NationStates Jolt Archive

For about the millionth time, I was watching a movie where the female lead was semi-hysterical about something. Later she was pointing a gun at one of the villians, who was advancing on her, and obviously would not have fired.

Why do most movies portray women in this way? I find it highly irritating. I've known some women who would rather die than become hysterical, and who would have no hesitation whatsoever to blow your sorry ass away should it become necessary. And I've known a few men who become hysterical at the sight of either blood or a gun! Is it just stereotyping, or what?

Yeah, I think it's stereotyping, and it's probably related to the fact that men still dominate Hollywood. Men are overwhelmingly in charge--they hold the top positions in the studios, make up the majority of the producers and directors and people who greenlight films, and I'd be willing to bet that they're more likely to do films that fit the strong male, weak female stereotype.

Go watch Alien (and sequels). I'm pretty sure those movies have chick that blows numerous sorry asses away (black, scaly, scary asses).

Guys like watching hysterical women. Movies like selling. Neither has much of a history of caring about realism.

Go watch Alien (and sequels). I'm pretty sure those movies have chick that blows numerous sorry asses away (black, scaly, scary asses).
There are films with strong female leads, no question, but they're hardly the majority, which is the point I think Eutrusca is making.

Guys like watching hysterical women.

I don't. I find watching hysterical people very irritating, regardless of gender. When it's the "high pitched shouting/screaming" kind of hysterical it's event worse.

If you want to watch semi-hysterical men, then watch comedies.

Welll, in horror films and action movies, they do show some hysterical men...but they're usually the first killed/tortured/eaten.

Actually, women can be seen to be stronger, in a way, than men. Women can and do overcome hysteria in serious films and then proceed to do what needs to get done.

A hysterical man is either dead or someone's bitch for the rest of the film. A hysteria attack (unless for comic effect,) is almost 100% fatal in the male movie character gig.

Courage is not being unafraid. That's insanity. Courage is being scared shitless and still getting it done.

I don't. I find watching hysterical people very irritating, regardless of gender. When it's the "high pitched shouting/screaming" kind of hysterical it's event worse.

Hear hear! That's the kind of behaviour that makes me want to dress them up as witches, regardless of gender, and burn them anyway!

Yes, BURN THEM ANYWAY!

I think this may be more of a Hollywood thing, as I tend to watch 'foreign' films or independent USian films, and I find this stereotype less prevalent. Mind you, many older foreign films also show this stereotype, so perhaps Hollywood will catch up soon in terms of its portrayals of women.

Yeah, I think it's stereotyping, and it's probably related to the fact that men still dominate Hollywood. Men are overwhelmingly in charge--they hold the top positions in the studios, make up the majority of the producers and directors and people who greenlight films, and I'd be willing to bet that they're more likely to do films that fit the strong male, weak female stereotype.
Hollywierd strikes again! Sigh. :(

women shouldnt even know what a gun is







just kidding;)

Go watch Alien (and sequels). I'm pretty sure those movies have chick that blows numerous sorry asses away (black, scaly, scary asses).
Vasquez in Alien II, I think it was. As her boyfriend said, "You just tooo fuckin' bad!" :D

As of late you could say this observation is in reverse with the strong unbreakable lead going to the female.

Ultraviolet
Aeon Flux
Underworld
Resident Evil
Kill Bill
Electra

There's more but I think the point gets across. Regardless stereotyping is nothing new.

Yeah, I think it's stereotyping, and it's probably related to the fact that men still dominate Hollywood. Men are overwhelmingly in charge--they hold the top positions in the studios, make up the majority of the producers and directors and people who greenlight films, and I'd be willing to bet that they're more likely to do films that fit the strong male, weak female stereotype.

i partly agree with you, especially if we were in the 50s and westerns were still the big thing, but today, it is changing, exhibit a brokeback mountain (http://imdb.com/title/tt0388795/)

if hollywood was still the male dominated the same way it was during the western era, this movie would of never been selected

Guys like watching hysterical women. Movies like selling. Neither has much of a history of caring about realism.
*I* don't! Watching those movies where the female lead is portrayed as perpetually on the verge of hysteria, falls down every time she tries to run, and as totally unable to use a weapon when the situation requires it, makes me wanna dog-slap both the female lead AND the frakking director! :p

what movie were you watching?

Hollywierd strikes again! Sigh. :(
It's the corporate mentality. Remember, it's rarely the creative types--the Hollyweird folks--who actually greenlight movies. If they actually had control, we'd see much more experimental fare, because artists take chances. They'd also lose money hand over fist, I imagine, because they worry more about vision and less about profit.

But if you want to blame someone for the stereotyping and for the derivative dreck that comes out of Hollywood, blame the people with the pocketbooks, because they make the ultimate calls on what gets made, and they like stereotype, because they know it sells enough to make a consistent profit.

As of late you could say this observation is in reverse with the strong unbreakable lead going to the female.

Ultraviolet
Aeon Flux
Underworld
Resident Evil
Kill Bill
Electra

There's more but I think the point gets across. Regardless stereotyping is nothing new.
I know, but the female lead in all of those movies was always drop-dead georgeous. What's up wid dat?

I think that's one reason I liked "Ripley" and "Vasquez" from the Aliens series. They were pretty much the sort of woman you might run into on the street, but they could definitely kick ass! :D

*I* don't! Watching those movies where the female lead is portrayed as perpetually on the verge of hysteria, falls down every time she tries to run, and as totally unable to use a weapon when the situation requires it, makes me wanna dog-slap both the female lead AND the frakking director! :p
Emoutional responce, Eut, it's all about the responce. You're supposed to want to feel sorry for the female and protective so you buy into the film more.

The fact that you want to bitch slap her and I usually end up cheering for the monster to eat her just goes to show we're both outta kilter with the rest of society. ;)

It's the corporate mentality. Remember, it's rarely the creative types--the Hollyweird folks--who actually greenlight movies. If they actually had control, we'd see much more experimental fare, because artists take chances. They'd also lose money hand over fist, I imagine, because they worry more about vision and less about profit.

But if you want to blame someone for the stereotyping and for the derivative dreck that comes out of Hollywood, blame the people with the pocketbooks, because they make the ultimate calls on what gets made, and they like stereotype, because they know it sells enough to make a consistent profit.
Sigh. I know you're right about this. Doesn't mean I gotta like it though. :(

"Derivitive dreck!" LOL! Nice turn of phrase! :D

i partly agree with you, especially if we were in the 50s and westerns were still the big thing, but today, it is changing, exhibit a brokeback mountain (http://imdb.com/title/tt0388795/)

if hollywood was still the male dominated the same way it was during the western era, this movie would of never been selected
That's a bad comparison, and CToaN can tell you why better than I can, but it boils down to this--Brokeback was made for $14 million, which is a pittance in Hollywood money, and until it was nominated for the Oscar, never spent a penny on tv advertising. The makers figured it would break even on dvd sales and art house receipts, maybe turn a small profit. They got lucky and got a blockbuster out of it. Now, if Brokeback had been a major studio release with a $60 million budget and a full court press on the advertising, you'd have a stronger case. I do think the tide is turning, slowly--more women are directing and more female-oriented films with strong leads are being made, but it's still a largely male dominated business.

If we're talking about Alien II quotes:

Wimpy guy: Hey, Vasquez! Anyone ever think you were a guy?
Vasquez: No. Anyone ever think you were a guy?

i'm paraphrasing. it sounds a lot cooler in the movie.

I know, but the female lead in all of those movies was always drop-dead georgeous. What's up wid dat?

I think that's one reason I liked "Ripley" and "Vasquez" from the Aliens series. They were pretty much the sort of woman you might run into on the street, but they could definitely kick ass! :D
I've got to think that the female pilots on the new Battlestar Galactica are modeled on Ripley and Vasquez--Starbuck and Cat especially. They're way more tough than pretty. Neither is ugly, but they're not classically beautiful either.

I know, but the female lead in all of those movies was always drop-dead georgeous. What's up wid dat?

I think that's one reason I liked "Ripley" and "Vasquez" from the Aliens series. They were pretty much the sort of woman you might run into on the street, but they could definitely kick ass! :D

Either way the unstoppable female killing machine is growing very tiresome regardless of looks. The incompotent female clutz is growing tiresome. The pathetic comic relief is growing tiresome. For some reason I feel that we'll still see these stereotypical roles for next century :(

YOu don't know what your talking about, Starbuck is totally hot.

Sigh. I know you're right about this. Doesn't mean I gotta like it though. :(

"Derivitive dreck!" LOL! Nice turn of phrase! :D
I don't like it either. That's probably a big part of the reason why I've been watching more documentaries lately.

If we're talking about Alien II quotes:

Wimpy guy: Hey, Vasquez! Anyone ever think you were a guy?
Vasquez: No. Anyone ever think you were a guy?

i'm paraphrasing. it sounds a lot cooler in the movie.

I believe the exact words were (I might be wrong, but I have a good memory for this kind of thing):

Guy: Hey, Vasquez, anyone ever mistake you for a man?
Vasquez: No. You?

Emoutional responce, Eut, it's all about the responce. You're supposed to want to feel sorry for the female and protective so you buy into the film more.

The fact that you want to bitch slap her and I usually end up cheering for the monster to eat her just goes to show we're both outta kilter with the rest of society. ;)
Heh! Whew! Thank goodness! For a moment there, I thought I'd lost my grip. :D

I've got to think that the female pilots on the new Battlestar Galactica are modeled on Ripley and Vasquez--Starbuck and Cat especially. They're way more tough than pretty. Neither is ugly, but they're not classically beautiful either.
Classical beauty is vastly overrated, IMHO. I love women who give as good as they get. :D

Classical beauty is vastly overrated, IMHO. I love women who give as good as they get. :D
So do I. I personally think Starbuck is not just hot, she's hawt! but she's not classically beautiful in that Grace Kelly way. Different type of attraction.

So do I. I personally think Starbuck is not just hot, she's hawt! but she's not classically beautiful in that Grace Kelly way. Different type of attraction.
I would. I definitely, definitely would. :D

I would. I definitely, definitely would. :D
She's got that "you're going to need a back brace and a plate of oysters when I'm done with you" thing going.

Classical beauty is vastly overrated, IMHO. I love women who give as good as they get. :D

The woman who kicks ass, regardless of physical appearance, definitely has a certain attracton for me.

She's got that "you're going to need a back brace and a plate of oysters when I'm done with you" thing going.
LOL! True, true. For me, that's just totally sexy. I see it as the opposite end of the spectrum from "just laying there." LOL! :D

The woman who kicks ass, regardless of physical appearance, definitely has a certain attracton for me.
Can you say "Tomb Raider," boys and girls? :D

Can you say "Tomb Raider," boys and girls? :D


Lets not forget Drew Barrymoore and the rest of the Angels.

God I'd kill to be the 4th Angel.

Lets not forget Drew Barrymoore and the rest of the Angels.

God I'd kill to be the 4th Angel.
But you ARE, you ARE! :D

But you ARE, you ARE! :D

I am somewhat of a badass mixed up with a bit of ooolala arent I? ;)

I am somewhat of a badass mixed up with a bit of ooolala arent I? ;)
Hehehe! DEFINITELY! :D

See, the only angel who I buy as a badass is Lucy Liu, maybe because I first saw her as the dominatrix in Payback--a very underrated film, by the way.

See, the only angel who I buy as a badass is Lucy Liu, maybe because I first saw her as the dominatrix in Payback--a very underrated film, by the way.

No way. Those 3 girls kicked ass in that movie. Well 4 if you count Demi. But she was the bad guy...erm girl. So I didnt like her very much.

No way. Those 3 girls kicked ass in that movie. Well 4 if you count Demi. But she was the bad guy...erm girl. So I didnt like her very much.
It's just a matter of personal taste. I think the other two are plenty pretty--I just don't buy that they're badass, especially not Cameron Diaz. And I'm not fond of Angelina Jolie either (mentioned above)--she seems too fake, too overly exaggerated. I like women with flaws--makes them real.

It's just a matter of personal taste. I think the other two are plenty pretty--I just don't buy that they're badass, especially not Cameron Diaz. And I'm not fond of Angelina Jolie either (mentioned above)--she seems too fake, too overly exaggerated. I like women with flaws--makes them real.


true true.... but I do like the off camera work Angelina does. She's a good gal.

Something like only 1 in 10 movies make money.
Knowing this straitjackets the producers into only making movies based on ones which have been shown to be successful.
Think of it if it was your money - would you want to put in $40 or $50 million into:
A. a movie with a strong female lead where historically these movies rarely if ever break even, or
B. a movie with a strong male lead and hysterical female which almost always turns a profit?

It's a vicious cirlce. They won't experiment out of fear of losing a massive amount of money which means they only make the same standard mindless crap movies we get and then they base their future decisions on what has made a profit previously.


On another note, I see Lars von Trier's new movie 'mandalay' is out in theatres in the states. Anyone seen it, and if so is it any good?
I've been waiting 2 years now (since Dogsville - a movie with a pretty strong, if cold-hearted, heroine in it btw) ! I think I'll have to (bito)RENT it off somebody, as it's not due out here for several more months.