NationStates Jolt Archive

Babysitters jailed for baby rape

Two babysitters have been jailed for raping a 12-week-old baby girl and taking pictures of the abuse.
Alan Webster, 40, and his girlfriend Tanya French, 19, both from Hatfield in Hertfordshire, pleaded guilty to rape and making indecent images.

Webster was given a life sentence at St Albans Crown Court; French was jailed for five years.

I was absolutely sickened and shocked when I saw this on the news. This is a new low for the human species. :(

Even re-reading the story now it gives me a chill down my spine.

Link: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/beds/bucks/herts/4599524.stm

Kill them both!

I was absolutely sickened and shocked when I saw this on the news. This is a new low for the human species. :(

Even re-reading the story now it gives me a chill down my spine.

Link: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/beds/bucks/herts/4599524.stm
T-thats horrible! What kind of sick depr...well those bas.... what were...

Words fail me. Being i am lazy i did not read the story. is the girl fine? She probaly wont remember it but her parents will have a difficult descision in about a dozen years.

It is sick and depraved. Unfortunately this is not a new low for humanity. This kind of fucked-up shit happens more than one might think.

Hang 'em.

My two hopes:

The baby remembers nothing of this.

The rapists are raped in jail with something as proportionally big as they were compared to the baby.

Sadly, this happens all the time in South Africa.

But (Judge Findlay Baker) said (Tayna) French was also a victim and had come under (Alan) Webster's "malign influence" and was to some extent "corrupted by him".

Something tells me she just had a better lawyer and they were both in on it equally. Not knowing her I can't say for sure but it's not like she was 15.

Regardless, this act is...beyond words really.

I support castrating these monsters with blunt, red-hot tongs, then giving them an enema of boiling hot acid.

I support castrating these monsters with blunt, red-hot tongs, then giving them an enema of boiling hot acid.


you think they should go easy on them???

I support castrating these monsters with blunt, red-hot tongs, then giving them an enema of boiling hot acid.

That's just messed up to work...maybe try something like in "A Clockwork Orange." I have heard, though, that castration actually makes rapists more violent, so I don't know if that would work.

God, I wish I hadn't read this. :(

Fromage. =/

Pedophilia carries a de facto death sentence, unless the convict is isolated from the other inmates for the entire duration of sentencing.

I could have gone without knowing about this...

Throw them into the general prison population and watch the pretty birds fly by for the next hour or so.

That's just messed up to work...maybe try something like in "A Clockwork Orange." I have heard, though, that castration actually makes rapists more violent, so I don't know if that would work.

It's not without precedent. One of Constantine The Great's sentences was the pouring of molten lava down the convict's throat.

yikes. :( That is terrible.

What is wrong with those people? I mean really..............I have to not comment further as I might say something that isn't very nice at all. :(

Pedophilia carries a de facto death sentence, unless the convict is isolated from the other inmates for the entire duration of sentencing.
This is paedophilia x1000, I hope they get put in with other inmates.

I was absolutely sickened and shocked when I saw this on the news. This is a new low for the human species. :(

Even re-reading the story now it gives me a chill down my spine.

Link: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/beds/bucks/herts/4599524.stm
Well there is yur first problem a 40 YO and a 19 YO what did you expect?



Castration wouldn't work because they can still use objects.

The Inquisition had some good methods for dealing with Jews and Moors, perhaps they can be put to better use at this point. An excellent bonus on all of their methods is that you dont have to clean up blood afterwards.
I suggest the 'Water Tourture' to start out with.
You stuff a rag in their mouth, then pour water on it until they swallow. You then insert tongs into their throat and yank the rag out. Again. And again. Im told that around the 5th time or so this gets to be pretty horrible and can permenantly damage the ability of the person to swallow food.
Of course, when all else fails, you can do really amazing things with a 300lb guy named Bubba who hasnt had sex for about ten years.
I dont support the death penalty, especially for these two, lethal injection is far too humane.

Well there is yur first problem a 40 YO and a 19 YO what did you expect?



Castration wouldn't work because they can still use objects.
I would expect something much less exterme ........... honestly. At the worst the 19 yr old would be raped. Still horrible but to a much much MUCH less degree.

Throw them into the general prison population and watch the pretty birds fly by for the next hour or so.
As much as I detest this behavior (specialy being a survivor of molestation) I refuse to think it is a good thing to knowingly let inmates do what we as a society should be taking care of

Those inmates that are exiled there if allowed to do this will take more punishment for doing the deads some want to set up for them

If you dont think the punishment fits the crime we should change the punishment and not let inmates do it for us.

yikes. :( That is terrible.

What is wrong with those people? I mean really..............I have to not comment further as I might say something that isn't very nice at all. :(

i am stunned too much for coherent speech...i would have a very very hard time being a correction officer around either of the 2...and i dont buy the judges' bullshit about the girl being influenced by his maligned mind!
i call b.s.
19 is more then old enough,hell,12 is old enough to know that is plain sick and demented.
and women/girls are suppose to be nurturers by nature in most part,so even if she was abnormal in that respect,she probably just went along to not let down her"cool/mature/pissing off my parents"boyfriend,and if that is the case she was a selfish little shit that put her stupid emotiall wants ahead of the torture of a infant.
she deserves a life in prison,and i dont even want to say what i would do with the guy..:headbang: bashing his head against a brick wall would just be the start.

I heard child rapists don't fare very well in prison.

Good for those prisoners!

As much as I detest this behavior (specialy being a survivor of molestation) I refuse to think it is a good thing to knowingly let inmates do what we as a society should be taking care of

Those inmates that are exiled there if allowed to do this will take more punishment for doing the deads some want to set up for them

If you dont think the punishment fits the crime we should change the punishment and not let inmates do it for us.
If only it didn't take so long for many countries to carry out the death penalty, I would agree. If they could take these scumbags out back to shoot them immediately after the trial and charge their families for the bullets, I'd be all for it.

I heard child rapists don't fare very well in prison.

Good for those prisoners!
Too bad thoes prisioners take an increased punishment for acts society aparently wants but is too weak to do themselfs.

Too bad thoes prisioners take an increased punishment for acts society aparently wants but is too weak to do themselfs.

Too bad indeed. Stupid bill of rights.

If only it didn't take so long for many countries to carry out the death penalty, I would agree. If they could take these scumbags out back to shoot them immediately after the trial and charge their families for the bullets, I'd be all for it.
I wouldn't charge their family ... if we as a society determine they are too dangerous to live then we should take care of it

Personally I am for life long imprisonment for these sort of folks (and this is coming from a child rape victim myself)

Too bad thoes prisioners take an increased punishment for acts society aparently wants but is too weak to do themselfs.
Yes, it is too bad, but the important part is that the bastards die.

Yes, it is too bad, but the important part is that the bastards die.
Ehh two wrongs don't make a right in my book

And to me it is not right that we let others do our dirty work for us that we are unwilling to do ourself.

Yes, it is too bad, but the important part is that the bastards die.
The only way they will is if a prisoner gets a screwdriver smuggled in...

Normally I'd say kill 'em, but in this case I agree, throw them to the general prison population. These...things ought to suffer.

Yes, it is too bad, but the important part is that the bastards die.

Why in the world would you want to kill them? Their suffering would end.
Dropping them into General is a good idea as long as you pull them back out long enough to patch them up again and let it start all over.
Along with a little sleep deprivation, judicious injection of saline solution, and the occasional month of intentionally painful bondage interspersed between the tours through the general population, we could keep them in perpetual agony for decades on end.
Why in the world would you want to kill them?

I would expect something much less exterme ........... honestly. At the worst the 19 yr old would be raped. Still horrible but to a much much MUCH less degree.
He better not having given it an STD....

I hope these as**oles die in prison, suffering greatly!! :mad: :mad:

That's just messed up to work...maybe try something like in "A Clockwork Orange."Of course, the whole point of A Clockwork Orange was that the technique therein should not be used. If you read the British version of the book, you'll see that conditioning of similar natures can be easily reversed with hypnosis anyway.

Best to either kill the fuckers or let them rot slowly in complete solitary confinement for the rest of their lives.

I could have gone without knowing about this...
Ugh...I can't help it, and I always regret it when I read these things...

Personally I am for life long imprisonment for these sort of folks (and this is coming from a child rape victim myself)


Really? Why not death? I mean, the crime is terrible and far reaching, why not just excise them from society?

Normally I'd say kill 'em, but in this case I agree, throw them to the general prison population. These...things ought to suffer.

Careful there, torture is not something we want in our justice system. I agree that there are crimes so terrible that society should not waste resources trying to rehabilitate the offender, but torture is something that is every bit as dangerous as their crimes.

Really? Why not death? I mean, the crime is terrible and far reaching, why not just excise them from society?

Because the government shouldn't have the power to kill it's citizens. Historically, it's always been the ruling powers that inflict the greatest slaughter on a population.

As for this guy, I hope they throw away the key.

This is paedophilia x1000, I hope they get put in with other inmates.

no, the guards will let the other inmates go to them.
Know an ex-guard

Pedophilia carries a de facto death sentence, unless the convict is isolated from the other inmates for the entire duration of sentencing.

And prison deaths are always considerably more entertaining than lethal injections. Look at Jeffrey Dahmer. His ass ws lethally injected wth the broomstick handle he was beaten to death with.

Who said violent criminals don't serve a useful purpose?!? :D

My two hopes:

The baby remembers nothing of this.

The rapists are raped in jail with something as proportionally big as they were compared to the baby.


1. The baby will not remember anything about it.

2. Hello? Anybody home? That's not what they always mean by rape. Do you really believe that the mother wouldn't have noticed anything if THAT was the case? Obviously the baby was quite alright after this horrible (but not SO horrible) abuse.

I think I might actually be more shocked by the hate that this is rousing in some people rather than the actual act. If people have the ability to hate someone that much, then what else is that hate capable of doing within society.

This reminds me of the reation to an episode of Brasseye about paedophilia. The public outcry was huge, denouncements left, right and centre. But everyone seemed to completely miss the point of the programme.
Chris Morris was not making light of paedophilia; his target was the dangerous sensationalism and exploitation that can characterise media coverage of the issue. As commentators have already noted, some of the more outspoken reaction to the programme only underlines the validity of the point it was making.

But then I don't really know much on the issue. I've never met someone who's been molested as a child or met someone who has deemed to tell that were. I guess I'm just trying to voice my beliefs that we shouldn't think about revenge as a form as punishment. I guess it's just my belief that killing people is wrong, raping people is wrong. And that even just standing by and letting these things happen to other people is wrong, regardless of their history, let alone even condoning such actions.

I support castrating these monsters with blunt, red-hot tongs, then giving them an enema of boiling hot acid.

I'm always struck by the similarities between these undoubtedly horrific crimes and the general calls from people who are not "sick perverts" to genitally mutilate the perpetrators in ways that are frankly mind boggling. Don't get me wrong, we don't want these people walking the streets but at the same time way to go showing that you're a sane and rational human being.

There is going to be no justice here unfortunatly.In the U.K unlike the U.S. these fucks will never see gen pop.The will go on tour for the first couple of years to protect their id then will go into a seg wing for the duration.The lifer will be considered for parole in ten years.For the first time I think the U.S justice system would serve better.

1. The baby will not remember anything about it.

2. Hello? Anybody home? That's not what they always mean by rape. Do you really believe that the mother wouldn't have noticed anything if THAT was the case? Obviously the baby was quite alright after this horrible (but not SO horrible) abuse.
That does not mean there will not be consequences down the line ... plenty of people have forgot their abuse but it effects their brain and personality development

This is a new low for the human species. :(

No it's not. It's a new low for those two humans. I'm no 'lower' today than I was yesterday, thank you very much.

I'm a practicing Buddhist, and take serious the concepts of applying kindness and compassion to all living beings, without exception...

...but this situation puts my faith to the test. If I saw this "man" in person, it would be very very hard not to put my fist through his face.

OMG!! :eek: :eek: :eek:

How, I mean, seriously, physically and psychologically can you rape a 12 week old baby. Seriously. I see a baby, (ie, prepubescent child) and in no way ever could conjure anything remotely sexual in my mind when I do. I've changed babied nappies, and have cleaned and powdered that whole area, but...I mean....How?!?

Horrified and shocked and very disturbed. When I have kids, I'm becoming more and more afraid of leaving them with anyone any more...

I'm often sorry to see how low humans can sink.

I dont know the graphic details of this "rape"- I'll hope it wasnt pentetration of any type, and maybe just improper touching. Rape can be a vague term-but its a horrendous violation either way.

I dont think we need any more people in society that cant tell the difference between whats right and whats wrong. If they knew it was wrong-I dont need them. If they didnt know what they were doing was wrong-I still dont need them.

I have no faith in "rehabilitation" of people like this. Especially when it will take another victim to prove efforts to rehabilitate were a waste of time.

If it makes anyone feel better, you can't form memories until age 3 or 4...

That does not mean there will not be consequences down the line ... plenty of people have forgot their abuse but it effects their brain and personality development


In addition, this family will always have this horrendous "dark secret" to deal with. Will the yever tell the child or keep it secret forever ? The emotional and psychological impact on the child's parents will always be there.
I'm afraid this baby will grow up and always have the sense that everything isnt quite right.

And I do believe that experiences as a baby- good or bad- can and do have
a lasting effect on people. If they were neglected or just not given enough attention-or if they were lovingly cared for and well attended to- I think that has a lot to do with future development.

If it makes anyone feel better, you can't form memories until age 3 or 4...

Doesn't change the fact that forever more, the parents will know, and knowing that something like that happened to your precious little one is murder on a parent. Even worse when you're a new parent, probably only been leaving your new arrival with babysitters at most for a couple of weeks and this happens. You think they'll ever trust anyone to take care of her again? One of them will have to give up work, if both work. The mother will never leave that child out of sight again. That's how I'd react...

In addition, this family will always have this horrendous "dark secret" to deal with. Will the yever tell the child or keep it secret forever ? The emotional and psychological impact on the child's parents will always be there.
I'm afraid this baby will grow up and always have the sense that everything isnt quite right.

And I do believe that experiences as a baby- good or bad- can and do have
a lasting effect on people. If they were neglected or just not given enough attention-or if they were lovingly cared for and well attended to- I think that has a lot to do with future development.
Agreed ... it has been shown that contact and love can have a very beneficial effect on a child ... its not a stretch even if you don't look at the data to make the logical leap and realize bad events can have bad effects.

Doesn't change the fact that forever more, the parents will know, and knowing that something like that happened to your precious little one is murder on a parent. Even worse when you're a new parent, probably only been leaving your new arrival with babysitters at most for a couple of weeks and this happens. You think they'll ever trust anyone to take care of her again? One of them will have to give up work, if both work. The mother will never leave that child out of sight again. That's how I'd react...
But it does mean that, barring physical complications, the kid will never know what happened to her. I think that's fairly important. No horrible traumatic memories...

But it does mean that, barring physical complications, the kid will never know what happened to her. I think that's fairly important. No horrible traumatic memories...


Very true, and I hope she never does. Be thankful for small mercies. But she does have a right to know, I'm sure she'll find out at some point in her life what happened. It'll probably she up an a hospital record in 20 years from now or something. Is it worse to find out like that or from your parents when you're old enough to understand?

Sadly, this happens all the time in South Africa.


Correct, cases of baby rape (usually resulting in the infant's death) are incredibly common in Africa, particularly sub-Saharan.

The shocking reason for this is that many men are deluded into thinking that they can immunise themselves against Aids if they have sex with a virgin; and a baby is obviously 'ideal' for this purpose. I got this first-hand from a veteran Public Health worker from Africa.


This particular incident is obviously disgusting but it's only news because it occurred in a supposedly civilised society.

And what's with all the 'bring back the inquisition's methods' bullshit? Getting creative about torturing someone to death is essentially no less sick than what this person has done. I'm not sure what should be done with him, possibly just shot in the face so the taxpayer doesn't have to accommodate him for 30 years.

If it makes anyone feel better, you can't form memories until age 3 or 4...


I dont think thats true. My oldest son has a photographic memory and often refers to things that happened or were said before he was able to speak. He spoke very early too. Under two years of age.
I think the intensity of something has more to do with the recollection of it- the more exciting or traumatic, the better its remembered.

you think they should go easy on them???

LOL! Nice Comment.

Anyway what the hell are people thinking. Why would you do something like that to something innocent. I support castration!

Reading further down the report it is said Webster also raped a 14-year-old Girl. He really needs to be taught a lesson.

Reading further down the report it is said Webster also raped a 14-year-old Girl. He really needs to be taught a lesson.

At the very least, he should be rendered incapable of raping again.

If it makes anyone feel better, you can't form memories until age 3 or 4...

Actually, that is incorrect. You start forming memories as soon as you open your eyes, they are just put so far back in your mind that you cannot re-remember them as an adult. But the memories are there, and the damage to both the child and the rest of the family is done.


To the people preferring life-sentence instead of the death penalty, I pose this question.
How much does it cost to have a single person in jail for a year, when thinking of facilities, guards on duty, administration, food, and whatever else is needed to keep a set of standards for the prisoners? I can agree that spending those amount of money on people who will be rehabilitated and sent back out into society might well be worth the cost, but does that go for people who will spend their entire lives (upwards 30+ years) in jail? Do we as society really want to spend our hard-earned money on such scum?
Yes, I know this is a very cynical way of looking at it, but on the other hand, a (wo)man sent to prison for life does nothing good for society, why should we as a society do anything good for them?

Of course, I'm looking at this from a danish point of view, where prisons are almost luxury hotels......

Actually, that is incorrect. You start forming memories as soon as you open your eyes, they are just put so far back in your mind that you cannot re-remember them as an adult. But the memories are there, and the damage to both the child and the rest of the family is done.


To the people preferring life-sentence instead of the death penalty, I pose this question.
How much does it cost to have a single person in jail for a year, when thinking of facilities, guards on duty, administration, food, and whatever else is needed to keep a set of standards for the prisoners? I can agree that spending those amount of money on people who will be rehabilitated and sent back out into society might well be worth the cost, but does that go for people who will spend their entire lives (upwards 30+ years) in jail? Do we as society really want to spend our hard-earned money on such scum?
Yes, I know this is a very cynical way of looking at it, but on the other hand, a (wo)man sent to prison for life does nothing good for society, why should we as a society do anything good for them?

Of course, I'm looking at this from a danish point of view, where prisons are almost luxury hotels......


I think the economic argument is just about the only good one when it comes justifying the death penalty.

However I think that, in the US for example, the administration of the death penalty (appeals process, long death row stays, etc) ends up costing just as much as it would have to just lock someone up?

les see, they did something sick and depraved their punishment should be the same. blow their kneecaps off.:mp5: then.... drop'em in a swamp somewhere.:gundge: ..... a swamp where the military is training their snipers ^^b :sniper:

Society at large needs to step back, objectively evaluate what is perfectly acceptable, what is tolerable, what needs to be restricted, and finally what is completely intolerable. Then, when something is found that an overwhelming majority finds completely intolerable they should institute strict, brutal, and uncompromising measures to meet them. None of this soggy, inefficient bullshit that we call a "Justice System" despite its consistent tendency to fly in the face of reason and accountability.

I'm not talking about torture here, nothing outlandishly cruel, just strict well defined punishment immediate in effect.

Excellent, I'll have you all know that the above statement was made under intensely controlled emotions. Now that it is out of the way allow me to lessen my restraint.

Crucify the fuckers, not metaphorically, not figuratively. I mean literal crucifixion. Cast iron posts on tops of prison, bare naked exposure to the elements, and a slow painful death by starvation and abuse by the prisoners below.

I don't like all this torture talk coming from "civilised" people. I would just send them to the Gulags/salt mines to earn their keep for the rest of their lives.

But seriously, this has shocked me. I can see how someone could kill a child, sick as it is - but to torture one that's only 12 weeks old!

I don't like all this torture talk coming from "civilised" people. I would just send them to the Gulags/salt mines to earn their keep for the rest of their lives.

But seriously, this has shocked me. I can see how someone could kill a child, sick as it is - but to torture one that's only 12 weeks old!

How, I mean, seriously, physically and psychologically can you rape a 12 week old baby. Seriously. I see a baby, (ie, prepubescent child) and in no way ever could conjure anything remotely sexual in my mind when I do. I've changed babied nappies, and have cleaned and powdered that whole area, but...I mean....How?!?

Yeah really. I mean, even children look vaguely like adults, but babies, eww.

I know this have been said several times in this thread but I'll enforce it.

HORRIBLE! They should be wiped from the face of the earth!