NationStates Jolt Archive


SAS man quits over Iraq after serving. Claims to have seen 'Dozens of illigal acts'

Aust
13-03-2006, 16:49
An SAS soldier has resigned from the army, describing the military intervention in Iraq as a "war of aggression" and "morally wrong". The soldier said he witnessed "dozens of illegal acts" by US forces there.
Ben Griffin, 28, who left after three months in Baghdad, is believed to be the first SAS soldier to refuse to go into combat and to leave the army on moral grounds. His decision comes at a time of growing disenchantment among British soldiers about their presence in Iraq.


This week, pre-trial hearings are due to start into the court martial of Flight Lieutenant Malcolm Kendall-Smith, an RAF doctor who is refusing to return to Iraq on the grounds that the war is illegal. Mr Kendall-Smith's lawyer, Justin Hugheston-Roberts, said yesterday: "We will be arguing that he has no case to answer because, without a UN mandate, the invasion of Iraq was manifestly unlawful and any subsequent order was therefore unlawful."
Mr Griffin told the Sunday Telegraph yesterday that he had expected to face a court martial for leaving the SAS. Instead, he was discharged with a glowing testimonial.

When he was on leave in March last year he told his commanding officer he had no intention of returning to Iraq. He said he was very angry "at the way the politicians have lied to the British public about the war. But most importantly, I didn't join the British army to conduct American foreign policy."

He said he had witnessed dozens of illegal acts by US fighters who viewed Iraqis as "sub-human". Mr Griffin said: "I saw a lot of things in Baghdad that were illegal or just wrong. The Americans were doing things like chucking farmers into Abu Ghraib, or handing them over to the Iraqi authorities, knowing full well they were going to be tortured."

The Ministry of Defence does not comment officially on any activities involving Britain's special forces. However, defence officials did not deny that Mr Griffin left the SAS in protest against the war in Iraq.

The SAS has been operating under cover in Iraq since the invasion, working with US special forces seeking out insurgents and foreign Arab fighters linked to or proclaiming sympathy with al-Qaida.

British officers have told the Guardian that they have been dismayed by US military tactics in Iraq. They also say that attempts to train the Iraqi army and police are fraught with problems.

Sound like theres mroe to come out about the absue of iraqis from this...
Franberry
13-03-2006, 16:51
dude, go to Iraq with your eyes closed, open them for a second, and then you can say u "witnessed dozens of illigal acts"
Lunatic Goofballs
13-03-2006, 16:54
I've seen dozens of illegal acts at decent parties. :)
Kievan-Prussia
13-03-2006, 16:56
People complain too much about Iraq war "crimes." Go look at WWII, Cold War, Korea and Vietnam and look at the crimes of those.
Zero Six Three
13-03-2006, 17:01
People complain too much about Iraq war "crimes." Go look at WWII, Cold War, Korea and Vietnam and look at the crimes of those.
We should complain about what happened in the past rather than what's happening now, in the present? Because these sort of things happens in wars so that makes it alright.. right?
Kievan-Prussia
13-03-2006, 17:04
We should complain about what happened in the past rather than what's happening now, in the present? Because these sort of things happens in wars so that makes it alright.. right?

Well, I just don't think it's a very big deal when some guys have to stand in a line naked.

And yes, we should complain about the past. If we don't, we'll forget it, and then repeat it.
Nadkor
13-03-2006, 17:05
People complain too much about Iraq war "crimes." Go look at WWII, Cold War, Korea and Vietnam and look at the crimes of those.
"The Iraq War: Not quite as bad as WW2!"
Myrmidonisia
13-03-2006, 17:28
If I was a SAS officer that didn't want to be sent to jail for disobedience, I'd come up with some darned good stories about unlawful activity, too. I guess that's what the court-martial is going to decide, whether or not unlawful activity took place and he was within his rights to refuse orders to abet it.
Skinny87
13-03-2006, 17:41
Well, I just don't think it's a very big deal when some guys have to stand in a line naked.

And yes, we should complain about the past. If we don't, we'll forget it, and then repeat it.

Yeah, the abuses of prisoners, torturing of prisoners, the illegal beatings, the random searches at night of people's houses without any reason...

No big deal, right?
Anglo-Utopia
13-03-2006, 17:46
It's war people. Shit happens. Of course there are gonna be illegal acts. The problem is all the media coverage hindering all the progress.

It's not a walk in the park.
Lunatic Goofballs
13-03-2006, 17:48
Yeah, the abuses of prisoners, torturing of prisoners, the illegal beatings, the random searches at night of people's houses without any reason...

No big deal, right?

SOunds a bit like New Jersey. :p
Skinny87
13-03-2006, 17:48
It's war people. Shit happens. Of course there are gonna be illegal acts. The problem is all the media coverage hindering all the progress.

It's not a walk in the park.

Just because there will be illegal acts doesn't mean they should be covered up or not commented on. The media coverage is neccessary so we know exactly what's going on over there by the soldiers supposedly fighting to free the Iraqi people and save us from WMDs and such.
Kinda Sensible people
13-03-2006, 18:00
If I was a SAS officer that didn't want to be sent to jail for disobedience, I'd come up with some darned good stories about unlawful activity, too. I guess that's what the court-martial is going to decide, whether or not unlawful activity took place and he was within his rights to refuse orders to abet it.

The article says he isn't being court-martialed and was, in fact, let off with a glowing testimonial. I'm not sure how that happens, but it appears to have happened.
Myrmidonisia
13-03-2006, 19:15
The article says he isn't being court-martialed and was, in fact, let off with a glowing testimonial. I'm not sure how that happens, but it appears to have happened.
Which article was that? In the OP, there was a sentence that went, "This week, pre-trial hearings are due to start into the court martial of Flight Lieutenant Malcolm Kendall-Smith, an RAF doctor who is refusing to return to Iraq on the grounds that the war is illegal." made it seem that he was being court-martialed.

My bet is that he used the Army to fund his medical education and now wants to weasel out of the deal.

Never mind, I see there two different stories in close proximity.
Skinny87
13-03-2006, 19:18
Which article was that? In the OP, there was a sentence that went, "This week, pre-trial hearings are due to start into the court martial of Flight Lieutenant Malcolm Kendall-Smith, an RAF doctor who is refusing to return to Iraq on the grounds that the war is illegal." made it seem that he was being court-martialed.

My bet is that he used the Army to fund his medical education and now wants to weasel out of the deal.

Never mind, I see there two different stories in close proximity.

Or maybe he was just disgusted by what he saw US and Coalition forces do in Iraq, so much so that he would rather risk jail than go back and even indirectly be a part of that situation.

I salute that man for his courage.
Anarchic Christians
13-03-2006, 19:28
Bastard! I posted this yesterday! and nobody replied

Well, you added in the doctor which I haven't seen.
Tactical Grace
13-03-2006, 19:35
Good to know there are some men of conscience even in units where soldiers are asked to have none.
Aust
13-03-2006, 20:44
Or maybe he was just disgusted by what he saw US and Coalition forces do in Iraq, so much so that he would rather risk jail than go back and even indirectly be a part of that situation.

I salute that man for his courage.
Amen to that.