NationStates Jolt Archive

Talk about anything remotely Spanish or Iberian here.

To start up a real converstaion by NS standards:

Why didn't Spain and Portugaul become leaders of their former colonies after they gained independence? Why did they revert back to being members of Western Europe?

And to not hijack another thread:
Go!...Barcelona (and Catalunya in general) is my favourite place. Miró, Gaudi, Dali, Picasso, great food, great landscapes, great bars, great shopping...and the famous bad service. (don't speak English, or if you do, try to speak it with a foreign accent)
I've been to Spain only once, on a month long trip. From Madrid, down to Morocco, back up the Eastern coast, and then back to Madrid. I don't have to worry about speaking English, I think I could pass for a very pale Mexican, as I can a little Spanish (presently). Anyhow, Spain is great. I want to check out the more Northernly reaches of Iberia when I return. Obviously: Barcelona, the tomatoe fest, and et cetera.

Have the Basques calmed down lately? As far as car-bombings and whatnot?

Spain is okay

I can't understand how someone says that Spanish gastronomy is good...they should try Italian or Portuguese to see what variety and taste really are.

Spanish folk music rules.

I can't understand how someone says that Spanish gastronomy is good...they should try Italian or Portuguese to see what variety and taste really are.
Yeah, there's such a big difference between those countries...
Have you tried anything else than a Spanish omelette?

I can't understand how someone says that Spanish gastronomy is good...they should try Italian or Portuguese to see what variety and taste really are.
Maybe they all taste quite good. There mustn't always be a number one. And then there's perception.
I've never had any Portuguese food, however, my experiences with Spanish dishes, Latin-American food, and pizza has been quite satisfactory.
I must say, I didn't like what I had in Morroco. But I'll be willing to try something from there again, if I ever get the chance, as there are far too many variables to consider when consuming things.

Spanish folk music rules.
Yup.
But, pretty much any folk music rocks in my opinion.

Yup.
But, pretty much any folk music rocks in my opinion.

Well, Spanish guitar music in particular rocks my jocks.

Well, Spanish guitar music in particular rocks my jocks.

I agree with that :)

I can't really judge on Spain since I've only been there once, the spanish people that I know seem to be nice...

Have the Basques calmed down lately? As far as car-bombings and whatnot?
Well, there are something on the news every now and then (bombings) but I quess so. At least some former ETA supporters have decided to give up violence and try to achieve things via politics. Some Spanish politicians won't believe that Batasuna is not a violent organisation. They even banned a democratically elected coalition (something-Batasuna). I don't know what to think about any of it. I really don't know enough about the situation and how it has changed in recent years. But based on what I've read I think that Batasuna should be seen as regular political party.

Some military highchief (yeah, I know a lot about military :D ) was forced to resign after he made some harsh comments about Basques and their future few weeks ago.

I think Spain is a overall good country with its climate, history and people taken into consideration. Portugal I had nothing but good times there. Seemed like a humble but proud people. Very old Europe in Portugal with it's old roads and buildings. Only place I know where an old Roman stadium was turned into apartments(Condeixa). Although I know recently they have made alot of progression to modernize.

Well, there are something on the news every now and then (bombings) but I quess so. At least some former ETA supporters have decided to give up violence and try to achieve things via politics. Some Spanish politicians won't believe that Batasuna is not a violent organisation. They even banned a democratically elected coalition (something-Batasuna). I don't know what to think about any of it. I really don't know enough about the situation and how it has changed in recent years. But based on what I've read I think that Batasuna should be seen as regular political party.

Some military highchief (yeah, I know a lot about military :D ) was forced to resign after he made some harsh comments about Basques and their future few weeks ago.
Well that's good, I can travel in Spain without my family being scared for me!

Yeah, there's such a big difference between those countries...
As the matter a fact there is, have you been to any of them?

Have you tried anything else than a Spanish omelette?
I've been to Spain several times and had much more than their omelette (it's called tortilla btw); and I repeat, their gastronomy isn't much to talk about. And I know several Spanish people that feel this way when they visit other countries.

A mi no me gusta Espana. Espana tiene comida que no querro comer, y tambien, los Espanoles no les gustan los Judios. Mira, OP, si tu o tu pais, no querro Judios en tu pais, no nessesita mi alli.

A mi no me gusta Espana. Espana tiene comida que no querro comer, y tambien, los Espanoles no les gustan los Judios. Mira, OP, si tu o tu pais, no querro Judios en tu pais, no nessesita mi alli.

Aww, I love it when Americans try to speak foreign languages!

Spain chucked the Sephardim out in 1492... I'm pretty sure that they don't hate them anymore.

A mi no me gusta Espana. Espana tiene comida que no querro comer, y tambien, los Espanoles no les gustan los Judios. Mira, OP, si tu o tu pais, no querro Judios en tu pais, no nessesita mi alli.
Bad. Spanish. *cringes*

Andalucia And Catalonia Are Not Spain.

Barcelona isn't in Spain, is in Catalonia

Sevilla isn't in Spain, is in Andalucia.

Andalucia And Catalonia Want The Same Freedom As Portugal To Spain!

Spain is a Franco land's too. Spain not going on in the mind or social development. Spanish government ist faschist.

Iberia are Portugal, Spain or Castilla, Andalucia, Catalonia, Galiza and Euskal Herria. Not Spain only.

Talk about anything remotely Spanish or Iberian here.

*points*
*clears throat*
*its plainly obvious*

Andalucia And Catalonia Are Not Spain.

Barcelona isn't in Spain, is in Catalonia

Sevilla isn't in Spain, is in Andalucia.

Andalucia And Catalonia Want The Same Freedom As Portugal To Spain!

Spain is a Franco land's too. Spain not going on in the mind or social development. Spanish government ist faschist.

Andalucia and Catalonia are in Spain.

Barcelona is in Catalonia, within Spain.

Sevilla is in Andalucia, within Spain.

No majority of Andalucians want independence, and there are hardly weekly demonstrations in Barcelona and Taragona for independence.

It doesn't say much for the Catalans that the reason most of them want independence is because they resent helping to pay for the welfare state in poorer parts of Spain. Sounds ever so slightly "egoista" to me.

A mi no me gusta Espana. Espana tiene comida que no querro comer, y tambien, los Espanoles no les gustan los Judios. Mira, OP, si tu o tu pais, no querro Judios en tu pais, no nessesita mi alli.

Is he trying to say he doesn't like Spanish food (which is preposterous, as Spanish food is amazing) and that Spaniards don't like Jews?

Is he trying to say he doesn't like Spanish food (which is preposterous, as Spanish food is amazing) and that Spaniards don't like Jews?
Yup.

Free Translation:
I don't like Spain. Spain has food that I don't want to eat, and the Spaniards don't like Jews. Look, OP, yes you and your country, I will not want Jews in your country, you don't need me then.

Spanish has a plural "you" form they don't know about, as well as not conjucating words correctly. Along with that, certain accents are missing.

Excuse my grammar and spelling please.

I would love to visit Spain someday, but that's not too likely to happen I'm afraid. My wife wants to visit Rome and that's probably going to be the only trip abroad we're going to be able to afford. Sigh.

... Spanish food is amazing.
Talk to me about Spanish food. I want to learn more. :)

Me encanta la comida española, sobre todo una paella valenciana o un gazpacho fresco.

Yup.

How random.

I would love to visit Spain someday, but that's not too likely to happen I'm afraid. My wife wants to visit Rome and that's probably going to be the only trip abroad we're going to be able to afford. Sigh.

Pero España es la mejor! La cultura, el tiempo, la gente, y como se puede olvidar la comida...

Talk to me about Spanish food. I want to learn more. :)

http://www.carnegielibrary.org/subject/food/spain.html

There are many links there.

Talk to me about Spanish food. I want to learn more. :)

Most of it's great, just steer clear of "caca de vaca" cheese... They cover it in vine leaves then bury it in cow s**t to "enhance the flavour".

Pero España es la mejor! La cultura, el tiempo, la gente, y como se puede olvidar la comida...
My clumsy attempt at translation:

But Spain is great! The culture, the time, the people, and eat [ something I cannot traslate here ]. :confused:

Most of it's great, just steer clear of "caca de vaca" cheese... They cover it in vine leaves then bury it in cow s**t to "enhance the flavour".
OMG! ROFLMAO!!! Uh ... thanks for the warning! :D

http://www.carnegielibrary.org/subject/food/spain.html

There are many links there.
Kewl! Thanks, Fass! :)

My clumsy attempt at translation:

But Spain is great! The culture, the time, the people, and eat [ something I cannot traslate here ]. :confused:

"But Spain is the best! The culture, the weather, the people, and how could one forget the food..."

My clumsy attempt at translation:

But Spain is great! The culture, the time, the people, and eat [ something I cannot traslate here ]. :confused:

Good try!

el tiempo=the weather

como=how

se puede=can one

olvidar=to forget

la comida=the food

So...

como se puede olvidar la comida=how can one forget the food!

Catalonia isn't Spain because Spanish Governments and people (not all) are racist in general with catalan culture and catalan people.

We want justice, not racisms from Spain.


It doesn't say much for the Catalans that the reason most of them want independence is because they don't be loved and respected from Spanish Government (and some extremist fondamentalist people) .

It's not egoist, it's respecting to the freedom for people of Catalonia. Why we must to be killed if we speak catalan ?

VIVA LA REPÚBLICA FEDERAL ESPAÑOLA! MUERTE A LOS FRANQUISTAS! SÍ AL NUEVO ESTATUTO PARA CATALUNYA EN LA ESPAÑA FEDERAL!

--snip--

Oh, pipe down. Catalonia isn't going anywhere.

Catalonia isn't Spain because Spanish Governments and people (not all) are racist in general with catalan culture and catalan people.

We want justice, not racisms from Spain.


It doesn't say much for the Catalans that the reason most of them want independence is because they don't be loved and respected from Spanish Government (and some extremist fondamentalist people) .

It's not egoist, it's respecting to the freedom for people of Catalonia. Why we must to be killed if we speak catalan ?

VIVA LA REPÚBLICA FEDERAL ESPAÑOLA! MUERTE A LOS FRANQUISTAS! SÍ AL NUEVO ESTATUTO PARA CATALUNYA EN LA ESPAÑA FEDERAL!

So just because there aren't Catalan signs in Madrid Spain is racist towards Catalonia?

The suggestion that you are "killed" if you speak Catalan is complete and utter nonsense... Article 3 of the Spanish constitution states that Spanish and Catalan have equal status in Catalonia, and every child educated in Catalan schools must learn Catalan, even if their parents don't.

It is true that most Catalans want freedom... from paying taxes towards the poor in Estremadura and Andalucia.

Maelog , I respect if you're Nationalcatholicist, but in Catalonia, majority, people's want to have the same Status as Extremadura, not a inferior Status as now.

Maelog, you defend a system where the rich regions (Madrid, Euskadi, Navarra) obtain more founds than they pay.

Catalonia can't afford to pay more money than all Länder from Germany to East or all California (California is as Spain in Extension) to all USA.

In Catalonia are only 7.000.000 inhab. And people need a health system, highways, railways, etc.. as Spain too. We not want to be a Citizens of third Quality.

Spanish Army Nationalcatholicist division want to attak the Catalonia Parliament because they don't like the Catalan Parlament elections results!!!! (There were a majority of left-wing and center-left parties)

Everyone can read about this in the Financial Times or The New York Times too (There were an editorial and a piece of news)

Why a rich of Extremadura don't help poor people of Catalonia and Working Class of Catalonia must to pay to Capital and the rich regions when they don't obtain nothing. (Catalan Government have not independent resources to founding itself)

Catalonia people obtain less money from Spanish State.

Maelog, you're nationalcatholicist Spain isn't good for people. You must to know development is good.

VIVA LA REPÚBLICA FEDERAL ESPAÑOLA. FRANQUISMO = RUINA, ASESINOS.

I would love to visit Spain someday, but that's not too likely to happen I'm afraid. My wife wants to visit Rome and that's probably going to be the only trip abroad we're going to be able to afford. Sigh.
Hmm....

Is this going to be an all-out Italy trip, or just Rome? How long?

If its budget your worried about, you could appeal to family to help you with paying certain expenses instead of gifts for Christmas, anniversaries, birthdays and so forth. Then you might be able to make a Spain trip more resonable.

Hmm....

Most of it's great, just steer clear of "caca de vaca" cheese... They cover it in vine leaves then bury it in cow s**t to "enhance the flavour".
I've ate something like that. It was in leaves, but it wasn't vine. It was oak leaves. But it was good. Really good. Best cheese I've had. I'd try the poo cheese. :p

feared for my life in the front seats of many Madrid taxis. ;)

Hmm....

Is this going to be an all-out Italy trip, or just Rome? How long?

If its budget your worried about, you could appeal to family to help you with paying certain expenses instead of gifts for Christmas, anniversaries, birthdays and so forth. Then you might be able to make a Spain trip more resonable.
We're just in the talking about it stage right now, but it would have to be pretty much just Rome, with maybe a few side trips. The max we would be able to stay is a few days.

Yes, the cost is the primary factor. I am, after all, just a retired/disabled veteran. They keep us on a pretty short leash. :(

I could start up a "Send Grammy and Poppa to Europe" fund. We might get enough to pay for most of our meals. My children face the same income/cost-of-living squeeze as most of us on here. It's a thought, anyway. Thanks! :)

We're just in the talking about it stage right now, but it would have to be pretty much just Rome, with maybe a few side trips. The max we would be able to stay is a few days.

Yes, the cost is the primary factor. I am, after all, just a retired/disabled veteran. They keep us on a pretty short leash. :(

I could start up a "Send Grammy and Poppa to Europe" fund. We might get enough to pay for most of our meals. My children face the same income/cost-of-living squeeze as most of us on here. It's a thought, anyway. Thanks! :)
Travel is very expensive, and so is eating out in Europe. Have you checked out Ryan Air? Its not the best flights, but it gets you there. Also, I've found staying in Bed and Breakfasts are much cheaper (and more cozy) than hotels. But that's all I can really offer at this moment.

If I were you, I'd start a thread here about it. I've never planned a trip myself, I've always had more expeirenced people do that with me. However, Europeans are good at traveling from experience. And they do it cheap. And there's lots of them here.

Does your disability affect how long you can stay from home?

EDIT: Do you have any friends that could tag along and share the burden? Trips like that are always great fun.

Maelog , I respect if you're Nationalcatholicist, but in Catalonia, majority, people's want to have the same Status as Extremadura, not a inferior Status as now.

Maelog, you defend a system where the rich regions (Madrid, Euskadi, Navarra) obtain more founds than they pay.

Catalonia can't afford to pay more money than all Länder from Germany to East or all California (California is as Spain in Extension) to all USA.

In Catalonia are only 7.000.000 inhab. And people need a health system, highways, railways, etc.. as Spain too. We not want to be a Citizens of third Quality.

Spanish Army Nationalcatholicist division want to attak the Catalonia Parliament because they don't like the Catalan Parlament elections results!!!! (There were a majority of left-wing and center-left parties)

Everyone can read about this in the Financial Times or The New York Times too (There were an editorial and a piece of news)

Why a rich of Extremadura don't help poor people of Catalonia and Working Class of Catalonia must to pay to Capital and the rich regions when they don't obtain nothing. (Catalan Government have not independent resources to founding itself)

Catalonia people obtain less money from Spanish State.

Maelog, you're nationalcatholicist Spain isn't good for people. You must to know development is good.

VIVA LA REPÚBLICA FEDERAL ESPAÑOLA. FRANQUISMO = RUINA, ASESINOS.

Try saying that coherently en castellano, then I'll give you a coherent response en castellano

Bad. Spanish. *cringes*

Heh, thats what happens when you learn it from an American education system. Also, I, I'm not hispanic, so sue me lol.

Yup.

Free Translation:
I don't like Spain. Spain has food that I don't want to eat, and the Spaniards don't like Jews. Look, OP, yes you and your country, I will not want Jews in your country, you don't need me then.

Spanish has a plural "you" form they don't know about, as well as not conjucating words correctly. Along with that, certain accents are missing.

Excuse my grammar and spelling please.

Three excuses. 1: I havnt been taking Spanish that long, and I have been learning it from an American education system.

2: I am no Spanish, so spanish is a new language for me

3: I cant type accents on my keyboard.

Edit: Also, can si also mean if? Like for instance. Si tu no queres ir a nadar en el mar, puedes dormir en la playa.

Three excuses. 1: I havnt been taking Spanish that long, and I have been learning it from an American education system.

2: I am no Spanish, so spanish is a new language for me

3: I cant type accents on my keyboard.
Sorry. I was in a pissy mood when I read that.

1. For not taking Spanish that long, that was decent. I usually have trouble with the language as well, to be honest. And the American education system isn't that bad. I learned it there, too!

2. Spanish isn't in your blood. That excuse is kind of OK. Its not in my blood either.

3. Ask your Spanish teacher. They'll show you how (mine showed me)!

Anyhow, keep it up! There's nothing more important than language in todays world! Seeing as you live in the South, you'll get more hands on that I did!

Sorry. I was in a pissy mood when I read that.

1. For not taking Spanish that long, that was decent. I usually have trouble with the language as well, to be honest. And the American education system isn't that bad. I learned it there, too!

2. Spanish isn't in your blood. That excuse is kind of OK. Its not in my blood either.

3. Ask your Spanish teacher. They'll show you how (mine showed me)!

Anyhow, keep it up! There's nothing more important than language in todays world! Seeing as you live in the South, you'll get more hands on that I did!

Yeah...no shortage of Cubanos in South Florida...lol.

Also, did you manage to catch my question that I edited into the above post?

As the matter a fact there is, have you been to any of them?


I've been to Spain several times and had much more than their omelette (it's called tortilla btw); and I repeat, their gastronomy isn't much to talk about. And I know several Spanish people that feel this way when they visit other countries.
Yes, I've been to all of them. Several times. So you're not a fan of Spanish food. Fine. I think that you can get both great food and horrible food in every country. Anyway I only wrote that you can get great food in Barcelona. Italian, if you wish.

Why use the Spanish word especially when the word has other meanings.

I love spain deeply.

Edit: Also, can si also mean if? Like for instance. Si tu no queres ir a nadar en el mar, puedes dormir en la playa.
Yes, that can be so. However, I've personally never used it. Spanish people, what's the official word? Is this everyday speak?

Why does the Spanish language have four different words for the English "you"?

Tú (informal singular)
Ustéd (formal singular)
Vosotros (informal plural)
Ustedes (formal plural)

AFAIK (and I don't really know, I'm no linguist, I study Spanish in third-year at school (I dunno what Americans call it, junior high or something)) no other Latin-based language has that strange piece of grammar...

Edit: Also, can si also mean if? Like for instance. Si tu no queres ir a nadar en el mar, puedes dormir en la playa.

Yes, but they are slightly different words.

Si = if
Sí (note the acute) = yes

I've been taking Spanish for 8 years, and I'm ying to go. Great food, great weather, great people, great destinations....

Oh, and I once had a math teacher who was Catalonian...she was one of the hottest people I've ever known.

BTW, I've also been studying Arabic for the last year, and there are neat connections. For instance, to adress someone respectfully you say "Ustad". Spain has such an interesting history...

Spain is kinda whimpy, they listened to the terrorists and elected who their enemies told them to elect. I did hear a speech made by the former Spanish President though I like him.

Spain is kinda whimpy, they listened to the terrorists and elected who their enemies told them to elect. I did hear a speech made by the former Spanish President though I like him.

Look! An ignorant Troll! Point and laugh:
AHAHHAHAHAHA!

Andalucia And Catalonia Are Not Spain.

Barcelona isn't in Spain, is in Catalonia

Sevilla isn't in Spain, is in Andalucia.

Andalucia And Catalonia Want The Same Freedom As Portugal To Spain!



Iberia are Portugal, Spain or Castilla, Andalucia, Catalonia, Galiza and Euskal Herria. Not Spain only.

I don't want to get into the rest of the discussion, but this is 100% Correct!
Spain is a subversion that only the Portuguese got away from. The problem is not the concept of a single country in the Iberian Peninsula, but that the castillans always tried to rule over all.

Oh and..

Viva Portugal! E caros estrangeiros, a nossa comida é muito melhor. E as nossas mulheres são muito mais bonitas ;)

My family and I lived there for three years, from 1970 to 1973 and loved every minute of it. We first lived in Alcala de Henaries then moved to Torrejon de Ardoth. Wonderful people there, great food, an OK climate, and lots to see.

I would love to visit Spain someday, but that's not too likely to happen I'm afraid. My wife wants to visit Rome and that's probably going to be the only trip abroad we're going to be able to afford. Sigh.

Save on air fare by taking a military hop to Europe and get a EURAIL pass to roam around.

Why does the Spanish language have four different words for the English "you"?

Tú (informal singular)
Ustéd (formal singular)
Vosotros (informal plural)
Ustedes (formal plural)

AFAIK (and I don't really know, I'm no linguist, I study Spanish in third-year at school (I dunno what Americans call it, junior high or something)) no other Latin-based language has that strange piece of grammar...
The question is: why does contemporary English use "you" as a singular, plural, informal, and formal? Think about it. Its more common in other languages to have all of those things, for example, Swedish:

du = "informal" singular you (its more and more common to not use "ni" in the plural tense)
ni = formal singular you and plural you

Unfortunately, there isn't an informal you in Swedish, that's a Spanish cultural mark harkening back on courtesy and politeness. But I would guess that English once had such terms, but they were slowly shed. Language is always "evolving" as most people say, but I find that they become more steamlined. One could also say, "dumbed down." :p

And Vosotros is only used in Spain. Tack och lov the Latinos don't use it, I really don't like it, and the verb conjucation always has that extra accent over it. A little extra work, but I like to complain.

BTW, I've also been studying Arabic for the last year, and there are neat connections. For instance, to adress someone respectfully you say "Ustad". Spain has such an interesting history...
Spain is cool like that. I think of it as the bridge between Western Europe and the Middle East for most parts. Spanish has quite a few loan words from Arabic, which makes it even more neato, as I hate loan words from French (curses English and Swedish). The Arbacis sites that are in Spain are awesome. *drools*

Spain is kinda whimpy, they listened to the terrorists and elected who their enemies told them to elect. I did hear a speech made by the former Spanish President though I like him.
Well, their democratically elected former president didn't give a rat's ass about what Spanish thought about the war. When more than 80% of the population are against something it's not a wise move to oppose it. Especially if you're not a dictator.

It's also not very nice to accuse your "enemy" (Basques) of terrorism when there's no evidence against them.

I don't want to get into the rest of the discussion, but this is 100% Correct!
Spain is a subversion that only the Portuguese got away from. The problem is not the concept of a single country in the Iberian Peninsula, but that the castillans always tried to rule over all.
I read a book one time that said that Spaniards aren't Spaniards. They'd rather say they're from there home town or province (however it goes). It looks like that's really true, and Iberia has had quite a rich history, and that means lots of different ethnic groups and cultures getting all smashed together into what we love today. Carthage, Rome, Celts, Goths, Saracens, and Greeks too, I think. There's probably hundreds more.

Ojos de Brujo owns.

*bump*