NationStates Jolt Archive

COMMENTARY: Some on here are always on about "the mean ole American military," but this story is only one out of thousands about how American military personnel are instrumental in helping Iraqis in many different ways. Just because you're military doesn't mean you're hearless.


Soldiers Help Mend Girl's Heart (http://www.military.com/features/0,15240,96249,00.html)


Army News Service | Michael Molinaro | May 04, 2006
FOB Kalsu, Iraq - With the help of Soldiers from the 4th Infantry Division, a 9-year-old Iraqi girl is on her way to receiving a medical procedure her parents only dreamed about.

Zenab Maan Fares, from the city of Hillah, has a serious heart condition known as Tetralogy of Fallot, which is a hole between the ventricles of the heart. Soldiers from 2nd BCT have helped coordinate her extensive surgery and post-surgery care.

The quest began when Soldiers from 1st Squadron, 10th Cavalry Regiment, 2nd BCT, conducted a reconnaissance of the children’s hospital in Hillah to assess the state of the hospital and find out what supplies were needed to keep the facility functioning properly.

Zenab’s father approached Sgt. 1st Class Sean Brack, a platoon sergeant in Troop A, 1-10 Cav., explaining his daughter condition and the difficulties he faced trying to find proper care for her.

Upon returning to Forward Operating Base Charlie, Brack relayed the information to Capt. Jon Bodenhamer, commander, Troop A, 1-10 Cav. Bodenhamer immediately began seeking help for the family, calling longtime friend and orthopedic surgeon, retired Lt. Col. Thomas Parr.

Meanwhile, Capt. Chris McNeil, 1-10 Cav. surgeon, began assessing Zenab’s condition, performing an ultrasound scan and making a precise diagnosis.

Parr and his wife, Joannie, began seeking a surgeon to perform Zenab’s surgery. They convinced Texas Children’s hospital in Houston to take the case.

“Capt. McNeil’s efforts allowed Texas Children’s hospital to make a good enough assessment of the girl’s condition and make a decision regarding the case,” Bodenhamer said.

The West Point Society of Greater Houston has made arrangements for the family’s travel. Members donated enough money to purchase commercial airline tickets to Houston from Kuwait for Zenab and her father.

The family is expected to be in Houston up to four months, depending on Zenab post-surgery progress. Mrs. Parr also arranged for translators and an Iraqi-American support group to be available during the Fares’ visit.

“Even though we are Soldiers, we are also citizens of the world. Something like this makes what we are doing here more meaningful,” Bodenhamer added. “It’s something that will change Zenab’s life and make us feel good for the rest of our lives.”

Nothing beats a propaganda coup.

.....
Army News Service | Michael Molinaro | May 04, 2006
FOB Kalsu, Iraq - With the help of Soldiers from the 4th Infantry Division, a 9-year-old Iraqi girl is on her way to receiving a medical procedure her parents only dreamed about.
....
Yes, the US-triggered civil war is giving some people a hard time. This makes entirely up for it though. Call it even, shall we? :rolleyes:

Yes, the US-triggered civil war is giving some people a hard time. This makes entirely up for it though. Call it even, shall we? :rolleyes:
Very funny. You're a regular laugh riot, you are. It is to laugh. Ha ha, ho ho, he he. :rolleyes:

Quagmus thoughtcrime doubleplusungood.

Quagmus thoughtcrime doubleplusungood.
Quagmus ... doubleplusungood ... period. :D

Very funny. You're a regular laugh riot, you are. It is to laugh. Ha ha, ho ho, he he. :rolleyes:

That's okay. I'd rather be a riot than a hypocrite.;)

Quagmus ... doubleplusungood ... period. :D

:D

That's okay. I'd rather be a riot than a hypocrite.;)
Seems you're actually both. Strange thing that. :p

Seems you're actually both. Strange thing that. :p
It takes one to know one I guess...

This is a great story, but are we surpirsed? Americans, by and large, are a generous group of people. We do not all agree with our leadership, but we do agree that it is right to help those in need. This is no way makes up for the military and social debacle we have created in this country. It does prove once again the power of human kindness. Remember, soldiers are people too although their primary mission is to destroy life, not save it. There are some exceptional times when they can help cure rather than kill. Thankfully for this little girl this is one of those times.

COMMENTARY: Some on here are always on about "the mean ole American military," but this story is only one out of thousands about how American military personnel are instrumental in helping Iraqis in many different ways. Just because you're military doesn't mean you're hearless.
Although this is a heart warming story, it doesn't negate the thousands of Iraqi children that were sent unnecessarily to their graves by US bombs and bullets.

Although this is a heart warming story, it doesn't negate the thousands of Iraqi children that were sent unnecessarily to their graves by US bombs and bullets.
Yes it does. Those were Freedom bombs and Democracy bullets!

Yes it does. Those were Freedom bombs and Democracy bullets!
Perhaps you are right, but those are one hell of a cure to longevity. :rolleyes:

Although this is a heart warming story, it doesn't negate the thousands of Iraqi children that were sent unnecessarily to their graves by US bombs and bullets.

True....sadly, most small children are not 'terrorists' but bombing their homes and killing their friends is a good way to make them think that maybe doing something...anything...is better than just sitting back and taking it.
Also I wonder why, when the whole point of this 'war' was to make things better for the people of Iraq...(ha ha) then how come they still don't have basic medical equipment, medicines and reasonable facilities in Iraq? Where is all the money going? Who is getting rich? Certainly not the people of Iraq, a country with huge oil reserves that can't buy antibiotics....hmmmmmm

I commend the individuals involved in this effort. Their kindness and actions have definitely made the world a better place for this girl and her family.

Having said that, I would like to add the following: things like this should be the norm for the US army at this point in the war. The goal is to rebuild the nation's infrastructure to the point that Iraq can function independently of the US occupying forces. Actions like this, if they became the norm, would go a long way to improving relations between the US forces and the Iraqi citizenry.

Although this is a heart warming story, it doesn't negate the thousands of Iraqi children that were sent unnecessarily to their graves by US bombs and bullets.
Thousands? :confused: That seems quite an inflated number.

I'm searching for two words for my response; one of them is token the other one is....erm...yes, that's right gesture.

I'm searching for two words for my response; one of them is token the other one is....erm...yes, that's right gesture.
It's just one example. You know that. So why make specious comments like that?

To everyone using this as another opportunity to bash the US military, I challenge you to tell me what right you have to say these things. Share with us your insight on the mind of a soldier.

To everyone using this as another opportunity to bash the US military, I challenge you to tell me what right you have to say these things. Share with us your insight on the mind of a soldier.
Why don't you rather tell us why we do not have that right?

To everyone using this as another opportunity to bash the US military, I challenge you to tell me what right you have to say these things. Share with us your insight on the mind of a soldier.
They can't. They couldn't pass the physical. :D

Why don't you rather tell us why we do not have that right?
Ah! But you DO have the "right" to say anything you like, regardless of how stupid, insipid, arrogant or downright silly. Go ahead. We love to watch! :D

They can't. They couldn't pass the physical. :D
Are you referring to the musclehead theory?

Are you referring to the musclehead theory?

No, the "Liberals are too weak for anything but targets theory". :p

Ah! But you DO have the "right" to say anything you like, regardless of how stupid, insipid, arrogant or downright silly. Go ahead. We love to watch! :D
So what seems to be the problem? Surely this is not another example of ewessayan veterinarian hypocracy?

Why don't you rather tell us why we do not have that right?

When you answer my question, ONLY then will I stoop to your level of mudslinging

So what seems to be the problem? Surely this is not another example of ewessayan veterinarian hypocracy?

because you are using this to sway the uninformed. You STILL haven't answered my question.

No, the "Liberals are too weak for anything but targets theory". :p
hence reduced to thinking....what evil fate...

because you are using this to sway the uninformed. You STILL haven't answered my question.
hehe...what was it again...my right to state an opinion? I find it to be a basic human right and closely connected to democracy. Would you like to discuss human rights? Or the justifications thereof?

because you are using this to sway the uninformed. ......

What, by informing them?

hehe...what was it again...my right to state an opinion? I find it to be a basic human right and closely connected to democracy. Would you like to discuss human rights? Or the justifications thereof?

No, as I stated, I want to discuss your understanding of the US soldier.

What, by informing them?

You can only give what you have. You are misinformed, and therefore can only misinform others.

I'm out for now

No, as I stated, I want to discuss your understanding of the US soldier.
What is my understanding of the US soldier?

You can only give what you have. You are misinformed, and therefore can only misinform others.

I'm out for now
How am I misinformed?

I commend the individuals involved in this effort. Their kindness and actions have definitely made the world a better place for this girl and her family.

Having said that, I would like to add the following: things like this should be the norm for the US army at this point in the war. The goal is to rebuild the nation's infrastructure to the point that Iraq can function independently of the US occupying forces. Actions like this, if they became the norm, would go a long way to improving relations between the US forces and the Iraqi citizenry.

Stories of soldiers helping Iraqis are the norm. You just do not hear about it in the mainstream press. Notice that this came from a military website and not from a major news organization? Stories of soldiers rebuilding schools and hospitals are all over the net.

To the Eut, well done. Continue to post the good news of what is happening over there. There is most definitely more good news than bad that is not being reported by our so called press.

Why don't you rather tell us why we do not have that right?

Judge not unless you be judged.

Judge not unless you be judged.
Bring it on!

i no lots of people who are currently in iraq, and no matter how many stories u have of us soldiers rebuilding schools and hospitals, i can come up with more reasons as to why they suck.

first of all, they destroyed iraq in the first place, so really their cleaning up their own mess and arent really helping iraqis. secondly, the mainstream press deviates away from stories that are considered too harsh for the mainstream public to believe, ones that i no personally.

when i was a 2 year old living in iraq, our 6 year old neighbour othman would come rushing to open our gate when we came come, a boy we were always delighted to see. After the US invasion of iraq, othman, now 18, was caught in the middle of a violent shia rally (u no, those that bush said was people "exercising their freedom,") us soldiers quickly surrounded the group, trying to control it in case it gets too violent, and seemed ready to fire. Othman, trying to clarify he is a sunni and not involved in the rally, held up a picture of saddam hussein. he then fell, with 2 bullets in his head, fired from an american humvee.

My 75 year old grandmother is currently living in our former house in baghdad. We call her everyday to check on her, and she states (which is independantly confirmed by my uncle in law) that a small bridge which connects sunni dominated al-athimiya (where my grandmother resides) and a neighbouring shia slum is frequently used so that shia militia can storm the households of al-athimiya and kill sunnis on sight.

Thank you america, youve just fucked my country forever

i no lots of people who are currently in iraq, and no matter how many stories u have of us soldiers rebuilding schools and hospitals, i can come up with more reasons as to why they suck.

first of all, they destroyed iraq in the first place, so really their cleaning up their own mess and arent really helping iraqis. secondly, the mainstream press deviates away from stories that are considered too harsh for the mainstream public to believe, ones that i no personally.

when i was a 2 year old living in iraq, our 6 year old neighbour othman would come rushing to open our gate when we came come, a boy we were always delighted to see. After the US invasion of iraq, othman, now 18, was caught in the middle of a violent shia rally (u no, those that bush said was people "exercising their freedom,") us soldiers quickly surrounded the group, trying to control it in case it gets too violent, and seemed ready to fire. Othman, trying to clarify he is a sunni and not involved in the rally, held up a picture of saddam hussein. he then fell, with 2 bullets in his head, fired from an american humvee.

My 75 year old grandmother is currently living in our former house in baghdad. We call her everyday to check on her, and she states (which is independantly confirmed by my uncle in law) that a small bridge which connects sunni dominated al-athimiya (where my grandmother resides) and a neighbouring shia slum is frequently used so that shia militia can storm the households of al-athimiya and kill sunnis on sight.

Thank you america, youve just fucked my country forever
And of course, you just LOVED Saddam. :rolleyes:

Bring it on!

Becareful what you wish for.

*snip*

Sorry for your loss. Accidents happen however. Sad and unfortunate. You have my condolences.

Becareful what you wish for.
Why should I?

And of course, you just LOVED Saddam. :rolleyes:

Eutrusca, your belittling dismissal of the other person's claims are extremely rude.

Previously, you have expressed how you feel insulted when someone uses the term USian. Since then, some people have stopped using that term out of consideration for your feelings. Perhaps you could be noble enough to extend the same courtesy to others.

Stories of soldiers helping Iraqis are the norm. You just do not hear about it in the mainstream press. Notice that this came from a military website and not from a major news organization? Stories of soldiers rebuilding schools and hospitals are all over the net.

To the Eut, well done. Continue to post the good news of what is happening over there. There is most definitely more good news than bad that is not being reported by our so called press.

To be honest, it doesn't matter what the press says about the US forces. What matters is the opinion Iraqis have of the US forces. If these actions are the norm, it would go a long way to winning the hearts and minds of the Iraqi populace, which I believe is instrumental in terms of stabilising the region.

To be honest, it doesn't matter what the press says about the US forces. What matters is the opinion Iraqis have of the US forces. If these actions are the norm, it would go a long way to winning the hearts and minds of the Iraqi populace, which I believe is instrumental in terms of stabilising the region.

These actions are the norm.

Thousands? :confused: That seems quite an inflated number.
Easily in the thousands, your choice:

http://www.unknownnews.net/casualties.html#iraqicivilianskilled

http://www.iraqbodycount.net/

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/3962969.stm

http://www.dailystar.com.lb/article.asp?edition_id=10&categ_id=5&article_id=10594

The only thing that is inflated about this whole mess, is George Bush's ego in thinking that the US could waltz into Iraq and install a "democracy" without breaking a sweat.

To everyone using this as another opportunity to bash the US military, I challenge you to tell me what right you have to say these things. Share with us your insight on the mind of a soldier.
I have every right in the world to share my beliefs. It is called "freedom of speech". In all honesty, my comments are not personally directed at the US military (although there are a few meatheads), but the US administration that caused this horrible war.

Anyone who badmouths our heroic troops is a traitor. Our troops have generously saved the life of this Muslim, and will hopefully save her soul in hospital, by converting her. I myself hope to go to Iraq to convert the Muslims.

Financially, this is cheap but effective PR for domestic consumption, the effect of stories of this sort on the morale of the faithful represents a great return on a tiny investment.

Anyone who badmouths our heroic troops is a traitor. Our troops have generously saved the life of this Muslim, and will hopefully save her soul in hospital, by converting her. I myself hope to go to Iraq to convert the Muslims.

Dude, don't make the rest of us Christians look bad please? We are hated enough on these boards.

There is most definitely more good news than bad that is not being reported by our so called press.
More jingoistic BS there Corny.

Anyone who badmouths our heroic troops is a traitor. Our troops have generously saved the life of this Muslim, and will hopefully save her soul in hospital, by converting her. I myself hope to go to Iraq to convert the Muslims.
A bit overdone, but this is probably closer to the truth - Ann Coulter and her ilk profess exactly such sentiments and they have audiences and book sales in the millions.

More jingoistic BS there Corny.

Actually, it really isn't but since you are already of the mind that we aren't helping people over there, what's the point? You have your opinions and I have mine. Agree to disagree?

Yes, the US-triggered civil war is giving some people a hard time. This makes entirely up for it though. Call it even, shall we? :rolleyes:
We didn't start the fire. We've been trying to fight.
It was Al Qaeda that started the civil war by trying to force the Iraqis to adopt a foriegn islamic government by killing tens of thousands of Iraqi civilians. That's way more than the number killed by stray American bombs.

Your statement is based on the false premise that all the people in the mideast are the same. The current situation with Iran proves otherwise. The arabs have already stated they will not only not support Iran but support the US should there be military action over Iran's nuke program.
Same with Desert Storm. The Arabs asked for US troops to go to their region and Saddam in his place. Ten years later we did just that. Saddam has been put in his place: a jail cell.

The views of people toward the mideast on this forum are racially biased. Your guys's comments on people of the mideast, are the same as claiming that there is no difference between Mexicans and Nicaraguans.

Just because people are Arab does not mean they support Osama Bin Laden. The real problem with American liberals is they think all arabs are the same.
You have to recognize that the arabs in Iraq don't think the same as the Arabs in Palestine or Syria. And the arabs in those places don't think the same as the arabs in Saudi Arabia. Yet, people like you would have us treat them all the same regardless of the differences.

That kind of attitude is equivalent as saying Americans and Brits all think alike because they're all white people. And therefore their cultures are exactly the same.

Dude, don't make the rest of us Christians look bad please? We are hated enough on these boards.

You aren't elect. I'm not going to do what you say. I'm not making Christians look bad, I'm spreading God's will!

We didn't start the fire.

?!!?!??! :eek:

I think maybe you did!

first of all, they destroyed iraq in the first place, so really their cleaning up their own mess and arent really helping iraqis.
Iraqi's seem to be doing a pretty good job of destroying themselves too. secondly, the mainstream press deviates away from stories that are considered too harsh for the mainstream public to believe, ones that i no personally. i'm kinda surprised of this, considering most mainstream media like to harp about the bad things most.

when i was a 2 year old living in iraq, our 6 year old neighbour othman would come rushing to open our gate when we came come, a boy we were always delighted to see. After the US invasion of iraq, othman, now 18, was caught in the middle of a violent shia rally (u no, those that bush said was people "exercising their freedom,") us soldiers quickly surrounded the group, trying to control it in case it gets too violent, and seemed ready to fire. Othman, trying to clarify he is a sunni and not involved in the rally, held up a picture of saddam hussein. he then fell, with 2 bullets in his head, fired from an american humvee.
Several things...
1. that makes you 14 now? Where are you currently living?
2. how did he get "caught up" in the middle of said rally?
3. Why did he have a picture of saddam hussein in the first place, wouldn't the shia's turn on him too?
4. How big was the picture?
5. Did he look passive when he help up the sign?
6. how do you know it was the US who killed him?
7. Sorry for your loss either way. I know it would suck to lose a friend to violence.

My 75 year old grandmother is currently living in our former house in baghdad. We call her everyday to check on her, and she states (which is independantly confirmed by my uncle in law) that a small bridge which connects sunni dominated al-athimiya (where my grandmother resides) and a neighbouring shia slum is frequently used so that shia militia can storm the households of al-athimiya and kill sunnis on sight.
So who's fault is this really? The US for invading Iraq, or the actual Iraqi's doing other Iraqi's harm? Don't people on these forums harp about personal responsibility?

Thank you america, youve just fucked my country forever
Forever is a long time... I wouldn't quite say that long. I would agree that mistakes were made, but i'm an optimistic and hopefully everything will turn out well there in the end.

You make the equally ignorant error of mistaking the views of Arab governments as being representative of the Arab people. The governments of the ME Gulf client states would agree to anything - they are rewarded very handsomely for doing so, and their security is guaranteed. The people they oppress have a whole spectrum of opinions.

Anyone who badmouths our heroic troops is a traitor. Our troops have generously saved the life of this Muslim, and will hopefully save her soul in hospital, by converting her. I myself hope to go to Iraq to convert the Muslims.
Really? I take you don't much about Iraq. You don't know that there is already a sizable christian population in Iraq. That's another misconception that people have about Iraq though. They assume that all Iraqis are muslims. Not true at all. Iraq has always had a sizable christian population.

Much unlike Saudi Arabia where 90% of the population is muslim.

Really? I take you don't much about Iraq. You don't know that there is already a sizable christian population in Iraq. That's another misconception that people have about Iraq though. They assume that all Iraqis are muslims. Not true at all. Iraq has always had a sizable christian population.

Much unlike Saudi Arabia where 90% of the population is muslim.

I said 'to convert the Muslims'. Did I say 'to convert the entire population (which is Muslim)'?

Really? I take you don't much about Iraq. You don't know that there is already a sizable christian population in Iraq. That's another misconception that people have about Iraq though. They assume that all Iraqis are muslims. Not true at all. Iraq has always had a sizable christian population.

Much unlike Saudi Arabia where 90% of the population is muslim.

Um, wtf?
Taken from the CIA factbook thingy:
Religion:
Muslim 97% (Shi'a 60%-65%, Sunni 32%-37%), Christian or other 3%

or, http://countrystudies.us/iraq/34.htm
about 95 percent of Iraqis are Muslim and Islam is the officially recognized state religion.

You make the equally ignorant error of mistaking the views of Arab governments as being representative of the Arab people. The governments of the ME Gulf client states would agree to anything - they are rewarded very handsomely for doing so, and their security is guaranteed. The people they oppress have a whole spectrum of opinions.
You mean like how people think the views of the American government is representative of all its people?

I commend the individuals involved in this effort. Their kindness and actions have definitely made the world a better place for this girl and her family.

Having said that, I would like to add the following: things like this should be the norm for the US army at this point in the war. The goal is to rebuild the nation's infrastructure to the point that Iraq can function independently of the US occupying forces. Actions like this, if they became the norm, would go a long way to improving relations between the US forces and the Iraqi citizenry.
THEY ARE! People just don't hear about it too often because the news is always so obsessed with reporting bad things, and as a result you get a misguided interpretation.

You mean like how people think the views of the American government is representative of all its people?
Far more so than anywhere else, yes. :) You see, the US is not only a democracy, but it is held to be a uniquely democratic system which serves as an example to all others. Thus more so than anywhere else in the world, the government is representative of its people. One could even argue that its ideals and the inclusiveness of its political process render them one and the same.

The Middle East is run by convenient tyrants which pass their office to friends and family and have protection agreements with the West. The stance of the government reflects the interests of the ruling elite. If their policy was in line with the popular mood, they wouldn't need the sort of internal security apparatus they have.

Far more so than anywhere else, yes. :) You see, the US is not only a democracy, but it is held to be a uniquely democratic system which serves as an example to all others. Thus more so than anywhere else in the world, the government is representative of its people. One could even argue that its ideals and the inclusiveness of its political process render them one and the same.

The Middle East is run by convenient tyrants which pass their office to friends and family and have protection agreements with the West. The stance of the government reflects the interests of the ruling elite. If their policy was in line with the popular mood, they wouldn't need the sort of internal security apparatus they have.
I'm afraid, TG, that you have a flawed interpretation of our government. It is typically only representative of the majority that voted for the President, typicaly ~55%. Not everyone votes, also(no idea how many do and how many don't.) Also, opinion polls show that as policies are implimented and changes occur, we change our opinion just like any other country would of its leaders. Currently, Bush is favored only by ~30 % of the population, while the rest of us don't like him.

So, no, while our system is unique, it is not more representative than any other democratic system.

US soldiers kill thousands of people and they do it on purpose. they open fire in schools and markets for no appearant reason. they rape young women and children. and they operate in human trafficing. they are the cause of this worlds problems and every issue going on in todays world can be linked to the us millitary.

they also draft young recruits right out of high school and brain wash them. they make them forget anything they might of learnt in school and teach them everything they need to know on how to kill

do i sound like an insane hippie yet?

US soldiers kill thousands of people and they do it on purpose. they open fire in schools and markets for no appearant reason. they rape young women and children. and they operate in human trafficing. they are the cause of this worlds problems and every issue going on in todays world can be linked to the us millitary.

they also draft young recruits right out of high school and brain wash them. they make them forget anything they might of learnt in school and teach them everything they need to know on how to kill

do i sound like an insane hippie yet?
...I didn't see that white text till I quoted this. I was about to yell at you for being a completely idiotic fool. Now I'll just settle for "a trolling annoyance."

...I didn't see that white text till I quoted this. I was about to yell at you for being a completely idiotic fool. Now I'll just settle for "a trolling annoyance."
;)

You aren't elect. I'm not going to do what you say. I'm not making Christians look bad, I'm spreading God's will!

HAHA! I'm not elect? Oh brother. The bible tells us that "except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of Heaven."

I am a born again Christian and am holding true to His word.

Really? I take you don't much about Iraq. You don't know that there is already a sizable christian population in Iraq. That's another misconception that people have about Iraq though. They assume that all Iraqis are muslims. Not true at all. Iraq has always had a sizable christian population.

Much unlike Saudi Arabia where 90% of the population is muslim.

One of Saddam's henceman was a Christian.

US soldiers kill thousands of people and they do it on purpose. they open fire in schools and markets for no appearant reason. they rape young women and children. and they operate in human trafficing. they are the cause of this worlds problems and every issue going on in todays world can be linked to the us millitary.

they also draft young recruits right out of high school and brain wash them. they make them forget anything they might of learnt in school and teach them everything they need to know on how to kill

do i sound like an insane hippie yet?

Yes you do sound like an insane Hippie. I am glad that this post is 100% sarcastic otherwise, I would rip into this and smack ya back down.

Didn't this happen awhile ago?

Seems to me like there's a misconception about who's killing civilians in Iraq. It's not the Americans, for the most part. It's the jihadists/insurgents who are doing the suicide car bombing, killing people at weddings, etc, they are the ones to blame. If the whole lot of them just packed their bags and went home, there would be no more violence in Iraq, and the Americans would leave also.

Well, maybe there would be still secterian militias, but once again, they aren't the american soldiers. Now, you could say that America is the root of all the violence in the first place, since it invaded Iraq, but it's foolish to say that Americans kill children and civilians en masse.

US soldiers kill thousands of people and they do it on purpose. they open fire in schools and markets for no appearant reason. they rape young women and children. and they operate in human trafficing. they are the cause of this worlds problems and every issue going on in todays world can be linked to the us millitary.

they also draft young recruits right out of high school and brain wash them. they make them forget anything they might of learnt in school and teach them everything they need to know on how to kill

do i sound like an insane hippie yet?
No, you sound like a severely retarded paranoiac.

Yes you do sound like an insane Hippie. I am glad that this post is 100% sarcastic otherwise, I would rip into this and smack ya back down.
'Tis the Christian way to resolve matters. :rolleyes:

'Tis the Christian way to resolve matters. :rolleyes:
I'm guessing when Jesus told people to turn the other cheek, he meant turn the other guy's cheek with the hand you've got clamped on his jaw, and bitch-slap the motherfucker there as well. :D

Dude, don't make the rest of us Christians look bad please? We are hated enough on these boards.
Perhaps you should heed your own advice? :eek:

'Tis the Christian way to resolve matters. :rolleyes:

I wouldn't physically harm him. This is the net after all. :D

Perhaps you should heed your own advice? :eek:

I just spread the word.

Seems to me like there's a misconception about who's killing civilians in Iraq. It's not the Americans, for the most part. It's the jihadists/insurgents who are doing the suicide car bombing, killing people at weddings, etc, they are the ones to blame. If the whole lot of them just packed their bags and went home, there would be no more violence in Iraq, and the Americans would leave also.

Well, maybe there would be still secterian militias, but once again, they aren't the american soldiers. Now, you could say that America is the root of all the violence in the first place, since it invaded Iraq, but it's foolish to say that Americans kill children and civilians en masse.
I second that statement. People who have never been to Iraq but who hate Bush always spout the lie that it is Americans who are deliberately killing innocent civilians in Iraq when the fact is that it is their precious terrorists/insurgents who are doing so.

I second that statement. People who have never been to Iraq but who hate Bush always spout the lie that it is Americans who are deliberately killing innocent civilians in Iraq when the fact is that it is their precious terrorists/insurgents who are doing so.
It also applies to people who think that the insurgents are the only ones killing innocents. They can't possibly know this unless they've been to Iraq.

I just spread the word.
Faith without works is dead. Telling everyone how Christian you are doesn't make you a Christian in the truest sense of the word?

It is bad enough that you support Bush-ke-bob in the Iraq debacle, and most recently joked about BBQing some Iranians.

Somehow, I don't see these as Christian hallmarks.

I'm guessing when Jesus told people to turn the other cheek, he meant turn the other guy's cheek with the hand you've got clamped on his jaw, and bitch-slap the motherfucker there as well. :D
Yeah, yeah, that must be it....why couldn't I see that? :D

Faith without works is dead. Telling everyone how Christian you are doesn't make you a Christian in the truest sense of the word?

It is bad enough that you support Bush-ke-bob in the Iraq debacle, and most recently joked about BBQing some Iranians.

Somehow, I don't see these as Christian hallmarks.

What does the Bible say about those in authority over us?

It also applies to people who think that the insurgents are the only ones killing innocents. They can't possibly know this unless they've been to Iraq.
I never said they were the only ones. Americans have undoubtedly killed some civilians, and committed abuses like Abu Gharib. However, we hear about about suicide car bombings and sectarian militias WAY more often than we hear about American abuses. It's just that the media reports about the comparably few American abuses much more than the jihadists' abuses because we Americans hold ourselves to a higher standard than the cold-blooded baby and woman killers who are fighting for their precious allah.

What does the Bible say about those in authority over us?
What did Jesus say?

"Blessed are the peacemakers"
"The meek shall inherit the earth"
"Turn the other cheek"

Now, number 2 and 3 are complete idiocy, but they should give you an inkling of what Jesus thought about war. And number 1 is good.

What does the Bible say about those in authority over us?
I know what my parents taught me:

Always question authority.

And given the choice between coosing to believe either a musty old book cooked up to keep people down, or my dearly departed parents, sorry Corny - King James' expensively-packaged bundle of loo paper-cum-campfire kindling'll always play second fiddle to the enduring generational wisdom of my Mum & Dad.

What did Jesus say?

"Blessed are the peacemakers"
"The meek shall inherit the earth"
"Turn the other cheek"

Now, number 2 and 3 are complete idiocy, but they should give you an inkling of what Jesus thought about war. And number 1 is good.

Nice dodge now answer to the question is.....

Nice dodge now answer to the question is.....
Well of course the Bible says that you must be loyal to your country and be a law-abiding citizen, but I hardly see what that has to do with supporting wars in foreign countries. :rolleyes:

What did Jesus say?

"Blessed are the peacemakers"
"The meek shall inherit the earth"
"Turn the other cheek"

Now, number 2 and 3 are complete idiocy, but they should give you an inkling of what Jesus thought about war. And number 1 is good.
you have a telegram

you have a telegram
What?

Jesus christ, it's war, of course people are killing eachother.

I'm british but I don't buy into this shit that the US military is DA EVIL! Anyway, it's not just the yanks, the brits and aussies and other evil bastards are ot there too.

What?
I sent you a telegram in your nation message box.

I just spread the word.
Me too! Only with me, the word is "legs!" :D

Me too! Only with me, the word is "legs!" :D

Bad Eutrusca. Bad Bad. very bad.

Me too! Only with me, the word is "legs!" :D
Um, sorry, but is this an inside joke?

Um, sorry, but is this an inside joke?
more like an 'inseam' joke...:rolleyes:

more like an 'inseam' joke...:rolleyes:
You people either have a very quirky sense of humor, or I don't have a sense of humor, because none of this is making any sense. :(

You people either have a very quirky sense of humor, or I don't have a sense of humor, because none of this is making any sense. :(

Ok. Someone didn't get what Eut ment by Spreading "legs".

You people either have a very quirky sense of humor, or I don't have a sense of humor, because none of this is making any sense. :(
I'll take the quirk. You can take the quark.

I'll take the quirk. You can take the quark.
Sorry, I didn't realize this was chemistry.

Sorry, I didn't realize this was chemistry.
Oh, it's just alchemy, nothing to see here, move along now...

*keeps one cautious eye trained on lump of lead transmuting to gold over in the corner*

Oh, it's just alchemy, nothing to see here, move along now...

*keeps one cautious eye trained on lump of lead transmuting to gold over in the corner*
Ever heard of fool's gold?

Ever heard of fool's gold?
Yes - I used to collect pyritized ammonites, as it happens. Ever heard of jollity?

Yes - I used to collect pyritized ammonites, as it happens. Ever heard of jollity?
No, what's that?

No, what's that?
Something you could evidently do with fostering more of an appreciation for.

Something you could evidently do with fostering more of an appreciation for.
It wouldn't be the only thing I could appreciate more. I'm a very basic type of guy. Just give me some beer and porn, and I'm happy as a pig in mud.

[QUOTE=Eutrusca]COMMENTARY: Some on here are always on about "the mean ole American military," but this story is only one out of thousands about how American military personnel are instrumental in helping Iraqis in many different ways. Just because you're military doesn't mean you're hearless.

what? soldiers need a pat on the back for doing their job now? i thought they got paid for that.

[QUOTE=Eutrusca]COMMENTARY: Some on here are always on about "the mean ole American military," but this story is only one out of thousands about how American military personnel are instrumental in helping Iraqis in many different ways. Just because you're military doesn't mean you're hearless.

what? soldiers need a pat on the back for doing their job now? i thought they got paid for that.
They deserve a pat on the back for defending us. And the pay is dirt.

So Sweet, Bushs' :sniper: bullys actually doing smething constructive. What splendid PR, Do you think it'll make the press? But what a load of tripe. Do these uneducated simians that are illeagally in Iraq and (shortly due in Iran) have any remorse for the children they have murdered. No, However wait for the backlash,wait for the psychiatric conditions these 'soldiers' will face on return, not to mention the treatment that they won't recieve.

They deserve a pat on the back for defending us. And the pay is dirt.

well i for one certainly don't remember any iraqi threatening me or my people. i do, however, note that the job of the us and uk military, after going in there and fucking everyone over, is to now clear up their mess and make amends to the people of iraq by helping them re-build their infrastructure, restock their hospitals and, of course, make sure anyone who needs specialist treatment that is not now available gets the treatment they require from elsewhere.

and i honestly couldn't care less how much they are paid. if it's dirt then more fool them for joining the military.

http://www.workingforchange.com/webgraphics/WFC/TMW05-03-06.jpg

See panel five.

well i for one certainly don't remember any iraqi threatening me or my people. i do, however, note that the job of the us and uk military, after going in there and fucking everyone over, is to now clear up their mess and make amends to the people of iraq by helping them re-build their infrastructure, restock their hospitals and, of course, make sure anyone who needs specialist treatment that is not now available gets the treatment they require from elsewhere.

and i honestly couldn't care less how much they are paid. if it's dirt then more fool them for joining the military.
Saddam was a threat more to the us than the uk, but in retrospect I don't think this war was worth it. Now, we have to rebuild what we've broken.

In your other post, you made it seem like the soldiers are doing what they're doing because they get paid a lot. Well, they don't, and I felt compelled to point that out.

So Sweet, Bushs' :sniper: bullys actually doing smething constructive. What splendid PR, Do you think it'll make the press? But what a load of tripe. Do these uneducated simians that are illeagally in Iraq and (shortly due in Iran) have any remorse for the children they have murdered. No, However wait for the backlash,wait for the psychiatric conditions these 'soldiers' will face on return, not to mention the treatment that they won't recieve.
So are you pro or anti military?

So Sweet, Bushs' :sniper: bullys actually doing smething constructive. What splendid PR, Do you think it'll make the press? But what a load of tripe. Do these uneducated simians that are illeagally in Iraq and (shortly due in Iran) have any remorse for the children they have murdered. No, However wait for the backlash,wait for the psychiatric conditions these 'soldiers' will face on return, not to mention the treatment that they won't recieve.
You seem to be the only "uneducated simian" on here, not to mention being seriously demented.

well i for one certainly don't remember any iraqi threatening me or my people. i do, however, note that the job of the us and uk military, after going in there and fucking everyone over, is to now clear up their mess and make amends to the people of iraq by helping them re-build their infrastructure, restock their hospitals and, of course, make sure anyone who needs specialist treatment that is not now available gets the treatment they require from elsewhere.

and i honestly couldn't care less how much they are paid. if it's dirt then more fool them for joining the military.
[ Invites "Infinite Revolution" to go perform an impossible act upon his own body. ]

[ Invites "Infinite Revolution" to go perform an impossible act upon his own body. ]
Nice one Eutrusca.
But hey, without flaming it just wouldn't be you right?:rolleyes:

So Sweet, Bushs' :sniper: bullys actually doing smething constructive. What splendid PR, Do you think it'll make the press? But what a load of tripe. Do these uneducated simians that are illeagally in Iraq and (shortly due in Iran) have any remorse for the children they have murdered. No, However wait for the backlash,wait for the psychiatric conditions these 'soldiers' will face on return, not to mention the treatment that they won't recieve.


Let's look at this issue with a bit of wisdom...

We Marines and Soldiers, who are currently fighting this on-going war, have sworn to uphold and defend the Constitution of the United States with our lives. Every moment I wake and sleep I must be ready to engage any and all threats that are likely to come my way. As a Marine, I am a special breed of a person. I look into the eyes of the suicide bomber and run towards them with that the thought that if my life is taken, I have saved 50 innocent people from death. My profession is war-fighting, my life is one of viligence and discipline. If you look at the population of the Earth, and at the number of Marines, Soldiers, and Sailors fighting in their nation's military; you will find that this very moment, the fate of over 8 billion people are being determined by the actions of a few million. As I said before, I have sworn my life to defend the U. S. Constitution with my life. The Constitution begins with the people, such as you, and ends with the Marine. This war that we are fighting for you, is not one that we have much say in...it is the people of America who elect the politicians that make the decisions of war and order us to fight. It all starts with the people. If America is unhappy with the war, then it is the responsibility of each citizen to ensure that the right people are elected to the House of Representatives, Senate, and Presidency. Americans must exercise their rights to votes and protest and make their voice heard. Spitting on the Marine or Soldier who is ultimately carrying out the will of the people is foolish. During the last Presidential elections, the Marines and Soldiers where overseas fighting the war, our absentee ballots rendered virtually worthless as they are counted after "election night". It was the American people (and oil companies) that re-elected Bush/Cheney and essentially continued this war.

I am no mere "uneducated simian". How many people do you know working towards their Masters of Science in Astrophysics? But I am a Marine, and I will never be ashamed, but always hold my head high. I am a part of the most elite fighting force the world has ever seen. You have no right to judge us as you can not even perceive the decisions we are faced with each day.

Imagine you are a 24 year old Marine Corps Sergeant who has been in Iraq for almost a year. During this time, you have seen so many Marines and Soldiers EVEN YOUNGER THAN YOU being sent home in boxes. You are now riding in a convoy to provide support for a platoon that is penned down by enemy fire and suddenly you are attacked by a group of young teenagers who each have explosive devices attached to their bodies...
These are our daily decisions, each wielding a consequence of either life or death.

You have no right to judge. If you want change, you must look into yourself and know that you are the one who must choose to remain silent and post meaningless blogs, or to use your vote and voice responsibly.

Talk to your Senator, not your Marine.

And of course, you just LOVED Saddam. :rolleyes:

did u ever live in iraq or personally no people who lived in iraq? saddam was actually alot better than many leaders the us supports (such as the saudi regime) if u just kept ur mouth shut and dont complain, and for gods sake dont commit treason by helping iran, ur fine.

unlike post-invasion, where ur killed for being outside, or now, where ur killed wherever u r

Let's look at this issue with a bit of wisdom...

We Marines and Soldiers, who are currently fighting this on-going war, have sworn to uphold and defend the Constitution of the United States with our lives. Every moment I wake and sleep I must be ready to engage any and all threats that are likely to come my way. As a Marine, I am a special breed of a person. I look into the eyes of the suicide bomber and run towards them with that the thought that if my life is taken, I have saved 50 innocent people from death. My profession is war-fighting, my life is one of viligence and discipline. If you look at the population of the Earth, and at the number of Marines, Soldiers, and Sailors fighting in their nation's military; you will find that this very moment, the fate of over 8 billion people are being determined by the actions of a few million. As I said before, I have sworn my life to defend the U. S. Constitution with my life. The Constitution begins with the people, such as you, and ends with the Marine. This war that we are fighting for you, is not one that we have much say in...it is the people of America who elect the politicians that make the decisions of war and order us to fight. It all starts with the people. If America is unhappy with the war, then it is the responsibility of each citizen to ensure that the right people are elected to the House of Representatives, Senate, and Presidency. Americans must exercise their rights to votes and protest and make their voice heard. Spitting on the Marine or Soldier who is ultimately carrying out the will of the people is foolish. During the last Presidential elections, the Marines and Soldiers where overseas fighting the war, our absentee ballots rendered virtually worthless as they are counted after "election night". It was the American people (and oil companies) that re-elected Bush/Cheney and essentially continued this war.

I am no mere "uneducated simian". How many people do you know working towards their Masters of Science in Astrophysics? But I am a Marine, and I will never be ashamed, but always hold my head high. I am a part of the most elite fighting force the world has ever seen. You have no right to judge us as you can not even perceive the decisions we are faced with each day.

Imagine you are a 24 year old Marine Corps Sergeant who has been in Iraq for almost a year. During this time, you have seen so many Marines and Soldiers EVEN YOUNGER THAN YOU being sent home in boxes. You are now riding in a convoy to provide support for a platoon that is penned down by enemy fire and suddenly you are attacked by a group of young teenagers who each have explosive devices attached to their bodies...
These are our daily decisions, each wielding a consequence of either life or death.

You have no right to judge. If you want change, you must look into yourself and know that you are the one who must choose to remain silent and post meaningless blogs, or to use your vote and voice responsibly.

Talk to your Senator, not your Marine.
Bravo. It's too bad that the left has been anti-military since Vietnam. With the exception of Gulf War I, that Euro crisis, and right after 9-11, I can't think of any post Vietnam point in history where the men and women of the US armed forces were treated as heroes.

I know it's the media. They post only negative stories to get higher ratings and the "educated" think that this is Vietnam II. It's not. We've exposed just how vulnerable Iraq was to chaos. Of course it was more peaceful under Sadaam. What if he died? Would Iraq be in this same mess? The US military is trying to rebuild a shattered nation with the whole world condemning their every breath. They're fighting an enemy whose been trained to kill anyone and everyone, armed marine or civillian child, in the name of a religion that is supposed to be peaceful and the left thinks of them as baby killers. People are assuming that it was the US, and only the US, who has been blowing up mosques, bombing weddings, and blowing childrens' heads off with guns. Guess what? Even though missiles can miss and overstressed soldiers might mistake plain-clothed terrorists for plain-clothed civillians, the US military isn't a barbaric group of baby-eating rapists they are often portrayed to be.

US soldiers tend to be overworked, underpayed, and unappreciated. They are criticised by people who believe anything and everything on news networks run by greedy corporations. Guess what? CNN wants good ratings. Fox News wants good ratings. NBC wants good ratings. They'll often degrade the military's image because that means higher ratings and higher ratings bring higher profits. They'll tell you almost always the bad and rarely the good. Every silver lining lines a dark cloud, after all.

You have no right to judge.
And you have no right to decide on questions of Life and Death, sir.

I know it's the media. They post only negative stories to get higher ratings and the "educated" think that this is Vietnam II.

While I'll refer you back to panel five (http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showpost.php?p=10904157&postcount=113).

Although this is a heart warming story, it doesn't negate the thousands of Iraqi children that were sent unnecessarily to their graves by US bombs and bullets.
Both sides have sent Children to their Graves you know. Even though you can make the debate that the Insurgancy is the US's fault, it's the Insurgant's choice to deliberatly place bombs in Civilian buildings, Open fire on random people, and blow up relgious buildings that don't have Americans in it.

Still that was nice of those soldiers.

Both sides have sent Children to their Graves you know. Even though you can make the debate that the Insurgancy is the US's fault, it's the Insurgant's choice to deliberatly place bombs in Civilian buildings, Open fire on random people, and blow up relgious buildings that don't have Americans in it.

Still that was nice of those soldiers.
Two wrongs do not make a right. I am fully aware that both sides have killed innocent children and both sides are wrong. The civil war started after the US invaded Iraq illegally and therefore the US should bare the lions share of the blame in this God awful mess. It is going to take an incredibily long time to fix the situation, assuming that it can be fixed.

Interesting.

And you have no right to decide on questions of Life and Death, sir.

Says who? And don't say the Bible, because it says that it is.

Two wrongs do not make a right. I am fully aware that both sides have killed innocent children and both sides are wrong. The civil war started after the US invaded Iraq illegally and therefore the US should bare the lions share of the blame in this God awful mess. It is going to take an incredibily long time to fix the situation, assuming that it can be fixed.

Let's say there's a blackout, and power is cut off to your house. Because of this, your alarm system doesn't work, so burglars rob your house. Who takes most of the blame for the incident, the electricity company or the burglars?

Let's say there's a blackout, and power is cut off to your house. Because of this, your alarm system doesn't work, so burglars rob your house. Who takes most of the blame for the incident, the electricity company or the burglars?
The burglars. Not a very fine metaphor.

We didn't start the fire. We've been trying to fight.
It was Al Qaeda that started the civil war by trying to force the Iraqis to adopt a foriegn islamic government by killing tens of thousands of Iraqi civilians. That's way more than the number killed by stray American bombs.
You started the fire. AQ seized an opportunity given to them. They are at war too, you know.



Your statement is based on the false premise that all the people in the mideast are the same. The current situation with Iran proves otherwise. The arabs have already stated they will not only not support Iran but support the US should there be military action over Iran's nuke program.
Same with Desert Storm. The Arabs asked for US troops to go to their region and Saddam in his place. Ten years later we did just that. Saddam has been put in his place: a jail cell. My statement has nothing to do with all the people in the mideast being the same. I know they are not. Which you seem not too, otherwise you'd specify which Arabs you are talking about.



The views of people toward the mideast on this forum are racially biased. Your guys's comments on people of the mideast, are the same as claiming that there is no difference between Mexicans and Nicaraguans. What guy?

Just because people are Arab does not mean they support Osama Bin Laden. The real problem with American liberals is they think all arabs are the same.
You have to recognize that the arabs in Iraq don't think the same as the Arabs in Palestine or Syria. And the arabs in those places don't think the same as the arabs in Saudi Arabia. Yet, people like you would have us treat them all the same regardless of the differences. I know you have opinions on u.s. liberals. I won't speak for them now, not being one. Certain conservatives have been known to make sweeping generalisations too, you know. Are you saying that it is correct to generalize on one crowd, and not the other?

That kind of attitude is equivalent as saying Americans and Brits all think alike because they're all white people. And therefore their cultures are exactly the same. Well, yes. That was not what I was saying. Neither was I badmouthing the usian troops as a whole. Some are bound to be drooling idiots, as with any crowd, unless it is selected by choosing non-droolers.

snip

You know, if you don't want to fight you could just...not...fight.

Anyone else see the video of the Iraqi policeforce graduating recently? The class was mainly Sunni's and they had been told when they joined they would be posted in their local areas.

At their graduation they were told they were going to be shipped around the country (and probably up North to deal with the trouble near the Kurdish/Iran border).... so they created one hell of a furore, stripped off their uniforms and refused.. and then promptly resigned to boot. :D

To everyone using this as another opportunity to bash the US military, I challenge you to tell me what right you have to say these things. Share with us your insight on the mind of a soldier.
The Freedom of Speech right... the one you defend. Well, not me but for the others USians.
:rolleyes:

Bravo. It's too bad that the left has been anti-military since Vietnam. With the exception of Gulf War I, that Euro crisis, and right after 9-11, I can't think of any post Vietnam point in history where the men and women of the US armed forces were treated as heroes.

I know it's the media. They post only negative stories to get higher ratings and the "educated" think that this is Vietnam II. It's not. We've exposed just how vulnerable Iraq was to chaos. Of course it was more peaceful under Sadaam. What if he died? Would Iraq be in this same mess? The US military is trying to rebuild a shattered nation with the whole world condemning their every breath. They're fighting an enemy whose been trained to kill anyone and everyone, armed marine or civillian child, in the name of a religion that is supposed to be peaceful and the left thinks of them as baby killers. People are assuming that it was the US, and only the US, who has been blowing up mosques, bombing weddings, and blowing childrens' heads off with guns. Guess what? Even though missiles can miss and overstressed soldiers might mistake plain-clothed terrorists for plain-clothed civillians, the US military isn't a barbaric group of baby-eating rapists they are often portrayed to be.

US soldiers tend to be overworked, underpayed, and unappreciated. They are criticised by people who believe anything and everything on news networks run by greedy corporations. Guess what? CNN wants good ratings. Fox News wants good ratings. NBC wants good ratings. They'll often degrade the military's image because that means higher ratings and higher ratings bring higher profits. They'll tell you almost always the bad and rarely the good. Every silver lining lines a dark cloud, after all.

Accurate to the last period.

And you have no right to decide on questions of Life and Death, sir.

Actually he does as he is a soldier because they deal with life and death situations. If we follow your line of logic then Relatives have no say on life or death situations and neither do doctors.

Actually he does as he is a soldier because they deal with life and death situations. If we follow your line of logic then Relatives have no say on life or death situations and neither do doctors.

You saying doctors aren't qualified to make life or death decisions?

You saying doctors aren't qualified to make life or death decisions?

If we use Dobbsworld's logic, no.

If we use Dobbsworld's logic, no.
I think we can let Dobbsworld speak for himself.

The burglars. Not a very fine metaphor.
Of course not. It doesn't support your illusions. :p

I think we can let Dobbsworld speak for himself.
Yup, but unfortunately I can no longer read his posts except when someone quotes him. :D

If we use Dobbsworld's logic, no.
OMG! You said "Dobbsworld" and "logic" in the same sentance! :eek:

COMMENTARY:

Soldiers Help Mend Girl's Heart (http://www.military.com/features/0,15240,96249,00.html)


Army News Service | Michael Molinaro | May 04, 2006
FOB Kalsu, Iraq - With the help of Soldiers from the 4th Infantry Division, a 9-year-old Iraqi girl is on her way to receiving a medical procedure her parents only dreamed about.


*sniff...Gawd bless 'mericaw....*sniff

Obviously this wonderful act of human compassion entirely excuses the other 30,000 plus dead - many of them children - killed by the US military. Forget too the forces unleashed which are now tearing the place apart, the destabilising of the region, the growth in support for Islamism around the world, or the blatant double standard set by the US. And don't mention the fact that its a war conducted by a bunch of fat-assed bureaucrats purely for the advancement of US interests. No, its all ok now.


[I myself hope to go to Iraq to convert the Muslims.

An excellent idea which I fully endorse. Proclaim your faith loudly.

[We didn't start the fire. We've been trying to fight. .

Bollocks.

Actually he does as he is a soldier because they deal with life and death situations. If we follow your line of logic then Relatives have no say on life or death situations and neither do doctors.
His "right" to do so is assumed. I grant no "right" to others to make such decisions on my behalf, and many people feel as I do.

I (and those who are similarly-minded) don't subscribe to the thinking that supports hierarchical organization, soldiers, or the willful promulgation of a sociopolitical climate that apparently necessitates decisions being made on my behalf that I cannot, nor will not, agree with.

And yes, if you blindly follow my logic, as you seem wont to do with any bright & shiny thing that crosses your cone of vision, Corny - blindly inflating a contextual observation into an existence defining set of rigid codices that one must follow to the letter as they appear, written in stone upon your own soul's very fundament, in the manner proscribed by all those who choose to live their lives by unquestioning adherence to, and unquestioning support for systems of hierarchical organization, yes - relatives & doctors would have no say in Life & Death situations.

You linear-minded, unclever prat of a Homo Sapiens Sapiens.

His "right" to do so is assumed. I grant no "right" to others to make such decisions on my behalf, and many people feel as I do.

I (and those who are similarly-minded) don't subscribe to the thinking that supports hierarchical organization, soldiers, or the willful promulgation of a sociopolitical climate that apparently necessitates decisions being made on my behalf that I cannot, nor will not, agree with.

I love the bolded part. Actually, I like the whole paragraph. And you talk about me following my beliefs. You are indeed doing the samething that you have accused me of doing. Interesting. That's ok. I forgive you.

And yes, if you blindly follow my logic, as you seem wont to do with any bright & shiny thing that crosses your cone of vision, Corny - blindly inflating a contextual observation into an existence defining set of rigid codices that one must follow to the letter as they appear, written in stone upon your own soul's very fundament, in the manner proscribed by all those who choose to live their lives by unquestioning adherence to, and unquestioning support for systems of hierarchical organization, yes - relatives & doctors would have no say in Life & Death situations.

Is this all you do is rant and not make a point? You are forgiven.

You linear-minded, unclever prat of a Homo Sapiens Sapiens.

Nice nice insult at the end of your rant. You are forgiven Dobbsworld. I forgive you for your insult of me.

[I myself hope to go to Iraq to convert the Muslims.

ok, it will kind of be a waste of time tho. 5% of iraqis are muslims, and if any1 wishes to convert to christianity they can do so, dont mix iraq with afghanistan.

ok, it will kind of be a waste of time tho. 5% of iraqis are muslims, and if any1 wishes to convert to christianity they can do so, dont mix iraq with afghanistan.

More than 5% of Iraq is muslim Iraqiya. I'm surprised that you did not know that unless you forgot the 9 infront of the 5 as someone posted earlier.

I forgive you for your insult of me.
I, however, won't forgive your proclivity for insulting my intelligence at every turn. Nor will I forgive you your ongoing incomprehension where my remarks are concerned.

You sir, are obtuse - at best.

I, however, won't forgive your proclivity for insulting my intelligence at every turn. Nor will I forgive you your ongoing incomprehension where my remarks are concerned.

You sir, are obtuse - at best.

Its ok. I am not asking for your forgiveness. I have forgiven you and I will continue to forgive you for your insults upon me for it is not I you have to answer to.

Its ok. I am not asking for your forgiveness. I have forgiven you and I will continue to forgive you for your insults upon me for it is not I you have to answer to.

No Corny - I'm not answerable to Yahweh/Jehovah/Allah. My God has instructed me well. And no, you don't know my God - so don't go making any more bone-headed assumptions on my behalf... or assuming that there's anybody else on this spinning ball of mud who's entitled to make same.

Like your soldiers. Or any other representatitive of hierarchical systems I am not a subscriber to.

Of course not. It doesn't support your illusions. :p
I see the burglar as the invaders. You?

I see the burglar as the invaders. You?
There is no illusion to your perception. Indeed the US are unwanted intruders. There was no written invitation, nor any implied invitation for them to destroy the lives of innocent Iraqis, and the devestation of their homeland. They are invaders and burglars for sure.

OMG! You said "Dobbsworld" and "logic" in the same sentance! :eek:
Don't you find it ironic to put Dobbs on ignore and yet use other peoples' quotes to side swipe him? :p