NationStates Jolt Archive


Yet another useless measurement system.

Silliopolous
31-01-2006, 20:00
YEs - From the same people (The US Government) that brought you the Terror Alert system, "Ohhhh it's amber today?...I don't remember, is that 'carry on normally but look distrustfully at the other people on the subway?' or is that 'whimper while hitting the refresh on you browser at CNN to see if Butte spontaneously combusted for no good reason?'... c'mon people...don't just color code it -TELL ME HOW FRIGHTENED I NEED TO BE TODAY!!!!!"...well, aparently they discovered that there was still one type of weather just not adequately measured.

You get your windspeed scale for Hurricanes. Your scale for Tornadoes. Your scale for Earthquakes. Wind Chill factors and the Humidex.

Goddamn it though, all they ever talk about with snow is inches.

Now inches may be important... to men AND (most) women....but it just isn't neatly enough compartmented into a few simple categories. So, with that in mind, the NOAA now has NESIS (http://www.noaanews.noaa.gov/stories2006/s2567.htm)


Jan. 30, 2006 — NOAA announced today that for the remainder of the winter season, its scientists will give the public a new, easy-to-understand scale to categorize major snowstorms after they affect the Northeast. The Northeast Snowfall Impact Scale, or NESIS, will quickly calculate the impact of a powerful snowstorm soon after it strikes, and give it a rank, similar to methods used to categorize the strength of tornadoes.

Until now, NOAA scientists had no way of sizing up a snowstorm's intensity with an index as understandable as the Saffir-Simpson scale for hurricanes, or the Fujita scale for tornadoes. While winds are used to measure hurricane intensity, NESIS will rank the severity of an East Coast snowstorm based on snowfall amount and the population of the affected areas. With NESIS, scientists can quickly assess a snowstorm's impact today, compare it with a storm of the past and assign it one of five categories: Notable, Significant, Major, Crippling or Extreme.

"The snowfall impact scale is designed to look retrospectively at a recent snowstorm—not to forecast one," said Uccellini, also a noted winter weather expert. "With its rankings, the scale will also give a better perspective on how these major storms affected populations in the Northeast." The snowstorm that moved through Northeast on December 8-9 was a NESIS category 2 (Significant) storm.


Oh yes. Just what everything needs. Simplicity. Because people are too fucking stupid to figure out how bad the blizzard they had two days ago was.

Not only that, it's not even predictive. It's a simple measurement of inches of snow, and the impact is designated based on how many people it impacted. So three days AFTER the blizzard you'll get to find out if you were Crippled, or if it was only Significant. Of course, by then you've long since dug your way out and got on with your life. But hey - won't it be good to know for sure how bad it was?

Fourteen feet of snow fell in Shitville Vermont? Doesn't register. Sorry guys - you didn't get "Crippled". Why? There just aren't enough of you to matter really...

Does it take into account the type of snow? Nope. Inches only. Let me tell you, anyone who lives through winter knows that eight inches of heavy slush is way more damaging than 18 inches of light fluffy stuff. Especially if it comes with a nice bit of freezing rain thrown in the mix.

And how usefull is this country-wide? Not at all. NorthEast only.

I assume this is based on the realization that anytime two snowflakes fall within a mile of each other in Texas it would qualify as crippling..... so it's hardly worth measuring.

But there you have it. Your tax dollars at work. There are now people getting paid to compare your latest snowfall with previous ones and cheerfully inform you two days later whether it was Significant or not. Because I'm sure that you have all been dying to know this. And rest assured some weather report is going to start telling you this in brethless detail: "This is Frosty McNumbnuts with the FUCKU weather team with a breaking news story. And it's offical. The NOAA has JUST declared that the storm we had three days ago was indeed Crippling. Feel free to now rest easy knowing that you were indeed right to have been really pissed at the weather then - even though it's a lovely day right now. Now, back to whatever stupid reality show it is that you are watching."


So let's all say thank you to the NOAA for something "Easy To Understand".


What's less easy to understand is why they bothered....
Deep Kimchi
31-01-2006, 20:04
And you wonder why I hate the Federal Government, and the Federal Bureaucracy in particular...
Silliopolous
31-01-2006, 20:06
And you wonder why I hate the Federal Government, and the Federal Bureaucracy in particular...


Hating the government doesn't suprise me. The fact that you often manage to do it partisanly is what suprises me!
Deep Kimchi
31-01-2006, 20:09
Hating the government doesn't suprise me. The fact that you often manage to do it partisanly is what suprises me!
I learned a long, long time ago that the villian in the government is not the Congress, not the Executive, and not the Supreme Court.

In fact, the villain isn't even mentioned in the Constitution, but holds far, far more power than any of the three mentioned.

It's the Bureaucracy, which MUST be fed and WILL have its way.
Letila
31-01-2006, 20:21
And you wonder why I hate the Federal Government, and the Federal Bureaucracy in particular...

I never understood that attitude among the conservatives (nor the reverse attitude among liberals). How do you plan on enforcing laws against abortion, porn, drugs, etc. without a strong government?
Deep Kimchi
31-01-2006, 20:27
I never understood that attitude among the conservatives (nor the reverse attitude among liberals). How do you plan on enforcing laws against abortion, porn, drugs, etc. without a strong government?

State and local government, not Federal government.
Letila
31-01-2006, 20:42
State and local government, not Federal government.

Why, though? What makes state politicians so great compared to federal ones?
Deep Kimchi
31-01-2006, 20:45
Why, though? What makes state politicians so great compared to federal ones?

They are more cognizant of local issues.

With the Feds, everything is "one size fits all" right up your ass.
Balipo
31-01-2006, 21:07
Living in Buffalo, NY...I think we came up the levels before.

1-16 inches - things stay open "Level 1"
16 - 18 with working plows - things stay open "Level 2"
18 + everything is closed - Level 3
Free Soviets
31-01-2006, 21:08
Not only that, it's not even predictive. It's a simple measurement of inches of snow, and the impact is designated based on how many people it impacted. So three days AFTER the blizzard you'll get to find out if you were Crippled, or if it was only Significant. Of course, by then you've long since dug your way out and got on with your life. But hey - won't it be good to know for sure how bad it was?

so you disapprove of coming up with a standard for comparing snowstorm-caused disruptions across various years and locations? it seems fairly damn useful to me.
Free Soviets
31-01-2006, 21:10
And you wonder why I hate the Federal Government, and the Federal Bureaucracy in particular...

because you hate scientists comparing things?
Silliopolous
31-01-2006, 21:23
so you disapprove of coming up with a standard for comparing snowstorm-caused disruptions across various years and locations? it seems fairly damn useful to me.

Really? In what sense?

As an after-the-fact measurement it doesn't include ANY of the variables I would expect to measure impact.

Cases in point: It assumes that 6 inches of light snow is as disruptive as 6 inches of heavy snow. It's not.

It doesn't include wind factors - a heavy snow in light wind can be far less injurous than a lighter snow (measured inchwise only) in strong, gusty winds that cause dangerous drifts on highways.

It doesn't include temperature. From a damage standoint, you wind up with far more stranded cars with complications from severe cold-related issues (car batteries failing etc), hypothermia cases etc, than if the weather is warmer.

Other contributing factors: Light snow over top of freezing rain can cause the most dangerous circumstances. It's not a factor.

No, if you want to know how a snowstorm affected lives AFTER THE FACT, ask the cities

a) How many man-hours it took to clean it up.
b) How many traffic accidents it caused.
c) How many powerlines came down.
d) How many fatalities it caused.

etc.

A measurement based exclusively on actual depth of snow fallen, the rate of accumulation, and population, and then factored down to one of five simple categories is incredibly misleading to the point of uselessness.
Dodudodu
31-01-2006, 21:23
They wasted my parents' tax money on THIS!?!
Ephebe-Tsort
01-02-2006, 03:54
Living in Buffalo, NY...I think we came up the levels before.

1-16 inches - things stay open "Level 1"
16 - 18 with working plows - things stay open "Level 2"
18 + everything is closed - Level 3

Luck you. I likve in SE England... any time we get more than a couple of inches, everything seems to seize up. It's odd... we get a little snow every year, and yet railways etc always seem to be unprepared and surprised, and unable to run anything like a normal service.:rolleyes:
Free Soviets
01-02-2006, 04:07
A measurement based exclusively on actual depth of snow fallen, the rate of accumulation, and population, and then factored down to one of five simple categories is incredibly misleading to the point of uselessness.

of course, covering any more data for the entire area affected by a storm would make it nigh on impossible to compare one storm to the next.
Peisandros
01-02-2006, 04:25
So.. The scale is for inches of snow? Well fuck, that's stupid.
[NS:::]Vegetarianistica
01-02-2006, 04:43
in Duluth, MN you measure the snow in feet, else it doesn't count.

1 foot = snowblower and plows. sledding, snowmobiling, fun driving.
2 feet = snowblower and plows. sledding, snowmobiling, fun driving.
3 feet = snowblower and plows. sledding, snowmobiling, no driving.
New Rafnaland
01-02-2006, 04:45
<snip>

Hee.

You just mentioned Butte.

Spontaneously combusting.

Have a cookie!
Free Soviets
01-02-2006, 05:11
So.. The scale is for inches of snow?

no
Silliopolous
01-02-2006, 13:21
of course, covering any more data for the entire area affected by a storm would make it nigh on impossible to compare one storm to the next.

In other words, you agree that it's pretty useless - but think that it's worthwhile just so you can say that a comparison WAS made?

If it has no value, then don't waste money on it.

That's my theory anyway.