NationStates Jolt Archive

To start this off, yes i am a athiest, but dont have that burning through your mind while your posting, think of me as a religious person if you want while you awnser this. We dont want any flaming or cussing at eachother.

To get to the point, this has been on my mind for a while, What good has religion done? Now im not just talking about christians, or muslims, or jews, or anyone else, im talking about all religions, every stinking one of em. Now i have studied ancient history for a long time now and i can accept religion has given people unity. Ever since the first religions have been around they gave people unity. Also i guess they affected the arts alot too. But much of that was all in ancient times. Talk about in this last century, what good has religion done besides start wars?

The wars would start regardless of relgion's exsistance. They just give people good excuses. There are thousands of religious charities out there so in that respect they have done some good.

yes i can see waht u mean by religious charities, but there are also thousands of other non religious charities helping the world also.

Oh Yeah, Like The Christians Childrens Fund. That's A "Good" Charity. But I Can't Get It Out Of My Mind That That Guy From The Commericals Looks So Much Like A Pedophile....

But good excuses for starting a war are very important. Although radical terrorists may still want to topple the western world, they use religion to recruit people to their cause. You can't get people to blow themselves up without telling them there will be eternal paradise or something.

*hangs head, shakes it slowly, walks away from thread*














*turns back, looks at OP*
















USE THE FUCKIN' SEARCH FUNCTION!!!













:rolleyes:

They have charities. Some people think charities are good or something. Whatever.

But good excuses for starting a war are very important. Although radical terrorists may still want to topple the western world, they use religion to recruit people to their cause. You can't get people to blow themselves up without telling them there will be eternal paradise or something.

ahha, this is very true, religion might not be a reason war has started but it sure contributes to the millions of innocent people lost.( ill throw the holocost in as an example)

I think the best thing religion has done is give people comfort. Be it in their fear of death, or of not knowing how to deal with the things in their life. A way of coping with the real world, I guess. Some people need it. Otherwise, the most common use I've ever seen for organized religion on a large scale, is to meet the interests of a person or group.

I like the whole spreading of good morals.

Sure it's lost on many. Sure it's lost on those who declare war in the name of religion (which ends up contradicting the religion really).

But for some reason, people only look to the people at the top who were the ones in power and not at the general masses.

If a religion has gotten just one person away from the act of killing someone, then that religion is probably good.

I think religion is probably more of a symptom of bad attitudes than a cause.

Mother Teresa

Martin Luther King, Jr.

Malcolm X

Pope John Paul II

Not to mention the countless Christian monks, nuns, and priests who ran the leper colonies in Africa and Europe, took care of wounded soldiers and sick peasants. And those of the Buddhist faith who did the same in Asia.

They've done a lot of good. It's just all the stupid evil religious people who get the press. After all, who wants to hear about Sister Mary in Africa taking care of an orphan in Africa, when they can listen to the most recent diatribe from Billy Graham?

I think the best thing religion has done is give people comfort. Be it in their fear of death, or of not knowing how to deal with the things in their life. A way of coping with the real world, I guess. Some people need it. Otherwise, the most common use I've ever seen for organized religion on a large scale, is to meet the interests of a person or group.

you know what, i really agree with that, i agree that some people need it for confort and theres nothing wrong with that, but religion should not be apart of the political world. It should just be there to give people hope and confort, not an excuse for something like war.

You claim not wanting to inspire any reason for flames and all matters related to it and I am certain your intentions are well, but you would be wise to perhaps rephrase your otherwise quite enjoyable topic for discussion. I'm refering to the part where you mention "every stinking one of em" especially.

That being said, back to the topic at hand. Indeed what did organised religion do for us besides incestives for unreasonable wars, opressive rules etc?

Actually they gave us alot. In the arts they have inspired men to achieve such great feats of beauty I doubt any man without a faith could have achieved. It moved men as Bach and Michalengelo to achieve the peak of their career.
Marvelous feats of architecture can be attributed to religion aswell. One can hardly not marvel at for example the St. Peters sheer size or be amazed by the piramides, an object we don't even bother to rebuild due to its complexity.

Arts aside, religion was also the only moral guideline we had. Without a fear of a negative afterlife I doubt many a poor and ragged human from before the age of enlightenment would have been moved to live the moral life. (what is or isn't moral being left open for dicussion). It is the fear of a higher power that keeps people and society as a whole from falling apart in anarchy. It is the very same why our legal system operates in the general preventive maner.

Mind you, much of the morals the west holds to be superior such as individuality are based upon the jewish-christian tradition. Obvious seeing as it influenced and still influences european and american moral life for the larger part of their existance.

I find that religion has in many regards influenced our lives postively. The question I find more interresting actually is if we actually still need religion?

(I have mainly used christianty as an example for religion seeing as it is the faith that is the most regulary attacked here)

yes excuse me, when i said "every stinking one of em" i did not mean anything offensive, personally, i dont think alot of things are really offensive, for instance today i used the phrase pissed off when i was awnsering a question about a short story from my teacher and everyone went crazy. but thats getting off topic. Yes i agree with you but if you read my original post, it was short but i did mention the arts, esspecially in the middle ages and renasonce.

Aw jeez,
NOT THIS SHIT AGAIN!

9/11, the holocuast, the cruasades, burning witches at stakes, Kasmir, Palestine, Manifest denstiney, and the perscuetion of homosexuals, the right to choose, and the prevention of advancements in stem cells. yay for religion, they have a charity or something right? btw Im a atheist in case it didnt come through.

Well, it did cause all that searching for another way to the far East.

Aw jeez,
NOT THIS SHIT AGAIN!
Where's that pic?

~Alan Smithee
Puppet of [Censored]~

yes excuse me, when i said "every stinking one of em" i did not mean anything offensive, personally, i dont think alot of things are really offensive, for instance today i used the phrase pissed off when i was awnsering a question about a short story from my teacher and everyone went crazy. but thats getting off topic. Yes i agree with you but if you read my original post, it was short but i did mention the arts, esspecially in the middle ages and renasonce.

As I said, I know you mean well, but toes are easily stepped upon. Especially at these kind of topics.

Though you must pardon me for the fact I did not read the question entirely seeing as you ask what religeon has done for us the -last- century.

Allow me to go back to the drawingboards as they say.

My main point still stands about western moralism, that holds tenants such as individualism and personal freedom highly, is based upon the faith most europeans followed in past ages. The basics of many faiths have quite a postive effect upon society given that they do not follow its laws to the point of fanatism.

Furthermore I would like to make the point that I find a world without any faith what so ever is a barren one. The void that religion leaves is one easily filled with cynism, apathy and cold calculation. Despite good evidence that this existance does not need a diety people still believe. Perhaps it is our human nature to do such and I see nothing wrong with that as long as it has a positive efffect upon our lives.

And I believe it does. However enjoying you may find your bible thumping neighbour to be, they are useally good citizens who rarely cause you any hinderence.

So what if they say you will burn in hell...you don't believe in it anyway.

What good has religion done?
It built big statues.
http://www.andrew.cmu.edu/user/kparasur/people/pictures/zeus.jpg

What good has religion done?

it gives people HOPE. it gives people a feeling that there's a point to all this crapola. it gives a feeling of interdependence of ALL things. and the acknowledgement that this is not the be all end all. that's there's more than we can ever begin to imagine. etc.

Vegetarianistica']it gives people HOPE. it gives people a feeling that there's a point to all this crapola. it gives a feeling of interdependence of ALL things. and the acknowledgement that this is not the be all end all. that's there's more than we can ever begin to imagine. etc.
Except for the fact that there is no point to this crapola and this is the be all end all. oops.

Except for the fact that there is no point to this crapola and this is the be all end all. oops.

In your opinion.

Churches are still places of socialization, you meet with your peers doing some rituals and talk about stuff. Qualifies as good, no?

These threads do nothing. Each side wont change its mind.

the religious people have faith that there is something they cannot see, whereas the atheists make a conclusion on what they can see.

These threads do nothing. Each side wont change its mind.

the religious people have faith that there is something they cannot see, whereas the atheists make a conclusion on what they can see.

........wow man you didnt even give a shit about reading what this thread is about, its not a thread about proving if god exists or not, i was just asking people to post what they think what good religion has done in the last century.

It's given faith and hope to those who had none. It gives people something to believe in, and something to strive for. To better themselves, and work towards an ultimate goal by helping others, and not "conforming" with the feral scum that roam the streets of Britain these days.

And what is it, 'In war, there is no such thing as an atheist'

9/11,

Caused by people who are as Muslim as Stalin was a Communist.

the holocuast,

Caused by an atheist.

the cruasades, burning witches at stakes, Kasmir, Palestine, Manifest denstiney, and the perscuetion of homosexuals, the right to choose,

See the line about Muslims, only substitute "Christian" for "Muslim".

and the prevention of advancements in stem cells.

That's a matter of debate. Some religious folk are for it, some are against it.

yay for religion, they have a charity or something right? btw Im a atheist in case it didnt come through.

"A little philosophy inclineth man's mind to atheism, but depth in philosophy bringeth man's minds about to religion."

But...

"Beware of the man of one book."

Religion and faith in higher power should be used by man to explain what they can not explain and have no power to do so. It is just too bad when those who follow religion ignore things they can explain in favor of their religous mythologies.





Umm, we had to wait an extra 1000 years for the steam engine and battery because of christianity, and the middle east will be a permanent crater because of all religions, oh, oh, I KNOW ONE!!!!


Well, actually, it isn't really because of religion. The Persians kept massive records of the times before the dark ages alive, so they weren't just lost forever and the enlightenment actually was able to happen.

hmmm...

I dunno.

........wow man you didnt even give a shit about reading what this thread is about, its not a thread about proving if god exists or not, i was just asking people to post what they think what good religion has done in the last century.


I'm sorry, why was that called for? I read the thread. My point is that threads like these no one changes their mind. If you are religious than you will believe that it has done good to society. If your not than you will believe that it has not done any good on society.

Though the latter might go either way in this situaution.

yes i know that it wont change anyones mind about how they feel but this thread isnt here to change people minds, thats what im trying to get through.

yes i know that it wont change anyones mind about how they feel but this thread isnt here to change people minds, thats what im trying to get through.


So why did you create this thread?

Except for the fact that there is no point to this crapola and this is the be all end all. oops.

That's exactly how it is. It's kind of a bleak outlook on things, so religion takes all the bleak, boring crap in the world and turns it into something beautiful and purposeful.

I believe that religion is good for most people because it gives them comfort and hope but some people take religion WAY too seriously. For example limiting stem cell research because it kills a potential baby when it could save hundreds of thousands of lives. Or wanting to obliterate gay's rights because they are immoral, while the Declaration of Independence says "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

...Stupid Pat Robertson...and Fred Phelps

I'm sorry, why was that called for? I read the thread. My point is that threads like these no one changes their mind. If you are religious than you will believe that it has done good to society. If your not than you will believe that it has not done any good on society.

Though the latter might go either way in this situaution.

Religion has done both good and ill, like all other human forces. But the question is not, "Has religion been a good thing or a bad thing?" Rather, it's "Has religion done good?"

Umm, we had to wait an extra 1000 years for the steam engine and battery because of christianity,
hmmm...


Completely off-topic but perhaps a fun fact to know is that we could have actually mastered the power of steam 2000 years ago as evidence shows that the greeks seem to have mastered its basic principals. The reason for not applying it however was due to the fact that rulers did not know what to do with the many slaves when steamengines would replace them.

That aside, perhaps it would be helpfull if you could explain in what maner christianty has delayed the progress of an invention such as the steamengine?
I'm able to accept your statement but not without sound argument.

ok you know waht, i have to go. But i want to say one last thing. In the past few posts some1 quated me talking baout how i didnt make this thread to change some1 mind and that person said "then why did u make this thread?" I made it so people can come and discuss what religion has done in the past century! Just because its a religious thread does not mean atheists and religious people have to be yelling at eachother saying the others wrong. GOOD NITE!

Except for the fact that there is no point to this crapola and this is the be all end all. oops.

the question is what's religion given people, dumbass.. not what hasn't it given us.

.. and i'm not sure what that is. :)

ok you know waht, i have to go. But i want to say one last thing. In the past few posts some1 quated me talking baout how i didnt make this thread to change some1 mind and that person said "then why did u make this thread?" I made it so people can come and discuss what religion has done in the past century! Just because its a religious thread does not mean atheists and religious people have to be yelling at eachother saying the others wrong. GOOD NITE!


It normally turns out into some kind of argument or another

Don't you people ever tire of "debating" the same shit over and over and over again?

One thing I can say was inspired by religion is exploration and colonization. Granted it may have been religious persecution that drove people over to the Americas in the first place, but undoubtedly it was religious faith that allowed them to survive some horrible climates.

I suppose you could say if religion wasn't doing horrible things to people in the first place, there would have been no need to go out and explore, but then Europe would probably be alot more crowded than it already is.

Don't you people ever tire of "debating" the same shit over and over and over again?
Nope.

Don't you people ever tire of "debating" the same shit over and over and over again?

The very reason that a topic has no conclusive objective anwser is reason enough to discuss it and gain as much understanding of the subject as possible.

Completely off-topic but perhaps a fun fact to know is that we could have actually mastered the power of steam 2000 years ago as evidence shows that the greeks seem to have mastered its basic principals. The reason for not applying it however was due to the fact that rulers did not know what to do with the many slaves when steamengines would replace them.

That aside, perhaps it would be helpfull if you could explain in what maner christianty has delayed the progress of an invention such as the steamengine?
I'm able to accept your statement but not without sound argument.

Damn, sorry, that was me mixing up different events. The steam engine and battery power were pretty much forgotten because of the wondrous cheapness of slave labor.

(Believe it or not, the Greeks had invented a primitive battery, composed of hard wax, acid, and wire, though more complex than just that. That is all a battery is, really, only replace wax with whatever type of metal they use in batteries to have modern ones)

I was mixing up the loss of the steam engine and battery power due to apathy for them with the burning of the Library of Alexandria and the dark ages, two very different and fairly unrelated events. You can still attribute a loss of a lot of ancient Greek philosophy, plays, and music to the influences of Christianity.

I apologize, bow, and present both of my wrists for furious slapping, for my folly.

Not like you can do much else.

The very reason that a topic has no conclusive objective anwser is reason enough to discuss it and gain as much understanding of the subject as possible.
...Or opposing viewpoints, indeed.

Same shit, different thread. Religion has done both good things and bad things, just like every other human organization. That should be immediately obvious to anyone who's ever taken a basic history class.