NationStates Jolt Archive

just kidding about roaming the earth part. I dunno if this was discussed already but i saw this on cnn about people

Animal-Human Hybrids Spark Controversy
Maryann Mott
National Geographic News

January 25, 2005
Scientists have begun blurring the line between human and animal by producing chimeras—a hybrid creature that's part human, part animal.

Chinese scientists at the Shanghai Second Medical University in 2003 successfully fused human cells with rabbit eggs. The embryos were reportedly the first human-animal chimeras successfully created. They were allowed to develop for several days in a laboratory dish before the scientists destroyed the embryos to harvest their stem cells.



In Minnesota last year researchers at the Mayo Clinic created pigs with human blood flowing through their bodies.

And at Stanford University in California an experiment might be done later this year to create mice with human brains.

Scientists feel that, the more humanlike the animal, the better research model it makes for testing drugs or possibly growing "spare parts," such as livers, to transplant into humans.

Watching how human cells mature and interact in a living creature may also lead to the discoveries of new medical treatments.

But creating human-animal chimeras—named after a monster in Greek mythology that had a lion's head, goat's body, and serpent's tail—has raised troubling questions: What new subhuman combination should be produced and for what purpose? At what point would it be considered human? And what rights, if any, should it have?

There are currently no U.S. federal laws that address these issues.

link to full story (http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2005/01/0125_050125_chimeras.html)



it is a little strange i think, but i like the idea of using these creations for stem cells then destroying them. because animal human hybrids would be a little scary. i dont think im ready to see a Mr. Tumnus running around :D

Wieeeerd. That's all I have. Oh, and First Post. And Post +1.

I want a wolf-kid.

Post +1

I read about this in a book by Dean Koontz. (Actually this might be all of his books).

Anway, it's really bad, and the world nearly ends. But it turns out okay, and the widowed cop ends up saving the world, finding true love, and adopting a super-intellegent labrador.

Does anyone know if plant/animal, plant/fungus, etc. hybrids are biologically possible? How far apart can genetics be for a hybrid to be possible?

Eh, depends, I suppose plants can grow just about anywhere....If you could have human cells, but with chloroplasts in them, they could make their own food, so starving to death would happen less, as long as you've got water, and don't live in some perpetually over cast place like England or something, and when you do, you could stilll eat human like. Maybe apendages that could be extended into the ground and gain nutrient?

I wouldn't mind.

Does anyone know if plant/animal, plant/fungus, etc. hybrids are biologically possible? How far apart can genetics be for a hybrid to be possible?

It depends what genes you're implanting. You don't stick a weed up a wolf's...*ahem*. You recombine specific genetic material from one organism into the genome of the other, and produce a hybrid. For example, I could maybe genetically engineer a hybrid that allowed an animal to perform some form of photosynthetic process, but genes regulating 'bodily' structure of a tree would probably not have an effect on a rabbit embryo conducive to being born alive.

This is worse BS then cloning lol.

What exactly do you mean? Are you anti-biotech then?

What is so wrong with this? And cloning?

Afraid of technology or something or the advances in science.

There is a moral dilema, but come on.

I'm all for science, technology, etc., but when you start dealing with flying tree-people and deciding whether dolphin-people get to vote... things start to seem a little f'd up.

Ah, comeon let them vote, it is not lke their vote would be any worse then what we have now.

You think this is screwy? Wait 20 years and 'future shock' won't even be a meaningful expression anymore in the face of the changes science and technology are going to bring. Uploads, cyborgs, group minds, genetically engineered superathletes and supergeniuses and Perfect People, every weird mix of genes possible, custom-made genomes and organisms, nanotech devices all over the place, computational power and bandwidth oozing out your pores....the baby boomers and such are going to be either in fetal position on a therapist's chair or barring themselves into hill forts....err, gated communities.

Especially dolphin people. dolphins are intelligent enough to learn from a different species. Can't say that for most humans.

Ah, comeon let them vote, it is not lke their vote would be any worse then what we have now.

Sure, you say that now, but once they take the senate, they'll banish us humans to the briney depths (stolen from Simpsons).

Fate of man kind.

(Good old simpson).

I've heard about this before. It's nifty. However, I have to wonder about the whole 'creating mice with human brains' business. I mean, are they going to like... figure out how to scale the brain down or something? Or are the mice just going to have freakishly huge heads and need to be suspended at all times or be crushed by their enormous craniums?

Don't worry, we'll create them with a susceptibility to a certain virus we created, but keep secret until they usurp us.

I've heard about this before. It's nifty. However, I have to wonder about the whole 'creating mice with human brains' business. I mean, are they going to like... figure out how to scale the brain down or something? Or are the mice just going to have freakishly huge heads and need to be suspended at all times or be crushed by their enormous craniums?

It's gonna need a whole lotta wrinkles....

....we're rather different. There aren't any other species that can teach us, both because not being intelligent they can't 'teach' anything, and also because there isn't any information for them to impart. We train dolphins to behave in certain ways that suit our needs. No animals really fit the bill for doing that to us....except for the mice, of course. :D The dolphins obviously can't, since they tried to warn us and failed.

Don't worry, we'll create them with a susceptibility to a certain virus we created, but keep secret until they usurp us.

...but by that time, they'll have genetically engineered a new subspecies thats 10 feet tall with complete disease immunity, razor sharp fangs, and an appetite for human flesh.

....we're rather different. There aren't any other species that can teach us, both because not being intelligent they can't 'teach' anything, and also because there isn't any information for them to impart. We train dolphins to behave in certain ways that suit our needs. No animals really fit the bill for doing that to us....except for the mice, of course. :D The dolphins obviously can't, since they tried to warn us and failed.

You'd think that, wouldn't you? I bet there's things you'd like to learn from other animals. How would you know they're not intelligent if you never listen?

...but by that time, they'll have genetically engineered a new subspecies thats 10 feet tall with complete disease immunity, razor sharp fangs, and an appetite for human flesh.

But we'll be able to create human flesh with inkjet printers by then, so we can train/capture them. the do some immediate taste bud rewiring, and have farmers selectively breed them, and have a 15 foot mry, with rock hard hides, and a taste for soon-to-be-endangered-by-them dolphins.

I've heard about this before. It's nifty. However, I have to wonder about the whole 'creating mice with human brains' business. I mean, are they going to like... figure out how to scale the brain down or something? Or are the mice just going to have freakishly huge heads and need to be suspended at all times or be crushed by their enormous craniums?

Nope, it doesn't really work like that. They'd have brains of the same size and such as normal mouse brains, but with human neurons. This probably isn't nearly as problematic as it sounds, since human intelligence as far as we can tell is an emergent property of the whole network, not something individually inherent to each neural cell.

Does anyone know if plant/animal, plant/fungus, etc. hybrids are biologically possible? How far apart can genetics be for a hybrid to be possible?
This was covered on an earlier thread. There have been genes from fireflys (lightning bugs) placed in plants and animals which causes them to glow. Science does this so they can find what parts of DNA do what. By placing firefly genes in a certain spot, they will know what that spot does because it will glow.

Also human genes have been put in goats so the goats will produce human hormones in their milk. The hormones can then be harvested to make medicine.

i would kinda like it 'cause chimeras are awsome. imagine being able to fly like a peregrine eagle, swim like a flying fish, or hop like a kangaroo. i might be mad but at least im an honest, kind mad

But we'll be able to create human flesh with inkjet printers by then, so we can train/capture them. the do some immediate taste bud rewiring, and have farmers selectively breed them, and have a 15 foot mry, with rock hard hides, and a taste for soon-to-be-endangered-by-them dolphins.

Whew... that makes me feel a lot better about the impending intraspecies holocaust.

Nope, it doesn't really work like that. They'd have brains of the same size and such as normal mouse brains, but with human neurons. This probably isn't nearly as problematic as it sounds, since human intelligence as far as we can tell is an emergent property of the whole network, not something individually inherent to each neural cell.

Oooh. So they're not exactly giving the mice human brains, just human brain tissue. Righto!

i would kinda like it 'cause chimeras are awsome. imagine being able to fly like a peregrine eagle, swim like a flying fish, or hop like a kangaroo. i might be mad but at least im an honest, kind mad

I don't think humans are ever really going to gain human flight. At least not without some really serious modification. Like being stuck extremely short, for one. Might need hollow bones as well... Lots of other things, too.

Huh. I hadn't even heard about this (except for that mouse with an ear on its back, but that was a long time ago). When Bush mentioned banning it during the State of the Union I was laughing my ass off, thinking he'd been watching too many B-movies and was just talking crap. Now I feel pretty dumb. :(

I don't think humans are ever really going to gain human flight. At least not without some really serious modification. Like being stuck extremely short, for one. Might need hollow bones as well... Lots of other things, too.

Yeah, only hollow boned midgets...if the wings got to big....welll.....wouldn't be pretty far as I can tell.

In Minnesota last year researchers at the Mayo Clinic created pigs with human blood flowing through their bodies.


that just bothers me for some reason.

that just bothers me for some reason.

Vampire Pigs.

Humans running in terror with mustard or sweet and sour sauce on THEM!

I'm all for science, technology, etc., but when you start dealing with flying tree-people and deciding whether dolphin-people get to vote... things start to seem a little f'd up.

LOL.... and I'm pro-biotech

I think it's a good idea, they can't speak yet but all the dolphins I've met seem decidedly liberal. As for flying tree people they would be up in the atmosphere making the ozone we need!

Just look at platypus.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Platypus#Physical_description

"The male platypus has venomous ankle spurs"

"It also has a reptile-like gait, with legs that are on the sides of rather than underneath the body."

"It is one of the few mammals known to have a sense of electroception"

"Although the platypus has two separate ovaries, only the left one is functional."

"It keeps its eyes tightly shut when swimming, relying completely on its other senses."

I'd say this is the ultimate proof that God doesn't exist :D

Just look at platypus.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Platypus#Physical_description

"The male platypus has venomous ankle spurs"

"It also has a reptile-like gait, with legs that are on the sides of rather than underneath the body."

"It is one of the few mammals known to have a sense of electroception"

"Although the platypus has two separate ovaries, only the left one is functional."

"the only mammals that lay eggs instead of giving birth to live young"

I'd say this is the ultimate proof that God doesn't exist :D

LIES! All monotremes are mammals that lay eggs. Echidnas lay eggs too. :p

LIES! All monotremes are mammals that lay eggs. Echidnas lay eggs too. :p

My bad. I didn't read the article well enough -> my quote was misleading.

Just look at platypus.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Platypus#Physical_description

"The male platypus has venomous ankle spurs"

"It also has a reptile-like gait, with legs that are on the sides of rather than underneath the body."

"It is one of the few mammals known to have a sense of electroception"

"Although the platypus has two separate ovaries, only the left one is functional."

I'd say this is the ultimate proof that God doesn't exist :D

Or that he has a sick twisted sense of humor....


P.S. Or a two-year-old he let create one of the animals of the world.

Or that he has a sick twisted sense of humor....


P.S. Or a two-year-old he let create one of the animals of the world.

I think God just used all his/hers leftovers. (Probably same thing with German grammar, now think of it)

What's funny is that I read an article about this like...a year ago.

Its just now news? =/

You think this is screwy? Wait 20 years and 'future shock' won't even be a meaningful expression anymore in the face of the changes science and technology are going to bring. Uploads, cyborgs, group minds, genetically engineered superathletes and supergeniuses and Perfect People, every weird mix of genes possible, custom-made genomes and organisms, nanotech devices all over the place, computational power and bandwidth oozing out your pores....the baby boomers and such are going to be either in fetal position on a therapist's chair or barring themselves into hill forts....err, gated communities.


Twenty years? Bullshit. I'd put that at one hundred years plus, if ever. In the fifties, they were saying that by now the helicopter and hovercar would replace the car, crime would be classed as a mental illness and eradicated, internal combustion engines would be a thing of the past, and we'd have colonies on the moon. And we're still waiting.

Most likely in twenty years, we'll have roughly what we have now only a bit better, with possible significant leaps in a select few fields mirroring the massive advances in computer technology between the fifties and now. Assuming that bird flu doesn't wipe us out first, or peak oil doesn't hit us like an express train, or global warming doesn't crispy-fry us.

Twenty years? Bullshit. I'd put that at one hundred years plus, if ever. In the fifties, they were saying that by now the helicopter and hovercar would replace the car, crime would be classed as a mental illness and eradicated, internal combustion engines would be a thing of the past, and we'd have colonies on the moon. And we're still waiting.

Most likely in twenty years, we'll have roughly what we have now only a bit better, with possible significant leaps in a select few fields mirroring the massive advances in computer technology between the fifties and now. Assuming that bird flu doesn't wipe us out first, or peak oil doesn't hit us like an express train, or global warming doesn't crispy-fry us.

1. Have you ever seen a graph of technological innovation vs. time? It isn't linear - if it was, you'd be perfectly correct. But it isn't; it's exponential, and we're getting ever closer to going near-vertical. Change is continuously accelerating.

2. Several radical areas of major innovation and change are right around the corner: biotechnology is in furious development, nanotech is starting to kick into a serious R&D gear, and infotech is self-explanatory; just look around you, and read Moore's Law.

3. As far as one specific area goes, Moore's Law says it all. By the early 2020's we'll have the necessary digital memory to store the data of a human brain for <$1000. Uploads, here we come. Before that, we have WiMAX practically being packaged, bandwidth and memory and processing power growth show no signs of faltering, and major quantum computing advances have been made. We know more about the brain and nervous system every day. Do you really think that we'll just be able to store longer movies for less? Computational and communicative information technology represents the greatest revolution in the history of mankind, and will completely change the human condition.

Vampire Pigs.

Humans running in terror with mustard or sweet and sour sauce on THEM!


vampire pigs will roam the earth.

http://www.slowfood.com/img_sito/premio/vincitori2001/images/Serbia/Serbia_03.jpg


FEAR!