NationStates Jolt Archive

Who here has tried there hand at constructing a language? What kind of language were you trying to create? How successful were you?

I have invented a few before, but never got beyond inventing the grammar and a few words.

I tried creating a written script based on visual representation of hexadecimal+ASCII once, but I never got too far. It isn't a language either - it's potentially compatible with any language that uses alphabetic script, so Chinese and Japanese wouldn't work.

I actually tried once, for a short story I was writing. I had 3 "languages" composed that summer, Sylph hunter language, goblin and elf. Then I lost my notebook with all the words, so that was a complete waste of time. :sniper:

I Formed A Cross Language Of Elvish And Dark Elvish. Does That Count?

I am currently progressing on the creation of a constructed language.

I'm trying to make one. Mine will have a letter for every sound used. Once you understand the alphabet, spelling and reading will be easy. There will be prefixes, suffixes, and root words. So far, I only have 1 word and 11 letters(all vowels).

Someday I'd like to work with someone and construct a language. Mmmm...teamwork.

This thread kinda reminds me of that one professor who was trying to get his word "presticogitation" into the Oxford English Dictionary...have any of you heard of that?

I know someone who knows Quenya and Sindarin. She can speak and write all the words Tolkien ever actually invented, and can write RL languages fluently in the Elvish script.

Why bother? It's been done (http://www.esperanto.net/), better than anyone else is likely to achieve.

Oh, And I Am Fluent In Dark Elvish, Elvish, Goblin, And Gnome.

I'm trying to make one. Mine will have a letter for every sound used. Once you understand the alphabet, spelling and reading will be easy. There will be prefixes, suffixes, and root words. So far, I only have 1 word and 11 letters(all vowels).

Do you plan to have consonants as well?

---

One of the strangest languages I created had only verbs and nouns, but they were all really long. The shortest a verb could be was 9 letters I think. I'll try to think of an example

"eston'koges, ithon'estes" -> "I think, therefore I am." I think that's how I had it. Each letter indicated something different about the word, e.g. the first letter indicates how I know (or why I believe) my statement to be true. E.g. I witnessed it, someone told me, I deduced it, etc.

I am currently progressing on the creation of a constructed language.
Not from my definition.

Why bother? It's been done (http://www.esperanto.net/), better than anyone else is likely to achieve.

A. There are more constructed languages than just international auxillary languages.
B. Esperanto has various flaws. See http://www.xibalba.demon.co.uk/jbr/ranto/

Not from my definition.

Huh?

Um, I can barely speak English at the best of times, but, rest assured, that a lot of the time, the shite that I can spout out can be considered a new language all of it's own

Okay, a littlie about my constructed language: I am planning to make the alphabet as phonetic as possible, by using a separate charactor for each sound.

Okay, a littlie about my constructed language: I am planning to make the alphabet as phonetic as possible, by using a separate charactor for each sound.

You might want to just make it phonemic, if you aren't already. The difference is that phonemic only separates it as far as people can tell the difference - e.g. the L in milk is phonetically different from the L in letter, but phonemically the same. (try saying them out loud to and thinking about where your tongue is to see the difference)

Also, I'm Making Plans For A Language Which Will Be Widely Used In My Up Coming Book Trilogy, Which Is The Second Trilogy Of The Blackbird Legacies. It's Used By A Race Which Is Something Like A Cross Between Illithids From Forgotten Realms, Elves, And Dragons. I Call Them The Rantana.

Also, I'm Making Plans For A Language Which Will Be Widely Used In My Up Coming Book Trilogy, Which Is The Second Trilogy Of The Blackbird Legacies. It's Used By A Race Which Is Something Like A Cross Between Illithids From Forgotten Realms, Elves, And Dragons. I Call Them The Rantana.

Why don't you tell us what the language is like? What are your aims, etc?

Curious: Are you an actual author, or is your writing just for your own pleasure?

Also, I'm Making Plans For A Language Which Will Be Widely Used In My Up Coming Book Trilogy, Which Is The Second Trilogy Of The Blackbird Legacies. It's Used By A Race Which Is Something Like A Cross Between Illithids From Forgotten Realms, Elves, And Dragons. I Call Them The Rantana.

Elves, dragons, and illithids? [tries to visualize that] [fails miserably]

You do realize that the languages of the elves and dragons are almost precise opposites, (harsh, guttural, grand, elemental, majestically beastial; flowing, smooth, elegant, ethereal) and that the illithids don't even have a spoken language? Their mode of communication is purely telepathic, and their written language is designed to express pure thought and telepathic communication, and to be read by feel, like braille.

Not to mention, the combination seems like bastardy to the highest degree. Like a bad xover or something. Seriously, how can you merge three of the most iconic, complex, and history-rich races in the D&D/FR universe into a single creature without losing everything that makes them special?

Elves, dragons, and illithids? [tries to visualize that] [fails miserably]

You do realize that the languages of the elves and dragons are almost precise opposites, (harsh, guttural, grand, elemental, majestically beastial; flowing, smooth, elegant, ethereal) and that the illithids don't even have a spoken language? Their mode of communication is purely telepathic, and their written language is designed to express pure thought and telepathic communication, and to be read by feel, like braille.

Not to mention, the combination seems like bastardy to the highest degree. Like a bad xover or something. Seriously, how can you merge three of the most iconic, complex, and history-rich races in the D&D/FR universe into a single creature without losing everything that makes them special?
It's Not A Combination Of The Languages, Just Of The Image. Oh, And I Write For My Own Pleasure. The Language Is A Mix Of Elvish, German, And Russian When Spoken. It's Writing Is Something A Bit Like Arcane Runes Mixed With Chinese Symbols.

Are you already fluent in German and Russian? I think that sounds like an interesting language.

It's Not A Combination Of The Languages, Just Of The Image.

Still pretty damn hard to picture. Can you describe them?

Are you already fluent in German and Russian? I think that sounds like an interesting language.
Yes, I Took Online German And Russian Classes. I'm Planning To Take German In High School, So I Will Most Definetly Ace It. I Learned Elvish Through Tolkiens Books And The English-Elvish Dictionary.

Yes, I Took Online German And Russian Classes. I'm Planning To Take German In High School, So I Will Most Definetly Ace It. I Learned Elvish Through Tolkiens Books And The English-Elvish Dictionary.

I'm currently in my 4th year of German (began in 8th grade). I speak Mandarin Chinese fluently as well, but I might go to Taiwan this year to learn how to better read and write.

Question: Do you think it's easier to talk in a constructed language, or write in one?

Still pretty damn hard to picture. Can you describe them?
Well, They're Lizard Humanoids, Obviously. But It's Not All Scales. It's More Of A Snake Kind Of Skin. They Have 1337 Psychic Powers, And Bolbous Heads Like The Illithids. They Have Pointed Ears And Great Agility Like Elves. They're Bald, Though. Also, They're Very Intelligent, And Have Rather Advanced Technology. Atleast, For A Civilization In A Midevial Fantasy Story. (As In, They Have Arbques) (Spelling?) They Have No Teeth, But Rather Have A Hard Upper Plate In Their Mouth And A Rather Strong Toung, Which They Use To Crush Their Food With. Their Diet Mainly Consists Of Flesh Of Any Kind. They Aren't Cannibals Though. The Reason The Language Is So Widely Used Is Because They Quickly Achieve World Semi-Dominance In The Few Weeks They Appear After Years Of Exile In A Lost Island. The Hero (If You Can Call Him That, He's A Self-Serving Necromancer) Has To Go To The Lost Island And Destroy A Crystal Which Sustains The Rantana's Life. The Crystal Sustains The Rantana's Life Because The Air On The Planet Is Poisonus To Them, Except On The Island. The Crystal Supplies Them With The Air Needed To Live. If He Destroys That, Well, Nuff Said. Believe Me, These Things Aren't Supposed To Be Pretty.

Question: Do you think it's easier to talk in a constructed language, or write in one?

Surely it depends on which language it is?

I'm currently in my 4th year of German (began in 8th grade). I speak Mandarin Chinese fluently as well, but I might go to Taiwan this year to learn how to better read and write.

Question: Do you think it's easier to talk in a constructed language, or write in one?
Depends. If The Writing Is The Regular Alphabet, Writing. If It Is Not, Talk. I'm Still Constructing It. I Do Have A Phrase For You, Which Is Roughly Translated From The Rantana Writing. It Is Still In Their Language Though. Trigila Mirti Roplo Neglia Mashun! Translation: You Weak, Pitiful, Disgusting Humans!

Surely it depends on which language it is?

Point. I would like to learn Latin, but my school doesn't offer it. Do you think I could teach myself online or through the library?

Oh, And I Still Don't Know Alot Of Arcane Runes Or Chinese Symbols Yet, So I'm Still Not That Far Into The Writing. I Do Have The Spoken Language About 1/3 Of The Way Done. I Started Making It About 3 Months Ago.

*Note* I Would Just Edit My Posts To Put In More Info, But I Want A Higher Post Count! :D *End Note* The Spoken Language Also Has A Bit Of My Own Styling In It, As Well. So If It Doesn't Sound Like An EXACT Copy Of A Combination Of Elvish, German, And Russian, Don't Be Suprised. Oh, And If The Writing Isn't Exactly A Combination Of Chinese And Arcane Runes, Don't Be Suprised Either. I Like To Put Alot Of My Own Stuff In Instead Of Just Combining. And The Dark Elvish-Elvish Combination Language, I Will Never Use. Just Wanted To See What A Few Select Phrases Would Sound Like In A Combination Of Elvish And Dark Elvish.

You don't always have to copy from other cultures; Chinese characters are pretty much just straightforward. The appearance help with the meaning.

Point. I would like to learn Latin, but my school doesn't offer it. Do you think I could teach myself online or through the library?

I expect there are resources online, but books might be easier.

I expect there are resources online, but books might be easier.

Thank you. I think I agree with that too. The Internet can be unreliable at times... -understatement-

Thank you. I think I agree with that too. The Internet can be unreliable at times... -understatement-
Just Look At Wiki, Man.

Point. I would like to learn Latin, but my school doesn't offer it. Do you think I could teach myself online or through the library?

Well, with any language, it's a matter of finding a logical way to go about it. If I was going to think of finding a way to lead someone through learning Latin, the list of things to learn would be like this:

present forms of "to be" (there's really not a good infinitive form in Latin)
1st and 2nd declension nouns
1st and 2nd conjugation verbs (present tense)
adjectives
infinitives
3rd declension nouns
perfect, pluperfect, future forms of verbs
3rd and 4th conjugation verbs
4th and 5th declension nouns
pronouns
gerunds, gerundives, perfect passive participles of verbs
subjunctive moods of verbs
idioms
proper names (although it's hard to avoid them as one goes along)

I'm sure I missed something, but it's been a while.

Well, with any language, it's a matter of finding a logical way to go about it. If I was going to think of finding a way to lead someone through learning Latin, the list of things to learn would be like this:

present forms of "to be" (there's really not a good infinitive form in Latin)
1st and 2nd declension nouns
1st and 2nd conjugation verbs (present tense)
adjectives
infinitives
3rd declension nouns
perfect, pluperfect, future forms of verbs
3rd and 4th conjugation verbs
4th and 5th declension nouns
pronouns
gerunds, gerundives, perfect passive participles of verbs
subjunctive moods of verbs
idioms
proper names (although it's hard to avoid them as one goes along)

I'm sure I missed something, but it's been a while.

Okay, thank you very much. I'm surprised at this forum - didn't know what to expect when I first joined, but people are pretty helpful. And willing to discuss things.

Okay, thank you very much. I'm surprised at this forum - didn't know what to expect when I first joined, but people are pretty helpful. And willing to discuss things.

You're welcome. It's a rather eclectic bunch here. Not all information posted is entirely accurate and some of it is downright wrong, but if it encourages one to head in their chosen direction, then they are much closer to their goal than when they started.

It's also a refreshing change to be one of the ignorants...I'm used to talking to people my own age or younger, so being exposed to people already out of high school and above, it's nice talking to (usually) more mature points of views. And I can finally be put in my place. Ha.

is any language learning online/library worth it?

i am currently studying french at my school, which lacks german. family history directs me to learn it.

are they reliable? is german a hard second language?

never finished any.

is any language learning online/library worth it?

i am currently studying french at my school, which lacks german. family history directs me to learn it.

are they reliable? is german a hard second language?

I have a 99 in the class. Really, it depends on the teacher. And the rigidity of the school. If you have the motivation (which I might have) and time, I think you could try learning almost any language yourself. This summer, I'll start looking at Latin.

You might want to just make it phonemic, if you aren't already. The difference is that phonemic only separates it as far as people can tell the difference - e.g. the L in milk is phonetically different from the L in letter, but phonemically the same. (try saying them out loud to and thinking about where your tongue is to see the difference)


Eh you got those backwards. Phonemic variation is what is demonstrated in the differences in the L's in Milk and Letter, or in the T's in Stop and Top. Phonetic is the refrence to the basic sound type itself, in the case of the L, just as a lateral approximate.
Phonemic difference can be incorporated into languages to make them kmore, interesting. For instance, in Korean, aspiration on a consonant is considred an entirely different letter (Aspiration is the difference between the T's in stop and top by the way).

Anyway...
I've done at least 7 constructed languages so far, all basicly completely reinventions of the previous. Right now though I'm working on a modernisation of the Sumerian language, incorporating barrow words and structures from Arabic and Taino.
Unfortunatly, as with all conlangs, I keep finding myself trying to stick grammatical and morphological structures of English into what Im creating.
And all my school work being done about English mostly doesn't help either.

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=phoneme

phoneme:

The smallest phonetic unit in a language that is capable of conveying a distinction in meaning, as the m of mat and the b of bat in English.

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=phonetic

phonetic:

Of, relating to, or being features of pronunciation that are not phonemically distinctive in a language, as aspiration of consonants or vowel length in English.

--------------

That's what I meant, just in case I didnt make it clear.

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=phoneme

phoneme:

The smallest phonetic unit in a language that is capable of conveying a distinction in meaning, as the m of mat and the b of bat in English.

http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=phonetic

phonetic:

Of, relating to, or being features of pronunciation that are not phonemically distinctive in a language, as aspiration of consonants or vowel length in English.

--------------

That's what I meant, just in case I didnt make it clear.


A phoneme is the specific name of a unit of language yes, but phonemic and phonmics mean more then just that, as I just expressed in my previous post.
I guess it can be more confusing then I think of it.

Although this was an assignment in one of my first year classes, do a paper on the difference between phonetics and phonemics.

Also, I'm Making Plans For A Language Which Will Be Widely Used In My Up Coming Book Trilogy, Which Is The Second Trilogy Of The Blackbird Legacies. It's Used By A Race Which Is Something Like A Cross Between Illithids From Forgotten Realms, Elves, And Dragons. I Call Them The Rantana.

Do they have talons?

A. There are more constructed languages than just international auxillary languages.
B. Esperanto has various flaws. See http://www.xibalba.demon.co.uk/jbr/ranto/
There's a number of different languages other than Esperanto and the like, but since Esperanto has been the most well accepted world-wide, it makes a good international alternative, to say, English or Chinese due to favoring nations over absolutely nothing. All languages have their quirks, and what that link wants is something that we can never give.

The Spoken Language Also Has A Bit Of My Own Styling In It, As Well. So If It Doesn't Sound Like An EXACT Copy Of A Combination Of Elvish, German, And Russian, Don't Be Suprised. Oh, And If The Writing Isn't Exactly A Combination Of Chinese And Arcane Runes, Don't Be Suprised Either. I Like To Put Alot Of My Own Stuff In Instead Of Just Combining. And The Dark Elvish-Elvish Combination Language, I Will Never Use. Just Wanted To See What A Few Select Phrases Would Sound Like In A Combination Of Elvish And Dark Elvish.
I take it every noun would be proper in your language then? :p

But, seriously, I wouldn't base an Elvish language on German, its so...angry and not very, Elf like in my opinion (I'm not a fantasy fan, but I feel I can give my input). Tolkein based his, partly, from the Finnish language, and if all of you aspiring linguists out there really wish to challenge yourselves, look into that. Russian is an interesting choice. However, I'm biased against Russians, just like the Finns. I would suggest looking into Finnish, its a lanugage completely its own, and has, well, lots of stuff in it that'd make Elvish truely cool.

Hejida,

xe'la'deme rejistaniha. mi'aru visko'tan la'va. xe'la'deme sunu'ny rejistaniha ji taran'ny. il'ki mi su?

---
Hi,

I created rejistanian, it is an artificial language. I wrote songs and texts in it. Do you know it?

Who here has tried there hand at constructing a language? What kind of language were you trying to create? How successful were you?

I have invented a few before, but never got beyond inventing the grammar and a few words.

I'm computer programmer and I don't need another language to confuse me.

I created a language for a novel I'm writing (fantasy). Today my "dictionary" has over a thousand words. It wasn't a hard decision to create a language.

First, I love lingustics, and the possibility of creating a language that included the sounds and features I love most about languages, and excluded the things I don't enjoy, was too intriguing to pass up.

Second, I have learned a great deal about all languages as a result of this exercise. No class I've ever taken has given me so thorough a grasp of the mechanics of language, or made me think harder about how each society shapes the way its language evolves.

Third, as a result of this exercise, I now have a wonderful way of making my random scribblings private. At present, no one but me can read or decipher my language.

Finally, it was a lot of fun. I recommend it highly to anyone who enjoys languages, language studies, logic puzzles, and/or a good challenge. You can see results almost immediately. It can be as in depth as you like. It's very easy to pick up and put down a language-building project at your leisure. Anyone who is really motivated can do this.

I admit, a full-blown language wasn't vital to my story. I could easily have stopped with just a list of names for the people and places. However, I wanted everything in my story to have a uniform look and feel, and I wanted the names my readers saw to mean something, preferably something that a reader could eventually begin to guess at based on his own knowledge of my story up to that point. I think I've achieved that.

It was a wonderful exercise.

I created a language for a novel I'm writing (fantasy). Today my "dictionary" has over a thousand words. It wasn't a hard decision to create a language.
...
It was a wonderful exercise.

What features did you decide to include?

Constructed languages are total bullshit. At best, they're elaborate codes for the inventor's mothertongue. Go and learn some real languages and use them to talk to people, you miserable nerds.

Russian was a constructed language originally, and that's done OK. And also, why isn't phoneticaly spelt phoneticaly? And why is there only one word for thesaurus?

Do they have talons?
Could They Construct Arbques (Spelling? Again.) With Talons? I Doubt It. They Have Regular 5 Finger Hands Like Elves.

Constructed languages are total bullshit. At best, they're elaborate codes for the inventor's mothertongue. Go and learn some real languages and use them to talk to people, you miserable nerds.

So, what you're saying is, you're an idiot who doesn't know what he's talking about, and you want everyone to know.

Who here has tried there hand at constructing a language? What kind of language were you trying to create? How successful were you?

I have invented a few before, but never got beyond inventing the grammar and a few words.
I'm currently working on one, and I'm following this guide (http://www.zompist.com/kit.html). It's quite helpful.

I'm currently working on one, and I'm following this guide (http://www.zompist.com/kit.html). It's quite helpful.

Bookmarked.

Well, I've always been interested in constructed languages. I have a project now called Socialese, which is basically a socialist-themed language. It is notable for its heavy inflection (think Latin's scary noun case tables but for verbs instead) that result in words as long as 20 letters or more. It also relies heavily on metaphor and various suffixes to extend the meaning of basic words so that only a few hundred roots are needed (at least that's the idea).

A few examples:

Kolììŋkisui ú tónákitaai, kólìntaai!
Workers of the world, unite!

Làummmómmiúkkise luò tuóóníllìntai, èliinsusaai sèssutaisáái uón lékkisa làutníllìntaisá, sáikika à kétlìntaisá kótlintai uòòl.
Do not be as the hagfish and avoid danger whilst exploiting others but confront it with courage and live honestly instead.

Piántútriùppììppuòslíŋkisámail.
My intense dispair has been diminishing on and off.

Constructed languages are total bullshit. At best, they're elaborate codes for the inventor's mothertongue. Go and learn some real languages and use them to talk to people, you miserable nerds.

Then you've obviously never seen Socialese. To illustrate, here is a breakdown of the word above:

Pán-

Root for "high" or "extacy"

Pián-

Root with antithesis infix inserted, making it "low" or "depressed"

Piántút-

Suffix showing intensification, making it "intense lowness"

Piántútriùt-

Suffix indicating that the root refers specifically to an emotional state, hense "intense depression"

Piántútriùppììt-

Suffix indicating that the activity is ending; note the sandhi that changes final -t into geminate /p/

Piántútriùppììppuot-

Suffix indicating that the activity is inconsistant, like the flickering of a light

Piántútriùppììppuòslíŋ-

Inflection for the progressive aspect (tense is not marked but implied through context)

Piántútriùppììppuòslíŋki-

Inflection for the source of knowledge of this event, in this case ones own perceptions

Piántútriùppììppuòslíŋkisá-

Inflection for a 3rd person immaterial patient

Piántútriùppììppuòslíŋkisámail

Inflection for 1st person possession or "my X". Thus, the entire word has been broken down.

What features did you decide to include?

For one thing, I excluded the verb "be". It's a totally unnecessary verb, and many languages other than English do just fine without it. Excluding it uncomplicates language considerably.

For example: "I am typing" and "I type" (or "I type now") mean the same thing. No real point in "am".

Also, some tenses in my language (the imperative, for example) are handled with a word of their own. "You go to the store" + [imperative word] = a command, instead of an observation.

I ruled out having genders for inanimate nouns. That's something I hated about Spanish, when I studied it. What makes a table female, exactly? English does fine without noun genders, so does my language.

These are just some of the issues I addressed.

a notice to all that try to create a language

you need a girlfriend/boyfriend or both which ever way you go, or a better hobby:D

Believe it or not, People without names, some people find an intellect sexy.

Then you've obviously never seen Socialese. To illustrate, here is a breakdown of the word above:

Pán-
...
Piántútriùppììppuòslíŋkisámail

Inflection for 1st person possession or "my X". Thus, the entire word has been broken down.
I bet you saw similar examples of word derivation on some website, and thought it was a great idea to make up similar things.

But, I happen to have such a language as a mothertongue. What really animates such derivational grammar is not its complexity, but usefulness. "Feikkailemisellasi et pääse pitkälle"; fake + frequentative + nominalizer + with + your = with your blatantly "faking around" you can't get very far.

The fact is that there are many endangered languages, which can't survive, because people like you think they're just funny ways to pronounce English or Russian. Languages are not made up! They're the cornerstone of any culture, and are inseparable from the community. There's plenty of material on real languages; why not learn a real language instead of making shit up?

I read this one on Tundra Nenets the other day:
http://www.helsinki.fi/~tasalmin/sketch.html

Nenets is a language spoken by around 30000 people in northern Siberia. Interesting in it is its extensive agglutinative and derivational grammar. Nenets has a separate method for deriving words meaning "to hunt something", see:
Captative verbs, e.g. noxa ‘Arctic fox’ ⇒ nosyih- : conneg. nosyiy°q ‘to hunt Arctic foxes’

I bet you saw similar examples of word derivation on some website, and thought it was a great idea to make up similar things.

Well, yes, Socialese is heavily influenced by the polysynthetic languages.

The fact is that there are many endangered languages, which can't survive, because people like you think they're just funny ways to pronounce English or Russian.

Don't put words in my mouth. I most certainly do not think of them that way. I based Socialese on them rather than the Indo-European languages because I admire them more than the IE languages, not because I think they're "funny ways to pronounce English or Russian".

Languages are not made up! They're the cornerstone of any culture, and are inseparable from the community. There's plenty of material on real languages; why not learn a real language instead of making shit up?

Yeah, which is why I found thousands of languages spoken by socialist cultures but decided to make up shit instead.:rolleyes: Shows what you know about my projects. If you knew anything, you'd know that most languages reflect the hierarchical nature of their societies. Socialese is a language without this hierarchy.

I suppose now you're going to tell me to stop learning musical composition because music isn't something that is made up but part of culture and there are plenty of existing musical traditions that are dying out because of pop music. You know what, though? I'm not them, so I can't make their music. I make my own, just as with constructed languages.

I can't begin to tell you just how pissed off your flames have made me.

Who here has tried there hand at constructing a language? What kind of language were you trying to create? How successful were you?

I have invented a few before, but never got beyond inventing the grammar and a few words.

If I'd did, it would be a totaly phinetic langale, with a simbol in teh alphabet for each of teh 44 phoneams. Other than that I think english is good enough. I mean, it has more words in it then any other langage in the world, and only two mean the same thing.