NationStates Jolt Archive

What exactly is a vocational education? I understand its supposed to provide you with skills needed to work but I dont quite understand the specifics. For example what are the majors associated with a vocational education (In the US)

What exactly is a vocational education? I understand its supposed to provide you with skills needed to work but I dont quite understand the specifics. For example what are the majors associated with a vocational education (In the US)
They are job focused degrees usualy at or below the BA level

2 year degrees

They also focus on other certifications such as Nursing Licence (usualy LPN here) and things like journymens licences and such (electrical certification)

Just about any of the skilled "blue collar" jobs. carpentry, plumber, auto repair, electrical, etc.

Just about any of the skilled "blue collar" jobs. carpentry, plumber, auto repair, electrical, etc.
That pretty much covers it.

Just about any of the skilled "blue collar" jobs. carpentry, plumber, auto repair, electrical, etc.
Much shorter then what I was even though that is what I was trying to get at lol

Just about any of the skilled "blue collar" jobs. carpentry, plumber, auto repair, electrical, etc.

Don't forget farming. I went to a Vocational Agricutlural high school.

It's non-academic; it's considered a 'practical' education (not to say that medical, law or teaching ones aren't; this is practical from the perspective of the educational process).

its a very good program which teaches kids more than bullshit grammer and stuff and teaches them real life things that they can acually use be it just around the house or in a career

its a very good program which teaches kids more than bullshit grammer and stuff and teaches them real life things that they can acually use be it just around the house or in a career

Ditto its not like going to a university and getting a political science degree.
What the hell am i suppose to do with a PS degree!!!

The military is probably the biggest trainer of vocational education

What exactly is a vocational education? I understand its supposed to provide you with skills needed to work but I dont quite understand the specifics. For example what are the majors associated with a vocational education (In the US)

A "Vocational Education" is not an education at all, it's TRAINING.

Education is something different, purer, and about knowledge which may not give you any advantage whatsoever, it's about broadening your mind, not making your mind able to handle certain tasks within your chosen profession.

Sorry, did that sound snotty?

A "Vocational Education" is not an education at all, it's TRAINING.

Education is something different, purer, and about knowledge which may not give you any advantage whatsoever, it's about broadening your mind, not making your mind able to handle certain tasks within your chosen profession.

Sorry, did that sound snotty?

Yes it did, it made you sound like a snotty academic. Just remeber, by your defintion your doctor, and the engineer who built the bridge you drive over are not educated. :P

Yes it did, it made you sound like a snotty academic. Just remeber, by your defintion your doctor, and the engineer who built the bridge you drive over are not educated. :P

Mmmmm, i was thinking more about accountancy and the like, to be honest. Medicine...well, you can expand the field of knowledge by research, engineer, well, you can develop new concepts in leverage, construction etc. Whereas accountants-well, you know, after "Double Entry Book Keeping" it's a bit of a dead field. I meant the mass of "educational" qualifications which are nothing of the sort, "Tourism degrees", nonsense like that.

And no, not a snotty academic. Although i'd have quite liked to be, i never had the financial backing to continue it past a certain stage...

(OOC)

Vactional Education takes many sizes and variations. Vocational education is considered to be one of the 4 things Americans expect thier HS's to provide their students. The 4 goals of the American Education System are:

1. Individual-Personal Growth (Self realization, the ability to make choices)
2. Socio-Civic Growth (Active and productive citizens, socially responsible)
3. Academic-Intellectual Growth (3 R's, Science, traditional school courses)
4. Vocational Growth (the topic of this discussion)

On the post secondary level it is traditionally thought of as the majority of majors at "Tech" schools, though there are many liberal arts schools that offer 2 year degrees in these areas as well.

It is also thought of by a growing number of people to be extremely cost INeffective and on the HS (not post secondary) level to be more limiting than helpful. (There are a number of scientific studies to cororberate this). Vocational training in HS's is on the decline because in part of this, though in greater part because of budgetary set backs.

(OOC)

Vactional Education takes many sizes and variations. Vocational education is considered to be one of the 4 things Americans expect thier HS's to provide their students. The 4 goals of the American Education System are:

1. Individual-Personal Growth (Self realization, the ability to make choices)
2. Socio-Civic Growth (Active and productive citizens, socially responsible)
3. Academic-Intellectual Growth (3 R's, Science, traditional school courses)
4. Vocational Growth (the topic of this discussion)

On the pose secondary level it is traditionally thought of as the majority of majors at "Tech" schools, though there are many liberal arts schools that offer 2 year degrees in these areas as well.

It is also thought of by a growing number of people to be extremely cost INeffective and on the HS (not post secondary) level to be more limiting than helpful. (There are a number of scientific studies to cororberate this). Vocational training in HS's is on the decline because in part of this, though in greater part because of budgetary set backs.

A growing number of people are also morons. For example, you remove Vocational schools, and explain who exactly will be repairing your car? Or any of a dozen other jobs that are taken so much for granted that most people never even think about it. Mechanics make DAMN good money, so I dunno what you mean by "cost ineffective".

As for vocational training in schools, it serves a purpose, namely for those that either don't want to, or aren't cut out for college. Why go somewhere you won't learn something you're going to use? Assuming EVERYONE is going to go to college is just stupid.

A growing number of people are also morons. For example, you remove Vocational schools, and explain who exactly will be repairing your car? Or any of a dozen other jobs that are taken so much for granted that most people never even think about it. Mechanics make DAMN good money, so I dunno what you mean by "cost ineffective".

(OOC)

Let me clartify a couple points:

Voactional training in HS's (High Schools) is considered by a growing number of poeple to be cost inneffective and limiting.

In a post secondary setting vocational training is entirely right, good, and necessary in this world and there is not a reasonable person that would dispute that. In a post secondary setting it is not cost inneffective or limiting, but rather life training.

Americans have again and again said they want their High Schools to provide and comprehensive education, which means they want their children to learn all the basics so they can do whatever they like with their lives. That is why vocational training in HS's started, though now there is evidence that says vocational training at this level does precisely the opposite.

In a HS setting, there is scientific backing to say that vocational training is cost inneffective and limiting rather than a beneficial.

I am not saying any of that with any bias, this is simply the fact of scientific study and of American Educational history.

(OOC)

Let me clartify a couple points:

Voactional training in HS's (High Schools) is considered by a growing number of poeple to be cost inneffective and limiting.

In a post secondary setting vocational training is entirely right, good, and necessary in this world and there is not a reasonable person that would dispute that. In a post secondary setting it is not cost inneffective or limiting, but rather life training.

Americans have again and again said they want their High Schools to provide and comprehensive education, which means they want their children to learn all the basics so they can do whatever they like with their lives. That is why vocational training in HS's started, though now there is evidence that says vocational training at this level does precisely the opposite.

In a HS setting, there is scientific backing to say that vocational training is cost inneffective and limiting rather than a beneficial.

I am not saying any of that with any bias, this is simply the fact of scientific study and of American Educational history.

Vocational Education is an elective anyway... It's not core curriculum. I took a few electives in the last couple years, and I know I never planned on going to College, so what I learned is only helping me.

Well, something I turn my nose up for one.

Yes it did, it made you sound like a snotty academic. Just remeber, by your defintion your doctor, and the engineer who built the bridge you drive over are not educated. :P
um...all doctors and most top engineers are university educated, not vocationally. Actually, if I remember correctly, about 50% of the top US engineers come from BU or Penn State.

Oh, and to the person who said grammar is bullshit, the fact is everyone must have written and verbal communication skills, which are directly related to your grammar. If you sound like an idiot, and your competition sounds well educated, you won't get the job.

(OOC)

I believe what PotHead Stoners was so mad about is the common method of grammar instruction in the US.

The form I believe he is talking about is either called parsing, or a close relative of parsing, diagramming.

(Caution, ahead of this statement is a rant.)

(begin rant)
What gets me, is that back in 1960 these 2 forms of teaching grammar were found to be TOTALLY inneffective way to teach grammar. Scientific studies, the whole lot, Parsing and Diagramming DO NOT WORK as methods of grammar instruction. Yet what do we find still in use today? You guessed it! Parsing and Diagramming!

We need our schools to get off this stupid grammar alone kick and teach grammar in relation to child's own writing! That works! Its proven.... bah!

Sorry about that all, I think thats the end...
(end rant)