can ask 1000 buddhists(sp?) to give you a brief run down of buddhism and you'll get a pretty similar answer from all of them. Ask the same thing of atheists and you'll get a lot of different answers. Anyone who believes there is no god(in whatever sense) or who does not believe in a god(again, in whatever sense) generally labels themself an atheist. Since there is no supreme authority on atheism there will most likely never be a proper definition of what atheism is, other than what those who call themselves atheists define it as.

Oops, mis-type. I actually prefer the LaVey Church of Satan.

The First Church was an off-branch by a former member sometime after LaVey's death (I think). I believe it goes back to the roots of Satanism, removing the elitest nature and focusing more on personal freedom and idenitification.

Atheism is just one belief. It just means not believing in God.

No. Atheism is the belief that there is no God.

I hold no beliefs relating to God at all. And thus, I am Agnostic.

Well based upon the WORD Atheist (No Theological Belief), then an Atheist believes in no gods.

13 Atheists and 13 Christians.. Suprising?

I consider myself Atheist/Agnoist

Well based upon the WORD Atheist (No Theological Belief), then an Atheist believes in no gods.
It could be that, or it could be that the Atheist believes in the absence of gods, or it could be that the Atheist does not have a belief either way in the subject of gods, or...

You get the picture. In truth, Atheism is whatever its members want it to be; just like Islam, Christianity, Agnosticism, Buddhism, Republicanism, Liberalism, Anarchism...

Agnostic. That's the one where you believe there possibly is a god, but he doesn't give a flying **** about us and what goes on down here. Right?

Cause that's what I believe.
There MIGHT be a God. But if there is, he doesn't wanna have anything to do with us, and doesn't really care.

It could be that, or it could be that the Atheist believes in the absence of gods, or it could be that the Atheist does not have a belief either way in the subject of gods, or...


What is the difference between believing gods do not exist and an absence of them? That they do exist, yet not in our existence?

An Atheist cannot say they do not have a belief either way in the subject of Gods, they would then be Agnostic. An Atheist is one who does not believe that any form of Gods exists.

Many atheists refer to science, but that does not mean atheists choose science over any other form of belief...

Agnostic. That's the one where you believe there possibly is a god, but he doesn't give a flying **** about us and what goes on down here. Right?

Cause that's what I believe.
There MIGHT be a God. But if there is, he doesn't wanna have anything to do with us, and doesn't really care.

Bingo!

An Atheist cannot say they do not have a belief either way in the subject of Gods, they would then be Agnostic. An Atheist is one who does not believe that any form of Gods exists.

You're being remarkably unclear, here.

First you say that Athiests are not people who have no beliefs pursuant to God, but then define them as not holding a belief, which is consistent with not holding any.

Well based upon the WORD Atheist (No Theological Belief), then an Atheist believes in no gods.

Right, because the definition of an English word is always based solely and entirely upon it's etymological root...

proud to be atheist.

Right.

An Atheist believes that there is no form of god.

Someone who is unsure or apathetic would be agnostic.

Is that clearer?

You left out Sikhism? After Buddhism, they're the coolest major world religion. Sikhs are the best!

What is the difference between believing gods do not exist and an absence of them? That they do exist, yet not in our existence?

An Atheist cannot say they do not have a belief either way in the subject of Gods, they would then be Agnostic. An Atheist is one who does not believe that any form of Gods exists.
Going by the roots of the word Atheism encompasses a number of options, such as the belief in the absence of all gods, a belief in no particular god, an absence of belief in any god, a lack of trust in any gods that may exist regardless of a particular belief that any god may or may not exist, or indeed any position that could be rationalised as contrary to a Theistic one. Not all of these notions are kept within the colloquial use of the word today, as you have aptly pointed out, so to base the definition on an interpretation of the word's origin will inevitably either miss something out or include erroneous information.

EDIT: Your given definition, while up for debate among some self-professed Atheists, seems clearer. Though I'm still explicitly voting "none". I am neither unsure nor apathetic about these issues; I just don't associate myself with anybody in relation to them. =P

You left out Sikhism? After Buddhism, they're the coolest major world religion. Sikhs are the best!

It is why I placed 'Other'. *grins* I ran out of options. Sorry.

Going by the roots of the word Atheism encompasses a number of options, such as the belief in the absence of all gods, a belief in no particular god, an absence of belief in any god, a lack of trust in any gods that may exist regardless of a particular belief that any god may or may not exist, or indeed any position that could be rationalised as contrary to a Theistic one. Not all of these notions are kept within the colloquial use of the word today, as you have aptly pointed out, so to base the definition on an interpretation of the word's origin will inevitably either miss something out or include erroneous information.

Well said actually. *tips hat*

I am a LaVeyan Satanist (thanx for noting the difference Cruxium). I am aware of the other Satanic Churches. There are other Satanist that post here, as well as some with Satanic leanings.

You're quite welcome. I might dislike religions, by and large, but I study them intently.

I am very much a fan of LaVeyan Satanism. I am still carrying out research though. Currently I think it is the most intelligent 'religion' I have seen, or rather, the most 'natural'.

You're quite welcome. I might dislike religions, by and large, but I study them intently.

I am very much a fan of LaVeyan Satanism. I am still carrying out research though. Currently I think it is the most intelligent 'religion' I have seen, or rather, the most 'natural'.


'the hell is it?

'the hell is it?

How much do you know of the Church of Satan?

I'm an agnostic

How much do you know of the Church of Satan?

Nothing
That's why I'm asking

There are, however, things I highly disagree with in the Church of Satanism.

For example, 'magic'. However the Church contradicts itself over this magic.

It states that it is merely "What you put into life is what you get out." Yet at other times that if you successfully invoke magic and yet do not acknowledge it, you lose it.

Those are the Eleven Rules of the Earth.

1. Do not give opinions or advice unless you are asked.

2. Do not tell your troubles to others unless you are sure they want to hear them.

3. When in another’s lair, show him respect or else do not go there.

4. If a guest in your lair annoys you, treat him cruelly and without mercy.

5. Do not make sexual advances unless you are given the mating signal.

6. Do not take that which does not belong to you unless it is a burden to the other person and he cries out to be relieved.

7. Acknowledge the power of magic if you have employed it successfully to obtain your desires. If you deny the power of magic after having called upon it with success, you will lose all you have obtained.

8. Do not complain about anything to which you need not subject yourself.

9. Do not harm little children.

10. Do not kill non-human animals unless you are attacked or for your food.

11. When walking in open territory, bother no one. If someone bothers you, ask him to stop. If he does not stop, destroy him.


7 and 11 are somewhat ridiculous. Otherwise, if you consider each of those in more normal terms, they are intelligent and moral, not dissimilar to religious teachings, with the exception that they make a large point of social deference and respect, as well as reflecting a touch of human nature (e.g. number 4)

'the hell is it?
It's an atheist religion based on doing what you want to do without guilt as long as you don't harm others who haven't harmed or tried to harm you. It is to religion what libertarianism is to politics. Also it uses ceremonies and the names of ancient gods and demons to focus one's primal drives, like the sex drive, the drive to compete for status, and others in order to make one behave in such a way as to help ensure success in his pursuits. At least that's my understanding of it.

Agnostic. That's the one where you believe there possibly is a god, but he doesn't give a flying **** about us and what goes on down here. Right?

Cause that's what I believe.
There MIGHT be a God. But if there is, he doesn't wanna have anything to do with us, and doesn't really care.

Not really...sounds...Deism...ish.

It's an atheist religion based on doing what you want to do without guilt as long as you don't harm others who haven't harmed or tried to harm you. It is to religion what libertarianism is to politics. Also it uses ceremonies and the names of ancient gods and demons to focus one's primal drives, like the sex drive, the drive to compete for status, and others in order to make one behave in such a was as to help ensure success in his pursuits. At least that's my understanding of it.

Very accurate. Very accurate indeed. There is ALOT of symbolism in Satanism, however that is precisely what it is: symbolism. It is common misconception that Satanists worship Satan. In fact they do not believe he exists in the typical sense. Rather they take Satan as a symbol.

Not really...sounds...Deism...ish.
Yeah, the definition of agnosticism isn't just that you're undecided or apathetic, but that you beleive there's now way to know for sure either way (although it's become common to refer to apathy or being undecided as agnostic because they don't have a cool word to go with their view).

So that sounds closer to deism (belief that there is a God who does not intervene with the world).

churcofsatan.com for those who wish to study Satanism.

Come on people, give the gift of information. Only 82 people have contributed so far.

I see Unitarians still aren't major enough to have their own category, althrough it is a great religion.

We believe in the use of reason to find our way to the center, and the church does not coerce any specific beliefs, but rather encourages those who attend to find their own beliefs.

Many generally believe in a combination of different religions, seeing as really the major ones do not clash as much as people tend to think. (i.e. Muhamed in the Muslim faith was really just a prophet, not a messiah. Doesn't contradict Christianity at all)

anyone else ever given a thought to the ideals of Unitarianism?

I see Unitarians still aren't major enough to have their own category, althrough it is a great religion.

We believe in the use of reason to find our way to the center, and the church does not coerce any specific beliefs, but rather encourages those who attend to find their own beliefs.

Many generally believe in a combination of different religions, seeing as really the major ones do not clash as much as people tend to think. (i.e. Muhamed in the Muslim faith was really just a prophet, not a messiah. Doesn't contradict Christianity at all)

anyone else ever given a thought to the ideals of Unitarianism?

However Muslims believe Jesus was a prophet and not a messiah. Quite an interesting barrier. Christianity, Judaism and Islam are all very similar though.

Current count:
Option:Votes:Percentage
Christian: 27: 30.68%
Jew: 2: 2.27%
Muslim: 0: 0%
Hindu: 1: 1.14%
Pagan: 1: 1.14%
Budhist: 4: 4.55%
Satanic: 1: 1.14%
Agnostic: :14 15.91%
Atheist: 31: 35.23%
Other (Please Specify): 7: 7.95%

I see Unitarians still aren't major enough to have their own category, althrough it is a great religion.

We believe in the use of reason to find our way to the center, and the church does not coerce any specific beliefs, but rather encourages those who attend to find their own beliefs.

Many generally believe in a combination of different religions, seeing as really the major ones do not clash as much as people tend to think. (i.e. Muhamed in the Muslim faith was really just a prophet, not a messiah. Doesn't contradict Christianity at all)

anyone else ever given a thought to the ideals of Unitarianism?
Other religions weren't left out because they are minor, it's cos there's a limit to how many poll options you can have.

I see Unitarians still aren't major enough to have their own category, althrough it is a great religion.

We believe in the use of reason to find our way to the center, and the church does not coerce any specific beliefs, but rather encourages those who attend to find their own beliefs.

Many generally believe in a combination of different religions, seeing as really the major ones do not clash as much as people tend to think. (i.e. Muhamed in the Muslim faith was really just a prophet, not a messiah. Doesn't contradict Christianity at all)

anyone else ever given a thought to the ideals of Unitarianism?
It contradicts Christianity plenty. Islam says that Jesus was just a prophet as well, and to call him the son of god is blasphemy and perhaps polytheism.

I selected other because I worship the Sun.

I selected other because I worship the Sun.
The sun? That's crazy. Nobody believes in the sun.

Why so many bloody atheists?...

Selecting on the dependent variable comes to mind...

More Christians than agnostics?
Disgusting.

*Shameless bump*

More Christians than agnostics?
Disgusting.

It is...?

I'm a Christian.

Im a little surprised, i thought there were more muslims then 0 in this thread.

Pastafarian.
More info. here: http://www.venganza.org/

I selected other because I worship the Sun.

Logical. The energy from the sun is after all the source of all life.

*And before anyone points out the life that exists around the volcanic vents in the deep ocean etc: The heat energy being used there is left over from the formation of the solar system. It too comes from the sun.*

AMERICA IS A CHRISTIAN NATION...
oh... wait... fuck.

Logical. The energy from the sun is after all the source of all life.

*And before anyone points out the life that exists around the volcanic vents in the deep ocean etc: The heat energy being used there is left over from the formation of the solar system. It too comes from the sun.*
Not necessarily. Many people believe that the earth's core contains enough radioactive isotopes to work as a sort of huge fission reactor that keeps the core hot.

Not necessarily. Many people believe that the earth's core contains enough radioactive isotopes to work as a sort of huge fission reactor that keeps the core hot.

Perhaps, but that is also left over from the formations of the solar system. Pressure form the earths gravity also contributes to the heat.

I never really understood the difference between athiest and agnostic. Somebody care to explain?

yeah, I voted athiest. But Satanism looks like a pretty interesting religion. I've been reading up on it quite a bit lately, and it's a lot different than what the popular media and the such make it out to be.

Perhaps, but that is also left over from the formations of the solar system. Pressure form the earths gravity also contributes to the heat.
Yeah, you're right but if it was just energy from the earth's formation I think Kelvin calculated that the earth's core would have cooled off by now, so something else, probably fission, must be keeping it from cooling off that quickly.

I never really understood the difference between athiest and agnostic. Somebody care to explain?

yeah, I voted athiest. But Satanism looks like a pretty interesting religion. I've been reading up on it quite a bit lately, and it's a lot different than what the popular media and the such make it out to be.
Atheists believe that god doesn't exist, Agnostic say it's unknowable whether or not god exists.

What, no pastafarianism?

What, no pastafarianism?
Beat you to it.
Look at post no. 68

I never really understood the difference between athiest and agnostic. Somebody care to explain?

yeah, I voted athiest. But Satanism looks like a pretty interesting religion. I've been reading up on it quite a bit lately, and it's a lot different than what the popular media and the such make it out to be.

An atheist is someone not a theist. Agnostic is a different type of philosophy, refering to the knowabilty of a god.

Well, after the recent serge of religious topics, I am curiois how many of each religion we have here on the boards.

I apologise in advance for not dividing things up more accurately, but if I seperate protestant and catholic, then I must also seperate all variations of islam, all the brotherhoods of satanism and so forth.
I just want to say that I really appreciate how you separated "agnostic" and "atheist." I'm so sick of people lumping those together in polls like this one. So yeah, thanks :).

I never really understood the difference between athiest and agnostic. Somebody care to explain?

As a couple of people have explained, agnosticism is the belief that we cannot know whether or not God exists, while atheism is a lack of belief in God or a belief that there is no God (either definition can be used).

What makes this even more complicated is that a person can be both an agnostic AND an atheist. A person can also be an agnostic theist. Dizzy yet?

As a couple of people have explained, agnosticism is the belief that we cannot know whether or not God exists, while atheism is a lack of belief in God or a belief that there is no God (either definition can be used).

What makes this even more complicated is that a person can be both an agnostic AND an atheist. A person can also be an agnostic theist. Dizzy yet?

'Tis 'zactly why I made the chart.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y138/Dragonkirby/Non-Kirby/SimpleChart.png

I should replace "Gnostic" with something else, because that usually refers to things like Gnosticism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gnosticism) which isn't really what I want there.

'Tis 'zactly why I made the chart.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y138/Dragonkirby/Non-Kirby/SimpleChart.png

I should replace "Gnostic" with something else, because that usually refers to things like Gnosticism (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gnosticism) which isn't really what I want there.
Oh man, yeah, the whole "gnosticism" thing just makes it even MORE confusing. :P

I never really understood the difference between athiest and agnostic. Somebody care to explain?

yeah, I voted athiest. But Satanism looks like a pretty interesting religion. I've been reading up on it quite a bit lately, and it's a lot different than what the popular media and the such make it out to be.

Well I too am considering a conversion to Satanism, specifically the Church of Satan rather than any member organisation of the Black Axis such as the Order of Nine Angels.

Christian :)
Protestant :)
Evangelical :)
Reformed/Calvinist :)
Presbyterian :)
Presbyterain Church (USA) :mad:
Ready to go to PCA or EvPC if this summer's General Assembly goes as predicted

Voted "Other."

Kemetic Traditionalist.