NationStates Jolt Archive

So i just watched that documentary about the supposed world wide conspiracy of Jewish take over, which the movie debunked that myth. Is there any one here that actually beleives it? why?

Also what about anti-jewish sentiments...are they on the increase in the world today? Add what ever you want to, so long as it deal with the movie, the forged document or anti-semetism


**Note** since this thread has went from what i wanted to talk about to starting to talk about other aspects of a jew...well i propose that we talk about anything jewish!

No to both questions.

Well, neo-nazis swear by it, unsurprisingly.

Is there any one here that actually beleives it?

Best not be ... I'll haunt them.

Also what about anti-jewish sentiments...are they on the increase in the world today?

Not in the West. Oh, sure, the old standbys like JewWatch.com or whatever are still around, but everything's generally pretty nice here. Now ... in the Arab world ... things have been on a steady downhill Jew hating slope since 1948.

*shrug*

I've been called "Jew boy" and had eggs thrown at my house and had swastikas painted on the door of the synagogue, but at least nobody's ever tried to blow me up.

Best not be ... I'll haunt them.



Not in the West. Oh, sure, the old standbys like JewWatch.com or whatever are still around, but everything's generally pretty nice here. Now ... in the Arab world ... things have been on a steady downhill Jew hating slope since 1948.

*shrug*

I've been called "Jew boy" and had eggs thrown at my house and had swastikas painted on the door of the synagogue, but at least nobody's ever tried to blow me up.

BUT arnt you muslim?

So i just watched that documentary about the supposed world wide conspiracy of Jewish take over, which the movie debunked that myth. Is there any one here that actually beleives it? why?
Yes, there are. The book is being republished in huge edititons in Turkey, for example. Because blaming people is easy.

Also what about anti-jewish sentiments...are they on the increase in the world today? Add what ever you want to, so long as it deal with the movie, the forged document or anti-semetismReporeted anti-semitic incidents have been on the rise in the last several years all over Europe and here in Canada too. (I don't know about the US).
Things like fire-bombings of synagogues, cemetary descecration, and targeting of jewish homes for vandalism have increased surprisingly in the recent time span.

BUT arnt you muslim?he's a weird hybrid that likes to think of himself as both.

if the jewish take over of the United States can produce a millitary as strong and efficient as the Isreali millitary, i say let it happen

he's a weird hybrid that likes to think of himself as both.

But..how can you be a Jewish muslim...they are two different beleifs.

Thats like saying, I'm a Hindu Christian.

BUT arnt you muslim?

Oy ... how many times do I have to explain this ...

I was BORN Jewish. My MOTHER is Jewish. I was RAISED Jewish.

I converted to Islam about 2 years ago.

That didn't stop me from being Jewish any more than it stopped me from having blue eyes.

Yeesh ... why do people think Muslim is a "race"?

But..how can you be a Jewish muslim...they are two different beleifs.

Actually, they're not. One can be a Muslim Jew or a Buddhist Jew or an Atheist Jew ....

One is born Jewish or, if they convert to Judaism, they become Jewish by immersion into the culture and community. Either way, you're a Jew for life no matter what you choose to believe.

Oy ... how many times do I have to explain this ...

I was BORN Jewish. My MOTHER is Jewish. I was RAISED Jewish.

I converted to Islam about 2 years ago.

That didn't stop me from being Jewish any more than it stopped me from having blue eyes.

Yeesh ... why do people think Muslim is a "race"?

Islam is not a race...but...if you convert from Judaism to Islam...that means you drop Judaism and adopt Islam. You arent a Jewish Muslim...you simply a muslim...or if you want, a muslim that comes from a Jewish family, or a muslim who was formerly Jewish.

It just doesnt make sense other wise.

Being Muslim DOES stop you from being Jewish..because unlike having a certain eye color which doesnt change, your beleifs...(Judaism or Islam) can change.

Oy ... how many times do I have to explain this ...

I was BORN Jewish. My MOTHER is Jewish. I was RAISED Jewish.

I converted to Islam about 2 years ago.

That didn't stop me from being Jewish any more than it stopped me from having blue eyes.

Yeesh ... why do people think Muslim is a "race"?

i dont really think of jewish as a race

Actually, they're not. One can be a Muslim Jew or a Buddhist Jew or an Atheist Jew ....

One is born Jewish or, if they convert to Judaism, they become Jewish by immersion into the culture and community. Either way, you're a Jew for life no matter what you choose to believe.

Thats not true at all. You cant be a muslim jew, or a buddhist jew, or an Atheist Jew.

Judaism is a beleif...a train of thought. Once you adopt another its usually because you beleive in that other religion...thus you adopt that and drop Judaism.

The whole Jew for life thing is just stupid and is what either...ultra religious Jews say to make Jews feel closer to each other, or what rascists say to stereotype and catagorize Jews.

Islam is not a race...but...if you convert from Judaism to Islam...that means you drop Judaism and adopt Islam. You arent a Jewish Muslim...you simply a muslim...or if you want, a muslim that comes from a Jewish family, or a muslim who was formerly Jewish.

I never once in my life ever practiced Judaism. That doesn't make me not Jewish. Judaism != Jew and Jew != Judaism. You can practice Judaism without being Jewish and you can be a Jew without practicing Judaism.

Being Muslim DOES stop you from being Jewish

No ..... no it doesn't. Nothing can strip me of my birth or my cultural identity.

i dont really think of jewish as a race

Exactly...me neither. Islam, nor Judaism are races.

i dont really think of jewish as a race

Well technically it isn't. It's a cultural identity. It's certainly not a religion.

Actually, they're not. One can be a Muslim Jew or a Buddhist Jew or an Atheist Jew ....

One is born Jewish or, if they convert to Judaism, they become Jewish by immersion into the culture and community. Either way, you're a Jew for life no matter what you choose to believe.


Exactly. My family on my moms side is jewish...unfortunatly they kinda hate that fact and hide..I found out on accident that i have some jewish blood. So now that i consider myself partially Jewish it doesn't mean I am not a Christian by faith.

I never once in my life ever practiced Judaism. That doesn't make me not Jewish. Judaism != Jew and Jew != Judaism. You can practice Judaism without being Jewish and you can be a Jew without practicing Judaism.



No ..... no it doesn't. Nothing can strip me of my birth or my cultural identity.

Theres something you dont understand. You CANT practice Judaism and not be Jew and you cant not beleive in Judaism and be a Jew. If you never once in your life practiced Judaism...you werent Jewish.

Your birth...Judaism is an idea...and since as a baby your too young to understand that idea your not really Jewish...thats just a Jewish tradition...just like baptising.

There's a big debate on that. Whether its a race, or culture, or religion. Its both religion and culture. And Judiasm and Islam aren't really that different. I mean, the Muslims recognize Moses as a prophet! It isn't muslims that hate Jews, its the extremist ones. There are extremists in all religions, and most notabely in the big three. You've got the crazy right-wing religious fundamentalists in the US, the crazy muslim extremists in. . .much of the middle east, and the crazy Ultra-orthodox Jews in Israel. And for the most part they hate everyone else.

And if the Protocols of Zion ARE true, then I'm still waiting for my cut of the cash.

Exactly. My family on my moms side is jewish...unfortunatly they kinda hate that fact and hide..I found out on accident that i have some jewish blood. So now that i consider myself partially Jewish it doesn't mean I am not a Christian by faith.

See...but thats wrong. Those are old stereotypes that are slowly dying out.

Jews arnt a race....It doesnt matter if both your parents are Jewish...it matters what YOU beleive. If you practice/beleive in Christianity...your a Christian. If you pracitce/beleive in Judaism...your Jewish.

From what i remember Jew comes from the region Judah. When the baylonians(maybe it was the assyrians i forget) took over northern israel, only the southern kingdom remained, Judah. hence the people were called Jew, regardless if they practiced the faith. Like Keru said, it is a cultural identity

Well technically it isn't. It's a cultural identity. It's certainly not a religion.

It certianly IS a religion. Your insane! LOL

Theres something you dont understand. You CANT practice Judaism and not be Jew and you cant not beleive in Judaism and be a Jew. If you never once in your life practiced Judaism...you werent Jewish.


Bullshit. Absolute and utter bullshit. My Rabbi, My family, and every Orthodox Jew in the world completely disagrees with you. My mother being Jewish makes me Jewish. Period. I had a brit milah, attended Yeshiva, and became a bar mitzvah. I am Jewish. When it came time for me to make up my own mind, I became Buddhist at around 14-15 years old.

I was still a Jew.

I take it you're not Jewish and know nothing of our people, traditions, or culture.

If you are Jewish and spewing this drivel, I suggest you speak to your Rabbi.

It certianly IS a religion. Your insane! LOL

"Jewish" is not a religion.

"Judaism" is a religion.

"Jewish" is not.

There's a big debate on that. Whether its a race, or culture, or religion. Its both religion and culture. And Judiasm and Islam aren't really that different. I mean, the Muslims recognize Moses as a prophet! It isn't muslims that hate Jews, its the extremist ones. There are extremists in all religions, and most notabely in the big three. You've got the crazy right-wing religious fundamentalists in the US, the crazy muslim extremists in. . .much of the middle east, and the crazy Ultra-orthodox Jews in Israel. And for the most part they hate everyone else.

And if the Protocols of Zion ARE true, then I'm still waiting for my cut of the cash.

Judaism is a religion and culture...but no more so than Eastern Orthodox is a religion and culture...Dont you guys see that?

"Jewish" is not a religion.

"Judaism" is a religion.

"Jewish" is not.

Jewish is just the adjective to describe someone who practices Judaism.

Thats not true at all. You cant be a muslim jew, or a buddhist jew, or an Atheist Jew.

Judaism is a beleif...a train of thought. Once you adopt another its usually because you beleive in that other religion...thus you adopt that and drop Judaism.

The whole Jew for life thing is just stupid and is what either...ultra religious Jews say to make Jews feel closer to each other, or what rascists say to stereotype and catagorize Jews.

There is two meanings of the word Jew:

1: A person of Hebrew/Jewish descendancy or culture

2: A member of the religion Judaism


The former can be the latter, and the latter can be the former, but you must be born into the former, while you can convert into the latter. By the same token, one cannot cease to be of the former group, while one can cease to be of the latter group. Furthermore, an athiest could potentially be a member of the former, but not of the latter.

Bullshit. Absolute and utter bullshit. My Rabbi, My family, and every Orthodox Jew in the world completely disagrees with you. My mother being Jewish makes me Jewish. Period. I had a brit milah, attended Yeshiva, and became a bar mitzvah. I am Jewish. When it came time for me to make up my own mind, I became Buddhist at around 14-15 years old.

I was still a Jew.

I take it you're not Jewish and know nothing of our people, traditions, or culture.

If you are Jewish and spewing this drivel, I suggest you speak to your Rabbi.

I am Jewish....This is what the orthodox beleive for one reason. To keep Jews together. To make them feel close. Notice how its only the ultra religious who view it this way...hence rabbis would say this.

All that stuff you said...having a brit milah bar mitzvah..all that...well then you were Jewish at the time but once you converted you stoped being Jewish....I dont understand whats so hard to understand about that.

I have talked to my rabbi about this.

If you pracitce/beleive in Judaism...your Jewish.

Wrong.

You do not have to practice Judaism to be Jewish.

http://www.ifshj.org/ (secular humanist Jews, still Jews)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_Jew (Wiki article on Muslim Jews)

http://www.jews-for-allah.org/ (Still Jews)

You need to read up more before you start making baseless assumptions.

Wrong.

You do not have to practice Judaism to be Jewish.

http://www.ifshj.org/ (secular humanist Jews, still Jews)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_Jew (Wiki article on Muslim Jews)

http://www.jews-for-allah.org/ (Still Jews)

You need to read up more before you start making baseless assumptions.


Don't forget Jewish Christians and/or messianic Jews! (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_Jews)

(ps i love how this debate is going...over who and who isn't a jew) hah

I am Jewish....

Then you should already know I'm right. Unless, that is, you're a young kid who hasn't studied it quite enough.

Either way, ask your Rabbi if there is any way a person who is born Jewish can stop being Jewish. Ask if one can be an Atheist Jew or a Buddhist Jew or even a Muslim Jew.

Ask him about Maimonides.

There is two meanings of the word Jew:

1: A person of Hebrew/Jewish descendancy or culture

2: A member of the religion Judaism


The former can be the latter, and the latter can be the former, but you must be born into the former, while you can convert into the latter. By the same token, one cannot cease to be of the former group, while one can cease to be of the latter group. Furthermore, an athiest could potentially be a member of the former, but not of the latter.

Yeah but the first is just an old stereotype from back in the day in Europe when the Church wanted to isolate and catagorize Jews...now it is mainly used by racists and the ultra orthodox to bring Jews together.

The former no longer really stands.

For instance.

I have very light straight blonde hair....used to be a toehead. I have green eyes...and am about 6"3...my family comes from Prussia and Austria. I am Jewish. Now my friend has very black curly hair...very dark eyes..a darker skin tone..and is about 5"6...how can you say all Jews are from the same ethnic group/race?

We are both Jews, but we are as different as night and day.

Then you should already know I'm right. Unless, that is, you're a young kid who hasn't studied it quite enough.

Either way, ask your Rabbi if there is any way a person who is born Jewish can stop being Jewish. Ask if one can be an Atheist Jew or a Buddhist Jew or even a Muslim Jew.

Ask him about Maimonides.

I have asked him and have looked it up. And I already told you, this is what the ultra orthodox beleive in. But just because they beleive in that...doesnt mean thats true. They say this because they want people to remain Jews...they want to keep Jews together. That whole thing.,

Theres something you dont understand. You CANT practice Judaism and not be Jew and you cant not beleive in Judaism and be a Jew. If you never once in your life practiced Judaism...you werent Jewish.

Your birth...Judaism is an idea...and since as a baby your too young to understand that idea your not really Jewish...thats just a Jewish tradition...just like baptising.
He's refering to being a jew as a cultural heritage, same as one can be Italian-American, German-Amerivan, or Irish-American. Judaism is both a religon and a cultural identity.

Yeah but the first is just an old stereotype from back in the day in Europe when the Church wanted to isolate and catagorize Jews...now it is mainly used by racists and the ultra orthodox to bring Jews together.

The former no longer really stands.

For instance.

I have very light straight blonde hair....used to be a toehead. I have green eyes...and am about 6"3...my family comes from Prussia and Austria. I am Jewish. Now my friend has very black curly hair...very dark eyes..a darker skin tone..and is about 5"6...how can you say all Jews are from the same ethnic group/race?

We are both Jews, but we are as different as night and day.

but you two still share the same cultural identity?

Yeah but the first is just an old stereotype from back in the day in Europe when the Church wanted to isolate and catagorize Jews...now it is mainly used by racists and the ultra orthodox to bring Jews together.

The former no longer really stands.

For instance.

I have very light straight blonde hair....used to be a toehead. I have green eyes...and am about 6"3...my family comes from Prussia and Austria. I am Jewish. Now my friend has very black curly hair...very dark eyes..a darker skin tone..and is about 5"6...how can you say all Jews are from the same ethnic group/race?

We are both Jews, but we are as different as night and day.

Ok. See, when a "Type 2" Jew who is not a "Type 1" Jew has descendants who become integrated in Jewish culture to a certain degree, they become "Type 1" Jews themselves.

I have asked him and have looked it up. And I already told you, this is what the ultra orthodox beleive in. But just because they beleive in that...doesnt mean thats true. They say this because they want people to remain Jews...they want to keep Jews together. That whole thing.,

It's not just the "ultra-orthodox" and by virtue of the fact that you'd use the term "ultra-orthodox", I question if you're truly Jewish or not. Even the Reform and Reconstructionist Jews hold the same beliefs. Someone who is born Jewish is *always* Jewish, regardless.

Your Jewish education is certainly lacking, either way.

Wrong.

You do not have to practice Judaism to be Jewish.

http://www.ifshj.org/ (secular humanist Jews, still Jews)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_Jew (Wiki article on Muslim Jews)

http://www.jews-for-allah.org/ (Still Jews)

You need to read up more before you start making baseless assumptions.

Thats garbage..like I said...it no longer stands today if a "conversion to Islam is considered apostasy by all branches of Judaism."

but you two still share the same cultural identity?

What cultural identity?

Judaism is a religion to me...nothing more. Its the way I beleive in God....what culture?

Thats garbage..like I said...it no longer stands today if a "conversion to Islam is considered apostasy by all branches of Judaism."

Where is that written? By whose authority is that said?

Give me a source on it. Give me a source where any Jewish text has ever, in the history of the Jewish people, used the term "apostate"!

It's not just the "ultra-orthodox" and by virtue of the fact that you'd use the term "ultra-orthodox", I question if you're truly Jewish or not. Even the Reform and Reconstructionist Jews hold the same beliefs. Someone who is born Jewish is *always* Jewish, regardless.

Your Jewish education is certainly lacking, either way.

You know, its wierd. I honestly never expected Keru to be of Jewish descent...:cool:

Ok. See, when a "Type 2" Jew who is not a "Type 1" Jew has descendants who become integrated in Jewish culture to a certain degree, they become "Type 1" Jews themselves.

So what are you saying...you confused me in there.

Where is that written? By whose authority is that said?

Give me a source on it. Give me a source where any Jewish text has ever, in the history of the Jewish people, used the term "apostate"!

Tt was in the second source you gave me. first or second paragraph.

Judaism is a religion to me...nothing more. Its the way I beleive in God....what culture?

Remind me to slap your mother. What do you mean "what culture"?! Oy gevalt.

Judaism is a religion.

Jewish is not.

I don't know why I can't get that through to you.

What cultural identity?

Judaism is a religion to me...nothing more. Its the way I beleive in God....what culture?


Do you neccessarily have to be a practiciing 100% torah beleive Jew to practice Passover? nope.. i no of jewish atheists that do it for tradition.

Remind me to slap your mother. What do you mean "what culture"?! Oy gevalt.

Judaism is a religion.

Jewish is not.

I don't know why I can't get that through to you.

Jewish is someone who practices Judaism.

What culture?!?

And what does Oy Gevalt mean?

Do you neccessarily have to be a practiciing 100% torah beleive Jew to practice Passover? nope.. i no of jewish atheists that do it for tradition.

Probably to be with their families...its a family holiday.

So they are still atheists....yet they are having a dinner with their family.

So what are you saying...you confused me in there.
When a person who is a member of the religion Judaism has a family, and that family becomes integrated into Jewish culture to a certain degree, members of that family can claim the title of Jew, in the "Type 1" or "former" sense (to refer to my first post).

Don't forget Jewish Christians and/or messianic Jews! (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_Jews)

(ps i love how this debate is going...over who and who isn't a jew) hah

Messianic Jews are not Jewish. They're Christian. The beliefs are in many ways so similar, they're basically just Christians with latkes and yarmalukes, and Hannukah.

They belive the messiah has come. That's not Jewish.

Tt was in the second source you gave me. first or second paragraph.

Oh I see. Yes, true ... but it doesn't stop you from being Jewish. It just means you can no longer light the sabbath candles in the Temple. You're still Jewish.

Remind me to slap your mother. What do you mean "what culture"?! Oy gevalt.

Judaism is a religion.

Jewish is not.

I don't know why I can't get that through to you.


... I guess now you know how it feels to be a parent? Can't get anything through those thick skulls:p

You know, its wierd. I honestly never expected Keru to be of Jewish descent...:cool:

See, the term Jewish descent is just stupid. Thats a phrase that doesnt stand in todays soceity.

Your religion is whatever you choose, not what you were born with.

It seems my saying this earlier might have been overlooked so I'll repeat. Keru. your refering to Jewish as a culture right? So you are a Jewish muslim in the same way that one might be a German-American or Italian-American, thats what your trying to get across?

And what does Oy Gevalt mean?

If you understood our culture, you'd know.

*sigh*

Get thee to Yeshiva!

Oh I see. Yes, true ... but it doesn't stop you from being Jewish. It just means you can no longer light the sabbath candles in the Temple. You're still Jewish.

No your not! LOL...If you arent accepted by any sects of Judaism...because you LEAVE THE RELIGION...you are no longer Jewish. How is that hard to understand?

Messianic Jews are not Jewish. They're Christian. The beliefs are in many ways so similar, they're basically just Christians with latkes and yarmalukes, and Hannukah.

They belive the messiah has come. That's not Jewish.

Why not? what if they still practice the traditions and so forth? what about their heritage?

ok boys and gals..be back in a few...making a walmart run!

If you understood our culture, you'd know.

*sigh*

Get thee to Yeshiva!

Yiddish is a dead language.

Jews, for the most part, speak either English, Hebrew, or Russian now.

... I guess now you know how it feels to be a parent?

Lol ... well I already have 4 kids (all Jewish, by the way ... HA!) ... but this one ... yeesh. Doesn't even know what "oy gevalt" means.

It seems my saying this earlier might have been overlooked so I'll repeat. Keru. your refering to Jewish as a culture right? So you are a Jewish muslim in the same way that one might be a German-American or Italian-American, thats what your trying to get across?

Ok, but my family came from Germany. So would that make me a German-Jewish-American?

Ok...now what if my family and I convereted?

Would we be German-Jewish-Christian-Americans?

Messianic Jews are not Jewish. They're Christian. The beliefs are in many ways so similar, they're basically just Christians with latkes and yarmalukes, and Hannukah.

They belive the messiah has come. That's not Jewish.

EXACTLY! The main difference between Jews and Christians...is that Christians beleive the Messiah has came, Jews dont.

No your not! LOL...If you arent accepted by any sects of Judaism...because you LEAVE THE RELIGION...you are no longer Jewish. How is that hard to understand?

Yes I am. Every Jew I know accepts me juuust fine. I even still go to seder at the synagogue! Here's a pic of me giving a talk at my daughter's elementary school about Chanukkah ... and I was the one recommended BY THE SYNAGOGUE to be the one to give this talk:

http://www.unlc.biz/images/presenting02.jpg

If that's not "acceptance", I don't know what is. YOU, my friend, are wrong.

But Yiddish is such a cool language. . .

A kramp (a kram, a kortsh) im in layb (in boyakh, in di kishkes, in di gederem, in di finger)!!
A cramp in his body (in his stomach, in his guts, in his bowels, in his fingers and toes).

Lol ... well I already have 4 kids (all Jewish, by the way ... HA!) ... but this one ... yeesh. Doesn't even know what "oy gevalt" means.

Yeah, they are all Jewish if you raised them Jewish...but if you raised them Muslim then they would be all Muslim.

And...sorry for not knowing a dead language that has no use in todays society.

Ok, but my family came from Germany. So would that make me a German-Jewish-American?

Ok...now what if my family and I convereted?

Would we be German-Jewish-Christian-Americans?
I'd say yes.

But Yiddish is such a cool language. . .

A kramp (a kram, a kortsh) im in layb (in boyakh, in di kishkes, in di gederem, in di finger)!!
A cramp in his body (in his stomach, in his guts, in his bowels, in his fingers and toes).

Hebrew is better. It has a beauty to it that is lacking in Yiddish.

Yes I am. Every Jew I know accepts me juuust fine. I even still go to seder at the synagogue! Here's a pic of me giving a talk at my daughter's elementary school about Chanukkah ... and I was the one recommended BY THE SYNAGOGUE to be the one to give this talk:

http://www.unlc.biz/images/presenting02.jpg

If that's not "acceptance", I don't know what is. YOU, my friend, are wrong.

No I'm not....I was proven right by YOUR OWN SOURCE. If you convert to Islam...Jews beleive that you have left the religion, which you have.

By the way..why do you look like such a freaking hippie?

Yiddish is a dead language.

Errr ... no it isn't. I met some Jews from North Africa a couple of weeks ago and the only way we could communicate is because we happened to all speak Yiddish.

It's still very widely in use. Just because you don't use it, doesn't mean it's dead.

I'd say yes.

LOL....Well then theres no arguing with you!

Yes I am. Every Jew I know accepts me juuust fine. I even still go to seder at the synagogue! Here's a pic of me giving a talk at my daughter's elementary school about Chanukkah ... and I was the one recommended BY THE SYNAGOGUE to be the one to give this talk:

http://www.unlc.biz/images/presenting02.jpg

If that's not "acceptance", I don't know what is. YOU, my friend, are wrong.
Hmh, you don't look much like I've always pictured you. Always pictured you as looking abit like Alan Alda for some reason.

Hebrew is better. It has a beauty to it that is lacking in Yiddish.
Aye, but Yiddish has a harshness to it that is lacking in Hebrew.

But Hebrew looks nicer when written, too.

No I'm not....I was proven right by YOUR OWN SOURCE. If you convert to Islam...Jews beleive that you have left the religion, which you have.

No, my source didn't prove anything of the sort. I will disagree with that bit of the source and, fortunately, I can go edit it and shall.

By the way..why do you look like such a freaking hippie?

Because I am a freaking hippie.

Errr ... no it isn't. I met some Jews from North Africa a couple of weeks ago and the only way we could communicate is because we happened to all speak Yiddish.

It's still very widely in use. Just because you don't use it, doesn't mean it's dead.

Its a dead language...no country uses it. Those Jews in North Africa should adopt their countrys language and assimilate...or if they dont like it...they should defect to Israel...or as Israelis call it...making Alliah.

No, my source didn't prove anything of the sort. I will disagree with that bit of the source and, fortunately, I can go edit it and shall.



Because I am a freaking hippie.

Dont edit it because you disagree with it...thats wrong and you know it. That source is correct. If you leave a religion to adopt another religion...YOU ARE LEAVING YOUR FORMER RELIGION.

Its a dead language...no country uses it. Those Jews in North Africa should adopt their countrys language and assimilate...or if they dont like it...they should defect to Israel...or as Israelis call it...making Alliah.

Ok .... enough of this schtuss ... either you're a brain dead kid or deliberately being an asshole for no useful purpose.

Aye, but Yiddish has a harshness to it that is lacking in Hebrew.

Have you ever been yelled at in Hebrew? I have. Hebrew can be harsh when necessary.

But imagine praying in Yiddish, or reciting love poetry in Yiddish.

Aye, but Yiddish has a harshness to it that is lacking in Hebrew.

But Hebrew looks nicer when written, too.

Thats because Yiddish comes from German and is actually VERY similar to German. Thats why it sounds so harsh.

YOU ARE LEAVING YOUR FORMER RELIGION.

BUT NOT YOUR CULTURE OR GENETICS.

Oy vey ... I need a drink ...

Ok .... enough of this schtuss ... either you're a brain dead kid or deliberately being an asshole for no useful purpose.

No. Maybe I'm just not a liberal hippie who beleives in some kind of pan religious movement where everyone beleives in each others religions.

What the hell is wrong with you....you must smoke ALOT of doobies.

LOL....Well then theres no arguing with you!
Well I might shorten it to just those heritages which cultures you were more active/interested in or break the three up to be (insert cuture)-American, but thats just cause its a mouthful otherwise. I'd describe myself the same way German-American and Irish-American.

BUT NOT YOUR CULTURE OR GENETICS.

Oy vey ... I need a drink ...

WHAT JEWISH CULTURE!?!??! You still havnt answered me on that!

GENETICS! Jews are mainly either White or Arab.

Well I might shorten it to just those heritages which cultures you were more active/interested in or break the three up to be (insert cuture)-American, but thats just cause its a mouthful otherwise. I'd describe myself the same way German-American and Irish-American.

I would descrbie my self, if I had to...as a German-American who practices Judaism. And thats what I am!

Its a dead language...no country uses it. Those Jews in North Africa should adopt their countrys language and assimilate...or if they dont like it...they should defect to Israel...or as Israelis call it...making Alliah.
Why it's fun having additional cultural influences besides just your home country:D

Gee. . .we're all arguing about stuff. . .must be a bunch of Jews in the house. . .

There's a reason Hebrew was chosen as the national language for Israel. I'm not saying Yiddish > Hebrew, or vice versa, just that Yiddish is cool. All I know is a few curses.

No. Maybe I'm just not a liberal hippie who beleives in some kind of pan religious movement where everyone beleives in each others religions.

"Jewish" is not a religion.

Let me repeat that.

"Jewish" is not a religion.

Jew·ish adj. Of or relating to the Jews or their culture or religion.

:eek: Three Separate Things!

When you talk to your Rabbi about this, be sure to ask him to let you borrow a dictionary.

If you understood our culture, you'd know.

*sigh*

Get thee to Yeshiva!
Shame on you Keruvalia - just because a kid hasn't been raised the way YOU have, doesn't mean that they have no concept of a jewish Identity. Not everyone grows up with pithy yiddish isms.

Anyway, I tend to agree with the Altlantian Islands on this one. Yes, I've been taught since forever that if you're born a Jew you stay a Jew, but that doesn't make a whole lot of sense. Sure, you retain cuultural/family/historical/language ties, regardless of whether you believe nothing whatsoever, or something different etirely.
But if one actively practices some other religion, well, why call oneself Jewish?


Anyway, isn't this thread supposed to be about The Protocalls of the Elders of Zion and antisematism?

WHAT JEWISH CULTURE!?!??! You still havnt answered me on that!

Our culture ... every little thing that makes us ... us! Do you need a definition of "culture"? Just google "Jewish Culture" ... yeesh.

WHAT JEWISH CULTURE!?!??! You still havnt answered me on that!

GENETICS! Jews are mainly either White or Arab.
Jewish culture would be the culture of the Jews that came to america to escape the programs of Europe, it would consist of all the unique cultural things they brought with them like holidays or foods, especialy food:p .

Shame on you Keruvalia - just because a kid hasn't been raised the way YOU have, doesn't mean that they have no concept of a jewish Identity. Not everyone grows up with pithy yiddish isms.

Anyway, I tend to agree with the Altlantian Islands on this one. Yes, I've been taught since forever that if you're born a Jew you stay a Jew, but that doesn't make a whole lot of sense. Sure, you retain cuultural/family/historical/language ties, regardless of whether you believe nothing whatsoever, or something different etirely.
But if you one actively practices some other religion, well, why call oneself Jewish?


Anyway, isn't this thread supposed to be about The Protocalls of the Elders of Zion and antisematism?

Yeah, but a bunch of Jews got hold of it, so now its arguing about law and Torah and stuff. Typical. . . :D

Shame on you Keruvalia - just because a kid hasn't been raised the way YOU have, doesn't mean that they have no concept of a jewish Identity. Not everyone grows up with pithy yiddish isms.

Anyway, I tend to agree with the Altlantian Islands on this one. Yes, I've been taught since forever that if you're born a Jew you stay a Jew, but that doesn't make a whole lot of sense. Sure, you retain cuultural/family/historical/language ties, regardless of whether you believe nothing whatsoever, or something different etirely.
But if you one actively practices some other religion, well, why call oneself Jewish?


Anyway, isn't this thread supposed to be about The Protocalls of the Elders of Zion and antisematism?

Thats exactly what I have been trying to say!

If you practice Islam and beleive in Islam and dont practice Judiasm and dont beleive in Judaism...your a Muslim...not a Jew!

I dont see why thats so complicated??:confused:

But if you one actively practices some other religion, well, why call oneself Jewish?

For the same reason I still call myself American.

"Jewish" is not a religion.

Let me repeat that.

"Jewish" is not a religion.

Jew·ish adj. Of or relating to the Jews or their culture or religion.

:eek: Three Separate Things!

When you talk to your Rabbi about this, be sure to ask him to let you borrow a dictionary.

but in your definition you declared it as a religion, im confused:confused:

I dont see why thats so complicated??:confused:

Because it's wrong.

Jewish culture would be the culture of the Jews that came to america to escape the programs of Europe, it would consist of all the unique cultural things they brought with them like holidays or foods, especialy food:p .

The holidays have nothing to do with culture...they have to do with the religion. The food...eh..Jewish/Israeli food is disgusting...couldnt care less.

So..what else is "Jewish culture"?

Because it's wrong.

No its not. Its not wrong at all. In fact your the only person I have ever met to think it wrong.

but in your definition you declared it as a religion, im confused:confused:

No ... I have declared Judaism as the religion of the Jewish people. There's an implied "their" in front of "religion" in that definition.

However, if being Jewish meant "a practitioner of Judaism" and nothing more, the dictionary would say just that. It means way more than that, though.

For the same reason I still call myself American.

Ones religion and ones nationality are two totally different things.

Terrible analogy.

Thats exactly what I have been trying to say!

If you practice Islam and beleive in Islam and dont practice Judiasm and dont beleive in Judaism...your a Muslim...not a Jew!

I dont see why thats so complicated??:confused:

Because if you are a "Type 1" Jew, you can follow whatever religion you like and still be a Jew no matter what.

No its not. Its not wrong at all. In fact your the only person I have ever met to think it wrong.

It is most definitely wrong. Jewishness is far, far more than a religious identity. There are lots of atheist Jews who remain active in the Jewish community.

In fact your the only person I have ever met to think it wrong.

Then you need to get out more. Just go to the synagogue tomorrow and ask your Rabbi. Then ask 10 more Rabbis. Need some phone numbers?

I've yet to ever meet a single Jew who thinks of me as not Jewish. Plenty of goyisher as confused as you apparently are, but never a Jew.

The holidays have nothing to do with culture...they have to do with the religion. The food...eh..Jewish/Israeli food is disgusting...couldnt care less.

So..what else is "Jewish culture"?
The holidays bit was more to do with culutre in general, however I have to disagree on the food what I have had of it is quite good.

Ones religion and ones nationality are two totally different things.

Exactly! That is why you can still be a Jew culturally even if you are a member of a different religion.

Ones religion and ones nationality are two totally different things.

Terrible analogy.

Ummmm ... no ... because you've already said that being born Jewish wasn't enough to keep me Jewish. You've already said that I must practice Judaism in order to continue being Jewish and the fact that I was born Jewish and my mother is Jewish doesn't matter.

I am American for the exact same reason I am Jewish.

Ones religion and ones nationality are two totally different things.

Terrible analogy.
Yes, Jewish is also a culture:headbang: Thats what the whole argument is about!

Ummmm ... no ... because you've already said that being born Jewish wasn't enough to keep me Jewish. You've already said that I must practice Judaism in order to continue being Jewish and the fact that I was born Jewish and my mother is Jewish doesn't matter.

I am American for the exact same reason I am Jewish.

No...once you leave America (Judaism) for Germany (Islam) you are no longer an American (Jew) but are now a German (Muslim).

No...once you leave America (Judaism) for Germany (Islam) you are no longer an American (Jew) but are now a German (Muslim).

No .... if I renounce my citizenship to America and move to Germany, I am still a by blood American and can proudly call myself an American-German. Just as I can call myself a Muslim Jew.

If I become apostate in Islam - which I am seriously contemplating lately, but that's a whole 'nother story - then I can never call myself Muslim again ... but I will *always* be Jewish.

It is most definitely wrong. Jewishness is far, far more than a religious identity. There are lots of atheist Jews who remain active in the Jewish community.
Yep, I'm one of them. It's a way of honoring my family's cultural heritage and memory. In fact, I come from a very long line of Jewish atheists, agnostics, and secularists, but that doesn't make us any less Jewish.

There is no one permanent way to define a person's identity! There's no litmus test to say whether someone is or isn't Jewish, or any other category, for that matter. There's a lot of grey area out there, especially for diasporic peoples. The definition of yiddishkayt changes depending on the subject and the definer--not on any sort of "reality" behind the identity.

Thats exactly what I have been trying to say!

If you practice Islam and beleive in Islam and dont practice Judiasm and dont beleive in Judaism...your a Muslim...not a Jew!

I dont see why thats so complicated??:confused:Well, the reason it's more comlicated is that is that many Jews (not all - an it seems like you might be included in that) feel an unusua;lly, or maybe uniquely strong bond to their community and traditions. That makes Judaism alot more than just a set of religious beliefs and practices, it becomes a cultural Identity. Israel is a big part of that too.

No...once you leave America (Judaism) for Germany (Islam) you are no longer an American (Jew) but are now a German (Muslim).
No you'd be an American-German, same as immigrants that came here from Germany were German-American.

The definition of yiddishkayt changes depending on the subject and the definer--not on any sort of "reality" behind the identity.

Disco! Now ... I just wish you weren't a first-poster so it didn't look like I went and made a puppet just to agree with me ...

Disco! Now ... I just wish you weren't a first-poster so it didn't look like I went and made a puppet just to agree with me ...I'm not a puppet! I swear! Besides, puppets can't disco dance. Can they? See, if I were a disco-dancing puppet, I would KNOW this. Non-puppet-ness proven!

I'm not a puppet! I swear! Besides, puppets can't disco dance. Can they? See, if I were a disco-dancing puppet, I would KNOW this. Non-puppet-ness proven!

ROFL! Awesome. Welcome to the forums, by the way! Always good to see someone with a sense of humor around here. :D

Atlantian Isles: You are a Zionist, correct?

Are you aware that one of the original tenets of Zionism is that Jewishness is a national identity?

David Ben-Gurion and Theodor Herzl were both atheists.

Atlantian Isles: You are a Zionist, correct?

Are you aware that one of the original tenets of Zionism is that Jewishness is a national identity?

David Ben-Gurion and Theodor Herzl were both atheists.

OMG ... I wish I knew he was a Zionist ... damn ... I could have pointed that out pages and pages ago ...

OMG ... I wish I knew he was a Zionist ... damn ... I could have pointed that out pages and pages ago ...
And after you went to all that trouble of crafting a puppet and everything.;) :p

And after you went to all that trouble of crafting a puppet and everything.;) :p

hehehe ... dag nabbit!

Atlantian Isles: You are a Zionist, correct?

Are you aware that one of the original tenets of Zionism is that Jewishness is a national identity?

David Ben-Gurion and Theodor Herzl were both atheists.

Oh I'm not a zionist. I am an American...this is my home and this is where I belong. If other Jews want to make an Israel...I will suport it...but I will suport it as an American.

If they were both atheists then I dont consider them Jews.

Oh I'm not a zionist. I am an American...this is my home and this is where I belong. If other Jews want to make an Israel...I will suport it...but I will suport it as an American.

If they were both atheists then I dont consider them Jews.Well, I think you aught to widen your definition a little to accomodate for most of the people who would identify themselves as Jews, in the world. Those being the ones (like me) who do not believe in God.

And by the way, Zionism still includes anyone who supports Israel's right to exist as a Jewish state. So you're in.

Oh I'm not a zionist. I am an American...this is my home and this is where I belong.

That has nothing to do with being a Zionist.

ok first off...Im changing the thread to be "everything you want to talk about relating to Jews."


Second: for Atlantian:
http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=navclient&ie=UTF-8&rls=GGLR,GGLR:2005-45,GGLR:en&q=jewish+culture

there is a bunch 'o crap on jewish culture..i recommend the first site though..

There is an ethnicity relating to the people of the hebrew tribes in the middle east. These people are commonly refered to as Jewish, the same name given to the religion that they founded. So when Keruvalia says that he is an "Islamic Jew" I take it to mean more "Islamic Hebrew" As his parents are descendents of those tribes.

Unless I assume too much.