NationStates Jolt Archive

Okay, we all know the story about Roswell.

but there are some holes that are intriguing about it.

Okay, i don't believe that a UFO crashed in Roswell but i do believe that something did happen.

My first point is the crash debris. Now this is a time where the USA was in the middle of the cold war. We were testing many types of aircraft, rockets, and other strange vehicles to see if we could use them against the soviet union.

Now the crash debris was really non conclusive about the origins. Yes it was radioactive but many thing will emit radiation after they have crashed and burned. you never know they might have had a battery that use nuclear material. when it burn up the batteries radioactive condense was spred out over the debris. (I'm just speculating there)

The bodies, all aircraft have to use shorter people, because the cockpit is so tiny, Especially in high speed aircraft. Now they used strange looking dummies in those times that could easily get an ignorant passerby to believe it something else.

The most interesting thing about the crash was the foil that they found that couldn't be cut bu scissors. I believe that was aluminum strands that were weaved to create a "cloth" and aluminum strand are very strong and you cant break it with you hands.

Area 51, I believe no UFOs have ever been inside that complex. but i believe its a place where the USA tests and builds our most secret aircraft. Now, some people wonder why you will get shot if you try to get near Area 51. Thats simple Area 51 is a warehouse for all of the USAs secret weapons. Do you really think they would let you stroll up to the gate and knock?
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Remember a few years ago that man came forward with his UFO pictures. It showed a aircraft that was diamond shaped? but after the F-117A was made public the guy never said anything about his UFO pictures again?

why?

Because it was the pictures were of the prototype F-117A. And it was flying where? Area 51!

Now i will debate about any of my theories as long as its logical and non ignorant.

It used to be. Area 51 is all but abandoned now, though. Too much publicity for a secret base.

If you read up on Area 51 youll fine that the US tested Saucer shaped Aircraft as well as the F-117, SR-71 the Auorura and various X aircraft.

I agree with the OP on this one. I can't give a definative yes or no about Aliens, because I've never been there, but if I were to wager a guess, I'd say secret weapons, that all.

It is kinda laughable that people think because it's so secret, there are aliens there. Ever try walking into the situation room at the White House or NORAD? They won't let you in there either. But there aren't any aliens there either.

It is kinda laughable that people think because it's so secret, there are aliens there. Ever try walking into the situation room at the White House or NORAD? They won't let you in there either. But there aren't any aliens there either.

How do you know? There could be. (Bush is an alien)

How do you know? There could be. (Bush is an alien)
you are an alien:p

you are an alien:p

Maybe I am. *plays the X-Files themesong*

*gasp* THEY ARE AMOUNG US!

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b383/DrkHelmet/bushtradefed.jpg

We even have pictures!

.....serious discussion down the drains again....*sigh*

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b383/DrkHelmet/bushtradefed.jpg

We even have pictures!

They're here!!! :eek: PANIC!!!!!!!!!

.....serious discussion down the drains again....*sigh*
Hey, it made it to the 4th post. Gotta be some kind of record!

.....serious discussion down the drains again....*sigh*
Cheer up Charlie. One day you will find a group of beings with your same level of intelligence, and you all can have hours and hours of serious debates. I would particiapte, but my cold has debilitated my attention span. :D

.....serious discussion down the drains again....*sigh*

I'm sorry. I can't help myself sometimes.

its okay

I agree with the OP on this one. I can't give a definative yes or no about Aliens, because I've never been there, but if I were to wager a guess, I'd say secret weapons, that all.

It is kinda laughable that people think because it's so secret, there are aliens there. Ever try walking into the situation room at the White House or NORAD? They won't let you in there either. But there aren't any aliens there either.


Don't know. George W don't look entirely human to me. Or is it just the vaugly spaced expression he seems to have all the time?;)

.....serious discussion down the drains again....*sigh*

How about this for a serious discussion. Why are the USAF keeping Area 51 (Groom Lake) open at all? You'd think that they'd up sticks and moving testing to another facility. Or is it all just a cover? After all Sun Tzu said 'All warfare is based on deception'. What if Area 51 actually never tested a single aircraft? What if it was all a hoax to keep people fixated while the tesing was carried out somewhere really secret, like in the wilderness of Alaska?

.....serious discussion down the drains again....*sigh*
Mwhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha
Hey, it made it to the 4th post. Gotta be some kind of record!
Mwhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha

Aliens landed and took over the South West.
They own the Texans, Houston Rockets and Dallas Cowboys as well as the Production and Distribution rights to The Hobbit!
-Those bastards!

Look at the B-117 and B-2, you know they aren't normal.

Area 51 is where all the M0ds get together for their plans to dominate the world! :eek:

The government already declassified what happened at Roswell. An experimental balloon (Project Skyhook, I believe) crashed.

Don't know. George W don't look entirely human to me. Or is it just the vaugly spaced expression he seems to have all the time?;)
Bush is clearly a monkey. Have you not seen Steve Bell's 'If...' cartoons in the Grauniad?


How about this for a serious discussion. Why are the USAF keeping Area 51 (Groom Lake) open at all? You'd think that they'd up sticks and moving testing to another facility. Or is it all just a cover? After all Sun Tzu said 'All warfare is based on deception'. What if Area 51 actually never tested a single aircraft? What if it was all a hoax to keep people fixated while the tesing was carried out somewhere really secret, like in the wilderness of Alaska?
You mean you're crediting the Americans with some sort of intelligence and cunning? :p

If you're looking for the link between the USAF and aliens, I suggest you look at Ohio at the Wright-Patterson AFB. That's where Project Blue Book was headquartered, and also where all the main files were/are kept. Groom Lake is simply a place where the government flew experimental and classified aircraft. All the captured Mig's were flown to Groom Lake and test-flown there. I used to believe in aliens and stuff too, but once I read The Mothman Prophecies by John Keel, I realized that things are never as black-and-white as the UFO-nuts make it out to be. The government is actually doing the responsible thing by covering up UFO activity.

Probably just the crash of experimental aircraft and the government had to come up with a lame excuse to cover it up. The alien conspiracies that came later would probably make the gov happy for it keeps things away from testing new weapons. I'm sure they regret that now, with all the conspiracies out there and with lying politicians in general, no one trust the government anymore.

How about this for a serious discussion. Why are the USAF keeping Area 51 (Groom Lake) open at all? You'd think that they'd up sticks and moving testing to another facility. Or is it all just a cover? After all Sun Tzu said 'All warfare is based on deception'. What if Area 51 actually never tested a single aircraft? What if it was all a hoax to keep people fixated while the tesing was carried out somewhere really secret, like in the wilderness of Alaska?

Area 51 has been closed for nearly a decade now. This was because the government was keeping an open air radioactive waste center just up wind of the facility. Consequently, the people working there were getting all sorts of cancer. Last I heard, the workers were trying to sue the government over it, but because of the secrecy of Area 51, they were having to argue that they legally exist to the courts (which they don't, due to secrecy). I haven't heard much about it since then.

For those who are interested, Popular Mechanics toured the now shut down Area 51 a few years ago. The work that used to go on at Area 51 was moved to Area 5294 or something like that. A four digit number with a 5 at the beginning. Don't recall the whole thing. Anyhue.

Well, Im not exactly a conspiracy nut, but Im positive there has been much more going on at Groom Lake than meets the eye.
Look at our plane technology and the sharp rises in technology levels between the late 60's, and today.

We basically go from the combat fighter propeller plane, to the jet engine, to stealth technology, in a couple small steps.

From the p-51 Mustang, to the F117.

What element would be introduced to prove such large jumps in aeronautics technology?

What about a reverse engineered alien craft?

In fact, scientifically speaking, if you look at basic technology, in the early 20th century, its not that far advanced from the previous century.
The early 1900's...not much more advanced than the 1800's.
The same is relatively true for pretty far back.

BUT....lets observe the latter part of the 20th century.

Transistors...leading to computers, medical breakthroughs eliminating some diseases...remember polio?
Air travel, Jet engines, breaking of the sound barrier.
Moon landings.
Microprocessors.

Quite the technological leaps in a few short years.

How?

It used to be. Area 51 is all but abandoned now, though. Too much publicity for a secret base.

That would not supprise me. Google earth has a crystal clear image of the entire installation.

Well, Im not exactly a conspiracy nut, but Im positive there has been much more going on at Groom Lake than meets the eye.
Look at our plane technology and the sharp rises in technology levels between the late 60's, and today.

We basically go from the combat fighter propeller plane, to the jet engine, to stealth technology, in a couple small steps.

From the p-51 Mustang, to the F117.

What element would be introduced to prove such large jumps in aeronautics technology?

What about a reverse engineered alien craft?

In fact, scientifically speaking, if you look at basic technology, in the early 20th century, its not that far advanced from the previous century.
The early 1900's...not much more advanced than the 1800's.
The same is relatively true for pretty far back.

BUT....lets observe the latter part of the 20th century.

Transistors...leading to computers, medical breakthroughs eliminating some diseases...remember polio?
Air travel, Jet engines, breaking of the sound barrier.
Moon landings.
Microprocessors.

Quite the technological leaps in a few short years.

How?


Technological acceleration.

If you map out the development of technologies, virtually any technologies, you find that every time you make one incremental improvement, it takes you only half as long to get to the next one. This has been true since the beginning of human history, and likely before we had histories. It was just that the initial periodicity was extremely long.

But halving the times - well consider: 1000 years - 500 years - 250 years - 125 years - 62 Years - 31 years - 15 years - 7 years - 3 years - 18 months - 9 months - 4.5 months - 9 weeks...

You get the picture. In addition, we've had no real quantum leaps of technology in the 20th century, nothing that wasn't both presaged by existing developments and predicted (admittedly, the impact of certain technologies was not predicted - home computers, for example - but the existence of the device was).

There was one absolute breakthrough - the semi-conductor or transistor. But even that built on what came before.

Occam's Razor - the simplest explanation. No Aliens required.

Look at our plane technology and the sharp rises in technology levels between the late 60's, and today.
We basically go from the combat fighter propeller plane, to the jet engine, to stealth technology, in a couple small steps.
From the p-51 Mustang, to the F117.
What element would be introduced to prove such large jumps in aeronautics technology?
What about a reverse engineered alien craft?
In fact, scientifically speaking, if you look at basic technology, in the early 20th century, its not that far advanced from the previous century.
The early 1900's...not much more advanced than the 1800's.
The same is relatively true for pretty far back.
BUT....lets observe the latter part of the 20th century.
Transistors...leading to computers, medical breakthroughs eliminating some diseases...remember polio?
Air travel, Jet engines, breaking of the sound barrier.
Moon landings.
Microprocessors.
Quite the technological leaps in a few short years.
How?
Well, air travel was around at the start of the century, pretty much, and as you said, it wasn't that much more advanced than the previous century.
The internal combustion engine, invented in the late nineteenth century, was the first main catalyst for technological advancement in the twentieth century, and that was the product of increased understanding of mechanical engineering throughout the Victorian age.
Jet engines were invented c.1940, and really took off (excuse the pun) after the war.
The war. Wars almost always lead to vast technological improvement. From the second world war we have rocketry, radar, and nuclear weapons. As more money is put into necessary research, new inventions come thick and fast, most of which have applications beyond the military world.
Computers were invented as far back as the middle of the nineteenth century, by Charles Babbage. Not modern computers, but it had the basics. The idea was developed, with military money, in the second world war. We have a lot to be thankful for about that war. The technological advancements from then are all around us now, and make our life a hell of a lot easier.

Bush is clearly a monkey. Have you not seen Steve Bell's 'If...' cartoons in the Grauniad?



You mean you're crediting the Americans with some sort of intelligence and cunning? :p


Oops! Now I see the error in my logic:rolleyes: Thanks for the heads up!:D

I believe a UFO landed in Roswell:
UFO-Unidentified Flying Object
Any thing that I see flying that I don't know what it is is a UFO. Simple, really.

Probably just the crash of experimental aircraft and the government had to come up with a lame excuse to cover it up. The alien conspiracies that came later would probably make the gov happy for it keeps things away from testing new weapons. I'm sure they regret that now, with all the conspiracies out there and with lying politicians in general, no one trust the government anymore.

I'd go a bit further than that, I'd say that the government actively encouraged (and maybe still encourages) UFO conspiracy theories to divert attention from ther actual activities.

During the Cold War, when Soviet forces were taking control of an eastern European country (I forget which one) American soldiers removed the crown jewels of that country to protect them. To keep the operation a secret, the soldiers guarding the truck carrying the jewels were told that the truck contained a crashed UFO. From this, it is not unreasonable to assume that the US government has propogated UFO stories to cover their actions at other times as well.

Well, air travel was around at the start of the century, pretty much, and as you said, it wasn't that much more advanced than the previous century.
The internal combustion engine, invented in the late nineteenth century, was the first main catalyst for technological advancement in the twentieth century, and that was the product of increased understanding of mechanical engineering throughout the Victorian age.
Jet engines were invented c.1940, and really took off (excuse the pun) after the war.
The war. Wars almost always lead to vast technological improvement. From the second world war we have rocketry, radar, and nuclear weapons. As more money is put into necessary research, new inventions come thick and fast, most of which have applications beyond the military world.
Computers were invented as far back as the middle of the nineteenth century, by Charles Babbage. Not modern computers, but it had the basics. The idea was developed, with military money, in the second world war. We have a lot to be thankful for about that war. The technological advancements from then are all around us now, and make our life a hell of a lot easier.

Too true, and the internal combustion engine is still going strong to this day (despite 'hybrid' cars and all that nonsense). On the topic of aliens I do believe they exist, but if I could span interstellar distances in my own llifetime (breaking the theory of relativity and the universal constant of the speed of light) I'd want to visit someplace more interesting than Roswell New Mexico. Las Vegas perhaps?

Note: I do know that Vegas only took off in the late fifties early sixties, but you get my point

Not sure what the big deal is, the government is allowed to have it's secrets (for good reason) and I am comfortable knowing that they are looking ahead 3-4-5 decades today the same way they were during the Cold War. Perhaps their work will grace the battle fields of the future; nothing wrong with that.

I would imagine that at this point Area 51 is no longer in use, but I also wouldn't be surprised if they have many other places like it. Isn't there one in Utah now?

As for alien tech… the ancient Egyptians credited the goddess with the invention of beer. Can’t we take a little responsibility for our own ingenuity?

Too true, and the internal combustion engine is still going strong to this day (despite 'hybrid' cars and all that nonsense). On the topic of aliens I do believe they exist, but if I could span interstellar distances in my own llifetime (breaking the theory of relativity and the universal constant of the speed of light) I'd want to visit someplace more interesting than Roswell New Mexico. Las Vegas perhaps?

Note: I do know that Vegas only took off in the late fifties early sixties, but you get my point
If I could span interstellar distances in my own lifetime, I wouldn't come to Earth even if it were the only place in the universe (except where I was from) with intelligent life (I'm talking about the mice, of course).

Nothing happened, but the unimaginative and mentally ill like to pretend that it did.

What element would be introduced to prove such large jumps in aeronautics technology?
Competition with the Russians. Do you assume that aliens invented the machine gun and the zeppellin as well?

If I could span interstellar distances in my own lifetime, I wouldn't come to Earth even if it were the only place in the universe (except where I was from) with intelligent life (I'm talking about the mice, of course).


Nice. I forgot we're all just part of the program;)

No of course aliens didn't invent the machine gun. That was men from Atlantis.... or maybe a German.... I get confused....

No of course aliens didn't invent the machine gun. That was men from Atlantis.... or maybe a German.... I get confused....

The truth is out there

If Area 51 is no longer operational, then why is there still secrecy. I have friends in the area who still reports trucks patrolling the area, and those signs are still there. Maybe the government just wanted us to believe it was shut down.

Nah, it's probably just empty buildings, but by keeping the security up, they keep the crazies from looking at other places, where they're ACTUALLY testing the new stuff.

Area 51 is the military answer to snoopy people - flypaper.

Wasn't Groom alke the airbase that spawned the Blackbird and the Stealth Fighter? It obviously has been things going on there. And since the US is always developing new tech, it's safe to say that experiments like that are being conducted, either at Area 51 or some other place.

The alien conspiracy theories are uninteresting to me. There are lot's of more interesting things to believe in...

The truth is out there

Excellent, the foolish fools have been fooled!

*shape-shifts back into lizard form and goes back to building secret mind control ray*

Excellent, the foolish fools have been fooled!

*shape-shifts back into lizard form and goes back to building secret mind control ray*

Oi, that's my job.

Excellent, the foolish fools have been fooled!

*shape-shifts back into lizard form and goes back to building secret mind control ray*
You mean that former football players theory? He's insane.