NationStates Jolt Archive

Milosevic 'found dead in prison'

Former Yugoslav President Slobodan Milosevic has died in The Hague, radio reports and his lawyer says.

Steven Kay, Mr Milosevic's lawyer, told BBC News 24 that he had been found dead in his cell on Saturday morning.

Mr Milosevic, 64, has been on trial at the UN war crimes tribunal for genocide and other war crimes.

The tribunal last month rejected a request by Mr Milosevic to go to Russia for medical treatment. He had high blood pressure and a heart condition.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4796470.stm

:( Oh well. A textbook case of a man's fall from grace, closes.

Wonder condition Saddam has (apart from delusional insanity)?

Good riddance. Burn in hell, Milosevic :upyours:

Well, war criminal or not, him giving the finger to NATO was kinda cool. I have to say it was Serbia I was rooting for in 1999. That took balls, you don't see much of that these days.

I'm not sorry. It's not a real loss.

Well, war criminal or not, him giving the finger to NATO was kinda cool. I have to say it was Serbia I was rooting for in 1999. That took balls, you don't see much of that these days.
Well let's see what's higher on my hate list...
Yep, just as I thought - genocide outranks NATO in terms of things I hate

Well let's see what's higher on my hate list...
Yep, just as I thought - genocide outranks NATO in terms of things I hate
*Shrugs*

It's not one or the other. You can condemn him for his crimes during the civil war, but you can also say holding out against a NATO air offensive for 72 days was a real feat. I don't dismiss one achievement because of another.

The tribunal last month rejected a request by Mr Milosevic to go to Russia for medical treatment. He had high blood pressure and a heart condition.

That's disturbing, if the treatments could have kept him alive and the court denied them. I foresee investigations.

Too bad the trial could not be concluded.

Well, war criminal or not, him giving the finger to NATO was kinda cool. I have to say it was Serbia I was rooting for in 1999. That took balls, you don't see much of that these days.

In 1988, he was told by a senior communist party member and friend
"If you use serbian nationalism to seize power, you will ignite a fire that will destroy Yugoslavia and kill 1000's of people"

"F. you I'm gonna do whatever it takes to seize power"

Good riddance I say :D

The tribunal last month rejected a request by Mr Milosevic to go to Russia for medical treatment. He had high blood pressure and a heart condition.

That's disturbing, if the treatments could have kept him alive and the court denied them. I foresee investigations.

Too bad the trial could not be concluded.

Yes but did they deny him treatment or did they just deny him the request to go abroad and get the treatment? There should have been no reason they couldn't have found him just as capable doctor's and specialists in the Netherlands or Western Europe as they could in Russia.

It seemed like he wanted to pull something along the lines of a Pinochet- Russia being fellow Slavs and all and were traditional friends to the Yugoslavs.

Good riddance.

The tribunal last month rejected a request by Mr Milosevic to go to Russia for medical treatment. He had high blood pressure and a heart condition.

That's disturbing, if the treatments could have kept him alive and the court denied them. I foresee investigations.

Too bad the trial could not be concluded.
only if they werent treating him for those conditions in whereever he was being held. its not like russia is the only place one can be treated for high blood pressure and heart problems.

not that him dying in his cell is an indication of great medical care.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/europe/4796470.stm

:( Oh well. A textbook case of a man's fall from grace, closes.
Sure saved the Hague and the EU a lot of money, his dying like that. Pretty thoughtful guy after all! :D

It is just not fair.:(

They've had him on trial for FOUR YEARS now. It's been a drag-out stall for time for most of it.

The bastard should have been hung at least two years ago.

They've had him on trial for FOUR YEARS now. It's been a drag-out stall for time for most of it.

The bastard should have been hung at least two years ago.

Europe does not have the death penalty. So he would never have been hanged. The trial was stalled due to his health issues, which seem to have been real.

Europe does not have the death penalty. So he would never have been hanged. The trial was stalled due to his health issues, which seem to have been real.
lol, well he certainly seems to have had the last word with regard to how real his health problems were.

The bastard should have been hung at least two years ago.
I'd rather he be on trial for a decade and get the right verdict than execute someone prematurely and discover it was a mistake. Innocent until proven guilty is a universal concept, and applies to even those who appear obviously guilty.

Good riddance! :mad:
At least the bastard doesn't waste any more money now.

Former Yugoslav Leader, Slobodan Milosevic is dead.

(AP)*Slobodan Milosevic, the former Yugoslav leader branded "the butcher of the Balkans" for orchestrating a decade of wars that eventually broke up his country and led to his war crimes trial, was found dead in his prison cell Saturday.

Whole thing here: http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/03/11/ap/world/mainD8G9DFNO8.shtml

http://forums.jolt.co.uk/showthread.php?t=472602

Other thread already up and running.

Can anyone hear the world's smallest violin playing in sympathy? I thought not.

I'd rather he be on trial for a decade and get the right verdict than execute someone prematurely and discover it was a mistake. Innocent until proven guilty is a universal concept, and applies to even those who appear obviously guilty.

Right. And I'm all for a fair AND SPEEDY trial. There is simply no way that something so obvious should have been allowed to be stretched out so long WITH NO END in sight! :(

Europe does not have the death penalty. So he would never have been hanged. The trial was stalled due to his health issues, which seem to have been real.

And it is a pity, in my mind, that Europe sees no contradiction in allowing abortion but allowing mass murderers to live.

Yes, he had health issues. But a 4 year trial that wasn't even wrapping up? Absurd. I could see a year. Maybe two.

And it is a pity, in my mind, that Europe sees no contradiction in allowing abortion but allowing mass murderers to live.

There is no contradiction. Abortion has nothing to do with the issue of the death penalty - it is, and has always been, about a woman's right to choose, and the death penalty is always wrong. Took us a few millennia, and millions of Jews and dissidents and heretics and gypsies and homosexuals, to come to the conclusion that, hey, governments killing people might not have been such a bright idea after all, and, no, one does become better than mass killers by bringing back governmental killing.

I for one am glad we have taken such a strong position against such immoral actions, whose nature is not changed whether done by a dictatorship or a democracy, a "free" or "unfree" society.

One can percieve several implications of his death: -the trial will now be post-humous, if it is prosecuted at all, and accordingly, Milosevic has no possibility to raise himself as a Yugoslavian martyr.
- Pro-Milosevic elements in Yugoslavia will claim murder and commence a revolt.
- It alleviates the repsonsibility upon the Hague to try him, and, in all likelihood, incarcerate or execute him.

Absurd. I could see a year. Maybe two.
It takes the time it takes. You don't fuck around and rush things when you're dealing with crimes as serious as what he'd been accused of.

His trial will be abandoned, probably very soon. There is however an ever-growing list of other Bosnian war criminals to put on trial. The rest of the process is unlikely to be interrupted.

- It alleviates the repsonsibility upon the Hague to try him, and, in all likelihood, incarcerate or execute him.

Again, the Tribuneral in The Hague cannot sentence anyone to death - the European Convention for the Protection of Human Rights and Fundamental Freedoms (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Convention_on_Human_Rights) bans the death penalty. (http://conventions.coe.int/treaty/en/Treaties/Html/187.htm)

Also, the trial is forfeit, as there is no defendant. There is no such thing as posthumous prosecution - how does a dead man defend himself?

Despite the man's past, all I can say is that a man died today. As with anyone who dies, he deserves respect.

So I'll wait til tomorrow to talk about what a ghastly bastard he really was.

:eek: Oops! :p

So I've been glued to the TV for the past couple of hours, and with German news channels covering fucking winter sports I resorted to CNN, only to hear the commentary of some nut person who did indeed express his sorrow for Milosevic's death, as he considered this as "justice being prevented from being made to him", as he were "innocent of the allegations [of war crimes and crimes against humanity]", with him being "a polititian, not a soldier or anything. And, after all, he did his best to unite and strengthen Yugoslavia, act in the best interest of his country and kept it from falling apart". My ass, I was about to use violence on the TV.


I was extremely disturbed at pictures from Serbia with protestors making heated accusations at The Hague and the tribunal for "murdering" Milosevic, and at those few Russian comments available at the moment basically saying the same, albeit in a more diplomatic manner.
I am aware of the request of his to go to Russia to get treatment being denied a couple of days ago, but, as somebody already mentioned, I fail to see how there were no adequate professionals in the NL which would be a prerequisite for this statement to have any truth at all, and also seeing how his family (some of whom worked with/under him during his presidency) lives (very well) in Russia, I share the doubts the tribunal expressed in their statement when they denied that request.

I'd rather have seen the trial being brought to an end and Milosevic convicted with at least some justice being rendered to the victims, and I'll be watching carefully how the Serbian-EU talks and the "hunt" for Mladic and the other guy I can't spell will go on now.

It takes the time it takes. You don't fuck around and rush things when you're dealing with crimes as serious as what he'd been accused of.

Accused of and with piles of proof of.
Nuremberg took just about a year.
The International Military Tribunal for the Far East took 2.5 years.

Further, It's not like he's in a civil court and has to wait around for days-- this trial is expressly for him.

I'm not saying give him a 2 day kangaroo court trail. I'm saying that in this case, justice was moving waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too slowly.

Fox News Update-

"A beloved figure of Serbian children's TV has passed away. Slobodan Milosevic died yesterday, despite the prayers of millions that he would live on to host his hit show, "Bath-Time is Fun." The zany kid's show garnered huge ratings in the Balkans and featured segments where dirty foriegners were hilariously gathered up and then cleansed."

There is no contradiction. Abortion has nothing to do with the issue of the death penalty - it is, and has always been, about a woman's right to choose, and the death penalty is always wrong.

I disagree. You're saying that a murderer cannot be put to death, but that a child can be if the mother find it inconvenient.
Death is death. At least be consistent.

Took us a few millennia, and millions of Jews and dissidents and heretics and gypsies and homosexuals, to come to the conclusion that, hey, governments killing people might not have been such a bright idea after all, and, no, one does become better than mass killers by bringing back governmental killing.

And apparently Jugoslavs, which is the whole reason this bastard is on trial in the first place! :rolleyes:

I for one am glad we have taken such a strong position against such immoral actions, whose nature is not changed whether done by a dictatorship or a democracy, a "free" or "unfree" society.

Killing unborn kids is moral, and killing those that kill others is wrong?
The more I see of Western European morality, the happier I am we emigrated from Slovakia to the US.

He deserved it.

Killing unborn kids is moral, and killing those that kill others is wrong?
The more I see of Western European morality, the happier I am we emigrated from Slovakia to the US.

It is illegal in every developed country to kill children, "markreich." Abortion has been discussed ad nauseum on this forum before. Use the search feature if you're interested in why people dont agree with you.

I disagree. You're saying that a murderer cannot be put to death, but that a child can be if the mother find it inconvenient.
Death is death. At least be consistent.
..
Killing unborn kids is moral, and killing those that kill others is wrong?
The more I see of Western European morality, the happier I am we emigrated from Slovakia to the US.
I think you fail to see that many of us do not see a fetus as a "child", that is, a person, thereofre not seeing abortion as "killing" as no "children" or "people" are involved.

But, as New Granada already pointed out, this has been discussed 'till we were all blue in the face before, and let us please not turn this thread into a debate about abortion. If you must, create a new thread and link to these post if you wish.


He deserved it.
Again, I'd rather have seen him tried, convicted and spending his entire remaining lifetime in prison, and actually think that to be more 'deserved', but meh.

Despite the man's past, all I can say is that a man died today. As with anyone who dies, he deserves respect.

So I'll wait til tomorrow to talk about what a ghastly bastard he really was.

:eek: Oops! :p

"Hi there! Thanks for the kindness!" -Your Slobo

http://www.artandfantasy.com/firedemon2.jpg


PS: Yes, the potato salad has pineapple in it.

It is illegal in every developed country to kill children, "markreich." Abortion has been discussed ad nauseum on this forum before. Use the search feature if you're interested in why people dont agree with you.

You know nothing is ever decided in the forums. Use your search feature to see what I mean. ;)

PS: What's with my name in ""?

I think you fail to see that many of us do not see a fetus as a "child", that is, a person, thereofre not seeing abortion as "killing" as no "children" or "people" are involved.

But, as New Granada already pointed out, this has been discussed 'till we were all blue in the face before, and let us please not turn this thread into a debate about abortion. If you must, create a new thread and link to these post if you wish.

Not to put too fine a point on it, but I fail to see how anyone can say it's okay to put a knitting needle though something with a heatbeat, but that it's not okay to do it to a mass murderer.
My point is that NOT supporting the death penalty while allowing abortion is inconsistant. I'm not debating if one or the other is right.

Markreich, take your anti-abortion rhetoric elsewhere. You are off-topic.

Killing unborn kids is moral, and killing those that kill others is wrong?
The more I see of Western European morality, the happier I am we emigrated from Slovakia to the US.

A cluster of cells is not a person. A human being is. How you can advocate putting a human being to death but not terminate a bunch of cells is utterly twisted. Killing a human being is barbaric in any case, but what makes the death penalty even worse is that there's always the possibility of killing an innocent person. People on death row in the US have been found innocent many times. But you conveniently ignore that.

Personally, I don't like the idea of abortion, but what a woman does with her own body is none of my business.

And this is getting off-topic. ;)

Markreich, as I've said before, I will not have my share in turning this thread into yet another abortion debate- you've been on these boards long enough to exactly know which points have been made regarding your posts, so look these up or make a new thread.

Edit:// beaten to it, I guess.

Also, the trial is forfeit, as there is no defendant. There is no such thing as posthumous prosecution - how does a dead man defend himself?I take it Europe also does not try people in absentia either?

Markreich, take your anti-abortion rhetoric elsewhere. You are off-topic.

Accepted. Sorry about that.
I did mean it as a point that Europe lacking the death penalty was off, but I went off on a tangent. Mea culpa.

Breaking news people: retards at a place called godlikeproductions.com already claim Milosevic was killed!

And it is a pity, in my mind, that Europe sees no contradiction in allowing abortion but allowing mass murderers to live.
Wow. And you call yourself a centrist.

I take it Europe also does not try people in absentia either?

I've not heard of trials in absentia in my own country, actually. Still, even if such a thing were to occur, it can be argued that the defendant can still mount a defence, but has by not appearing in court decided not to - and that person can still appeal the verdict. It is quite a different thing to try someone who fails to show up in court, to trying someone who cannot show up court, ever, since they're dead.

This trial is over.

I've not heard of trials in absentia in my own country, actually. Still, even if such a thing were to occur, it can be argued that the defendant can still mount a defence, but has by not appearing in court decided not to - and that person can still appeal the verdict. It is quite a different thing to try someone who fails to show up in court, to trying someone who cannot show up court, ever, since they're dead.

This trial is over.I could see how a country could allow in absentia trials but not posthumous, but presumably it would allow either or both. Here, we have both.

Besides, what would they sentence him to? Life? :p

Besides, what would they sentence him to? Life? :pLol. I suppose in this case where there isn't a set number of people who have committed the crime, it would be silly to continue the trial. Usually the purpose of doing so would be to prove other people not guilty, but that won't happen in this case. So I agree, they should end it.

Besides, what would they sentence him to? Life? :p

They'd still be able to come with a verdict that he was guilty of the things he is accused of. Him dying should just make the process go quicker. History should show he was convicted not that he died so the charges went away.

They'd still be able to come with a verdict that he was guilty of the things he is accused of. Him dying should just make the process go quicker.

Oh, so we tried Hitler after he died, did we? No? Well, then.

Oh, so we tried Hitler after he died, did we? No? Well, then.

He was already dead. Milosevich was being tried for years and they should conclude it and condemn him. Perhaps it will finish quickly and a SPEEDY trial will actually occur. :rolleyes:

He was already dead. Milosevich was being tried for years and they should conclude it and condemn him. Perhaps it will finish quickly and a SPEEDY trial will actually occur. :rolleyes:

They cannot convict him when he cannot defend himself. It would be a sham to go on.

They cannot convict him when he cannot defend himself. It would be a sham to go on.

I suppose. It isn't as if the end result was in doubt anyway.

I suppose. It isn't as if the end result was in doubt anyway.

No, but due process and nulla poena sine lege are fundamental rights.

No, but due process and nulla poena sine lege are fundamental rights.

I just wonder if anyone 50 years from now will even know who he was or what he had done. People are simply horrid when it comes to history. :(

I just wonder if anyone 50 years from now will even know who he was or what he had done. People are simply horrid when it comes to history. :(

I think you would be surprised at the number of people who don't remember him, yet they can remember when the Blue Jays won the world series.

yet they can remember when the Blue Jays won the world series.

When exactly was that? :p

When exactly was that? :p

It was during the brief period that they were a good team and Canada was beginning to love Baseball. I even went to watch a game, but I fell asleep...

It was during the brief period that they were a good team and Canada was beginning to love Baseball. I even went to watch a game, but I fell asleep...
Your Torontocentrism is showing. Baseball has been popular in Canada for many decades. Just because that popularity was brought to your attention in the early 90s has little or no bearing on the longevity of the affections of Canadians for the sport.

Your Torontocentrism is showing. Baseball has been popular in Canada for many decades. Just because that popularity was brought to your attention in the early 90s has little or no bearing on the longevity of the affections of Canadians for the sport.

How dare you say I have anything to do with Toronto!! I find that to be the worst insult in the world! Mississauga is a far better place, for now.

Away, you bottle-ale rascal, you filthy bung, away!

20 years too late to do anyone any good though. The Kosovo war was based on fake intelligence manufactured by the Clinton regime to give NATO a crack at punishing Serbia. The War Crimes Trial was a bit shocked when a Canadian Officer took the stand and told them point blank that there were no mass graves in Kosovo. The Croatian leaders were just as bad as the Serbian ones in the war that shattered former Yugoslavia. The Serbs got ethnically cleansed in the north and everyone went to town on the Bosnians. The US just couldn’t get their head around a conflict without white hats to support so they backed the Ustashe wannabe government in Croatia. The Croatians have a lot to be held accountable in that war. There were no white hats with guns, just people being victimized by brigands.

Well, good riddance. He was a son of a bitch and deserved to die for what he did to his own people. Unfortunately, he did have one issue he was right on, and that was defending Kosovo from the immigrant drug-dealing Islamic extremists. Fat lot of good the west did on that, or trying to have something else good happen in that region of the world besides Slobo's overthrow.

The ICC now has a body count higher than Gitmo! I demand an investigation!

He probly just died of sheer boredom.

*yawn*

Who cares? He was just a petty dictator. Big deal.

*goes back to sleep*

Meh. I have some things to say about Milosevich dying of a heart attack:

1- At least HE died from natural causes! :P

2- He had a HEART??? O_O