NationStates Jolt Archive

Which south african political party do you support?

South Africa has political parties? O_O

(Joke, joke, please don't flame me. I just don't know anything about SA politics)

South Africa has political parties? O_O

(Joke, joke, please don't flame me. I just don't know anything about SA politics)
*Incinerates you in hellfire*

South African Communist Party, though its Leninism and past pro-Moscow stance bother me, as does its alliance with the ANC.

None. Not one of them appeals to me.

Which south african political party do you support?
I like that Inkatha Freedom Party because it has an awesome name. The only thing I know about South Africa's parties was from National Geographic (yes, I read it).

None. Not one of them appeals to me.

I am ignorant to South Afrikan politics....Which one of those parties is the right wing one?


P.S. replied to your message.

I voted Inthaka Freedom Party (IFP).

The Zulus need their own nation, along with the Boers having their own Nation and the Xhosans having their own Nation.

The SA Republic has too many racial and ethnic groupings to survive as a single nation.

On another note, I noticed the absence of the New National Party (formerly the SA National Party of the aparthied era).

I saw some source that said the NNP joined forces with the ANC, due to the NNP having no real support anymore.

Is this true?

Is this true?

Yes, it is (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_National_Party_%28South_Africa%29).

I am ignorant to South Afrikan politics....Which one of those parties is the right wing one?


P.S. replied to your message.
Parties like the ARM, the ACDP, and possibly the UCDP.

Is the ARM the Afrikaaner Resistance Movement (AWB)?

Are they Boer nationalists who seek to rule over the native African population, like the aparthied system, or are they sepratists, like other Boer movements and the IFP?

Is the ARM the Afrikaaner Resistance Movement (AWB)?

Are they Boer nationalists who seek to rule over the native African population, like the aparthied system, or are they sepratists, like other Boer movements and the IFP?
No, they are secessionist.

Parties like the ARM, the ACDP, and possibly the UCDP.

Ehh, ones too Nazi, the others to religious.

No wonder things are so bad down there, you guys dont have a good conservative party :p

Ehh, ones too Nazi, the others to religious.

No wonder things are so bad down there, you guys dont have a good conservative party :p
None of the parties there are worth the time that they demand.

ARM are more secessionist than Nazi.

Boers are evil. The native Africans were there first. Then again, it's not too bad to be evil.

None of the parties there are worth the time that they demand.

ARM are more secessionist than Nazi.


Still, I cant take a party seriously with a flag like that.

Yeah, I see they are secessionist....is there any talks of a civil war down there?

Still, I cant take a party seriously with a flag like that.

Yeah, I see they are secessionist....is there any talks of a civil war down there?
They aren't really numerous enough, nor taken seriously enough for that to happen. Whilst I agree to the right to secession, I don't see it happening.

They aren't really numerous enough, nor taken seriously enough for that to happen. Whilst I agree to the right to secession, I don't see it happening.

Honestly, theres some places I have given up on and that I think wont change unless something drastic happens. Those places include South Afrika, New Orleans, Iran....to start with.

Honestly, theres some places I have given up on and that I think wont change unless something drastic happens. Those places include South Afrika, New Orleans, Iran....to start with.
I have yet to give up hope on it, although I am not also foolishly optimistic. I am more than content in Europe.

I voted Inthaka Freedom Party (IFP).

The Zulus need their own nation, along with the Boers having their own Nation and the Xhosans having their own Nation.

The SA Republic has too many racial and ethnic groupings to survive as a single nation.

On another note, I noticed the absence of the New National Party (formerly the SA National Party of the aparthied era).

I saw some source that said the NNP joined forces with the ANC, due to the NNP having no real support anymore.

Is this true?
Oh, crap.

I support the AWB.

I support the AWB.
And another one pops. Where have you been, Nazis?

And another one pops. Where have you been, Nazis?
Oh. The nazi insult. How terribly original.:rolleyes:
Is this the part where I try my darndest just to convince you I'm actually a PC extremist?

Oh. The nazi insult. How terribly original.:rolleyes:
I could also call you a moron.
You support a paramilitary, violent, pro-Apartheit, Nazi-nostalgiac, red-flag-and-swastika-like-symbol-in-a-white-circle party, and you are not a Nazi.
Enlighten me then. You are a__________________________ (fill in the blank).

Oh, crap.

Why did you say that?

Didi you disagree with my view that the different races of South Africa having their own indepedent nations or did you think the NNP joining forces with the ANC was crap?

And another one pops. Where have you been, Nazis?

The ARM/AWB are NOT National Socialists.

The ARM/AWB supports a free market economy, the self determination of the Boer race, along with the self detemination of the many different native African races and nations is South Africa.

The ARM/AWB do not support mass murder or any harm against any race.

However, I would like to point out the party that has killed the MOST people in South Africa, according to their race/ethinicity, the ANC.

In the early 1990s, the ANC's paramilitary wing and ANC supporters killed many Zulus, some estimates are between 6000-10,000 people killed.

Ironic, the ANC (the 'democratic' party of 'racial tolerance') has killed more native Africans than the Aparthied system did.

But then again, look at the ANC's bedfellows, the terrorist group, the SACP. The ANC are nothing but a front for the SACP and communist inflitration.

But then again, I have seen soo many killings done by communists and their dirty propaganda tricks.

Such a shame that South Africa is now in decline, but then again, what can we expect from communist gangsters!

I could also call you a moron.
I could call you the same.

You support a paramilitary, violent, pro-Apartheit, Nazi-nostalgiac, red-flag-and-swastika-like-symbol-in-a-white-circle party, and you are not a Nazi.
Enlighten me then. You are a__________________________ (fill in the blank).
I don't owe you an apoligy an explenation or anything. Would it be OK with you if I said I supported a "peacefull" terrorist party like the ANC? Since their members mostly aren't pigmentaly challenged?

The ARM, the genocide of the boers must end!

However, I would like to point out the party that has killed the MOST people in South Africa, according to their race/ethinicity, the ANC.

In the early 1990s, the ANC's paramilitary wing and ANC supporters killed many Zulus, some estimates are between 6000-10,000 people killed.

Ironic, the ANC (the 'democratic' party of 'racial tolerance') has killed more native Africans than the Aparthied system did.

But then again, look at the ANC's bedfellows, the terrorist group, the SACP. The ANC are nothing but a front for the SACP and communist inflitration.

But then again, I have seen soo many killings done by communists and their dirty propaganda tricks.

Such a shame that South Africa is now in decline, but then again, what can we expect from communist gangsters!
Haven't you learned anything? Non-white paramilitaries are freedom fighters.

The ARM, the genocide of the boers must end!
There is no genocide per se, although I would like to see a change in SA's current political situation.

I could call you the same.

I don't owe you an apoligy an explenation or anything. Would it be OK with you if I said I supported a "peacefull" terrorist party like the ANC? Since their members mostly aren't pigmentaly challenged?
You don't owe me anything.
Technically, it is a non-sequitur to call an ANC supporter (which I am not) a Nazi.
Even in that absurd world where we could compare the sabotage advocated by the ANC with the terror tactics of AWB or Inkhata, you would still be dillusional for suggesting that they were evenly matched.
"Pigmentally challenged" (moving past your syncretic jingoism) is true from only one perspective: the decades of crypto-slavery at the hands of the Afrikaaner turdish Calvinist politicians.

The ARM/AWB are NOT National Socialists.

The ARM/AWB supports a free market economy, the self determination of the Boer race, along with the self detemination of the many different native African races and nations is South Africa.

The ARM/AWB do not support mass murder or any harm against any race.

However, I would like to point out the party that has killed the MOST people in South Africa, according to their race/ethinicity, the ANC.

In the early 1990s, the ANC's paramilitary wing and ANC supporters killed many Zulus, some estimates are between 6000-10,000 people killed.

Ironic, the ANC (the 'democratic' party of 'racial tolerance') has killed more native Africans than the Aparthied system did.

But then again, look at the ANC's bedfellows, the terrorist group, the SACP. The ANC are nothing but a front for the SACP and communist inflitration.

But then again, I have seen soo many killings done by communists and their dirty propaganda tricks.

Such a shame that South Africa is now in decline, but then again, what can we expect from communist gangsters!
Oh, crap.

You don't owe me anything.
Technically, it is a non-sequitur to call an ANC supporter (which I am not) a Nazi.
I think he accused you of being a moron, not a Nazi...

However, I would like to point out the party that has killed the MOST people in South Africa, according to their race/ethinicity, the ANC.

In the early 1990s, the ANC's paramilitary wing and ANC supporters killed many Zulus, some estimates are between 6000-10,000 people killed.

Ironic, the ANC (the 'democratic' party of 'racial tolerance') has killed more native Africans than the Aparthied system did.

But then again, look at the ANC's bedfellows, the terrorist group, the SACP. The ANC are nothing but a front for the SACP and communist inflitration.

But then again, I have seen soo many killings done by communists and their dirty propaganda tricks.

Such a shame that South Africa is now in decline, but then again, what can we expect from communist gangsters!

Your dogmatic hate of communists is fairly amusing, but I hesitate to point out to you that the fine line between the evil of national socialism and the evil of totalitarian communism tends to fall in that national socialists are murdering, violent, socialistic and racist whereas the commies tend to be a little less overtly racist.

I honestly know very little about South African politics, but I'm fully willing beleive your claims if you back them up from a reasonable, reliable source. And... I'd also bet that apartheid has killed far more people than you give it credit for killing.

I'm betting you, like most nazis, have no real facts to back up your falsified claims, but I'll give you the benefit of a doubt.

Your dogmatic hate of communists is fairly amusing, but I hesitate to point out to you that the fine line between the evil of national socialism and the evil of totalitarian communism tends to fall in that national socialists are murdering, violent, socialistic and racist whereas the commies tend to be a little less overtly racist.

I honestly know very little about South African politics, but I'm fully willing beleive your claims if you back them up from a reasonable, reliable source. And... I'd also bet that apartheid has killed far more people than you give it credit for killing.

I'm betting you, like most nazis, have no real facts to back up your falsified claims, but I'll give you the benefit of a doubt.
There is indeed tension between the african tribes themselves. They have never been on good terms with each other.

The AWB is no more a party than the KKK is. They're the same bloody people.

I don't have a favourite though. I know next to nothing about RSA's politics, and so even a look at wiki wouldn't give me enough info to make a good decision.

I think he accused you of being a moron, not a Nazi...
Oh, in that case he's right.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/25/Awb.PNG

TRhis is the flag of the AWB. Ponder.

There is indeed tension between the african tribes themselves. They have never been on good terms with each other.

I know that much. I'm more contesting his claims that the African National Congress, a political group with it's background in nonviolence is the group at fault. I also think he drastically underestimates the actual deathtoll atributable to apartheid.

I know that much. I'm more contesting his claims that the African National Congress, a political group with it's background in nonviolence is the group at fault. I also think he drastically underestimates the actual deathtoll atributable to apartheid.
To be honest, I am dismayed by all the nation's political parties. Some are too idealistic, most too corrupt. He is right in that secessionism would help cool off tensions between tribes and various ethnicities though.

To be honest, I am dismayed by all the nation's political parties. Some are too idealistic, most too corrupt. He is right in that secessionism would help cool off tensions between tribes and various ethnicities though.
Hm. Bantustans, perhaps?

The Circle of Life.

Hm. Bantustans, perhaps?
That has a pejorative sense to it. No.

I'm more contesting his claims that the African National Congress, a political group with it's background in nonviolence is the group at fault.
Are we talking about the same ANC?

That has a pejorative sense to it. No.
So, like them. But without the pejorative sense.

So, like them. But without the pejorative sense.
Essentially allowing them to maintain their own territories, with their own laws and their own traditions. And allowing them to elect their own leaders.

To be honest, I am dismayed by all the nation's political parties. Some are too idealistic, most too corrupt. He is right in that secessionism would help cool off tensions between tribes and various ethnicities though.

Loth as I am to agree with any nazi on any issue (hell, if a Nazi told me the sky was blue I'd have to inform him that it was, indeed, grey), I tend to agree that the arbitrary lines drawn in the ground by European powers do indeed need to be replaced by the lines that the different peoples of Africa feel most comfortable in. That would be the most self-determinationalist (is that even a word?) way of handling it.

Essentially allowing them to maintain their own territories, with their own laws and their own traditions. And allowing them to elect their own leaders.
So, like bantustans. What you don't feel responsible for, you let loose.

Loth as I am to agree with any nazi on any issue (hell, if a Nazi told me the sky was blue I'd have to inform him that it was, indeed, grey), I tend to agree that the arbitrary lines drawn in the ground by European powers do indeed need to be replaced by the lines that the different peoples of Africa feel most comfortable in. That would be the most self-determinationalist (is that even a word?) way of handling it.
Determinist. Yes. I agree. People think the tensions are limited to whites vs blacks, or blacks vs indians, or blacks vs Jews, or blacks vs all these groups, but they forget that the blacks themselves are not one homogenous group. They are many different tribes.

Are we talking about the same ANC?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umkhonto_we_Sizwe

This is all the ANC can be credited with as far as violence is concerned. And that was started after the Apartheid government shot hundreds when peaceful resistance was tried.

So, like bantustans. What you don't feel responsible for, you let loose.
I don't see why they should be forced to live under a regime they do not support.

Are we talking about the same ANC?

The one that elected Nelson Mandela in the first free election in South Africa? You know, Nelson Mandela, the Gandhi of South Africa? Yeah...

:rolleyes:

Of course, the party could be different today than it was then.

The one that elected Nelson Mandela in the first free election in South Africa? You know, Nelson Mandela, the Gandhi of South Africa? Yeah...

:rolleyes:

Of course, the party could be different today than it was then.
It is a lot more politicised now. I don't like SA's current president at all. He is no Mandela, that is for sure.

I know that much. I'm more contesting his claims that the African National Congress, a political group with it's background in nonviolence is the group at fault. I also think he drastically underestimates the actual deathtoll atributable to apartheid.

First off, what background of the ANC's non-violence.

Have you forgotten their bombing campaigns, their training camps in Marxist Zimbabwe, their support from the USSR and the terrorist regime in Cuba.

Also, gues who invested that wonderful practice called 'necklacing'. To refresh your memory, it's when you put a car tire around a victims neck, the car tyre is covered in petroleum and then you set it alight.

Futhermore, this barbaric way of killing someone, was used by the ANC on BLACK Africans, whom the ANC accused (of course without any evidence or trial) of supporting the 'enemy' or being a 'traitor'. But given the corrupt nature of the ANC, people were killed in this way for the simple reason of not handing over money to the ANC.

This show that the ANC are gangsters, that's not an insult, a statement of fact. They claim Marxist leanings, yet seem to spend their time with their fingers in the public purse and getting bribes of their poverty striken people.

They work in the same manner of Al Capone.

I agree that Aprthied was opressive and the wrong system to have, I do NOT support the Aparthied system.

Like I said, I wish to see ALL races and ethnicities having their own nations and self determination, you call this Nazi, yet self determination is in the UN Declaration of Human Rights.

The Aparthied system, though oppressive, was oppressive in the sense of it's restrictions on freedom of movement for certain races and the lack of voting rights for the native population. It was not genocidal, in that it did not seek to wipe out any race.

Those who died under Aparthied were those caught up in the civil unrest of the era, in riots, terrorist attacks and the regional wars it spawned in South West Africa and Lesotho.

But Apatheid was democratic, though a VERY limited democratic system. White South Africans could publicly oppose Aparthied in the media and in the SA parliament, the old Federal Party did just that.

It was NOT a one party dictatorship nor did it seek mass murder.

If it did, it would not have allowed itself to dissolve in 1994.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umkhonto_we_Sizwe

This is all the ANC can be credited with as far as violence is concerned. And that was started after the Apartheid government shot hundreds when peaceful resistance was tried.
Ja. I know. So saying that the ANC is peacefull is just a load of crap.

I don't see why they should be forced to live under a regime they do not support.
Who is "they", and what is the "regime"? The ANC on both sides? Because that's the Party winning the elections.
My point is that South Africa, for better or worse, is a single country. It shouldn't really be carved out for the benefit of the more prosperous. The solution of the bantustans made the very same point.
And, to be fair, if "they" can get land back, then "they" could just as well claim out of all South Africa, not just the leftovers. A unified state is for everybody's benefit. An uneasy peace perhaps, but after centuries of slavery and apartheid, it should be clear why.

Ja. I know. So saying that the ANC is peacefull is just a load of crap.
Perhaps you should read more than the first two words of the sentence. And also, click the goddamn link he provided for you.
Tolle, lege.

Who is "they", and what is the "regime"? The ANC on both sides? Because that's the Party winning the elections.
My point is that South Africa, for better or worse, is a single country. It shouldn't really be carved out for the benefit of the more prosperous. The solution of the bantustans made the very same point.
And, to be fair, if "they" can get land back, then "they" could just as well claim out of all South Africa, not just the leftovers. A unified state is for everybody's benefit. An uneasy peace perhaps, but after centuries of slavery and apartheid, it should be clear why.
"They" refers to the country's citizens, and the "regime" is the current government. I want to see how long the current state lasts before dissolving. As for the party winning elections, this only means that a majority approves of it. I am strongly in favour of secessionism where it is the will of the majority of an area. I do not believe the government has the right to stop it in this case.

It is a lot more politicised now. I don't like SA's current president at all. He is no Mandela, that is for sure.

What don't you like about him?

Perhaps you should read more than the first two words of the sentence. And also, click the goddamn link he provided for you.
Tolle, lege.
Perhaps you should read it too. I already read it. I had the same link on standby. So, read it. And then tell me the ANC is peaceful.

What don't you like about him?
He can come off as extremely arrogant at times. He hasn't got the same warmth and charisma that Mandela possessed. I admire him for his academic credentials, yet I preferred Mandela to him.

Perhaps you should read more than the first two words of the sentence. And also, click the goddamn link he provided for you.
The link which described the ANC's military wing? The one which referenced some of their violent activities?

The link which described the ANC's military wing? The one which referenced some of their violent activities?
Yes. The one referring to the gruesome way in which they tore up railways, and their murderous spree on electical wires. I also think they massacred two telephones back in 1960.

Yes. The one referring to the gruesome way in which they tore up railways, and their murderous spree on electical wires. I also think they massacred two telephones back in 1960.
Or how they killed 3 and wounded 73 on june 14 1986?:rolleyes: And you dare telling me I should read beyond the first 2 words?

Yes. The one referring to the gruesome way in which they tore up railways, and their murderous spree on electical wires. I also think they massacred two telephones back in 1960.

Not too mention their necklacing of innocent black victims and their mass murder of thousands of Zulus in the early 1990s.

Open your eyes, or has Nicolai Ceaucescu's Marxist brainwashing programmes in the schools of Romania made you blind to the truth?

Yes. The one referring to the gruesome way in which they tore up railways, and their murderous spree on electical wires. I also think they massacred two telephones back in 1960.
Isn't it funny, then, that your article spends quite a bit of time referring to their "numerous bombings of military, industrial, civilian and infrastructural sites", and their attack on a nucear power plant?

Or how they killed 3 and wounded 73 on june 14 1986?:rolleyes: And you dare telling me I should read beyond the first 2 words?
You moron. They were at fucking war with a fucking oppresive government that mudrdered kids in the street, tortured its population, enslaved it, mocked it, and emprisoned it without trial. And they killed three people?
Do you have no sense of the grotesque when you squirt that thinking of yours out of its brain?

Not too mention their necklacing of innocent black victims and their mass murder of thousands of Zulus in the early 1990s.

Open your eyes, or has Nicolai Ceaucescu's Marxist brainwashing programmes in the schools of Romania made you blind to see the truth?
At least learn to spell his name.

You moron. They were at fucking war with a fucking oppresive government that mudrdered kids in the street, tortured its population, enslaved it, mocked it, and emprisoned it without trial. And they killed three people?
This looks like a different argument then before, namely, whether they were justified in military action. Weren't you arguing that the ANC was peaceful? If so, doesn't saying that they were at war rather contradict that?

You moron. They were at fucking war with a fucking oppresive government that mudrdered kids in the street, tortured its population, enslaved it, mocked it, and emprisoned it without trial. And they killed three people?
Do you have no sense of the grotesque when you squirt that thinking of yours out of its brain?
You realy are an idiot. A few minutes ago all you accused them of was the massacre of a few phonebooths. And now your making up excuses for terrorists.

At least learn to spell his name.

Websites have spelt his name in that way, how do Romanians spell the tyrants name?

Not too mention their necklacing of innocent black victims and their mass murder of thousands of Zulus in the early 1990s.
Now that I didn't see in the article.
Have you any sources supporting that claim?

This looks like a different argument then before, namely, whether they were justified in military action. Weren't you arguing that the ANC was peaceful? If so, doesn't saying that they were at war rather contradict that?
Actually, I wasn't. I was arguing that it is absurd to make mention of whether it was peaceful or not.
And: if they were justified in war then, and you admit it, the whole topic should be about wether they are now. Are they violent/terrorist/cohersive now? Not.

Websites have spelt his name in that way, how do Romanians spell the tyrants name?
I don't know how the White Power sites spell it, I admit it. Perhaps you should frequent one that is actually from Romania in order to see.

Like I said, I wish to see ALL races and ethnicities having their own nations and self determination, you call this Nazi, yet self determination is in the UN Declaration of Human Rights.

I'm a black white Native American Ashkenazic Jew. Once you divide the world up into racially-based states, where do I go?

You realy are an idiot. A few minutes ago all you accused them of was the massacre of a few phonebooths. And now your making up excuses for terrorists.
I had said that was the main action carried out. I was using a metaphor.
People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.

I had said that was the main action carried out. I was using a metaphor.
People who live in glass houses shouldn't throw stones.
I don't live in a glass house. So I can throw as many stones at you as I like. Cause you started attacking me when I said the ANC wasn't peaceful. And you just demonstrated your stupidity again. Considering blown up phonebooths beeing the main action of the ANC.

I don't live in a glass house. So I can throw as many stones at you as I like. Cause you started attacking me when I said the ANC wasn't peaceful. And you just demonstrated your stupidity again. Considering blown up phonebooths beeing the main action of the ANC.
I attacked you when you misinterpreted another poster's point of view. I hadn't said they were peaceful, because that was not peace. If I have to qualify their acts, I'd still say they equate the murder of phones in comparison.
And your glass house is called the AWB, Nazi prick.

Now that I didn't see in the article.
Have you any sources supporting that claim?

How about a South African, born and raised in the 70's?

Necklacing and other daft forms of terrorism were extremely common, in fact in the early 90's Winnie Mandela was in court defending herself against charges that included necklacing some young youths that played in her soccer league.

I attacked you when you misinterpreted another poster's point of view.
A poster who claimed they were peaceful. Which they aren't. Which you then defended.
I'd still say they equate the murder of phones in comparison.
And still do.
And your glass house is called the AWB, Nazi prick.
Owowow...the Nazi again. Thats of course an absolute winner in arguments.:rolleyes:

How about a South African, born and raised in the 70's?

Necklacing and other daft forms of terrorism were extremely common, in fact in the early 90's Winnie Mandela was in court defending herself against charges that included necklacing some young youths that played in her soccer league.
That woman was absolutely awful. I remember her. Vile poison. I cannot believe Mandela ever wed a woman like that.

Nazi prick.

Von Witzleben never insulted you, why go personal when someone disagree's with your version of history?

If you have to resort to name calling and insults, you have only shown that you cannot hold down a proper debate and just expose that fact you know next to nothing about South Africa.

Like with me, instead of just talking about some minor mispelling on my part, of the tyrant of Romania's name, why don't you respond to the points I made about the ANC's killing of Zulu's and their torture tacticts?

Either put forward your side of the debate in a rational manner or shut up.

How about a South African, born and raised in the 70's?

Necklacing and other daft forms of terrorism were extremely common, in fact in the early 90's Winnie Mandela was in court defending herself against charges that included necklacing some young youths that played in her soccer league.

From HRW: The Killings in South Africa: The Role of the Security Forces and the Response of the State: 4. BACKGROUND
Because township residents have perceived the courts as either unwilling or unable to discharge their responsibilities, they have bypassed the judicial system. In 1985 and 1986, "people's courts" sprang up in townships that had become "no-go" areas for whites. These courts in effect took the law into their own hands. While some of them only imposed fines, others authorized whip lashings and deaths by "necklacing," in which a rubber tire, filled with kerosene, is forced around a victim's chest and arms, and set on fire. Necklacing was frequently used to punish offenders, including children, alleged to be traitors to the movement as well as those related to the offenders by blood or other ties. The ANC executive body condemned the practice. During the first half of 1990, a number of killings were carried out on the south coast of Natal by young men claiming to be carrying out ANC justice.

Inkatha warlords have been known to rule their constituencies harshly as well. For example, one warlord, who called for "liquidation" of ANC and UDF youths, warned Inkatha parents that their Zulu children who joined the ANC would be killed.

This is the full context. And Winnie Mandela, to my knowledge, was only accused of endorsing the practice in a non-specific manner, and on her own.

Well i think its important not to romanticise Mandela's role, he was equally as millitant, hence his time in jail. That being said, he made an awesome statesmen, as does his successor Mr Mbeki. Its the next generation that has most educated Zafrikans scared.

Von Witzleben never insulted you, why go personal when someone disagree's with your version of history?

If you have to resort to name calling and insults, you have only shown that you cannot hold down a proper debate and just expose that fact you know next to nothing about South Africa.

Like with me, instead of just talking about some minor mispelling on my part, of the tyrant of Romania's name, why don't you respond to the points I made about the ANC's killing of Zulu's and their torture tacticts?

Either put forward your side of the debate in a rational manner or shut up.
Why don't you check his posts, and see wher he insulted me?
I only answered about the spelling of Ceausescu's name because your other statements did not deserve any attention. I thought you might benefit more from a lesson in common spelling than from my pure disdain.

Well i think its important not to romanticise Mandela's role, he was equally as millitant, hence his time in jail. That being said, he made an awesome statesmen, as does his successor Mr Mbeki. Its the next generation that has most educated Zafrikans scared.
Wasn't Mbeki the one that claimed it's a modern myth that the spreading of AIDS can be stopped or at least slowed down by using condoms?

Well i think its important not to romanticise Mandela's role, he was equally as millitant, hence his time in jail. That being said, he made an awesome statesmen, as does his successor Mr Mbeki. Its the next generation that has most educated Zafrikans scared.
Living in Europe, I am quite distanced from current happenings in ZA politics. If things get worse, I might contemplate making my residency in the EU permanent. What is it about the next generation that is so worrying?

Why don't you check his posts, and see wher he insulted me?
Hmm yeah. I did. But who started it? I only reacted in same the manner.

Living in Europe, I am quite distanced from current happenings in ZA politics. If things get worse, I might contemplate making my residency in the EU permanent. What is it about the next generation that is so worrying?

Large scale dissatisfaction with service delievery, none of the free electricity, water and houses that were promised, are forcing citizens to support slightly more aggressive policy makers with questionable ethics: eg, jacob zuma. Who is currently being prosecuted for large scale corruption and rape. (They are seperate cases, haha).

The worry is that there is a massive void within the ANC of respected and sane people to lead the country, and job that is going to be even more difficult to do as dissent grows.

Imagine the Health Minister as President, denying that HIV causes AIDS, and suggesting that it is easily treated with with patatoes - a stance that is indeed ridiculous. This is the level of inteligence, lie to the people because we dont have the budget to tell the truth ...

Large scale dissatisfaction with service delievery, none of the free electricity, water and houses that were promised, are forcing citizens to support slightly more aggressive policy makers with questionable ethics: eg, jacob zuma. Who is currently being prosecuted for large scale corruption and rape. (They are seperate cases, haha).
Yep, I head of this. The Economist made quite a fuss about it, and gave rather dire predictions for ZA's future if it went on with current trends. Although, by its nature, the Economist is a bit of a cynic's publication.

Empty promises are too often a feature of getting elected.

The worry is that there is a massive void within the ANC of respected and sane people to lead the country, and job that is going to be even more difficult to do as dissent grows.

Imagine the Health Minister as President, denying that HIV causes AIDS, and suggesting that it is easily treated with with patatoes - a stance that is indeed ridiculous. This is the level of inteligence, lie to the people because we dont have the budget to tell the truth ...
I cannot believe that such attitudes are tolerated within the party. ZA comes very near to being a nation of the West, yet it always manages to fall back somehow. I wonder what they are going to say when large portions of the population end up dead from AIDs. Perhaps potatoes can bring the dead back to life? :rolleyes:

Indeed South Africa is actually is not like any other african country, but we seem to sabotage ourself by letting stupid people represent us. The problem lies within the fact that most of the non white population born during apartheid had an education system designed to teach complacency. Hopefully kids of the future will ask questions. These days everyone just votes and supports whatever party leader speaks their language or looks like them, blindly.

Indeed South Africa is actually is not like any other african country, but we seem to sabotage ourself by letting stupid people represent us. The problem lies within the fact that most of the non white population born during apartheid had an education system designed to teach complacency. Hopefully kids of the future will ask questions. These days everyone just votes and supports whatever party leader speaks their language or looks like them, blindly.
I think as the education system improves, voter choices will also be better. Maybe then the most able, rather than the most charismatic, politicians will come into power. One can hope. If there is a future to it, I might return.

I am ignorant to South Afrikan politics....Which one of those parties is the right wing one?

P.S. replied to your message.
Do you really think that just because right-wing policies may be best for your country, that they are best for every country?