Sheni
11-02-2006, 01:34
EDIT: As a note, I mean dirty in the sense of "immoral", rather then in the sense of "unclean".
I've been thinking of making this topic for a long time but the kids and sex topic finally inspired me to make it. Why is sex dirty? It's a natural body function that's fun and that brings another human into existance. In short, I can only think of good things about it. Now, you may say something about religion. I've rejected that on the point that the Bible(OT at least) is pretty open about sex. Consider this optional sidenote:
9:21 And he drank of the wine, and was drunken; and he was uncovered within his tent. 9:22 And Ham, the father of Canaan, saw the nakedness of his father, and told his two brethren without.
And this odd tidbit that they also could have skiped:
19:5 And they called unto Lot, and said unto him: 'Where are the men that came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them.' 19:6 And Lot went out unto them to the door, and shut the door after him. 19:7 And he said: 'I pray you, my brethren, do not so wickedly. 19:8 Behold now, I have two daughters that have not known man; let me, I pray you, bring them out unto you, and do ye to them as is good in your eyes; only unto these men do nothing; forasmuch as they are come under the shadow of my roof.'
And another optional sidenote:
19:31 And the first-born said unto the younger: 'Our father is old, and there is not a man in the earth to come in unto us after the manner of all the earth. 19:32 Come, let us make our father drink wine, and we will lie with him, that we may preserve seed of our father.' 19:33 And they made their father drink wine that night. And the first-born went in, and lay with her father; and he knew not when she lay down, nor when she arose. 19:34 And it came to pass on the morrow, that the first-born said unto the younger: 'Behold, I lay yesternight with my father. Let us make him drink wine this night also; and go thou in, and lie with him, that we may preserve seed of our father.' 19:35 And they made their father drink wine that night also. And the younger arose, and lay with him; and he knew not when she lay down, nor when she arose. 19:36 Thus were both the daughters of Lot with child by their father. 19:37 And the first-born bore a son, and called his name Moab--the same is the father of the Moabites unto this day. 19:38 And the younger, she also bore a son, and called his name Ben-ammi--the same is the father of the children of Ammon unto this day.
Also here:And Reuben went in the days of wheat harvest, and found mandrakes in the field, and brought them unto his mother Leah. Then Rachel said to Leah: 'Give me, I pray thee, of thy son's mandrakes.' 30:15 And she said unto her: 'Is it a small matter that thou hast taken away my husband? and wouldest thou take away my son's mandrakes also?' And Rachel said: 'Therefore he shall lie with thee to-night for thy son's mandrakes.' 30:16 And Jacob came from the field in the evening, and Leah went out to meet him, and said: 'Thou must come in unto me; for I have surely hired thee with my son's mandrakes.' And he lay with her that night.
Here:
34:1 And Dinah the daughter of Leah, whom she had borne unto Jacob, went out to see the daughters of the land. 34:2 And Shechem the son of Hamor the Hivite, the prince of the land, saw her; and he took her, and lay with her, and humbled her.
You may note here that I intend to reproduce every such passage in the entire thing. Like this one here, the semi-famous Onan passage:
38:8 And Judah said unto Onan: 'Go in unto thy brother's wife, and perform the duty of a husband's brother unto her, and raise up seed to thy brother.' 38:9 And Onan knew that the seed would not be his; and it came to pass when he went in unto his brother's wife, that he spilled it on the ground, lest he should give seed to his brother.
And shortly after that one:38:15 When Judah saw her, he thought her to be a harlot; for she had covered her face. 38:16 And he turned unto her by the way, and said: 'Come, I pray thee, let me come in unto thee'; for he knew not that she was his daughter-in-law. And she said: 'What wilt thou give me, that thou mayest come in unto me?'
And look! It even spends a few pages talking about genital emissions(all censors are the translators, not the writers):15:1 And the Lord spoke unto Moses and to Aaron, saying: 15:2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them: When any man hath an issue out of his flesh, his issue is unclean. 15:3 And this shall be his uncleanness in his issue: whether his flesh run with his issue, or his flesh be stopped from his issue, it is his uncleanness. 15:4 Every bed whereon he that hath the issue lieth shall be unclean; and every thing whereon he sitteth shall be unclean. 15:5 And whosoever toucheth his bed shall wash his clothes, and bathe himself in water, and be unclean until the even. 15:6 And he that sitteth on any thing whereon he that hath the issue sat shall wash his clothes, and bathe himself in water, and be unclean until the even. 15:7 And he that toucheth the flesh of him that hath the issue shall wash his clothes, and bathe himself in water, and be unclean until the even. 15:8 And if he that hath the issue spit upon him that is clean, then he shall wash his clothes, and bathe himself in water, and be unclean until the even. 15:9 And what saddle soever he that hath the issue rideth upon shall be unclean. 15:10 And whosoever toucheth any thing that was under him shall be unclean until the even; and he that beareth those things shall wash his clothes, and bathe himself in water, and be unclean until the even. 15:11 And whomsoever he that hath the issue toucheth, without having rinsed his hands in water, he shall wash his clothes, and bathe himself in water, and be unclean until the even. 15:12 And the earthen vessel, which he that hath the issue toucheth, shall be broken; and every vessel of wood shall be rinsed in water. 15:13 And when he that hath an issue is cleansed of his issue, then he shall number to himself seven days for his cleansing, and wash his clothes; and he shall bathe his flesh in running water, and shall be clean. 15:14 And on the eighth day he shall take to him two turtle-doves, or two young pigeons, and come before the Lord unto the door of the tent of meeting, and give them unto the priest. 15:15 And the priest shall offer them, the one for a sin-offering, and the other for a burnt-offering; and the priest shall make atonement for him before the Lord for his issue. 15:16 And if the flow of seed go out from a man, then he shall bathe all his flesh in water, and be unclean until the even. 15:17 And every garment, and every skin, whereon is the flow of seed, shall be washed with water, and be unclean until the even. 15:18 The woman also with whom a man shall lie carnally, they shall both bathe themselves in water, and be unclean until the even. 15:19 And if a woman have an issue, and her issue in her flesh be blood, she shall be in her impurity seven days; and whosoever toucheth her shall be unclean until the even. 15:20 And every thing that she lieth upon in her impurity shall be unclean; every thing also that she sitteth upon shall be unclean. 15:21 And whosoever toucheth her bed shall wash his clothes, and bathe himself in water, and be unclean until the even. 15:22 And whosoever toucheth any thing that she sitteth upon shall wash his clothes, and bathe himself in water, and be unclean until the even. 15:23 And if he be on the bed, or on any thing whereon she sitteth, when he toucheth it, he shall be unclean until the even. 15:24 And if any man lie with her, and her impurity be upon him, he shall be unclean seven days; and every bed whereon he lieth shall be unclean. 15:25 And if a woman have an issue of her blood many days not in the time of her impurity, or if she have an issue beyond the time of her impurity; all the days of the issue of her uncleanness she shall be as in the days of her impurity: she is unclean. 15:26 Every bed whereon she lieth all the days of her issue shall be unto her as the bed of her impurity; and every thing whereon she sitteth shall be unclean, as the uncleanness of her impurity. 15:27 And whosoever toucheth those things shall be unclean, and shall wash his clothes, and bathe himself in water, and be unclean until the even. 15:28 But if she be cleansed of her issue, then she shall number to herself seven days, and after that she shall be clean
15:29 And on the eighth day she shall take unto her two turtle-doves, or two young pigeons, and bring them unto the priest, to the door of the tent of meeting. 15:30 And the priest shall offer the one for a sin-offering, and the other for a burnt-offering; and the priest shall make atonement for her before the Lord for the issue of her uncleanness. 15:31 Thus shall ye separate the children of Israel from their uncleanness; that they die not in their uncleanness, when they defile My tabernacle that is in the midst of them. 15:32 This is the law of him that hath an issue, and of him from whom the flow of seed goeth out, so that he is unclean thereby; 15:33 and of her that is sick with her impurity, and of them that have an issue, whether it be a man, or a woman; and of him that lieth with her that is unclean.
So we've established it's not religion that makes sex dirty, or at least, not the base religion. Fundie wackos aside, religion does not make sex dirty. So what does? (You may suspect that this whole post was mainly an excuse to reproduce dirty Bible passages. And you may be right.)
I've been thinking of making this topic for a long time but the kids and sex topic finally inspired me to make it. Why is sex dirty? It's a natural body function that's fun and that brings another human into existance. In short, I can only think of good things about it. Now, you may say something about religion. I've rejected that on the point that the Bible(OT at least) is pretty open about sex. Consider this optional sidenote:
9:21 And he drank of the wine, and was drunken; and he was uncovered within his tent. 9:22 And Ham, the father of Canaan, saw the nakedness of his father, and told his two brethren without.
And this odd tidbit that they also could have skiped:
19:5 And they called unto Lot, and said unto him: 'Where are the men that came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them.' 19:6 And Lot went out unto them to the door, and shut the door after him. 19:7 And he said: 'I pray you, my brethren, do not so wickedly. 19:8 Behold now, I have two daughters that have not known man; let me, I pray you, bring them out unto you, and do ye to them as is good in your eyes; only unto these men do nothing; forasmuch as they are come under the shadow of my roof.'
And another optional sidenote:
19:31 And the first-born said unto the younger: 'Our father is old, and there is not a man in the earth to come in unto us after the manner of all the earth. 19:32 Come, let us make our father drink wine, and we will lie with him, that we may preserve seed of our father.' 19:33 And they made their father drink wine that night. And the first-born went in, and lay with her father; and he knew not when she lay down, nor when she arose. 19:34 And it came to pass on the morrow, that the first-born said unto the younger: 'Behold, I lay yesternight with my father. Let us make him drink wine this night also; and go thou in, and lie with him, that we may preserve seed of our father.' 19:35 And they made their father drink wine that night also. And the younger arose, and lay with him; and he knew not when she lay down, nor when she arose. 19:36 Thus were both the daughters of Lot with child by their father. 19:37 And the first-born bore a son, and called his name Moab--the same is the father of the Moabites unto this day. 19:38 And the younger, she also bore a son, and called his name Ben-ammi--the same is the father of the children of Ammon unto this day.
Also here:And Reuben went in the days of wheat harvest, and found mandrakes in the field, and brought them unto his mother Leah. Then Rachel said to Leah: 'Give me, I pray thee, of thy son's mandrakes.' 30:15 And she said unto her: 'Is it a small matter that thou hast taken away my husband? and wouldest thou take away my son's mandrakes also?' And Rachel said: 'Therefore he shall lie with thee to-night for thy son's mandrakes.' 30:16 And Jacob came from the field in the evening, and Leah went out to meet him, and said: 'Thou must come in unto me; for I have surely hired thee with my son's mandrakes.' And he lay with her that night.
Here:
34:1 And Dinah the daughter of Leah, whom she had borne unto Jacob, went out to see the daughters of the land. 34:2 And Shechem the son of Hamor the Hivite, the prince of the land, saw her; and he took her, and lay with her, and humbled her.
You may note here that I intend to reproduce every such passage in the entire thing. Like this one here, the semi-famous Onan passage:
38:8 And Judah said unto Onan: 'Go in unto thy brother's wife, and perform the duty of a husband's brother unto her, and raise up seed to thy brother.' 38:9 And Onan knew that the seed would not be his; and it came to pass when he went in unto his brother's wife, that he spilled it on the ground, lest he should give seed to his brother.
And shortly after that one:38:15 When Judah saw her, he thought her to be a harlot; for she had covered her face. 38:16 And he turned unto her by the way, and said: 'Come, I pray thee, let me come in unto thee'; for he knew not that she was his daughter-in-law. And she said: 'What wilt thou give me, that thou mayest come in unto me?'
And look! It even spends a few pages talking about genital emissions(all censors are the translators, not the writers):15:1 And the Lord spoke unto Moses and to Aaron, saying: 15:2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them: When any man hath an issue out of his flesh, his issue is unclean. 15:3 And this shall be his uncleanness in his issue: whether his flesh run with his issue, or his flesh be stopped from his issue, it is his uncleanness. 15:4 Every bed whereon he that hath the issue lieth shall be unclean; and every thing whereon he sitteth shall be unclean. 15:5 And whosoever toucheth his bed shall wash his clothes, and bathe himself in water, and be unclean until the even. 15:6 And he that sitteth on any thing whereon he that hath the issue sat shall wash his clothes, and bathe himself in water, and be unclean until the even. 15:7 And he that toucheth the flesh of him that hath the issue shall wash his clothes, and bathe himself in water, and be unclean until the even. 15:8 And if he that hath the issue spit upon him that is clean, then he shall wash his clothes, and bathe himself in water, and be unclean until the even. 15:9 And what saddle soever he that hath the issue rideth upon shall be unclean. 15:10 And whosoever toucheth any thing that was under him shall be unclean until the even; and he that beareth those things shall wash his clothes, and bathe himself in water, and be unclean until the even. 15:11 And whomsoever he that hath the issue toucheth, without having rinsed his hands in water, he shall wash his clothes, and bathe himself in water, and be unclean until the even. 15:12 And the earthen vessel, which he that hath the issue toucheth, shall be broken; and every vessel of wood shall be rinsed in water. 15:13 And when he that hath an issue is cleansed of his issue, then he shall number to himself seven days for his cleansing, and wash his clothes; and he shall bathe his flesh in running water, and shall be clean. 15:14 And on the eighth day he shall take to him two turtle-doves, or two young pigeons, and come before the Lord unto the door of the tent of meeting, and give them unto the priest. 15:15 And the priest shall offer them, the one for a sin-offering, and the other for a burnt-offering; and the priest shall make atonement for him before the Lord for his issue. 15:16 And if the flow of seed go out from a man, then he shall bathe all his flesh in water, and be unclean until the even. 15:17 And every garment, and every skin, whereon is the flow of seed, shall be washed with water, and be unclean until the even. 15:18 The woman also with whom a man shall lie carnally, they shall both bathe themselves in water, and be unclean until the even. 15:19 And if a woman have an issue, and her issue in her flesh be blood, she shall be in her impurity seven days; and whosoever toucheth her shall be unclean until the even. 15:20 And every thing that she lieth upon in her impurity shall be unclean; every thing also that she sitteth upon shall be unclean. 15:21 And whosoever toucheth her bed shall wash his clothes, and bathe himself in water, and be unclean until the even. 15:22 And whosoever toucheth any thing that she sitteth upon shall wash his clothes, and bathe himself in water, and be unclean until the even. 15:23 And if he be on the bed, or on any thing whereon she sitteth, when he toucheth it, he shall be unclean until the even. 15:24 And if any man lie with her, and her impurity be upon him, he shall be unclean seven days; and every bed whereon he lieth shall be unclean. 15:25 And if a woman have an issue of her blood many days not in the time of her impurity, or if she have an issue beyond the time of her impurity; all the days of the issue of her uncleanness she shall be as in the days of her impurity: she is unclean. 15:26 Every bed whereon she lieth all the days of her issue shall be unto her as the bed of her impurity; and every thing whereon she sitteth shall be unclean, as the uncleanness of her impurity. 15:27 And whosoever toucheth those things shall be unclean, and shall wash his clothes, and bathe himself in water, and be unclean until the even. 15:28 But if she be cleansed of her issue, then she shall number to herself seven days, and after that she shall be clean
15:29 And on the eighth day she shall take unto her two turtle-doves, or two young pigeons, and bring them unto the priest, to the door of the tent of meeting. 15:30 And the priest shall offer the one for a sin-offering, and the other for a burnt-offering; and the priest shall make atonement for her before the Lord for the issue of her uncleanness. 15:31 Thus shall ye separate the children of Israel from their uncleanness; that they die not in their uncleanness, when they defile My tabernacle that is in the midst of them. 15:32 This is the law of him that hath an issue, and of him from whom the flow of seed goeth out, so that he is unclean thereby; 15:33 and of her that is sick with her impurity, and of them that have an issue, whether it be a man, or a woman; and of him that lieth with her that is unclean.
So we've established it's not religion that makes sex dirty, or at least, not the base religion. Fundie wackos aside, religion does not make sex dirty. So what does? (You may suspect that this whole post was mainly an excuse to reproduce dirty Bible passages. And you may be right.)