NationStates Jolt Archive

http://toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060112/NEWS16/601120344

Man gets fired for accessing forums during work :) (figured this would hit home for a lot of people) Personally I think they are exaggerating the post count (or at least the post count achieved at work)
The reason I think they are exaggerating it

In a 4 week month, of 40 hour weeks, that equals 9600 minutes x 2 months = 19,200

He would have had to post once a Minuit for two months (they were saying just a bit over two months) while I understand that this is within the realm of possibility he still managed to get all his assigned work done

It may have been a slack job but not THAT slack of a job

Edit ... he did 6 k + posts not 19 (that was an estimated "acess amount")

Only lazy, useless, workshy twonks post on forums at work.

Edit: And he resigned, not got fired.

I wonder what my employer thinks about my forum access. I know that as long as I'm not posting while on calls, which I never do (there's really no time during calls to do anything but help the customer, honestly), they don't seem to mind. Else I probably would have heard about it by now, no?

I wonder what my employer thinks about my forum access. I know that as long as I'm not posting while on calls, which I never do (there's really no time during calls to do anything but help the customer, honestly), they don't seem to mind. Else I probably would have heard about it by now, no?One would hope so, but of course they can fire "at will" employees pretty much at any time for pretty much anything.

Well, i exclusively post from work. As long as i dont let up my work my boss is fine with it.

Else I probably would have heard about it by now, no?
Our company doesn't have anything to monitor internet use. I've checked.

Oh, and as the chap's supervisors were happy with his work, who cares if it's caused by him dilligently working 70 hours per week, or Divine Intervention whilst he was at home in bed?

Only lazy, useless, workshy twonks post on forums at work.

Edit: And he resigned, not got fired.
Yeah “resigned” as in “if you don't quit we will do it for you” type of reassignment

Might as well have been fired

Well, i exclusively post from work. As long as i dont let up my work my boss is fine with it.
Ditto - well, almost. Doing ANYTHING on 28.8 dialup sucks, so I don't dial n from home much.

Look at my post count... but then, my day is mostly downtime interrupted by occasional hours of obscene craziness and users who refuse to RTFM. :headbang:

Sassy Sarah's frequent appearance in online discussions during work hours was brought to city officials' attention Dec. 27 by a citizen who said he was irritated by the apparent misuse of taxpayers' computers and work time.

NOW do you see why I'm paranoid about revealing too much of my identity??? Still, how did this 'citizen' know? This employee was apparently posting as woman...did 'she' let it slip that she was posting from work?

Not so much on this forum, but in total I think I average about 10-15 posts a day on all my web boards combined, and perhaps a 4-5 of those are at work. But in a year, I haven't heard complaints, and I do my work in time after all.

Sassy Sarah's frequent appearance in online discussions during work hours was brought to city officials' attention Dec. 27 by a citizen who said he was irritated by the apparent misuse of taxpayers' computers and work time.

Probably had a grudge to settle too.

Which shows that you shouldn't get into flame wars if your debating partners have dirt on you.

One would hope so, but of course they can fire "at will" employees pretty much at any time for pretty much anything.

Aye, and I'm only a temp, so they can just not extend my contract or whatever. They wouldn't even be firing me.

Plus, it says that this guy's post count was racked up both before, during, and after his workday...so how much posting actually happened during work? And it's not like each post takes minutes and minutes to type...

Seems to me his bosses weren't all that worried either, and 'public outrage' was the reason it became an issue at all. Sounds like jealousy, frankly...if the guy was getting his job done, so what? I think some people are just pissed that others have easier jobs than they.

Doing anything that won't benefit the employer at work is stealing. Plain and simple. An employee can always work on learning more about the company and it's products and services or looking for ways to improve profits (maybe like having fewer deadbeat employees).

NOW do you see why I'm paranoid about revealing too much of my identity???

Heh, I agree. Some people I trust over MSN and whatnot, but i've decided to zip up about a lot of things...I've actually been recognised from my photo on here. :/

I post exclusively from home, though.

Doing anything that won't benefit the employer at work is stealing. Plain and simple. An employee can always work on learning more about the company and it's products and services or looking for ways to improve profits (maybe like having fewer deadbeat employees).

Because your employer > you.

Doing anything that won't benefit the employer at work is stealing. Plain and simple. An employee can always work on learning more about the company and it's products and services or looking for ways to improve profits (maybe like having fewer deadbeat employees).
Well, I disagree. Especially when our bosses take little naps, play online games, or have an extended lunch break (2 hours). If someone gets their job done, they are fulfilling their obligations. 'Busy work' is not necessarily beneficial.

Only lazy, useless, workshy twonks post on forums at work.

Edit: And he resigned, not got fired.
And that's exactly what we expect from every member of NS General. If work starts interfering in your posting, quit :)

So long as your not costing the taxpayer money or downloading anything Who cares what you do at work after your work has been completed. Get over it....

I wonder what my employer thinks about my forum access. I know that as long as I'm not posting while on calls, which I never do (there's really no time during calls to do anything but help the customer, honestly), they don't seem to mind. Else I probably would have heard about it by now, no?

Thats a relief- When I saw this thread and started reading it, you came to mind-I'm glad it wasnt you.

NOW do you see why I'm paranoid about revealing too much of my identity??? Still, how did this 'citizen' know? This employee was apparently posting as woman...did 'she' let it slip that she was posting from work?

I dont think you're paranoid. That reasonable caution is good. You dont know who any of us are.
Keep your identity secret. The more you reveal about your identity in here, the closer you are to some unwelcome surprise.
And potentially embarassing.

Doing anything that won't benefit the employer at work is stealing. Plain and simple. An employee can always work on learning more about the company and it's products and services or looking for ways to improve profits (maybe like having fewer deadbeat employees).If it's not an employee's job to do those things then why should the employee be concerned about them?

Doing anything that won't benefit the employer at work is stealing. Plain and simple. An employee can always work on learning more about the company and it's products and services or looking for ways to improve profits (maybe like having fewer deadbeat employees).
Why would I want to work harder than I have to?
If I can get everything I'm supposed to do done in less time than I have to do it, why should I invent more work for myself? Why not go at a relaxed pace? I can think of no advantages to me for making myself work harder.

Do I get paid more if I do more work? Nope.
Can I go home early if I've done all my work early? Nope.

If you are on company time then you are being paid to do what they want done. Not go on forums.

I am certain he coud have moved on to antoher task, then soak up tax payer dollars wasteing time pretending to be a woman.


He could have posted before his shift, and on his scheduled breaks.

If your on someone elses dime then you are are doing for them, not yourself.

Lazy, self centered Gen Xers.

Why would I want to work harder than I have to?
If I can get everything I'm supposed to do done in less time than I have to do it, why should I invent more work for myself? Why not go at a relaxed pace? I can think of no advantages to me for making myself work harder.

Do I get paid more if I do more work? Nope.
Can I go home early if I've done all my work early? Nope.
Though there is a happy medium ... doing work efficently and quickly without over stressing yourself

Setting the pace too high will burn you out ... you are of more use to your employer to step back and relax sometimes so you dont burn out

Training replacements is expensive

The more you reveal about your identity in here, the closer you are to some unwelcome surprise.
And potentially embarassing.
Hmmm...is that a threat? Under new federal regulations, all threats and annoying posts must be accompanied by your full name:D

Hmmm...is that a threat? Under new federal regulations, all threats and annoying posts must be accompanied by your full name:D

No threat at all. Its wise to guard your identity in a medium like this. Dont get soft and start giving away your info.

I find people for a living. It doesnt take a lot for an experienced and motivated person to find someone else. Or facts about them. Or assets.

So-if you give out personal detail, be prepared to have it thrown in your face somewhere down the road- by an employer, spouse or whomever.
If you want to be really free to speak whatevers on your mind at all times, then be careful to protect your true indentity.

I actually had this kind of thing happen to me once. Though it was for using chat engines while I was also working.

Often it was with my wife or friends overseas, but just as often it was with tech savvy clients that didn't want to waste money on a long distace phone call.

My boss (a total ludite) didn't understand.

And that's exactly what we expect from every member of NS General. If work starts interfering in your posting, quit :)

:D LOL

If you are on company time then you are being paid to do what they want done. Not go on forums.

I am certain he coud have moved on to antoher task, then soak up tax payer dollars wasteing time pretending to be a woman.


He could have posted before his shift, and on his scheduled breaks.

If your on someone elses dime then you are are doing for them, not yourself.

Lazy, self centered Gen Xers.

Perhaps you don't understand the intricacies of working for the government. You do exactly what you are told. You do not do a single thing more than you are told. Working extra hard and getting stuff done does not get you any sort of commendation. Working extra hard and getting stuff done gets you told not to work so hard.

Doing anything that won't benefit the employer at work is stealing. Plain and simple. An employee can always work on learning more about the company and it's products and services or looking for ways to improve profits (maybe like having fewer deadbeat employees).

So if I jump off the phones for a few minutes to take a piss, I'm stealing from the company? What exactly am I stealing from them as I take a leak? The water when I flush the toilet?

Because your employer > you.

Yeah, unfortunately, that seems to be a pretty common attitude in today's capitalist Western world.

When I go to work, I am NOT going there and acting as my employer's devoted slave for 6-8 hours. I am selling my time and labour to do a specific task or set of tasks. Once those are done, or while I have not been assigned to do any of the specific tasks that I am selling my labour to complete, then I am not under any obligation to be doing something that benefits my employer. If my employer wants me to do more than my current specific tasks, they can discuss that with me themselves and offer me more money.

So if I jump off the phones for a few minutes to take a piss, I'm stealing from the company? What exactly am I stealing from them as I take a leak? The water when I flush the toilet?

You equate posing as a woman on internet message boards with a bioilogical function your life depends on?

When I go to work, I am NOT going there and acting as my employer's devoted slave for 6-8 hours. I am selling my time and labour to do a specific task or set of tasks. Once those are done, or while I have not been assigned to do any of the specific tasks that I am selling my labour to complete, then I am not under any obligation to be doing something that benefits my employer. If my employer wants me to do more than my current specific tasks, they can discuss that with me themselves and offer me more money.

Except you are offering both your effort and your time in exchange for money. Which means, while you are on the clock being paid, you are supposed to only be doing things beneficial to your employer. While they cannot ask you to do anything physically or mentally harmful to yourself, they can say "hey, don't waste our money and bandwidth and don't expose us to unessaccery security risks."

And when exactly did internet access become a human right?

At my last job, I was the LAN administrator for a City agency and I didn't even have internet access at my workstation. If I had enough time to complain abut it, they found something for me to do. I have no idea what you people are whining about.

So if I jump off the phones for a few minutes to take a piss, I'm stealing from the company? What exactly am I stealing from them as I take a leak? The water when I flush the toilet?

Depending on where you decide to do it, you could actually be giving them a present rather than stealing.

You equate posing as a woman on internet message boards with a bioilogical function your life depends on?



Except you are offering both your effort and your time in exchange for money. Which means, while you are on the clock being paid, you are supposed to only be doing things beneficial to your employer. While they cannot ask you to do anything physically or mentally harmful to yourself, they can say "hey, don't waste our money and bandwidth and don't expose us to unessaccery security risks."

And when exactly did internet access become a human right?

At my last job, I was the LAN administrator for a City agency and I didn't even have internet access at my workstation. If I had enough time to complain abut it, they found something for me to do. I have no idea what you people are whining about.

How did you manage to be a network admin without the ability to google lol
The oricle saves our asses every day lol

Except you are offering both your effort and your time in exchange for money. Which means, while you are on the clock being paid, you are supposed to only be doing things beneficial to your employer. While they cannot ask you to do anything physically or mentally harmful to yourself, they can say "hey, don't waste our money and bandwidth and don't expose us to unessaccery security risks."



That's not in my contract. I don't do work outside the parameters of my agreed-upon tasks, regardless of whether I'm "on the clock" or not. Again, if they want to change the terms of my contract, they can discuss it with me and offer me more money for the extra work. If the work I am being paid to do gets done, they have no business telling me what I can and cannot do if it does not harm the business. If my employer wants me to voluntarily work to benefit the business outside of the specific labour I'm selling, they need to start treating me like a person and stop treating me like just another resource to be used up. This goes for all other employers as well.

I don't have internet access at work, but if there's nothing around that I'm meant to be doing, I'm not going to indulge in some bullshit make-work just to seem like I'm benefiting a business I, quite frankly, don't care about in the least.

While doing what the fellow in the story did might be considered as "harmful to the business", it's a bit of a stretch. The computers are likely to be on and connected to internet regardless of what employees are using them for. Perhaps a clear set of "computer use guidelines" would have helped?

Perhaps a clear set of "computer use guidelines" would have helped?Almost every Place has Computer Guidelines...

Heck even your Local Library has them... Have you ever tried to View porn? If you did.. you where breaking the Guidelines.

The Internet is a beautiful and useful beast...

But it also has drawbacks... one of them is the increasing waste of Working hours..

If the employees cant control themselves.. they will lose privileges.. and they can only blame themselves.

one of them is the increasing waste of Working hours.

good. people work too much as it is. productivity is through the fucking roof, and yet we still demand that people work long hours - even when they don't technically have anything to do for many of them. therefore we should either let them goof off on the job, or we should give everybody huge raises and cut back the workweek.

Or we can monitor computer usuage and not pay them when they are goofing off. Or just have the local bosses send them home.

And what the hell makes you say production is through the roof?

Or we can monitor computer usuage and not pay them when they are goofing off. Or just have the local bosses send them home.

And what the hell makes you say production is through the roof?

Then they'll sit and twiddle their thumbs.

OK, go home.

OK, go home.

As long as I get paid the agreed upon amount for finishing the task that was put before me.

Only lazy, useless, workshy twonks post on forums at work. ....
Yay, those are my kind of people!
__________________
"Hard work often pays off later, but laziness always pays off now." -- Motto of America of Tomorrow (http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/page=display_nation/nation=america_of_tomorrow) (NSwiki (http://ns.goobergunch.net/wiki/index.php/America_of_Tomorrow)) (Xanga (http://www.xanga.com/gg2112/)) :)

If the work I am being paid to do gets done, they have no business telling me what I can and cannot do if it does not harm the business.

And you see no problem using company resources for your own personal entertainment? Isn't that getting something for nothing?

Some people might read that as meaning you do owe the company more work now.

Yay, those are my kind of people!
__________________
"Hard work often pays off later, but laziness always pays off now." -- Motto of America of Tomorrow (http://www.nationstates.net/cgi-bin/index.cgi/page=display_nation/nation=america_of_tomorrow) (NSwiki (http://ns.goobergunch.net/wiki/index.php/America_of_Tomorrow)) (Xanga (http://www.xanga.com/gg2112/)) :)

That quote is from www.despair.com.

Perhaps you don't understand the intricacies of working for the government. You do exactly what you are told. You do not do a single thing more than you are told. Working extra hard and getting stuff done does not get you any sort of commendation. Working extra hard and getting stuff done gets you told not to work so hard.
It does get you things, it gets your contract renewed. It gets you more weight when you negotiate for more.

Dont break your arm patting yourself on the back for a trite and over done cynical comment.

I am sorry are you an engineer for the city, state, nation of?

Meter reader?

Mop pusher?

Anything?

No. Oh, ok.

I worked for uncle sam as civilian dock worker for the 127 fighter wing Logistics out at SANG base in MI.

I worked the Docks for General Dynics and have encountered my fair share of gvernment employees.

There are intricate about it---it is laziness.
You people, filthy 20 somethings think you should be accorded some entitlment of respect for doing literally nothing at all.

If you are on company time doing your own thing you are stealing MONEY.
Since you have ineffect sold that time to the company---then taking the agreed sum you actual have embezzeled the funds because you are not providing the service agreed upon--X hours for Y dollars.

That is the problem with YOU people, you dont even know what work means.

Doing anything that won't benefit the employer at work is stealing. Plain and simple. An employee can always work on learning more about the company and it's products and services or looking for ways to improve profits (maybe like having fewer deadbeat employees).

Hmmm you do like chiming in on things you really don't understand.

Voice of experience time: I once worked for a rather large aerodefense company in their internetwork security department.

The executives spouted the exact same line of logic and started firing people for any transaction they called "stealing"

A person was suspended for looking at a news site and I decided I would do a "virus" and "security" check on the executives systems.

On computer of the person who was most vocal of this policy. I found pirated computer games, porn, and the net access logs showed he frequently visted BBS sites that were not work related.

I have done this "experiment" a few times and have come to the conclusion that the policy makers tended to be the biggest violaters of the policies.

Arguing 8 hours work for 8 hours pay is rather ignorant view of things as well. People can't do that. In fact you will get crappier output if attempted it. People need breaks.

Some of the best software developers I have known would get into a bind over an issue and play a computer game for 1/2 hour to an hour. After that everything was sorted out in their heads.

Shall we talk about meetings? 70% of the time investing in meetings is a complete waste. The best VP I had ever known would have "firefighting" meetings over major problems that would last 15 minutes. As he once told me "we could spend an hour but that would be 45 minutes you could spend working on a solution for me."

Knowing more about my company and its services? As in what? The company doesn't pay me to know how to software develope. They pay me to keep their servers and networks available for the longest time possible. Knowing how to design asic or synthesis would be a waste of the companies money. The guys doing that job know this stuff. It woutd be a waste of the companies money for them to learn how the network management system works.

Improving profits? How? Unless it will affect them in a possible way, few people aren't going to give it much thought unless there is an incentive. Especially if the end result gives the employee a 3 % raise and the executive gets a healthy "bonus" for saving the company money.

Now arguing it will allow them to keep their jobs is rather ignornat as most people are hired to do a job. Increasing profits is the executives job.

Don't get me wrong some execs really do earn what they get. However, I have known a few where the janitor makes greater contributions to the company.

Finally, yes there are "deadbeat" employees. But that also includes the managment.

Have you even worked in a "real" corporation?

That quote is from www.despair.com.
One of my favorite sites.

It does get you things, it gets your contract renewed. It gets you more weight when you negotiate for more.

Dont break your arm patting yourself on the back for a trite and over done cynical comment.

I am sorry are you an engineer for the city, state, nation of?

Meter reader?

Mop pusher?

Anything?

No. Oh, ok.

I worked for uncle sam as civilian dock worker for the 127 fighter wing Logistics out at SANG base in MI.

I worked the Docks for General Dynics and have encountered my fair share of gvernment employees.

There are intricate about it---it is laziness.
You people, filthy 20 somethings think you should be accorded some entitlment of respect for doing literally nothing at all.

If you are on company time doing your own thing you are stealing MONEY.
Since you have ineffect sold that time to the company---then taking the agreed sum you actual have embezzeled the funds because you are not providing the service agreed upon--X hours for Y dollars.

That is the problem with YOU people, you dont even know what work means.

Wow. That must have been hard to get all that condescention into one post. What do you know about me and my job history? Do you know if I've ever had two different government jobs? No. You know dick. So keep your judgements to yourself.

And what the hell makes you say production is through the roof?

productivity

and the answer is easily checked statistics (http://data.bls.gov/PDQ/servlet/SurveyOutputServlet?request_action=wh&graph_name=PR_lprbrief)

So why is it a negative?

Also, if you did work and didn't get paid for it, can we agree that the company is stealing from you?

So why is it a negative?

Also, if you did work and didn't get paid for it, can we agree that the company is stealing from you?

Companies do it all the time. Just ask any salaried employee.

My description says 40 hours a week and I usually do 60-70....

Companies do it all the time. Just ask any salaried employee.

My description says 40 hours a week and I usually do 60-70....

Because salary employess are paid to complete the task. Wage employees are paid to work while they are there. Salary emplyees also have an easier time getting bonuses.

And again, is it not stealing if the company does not pay you for the work you put in?

So why is it a negative?

why is what a negative?

Because salary employess are paid to complete the task. Wage employees are paid to work while they are there. Salary emplyees also have an easier time getting bonuses.

And again, is it not stealing if the company does not pay you for the work you put in?

Bonues?!?!?! :D Ok I do have to ask what you do?

I have had bonues in my career and they are not readily available as you suggest.

Yes the company does steal all the time. There is 20-30 hours a week they get for free. Especially when companies expect the extra hours put in.....

I think the main reason is primarily the risk of people leaking information on to the Internet; during the dot-com era, there were thousands of people who intentionally spread disinformation about their companies (often at work) on to the message boards/BBSs' as a means of either discrediting the company, driving up/down the stock price, and generally causing havoc.

As a result, companies cracked down on it and eventually it became another tool to improve productivity.

Bonues?!?!?! :D Ok I do have to ask what you do?

LAN administration/ IT support.

I have had bonues in my career and they are not readily available as you suggest.

I didn't say they were easy, I said they were easier than wage employeees. Of course, they are supposed to get overtime.

Yes the company does steal all the time. There is 20-30 hours a week they get for free. Especially when companies expect the extra hours put in.....

Do they want the extra time, or that the project gets done? Thats the problem with salary. You aren't paid for coming in 9-5, you are paid to get it done no matter the time.


But, I digress. The company not paying you for the agreed upon time to a wage worker is indeed stealing.

So what is it when said worker is on company time surfing the web with the company's badnwidth and computer?

Do they want the extra time, or that the project gets done? Thats the problem with salary. You aren't paid for coming in 9-5, you are paid to get it done no matter the time.

Not always. Project coming in time is not the same as expecting it all the time. My last two companies did that.


The company not paying you for the agreed upon time to a wage worker is indeed stealing.

Sure they are. The job description says 40 hours. It doesn't say when project is due.


So what is it when said worker is on company time surfing the web with the company's badnwidth and computer?

Ahh but to use your own argument.

As long as the project is completed on time, it is nothing.

Sorry but the bandwidth and computer arugement is crap. Such people that are ardent about it tend to be violating it themselves.

For example. Checking stock prices isn't related to work and yet few managment types would say it isn't a good use of time.

We are easy going here. See we have this crazy idea the managers are supposed to have schedules for their workers projects.

So what company do you work for and how many computers do you take care of?

I think the main reason is primarily the risk of people leaking information on to the Internet; during the dot-com era, there were thousands of people who intentionally spread disinformation about their companies (often at work) on to the message boards/BBSs' as a means of either discrediting the company, driving up/down the stock price, and generally causing havoc.

As a result, companies cracked down on it and eventually it became another tool to improve productivity.

Ahh but isn't this more of a case of "lady Macbeth syndrome"

How many of those cases involved the average employee vs managment?

Ahh but to use your own argument.

As long as the project is completed on time, it is nothing.

Except that you are us9ing company resources.

Sorry but the bandwidth and computer arugement is crap. Such people that are ardent about it tend to be violating it themselves.

That doesn't make it an invalid argument. It just makes those jerks hypocrites.

Do we let off a bank robber because he can claim someone else stole more?

For example. Checking stock prices isn't related to work and yet few managment types would say it isn't a good use of time.

We are easy going here. See we have this crazy idea the managers are supposed to have schedules for their workers projects.

You're right. I don't mean to say the company was right to have fired someone who was surfing the net on a slow period, but if it was documented company policy, it was within their rights to do so.

Access to the internet is not some right. For some, its a valuable tool meant to get work done. For others, its a fringe benfit that can be yanked away at any time.

If the company says "no more using our stuff to entertain yourselves", guess what. Thats their perogative.

So what company do you work for and how many computers do you take care of?

The last time I had a job relevent to this conversation, I was a LAN Administrator for a NYC agency and I was responsible for 350+ users at the main site plus a handful at satelites.

Except that you are us9ing company resources.

It's a matter of definition. Telephones were once highly guarded and you had to use pay phones if you wanted to talk to your spouse. Now they don't get too crazy about it unless you are calling long distance all the time.

We monitor that as we are a multinational.


That doesn't make it an invalid argument. It just makes those jerks hypocrites.


Exactly and once word gets out the policy is "do as I say not as I do" the policy has failed.


Do we let off a bank robber because he can claim someone else stole more?

Strawman. The bank robber commited a felony.


You're right. I don't mean to say the company was right to have fired someone who was surfing the net on a slow period, but if it was documented company policy, it was within their rights to do so.


Ahh! Ok then we agree on something.


Access to the internet is not some right. For some, its a valuable tool meant to get work done. For others, its a fringe benfit that can be yanked away at any time.


Well it depends on the company. It is a bene for us as the type of skill set we need is hard to obtain and retain.


If the company says "no more using our stuff to entertain yourselves", guess what. Thats their perogative.

True. But in ourcase, they would probably lose 1/4 to 1/2 of the engineers.


The last time I had a job relevent to this conversation, I was a LAN Administrator for a NYC agency and I was responsible for 350+ users at the main site plus a handful at satelites.

Ahh goverment. Now I know where you are coming from.

We are arguing from two different points of view. Public vs private.

In the aerodefense company, Net access was closely monitored......

Please. In every single organization I've worked in, the thing people work the hardest at was convincing other people they were working.

If he got his job done, why should anyone else care?

Also, always make friends with the IT people. They can save your life on occasion, and always have the juiciest gossip.

At my job, there are only two rules with regard to the internet:

1. If you're talking to a customer, don't do it.

2. If you're not, keep it reasonable.

That means: no porn (instant termination), no games (they just tell you to get out of the game), and probably no hate sites or anything. Basically, what I do between calls and on my breaks is more or less up to me. Often times I come here. Granted, I get yanked out of my NS-induced euphoria with less than a second's notice and am foisted onto a call, but until then, they don't bother me. Since my being on NS doesn't affect their call flow, they don't really give a damn. (The actual rules do prohibit free Internet surfing, but no one ever enforces that rule. Maybe someone should.)

If his posting is getting in the way of his job, something should be done. Maybe not a firing, but certainly something. If it's not, who gives a damn? I wasn't clear on if it was affecting his performance (looked like it wasn't) but if he was forced out because of it, then his employers need to give it a rest already and pick their battles.

It's a matter of definition. Telephones were once highly guarded and you had to use pay phones if you wanted to talk to your spouse. Now they don't get too crazy about it unless you are calling long distance all the time.

But it was and still is regarded as their resource. They're just not such hardasses about it.


Exactly and once word gets out the policy is "do as I say not as I do" the policy has failed.

I agree, the policy needs to be applied equally. But, that doesn't really absolve him of breaking it. We don't know what the situation in his office was.


Strawman. The bank robber commited a felony.

No, because he was breaking a rule. Granted, it was way worse than what we are discussing, but the pincipal is the same.

Ahh! Ok then we agree on something.

I'm not unreasonable, just realistic.



We are arguing from two different points of view. Public vs private.

In the aerodefense company, Net access was closely monitored......


And we didn't have it at all. And God help anyone caught reading a newspaper or anything at their desk during company time. Even certifiction giudes were frowned upon.

Essentially why I am trying to get my own company off the ground. Tired of coniving, back stabbing, CYA playing bosses who throw me under the bus to make herself look good.....but I'm ranting.