NationStates Jolt Archive


Your favourite German Federal Chancellor?

Neu Leonstein
22-02-2006, 01:32
Well, we've got an American one, and a British one, and so I add a German one.

Konrad Adenauer (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Konrad_Adenauer)
From 1917-1933 he was mayor of Cologne, but during the Nazi era he lost his job, was briefly imprisoned, and stayed out of the public light. He was accused of being part in the assassination attempt on Hitler, but he wasn't involved, since he had declined the offer.
In the tough times after the war, he can be credited with restoring much of Germany's credibility and integrating Germany into the West.

Ludwig Erhard (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludwig_Erhard)
A good friend of Adenauer's, this economist is the chief architect of the social market economy and of the economic miracle. When the allies wanted to keep the price controls in the country, it was Erhard who abolished them (although that wasn't his job...) In my view, that alone makes him 2nd only to Bismarck.

Kurt Kiesinger (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurt_Georg_Kiesinger)
Well, he was boring. His only notable "achievement" was that he headed the first Grand Coalition, which has become somewhat topical these days.

Willy Brandt (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Willy_Brandt)
He's generally regarded as the best man the SPD ever had. He got the Nobel Peace Prize, managed to normalise relations somewhat with East Germany and other communist countries, which was quite controversial. He also took a couragous stand on the holocaust, when he fell to his knees at a memorial on a state visit to Poland. He had to resign when it was found out that one of his close co-workers and friends was a communist spy...

Helmut Schmidt (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helmut_Schmidt)
I like the guy because he is a big part of my favourite newspaper, Die Zeit, and because he's from Hamburg. He took a fairly tough line on Germany's own terrorist threat, the RAF, and continued to emphasise ties with Nato.

Helmut Kohl (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helmut_Kohl)
Big Man Kohl...well, he was a political animal - most likely an elephant. He crushed all opposition, both inside his party and out, and made Germany his own for 16 years.
Pros include the reunification, which he pulled off against resistance from all sides.
Cons include the way the reunification was handled and his involvement in the CDU corruption scandal.
Nonetheless, he's good for quotes.

"I have been underestimated for decades. I've done very well that way."
"We never want to wage war again against each other. We want to honour the dead and tend to the graves but we never again want to have soldiers' tombs in Europe. That is the most important reason for a united Europe."


Gerhard Schröder (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerhard_Schr%C3%B6der)
Well, most of you would know all there is to know about him. He's probably more like Kohl than he would admit, they both are animals when it comes to politics.
At any rate, most notably among Schröder's achievements were keeping Germany out of Iraq, leaving nuclear energy (I disagree with that one) and finally beginning the long reform process that really should have been done by Kohl.
These days, he's somewhat fallen from grace because he now has a cushy job with an oil consortium he himself set up with his good friend Putin.

Angela Merkel (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Angela_Merkel)
The first female leader of Germany, her achievements were that she managed to take out some big names in the race to the top (just like Kohl people tend to underestimate her), she managed to get the left-wing SPD to agree to a coalition with her right-wing CDU, and she created some sort of compromise at the recent EU budget talks.
And even the economy seems to be doing all right, although in her bid to get the country's finances back in order she'll raise the sales tax a little soon, and we'll see how that turns out.
Argesia
22-02-2006, 01:33
I go with Mr. Brandt.
Europa Maxima
22-02-2006, 01:34
I would say Bismarck, but he belonged to the German Empire :p So I will say Angela Merkel. I like her a lot so far. Definitely better than that fool Schoeder.
Undelia
22-02-2006, 01:37
He also took a couragous stand on the holocaust, when he fell to his knees at a memorial on a state visit to Poland..
How is that courageous? It isn’t courageous is everyone fucking agrees with you.
Kievan-Prussia
22-02-2006, 01:37
Adenauer.
Whereyouthinkyougoing
22-02-2006, 01:38
I voted for Kohl, just to be a jerk. :D

Also, now I'll be able to honestly say "Why yes, of course I voted for Kohl!".
Neu Leonstein
22-02-2006, 01:40
How is that courageous? It isn’t courageous is everyone fucking agrees with you.
It hadn't been done before. Germans were generally keeping very quiet about the whole thing, it was forgetting rather than remembering which was on the cards.
Brandt not only brought the whole thing into the public again to be faced and debated, he also took the first step towards properly normalising relations with those that had been mistreated (Poland first and foremost).

Oh, and I would like to see a US President going to Vietnam and falling on his knees at a memorial there. That too would be courageous.
Soheran
22-02-2006, 01:43
Oh, and I would like to see a US President going to Vietnam and falling on his knees at a memorial there. That too would be courageous.

Just acknowledging what the United States did to the people of Vietnam would be courageous.
Fleckenstein
22-02-2006, 01:44
How is that courageous? It isn’t courageous is everyone fucking agrees with you.

perfect. that needs to be one of those quote of the day thingies.
Europa Maxima
22-02-2006, 01:45
Oh, and I would like to see a US President going to Vietnam and falling on his knees at a memorial there. That too would be courageous.
Or President Hu Jin Tao going to the Japanese WW 2 Memorial and kneeling down :p
Neu Leonstein
22-02-2006, 01:47
Or President Hu Jin Tao going to the Japanese WW 2 Memorial and kneeling down :p
Other way around and we'll have a deal.

The Japanese haven't had a Willy Brandt equivalent, they are still in the same mode Germany was in the years after the war, and they've got nothing but trouble from it.
Europa Maxima
22-02-2006, 01:48
Other way around and we'll have a deal.

The Japanese haven't had a Willy Brandt equivalent, they are still in the same mode Germany was in the years after the war, and they've got nothing but trouble from it.
It would still be courageous though...it would get him ousted.

Japan is progressing, in some ways very fast, in others very slow.
Pacitalia
22-02-2006, 01:49
Kohl, by far.
The Cariebbean
22-02-2006, 01:50
Brandt! Bottom three suck for various reasons.
Neu Leonstein
22-02-2006, 01:54
Kohl, by far.
Why not make a debate of it? Why do you think Kohl was the best?
Europa Maxima
22-02-2006, 01:56
Brandt! Bottom three suck for various reasons.
Err why does Angela suck?
Pacitalia
22-02-2006, 01:58
Why not make a debate of it? Why do you think Kohl was the best?

Like you said, he was a political animal. I like political animals. ;)

And I have the flu, so you won't be getting much debating from me.
Kossackja
22-02-2006, 01:58
Germans were generally keeping very quiet about the whole thing, it was forgetting rather than remembering which was on the cards.germans are totally obsessed with their nazi past, there are enough german nazi documentaries to provide 24/7 'entertainment', about hitler, hitlers generals, hitlers doctors, hitlers secretaries, hitlers cook, hitlers teddybear... it also seems germens cant get enough memorials, there are memorials for jews the nazis killed, for the euthanized gays, for the disabled, for the gypsies (who are quarreling amongst themselves, because some gypsy tribes want their very own memorial only dedicated to their tribe now). germany even has a law, that makes it illegal to even question if the holocaust happened.
Europa Maxima
22-02-2006, 02:00
germans are totally obsessed with their nazi past, there are enough german nazi documentaries to provide 24/7 'entertainment', about hitler, hitlers generals, hitlers doctors, hitlers secretaries, hitlers cook, hitlers teddybear... it also seems germens cant get enough memorials, there are memorials for jews the nazis killed, for the euthanized gays, for the disabled, for the gypsies (who are quarreling amongst themselves, because some gypsy tribes want their very own memorial only dedicated to their tribe now). germany even has a law, that makes it illegal to even question if the holocaust happened.
Yes. Whilst I absolutely agree with learning about History, I think the entire period is given too much attention.
Neu Leonstein
22-02-2006, 02:01
-snip-
Note that I was using the past tense.
Pacitalia
22-02-2006, 02:02
Yes. Whilst I absolutely agree with learning about History, I think the entire period is given too much attention.

I disagree in the sense that it reminds us all of humanity's faults. Though this mess in the Mideast is certainly primed to replace that. ;)
Europa Maxima
22-02-2006, 02:03
I disagree in the sense that it reminds us all of humanity's faults. Though this mess in the Mideast is certainly primed to replace that. ;)
Learn lest you forget. History's purpose is to teach us and help us avoid future mistakes. Sort of like a form of feedback.
The Cariebbean
23-02-2006, 23:21
Err why does Angela suck?

She is CDU.
Fass
23-02-2006, 23:23
Didn't you post this same exact thread several months ago?
Cabra West
23-02-2006, 23:55
Yes. Whilst I absolutely agree with learning about History, I think the entire period is given too much attention.

I wouldn't really say that... considering the amount of viewers that many documentaries about the Nazi era draw to the screens, I would say there is a good amount of genuine interest in the topic to be found in the German public.

Personally, I'm more than a little interested in the time, not so much in the political situation or the strategic events of the war, but more in the psychological and social aspects.
Yes, I'm still having a hard time coming to terms with the knowledge - or rather, the guesswork - about what the people who raised me did during the Nazi years...
SoWiBi
23-02-2006, 23:59
I voted for Kohl, just to be a jerk. :D
Also, now I'll be able to honestly say "Why yes, of course I voted for Kohl!".Thanks for posting, I couldn't have gone to bed without the reassurance you were kidding. Dir Birne, die Birne muss weg!

Also, amusing little summaries, Leon.
The Atlantian islands
24-02-2006, 02:39
Kohl, second only to Merkel. Although, admittingly, Merkel is a noob in office so we will see what good comes from her. I have faith in her though.
The Atlantian islands
24-02-2006, 02:45
Yes. Whilst I absolutely agree with learning about History, I think the entire period is given too much attention.

I dont think so. I think the reason it is given so much attention, is because it shows what can happen to a first world, western, industrialized country, not just some shithole in north east Africa.

I think the reason the Germans constantly remind everyone, is because, obvioulsy it affected them more than us Americans, or you English. Their own country did it, and they want to make sure it doesnt happen again, while making sure that people see that they are trying to rectify their mistakes.

I, for one, dont hold anything against present day Germany and its Germans.

I dislike Germany more for its lefties than for its Nazi past.

Holocaust memorials are summed up in four words, "forgive but never forget." Germany has been desperatly trying to do the latter, thus all the Hitler/Nazi 'obsession', while also begging the former.
Bobs Own Pipe
24-02-2006, 03:09
I always had a fondness for Helmut Schmidt.