NationStates Jolt Archive

TB is in for a shock these past few days. The "religious hatred" leglislation was sent back from the Lords with amendments. This was not what TB wanted and pressed forward with the Government's proposals. With 20 Labour MPs away at a bi-election and over 100 rebels and with Conservatives and Lib Dems in full force the Lords proposals were pushed through. Then came a second part to be voted on,this time, so confident was Blair he didn't even bother to vote. Victory to the Rebels, by one Vote. A cock-up and no mistake. It does show the willingness of Labour Mps to Rebel against Blair. With an important schools bill looming and with threatening Rebellion from some even in the cabinet, Balir could well lose, and that would be grounds for resignation. Blair does have conservative support however.

So in the future how will Blair fair?

Hopefully as abysmally as he presently is, and as deplorably porly as Brown will.
:)

Frankly, I am thoroughly enjoying too, oppurtunictic, demagogic unprincipled fools that they are.

So in the future how will Blair fair?
Schoolboys will punch him, schoolgirls will laugh and pull his hair, and I....I will sit idly by, smoking delightedly....

TB is in for a shock these past few days. The "religious hatred" leglislation was sent back from the Lords with amendments. This was not what TB wanted and pressed forward with the Government's proposals. With 20 Labour MPs away at a bi-election and over 100 rebels and with Conservatives and Lib Dems in full force the Lords proposals were pushed through. Then came a second part to be voted on,this time, so confident was Blair he didn't even bother to vote. Victory to the Rebels, by one Vote. A cock-up and no mistake. It does show the willingness of Labour Mps to Rebel against Blair. With an important schools bill looming and with threatening Rebellion from some even in the cabinet, Balir could well lose, and that would be grounds for resignation. Blair does have conservative support however.

So in the future how will Blair fair?
To be honest, he'd have been gone by now if the bombings back in July hadn't given the tosspot an excuse to not hand over the PM role to Brown as he'd promised. (He's probably very annoyed that it didn't happen sooner, but this will have to wait on his autobiography, one imagines.) Even given that, his days are numbered and it's only a matter of how long he can eke out his career and how much damage he's going to do to the labour party in the process.
It will be a pity to see him go to the slow process of political entropy and public loathing, though: I rather had my heart set on assassination.

It will be a pity to see him go to the slow process of political entropy and public loathing, though: I rather had my heart set on assassination.

Maybe shot be an asylum seeker with NO IDENTITY CARD!!!!! He turns to Cherie and whispers "I die for England" and passes on. I think I might shed a tear myself....

Hopefully as abysmally as he presently is, and as deplorably porly as Brown will.
:)

Frankly, I am thoroughly enjoying too, oppurtunictic, demagogic unprincipled fools that they are.

Still like your big words eh? ^^

I hope Blair gets out of the way soon so Brown can step in and hopefully sort things out a bit. Frankly Blair is looking more and more like he'd make a better Tory leader than Labour every day now. He seems intent on taking our civil liberties away.

Still like your big words eh? ^^

I hope Blair gets out of the way soon so Brown can step in and hopefully sort things out a bit. Frankly Blair is looking more and more like he'd make a better Tory leader than Labour every day now. He seems intent on taking our civil liberties away.

Since when are Tories against civil liberties? Who gave Women the vote, who
defends the common law against the EU. We Torys believe firmly in civil liberities. The whole buisness about interning memebers of the IRA without trial was a mistake we don't like to talk about.

Maybe shot be an asylum seeker with NO IDENTITY CARD!!!!! He turns to Cherie and whispers "I die for England" and passes on. I think I might shed a tear myself....

Good lord yes, akin to Nelson, but so much more funny.

Since when are Tories against civil liberties? Who gave Women the vote, who
defends the common law against the EU. We Torys believe firmly in civil liberities. The whole buisness about interning memebers of the IRA without trial was a mistake we don't like to talk about.

Eh, it's only recently the Tories have started potraying themselves as the party of freedom. Although I agree - Cameron certainly is no way near as anti-civil liberties as Blair.

I don't want to be inflamatory but being Irish I see Tony Blair as a blessing. Never before has a British ruler been so commited to peace and equality in the north. His frequent trips were morale boosters for my country and its people helping us believe that there will be light at the end of what is a very dark tunnel.:)

Still like your big words eh? ^^

I hope Blair gets out of the way soon so Brown can step in and hopefully sort things out a bit. Frankly Blair is looking more and more like he'd make a better Tory leader than Labour every day now. He seems intent on taking our civil liberties away.

Civil liberties? Frankly, Blair's recent succession of "anti-terror" legislation is poorly disguised knee jerk demagoguery, he merely aims to procure a reputation beyind that of "the jug eared, unprincipled twat who followed Bush myopically into Iraq".

Im a 15 years old and i dont dislike Tony Blair. (and thats rare in my age group!) I think he has done a fairly good job on the whole although he has messed up on occasions i can addmit that. i think that he can have as much time as he wants being PM and then maby hand over to Brown about a year before the next elcection.:rolleyes:

Since when are Tories against civil liberties? Who gave Women the vote, who
defends the common law against the EU. We Torys believe firmly in civil liberities. The whole buisness about interning memebers of the IRA without trial was a mistake we don't like to talk about.
Since about 1978 in real terms, unfortunately. Much as it pains me to admit it, there are a few Tories I admire greatly, but we're not likely to see another Ted Heath emerging from the party in the near future. (Which is a great pity, really.)
And don't get me started on defending the common law from the EU: at this point, I'm far more worried about who's going to defend the law of the land from Washington, and besides Clarke, I'm stumped if I can think of anybody in the Conservative party with even the faintest interest in that.

Since about 1978 in real terms, unfortunately. Much as it pains me to admit it, there are a few Tories I admire greatly, but we're not likely to see another Ted Heath emerging from the party in the near future. (Which is a great pity, really.)
And don't get me started on defending the common law from the EU: at this point, I'm far more worried about who's going to defend the law of the land from Washington, and besides Clarke, I'm stumped if I can think of anybody in the Conservative party with even the faintest interest in that.

Davis?

Im a 15 years old and i dont dislike Tony Blair. (and thats rare in my age group!) I think he has done a fairly good job on the whole although he has messed up on occasions i can addmit that. i think that he can have as much time as he wants being PM and then maby hand over to Brown about a year before the next elcection.:rolleyes:

Naturally, I assume you are either below the middle classes, ethnic in origin, or special, since he is the most lambasted minister since possibly Thatcher, or, to my mind, Lloyd George.

As for him having "as much time as he wants", I would concur actually, since it would merely compound our victory in 2009.

Davis?
Pro Europe or anti American?

Pro Europe or anti American?

Hence the question mark, I sincerely do not know.

Blair wants to stay on until mid 2007 at least so he can say he's been PM for 10 years.

That's the kind of c*nt he is.

Hence the question mark, I sincerely do not know.
To be honest, I've not been paying all that much attention to the current crop (or possibly the details haven't sunk in properly yet): I'm just assuming that they wouldn't have been in the leadership contest in the first place if they weren't anti-Europe. They'd have hardly replaced Major with Thatcher's evil munchkin rather than Clarke back in '97 if that wasn't the case, would they?

not having really known the guy, i can't say if what he is currently involved in has merit or not. i can say that his help and support of operations in iraq and afghanistan are appreciated here. i like democracy and inexpensive gas. people can complain all they want about how horrible the U.S. foreign policy is, but we didn't mess all these places up over the past 500 years. can you say balfour declaration?

I'm a socialist. I support the Labour Party. Therefore I dislike Tony Blair.

I'd love to see Old Labour make a comeback but I'm fairly cynical about that happening.

Well, looks like at least Tony Blair managed to fulfill his dream of being a great statesman - he has far more support from outside his country than within if this is anything to go by!

Since when are Tories against civil liberties? Who gave Women the vote

The Liberals.

Tony Blair is a failure.

Education - Standards have dropped alarmingly since he came to power. For example, a maths A gained today was a C around 1997, and a borderline pass under Thatcher/Major. His current education proposals effectively remove science from the national curriculum. Most children at school today will leave the system functionally illiterate.

Health - Hmm, where did the NHS dentists go? Oh, haha, silly me, we have to pay for it now, with no corresponding tax reduction.

Energy - Dumbass. His legacy will be the most idiotic period of procrastination since Thatcher decided the energy department was unnecessary. But it's OK, he knows it'll be Brown who will get shafted for the blackouts.

Law and Order - Passed more criminal law reforms than every government since WW2 combined. He should take a walk from Longsight to Moss Side, alone, and see the improvement.

Foreign Policy - Say what you like about the Conservative party in government, but their military adventures were usually for the UK's benefit, not someone else's.

Europe - He pissed the opportunity away.

Well, looks like at least Tony Blair managed to fulfill his dream of being a great statesman - he has far more support from outside his country than within if this is anything to go by!

I'm not sure this forum is wholly representative of the UK. To my mind, the Labour government has delivered social and constitutional reforms of an order not seen for 40 years. The continued assault on the poverty trap alone is enough to commend the government. I dont think I need tell you about the tremendous success of the economy (an accolade previously thought unattainable by a Labour govt)

It is a government which, arguably, would not be in power without Blair. That in itself earns my support.

Incidentally, I find the fact that Blair has achieved things for those who are
[QUOTE=The blessed Chris]below the middle classes, ethnic in origin, or special[QUOTE]
an asset, and should not be used as a weapon to attack those who wish to take part in a (mostly) mature debate. Keep expressing your opinions British persons, and dont let some bigot shout you down.

people can complain all they want about how horrible the U.S. foreign policy is, but we didn't mess all these places up over the past 500 years.
The Iranians may not agree with that, unfortunately: the fact that a theocracy is now running the country was largely due to the reinstatement of the Shah in the '70s.

I don't want to be inflamatory but being Irish I see Tony Blair as a blessing. Never before has a British ruler been so commited to peace and equality in the north. His frequent trips were morale boosters for my country and its people helping us believe that there will be light at the end of what is a very dark tunnel.:)

And being Irish, I preferred the hostile honesty of the deplorable Thatcher, than the sleazy cold smile of Bliar. Hes "Tory lite" - the same beast (if not worse in some respects) in lambs clothing, with a lust for legislation which surpasses even our own McDowells. A pox on him and his unctuous kind.

people can complain all they want about how horrible the U.S. foreign policy is, but we didn't mess all these places up over the past 500 years.

So the last 50 are playing "catch-up" then...this explains much.

I'm not sure this forum is wholly representative of the UK. To my mind, the Labour government has delivered social and constitutional reforms of an order not seen for 40 years.

What's so great about the reforms they've made? They've weakened the union by creating devolved assemblies with far-reaching powers, and weakened the effective bits (ie the House of Lords) in order to satisfy an old labour desire for class war.

The continued assault on the poverty trap alone is enough to commend the government.

Since 1997, social mobility has actually fallen, which suggets that the government is doing very poorly in its attempt to create a more equitable society. Working-class children in 1950 had a better chance of moving up the income scale than those born today. Inequality has fallen under this government, but only by a fall in the wealth of the very top: the wealth of the bottom 10% is still extremely low.


I dont think I need tell you about the tremendous success of the economy (an accolade previously thought unattainable by a Labour govt)

Successful economy? Give over. Britain has gone down in almost every single table of economies (whether it be competitiveness or business-friendly regulation). Our national debt has not been substantially reduced, and the government has been running a deficit for most of its existence. Our levels of taxation are now exceeding Germany's, so don't expect the Chancellor to be able to crow about the economy in the near future.

<snip>
Hear, hear! We'll be headed for a recession soon because of Labour's overspending on public services, and people will finally get tired of their oppressive nanny-statism and their stupid scatter-gun banning approach to deal with any potential social ill.

I'm a socialist. I support the Labour Party. Therefore I dislike Tony Blair.

I'd love to see Old Labour make a comeback but I'm fairly cynical about that happening.
i think the lib dems are our only hope left for anything like realistic socialism in UK politics...


though we must remember one thing, one saving grace for Blair
he is better than the tories (maybe marginally, but he has sure done better than the 1979 - 1997 tory era)

[QUOTE=Sculldom]I'm not sure this forum is wholly representative of the UK. To my mind, the Labour government has delivered social and constitutional reforms of an order not seen for 40 years. The continued assault on the poverty trap alone is enough to commend the government. I dont think I need tell you about the tremendous success of the economy (an accolade previously thought unattainable by a Labour govt)

It is a government which, arguably, would not be in power without Blair. That in itself earns my support.

Incidentally, I find the fact that Blair has achieved things for those who are
an asset, and should not be used as a weapon to attack those who wish to take part in a (mostly) mature debate. Keep expressing your opinions British persons, and dont let some bigot shout you down.[QUOTE]

Bigot? No.

I happen to be self-interested, and in relation to labour, the lower echelons of society only prosper through exorbitant taxation upon those natural voters, since the re-alignment of urban constituencies has ensured that only a centrally oriented or further left can obtain power. Incidentally, what would be happening to the economy presently?

Naturally, I assume you are either below the middle classes, ethnic in origin, or special, since he is the most lambasted minister since possibly Thatcher, or, to my mind, Lloyd George.

As for him having "as much time as he wants", I would concur actually, since it would merely compound our victory in 2009.

Ooooh Burned ;p
Hail the Middle classes! May we force socialism on the lower classes even tho they dont really want it! ;p
Vote Lib Dems.
Because its fun annoying people.

He's a great public speaker.

He happens, however, to be a slimeball.

i think the lib dems are our only hope left for anything like realistic socialism in UK politics...
Sadly the same can be said of laissez-faire. Believe it or not, Labour is not Capitalist. They have:

- Introduced a minimum wage.
- Raised taxes, MASSIVELY. We have overtaken Germany.
- Increased public spending, MASSIVELY. We have overtaken Germany.

THey are as socialist as you're really going to get, and the Lib Dems are really a political vacuum.

though we must remember one thing, one saving grace for Blair
he is better than the tories (maybe marginally, but he has sure done better than the 1979 - 1997 tory era)
He really hasnt.

Ooooh Burned ;p
Hail the Middle classes! May we force socialism on the lower classes even tho they dont really want it! ;p
Vote Lib Dems.
Because its fun annoying people.

Vote Lib Dems, we need the sympathy....:p

evening mate:)

Vote Lib Dems, we need the sympathy....:p

evening mate:)

Eeeeevnin govna.

Liberal Democrats are gonna lose <----> this many seats because they got rid of the Scotsman.
Who actually CARES hes an alcoholic.

Sadly the same can be said of laissez-faire. Believe it or not, Labour is not Capitalist. They have:

- Introduced a minimum wage.
- Raised taxes, MASSIVELY. We have overtaken Germany.
- Increased public spending, MASSIVELY. We have overtaken Germany.

THey are as socialist as you're really going to get, and the Lib Dems are really a political vacuum.

not socialist enough, and too capitalist.
have they renationalised any key industries? no. have they continued evil tory privatisation? yes.
just one issue but thats rather more capitalist than socialist if you ask me

He really hasnt.
he hasn't gone back to the days of boom & bust... the economy has stayed strong dispite world economic decline and war, unlike the tories engineering a recession in a time of world economic boom.
in this way, labour have been good. whether that's Blair or Brown's doing i don't know...

Eeeeevnin govna.

Liberal Democrats are gonna lose <----> this many seats because they got rid of the Scotsman.
Who actually CARES hes an alcoholic.

Not me, found it more fun than David "low cal low fat" Cameron anyway.

Personally the fact that the Torys are more left wing than LAbour makes me cry. The fact that all the old Labour men are being killed is alos a bad thing, the sooner he goes the sooner Labour can get abck to where it belongs-the left!

Tony Blair is the only exception to my belief that killing people is bad. He is the only person I would preach hate about. He is the only person I would become a suicide bomber over. (Not that I will)

Personally the fact that the Torys are more left wing than LAbour makes me cry. The fact that all the old Labour men are being killed is alos a bad thing, the sooner he goes the sooner Labour can get abck to where it belongs-the left!
Indeed it is true. With Cameron in the Tory front seat, by the time of the next General Election (I'll be 17 or something), the Conservatives will have become the Liberal Democrats, and New Labour will have become the Conservative Party. The Lib Dems will have disbanded or something (they REALLY are on a slippery slope)

Indeed it is true. With Cameron in the Tory front seat, by the time of the next General Election (I'll be 17 or something), the Conservatives will have become the Liberal Democrats, and New Labour will have become the Conservative Party. The Lib Dems will have disbanded or something (they REALLY are on a slippery slope)

Which is why you should vote Intellectual Socialist :)
On the Ballots 2016 for Wales
2020 for Britain.
Welcome the new age of Intelligence :)
If we find out you havnt voted for us, we shall announce to our loyalists where you live :)
Guess what happens next ;p

Which is why you should vote Intellectual Socialist :)
On the Ballots 2016 for Wales
2020 for Britain.
Welcome the new age of Intelligence :)
If we find out you havnt voted for us, we shall announce to our loyalists where you live :)
Guess what happens next ;p
It'll be too tiny to make a difference. As soon as I turn 18 (in 4 years' time) I'll immediately vote Liberal Democrats for local elections (and then general too)

I would like TB to go, but at the same time don't want GB to come in because he would be the worst PM of all time...just look at the economy right now, in huge amounts of debt, the housing market is in decline so is the retail market, industry collapsed years ago, Rover have gone...i mean its really in the shits. And GB can't admit this and rather add more taxes which are making the problem worse! Imagine what would happen if GB was in charge and he got a problem...he would make it worse by not reacting, or if he did properly make it worse again by over reacting!

TB IMO should stay until we have a suitable candidate to take over his job...so that will be a 10 year wait then! :D

Graham Harvey

I'm a conservative and I like him, as seen as he is actually the closest thing to a conservative in the 3 main parties.

I'm British and I dislike him

Indeed it is true. With Cameron in the Tory front seat, by the time of the next General Election (I'll be 17 or something), the Conservatives will have become the Liberal Democrats, and New Labour will have become the Conservative Party. The Lib Dems will have disbanded or something (they REALLY are on a slippery slope)
The Lib Dems won't isband-there pritty resilient.

I think that the UK Independance Party should take advantage of the current political crisis.

I think that the UK Independance Party should take advantage of the current political crisis.
However are the UKIP going to do that? They couldn't even compete with the Tories when they were being led by Howard the Schmuck and the Mail were bitching that they weren't right wing enough anymore.
About the only thing they have going for them is that they aren't Veritas, but I doubt that they'd be able to defeat the Church Of The Undead Elvis Party in a by election either.

:headbang: As a liberal American, I wish TB had told GWB to take a hike ages ago. I approve, however, of his warnings on Global Warming, in contrast to our sycophantic relationship with Big Oil. I'm not privy to all the comings and goings and intrigue of British Politics, so my perspective is limited. But TB seems to have as much backbone as the US Media and the US democratic party (unfortunately.):gundge:

:headbang: As a liberal American, I wish TB had told GWB to take a hike ages ago. I approve, however, of his warnings on Global Warming, in contrast to our sycophantic relationship with Big Oil. I'm not privy to all the comings and goings and intrigue of British Politics, so my perspective is limited. But TB seems to have as much backbone as the US Media and the US democratic party (unfortunately.):gundge:
That seems about right: he certainly didn't try to negotiate over invading Iraq, and given Bush didn't want to make that a purely American undertaking, he had some clout there.

I think that the UK Independance Party should take advantage of the current political crisis.
Despite the fact there a load of stupid xnophobic manics.

Despite the fact there a load of stupid xnophobic manics.

Nonetheless the closed border immigration policy they advocate is admirable, as is their nationalism, notably given its dilution under Labour.

Nonetheless the closed border immigration policy they advocate is admirable, as is their nationalism, notably given its dilution under Labour.
I balive in boarders open to immigration (with nesscary cheaks of course) and I don't like nationalism, patriotism is fine, supporting England is fine, thinking Britian is the best in the best is not fine.