NationStates Jolt Archive

Well, it's Pride week at my uni. As I was breaking out the rainbow gear, I realized that the whole concept of "Pride" was a bit silly. Sexuality is something we're born with -it's an essential part of who we are. Everyone. But is it anything to be poud of? I don't think so.

Things like Pride week, phrases like "the gay community", and raunchy carnival floats only serve to compartmentalize people when in fact the reality is much more nuanced, and less exciting. After all, gay people are as diverse a bunch as any other arbitrary group.

Ah well. It's an exuse to party while bringing attention to a group that has been, and still is marginalized at times, in a [positive and inclusive way. Just the title of the event struck me as strange for the first time.

I'd never really thought about it like that...
I don't think I've ever had "pride" in being heterosexual...
Bizarre.
Maybe it's more a point of pride of coming out and admitting it? That they're not ashamed of being gay?
Beats me... I'll have to ask about that...

When passivity is being told repeatedly that you're a pervert and a sinner because of who you love, a more active stance is necessary.

It's a response, to not be ashamed of being gay, not having to hide who they are. No one is asking you to hide your heterosexuality, you don't need a pride week.

Also straight people arent persecuted like homosexuals are. Maybe they feel like saying "hey youre no better than me and who are you to judge anyway?"

But anything can be taken to the extreme.

I say if the homosexuals get to have pride week, or anything pride. Then the hetrosexuals should get the same thing!

It's a response, to not be ashamed of being gay, not having to hide who they are. No one is asking you to hide your heterosexuality, you don't need a pride week.That's a bit of a cop-out. I get all the reaction-to-past/present-inequality stuff, and I agree that celebrating sexuality that isn't utterly mainstream is nice. But in essence, I don't think being gay is anything to take pride in - I mean, it isn't like you did anything laudable to attain homosexual status.

The reason Gay pride weeks exist is pretty straightforward:

When people are demonized the way gays tend to be, they need every ounce of help they can get. Not being intimidated by bible/koran/torah-thumpers is definitely not easy, and such courage deserves reward.

I say if the homosexuals get to have pride week, or anything pride. Then the hetrosexuals should get the same thing!
We get that the other 51 weeks out of the year though.

We get that the other 71 weeks out of the year though.

How? I never saw a Straight Pride Parade. Hell I would LOVE to see a Straight Pride Parade.

Gay pride is not about being proud because you were born homosexual. It is being proud about being able to stand up in a society that on the whole ranges from non-supportive to actively hostile and say "I am who I am, I am strong enough to believe I am ok no matter what anyone else says about it, and I am proud that I don't allow myself to be marginalized by those who would rather see me shoved back into a closet." The reason there is no heterosexual pride is that heterosexuals have never needed to say any of that about themselves.

It is a sad thing that we NEED gay pride, but a very good thing that we celebrate it.

We get that the other 71 weeks out of the year though.

Wow! You get 72weeks a year, cool. I'm stuck with the boring old 52, just think what I could do with all that extra time

:)

How? I never saw a Straight Pride Parade. Hell I would LOVE to see a Straight Pride Parade.
Well, every parade you see a husband and wife walking hand in hand is one.

Every movie with straight couples celebrates that life style and afirms it.

The day before yesterday (from my perspective) was a day just LOADED with nothing but pride in heterosexual relationships.

I didn't really understand the need for pride and the ability to, at least once, be able to stand out with others like me and say how proud I am until I suddenly found myself being the odd fish and the only American in many, many miles.

We get that the other 71 weeks out of the year though.

What kind of crazy calendar are you using?

Wow! You get 72weeks a year, cool. I'm stuck with the boring old 52, just think what I could do with all that extra time

:)
See? This is what happened when you type fast at the end of a long day... espcially when you're coming down with a cold.

Thanks, I fixed it. ;)

Don't ask me. I'm still trying to figure out why I cannot be proud to be what I am, a white heterosexual male, without being called a homophobe, a racist, and a sexist.

Ah, well. I guess life's a bitch and what's worse, she has puppies.

Well, come to think of it, I suppose Gay Pride is much like national pride, religious pride, familial pride, pride in your school, gender-specified pride, whatever. Something that is in some way innate and not very deserving, but has been threatened, or is important in its own rite. I think perhaps it is justified as long as there is a cause to fight for, and a goal to strive for - in that case, pride can be a good motivvation and a tool.
When the ultimate goal of acceptance and normalcy regarding sexuality arrives though, I don't see the point at all.

I think a straight Pride is a great idea. Everybody could be wearing plain clothes, sit in couches and drink lots of beer. Occasionally we would bring a live animal up on one of the platmforms and hunt it. Like all straight men do. And we could all watch football/soccer/baseball. Like all straight men do. And we could be really quiet and insensitive. Like all straight men.

That's why I think the gay pride is stupid. It only reinforces the image that gay people are hilarious party-people who simply love walking around in tight swimsuits all day and Chippendale. There are gay people who do, but I think most are pretty "normal"(don't misunderstand me).

Don't ask me. I'm still trying to figure out why I cannot be proud to be what I am, a white heterosexual male, without being called a homophobe, a racist, and a sexist.

Ah, well. I guess life's a bitch and what's worse, she has puppies.

You can be proud to be who you are... no problems there. If, however, it becomes pride that you are NOT an asian lesbian female, that is when those other lables start to apply.

Well, it's Pride week at my uni. As I was breaking out the rainbow gear, I realized that the whole concept of "Pride" was a bit silly. Sexuality is something we're born with -it's an essential part of who we are. Everyone. But is it anything to be poud of?

Hey, if it's your last best hope to claim "more equal than other's" status and the benefits that are derived from it, they gotta take a shot. I mean hell, look at all the goodies you get if you hit the minority jackpot. Welfare, protected class status, free health care, affirmative action benefits, extra points for federal jobs, discrimination lawsuits, maybe even a free night in Barney Franks basement with a get out of jail free card!

I think a straight Pride is a great idea. Everybody could be wearing plain clothes, sit in couches and drink lots of beer. Occasionally we would bring a live animal up on one of the platmforms and hunt it. Like all straight men do. And we could all watch football/soccer/baseball. Like all straight men do. And we could be really quiet and insensitive. Like all straight men.

That's why I think the gay pride is stupid. It only reinforces the image that gay people are hilarious party-people who simply love walking around in tight swimsuits all day and Chippendale. There are gay people who do, but I think most are pretty "normal"(don't misunderstand me).

If we had straight pride and did those things, would you think that all straight men were insensitive, sports fantatic, animal slaughtering, couch potato drunks? No, you would realize that this IS a stereotype that the group is playing to in order to make the point that it is over the top. Gay pride is often much the same.

I have marched in many gay pride parades, with many friends, and not one of them wears a feather boa on any other day of the year. But they do enjoy the party, just as you might if you were to attend a Mardi Gras festival. I, personally, think that the costumes and such at a gay pride parade are more for the benefit of making other people face those prejudices and realize how ridiculous they really are.

When you see your accountant, or your doctor, or your teacher or your neighbor all dressed up and having a good time, maybe it will make you realize that this is NOT the way all homosexuals behave, you have seen these people all around you the rest of the year and they are no different than you.

Hey, if it's your last best hope to claim "more equal than other's" status and the benefits that are derived from it, they gotta take a shot. I mean hell, look at all the goodies you get if you hit the minority jackpot. Welfare, protected class status, free health care, affirmative action benefits, extra points for federal jobs, discrimination lawsuits, maybe even a free night in Barney Franks basement with a get out of jail free card!
Erm, the "minority jackpot" is there to adress existing inequality. Here in Canada, everyone gets free health care, and welfare is universal. As for the other ones, I don't think sexual orientation is an entry field on any applications (correct me if that's not true - I've never seen it.)
I suggest that you're a bitter whilte male with an overdeveloped sense of your own entitlement. get over yourself.

How? I never saw a Straight Pride Parade. Hell I would LOVE to see a Straight Pride Parade.

What, the one called "society" and that goes on 24/7/365 isn't enough for you?

When you see your accountant, or your doctor, or your teacher or your neighbor all dressed up and having a good time, maybe it will make you realize that this is NOT the way all homosexuals behave, you have seen these people all around you the rest of the year and they are no different than you.I dunno. Call me unsophisticated, but that's a bit too much reverse psychology. I agree with Hatta-allah on this one. (Not that I in any why undervalue an exuse to party - god forbid)

Meh. I'm just proud to be who I am, and part of who I am is being heterosexual.

That's a bit of a cop-out. I get all the reaction-to-past/present-inequality stuff, and I agree that celebrating sexuality that isn't utterly mainstream is nice. But in essence, I don't think being gay is anything to take pride in - I mean, it isn't like you did anything laudable to attain homosexual status.
You're playing a semantic game to ignore what is an obvious point.

Meh. I'm just proud to be who I am, and part of who I am is being heterosexual.Fair enough. I guess I've been trained to be proud of my accomplishments, as opposed to my abilities and "who I am" in general. Though maybe there isn't much difference between pride and general satisfaction in who you are.
What, the one called "society" and that goes on 24/7/365 isn't enough for you?I don't really think it is a "straight pride parade" - it's just a routine expression of comfort with heterosexuality. Hopefully the same thing will eventually be possible with homosexuality such that exaggerated "pride" events are rendered unecessary.
You're playing a semantic game to ignore what is an obvious point.I'm not ignoring your point. I agreed with it.

Erm, the "minority jackpot" is there to adress existing inequality. Here in Canada, everyone gets free health care, and welfare is universal. As for the other ones, I don't think sexual orientation is an entry field on any applications (correct me if that's not true - I've never seen it.)
I suggest that you're a bitter whilte male with an overdeveloped sense of your own entitlement. get over yourself.

Actually I am a very content white male with a whole lot of gay friends that are absoutely embrassed by flames and recruiters that do nothing but constantly whine about being picked on and making a spectacle of themselves. So maybe you might thing about getting over your anger and next time if you dont want to hear the answer, dont ask the stupid question in the first place.

FYI, In the US, the minority jackpot is there to buy votes and make the minority population subservient and depenedent on political parties for their welfare. It has nothing to do with addressing inequality.

I don't really think it is a "straight pride parade" - it's just a routine expression of comfort with heterosexuality. Hopefully the same thing will eventually be possible with homosexuality such that exaggerated "pride" events are rendered unecessary.

It isn't "comfort with heterosexuality." That isn't the problem. The problem is the constant assumption that people are heterosexual and that that is the "normal" way to behave.

In a culture like that - and the reaction to Brokeback Mountain proves that we do have a culture like that, if it wasn't obvious before - GLBT people have every reason to assert their existence and their legitimacy.

Actually I am a very content white male with a whole lot of gay friends that are absoutely embrassed by flames and recruiters that do nothing but constantly whine about being picked on and making a spectacle of themselves. So maybe you might thing about getting over your anger and next time if you dont want to hear the answer, dont ask the stupid question in the first place.The tone of your first post was pretty harsh. I'm sorry that I read it in the wrong manner - my apologies to you.
I too see the disadvantages of drawing attention to yourself as an ostensible united "community" in such a way. Though like you say, I doubt there's all that much concensuss on the subject among gay people.

I think all those people look pretty normal to me, except, you know, they get the concept of a "parade."

They are too tanned. Especially for sweden.

I call fake!

That's why I think the gay pride is stupid. It only reinforces the image that gay people are hilarious party-people who simply love walking around in tight swimsuits all day and Chippendale. There are gay people who do, but I think most are pretty "normal"(don't misunderstand me).

What in the concept of a "parade" is it that you haven't understood when you seem to expect people not to dress up for them? Oh, and have you ever been to a gay pride parade? It seems to me you haven't...

http://www.qx.se/nyheter/bilder/200508/20050806194025.jpg

http://www.qx.se/nyheter/bilder/200508/20050806192740.jpg

http://www.qx.se/nyheter/bilder/200508/20050806192946.jpg

http://www.qx.se/nyheter/bilder/200508/20050808133343.jpg

http://www.qx.se/nyheter/bilder/200508/20050808130747.jpg

http://www.qx.se/nyheter/bilder/200508/20050808130511.jpg

http://www.qx.se/nyheter/bilder/200508/20050806193441.jpg

I think all those people look pretty normal to me, except, you know, they get the concept of a "parade."

How? I never saw a Straight Pride Parade. Hell I would LOVE to see a Straight Pride Parade.
Why? Your desire for a straight pride parade is obviously a reaction to gay pride. Its not something you've ever had to think about except in the context of they-got-one-I-want-one.

Gay pride is about self-respect, about not being ashamed when people tell you you should be. It's about celebrating diversity and individuality, and about civil rights.

What would your straight pride event be about? Why do you want one? Is it just cause our stuff makes you feel alienated? Guess what, gays feel that way all the time. Do you see something you can't be part of and that makes you want to do something self-agrandizing to reafirm your own importance?
All I want is just for once for someone to explain why they want a straight pride parade other than the existence of gay pride parades. In that context is is nothing but yet another attempt to marginalize a minority group that continues to be persecuted and alienated. How proud does that make you feel?

The tone of your first post was pretty harsh. I'm sorry that I read it in the wrong manner - my apologies to you.
I too see the disadvantages of drawing attention to yourself as an ostensible united "community" in such a way. Though like you say, I doubt there's all that much concensuss on the subject among gay people.

Gladly accepted. I think a lot depends on just where you live. I live in the midwest and if you want the true middle of the road in attitudes and acceptance this is the place to find it. (Fred and family excluded). People here are more low key and simply do not relate to the concept of any publicity is good publicity. Don't misunderstand though, that there is a very united community here, they simply do not exclude all others or view us as the enemy, like you will find on either coast. Maybe because they are already accepted, I really don't know.

They are too tanned. Especially for sweden.

I call fake!

Sweden has a pretty large immigrant population.

They are too tanned. Especially for sweden.

I call fake!

There is one thing that our secular society still worships unabashedly, apart from our socialist overlords, and that thing is the sun.

Don't ask me. I'm still trying to figure out why I cannot be proud to be what I am, a white heterosexual male, without being called a homophobe, a racist, and a sexist.

Ah, well. I guess life's a bitch and what's worse, she has puppies.
Most queer people get called names for being out and proud too. I'm still trying to figure out why I cannot be what I am, a white, liberal, homosexual female, without being called a dyke, an america-hater, and a sinner.

You belong to a pretty privileged group, and whether you asked for that privilege or not, a little oppressor guilt is the price you pay. It's a rough life.

I guess if your orientation has been derided and ridiculed it could be empowering to show 'pride'. But the concept of 'pride' does seem to be overused in society today. I really honestly have never thought about my sexual orientation and felt pride.




Now my sexual performance is another matter...

Most queer people get called names for being out and proud too. I'm still trying to figure out why I cannot be what I am, a white, liberal, homosexual female, without being called a dyke, an america-hater, and a sinner.

You belong to a pretty privileged group, and whether you asked for that privilege or not, a little oppressor guilt is the price you pay. It's a rough life.

I'd almost buy that if not for the fact that I apparently belong to the only group of people in America that does not presently have a special-interest group in Washington looking out for their interests.

It would appear that you have at least two working for you.

I'd almost buy that if not for the fact that I apparently belong to the only group of people in America that does not presently have a special-interest group in Washington looking out for their interests.

It would appear that you have at least two working for you.
What don't you buy? That being white and male and straight gives you certain privileges? That other people don't get called mean names undeservedly too?

If you had a special-interest group looking out for you, as a white straight male, what would they lobby for? You can already get married to whoever you happen to fall in love with, and you're on the right side of the wage gap.
What exactly do you want?

Edit: Wait wait wait. It just occured to me that you might be trying to claim that white straight males are under-represented in politics and government in the U.S. Excuse me for a moment while I laugh uncontrollably.

I'd almost buy that if not for the fact that I apparently belong to the only group of people in America that does not presently have a special-interest group in Washington looking out for their interests.

It would appear that you have at least two working for you.


Ummm... you are kidding, right? No one looking out for the interests of white males? Errr... do we need to explain the obvious here?

Meh... 'We're here we're quere get used to it'...Yes your here your quere and guess what? We're used to it!Why can't homosexuals get used to the idea that most sane people don't give a flying f*cuk what two consenting people get up to together.Just let it go.....

Meh... 'We're here we're quere get used to it'...Yes your here your quere and guess what? We're used to it!Why can't homosexuals get used to the idea that most sane people don't give a flying f*cuk what two consenting people get up to together.Just let it go.....

If that were true, then homosexual couples could marry, could adopt, could file joint taxes, could make medical decisions for their partners, would be allowed to put each other on their insurance, would have over 1000 other rights automatically granted to heterosexual couples...

Unfortunately, if most sane people are not concerned with what consenting adults do, the rules are currently being made by insane people.

If everyone was "used to it" then there would be no need to keep saying it.

If that were true, then homosexual couples could marry, could adopt, could file joint taxes, could make medical decisions for their partners, would be allowed to put each other on their insurance, would have over 1000 other rights automatically granted to heterosexual couples...

Unfortunately, if most sane people are not concerned with what consenting adults do, the rules are currently being made by insane people.

If everyone was "used to it" then there would be no need to keep saying it.
Just out of bed and cranky with the world...I never figured out why I cannot fall in love with a someone of the same gender<which I have on ocassion> without all the bullshit that goes with it.Why though are taxes always brought up?

Just out of bed and cranky with the world...I never figured out why I cannot fall in love with a someone of the same gender<which I have on ocassion> without all the bullshit that goes with it.Why though are taxes always brought up?

You can fall in love, certainly. And if that is all you want to do, and that satisfies you, good for you.

There are many people, however, who would like equality. Tax breaks are just one of the many points of inequality, and one that would be, frankly, simple to correct. There are people who would like to settle down and marry and raise families like 90% of the world can do without thinking about it. So yes, mundane issues like taxes and inheritance and insurance are discussed, because they are rights so taken for granted by heterosexuals and denied to homosexuals. A homosexual couple has to go to court, in many states, for the right to decide medical issues for each other, and in some states cannot even if they do go to court. If a man has been with his partner for 50 years, and the partner's family disowned him and has not spoken to him in all that time, the family, not the man, in many cases, still has the right to decide how the partner is treated, and may even ban the man from his partner's bedside.

If you were the man in this situation, how would you feel if you were told you could not see the man you had loved all your life? If you couldn't hold his hand and comfort him in his final illness? If you could not say goodbye to him?

If love were the only issue, these sorts of cases would never come up, but the legality of a marriage license is what prevails in our society. If you were allowed to marry him, these questions would never even arise. Just one of the many reasons that this struggle is important.

Serious question.Is it not possible for someone in the states to put on their medical records who is 'next of kin'?Or is it possible that a living will would surfice?

I agree with the arguments on this issue. Personally, i feel that the gay "pride" ideology, floats, merchandise is a product of a few issues. The gay voice (as one may call it in politics) had not been heard, as a result, certain actions were to take place...

Though these actions of in your face promotion of the "gay culture and community" has done more division and seperation from the ambitions gays had in equality. Expressing your sexual nature as normal, and every day. Something that is not new and scary but normal and acceptable...thats the only way to get through to a hard shelled society.

Serious question.Is it not possible for someone in the states to put on their medical records who is 'next of kin'?Or is it possible that a living will would surfice?

It's a valid question. In some cases, yes, in many cases, no. And in some cases where one does record next of kin, or has a living will, courts will still rule in favor of the family, overturning both if there is no marriage license.

And the question YOUR question brings up is "why should homosexuals have to go through the extra effort and legal hassles that heterosexuals do not?"

It's a response, to not be ashamed of being gay, not having to hide who they are. No one is asking you to hide your heterosexuality, you don't need a pride week.
I have a weak pride. Does that count?

It's a valid question. In some cases, yes, in many cases, no. And in some cases where one does record next of kin, or has a living will, courts will still rule in favor of the family, overturning both if there is no marriage license.

And the question YOUR question brings up is "why should homosexuals have to go through the extra effort and legal hassles that heterosexuals do not?"
Maybe its just me but I cannot bring myself to even begin to understand certain things.Homophobia and racism are top of the list.On homophobia, I cannot see how anybody can even begin to think that they can legislate for an emotion like love.I can't and wont accept that idea.One of the people I most admire is a man called David Norris who brought this issue to the forefront in a very catholic Ireland.

How? I never saw a Straight Pride Parade. Hell I would LOVE to see a Straight Pride Parade.

Nobody's stopping you from organising one. I would imagine that the only people you would manage to recruit on a serious level would be homophobes and religious folks, though.

As has been mentioned, however, heterosexuals have never been oppressed, heterosexuality isn't considered 'shameful', heterosexuals generally don't get beaten up on the streets for fancying members of the opposite sex (well, it depends on who they fancy and what they've done with them, but that's not really the same thing...), and heterosexuals generally don't get important politicians like the President of the United States of America trying to amend certain documents to restrict their rights. When these things are no longer happening to them, I would imagine that the need for homosexual pride festivities would dwindle. Heterosexuals generally only suggest the need for a heterosexual pride event because homosexuals get one. That isn't really a good enough reason to convince many people.

It is sad and scary here to listen to the people who violently oppose homosexual marriage, equality, and homosexuality itself. And to see violence against homosexuals, i.e. Matthew Sheppard.

It is painful when our president advocates putting into effect laws that will absolutely prevent people who love each other from ever enjoying marriage. It is awful when individual states find ways to restrict homosexual relationships to the fringes.

But in some ways, as in other parts of the world, things are getting better. Some states have passed legislation permitting either gay marriage or civil unions (not as good, but a start). In large part, this is due to the education of the public to the issues, and one of the ways that happens is through gay pride events.

It is sad and scary here to listen to the people who violently oppose homosexual marriage, equality, and homosexuality itself. And to see violence against homosexuals, i.e. Matthew Sheppard.

It is painful when our president advocates putting into effect laws that will absolutely prevent people who love each other from ever enjoying marriage. It is awful when individual states find ways to restrict homosexual relationships to the fringes.

But in some ways, as in other parts of the world, things are getting better. Some states have passed legislation permitting either gay marriage or civil unions (not as good, but a start). In large part, this is due to the education of the public to the issues, and one of the ways that happens is through gay pride events.

I just found an article which you may find intresting.It seems to suggest that homophobia is not a phobia(ie. an irrational fear) but more of a higher functioning issue kinda like racism..link below
http://psychology.ucdavis.edu/rainbow/html/prej_defn.html

Interesting article.

Yes, phobia does denote an irrational fear, one that other prejudices like racism do not have. The term "sexual prejudice" does seem much more accurate a description.

And as with any prejudice, education is key to overcoming it.

Hey, if it's your last best hope to claim "more equal than other's" status and the benefits that are derived from it, they gotta take a shot. I mean hell, look at all the goodies you get if you hit the minority jackpot. Welfare, protected class status, free health care, affirmative action benefits, extra points for federal jobs, discrimination lawsuits, maybe even a free night in Barney Franks basement with a get out of jail free card!

"Benefits" and "goodies"? Please.

The only thing on your list even remotely pertaining to homosexuality are discrimination lawsuits. Yeah, gay people who get harrassed for their sexual orientation are clearly just in it for the fancy discrimination lawsuits they can then file. Yay!

Interesting article.

Yes, phobia does denote an irrational fear, one that other prejudices like racism do not have. The term "sexual prejudice" does seem much more accurate a description.

And as with any prejudice, education is key to overcoming it.
Maybe if homophobia was classified as a prejudice there would be alot less tolerance of it.Holding a prejudice is a lot less palatable than a phobia.If I were to say that I hate all black people I would be castigated, maybe we should start holding homophobia in the same light.

That's a bit of a cop-out. I get all the reaction-to-past/present-inequality stuff, and I agree that celebrating sexuality that isn't utterly mainstream is nice. But in essence, I don't think being gay is anything to take pride in - I mean, it isn't like you did anything laudable to attain homosexual status.Then you're just not thinking hard enough are you. The pride is in facing up to society's contempt, bigotry, ignorance, hostility. The pride is coming to terms with your sexuality within a largely homophobic environment, which can include family, friends, school, university/college, the workplace and the wider community.

When your a confused teenager, trying to come to terms with an understanding of your sexuality, who can you turn to? Your Dad!, your mum, siblings, friends? No, generally you're alone and isolated. It's a wonder that most Gay people end up being sound and decent people, I personally think thats plenty enough reasons to be proud of your Gayness, it's so much a fundemental part of who you are.

Let me ask the heteros this, when you see a hetero couploe walking hand in hand down the street, you might think "Ahh that's sweet", but when you see a gay couple doing likewise, be honest, what is your reaction then?

To be a sorted gay person today, is definitely something to take pride in, ther's no heterosexual equivilant, so therefore no need to feel pride in heterosexuality, just pride in being a (hopefully) decent and sorted person.

It isn't "comfort with heterosexuality." That isn't the problem. The problem is the constant assumption that people are heterosexual and that that is the "normal" way to behave.



Not arguing about the "normal" way to behave being wrong, but it is my experience that people tend to assume that others are like them, until they learn different. For instance, my straight friends all assumed correctly that I was indeed straight. My gay friends, especially when I went out in a group with them, tended to assume I was also gay, until they realised I was perving on boys. There is absolutely nothing wrong about either assumption. It is when we discriminate against people who are different to us, based on that assumption.

What, the one called "society" and that goes on 24/7/365 isn't enough for you?

You know, normally I would call bullshit on this, but strangely enough, I would have to agree. Society sucks if you're handicapped or is physically diffrent too.

Why? Your desire for a straight pride parade is obviously a reaction to gay pride. Its not something you've ever had to think about except in the context of they-got-one-I-want-one.

Eh, I figured that if the homosexuals and lesbians get to celebrate their sexuality, then why should hetrosexuals be denied the same freedom?


Gay pride is about self-respect, about not being ashamed when people tell you you should be. It's about celebrating diversity and individuality, and about civil rights.

and at the same time shoving homosexuality down the throats of the population and making a very uncomfortable situation for those who don't really give a damn what you do in the bedroom, they're just trying to get to work and the parade route is in their way.


What would your straight pride event be about?


Actually, it'll probably turn into an event for straight people to grope each other in public and not get in trouble for it. Fun is still had by all.


Why do you want one? Is it just cause our stuff makes you feel alienated? Guess what, gays feel that way all the time. Do you see something you can't be part of and that makes you want to do something self-agrandizing to reafirm your own importance?

Like I said, if the homosexual and lesbian community get to have a "pride" parade, I don't see why the straight should be denied a "pride" parade.


How proud does that make you feel?

Eh, indiffrence, but fun will still be had by all!

You know, normally I would call bullshit on this, but strangely enough, I would have to agree. Society sucks if you're handicapped or is physically diffrent too.

As a physically disabled person I agree comletly. As to the point of getting 'the welfare jackpot, sure, I live in a wheelchair 24/7, without a social life or anything, with a medical condition, JUST so I get less per month then the minimum wage in Australia. And the disabled have no political voice, get little or no funding, and cant afford lawsuits about discrimination. Wow, what a jackpot!

As a physically disabled person I agree comletly. As to the point of getting 'the welfare jackpot, sure, I live in a wheelchair 24/7, without a social life or anything, with a medical condition, JUST so I get less per month then the minimum wage in Australia. And the disabled have no political voice, get little or no funding, and cant afford lawsuits about discrimination. Wow, what a jackpot!

Eh it's no better in America. Society apparently can only treat you two ways here. They can either put you on a silver platter and say "See, he can do it and blah blah blah." or they're wayy too emphatic "Awww he's handicapped." Hey, here's a crazy idea, how about treating us as FUCKING HUMAN BEINGS!

Yellow.

Yellow.

Homer Simpson.

Eh, I figured that if the homosexuals and lesbians get to celebrate their sexuality, then why should hetrosexuals be denied the same freedom?



and at the same time shoving homosexuality down the throats of the population and making a very uncomfortable situation for those who don't really give a damn what you do in the bedroom, they're just trying to get to work and the parade route is in their way.



Actually, it'll probably turn into an event for straight people to grope each other in public and not get in trouble for it. Fun is still had by all.



Like I said, if the homosexual and lesbian community get to have a "pride" parade, I don't see why the straight should be denied a "pride" parade.



Eh, indiffrence, but fun will still be had by all!
If anyone is denying you the right to have a straight pride parade it would be the local governments. For stupid reasons like "political correctness".. idiots..

And you can hardly argue that you're having their sexuality forced down you throat when they recievethe same every day of the year..

But in essence, I don't think being gay is anything to take pride in - I mean, it isn't like you did anything laudable to attain homosexual status.
Nah, it isn't.
I'd say it is more about being proud of openly being oneself despite the way a large part of society still reacts today, proud of having achieved so much in the struggle for equal rights, proud of every achievement in your very own personal struggle for and with acceptance.

More often than not, being an out, open non-heterosexual at peace with oneself is preceeded by a damn lot of work and pain, and having made it through that is what we're proud of. And what we're celebrating.

Society sucks if you're handicapped or is physically diffrent too.
Yeah. Too bad people tend to only see other people's rights and stances only when suddenly they are concerned too.
No hard feelings though, I'm glad you said that.

And yes, there is a parallel. And no, we don't get to be proud for being handicapped/physically different/whatever, as the very fewest of us chose it. But we get to be proud of still making it so often, of doing things others thought we weren't capable of, of finding new ways to manage, of not being ashamed, of establishing ourselves as regular members of society as much as we can.
Thinking about how not a hundred years ago, visibly disabled kids were often locked away in their homes for the shame of it all, that's a long way to have gone. A way to be proud of. And yet still quite a way to go to be truly comfortable. And all of those are reasons why we do have handicapped pride rallies/parades as well, legitimately so.

If anyone is denying you the right to have a straight pride parade it would be the local governments. For stupid reasons like "political correctness".. idiots..

Heh, I'm gay and all for straight pride parade. Whatever floats your boat.

About the "shoving homosexuality down everyone's throat" thing, you straight should realise that you're shoving heterosexuality down our collective throats the other 364 days of the year. Yet we're not complaining. So bear with us for gay pride day, alright? I don't think it's asking too much.

Technically, we should be shoving our gayness down your throats (boy did THAT sound kinky) 36.5 days a year(seeing as we represent roughly 10% pop.), anyway, and we're only taking one. Not a bad deal for you guys.

And yet still quite a way to go to be truly comfortable. And all of those are reasons why we do have handicapped pride rallies/parades as well, legitimately so.

Wait, we have Handicapps Pride Parades? When did this happen??

Well, it's Pride week at my uni. As I was breaking out the rainbow gear, I realized that the whole concept of "Pride" was a bit silly. Sexuality is something we're born with -it's an essential part of who we are. Everyone. But is it anything to be poud of? I don't think so.

Things like Pride week, phrases like "the gay community", and raunchy carnival floats only serve to compartmentalize people when in fact the reality is much more nuanced, and less exciting. After all, gay people are as diverse a bunch as any other arbitrary group.

Ah well. It's an exuse to party while bringing attention to a group that has been, and still is marginalized at times, in a [positive and inclusive way. Just the title of the event struck me as strange for the first time.The reason we don't have straight weeks is because it's never been socially wrong to be straight while it has been and still is socially disliked to be homosexual in some places. Gay pride is a way of giving those that are different the self esteem necessary to understand that they aren't doing something wrong.

Wait, we have Handicapps Pride Parades? When did this happen??
*makes use of the new&shiny quote button*
Sure do. That happened..umm..ever since handicapped people crawled out of the closet as well?
Contact your local wheelchair dealer for info. Or just make use of the net.

Oh, and they are quite some more of a sight than the Gay Pride ones. Quite more diverse, too. Get your fix ASAP.

Heres the question I want to get out there. Are we doing more good or more harm by setting aside an entire week, or a day, or how long of a length of time for a specific group of people? I mean by setting aside a week for "pride", aren't we still seperating the homosexuals from the rest of the population? I mean aren't we still saying "Hey look, they're gay, and it's ok that they're gay, in fact, it's so ok that we're going to dedicate a week to just celebrate just how ok it is to be gay." Personally I think the whole setting aside a week, or how long of a length of time is counter productive to what the gay community want to achieve, which is acceptance, equal rights, and to be treated as normal human beings.

"Shoving sexuality down your throats"


Crikey!

Heres the question I want to get out there. Are we doing more good or more harm by setting aside an entire week, or a day, or how long of a length of time for a specific group of people? I mean by setting aside a week for "pride", aren't we still seperating the homosexuals from the rest of the population?
PR is your friend..

No, seriously, I don't think there's any of the harm you describe.
These hours/days/weeks are not trying to make the point that homosexuality is something different, something "apart", and they are in no way exclusive. You may want to attend such an event one day to see just how inclusive they ae.

It really is but an awareness-raising thing. Let's try to compare it to..uh, let's say the Environment Isuuses Awareness Week we had the other month. It wasn't about saying those environmental issues were different than other important issues, it wasn't about making them stand out as a seperate group, it was just to say "look, those are there too, and we need to include environmental reasoning in our future decisions as well as all the otehr stuff, as it's one of the many aspects of every issue". Okay, [/ bad wannabe-analogy].

Heres the question I want to get out there. Are we doing more good or more harm by setting aside an entire week, or a day, or how long of a length of time for a specific group of people? I mean by setting aside a week for "pride", aren't we still seperating the homosexuals from the rest of the population? I mean aren't we still saying "Hey look, they're gay, and it's ok that they're gay, in fact, it's so ok that we're going to dedicate a week to just celebrate just how ok it is to be gay." Personally I think the whole setting aside a week, or how long of a length of time is counter productive to what the gay community want to achieve, which is acceptance, equal rights, and to be treated as normal human beings.
Don't ask me. I live my sexuality openly and honesty all year long, and I certainly don't stop myself from smooching my boyfriend or holding his hand in public the other 51 weeks of the year.

When I have one, that is.

At any rate, I think my way of doing things has more impact, specifically because it's NOT one big-ass parade for a day then let it die for the rest of year. People sometimes get surprised at seeing me living my life normally like my different sexuality didn't matter at all. Well, newsflash: it doesn't.

Don't ask me. I live my sexuality openly and honesty all year long, and I certainly don't stop myself from smooching my boyfriend or holding his hand in public the other 51 weeks of the year.

When I have one, that is.

At any rate, I think my way of doing things has more impact, specifically because it's NOT one big-ass parade for a day then let it die for the rest of year. People sometimes get surprised at seeing me living my life normally like my different sexuality didn't matter at all. Well, newsflash: it doesn't.

I have no problem with gay couples holding hands or kissing. I mean if straight people like me get to do it, then of course the gay couples should have the same right. Look, I understand that the goal is equal rights, to be accepted as normal human beings and treated as such. I have no problem with those goals. In fact I support those goals. What I have a problem with is how the goals are achieved. To me they just sound counter productive.

Just a thought here, but doesn't the whole parade thing segregate the gay community further, completely unintentionaly but it marks gays out as being different from the rest of society, whereas I see them as no different from other people. I'm not saying you should not be proud, I'm saying you shouldn't need to be proud.

I have no problem with gay couples holding hands or kissing. I mean if straight people like me get to do it, then of course the gay couples should have the same right. Look, I understand that the goal is equal rights, to be accepted as normal human beings and treated as such. I have no problem with those goals. In fact I support those goals. What I have a problem with is how the goals are achieved. To me they just sound counter productive.

Still, just because we're gay doesn't mean we shouldn't have the right to party just because it might "reflect badly" on us. The pride parades are mostly big parties, and not really about equals right anymore. We took the equal rights fight elsewhere, but the parades stayed, as a reminder that we owe our civil rights to a bunch of Drag Queens and Queers in Stonewall bar who stood up against police raids in 1969.

Just a thought here, but doesn't the whole parade thing segregate the gay community further, completely unintentionaly but it marks gays out as being different from the rest of society, whereas I see them as no different from other people. I'm not saying you should not be proud, I'm saying you shouldn't need to be proud.

I already find it to be bad manners not to read a thread completely before responding, but I have come around to accept that most people will only bother to read so much.
It is downright rude to basically repeat the exact post that has been made, what, 5 comments earlier, and that has been discussed up to your very post.


And I even agree that we shouldn't need to be proud, but things being the way they are, it looks like sometimes we need a healthy dose of pride to keep us going when so often so many more things than just this pride thing are denied to us.
As log as there's subjugation, there'll be pride as protectional reaction.

Just a thought here, but doesn't the whole parade thing segregate the gay community further, completely unintentionaly but it marks gays out as being different from the rest of society, whereas I see them as no different from other people. I'm not saying you should not be proud, I'm saying you shouldn't need to be proud.My best friend is gay, and he hates Gay Pride parades for precisely this reason. The way he sees it is that his homosexuality is only part of who he is, not everything about him. Thus he sees no reason to make a big deal out of it, and feels like the drawing of attention to homosexuality by such parades only serves to make gay people seem very different to the rest of society.

I certainly see, and to a large extent agree, with his point. On the other hand, though, I wonder what would happen if we didn't have gay people (or any other marginalised group) standing up and saying "we're gay, we're not ashamed, we're doing nothing wrong and therefore demand as much rights and recognition as the rest of you"? Those who have campaigned for gay rights by drawing attention to it have perhaps secured rights and acceptance for gay people that they may otherwise not have had. In initially drawing attention to the group, as it becomes more and more accepted, I would hope that a time will come where we don't need such demonstrations, and a gay or lesbian couple could walk down the street hand-in-hand without being raising eyebrows.

This has probably been mentioned before, but I'll say it anyway.

I don't think it's really about being proud to be gay, but rather refusing to be ashamed. Alot of people expect gays to be ashamed of their sexuality.

*snip* Alot of people expect gays to be ashamed of their sexuality.

They're losing their time with me and Fass.

Obviously.

The reason Gay pride weeks exist is pretty straightforward:

When people are demonized the way gays tend to be, they need every ounce of help they can get. Not being intimidated by bible/koran/torah-thumpers is definitely not easy, and such courage deserves reward.

this courage deserves a reward ? because your standing up to arguablly represeive elements of religon.. man there should be alot more pride days then. Religion represses a lot of groups

this courage deserves a reward ? because your standing up to arguablly represeive elements of religon.. man there should be alot more pride days then. Religion represses a lot of groups
Good point. It's not like we're discouraging anyone about having their own pride parades, you know.

But we all know no straight parade could ever hope to be as flamboyant =D