NationStates Jolt Archive

Were you upset when the USSR failed?
What caused it to Fail?
Was it a step in the right direction?

Personally i think the USSR failed because of The mafia
I think it was a good thing, if badly run.

I remember the USSR. Intertourist. Ha.

The USSR fell officially in 1991 right? I was 7 years old at the time so I had no opinion. Now I believe its certainly a good thing since East Europe now has a chance to know democracy.

why did it fail?

i think it's a melange of different variables:

weak economy

arms race with the US (we bled them dry... they couldn't keep up, but tried damn hard!)

the ideal of freedom sparked in the populace

nobody like Stalin in power to put down the uprising for freedom

freedom uprisings in Iron Curtain states


and maybe about a hundred other things.

USSR sucked.

1) Say the wrong thing end up in a gulag.
2) Government thought it could impose it's will on science. Remember Lysenkoism? (GWB should take note of this)
3) Food shortages
4) Major pollution problems

And there were many, many more problems with USSR.

Good riddance.

The USSR fell officially in 1991 right? I was 7 years old at the time so I had no opinion. Now I believe its certainly a good thing since East Europe now has a chance to know democracy.
Just curious, what countries you mean?

Major problems with the economy dealt the final blow. But that 10 year war with Afghanistan didn't help much either.

Were you upset when the USSR failed?
What caused it to Fail?
Was it a step in the right direction?
1. No. It was a bad idea in the first place.

2. It failed because it was based on rigid ideology.

3. No.

The USSR did not just only fail as a political system. A socialist state functions only when the central and plannend economy functions. The USSR was getting a lot of economical and social problems.

Just curious, what countries you mean?

I was speaking generally as not all have been as lucky as others. Still it is certainly better then being under the weak, corrupt, oppressive Soviet regime.

God save the CCCP! lol

I was speaking generally as not all have been as lucky as others. Still it is certainly better then being under the weak, corrupt, oppressive Soviet regime.
Yes, of course. As I sais I was just curious. You know e.g. Estonia was an independent and democratic nation in the early years of 20th century (since -hmm- not 100% sure now- 1920). Somehow they managed to turn the country into dictatorship very quickly (1930's) and then lost their independency for decades during WWII.

USSD

United Soviet States of Denmark

We shall crush you all... ALL I TELL YA!

...To answer the questions, I cried when it all crumbled... It was all Stalin and his foolish schemes fault... And of course, a new, SOVIET Union would be the cure for this falling planet!

...To answer the questions, I cried when it all crumbled... It was all Stalin and his foolish schemes fault... And of course, a new, SOVIET Union would be the cure for this falling planet!
I like you. You're silly.

STALIN was the beginning of the end, Trotsky was the last hope of marxism but it was the evil georgian who came out on top.

I like you. You're silly.

You won't call me silly when your face is trodden down in the mud by a USSD infantry boot!

Doublebarreled tanks, here I come!

The USSR was evil. Not only was any freedom of speech abolished but monasteries, churches and univercitys, great centers of learning, were destroyed. Devestating eastern europe that has never seemed to Recover not to mention the Church. I agree the Tzar was not the best but could'nt they have had a democracy or somthing? I feel sorry for eastern europe and Russia.

The USSR was evil. Not only was any freedom of speech abolished but monasteries, churches and univercitys, great centers of learning, were destroyed. Devestating eastern europe that has never seemed to Recover not to mention the Church. I agree the Tzar was not the best but could'nt they have had a democracy or somthing? I feel sorry for eastern europe and Russia.

Democracy is so slow, when you want new laws and such being implented... A single leader can pick a law, and it would be in the constitution/basic rules in the next five minutes.

The USSR failed mainly under it's own weight. Similiar to the fall of Rome. It became too extended with too much aid to other nations. The final blow was the war in Afganistan that bled it dry. The West had little to do with it. The people just quit supporting the government.

The internal problems included economy, but also the problem of all empires--ethnic diversity. Yes the US has some ethnic diversity but in an empire the ethnic groups don't intermingle and don't recognize the central government as their true uniting force. In an empire people think of themselves as separate nations that happen to be ruled by a bigger nation. This is far different than US states. But it is similiar to N. Ireland and Scotland in GB.

Eastern Europe was really part of this empire mentality. West Germany and Italy were set up as independent. Allied troops remained but the nations were allowed to disagree with the former allies.

In the end, a truth came true. "There is really no such thing as a non-democratic government." In other words there is no government that can stand without a vast majority of the people supporting it. Even a significant minority can bring down a government. Even a 1% minority willing to fight will bring down a government. Could the US govenment stand if 3 million citizens decided to fight? When the people withdraw their support, the government falls. This truth needs to be considered as we run around the world professing to set up governments for others.

In the end, a truth came true. "There is really no such thing as a non-democratic government." In other words there is no government that can stand without a vast majority of the people supporting it.
Well, that's not entirely true. Stalin's regime was "supported" by the people because they were too afraid to do anything else. We still wouldn't refer to it as a democratic government, but it worked nonetheless.

Well, that's not entirely true. Stalin's regime was "supported" by the people because they were too afraid to do anything else. We still wouldn't refer to it as a democratic government, but it worked nonetheless.
How long would Stalin or Saddam or any other "evil dictator" have been in power if everytime a troopy went out on the street he got a pitchfork in the back. Or an IED. Yes, many would die, but with even a small number voting with their actions to fight the govenment, the government won't stand. A dictator must have the support of the masses.

One of the things westerners don't understand is there are advantages to total control. One of those is no crime. Commit a crime and you and all around you are killed. Do you have the freedom to walk any part of your country, at any time of day without fear of crime?

I'm all for western freedoms. But I also know those freedoms mean I'm not safe. When we ask for safety, as in the last few years, the solution is to remove freedoms.

Given that I was 7 when the Berlin Wall fell (which arguably was a central point in the demise of the Warshaw Pact), I was mostly glad for two reasons:
- we no longer had to wait hours upon hours at the border when we went visiting our friends in Dresden,
- on every corner, there were people selling medals and stuff for next-to-nothing, it was sooo easy becoming a general :)

The USSR collapsed because its economic system was riddled with corruption, stagnation, and incompetence. It was so inefficent that it simply could not deal with the technological innovation occuring in the West, and its production facilities were incredibly unproductive, costly, and produced limited amounts of very poor quality goods. Combine this with a massive, unsustainable military budget and the inability to deal with inflation and shortages and it is obvious that the system was doomed to failiure as early as the start of the 1970's.

Ultimately, the political nature of the centrally planned economy doomed it to failiure. The incredible degree of social, criminal, and environmental damage unleashed in many parts of the USSR by central planning show it as a prime example of what not to follow when determining economic policy.

I'm all for western freedoms. But I also know those freedoms mean I'm not safe. When we ask for safety, as in the last few years, the solution is to remove freedoms.

I really hope that you aren't seriously proposing that we should give up our freedoms. :rolleyes:

One of the things westerners don't understand is there are advantages to total control.
I never disputed the advantages of total control. I was just saying that ruling through fear can be just as effective as democracy is at winning the support of the people. But I agree with you in that freedom sometimes carries a price.

Were you upset when the USSR failed?
What caused it to Fail?
Was it a step in the right direction?

1. Yes, but then again I was upset the way the USSR was being run.

2. The Arms Race, The flawed economy, lack of democratic rights, lack of freedom of speech and all the other puppet governments it had to support.

3. No and Yes. I believe reform was needed, but disbanding the whole country? I think it could have been dealt with better so that terrorist don't have old Soviet weapons. Plus, Russia, Eastern Europe and all the other Soviet Bloc countries could still have independence and their own government, but keep the USSR, as sort of a symbolic thing. Like the Commonwealth.

Good riddance. The USSR was a menace to the world around it and its own people. May it never rise again.

To the group of apologetics who admired the USSR - what do you say to Stalin's "Great Purges" and the 30-40 million people killed under his reign?

The Cold War thanks in part to Stalin and his damned ego couldn't compromise with Churchill's and FDR's plan to invade Europe via Africa in WWII. So he just has to find a way to get us back.

Just my personal opinion but the USSR failed because it was A. Too big of an economy/country. Socialist states work better when they are smaller. B. Stalin. I don't even need to explain that part. Put simply, a dictatorship will ruin just about any style government unless of course it's a facist society ie. North Korea C. Russia spent themselves aiding other nations at crucial times.

I'm pro democratic but I'm not against socialist economies. There should be a mix of the two (captialism/socialism) as neither will work well purely on it's own. So I can't say I hated the USSR. HAd it been done right it probably would have succeeded.

Could the US govenment stand if 3 million citizens decided to fight? When the people withdraw their support, the government falls.

There was this little thing called the American Civil War... But I get your point.

USSR; good bye and good riddance. You made great bad guys, but it was time for Russians to quit lining up for green sausage.

I really hope that you aren't seriously proposing that we should give up our freedoms. :rolleyes:
Not at all. What I was commenting on was things like the "Patriot Act", domestic wiretapping, etc. that many people are supporting in order to be "safe". Just today the Pres. put out a report to generate more fear so he can justify the taking of freedoms. I would rather be a little scared and have more freedom.

To the group of apologetics who admired the USSR - what do you say to Stalin's "Great Purges" and the 30-40 million people killed under his reign?


Hitler was once the leader of Germany, do you feel that Germany should disband? Stalin was just one man, he doesn't represent the whole country. Hell, even members of the Party hated Stalin.

I kind of miss the USSR because it was the only Russia I really ever knew. I was there in '87 and it was pretty much the end at that point.

Black markets always had interesting commodities.

That and it was the only time I managed to have interesting conversations with prostitutes.

Hitler was once the leader of Germany, do you feel that Germany should disband? Stalin was just one man, he doesn't represent the whole country. Hell, even members of the Party hated Stalin.

So you therefore suggest that Nazi Germany was a good country, but Hitler screwed it up.


Black markets always had interesting commodities.

You should visit Stadion Dziesięciolecia (Ten Years' Stadium) in Warsaw.

So you therefore suggest that Nazi Germany was a good country, but Hitler screwed it up.




You should visit Stadion Dziesięciolecia (Ten Years' Stadium) in Warsaw.
This was a good thread but Godwin screwed it up.

Well, it failed in the most meaningful sense due to flawed application of already flawed theory, psychotic dictators, and so on. All in all, not a recipe for success.

The USSR began to fail in 1924, when Lennin died. (He took four strokes before he died, tough bastard!) And power-hungry Uncle Joe stepped into the limelight.

I liked the USSR, it gave the U.S. something to focus our hatred on. When it collapsed we were left with different enemies, those slippery terrorists, most of whom we trained and armed while they were fighting the USSR. Granted, anit-communism in this country led to Joe McCarthy, the Red Scare, etc.; but we'd prefer you just forgot about that.

Finally: I can't be the only one who wanted to see what a Commanche would do to some Soviet tanks.

I liked the USSR, it gave the U.S. something to focus our hatred on. When it collapsed we were left with different enemies, those slippery terrorists, most of whom we trained and armed while they were fighting the USSR. Granted, anit-communism in this country led to Joe McCarthy, the Red Scare, etc.; but we'd prefer you just forgot about that.

Finally: I can't be the only one who wanted to see what a Commanche would do to some Soviet tanks.
Wasn't the comanche project scrapped?

Yeah it was... what I want to see is a Soviet Tank Army being J-SOWed... alas, they are gone... which is a good and bad thing.

Good because it brought down an oppressive goverment which was very inept and corrupt.

Bad, because it opened a TON of weapons bunkers up for the Arms Dealers. Unguided missiles, guided missiles, guns, Armored Personnel Carriers, Main Battle Tanks, hell, even Helicopter Gunships and Short Ranged Ballistic Missiles! There were even reports of tactical nukes and other Weapons of Mass Destruction going missing!

The USSR was the largest concentration camp in history, and the worst mass murderer. It was as close as we ever got to pure evil.

I think that now that we're in a more democratic (or anti-communist) era, it would be the duty of any sovereign nation to court-martial any politicians and Communist party members that co-operated with the USSR. But, did you know that the old European Commission member Erkki Liikanen was a former Soviet brownnoser?