NationStates Jolt Archive

Whenever the question of rap music is introduced on a forum like this someone always has to point out how it's not music. Or it's not "real" music.

Well, let's decide it once and for all!

Yes, it is.

I like it. Especially some of the old stuff like Too Short and Dr. Dre.

I also like Eminem

Yes, it is.

Those who say it isn't are usually racist, ignorant on the topic, or both.

Yes, i think it's music, it's just music that for the most part, i don't like. Though there are a few exceptions.

Whether or not rap should be considered 'music' is debatable. I don't care for it.

Where is the multiple choice? I think it is music and I farted.

Yes, of course it is. By every definition of the term "music".

Anyone who thinks it isn't, doesn't know what "music" means.

I even like some of it and I'm a huge musical snob.

Where is the multiple choice? I think it is music and I farted.

But did you giggle?

Where is the multiple choice? I think it is music and I farted.

But did you fart to the beat? [/Bobby Jimmy]

of course its music. beating on a trash can lid is music too...

tupac, dre, eminem, obie trice, kanye west, 50 cent, nate dogg, snoop, and paul wall are some of my favorites...

But did you giggle?

I laughed uncontrollably for about 2-3 minutes like I always do.

I laughed uncontrollably for about 2-3 minutes like I always do.

Laughing isn't giggling.

Laughing isn't giggling.

Well it's close and I deserve credit.

I like hip hop and stuff but not striaght rap. Rap is boring. Less you are into words.

Now, I'm no elitist snob, but you call that trash MUSIC? Do I want to hear someone go on and on about their life, drugs, and illegal acts over bad music?

I certainly don't.

Now, I"ll stand for (and DEFEND) most music. Classical, Rock, Jazz, almost anything.

Just not rap.

Rap hardly seems like music to me. It's just a bunch of people talking.

Music to me is melody, melody will be the deciding factor in whether I like or dislike a song.

If the song has no melody, then it isn't worth my time.

Now, I'm no elitist snob, but you call that trash MUSIC? Do I want to hear someone go on and on about their life, drugs, and illegal acts over bad music?



:rolleyes:

Now, I'm no elitist snob, but you call that trash MUSIC? Do I want to hear someone go on and on about their life, drugs, and illegal acts over bad music?

I certainly don't.

Now, I"ll stand for (and DEFEND) most music. Classical, Rock, Jazz, almost anything.

Just not rap.

Well, that's nice, but not all rap is about drugs and illegal acts.

Still, either that or it's a boring speech.

Still, either that or it's a boring speech.

You're not listening to the stuff I'm listening to, then.

Now, I'm no elitist snob, but you call that trash MUSIC? Do I want to hear someone go on and on about their life, drugs, and illegal acts over bad music?

I certainly don't.

Now, I"ll stand for (and DEFEND) most music. Classical, Rock, Jazz, almost anything.

Just not rap.

Now, I'm no elitist snob, but you call that trash an OPINION?

Well, I haven't listened to all of it, but yeah, it just doesn't appeal to me.

EDIT:

At Vittos Ordination2:

What ind of defense was that?

From Dictionary.com:

1 The art of arranging sounds in time so as to produce a continuous, unified, and evocative composition, as through melody, harmony, rhythm, and timbre.
2 Vocal or instrumental sounds possessing a degree of melody, harmony, or rhythm
... <SNIP irrelevent definitions>...
6 An aesthetically pleasing or harmonious sound or combination of sounds: the music of the wind in the pines.

--------------------

1 It may not have melody or harmony, but it does have rhythm. Timbre is debatable, but whatever it does, it produces a continuous, unified, and perhaps even evocative composition. So it is music, of some sort or other.

2. It is a vocal sound, possessing a degree of rhythm, if not melody or harmony.

6. I'd rather listen to a wind in the pines than some idiot talking to a beat and passing it off as music. I don't think rap fits into this category, as it is not designed to be aesthetically pleasing or harmonious, except perhaps in a few cases. Mostly it is designed to evoke rather more negative feelings than a wind in the pines might. It may indeed be evocative, and very expressive, definitely, but I prefer to avoid the things it evokes and expresses.

Thus, while I'll grant it is music, my question is this: Is it GOOD music?

*claps*

Nice explanation. But no, it isn't good music.

Now, I'm no elitist snob, but you call that trash MUSIC? Do I want to hear someone go on and on about their life, drugs, and illegal acts over bad music?

Ummm ... even the songs written during the Gregorian Monk days were filthy tavern songs about getting drunk and bangin' whores.

Music has always been about one thing and one thing only: Sex.

Deal with it.

At Vittos Ordination2:

What ind of defense was that?

It wasn't a defense, it was an insult. I can't defend against pure bias.

Ummm ... even the songs written during the Gregorian Monk days were filthy tavern songs about getting drunk and bangin' whores.

Music has always been about one thing and one thing only: Sex.

Deal with it.

I hope you're joking. You can't honestly believe that.

Um... Huh? Not all music is about that. At least not what I listen to.

Vitto-go record yourself in the whacha sound like thread.

/hijack


I like country, I like classical, I like rap. About the only kind of music I dont like is Gospel. If we are making a distinction between hip hop and rap then I'm adding hip hop to the "I like" list.

Music has always been about one thing and one thing only: Sex.

The grand old Duke of York/He had ten thousand men?

It's music, but I wouldn't consider it to be particularly good music. As a singer myself, I suppose I don't quite understand the point of using an instrument as versatile as the human voice in such a limited fashion.

There were a lot of awesome old school rap videos on last night on "rage". I never watch music videos, but yesterday, I couldn't get away from it until way past midnight.

I hope you're joking. You can't honestly believe that.

Believe it? Shit man ... I can prove it.

There were a lot of awesome old school rap videos on last night on "rage". I never watch music videos, but yesterday, I couldn't get away from it until way past midnight.


Did they have NWA on there?

The grand old Duke of York/He had ten thousand men?


Sexy!

It is music of a sort, but definitely not the type I like. I can stomach Missy Elliot though, mainly because she is original.

I hope you're joking. You can't honestly believe that.

Heh. Speaking as a student of medieval and Renaissance music, I can testify that a very large proportion of vocal music has indeed always been about sex.

I can also say, though, that your typical madrigal is significantly more interesting to listen to than your typical rap song, even if they do both boil down plot-wise to "Woo-hoo, sex!"

Rap is syncopated poetry. If you consider poetry music, then rap is music.

Sorry Peeches, no microphone.

Whenever the question of rap music is introduced on a forum like this someone always has to point out how it's not music. Or it's not "real" music.

Well, let's decide it once and for all!
No. It's bad poetry with a beat to it. That's all there is. There's more music in a three-year old's finger painting than in rap.

Now, I'm no elitist snob, but you call that trash MUSIC? Do I want to hear someone go on and on about their life, drugs, and illegal acts over bad music?
Rock seems pretty popular.

Sorry Peeches, no microphone.

darn it. you can use headphones as a mic. *tries to convince*

ok, I'll figure out another way to hear you. Maybe you could even rap for me....:eek:

Rock seems pretty popular.
...

Rock, at least, has actual instrumental behind it. Quite solid, in fact. Have you ever heard a rock remix of Beethoven's Fifth Symphony? Quite awesome, if I do say so myself.

Ummm ... even the songs written during the Gregorian Monk days were filthy tavern songs about getting drunk and bangin' whores.

Music has always been about one thing and one thing only: Sex.

Deal with it.

Not all music is about sex... there are a few other topics it covers as well. But I'd say that all genres of music included large sections of them about sex, if indirectly at times.

I was on a road trip today, and we were in the area of a really great classical station which had on Saturday Afternoon at the Opera, live from the Met. I was a little sleepy, and definitely bored, so and they were giving the plot line, so I left it on. The opera today was some lunatic plot about this really old guy who wants to marry his god-daughter, who is way way "too young" for him. He asks her dad, who says no way, and after a bit of violence, she runs off with him. Yep, sex.

But there is also music about violence, and about any number of other huge themes which are fairly unrelated to sex. You may be sufficiently freudian to read sex into absolutely everything, but in my opinion that speaks more to the state of your mind than the state of the world, and the music therein.

...

Rock, at least, has actual instrumental behind it. Quite solid, in fact. Have you ever heard a rock remix of Beethoven's Fifth Symphony? Quite awesome, if I do say so myself.
Add to that the fact that Rock encompasses a huge collection of sub-genres, and can be about anything from medieval castles to voyages in space. It is one of the least restricted -at least thematically- genres out there.

...

Rock, at least, has actual instrumental behind it. Quite solid, in fact. Have you ever heard a rock remix of Beethoven's Fifth Symphony? Quite awesome, if I do say so myself.
Nice set of excuses and singlular exceptions to the rule. Want to try for something solid?

It's music, although I don't enjoy it much...

I can also say, though, that your typical madrigal is significantly more interesting to listen to than your typical rap song, even if they do both boil down plot-wise to "Woo-hoo, sex!"

Wow, now that is just so very quotable, I HAD to quote it, even if I didn't have anything else intelligent to say.

Madrigals also are much more musically complex, so they hide the "Woo-hoo, sex!" much better than rap does. They have melody, harmony AND rhythm instead of just the "music" of the rhythm of a human voice in its most bare form. I guess it just goes to show that all humans everywhere have the same essential experience, even if their means of expressing it varies drastically.

Did they have NWA on there?
That too, but mainly things like J5, De La Soul, Public Enemy and a whole heap of people I'd never even heard of, like Biz Markie and Black Sheep.

It was very old school, with awesome hair, huge gold chains and strange-looking glasses. :D

The grand old Duke of York/He had ten thousand men?

Don't look now, but sources are reporting that fass has laid siege to York.

The grand old Duke of York/He had ten thousand men?

That lucky bastard.

Of course rap is music. It's not my cup of tea. But hey, whatever gets you through the night.

Speaking of which, how can I get in touch with the the grand old Duke of York? :p

.

darn it. you can use headphones as a mic. *tries to convince*

ok, I'll figure out another way to hear you. Maybe you could even rap for me....:eek:

I gotta crazy flow

No. It's bad poetry with a beat to it. That's all there is. There's more music in a three-year old's finger painting than in rap.

Ehh wrong. Re-read the definition of what music is, posted earlier in this thread.

Just because you don't like it doesn't make it not music.

'course it is. And I happen to be listening to Public Enemy's It Takes A Nation of Millions to Hold Us Back right now. So there.

Yes. It is music. But bad music. Rap is just bad poetry with a lot of macho posturing set to a rhythm track. In most cases the "artist" cannot even play an instrument.

But pay no attention to me. I don't like techno either.

Yes. It is music. But bad music.

Wow, all of it?

You must listen to a lot of rap to make that judgement.

Rap is just bad poetry with a lot of macho posturing set to a rhythm track. In most cases the "artist" cannot even play an instrument.

Many singers can't play an instrument. Instrumental skill is apparently not required to be a musician.

As for bad poetry set to rhythm, well, that sounds to me like the majority of songs in any genre.

Many singers can't play an instrument. Instrumental skill is apparently not required to be a musician.


"Voice" is generally considered to be an instrument, you know, and using it well takes as much skill, training, and practice as it does to use any other instrument well.

I like some rap, just not most new rap.

I like Run DMC, Ton Loc, Newcleus, Antipop Consortium, Eminem, old school Snoop, Sugar Hill Gang. Things like that.

I like the old ones Grandmaster Flash and the Sugar Hill Gang

Rap and music are opposites so how can rap be music???

(grins)

Someone doesnt know fuckall about "Elitists."


Rap isnt Music.
Neither is R'n'B
and the people who listen to such music ARE NOT PEOPLE.

(hides behind sofa.)

Nice set of excuses and singlular exceptions to the rule. Want to try for something solid?

Seriously, listen to some Yngwie Malmsteen.

I Hate Rap! Its Crap!!

Rap is like beer. People who don't like it generally just haven't had any worth having.

Rap is like beer. People who don't like it generally just haven't had any worth having.
I dont like beer.

IM A VODKA FIEND!!!

(Cossack dances )

psh, its just the arrangement of samples and clips you can concoct with protools within 3 seconds. The beats are especially lame. I find it laughable that these supposedly "hardcore" rappers rap over prissy little drum machines and harpsicord motifs. Its not real music, rock/jazz/classical etc music is real music.

Rap is technically music since it involves organizing sound in time in a somewhat musical fashion, but it isn't really music in an artistic sense as rap is created for profit rather than artistic expression. It's all about money rather than art, it seems, and rap just doesn't demand the kind of artistic talent and skill that other genres (particularly classical) require.

No it is not and neither is heavy metal. They are noise and should be made illegal.

The pompous, elitist attitude here is sickening. People sitting there spouting bullshit cliches and insulting an entire genre when they couldn't probably name more than 2, if 2, groups or artists. They cite reasons like "all they talk about are drugs, sex, and their lives." What the fuck kind of reason is that? Do you just listen to classical? Every damn genre with worded music is about sex, drugs, or the artists' lives, even some that don't have words. "Lol, I don't like rap after hearing that one song by that one guy, rap is crap, lol."


Point in question
and rap just doesn't demand the kind of artistic talent and skill that other genres (particularly classical) require.

No shit, no genre has the artistic talent and skill required that is required for classical. That is the perfect example of people insulting rap by using comparisons that are extraordinary when they would never say the same thing about any other genre.

Rap, hip-hop and related genres, while are all music have (in their mainstream senses) become far to defined in relation to their content than in terms of the actual style of music they play. It doesnt help that in many cases this content is represented by extreme decadence. Its also the musical genre which in my opinion has been most dominated by the industrialisation of music, making it more about profit than art (hence the decadence).

rap just doesn't demand the kind of artistic talent and skill that other genres (particularly classical) require.

Here here

Point in question

and rap just doesn't demand the kind of artistic talent and skill that other genres (particularly classical) require.

No shit, no genre has the artistic talent and skill required that is required for classical. That is the perfect example of people insulting rap by using comparisons that are extraordinary when they would never say the same thing about any other genre.

I think this comparison is valid. Many rappers do not play any musical instruments. Many cannot even read music. Most musicans in the rock profession are either classicly or self trained in their insturments. The same is true of Jazz and classical.

I think this comparison is valid. Many rappers do not play any musical instruments. Many cannot even read music. Most musicans in the rock profession are either classicly or self trained in their insturments. The same is true of Jazz and classical.
Since when did the requirement for playing a musical instrument arise? Are you saying that people who can't play intruments arn't musicians? Do you consider choir music not music? What requirement is there to read music either? You can play an instrument or sing without knowing how to read anything. You might want to go watch the movie about Ray Charles.

Again, your reasons for the insult are extraordinary and ridiculous.

I think this comparison is valid. Many rappers do not play any musical instruments. Many cannot even read music. Most musicans in the rock profession are either classicly or self trained in their insturments. The same is true of Jazz and classical.
Ever heard of an instrument called your voice?

No shit, no genre has the artistic talent and skill required that is required for classical. That is the perfect example of people insulting rap by using comparisons that are extraordinary when they would never say the same thing about any other genre.

Well, I do criticize other genres for not being as demanding as classical, but rap is a particularly conspicuous example.

Are you aware their are different kinds of rap ? Thug Rap(Tupac), commercial(Nelly, Missy Eliot, 50 cent), and alternative(Pete Rock-My Favorite, Tragedy Khadafi, Aesop rock, some mobb deep stuff)

Well, I do criticize other genres for not being as demanding as classical, but rap is a particularly conspicuous example.
It's an incorrect comparison.

It's an incorrect comparison.

You have yet to give a reason why

Since when did the requirement for playing a musical instrument arise? Are you saying that people who can't play intruments arn't musicians? Do you consider choir music not music? What requirement is there to read music either? You can play an instrument or sing without knowing how to read anything. You might want to go watch the movie about Ray Charles.

Again, your reasons for the insult are extraordinary and ridiculous.

I didnt say that it was a requirement to play a musical insturment to be music. However what I did say was is that to play a musical insturment in a self taught or classically trained style (as is the case in rock/jazz/classical) requires more talant as I see it than does what you need to be a rapper.

As for Ray Charles he was particually talanted, he learnt to play an insturment at an extreme disadvantage to his ability to.

You have yet to give a reason why

If you can create a bass line and be able to rap and freestyle as well as the majority of signed rappers, then I'll stop classing it as music. Until then you have no evidence to say it isn't.

If you can create a bass line and be able to rap and freestyle as well as the majority of signed rappers, then I'll stop classing it as music. Until then you have no evidence to say it isn't.

I havent said it wasnt music. I have however made other criticisms of it

- Rap and other genres in the similar vain have become more defined by content than musical style in recent times
- Rap is possibly the genre which has industrialised its musical output the most, thus becoming more about the profit than the artistic nature of it
- Due to this industrialised nature of this output, much of the content has become related with many kinds of decadance

I havent said it wasnt music. I have however made other criticisms of it

Sorry. Should have paid more attention.


- Rap and other genres in the similar vain have become more defined by content than musical style in recent times
That depends on what type of rap you're listening to.


- Rap is possibly the genre which has industrialised its musical output the most, thus becoming more about the profit than the artistic nature of it
- Due to this industrialised nature of this output, much of the content has become related with many kinds of decadance

I agree on both but don't feel that they're valid reasons for throwing out an entire genre.

Sorry. Should have paid more attention.

Apology accepted.


That depends on what type of rap you're listening to.

True I suppose


I agree on both but don't feel that they're valid reasons for throwing out an entire genre.

Well I feel that you cant claim that rap is on the same level as rock as rock (at least in Britain) still has what I'd like to call the 'culture of the musicans' rather than the 'culture of record producers' which is what rap is moving towards. And I feel that the glamourisiation of decadance isnt exactly helping the social situation that many western countries are in. Espically the many cases of the glamourisation of viloence.

Sure, most of commerical rap is about violence and sex. But the rap hidden in the backround is the most appealing, while some mainstream stuff is amazing, such as Tupac's Dear Mama and Keep ya head up, to name a few.

Well I feel that you cant claim that rap is on the same level as rock as rock (at least in Britain) still has what I'd like to call the 'culture of the musicans' rather than the 'culture of record producers' which is what rap is moving towards. And I feel that the glamourisiation of decadance isnt exactly helping the social situation that many western countries are in. Espically the many cases of the glamourisation of viloence.

To be quite frank I think the whole "rap music causes violence" thing is as bogus as the "violent video games cause violence" argument. Fact is rap music is produced mainly for black people in very poor situations (maybe not from a sales point, but from an artist's POV). These people are already living a life of violence, and the music reflects this.

You don't think rock is ridiculously overproduced today? Try getting a rock band to defy their record label and see what happens. Fact is all forms of music are increasingly being produced by major corporate record labels who water down the music and cloud pretty much any socio-politcal message. Look at what's happened to punk. I think you are right that it is most advanced in rap music, but it has not destroyed the entire genre as there are still plenty of alternative and underground groups/artists staying loyal to themselves.

- Rap and other genres in the similar vain have become more defined by content than musical style in recent times

So you think style should be more important than content?


- Rap is possibly the genre which has industrialised its musical output the most, thus becoming more about the profit than the artistic nature of it

I think it's "possibly" just perceived that its "industrialised" its musical output the most. While you sit there thinking your british rock is still original and musically relevant. In other words a classic case of someone who thinks their music is good while other peoples is shitty, for no real reason other than musical preference.


- Due to this industrialised nature of this output, much of the content has become related with many kinds of decadance

Decadence, oh no!

They said the same thing of Stravinsky.

I take it you only listen to chamber classical music?

meh... somes ok I guess

Rap is technically music since it involves organizing sound in time in a somewhat musical fashion, but it isn't really music in an artistic sense as rap is created for profit rather than artistic expression. It's all about money rather than art, it seems, and rap just doesn't demand the kind of artistic talent and skill that other genres (particularly classical) require.

How very, very wrong. It takes a lot of talent and artistry. I can't do it and I'm an amazing musician.

It also isn't made for profit. Rap comes from the street, much like blues and jazz. Some people made it a little bigger and it has started to get into the main stream. So what?

I like it. Especially some of the old stuff like Too Short and Dr. Dre.

I also like Eminem

Old stuff . . . Run DMC, Public Enemy. Socially conscious too. If country and western are music, rap sho' nuff is.

To be quite frank I think the whole "rap music causes violence" thing is as bogus as the "violent video games cause violence" argument. Fact is rap music is produced mainly for black people in very poor situations (maybe not from a sales point, but from an artist's POV). These people are already living a life of violence, and the music reflects this.

Firstly, I did not say that rap causes violence. I have studied sociolgy and I am aware that there are a vast arrary of causes to these kinds of situations. However, what I did say was that I dont think that glamourising any kind of criminal behavior (as many rap songs do) is going to help the social situation. Secondly, it may be produced for black people in poor circumstances but that isnt an excuse for glamourisng vilonence.


You don't think rock is ridiculously overproduced today? Try getting a rock band to defy their record label and see what happens. Fact is all forms of music are increasingly being produced by major corporate record labels who water down the music and cloud pretty much any socio-politcal message.

Lets take a case study shall we. Coldplay. Coldplay were very very diffrent to many of the bands around the place at the time. There musical style from their first album was very quiet and introspecitve at a time when rock music was not so inclined. Yet Parliphone gave them a fair chance not of their own mind, but on recomendations from a few Radio 1 DJ's and other musical journelists. I think that the rock world still can see and take a chance on originality.


Look at what's happened to punk. I think you are right that it is most advanced in rap music, but it has not destroyed the entire genre as there are still plenty of alternative and underground groups/artists staying loyal to themselves.

I agree with you. My point however in comparing rap to rock is I believe that even in modern times there is still far more diversity within rock bands and not as much interinfluence. For example if you were to compare Athlete to the Editors or Subways to Phantom Planet etc.

Lets take a case study shall we. Coldplay.

Yes, if Coldplay is music, then so definitely is rap.

However, what I did say was that I dont think that glamourising any kind of criminal behavior (as many rap songs do) is going to help the social situation.

Rock does the same thing. Judas Priest is a prime example. Hell, even Johnny Cash did it. Sex, Drugs, and Violence are common themes in all music. From J.S. Bach's "Coffee Cantata" (written at a time when caffeine was as illegal as crack is today) to more modern takes on things, those themes have always been prevalent in music.

I agree with you. My point however in comparing rap to rock is I believe that even in modern times there is still far more diversity within rock bands and not as much interinfluence.

Also not true. You just have to get used to the styling. To anyone who doesn't like, or doesn't listen to, rock music, Led Zeppelin and Oasis would sound the same. Within rap, though, there is as big a variance in styles as there is in rock or jazz or classical.

Rock does the same thing. Judas Priest is a prime example. Hell, even Johnny Cash did it. Sex, Drugs, and Violence are common themes in all music. From J.S. Bach's "Coffee Cantata" (written at a time when caffeine was as illegal as crack is today) to more modern takes on things, those themes have always been prevalent in music.

Sweet! There's a coffee cantata? Where can I get a copy? I love coffee and Bach.

Sweet! There's a coffee cantata? Where can I get a copy? I love coffee and Bach.

Ask for it at your local music shop. Or you could download it ... I'm pretty sure it's in the public domain now. It's catalogued as BWV 211.

I like a lot of Rap and Hip-hop actually. One of my favorites is a group out of Philadelphia called The Goats (http://jimmyluxury.com/thegoats.htm). On the other hand, most of the stuff you see in the mag ads, and on tv isn't all that great, kind of like a different musical genre's version of all those stoopid pop "artists". Frankly I hate the music of Britany Spears (I call her "BS") more than any rap I could ever hear.

If poetry read aloud is music then rap is. (So I hardly consider it to be music at all)

That being said, I like some of it.

I suppose I would call it music, but it's not usually as musical as other genres. It stands closer to the line between music and non-music than nearly all other music genres, IMO. I have a (limited) amount of respect for it, but I don't identify with the hip-hop culture very much, and the music itself (at least the mainstream stuff) is quite boring and shallow.

I'd say rap is more entertainment than music.

No it is not and neither is heavy metal. They are noise and should be made illegal.

:eek: Heavy metal is not music? Blasphemy!!

May the God's who made heavy metal turn you into a newt!

Yes, if Coldplay is music, then so definitely is rap.
Coldplay play instruments and have melodies. They aren't reciting poetry to a beat. There's a huge difference there.

I agree with you, Celtlund.

Coldplay play instruments and have melodies. They aren't reciting poetry to a beat. There's a huge difference there.

Ok, rap sucks (just my subjective viewpoint, deep breaths) but Coldplay...
Couldn't you just have picked a little more BORING band?

Pythogria: Im... coming... for... you!

Coldplay play instruments and have melodies. They aren't reciting poetry to a beat. There's a huge difference there.

Indeed, here here

Coldplay in my view, are the vanguard of another wave of great British rock music. The Editors and Athlete are also big ones to watch

Indeed, here here

Coldplay in my view, are the vanguard of another wave of great British rock music. The Editors and Athlete are also big ones to watch

Coldplay vanguard of British rock?
[has heart attack] This place is crawling with heathen!

Melody is very simple.

1. A pleasing succession or arrangement of sounds.
2. Musical quality: the melody of verse.
3. Music.
1. A rhythmically organized sequence of single tones so related to one another as to make up a particular phrase or idea.
2. Structure with respect to the arrangement of single notes in succession.
3. The leading part or the air in a composition with accompaniment.
4. A poem suitable for setting to music or singing.


Rap is rhythmically organized sequence of tones arranged in phrases.

Rap includes structures with respect to the above.

Rap vocals are obviously the leading part in a composition with accompaniment.

Rap can also be said to be poetry set in music.

Rap has melody and rhythm and harmony. It's music. End of story folks.

Coldplay play instruments and have melodies. They aren't reciting poetry to a beat. There's a huge difference there.

Most rappers have a back-up band. A rapper is the frontman for the band.

All those drums and guitars and basses and flutes and whatnot you hear when you listen to rap are actual instruments being played by actual people.

Unless, of course, you don't consider Roger Daltry (who doesn't play instruments) not an important part of The Who.

Also, you can't pass it off to just "reciting poetry to a beat" because it's more than that. It takes a strong sense of rythm and rhyme, timing, cadence, and message. It also takes a sense of key, register, and tonality. You're not just talking, it is a form of singing. If you don't believe me, learn the lyrics to something and don't sing it, just talk it. You'll be out of tune with the instrumentation.

There is way more to rap than people realise and it's a lot tougher to do than people realise.

Most rappers have a back-up band. A rapper is the frontman for the band.

All those drums and guitars and basses and flutes and whatnot you hear when you listen to rap are actual instruments being played by actual people.

Unless, of course, you don't consider Roger Daltry (who doesn't play instruments) not an important part of The Who.

Also, you can't pass it off to just "reciting poetry to a beat" because it's more than that. It takes a strong sense of rythm and rhyme, timing, cadence, and message. It also takes a sense of key, register, and tonality. You're not just talking, it is a form of singing. If you don't believe me, learn the lyrics to something and don't sing it, just talk it. You'll be out of tune with the instrumentation.

There is way more to rap than people realise and it's a lot tougher to do than people realise.

The way most anti-rap crappers paint it, anyone and his kid sister could rap.

Which makes me wonder why everyones working at Wal Mart instead of churning out albums....

Which makes me wonder why everyones working at Wal Mart instead of churning out albums....

Hahaha ... I had that talk with a friend of mine. I was listening to Mos Def (I like him .... he's jazzy) and my friend was like, "What is that crap?" I said, "It's music, got a problem with it?"

He went on to say that it required no talent and anyone could do it, so I said, "Ok show me. You do it. Right now."

He couldn't and I said, "That's why you work as a grocery sacker and Mos Def drives an escalade."

Fool.

The way most anti-rap crappers paint it, anyone and his kid sister could rap.

Which makes me wonder why everyones working at Wal Mart instead of churning out albums....

Because you have to look gangsta to be able to sell your rap. :p

Because you have to look gangsta to be able to sell your rap. :p

Nah .... check out Ludacris.

http://www.celebopedia.com/ludacris/images/ludacris.jpg

:D

ROFL :D Them rappers...

I object to this poll. It's biased by not having a simple "No" answer. Even the one no answer still implies that rap is music. Having said that I do think rap is music, but it's just not my style.

I think this comparison is valid. Many rappers do not play any musical instruments. Many cannot even read music. Most musicans in the rock profession are either classicly or self trained in their insturments. The same is true of Jazz and classical.

I'd like to point out that Jimi Hendrix could not read music, and I think that most people would consider Purple Haze music. As for not playing any instruments, I could name a thousand singers that don't play instruments, but noone is posting threads asking if they are music or not. While I would rather gouge my eardrums out with a rusty spoon than listen to rap, I also recognize that it is by definition music.

I'd like to point out that Jimi Hendrix could not read music, and I think that most people would consider Purple Haze music. As for not playing any instruments, I could name a thousand singers that don't play instruments, but noone is posting threads asking if they are music or not. While I would rather gouge my eardrums out with a rusty spoon than listen to rap, I also recognize that it is by definition music.

Had you actually read my post in full or my previous posts you would understand my point here. I am not claiming that rap is not music. I am however claiming that while music, it does not require as much talant as other genres. Also I said "classicly taught or self trained" Jimi Hendrix would be a self trained musician, as are the members of Coldplay. Which in my mind makes them even more talanted, as not only can they play an insturment, but they taught themselves to do it. As for singers who dont play their instruments, often you'll find they dont write their own songs either. So I dont really think its fair to call them artists.

As for singers who dont play their instruments, often you'll find they dont write their own songs either. So I dont really think its fair to call them artists.

But many (most?) singers write their own lyrics. By writing them they are most certainly artists, and by singing them they create music. Have at thee!

As for singers who dont play their instruments, often you'll find they dont write their own songs either. So I dont really think its fair to call them artists.

Okie ...

Eminem. Writes his own lyrics, his own music, and is a performer. Very few bands can claim that. Would you concede that he's an artist?

Just check the writing credits on any song out there, though. Very few musical groups write their own music anymore.

But many (most?) singers write their own lyrics. By writing them they are most certainly artists, and by singing them they create music. Have at thee!

Since when did reciting become singing? If so, all politicians are rappers too :eek: