Fatah still rules, but Hamas big winner in Palestinian elections
Portu Cale MK3
26-01-2006, 00:06
Yet again the people choose complete freaks for power! And yes, it was a free, democratic election.
What consequences (if any) will this have on the (lack of) peace process in the middle east? Will Hamas turned political become a dove, or even more hawkish? How will they influence the moderates of the late Yasser Arafat Fatah?
Neu Leonstein
26-01-2006, 00:33
We'll see.
I think Hamas has already toned it down a little, but a lot will depend on the Israeli reaction now.
For Palestine as a whole, this will probably be a good thing (at least domestically), because it gives a bit of extra legitimacy to the process, and if Hamas joins the Fatah in government, that might even end a lot of criticism the PA has been getting from its own people.
That being said, if Israel now goes apeshit, then so will Hamas, and it won't look pretty at all. It's probably best to wait for the Israeli elections and then look at the two as one package.
Super-power
26-01-2006, 00:34
Does it matter that Hamas has gained? They're just as militant as Fatah :headbang:
Yet again the people choose complete freaks for power! And yes, it was a free, democratic election.
What consequences (if any) will this have on the (lack of) peace process in the middle east? Will Hamas turned political become a dove, or even more hawkish? How will they influence the moderates of the late Yasser Arafat Fatah?
Freaks elected again??? That means that it was a good election. The USA sets an example in electing freaks to office, why shouldn't the rest of the world have the same opportunity.
Lets GIVE Iran a few nukes. They will straighten it all out quickly.
Neu Leonstein
26-01-2006, 00:55
They're just as militant as Fatah :headbang:
:confused:
Are you aware what Fatah is?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamas
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatah
They used to be pretty radical, but since they managed to create some sort of PA under Arafat, and with the big man dead, they've become pretty moderate.
Problem is just that their leadership is still a corrupt bunch, and that ultimately they are being seen as pretty toothless, not only by real militant organisations, but also by many Palestinians. Which is why I think that Hamas (an organisation with real street cred, so to speak) in coalition with Fatah could actually help things.
And I would hope that this would also stop them from bombing places...Hezbollah seems to make a good impression right now in Lebanon. They haven't blown anyone up for ages.
Workers Dictatorship
26-01-2006, 01:09
This just gives Israel/the U.S. another excuse to renege on their promises to the Palestinian Authority.
:confused:
Are you aware what Fatah is?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamas
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatah
They used to be pretty radical, but since they managed to create some sort of PA under Arafat, and with the big man dead, they've become pretty moderate.
Problem is just that their leadership is still a corrupt bunch, and that ultimately they are being seen as pretty toothless, not only by real militant organisations, but also by many Palestinians. Which is why I think that Hamas (an organisation with real street cred, so to speak) in coalition with Fatah could actually help things.
And I would hope that this would also stop them from bombing places...Hezbollah seems to make a good impression right now in Lebanon. They haven't blown anyone up for ages.
hahahahaha moderate!!!!!! XD best joke i've heard all day....week....month...year! YEARS!
no seriously i hope your joking....maybe they're moderate compared to other politicians in the territories, but overall they're nothing but pieces of ****.
EDIT: I'm logged onto my other account? oO
Neu Leonstein
26-01-2006, 01:21
no seriously i hope your joking....maybe they're moderate compared to other politicians in the territories, but overall they're nothing but pieces of ****.
They are the most moderate force in the territories, which is obviously what I meant.
You don't expect Palestinians to be "moderate" in your sense of the word after all the crap that's happened over the past decades, do you?
Some of them are shit, primarily the police chiefs and the rest of the corrupt bastards, but others just genuinely try to figure out a way to create a proper Palestinian state, and are quite happy to make concessions to the Israelis for that. Abu Masen is a good example, I think.
Except of course if you are just generally of the opinion that Palestinians are terrorists, in which case I just wasted three minutes of my life typing.
They are the most moderate force in the territories, which is obviously what I meant.
You don't expect Palestinians to be "moderate" in your sense of the word after all the crap that's happened over the past decades, do you?
Ok, then yes they are 'moderate' by that sense, and i'm sure they would be actual moderates, had Israel ignored the UN and killed off Arafat and the terrorists long ago...it might also mean no government, but it would mean for the most part, only moderates in the country.
Some of them are shit, primarily the police chiefs and the rest of the corrupt bastards, but others just genuinely try to figure out a way to create a proper Palestinian state, and are quite happy to make concessions to the Israelis for that. Abu Masen is a good example, I think.
I have no time to get into a debate, just some general comments. So sure why not.
Except of course if you are just generally of the opinion that Palestinians are terrorists, in which case I just wasted three minutes of my life typing.
Well i certainly don't think all Arabs are terrorists...Palestinians is a different issue that varies in my mind sometimes. But at least I can agree on this much...only the 'moderates' and worse are terrorists. =)
New Rafnaland
26-01-2006, 01:29
Israel's next move: See what happens to the PA with greater control from Hamas.
Israel's next move: See what happens to the PA with greater control from Hamas.
Less corruption, but more then likely more militarism.
Neu Leonstein
26-01-2006, 01:41
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/middle_east/4640702.stm
Ok, then yes they are 'moderate' by that sense, and i'm sure they would be actual moderates, had Israel ignored the UN and killed off Arafat and the terrorists long ago...it might also mean no government, but it would mean for the most part, only moderates in the country.
Actually, that would have made him even more of a martyr, and nothing would be better.
And besides...why is Arafat a terrorist again? Where does this theory come from?
As I see it, there never really was any evidence that he had anything at all to do with the Munich thing, and the rest of it seems like guerilla warfare and otherwise "freedom fighting", ie legitimate resistance against a military.
Well i certainly don't think all Arabs are terrorists...Palestinians is a different issue that varies in my mind sometimes. But at least I can agree on this much...only the 'moderates' and worse are terrorists. =)
How can it be so difficult for you to at least try to look at an issue from a different perspective?
All this "good vs evil" shit is making me sick. Seriously.
Psychotic Mongooses
26-01-2006, 01:47
Observers say the elections were peaceful, and one EU official said the vote was an example to the Arab world.
No longer can people say Israel is the only democracy in the Middle East. This can only be a good thing.
Super-power
26-01-2006, 03:01
They used to be pretty radical, but since they managed to create some sort of PA under Arafat, and with the big man dead, they've become pretty moderate.
Sorry. It's just that I'm still trying to wash the proverbial taste of corruption out of my mouth that Arafat left.