NationStates Jolt Archive

For those who don't know what "yobs" are, here's a link to a google news search, and two of the articles it found:

http://news.google.co.uk/news?hl=en&ned=uk&q=yob&btnG=Search+News
http://www.sunderlandtoday.co.uk/ViewArticle2.aspx?SectionID=1107&ArticleID=1348909
http://www.manchesteronline.co.uk/men/news/s/203/203174_drunk_yob_attacked_fire_heroes.html

Poll coming

Legalize private ownership of guns and allow people to shoot in self defense.

For those who don't know what "yobs" are, here's a link to a google news search, and two of the articles it found:

http://news.google.co.uk/news?hl=en&ned=uk&q=yob&btnG=Search+News
http://www.sunderlandtoday.co.uk/ViewArticle2.aspx?SectionID=1107&ArticleID=1348909
http://www.manchesteronline.co.uk/men/news/s/203/203174_drunk_yob_attacked_fire_heroes.html

Poll coming

I'm sorry to be obtuse, but is a "yob" simply a juvenile offender?

Legalize private ownership of guns and allow people to shoot in self defense.

I think the yobs would just steal their parents' guns and make the problem worse.

Legalize private ownership of guns and allow people to shoot in self defense.

already generally the case in the US. must be why we have no juvenile crime.

I think the yobs would just steal their parents' guns and make the problem worse.
Then just give them jobs. It'll keep them off the streets for eight hours each day.

New program: Jobs for Yobs.

I'm sorry to be obtuse, but is a "yob" simply a juvenile offender?

Yes. Human vermin of British streets.

already generally the case in the US. must be why we have no juvenile crime.
Exactly.

Hunt 'em down, and some chavs too while we're at it.

Hunt 'em down, and some chavs too while we're at it.

Yobs are chavs, but it's probably fair to say that not all chavs are yobs.

This will be fun. Double mandatory prison sentences, crippling fines and conscription to munitions productions for serious degenerate behaviour, smaller fines for less deplorable behaviour.

I'm not going to read your links. I already know a yob is simply yiddish corn. And I don't think we need to do anything about it.

Did a web search on Yob and found this... Yet another Test (http://www.guardian.co.uk/quiz/questions/0,5961,408093,00.html).

This will be fun. Double mandatory prison sentences, crippling fines and conscription to munitions productions for serious degenerate behaviour, smaller fines for less deplorable behaviour.

So if you commit a crime as a juvenile you should get a mandatory prison sentence of double what you would get if you committed the same crime as an adult?

Or are you just for doubling all sentences and making all sentences mandatory?

I'm not going to read your links. I already know a yob is simply yiddish corn. And I don't think we need to do anything about it.

*so tempting to insult sense of humour... must resist... *

So if you commit a crime as a juvenile you should get a mandatory prison sentence of double what you would get if you committed the same crime as an adult?

Or are you just for doubling all sentences and making all sentences mandatory?

The latter.

*so tempting to insult sense of humour... must resist... *
I don't know what you're on about. I'm bloody serious. Leave the yiddish corn alone. Racists.

I think some kind of CCC program. Ship them off to the wilds: hard work, fresh air, good diet. Teach some self-discipline and self-respect. Optional trade training.

A paycheck and learning a useful skill in safe discplined environment could do wonders for probably 90% of them. Of course, there are always going to be an incorrigible minority (at all class levels) but that's what prison is for.

All this talk about harsh jail sentences is silly.

Yo, mang. I gots tree yobs! My cousino gots me a yob after two day here in gringo land, mang. Home I gots no yobs.

Another relevant google news page:
http://news.google.co.uk/news?hl=en&ned=uk&q=happy+slap&btnG=Search+News

And an article:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/main.jhtml?xml=/news/2006/01/24/nslap124.xml&sSheet=/news/2006/01/24/ixnewstop.html

Yo, mang. I gots tree yobs! My cousino gots me a yob after two day here in gringo land, mang. Home I gots no yobs.
¿Suegro? Is that you?

Did a web search on Yob and found this... Yet another Test (http://www.guardian.co.uk/quiz/questions/0,5961,408093,00.html).

Heh. I recommend others read this - you don't have to answer the questions, just reading them gets the point across.

¿Suegro? Is that you?
No. :(

Sorry. :(

I was watching Mind of Mencia. :(

No. :(

Sorry. :(

I was watching Mind of Mencia. :(
http://www.comedycentral.com/shows/mind_of_mencia/index.jhtml
Click English the Mencia Way.

http://www.comedycentral.com/shows/mind_of_mencia/index.jhtml
Click English the Mencia Way.
ha! That's exactly the skit I was thinking of when I wrote that. :p

I think we should give them a mandatory "community service" type job with a mandatory number of hours, and make the parent and child responsible for getting the child there. The job must me no fun, like running a jackhammer, or carrying steel, or doing some other very difficult job. If the kid does not show up, the parent and the kid goes to jail for a short time until they work out how the kid is going to get to the job. The kid must attend the entire "sentence". No shortcuts.

Make parents scared NOT to raise their kids up right

Yobs are chavs, but it's probably fair to say that not all chavs are yobs.

sorry, but that sounds like some kind of mind question on standardized testing!
:D

all piks are yobs, yobs are chavs, but not all chavs are yobs.
is a pik a yob?
A: yes
B: probably
C: no
D: all of the above

I think we should give them a mandatory "community service" type job with a mandatory number of hours, and make the parent and child responsible for getting the child there. The job must me no fun, like running a jackhammer, or carrying steel, or doing some other very difficult job. If the kid does not show up, the parent and the kid goes to jail for a short time until they work out how the kid is going to get to the job. The kid must attend the entire "sentence". No shortcuts.

Make parents scared NOT to raise their kids up right
Running a jackhammer is kinda fun. I've done it a few times. Breaking shit is always fun.

I wonder if much like the "predator youth" or "super-predator" stories of the 90s in the US that this is just media-hyped hysteria.

sorry, but that sounds like some kind of mind question on standardized testing!
:D

all piks are yobs, yobs are chavs, but not all chavs are yobs.
is a pik a yob?
A: yes
B: probably
C: no
D: all of the above

pik? you mean pikey (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=pikey)?

I wonder if much like the "predator youth" or "super-predator" stories of the 90s in the US that this is just media-hyped hysteria.

I'm not hysterical at all. I just want people to be able to walk the streets safely.

I've got to attend trial as a witness soon since I was a victim of an attack by yobs. I actually got given a say in what the punishment would be if they were found guilty, and I said he should get a lot of community service.

I think prison is mostly a waste of time and money - I agree with Schnausages, they should be given humiliating and strict community service. Stuff like picking up litter or generally any task which is actually paying society back for their crimes, rather than the tax payer having to spend a load of money catering for them in prison.

Maybe if the police actually did something to discourage them from committing crimes.

http://www.thefirstpost.co.uk/index.php?menuID=1&subID=281

Last week I met a young mother who'd been threatened by a 10-year-old boy wielding a so-called 'BB gun', a pistol that fires ball-bearings. He was wandering along the pavement, firing it at passing cars when she accosted him. He screamed at her and aimed the weapon - capable of killing at close range, certainly of blinding - at the six-month-old baby she was carrying in her arms. In the heat of the moment, she grabbed the gun from him.

"Three days after reporting it, the police called me and said: 'Sorry, but we can't do anything about it'," she told me. "When I asked why, they said: 'Well, it's your word against his.' "

Maybe if the police actually did something to discourage them from committing crimes.

http://www.thefirstpost.co.uk/index.php?menuID=1&subID=281

Last week I met a young mother who'd been threatened by a 10-year-old boy wielding a so-called 'BB gun', a pistol that fires ball-bearings. He was wandering along the pavement, firing it at passing cars when she accosted him. He screamed at her and aimed the weapon - capable of killing at close range, certainly of blinding - at the six-month-old baby she was carrying in her arms. In the heat of the moment, she grabbed the gun from him.

"Three days after reporting it, the police called me and said: 'Sorry, but we can't do anything about it'," she told me. "When I asked why, they said: 'Well, it's your word against his.' "
She should have bashed him upside the head with the BB gun. I wouldn't take pointing any kind of weapon at a six month old baby lightly.

Good idea to grab the gun. I would (not thinking rationally) probably have grabbed his throat too. Of course, I would be the one punished, but I wouldnt be thinking rationally if someone screamed at me and pointed a gun.

She should have bashed him upside the head with the BB gun. I wouldn't take pointing any kind of weapon at a six month old baby lightly.

With everything I've been reading about the prosecutors over there, she would have been arrested and convicted.

There was a teacher that fired a BB gun at the ground when some yobs were harassing her and vandalizing her property. She was convicted.

I'm not hysterical at all. I just want people to be able to walk the streets safely.

That is what I mean by hysteria.

The UK has relatively low crime rates and your crime rates are going down.

With everything I've been reading about the prosecutors over there, she would have been arrested and convicted.

There was a teacher that fired a BB gun at the ground when some yobs were harassing her and vandalizing her property. She was convicted.
Well maybe that's your problem right there.

That is what I mean by hysteria.

The UK has relatively low crime rates and your crime rates are going down.

1. This is what the dictionary means by hysteria:

hysteria

Behavior exhibiting excessive or uncontrollable emotion, such as fear or panic.

2.
Somehow, I don't think "the UK has relatively low crime rates" will do much to comfort people who've been assaulted by yobs, or the families of people who've been killed by yobs.

With everything I've been reading about the prosecutors over there, she would have been arrested and convicted.

There was a teacher that fired a BB gun at the ground when some yobs were harassing her and vandalizing her property. She was convicted.

Again, contrary to the anecdotal evidence, Cornwall is one of the safest counties in the UK and the District of North Cornwall enjoys a low overall crime rate compared to the rest of the county.

http://www.cornwall.gov.uk/index.cfm?articleid=8769

That is what I mean by hysteria.

The UK has relatively low crime rates and your crime rates are going down.

True - you never hear the good news about crime, only the bad news. Like when the crime figures were published a year ago - all crime but violent had decreased significantly on official police statistics, and on victim survey results even that had decreased. But the next day the headlines were "Violent crime on the increase!" because it had risen by like 2%.

1. This is what the dictionary means by hysteria:



2.
Somehow, I don't think "the UK has relatively low crime rates" will do much to comfort people who've been assaulted by yobs, or the families of people who've been killed by yobs.

Of course not.

But running around yelling "the yobs are coming! head for the hills!" isn't helpful either.

The truth is different from the popular fiction. That does not mean there are no victims of crime. It does mean crime is low in the UK and is going down. Yob stories are press sensationalism, just as the US "super-predator" stories were.

EDIT: we are agreed on the meaning of hysteria. There is nothing the press loves more than fear and panic.

That is what I mean by hysteria.

The UK has relatively low crime rates and your crime rates are going down.

Do you have any recent figures?

The reports I've read had overall down 6% but violent up 7%. for 2005 after a 12% jump in VC in 2004.

pik? you mean pikey (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=pikey)?

thats weird. i have no idea wtf that is. i live in the u.s. and randomized piks.


eery.

Do you have any recent figures?

The reports I've read had overall down 6% but violent up 7%. for 2005 after a 12% jump in VC in 2004.


http://www.crimereduction.gov.uk/statistics40.htm

Crime overall is down. Violent crime is down. Recorded crime is slightly up, due to changes in the system of recording.

But running around yelling "the yobs are coming! head for the hills!" isn't helpful either.
I'm not asking anyone to head for the hills. Personally, I think the problem is parents not bringing their children up properly.

http://www.sunderlandtoday.co.uk/ViewArticle2.aspx?SectionID=1107&ArticleID=1348909
I have a suggestion about this one who attacked a 71 year old man. I'll make myself a decoy by looking a bit dishevelled and walking with a cane. When he ( or another one ) attacks me, I'll beat the shit out of hm. Then you can publish an account of it and laugh at him for allowing himself to be beat up by an old man. :D

The risk of becoming a victim of crime has fallen from 40% in 1995 to 24% according to BCS interviews in 2004/05, representing almost six million fewer victims. This is the lowest level recorded since the BCS began in 1981.

Wait, am I reading this right? I'm assuming those figures mean that the average person has a 24% chance of being victim to crime in a year (it doesn't specify period of time, but it says it is published annually).

So, if I live to 80, say, I will "only" be a victim of crime 20 times? How comforting.

I have a suggestion about this one who attacked a 71 year old man. I'll make myself a decoy by looking a bit dishevelled and walking with a cane. When he ( or another one ) attacks me, I'll beat the shit out of hm. Then you can publish an account of it and laugh at him for allowing himself to be beat up by an old man. :D

Ha! That would be great. Just to add salt to the wound, so to speak, we could also prove that Smunkeeville's kids are more intelligent than him.

http://www.crimereduction.gov.uk/statistics40.htm

Crime overall is down. Violent crime is down. Recorded crime is slightly up, due to changes in the system of recording.


The RC change occured in '96 I believe. It was supposed to make it more accurate. " The shadow home secretary, David Davis, said the BCS did not record "various categories of violent crime", including murder and rape, retail crime, drug-taking, or offences in which the victims were aged below 16."

http://www.mail-archive.com/firearmsregprof@lists.ucla.edu/msg00424.html

I would trust more in crime reports ( similar to the FBI UCR) rather than a survey. If we went w/ those, according to the UN, the UK is more violent than almost anywhere in the US.

It would be nice though if they could get a uniform system together for an accurate measurement.

Edit: It occured in '03. It started recording an increase in '96. So even before the change, it had it increasing .

I guess they like confusing people, here are five headlines from a 1 yr period.

Related to this story:
Force hails fall in violent crime (11 Jun 03 | Scotland )
Violent crime on the rise (28 May 03 | Scotland )
Texting blamed for crime rise (16 Apr 03 | Scotland )
Scottish gun crime 'soaring' (07 Nov 02 | Scotland )
Lower crime rate fails to dispel fear (21 Oct 02 | Scotland )
Police clear-up rate rises (24 Apr 02 | Scotland )

The RC change occured in '96 I believe. It was supposed to make it more accurate. " The shadow home secretary, David Davis, said the BCS did not record "various categories of violent crime", including murder and rape, retail crime, drug-taking, or offences in which the victims were aged below 16."

http://www.mail-archive.com/firearmsregprof@lists.ucla.edu/msg00424.html

I would trust more in crime reports ( similar to the FBI UCR) rather than a survey. If we went w/ those, according to the UN, the UK is more violent than almost anywhere in the US.

It would be nice though if they could get a uniform system together for an accurate measurement.

Edit: It occured in '03. It started recording an increase in '96. So even before the change, it had it increasing .

I guess they like confusing people, here are five headlines from a 1 yr period.

Related to this story:
Force hails fall in violent crime (11 Jun 03 | Scotland )
Violent crime on the rise (28 May 03 | Scotland )
Texting blamed for crime rise (16 Apr 03 | Scotland )
Scottish gun crime 'soaring' (07 Nov 02 | Scotland )
Lower crime rate fails to dispel fear (21 Oct 02 | Scotland )
Police clear-up rate rises (24 Apr 02 | Scotland )

FYI, the US also tracks both recorded crimes and crime surveys and relies on the combination for crime rate statistics.

It sometimes causes confusion, but not as much as the change that the UK made in the way it records crime.

FYI, the US also tracks both recorded crimes and crime surveys and relies on the combination for crime rate statistics.

It sometimes causes confusion, but not as much as the change that the UK made in the way it records crime.

You're right. I forgot about the NCVS. I've always seen the UCR as the primary indicator in reports.


I think I found the difference though:

http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/cius_04/appendices/appendix_04.html

"As much as their different collection methods permit, the two measure the same subset of serious crimes, defined alike. Both programs cover rape, robbery, aggravated assault, burglary, theft, and motor vehicle theft. Rape, robbery, theft, and motor vehicle theft are defined virtually identically by both the UCR and the NCVS."


Whereas apparently the BCS and RC use different definitions.

The change in the RC would affect the ROC for the comparison of that year to the previous. It shouldn't affect the ROC for the following years though.

I went to fark.com just now, hoping for an amusing read. What was the top headline?

Yobs kill dad for egg gag (http://www.thesun.co.uk/article/0,,2-2006070450,00.html).

The guy was pretty stupid, bringing it upon himself like that, but that doesn't excuse murder.

Yobs are chavs, but it's probably fair to say that not all chavs are yobs.
sounds like one of those god-awful IQ test questions...

Incidently, I don't like the way people characterise all yobs as 'bloody filthy commoners'. In my experience, the middle class wanna-be chavs are far worse because they feel they have something to prove and aren't actually tough enough to get in fights amongst themselves, so pick on lone people. Working class chavs tend to keep to themselves more and aren't as arrogant.

I'm always amazed at how many chavs there are in my very affluent home town and the surrounding area in the Midlands, which is all pretty rich. I feel far far safer in Yorkshire, which according to the "poor = scum" thesis should be rife with yobs. I very rarely see any chavs and never seen any harrasing passers by, which i've seen in the south. I think it's just overall people have more respect for one another.