NationStates Jolt Archive

Meh. This has probably been asked before. I could probably make an RP off of this... But uh... Anyways. What would happen if the American Revolution FAILED?!?!?!

Edit: It failed because The Winter At Valley Forge became -50* colder. All of the soldiers there, and I mean ALL of them died.

The British Empire would have taken over the world, it's really that simple.

If the American Revolution failed decisively, it would completely change world history. For one, the Germans probably would have won WWI (if WWI still happened >_>).

The British Empire would have taken over the world, it's really that simple.
No.

First, one must pinpoint where on the line the colonial revolution failed. Once established, we can then decide what occurs from there. I suspect eventually the United States--perhaps called United Commonwealths instead--would have been granted independence, much like the Dominion of Canada was. It would certainly be nowhere near the same size. Mexico would probably still possess California and what have you. We'd certainly see a dramatically different world. For all we know it could be a nuclear wasteland by 2006 in this alternate universe. I, however, am not a historian--yet--so I cannot tell you what would occur.

Well, what immidiatly springs to mind is a lot more deaths in both World Wars, probobly the same result, but in 1950 or so.
Of course, that is assuming the world wars even happen. I think the Napoleonic Wars might still occure, in which case things would get quite interesting since France would have to sell Louisiana to some OTHER country or go broke rather quickly. This means the Napoleonic Wars possibly end sooner with fewer deaths and a lack of Russian involvement.
Of course, that assumes there WAS a French Revolution to begin with and that it did succede.
Assuming there was, and assuming world history keeps on its course until about 1950, I can easily see a Soviet dominated world map, not to sound TOO paranoid, most likely covering East and Central Europe, China and parts of the Middle East. Britain MIGHT be strong enough to stand against the Soviets if it kept its colonies and used them correctly.

to an extent, France however would have provided better resources to expand themselves as in history they were pre-occupied with supporting the American Rev, and could have held onto the center of North America and Louisiana (?spelling?).

What would happen if the American Revolution FAILED?!?!?!

Are you implying that it actually worked?

Are you implying that it actually worked?
...what exactly do you mean?

...what exactly do you mean?

I believe I am posing the question 'Did the American Revolution work?'.


* checks *

Yup, that seems to be what I am doing.

...what exactly do you mean?

Wasn't the American Revolution designed to free the country from the rule of an imbecile called George, who only got the job because of who his father (also called George) was?

Wasn't the American Revolution designed to free the country from the rule of an imbecile called George, who only got the job because of who his father (also called George) was?
Wait a minute. I just realized something. We switched out one George for another George.

I believe I am posing the question 'Did the American Revolution work?'.


* checks *

Yup, that seems to be what I am doing.
I know that. But what makes you ask that question? I don't see how it makes any sense to ask that. Of course it worked. The United States, last I checked, is a sovereign nation.

So, unless you're implying something involving a communist revolution, I don't understand how your question is relevant.

Oh, and how IS the American Revolution described in your British text books? Or is it even in there?

Oh, and how IS the American Revolution described in your British text books? Or is it even in there?
It's not there. Why would such a minor event in British history be relevant?

I believe I am posing the question 'Did the American Revolution work?'.


* checks *

Yup, that seems to be what I am doing.

Well, we won our independence from Britain. Now, if only we could win it from DC.

Wasn't the American Revolution designed to free the country from the rule of an imbecile called George, who only got the job because of who his father (also called George) was?

Y'know, I had never actually noticed that.

One would have to pinpoint the exact time that the Revolution 'failed' and how it did, to ensure accuracy. There are too many factors for me to really give an idea, but the novel The Two Georges by Harry Turtledove plays on this idea, and it seems plausible to me. He sets it in the early 21st Century with the British Empire still strong and possessing the NAU (North American Union) after George Washington somehow decided not to lead a rebellion or posibly helped quash it. In this world, the fastest transportation is the airship and biplane for the military, there are still magazine rifles circa 19th Century or so, and the world is split between the Empire and the Franco-Spanish Alliance. The technology that an independent USA bought to the world never occured, causing a technologically retarded world.

What would have likely happened is that Manifest Destiny might not have developed, as the British intended to contain colonial development. I have no idea how likely it is that they would have stuck to that commitment, though.

I don't see how it makes any sense to ask that. Of course it worked. The United States, last I checked, is a sovereign nation.

So instead of being governed by white Anglo-Saxon Protestants born into privilege, the American Revolution allowed the nascent state to be governed by white Anglo-Saxon Protestants born into privilege?

One would have to pinpoint the exact time that the Revolution 'failed' and how it did, to ensure accuracy. There are too many factors for me to really give an idea, but the novel The Two Georges by Harry Turtledove plays on this idea, and it seems plausible to me. He sets it in the early 21st Century with the British Empire still strong and possessing the NAU (North American Union) after George Washington somehow decided not to lead a rebellion or posibly helped quash it. In this world, the fastest transportation is the airship and biplane for the military, there are still magazine rifles circa 19th Century or so, and the world is split between the Empire and the Franco-Spanish Alliance. The technology that an independent USA bought to the world never occured, causing a technologically retarded world.
You actually bought such propoganda?! :eek:

To take just one example; the jet engine was invented by a British man.

Oh, and how IS the American Revolution described in your British text books? Or is it even in there?

No idea, I never did it. Obviously it took up time that could be used studying Nazis, Tudors and the Catholic Church.

One would have to pinpoint the exact time that the Revolution 'failed' and how it did, to ensure accuracy. There are too many factors for me to really give an idea, but the novel The Two Georges by Harry Turtledove plays on this idea, and it seems plausible to me. He sets it in the early 21st Century with the British Empire still strong and possessing the NAU (North American Union) after George Washington somehow decided not to lead a rebellion or posibly helped quash it. In this world, the fastest transportation is the airship and biplane for the military, there are still magazine rifles circa 19th Century or so, and the world is split between the Empire and the Franco-Spanish Alliance. The technology that an independent USA bought to the world never occured, causing a technologically retarded world.
Is that what that one is about? Well, that seems like a rather logical prediction. Turtledove has been researching history all his life, so if anyone could reasonably predict it, it would be him.

As for those harping on about Bush: Oy, stop it. He was democratically elected. I do not agree with his policies and did not vote for him myself, but it's not like he took power illegally.

As for those harping on about Bush: Oy, stop it. He was democratically elected. I do not agree with his policies and did not vote for him myself, but it's not like he took power illegally.

Ah, but the same cannot be said for the insurgent Americans.

It all depends upon how long the revolution lasted before it was put down. If the British made certain concessions before the beginning of the war, (i.e political representation in Parliament of some kind) then we might well be a British holding today. Of course, the map would look much different. America would still expand westward in much the same way as it did in real life, although the expansion into Louisiana would have taken the form of a GBv. Royal France war.

Secondly, the French Revolution would have taken longer to occur, if it did at all. French revolutionaries were inspired and actively supported by men like Benjamin Franklin, without whom things may not have taken off as they did. I believe that the French Revolution would still have taken place; the French were very much on par with the British as leaders in the Enlightenment.

France did not expend all that much money aiding the Americans, by their standards. What they did expend money on was primarily the cold war with England, one which they were destined to lose. So, in the final sense, all of Canada, much of America and probably some of the Carribean holdings would still remain British. The chief reason that England dissolved it's empire was because of its inability to hold it under any kind of meaningful control as the Empire's cash reserves and popularity took a hit in India, its major cash cow.

If the American Revolution lasted for some years before being put down, then Britain would have been obliged to install a military governor, post absurd amounts of soldiers in major cities, and devote an 'American Squadron' of its navy to control the eastern seaboard and gulf states. This would likely have hastened the Empire's decline, and left Napoleon victorious in Europe. He would not have invaded Britain by dint of the Channel Fleet, nor threatened Britain's offshore holdings, but anything connected by land would be threatened by possible French invasion.

If you RP this, I'll join.

Don't you mean what would have happened if the American Revolution had failed?

It's not as if it it's still going on is it?

Ah, but the same cannot be said for the insurgent Americans.
True.

Tell me: Are you British, or an American citizen? Or something else? Your posts all seem to point towards hating the U.S., but it might just be the current government you dislike.

People seem to be confusing an America without indipendance with there being no America in the world at all

True.

Tell me: Are you British, or an American citizen? Or something else? Your posts all seem to point towards hating the U.S., but it might just be the current government you dislike.

I just hate governments as a whole. Matter of principle.

I know that. But what makes you ask that question? I don't see how it makes any sense to ask that. Of course it worked. The United States, last I checked, is a sovereign nation.

was that the entire point?

Is that what that one is about? Well, that seems like a rather logical prediction. Turtledove has been researching history all his life, so if anyone could reasonably predict it, it would be him.

As for those harping on about Bush: Oy, stop it. He was democratically elected. I do not agree with his policies and did not vote for him myself, but it's not like he took power illegally.

The man may not be able to write brilliantly anymore, but his historiography and sense of history is brilliant.

Meh. This has probably been asked before. I could probably make an RP off of this... But uh... Anyways. What would happen if the American Revolution FAILED?!?!?!

Edit: It failed because The Winter At Valley Forge became -50* colder. All of the soldiers there, and I mean ALL of them died.

Hmm?

Half of the people here wouldn't have something to complain about?

No idea, I never did it. Obviously it took up time that could be used studying Nazis, Tudors and the Catholic Church.
It is, they give the teachers a list and the teachers pick. I studied it briefly at GCSE as a background to later events, but I think there was an option to study that earlier time period and the British Empire, not specifically the USA but including India etc.

Meh. This has probably been asked before. I could probably make an RP off of this... But uh... Anyways. What would happen if the American Revolution FAILED?!?!?!

Edit: It failed because The Winter At Valley Forge became -50* colder. All of the soldiers there, and I mean ALL of them died.
Fahrenheit or Celsius?

If it was Fahrenheit, the world would be a terrible place.
There would be massive earthquakes and terrible epidemics. And our evil overlords from outter space would crucify us if we failed to reach our ridiculously high productivity quota.

If it was Celsius, the world would be a very happy place.
There would be no more war or death or sickness. And our unbelievably sexy "companions" from Venus would gladly give us anything we wanted and more.

Oh, and how IS the American Revolution described in your British text books? Or is it even in there?

Depends what you study. One part of A-level history (i.e. 16-18 years old) begins in 1792 with the French Revolution and the Naopleonics that followed. The American Revolution is covered a little, however it's not classed as 'modern' history in terms of politics or military.

The other is medieval history and finishes just post-Renaissance IIRC.

Still, we know we lost, had a brief arguement in 1812 and been trying to interfere ever since ;)

GCSE we did the Wild West, the period of Manifest Destiny and the expansion to the Pacific, but the way it was taught isn't what I'd class as history. It's more memorising dates.

Depends what you study. One part of A-level history (i.e. 16-18 years old) begins in 1792 with the French Revolution and the Naopleonics that followed. The American Revolution is covered a little, however it's not classed as 'modern' history in terms of politics or military.

The other is medieval history and finishes just post-Renaissance IIRC.

Still, we know we lost, had a brief arguement in 1812 and been trying to interfere ever since ;)

GCSE we did the Wild West, the period of Manifest Destiny and the expansion to the Pacific, but the way it was taught isn't what I'd class as history. It's more memorising dates.

Didn't cover it leading up to o'level either. (God that dates me).

We went straight from the Tudors to WWI. I gather the bit we skipped was considered unimportant.

Didn't cover it leading up to o'level either. (God that dates me).

We went straight from the Tudors to WWI. I gather the bit we skipped was considered unimportant.

Shows how much its changed. I must say we now end at the Tudors and skip to 1792 then end at WW1.

I gather the bit we skipped was considered unimportant.

i like that the u.s. does the same, even though it's got a distinct lack of history to cover in the first place.

iirc, it goes:
jamestown and the pilgrims (and maybe a witch trial or two)
skip a bit
passing mention of some apparently rather unimportant war involving some french people and some indians or something.
skip a bit
evil oppressive taxes, declaration of independence
unmentioned skip, leaving the impression that no skip has occured
constitution

from there it evens out a bit more, though there are the emphasized and neglected bits that change around.

i like that the u.s. does the same, even though it's got a distinct lack of history to cover in the first place.

iirc, it goes:
jamestown and the pilgrims (and maybe a witch trial or two)
skip a bit
passing mention of some apparently rather unimportant war involving some french people and some indians or something.
skip a bit
evil oppressive taxes, declaration of independence
unmentioned skip, leaving the impression that no skip has occured
constitution

from there it evens out a bit more, though there are the emphasized and neglected bits that change around.
Gasp!! :eek: Tell me more about this Unmentioned Skip. Does it have something to do with Jesus having an affair with Mary Magdalen?

Gasp!! :eek: Tell me more about this Unmentioned Skip. Does it have something to do with Jesus having an affair with Mary Magdalen?

It can do, depending on how much BS you wish to write...

Gasp!! :eek: Tell me more about this Unmentioned Skip. Does it have something to do with Jesus having an affair with Mary Magdalen?

yes. well that and the government of the articles of confederation (and the independent republic of vermont)...

Shows how much its changed. I must say we now end at the Tudors and skip to 1792 then end at WW1.

I gather people were a bit more embarrased by the Empire back then. Or at least hadn't come to terms with its legacy so much. So it was all pretty much glossed over. And that Cromwell thing. Oh, and Ireland. And the scottish clearances. Actually, now I think back on it, pretty much any reference to all those times we invaded france was avoided too.

There was probably a lot of other stuff that was skipped, but it was a long time ago, so I forget.

I remember learning about Roman britian. But that could have been before I started the o'level curriculum.

We did learn that we beat Hitler though. And that's what counts. Also plague is bad, and the spanish jolly well got what was coming to them.

i like that the u.s. does the same, even though it's got a distinct lack of history to cover in the first place.

iirc, it goes:
jamestown and the pilgrims (and maybe a witch trial or two)
skip a bit
passing mention of some apparently rather unimportant war involving some french people and some indians or something.
skip a bit
evil oppressive taxes, declaration of independence
unmentioned skip, leaving the impression that no skip has occured
constitution

from there it evens out a bit more, though there are the emphasized and neglected bits that change around.

High school history is really just not so subtle propaganda.

In Mexico the American Revolution is known as Independence of the United States. It's treated in some detail, although not too much, as a precedent to the independence movements in the rest of the continent, along with the French Revolution, Napoleon's invasion of Spain, and the whole Illustration bit.

And then the War of Texas and the US-Mexican War, of course.

What would have happened? Mmh... Canada would be a lot bigger, so would Mexico. There'd be a higher population in Europe and probablt WW1 would have been even bloodier. There would still have been a WW2 and a Soviet Union perhaps counter-balanced by a French-British alliance.

Funnily enough, without the American revolution, the British Empire might have never have been as large or as powerful as it eventually became. Once the war was over, Britain still had a complete monopoly on trade into the new U.S.A, and the Crown no longer had to fund the colonies or their defence. Consequently, British economic power grew to a great degree, making it possible to fund the expansion of the Empire into Africa, India etc.

So for every British person who is proud of our nations Imperial heritage, say a big thank you to our American friends, for having the nerve to ask not to have any more money spent on them.

I gather people were a bit more embarrased by the Empire back then. Or at least hadn't come to terms with its legacy so much. So it was all pretty much glossed over. And that Cromwell thing. Oh, and Ireland. And the scottish clearances. Actually, now I think back on it, pretty much any reference to all those times we invaded france was avoided too.

There was probably a lot of other stuff that was skipped, but it was a long time ago, so I forget.

I remember learning about Roman britian. But that could have been before I started the o'level curriculum.

We did learn that we beat Hitler though. And that's what counts. Also plague is bad, and the spanish jolly well got what was coming to them.

Yeah, we study the Empire now, esp. the mid 19th Century, Indian Mutiny/First War of Independence, the 'Irish Problem' (such a flippant title) and the we gave Hitler a kicking.

We get the background on Cromwell (its so hard to believe I'm related to that family), the Jacobite Uprising and kicking the Spanish.

As for the French, well we do learn how we all murdered each other, married into each others monarchies and owned each others land a few times around.

A whole new set of recruits would sign up to join.

But if not, I don't know. Britain might still have held on to the US, but maybe not...they might have punished us severly...I know I would probably not be around though...my parents and their parents and so on would not have met.

Meh. This has probably been asked before. I could probably make an RP off of this... But uh... Anyways. What would happen if the American Revolution FAILED?!?!?!

Edit: It failed because The Winter At Valley Forge became -50* colder. All of the soldiers there, and I mean ALL of them died.

I wouldn't ever have to hear people say god bless America and no one would ever play rugby with body armour on. Talking of armour people would spell such words properly. Oh, and "The Patriot" would never have been vomited from whatever hell hole it coalesced in.

GOD BLESS IRELAND.

Yeah, we study the Empire now, esp. the mid 19th Century, Indian Mutiny/First War of Independence, the 'Irish Problem' (such a flippant title) and the we gave Hitler a kicking.

We get the background on Cromwell (its so hard to believe I'm related to that family), the Jacobite Uprising and kicking the Spanish.

As for the French, well we do learn how we all murdered each other, married into each others monarchies and owned each others land a few times around.

When I went to school, I think the first time the empire was mentioned at all, was around third form. And only in reference to twentieth century events.

The chief reason that England dissolved it's empire was because of its inability to hold it under any kind of meaningful control as the Empire's cash reserves and popularity took a hit in India, its major cash cow.



Of course blowing the procedes of 200 yrs of empire on 2 world wars in 20 yrs had something to do with the empire running short of cash.

Whats glossed over is in the period 1939-late 1941, the US economy boomed as
British cash was spent buying supplies from the US.

When I went to school, I think the first time the empire was mentioned at all, was around third form. And only in reference to twentieth century events.

Third form?

Talk about dating yourself ;)

I was lucky with my history teachers, they often went on rambling lectures about various periods outside our study area, esp. at A level where everyone was actually interested in history.

I was never very good at writing essays, but I was the one who took the revision lessons caus I knew the whole course inside out.

Third form?

Talk about dating yourself ;)


Don't get me started on the 'new' money.!!!:mad:

Nah, I'm not quite that old. I think comprehensives in the north are fairly reactionary, and tend to hold onto the old terminology well after its dated.

Britain wouldn't of expanded into Australia and we would of sent convicts to America for a longer time basically America would be just like Australia

Where we would of gone from there? Who knows world domination looks about right since we would of never became an empire of trade WWI would have been a walkover really (that is if Germany hadn’t taken Australia and been content with it)

Britain wouldn't of expanded into Australia and we would of sent convicts to America for a longer time basically America would be just like Australia

Where we would of gone from there? Who knows world domination looks about right since we would of never became an empire of trade WWI would have been a walkover really (that is if Germany hadn’t taken Australia and been content with it)

I nearly suffocated when I saw "wouldn't of"...

Third form?

Talk about dating yourself ;)

How does that date him? :confused:

The only encounter with the War of Independence (American, as opposed to Irish, which we've studied extensively) was in a module I took in Uni last year about the southern US states between 1700 and 1850.

That's it; nothing in school, nothing in any other modules in Uni.

Although, I suppose we have a couple of thousand years of history to study, so something relatively minor like the US Independence isn't at the top of mosts lists for study.

i'd say that if the american revolution failed the brittish empire would have remained intaked much loner. the fench revolution would have hapened, in much the same way as it did in reality, as the driving forces behind it were ecconomical, not political as was the case with the american revolution. The american civil war would still have occured, but would have been shorter and more decisivly won by the british (replacing the north in the real civil war). i'd also say that if the world wars occured, they would have been much shorter and would have resulted in brittan rising to super power status, because brittan would have had the resorces of the US to divote to the war effort. the british empire would later loose many of it's holdings in Africa and Canada in the wake of india's indapendence.

technologically i see no probable differences. exept that those advances made by US citisans would have been made by citisens of the UK instead.

Don't get me started on the 'new' money.!!!:mad:

Nah, I'm not quite that old. I think comprehensives in the north are fairly reactionary, and tend to hold onto the old terminology well after its dated.

Well, they've got rid of that now, and in my experience they've been gone since the start of the 90's.

In England they can't be referred to as forms in state schools any longer, it's now the 'Year' system, with the first year of secondary school being Yr.7.

How does that date him?:confused:

The only encounter with the War of Independence (American, as opposed to Irish, which we've studied extensively) was in a module I took in Uni last year about the southern US states between 1700 and 1850.

That's it; nothing in school, nothing in any other modules in Uni.

Although, I suppose we have a couple of thousand years of history to study, so something relatively minor like the US Independence isn't at the top of mosts lists for study.

See above, bar private schools, the phrase 'Form' in reference to a year group is no longer valid in England.

Well, they've got rid of that now, and in my experience they've been gone since the start of the 90's.

In England they can't be referred to as forms in state schools any longer, it's now the 'Year' system, with the first year of secondary school being Yr.7.



See above, bar private schools, the phrase 'Form' in reference to a year group is no longer valid in England.


Ah, ok. I think they changed that here maybe...last year? Very recently. And only so it fits with the computer system they got in from England. Most schools I know still use Form 1, 2, 3 etc.

Had it failed, the world would be a better place now. One of these days, America is doing to destroy the world.

Just watch.

Ah, ok. I think they changed that here maybe...last year? Very recently. And only so it fits with the computer system they got in from England. Most schools I know still use Form 1, 2, 3 etc.

Well, our upper and lower 6th are often still referred to as such, but their proper names are now year 12 and 13.

Doubtless it will change again in 10 years time... :rolleyes:

If an unelected militant minority had not rebelled then the loyal people of north American would still be British and North America would not now be overrun by descendants of bloody Germans!

The people of Florida who remained loyal to the British would not have been betrayed and given over to the opportunistic Spanish enemy, who later gave it away to attacking rebel American insurgence in return for Texas (last time anyone trusted the USA!). :D

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.
I was not taught a single piece of history during my entire education in New Zealand (when they still had "Form 1" to the "7th form") as History class were as optional elective. However this still means I know a thousand times more history then the average American and a lot more then the average pom!

If an unelected militant minority had not rebelled then the loyal people of north American would still be British and North America would not now be overrun by descendants of bloody Germans!

The people of Florida who remained loyal to the British would not have been betrayed and given over to the opportunistic Spanish enemy, who later gave it away to attacking rebel American insurgence in return for Texas (last time anyone trusted the USA!). :D

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>.
I was not taught a single piece of history during my entire education in New Zealand (when they still had "Form 1" to the "7th form") as History class were as optional elective. However this still means I know a thousand times more history then the average American and a lot more then the average pom!

Did you take "arrogance class" instead?

Well, our upper and lower 6th are often still referred to as such, but their proper names are now year 12 and 13.

Bizarrely enough when I was at school we had lower 6th and middle 6th, but no upper 6th.

The US and Canada would be one huge super-country...with very close ties to Britain and the Commonwealth...probably.

Meh. This has probably been asked before. I could probably make an RP off of this... But uh... Anyways. What would happen if the American Revolution FAILED?!?!?!.

Instead of "My Country 'Tis of Thee" we'd sing "God Save the Queen".
No big change otherwise.

Bizarrely enough when I was at school we had lower 6th and middle 6th, but no upper 6th.

My brother spent four years in 6th form. And it was good apparently.

My brother spent four years in 6th form. And it was good apparently.

My initial reaction is 'Bucking all round him, was he?' Make of that what you will.

In Mexico the American Revolution is known as Independence of the United States. It's treated in some detail, although not too much, as a precedent to the independence movements in the rest of the continent, along with the French Revolution, Napoleon's invasion of Spain, and the whole Illustration bit.

And then the War of Texas and the US-Mexican War, of course.

What would have happened? Mmh... Canada would be a lot bigger, so would Mexico. There'd be a higher population in Europe and probablt WW1 would have been even bloodier. There would still have been a WW2 and a Soviet Union perhaps counter-balanced by a French-British alliance.

While largely considered a waste of money at the time, the Louisiana Purchase was the most important act of the early Mexican Republic.
Discuss.

If the American Revolution failed to bring the Americans the independence from Britian, several things would have happened:
-Brittian would lose its empire sooner. The reason: the revenue the American colonies would have brought would be cancelled out by the cost of protecting the investment. Thusly, they would lose money.

-The French revolution might not have happened. While the reasons were different, it is believed by many that the success of the American Revolution(the little guys defeating one of the most powerful tyrants the world had ever seen) might have helped sparked the French Revolution, and possibly later revolutions, by bringing hope. After all, if a group of individuals, with almost no military training, could defeat what was possibly the most powerful military at the time, why couldn't they?

-I would be European and living in a non-European continent. I wouild be North American and European. Quite the problem.

Wasn't the American Revolution designed to free the country from the rule of an imbecile called George, who only got the job because of who his father (also called George) was?I suspect that you've been listening to the same radio trailers as I have... (Ok, so this particular Meme isn't that unique, but given the coincidence of them appearing in the last week, I'm making a guess... ;))

I'd just like to point out to all the patriotic americans here that the Revolution wasn't justified.

Sure, you were taxed and didnt have a place in Parliament. BUT you we're taxed LESS than the people in the British Mainland and Manchester and Liverpool (who were much bigger than America) didn't have a seat and were taxed more. And *they* didn't take a massive hissy-fit and follow a slave-owner into war.

BUT, I'm an Irish Nationalist, so I congratulate America getting rid of the Brits. ;)

And what if the British won? Tbh, I think there would have been a big Colonial War with France for the South, and if Britian won (through funding the Revolution and placing a friendly friend on the Throne) Britain wouldn't really have anyone to stop it.

I see them taking over North America, India, Africa and that other place they owned.

Unrealistic? Rember, the Napoleanonic Wars never happened.

Slowly Britain gives out more Automny, and those nations become pretty much free, but still have a British Monarch (think Canada and Queen Lizzie).


The two world wars still happen, but happen earlier and are less Bloody.

And yes, Germany still starts it, but this time they work with Russia.

THE OTHER PLACE BRITAIN OWNED WAS AUSTRALIA! How'd I forget the Aussies?

I'd just like to point out to all the patriotic americans here that the Revolution wasn't justified.

Sure, you were taxed and didnt have a place in Parliament. BUT you we're taxed LESS than the people in the British Mainland and Manchester and Liverpool (who were much bigger than America) didn't have a seat and were taxed more. And *they* didn't take a massive hissy-fit and follow a slave-owner into war.

how does that show the merkans to not be justified, rather than showing that those groups would have been justified in rebelling if they had done so?

People would remember to put the U after the O in a lot of words. Also, the British rock invasion would effectively be just a few blokes from across the pond. Elvis would have been a banker.

The two world wars still happen, but happen earlier and are less Bloody.

And yes, Germany still starts it, but this time they work with Russia.



Wait Wait Wait...

So, Germany, allied to Czarist and Bolshevik Russia, start both world wars.

And it would be less bloody? With a weakened United States?

Something isn't adding up, friend.

Wait Wait Wait...

So, Germany, allied to Czarist and Bolshevik Russia, start both world wars.

And it would be less bloody? With a weakened United States?

Something isn't adding up, friend.

Well, I've a feeling the War would end alot faster, and Britain would be in a much strong poistion to fight it.

And, as America was in the Commonwealth, it'd be fighting from the start, not joining in as soon as she knew who was going to win :P.

While largely considered a waste of money at the time, the Louisiana Purchase was the most important act of the early Mexican Republic.
Discuss.
Without it the creation of the Giant Buffalo Taco in Salsa Verde would not have been possible.

how does that show the merkans to not be justified, rather than showing that those groups would have been justified in rebelling if they had done so?

You've a fair point, and I think I didn't make myself clear actually.

What I meant was the reasons drilled into the Western World's head are unjustified, i.e.: The New Goverment wasn't much more progressive than the British one was in a few years or so.

BUT, I'm sorry if i said it wasn't justified, it was: King George was a Tyrant. :)

And it gives me something to make fun of my english friends about.

It would really be quite simple.

Australia wouldn't have been taken over, and so the Aboriginies would've united into a powerful multination confederation, developed nuclear boomerangs, and conquered the world.

Seriously, though, if the American Revolution failed, I probably wouldn't be here today.