Syniks
26-01-2006, 03:19
Comment: This TG, while essentially private brings up an interesting discussion. I thought it deserved a Thread.
Hi, I'm from Italy and I've just recently read about Ayn Rand works, and I'd like some explanation or a pointer to some elucidations if you'd be so kind.
"The smallest minority on earth is the individual. Those who deny individual rights cannot claim to be defenders of minorities." Individual rights exist only thanks to governments/state, or at least to some form of agreement between people; in fact, if you were the last man on earth, you'd have freedom but no rights. So, since you libertarians are advocating pro-individual rights through (at least economical) anarchy, don't you think that it is contradictory? The only right you have under anarchy is to unite with others to form some sort of "might makes right" group of people and then make rules for yourselves... Or am I missing something?
Interesting. I've never had anyone ask that before. Let's look at it seriatem:
Individual rights exist only thanks to governments/state, or at least to some form of agreement between people; in fact, if you were the last man on earth, you'd have freedom but no rights.
Not quite true, at least in US English. "Rights" preceed "Freedoms". Under the Enlightenment vision of Freedom which engendered the US, Freedom is the LACK of government restriction, where Rights are somthing that exist as a result of our creation/existence. I have a Right to Exist. I have the Right to persue Happiness. I have the Freedom to live without fear of unwarranted Search & Seizure. See the difference?
So, since you libertarians are advocating pro-individual rights through (at least economical) anarchy, don't you think that it is contradictory?
Nope. Not using the US English terms. I don't know how Italian deals with it.
The only right you have under anarchy is to unite with others to form some sort of "might makes right" group of people and then make rules for yourselves...
And this is different from Government in what way?
Or am I missing something?
Just basic Linguistic/Semantic paradigms. Not your fault, just a product of your Linguistic (Italian Language) POV.
Hi, I'm from Italy and I've just recently read about Ayn Rand works, and I'd like some explanation or a pointer to some elucidations if you'd be so kind.
"The smallest minority on earth is the individual. Those who deny individual rights cannot claim to be defenders of minorities." Individual rights exist only thanks to governments/state, or at least to some form of agreement between people; in fact, if you were the last man on earth, you'd have freedom but no rights. So, since you libertarians are advocating pro-individual rights through (at least economical) anarchy, don't you think that it is contradictory? The only right you have under anarchy is to unite with others to form some sort of "might makes right" group of people and then make rules for yourselves... Or am I missing something?
Interesting. I've never had anyone ask that before. Let's look at it seriatem:
Individual rights exist only thanks to governments/state, or at least to some form of agreement between people; in fact, if you were the last man on earth, you'd have freedom but no rights.
Not quite true, at least in US English. "Rights" preceed "Freedoms". Under the Enlightenment vision of Freedom which engendered the US, Freedom is the LACK of government restriction, where Rights are somthing that exist as a result of our creation/existence. I have a Right to Exist. I have the Right to persue Happiness. I have the Freedom to live without fear of unwarranted Search & Seizure. See the difference?
So, since you libertarians are advocating pro-individual rights through (at least economical) anarchy, don't you think that it is contradictory?
Nope. Not using the US English terms. I don't know how Italian deals with it.
The only right you have under anarchy is to unite with others to form some sort of "might makes right" group of people and then make rules for yourselves...
And this is different from Government in what way?
Or am I missing something?
Just basic Linguistic/Semantic paradigms. Not your fault, just a product of your Linguistic (Italian Language) POV.